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Puzzle Etiquette


SigsPig

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I did a search for this topic & didn't get any hits so here goes: is it considered bad form to email the cache owner & ask for verification of an answer you've come up with for part of his puzzles?

For example, if part of your final solution involves getting the answer to an ambiguious question will make the difference between 20 meters & 200 meters, would you email the owner?

When I do this, I usually state the question causing me the problem & the 2-3 sources for answers & ask them which they used.

Thoughts?

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I had started a thread in the Web site forum about this suggesting the possibility of having people include a coord checker for their puzzle caches. Idea went over like a lead balloon. But I think Res2100 is right, there's no point searching an area if it doesn't have a cache and it would seem good etiquette to give people a chance to verify their coords before setting out.

JD

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You would think the coordinate checker would be a blessing for those people putting out puzzle caches. Answer XX amount of emails or send those users to a site to see if their right/wrong.

The few people who do have the "checker link", I have praised in my logs after a successful caching trip. I don't understand why more people aren't using this service

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For example, if part of your final solution involves getting the answer to an ambiguious question will make the difference between 20 meters & 200 meters, would you email the owner?

Thoughts?

It would be nice if puzzles had just one answer and not an ambiguious one :anibad: . If it's a puzzle that has a section or answer we can't solve, we like to put in a couple of points based on a range of workable options and then walk a bearing line. There's a lot of fun in walking a bearing line in the woods looking for a cache - especially if you find it! Geochecker is good when there could be two right answers - like flora names for example.

 

If there is no geochecker, I might send an e-mail if I was travelling a great distance to find it, otherwise we've been known to ask previous finders to confirm our coords for us rather than bug the cache owner.

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Landsharkz: this was more of a trivial pursuit puzzle rather than a math type. And one of the questions had various answers depending on which web source you used.

The cache owner was nice enough to answer & admitted that the question was a "red herring". But then I was asked if I was in the habit of emailing cache owners for verification. I asked the person if it was considered bad form & never got a reply back. That's how this post got it's start.

Perhaps your method of asking previous finders is the better option :anibad:

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I had started a thread in the Web site forum about this suggesting the possibility of having people include a coord checker for their puzzle caches. Idea went over like a lead balloon. But I think Res2100 is right, there's no point searching an area if it doesn't have a cache and it would seem good etiquette to give people a chance to verify their coords before setting out.

JD

 

It might have gone over as a lead balloon in another time and perhaps context but let me chime in and say that NOT having a coordinate checker on the cache page is bad form. Making people field test their answers takes a lot of fun out of it. Yes, check your answers first and do not feel that you are asking for anything unusual.

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Landsharkz: this was more of a trivial pursuit puzzle rather than a math type. And one of the questions had various answers depending on which web source you used.

The cache owner was nice enough to answer & admitted that the question was a "red herring". But then I was asked if I was in the habit of emailing cache owners for verification. I asked the person if it was considered bad form & never got a reply back. That's how this post got it's start.

Perhaps your method of asking previous finders is the better option :o

Personally... I'd prefer cachers ask me for verification/hints etc. I'm more than willing to help, but I generally know better than previous finders how much information I can give away without spoiling the puzzle. It also alerts me to potential problems with my puzzles.

 

That being said there are certain *types* of puzzles I probably wouldn't give verification on.

 

I've got one I'm planning on where you'd have to very accurately measure the position of a location on the surface of the earth (much closer than you'd typically get out of a standard GPS reading). In a case like that, you're basically asking for the answer to the puzzle by asking for verification, and I'd be annoyed as all heck if people 'verified' coordinates between themselves rather than solving the puzzle (the only that's holding me back on this one is I have to get the numbers myself before I can post the puzzle :anibad: )

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At this time, I would rather get an email and help people than just use geochecker.com because often people email me asking for a hint instead of checking the solution.

 

But I think both should be encouraged. Having both "Email Me for a hint" and "Check your answer here" links is a great benefit. Sometimes I do worry about third party solutions, like geochecker.com for reasons like what might happen if their service went down.

 

<_< BQ

Edited by The Blue Quasar
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At this time, I would rather get an email and help people than just use geochecker.com because often people email me asking for a hint instead of checking the solution.

 

But I think both should be encouraged. Having both "Email Me for a hint" and "Check your answer here" links is a great benefit. Sometimes I do worry about third party solutions, like geochecker.com for reasons like what might happen if their service went down.

 

:( BQ

Asking for a hint is a good idea and if the owner is willing they could say that. But the reason I see a need for services like geochecker.com is that not everyone lives close to the caches they have to visit. Where I live, I regularly have to travel 60km+ to look for a new cache. Given that much of that is not on 4 lane highways, I can easily take more than an hour to get to caches. That's a long way to go to find that you may have done some miscalculation. Given the distances in this country, I'm sure I'm not alone with the distance problem. IMHO, it is good etiquette to give people the opportunity to not waste their time and gas in these situations.

 

JD

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I figure if a Puzzle cache owner doesn't like getting emails asking for verification they will quickly learn how to add a link to a coordinate checker. :P

 

If no coordinate checker is available and I am going out of my way for a Puzzle cache I will try and get verification from the owner and, if that fails, I'll ask one of the previous finders if I know him/her.

 

If my calculated coordinates aren't too far out of my normal area than I will go search without verification from someone. That might mean trying five or six possible locations, "walking the line" or whatever. There is an extra bit if satisfaction in finding a cache when you aren't 100% sure you are correct.

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With snow up to the waist in spots & parking locations to get to the cache being at a premium, I wanted my answer confirmed before venturing out. I had also included sources for my answer to part of his puzzle.

With the price of gas being what it is; a walk in the woods is good, finding the cache in question is better :huh:

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I'll give someone as much, or as little, help as they want on my puzzles. I'll even give them the final coordinates if they want them (some people aren't into puzzles).

I wish everyone felt that way, and with Res2100 that caches are meant to be found. However, not everyone does think that way.

 

The point to using geochecker or similar is to provide a convenient way for people who like to solve the puzzles themselves to confirm their answers. Given that you don't know whether an owner is the type to help you or not this would help people out.

 

JD

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One of my caches has a somewhat complex puzzle, and the initial few finders asked a lot of questions of me - questions that helped me refine the puzzle to be unambiguous.

 

I have a coordinate checker on that cache, but usually people just email me, and I'm cool with that.

 

I won't give someone the final coordinates though unless they can demonstrate that they've at least TRIED to figure it out in an intelligent way (my judgement). There are plenty of traditional caches to find without getting a bye on puzzles.

Edited by geoSquid
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You would think the coordinate checker would be a blessing for those people putting out puzzle caches. Answer XX amount of emails or send those users to a site to see if their right/wrong.

The few people who do have the "checker link", I have praised in my logs after a successful caching trip. I don't understand why more people aren't using this service

 

I love a geochecker.com puzzle cache! I use it with my puzzle caches (when I remember) and think it's great! I do know someone who doesn't like it because she thinks that some people just sit there and plug in likely coordinates until they get the right one. Personally, I don't have time to do that but I guess there are those that do.

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I'll give someone as much, or as little, help as they want on my puzzles. I'll even give them the final coordinates if they want them (some people aren't into puzzles).

I do exactly the same as you...afterall, caches are meant to be found.

 

OK res, if you're willing to give up your puzzle coordinates, there's a few Bouncy Bunny ones that I'd like to have!!! (hahahahahaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa) :rolleyes: C-

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You would think the coordinate checker would be a blessing for those people putting out puzzle caches. Answer XX amount of emails or send those users to a site to see if their right/wrong.

The few people who do have the "checker link", I have praised in my logs after a successful caching trip. I don't understand why more people aren't using this service

 

I love a geochecker.com puzzle cache! I use it with my puzzle caches (when I remember) and think it's great! I do know someone who doesn't like it because she thinks that some people just sit there and plug in likely coordinates until they get the right one. Personally, I don't have time to do that but I guess there are those that do.

 

One of the problems with checkers, that I have noticed, is that they seem to allow an exact match only. This can be an issue if a puzzle is mathematical and involves any rounding - the person solving it may get an answer that is slightly different from what is in the checker, but is more than good enough to find the cache... a difference in the thousandths of minutes, for example. Consequently, a checker can cause frustration.

 

I know this because I have this issue with one of my caches.

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You would think the coordinate checker would be a blessing for those people putting out puzzle caches. Answer XX amount of emails or send those users to a site to see if their right/wrong.

The few people who do have the "checker link", I have praised in my logs after a successful caching trip. I don't understand why more people aren't using this service

 

I love a geochecker.com puzzle cache! I use it with my puzzle caches (when I remember) and think it's great! I do know someone who doesn't like it because she thinks that some people just sit there and plug in likely coordinates until they get the right one. Personally, I don't have time to do that but I guess there are those that do.

 

One of the problems with checkers, that I have noticed, is that they seem to allow an exact match only. This can be an issue if a puzzle is mathematical and involves any rounding - the person solving it may get an answer that is slightly different from what is in the checker, but is more than good enough to find the cache... a difference in the thousandths of minutes, for example. Consequently, a checker can cause frustration.

 

I know this because I have this issue with one of my caches.

 

For what it's worth, I used geochecker.com for one of my caches and I found a selection for a "fuzzy search" and then it gave me some options for how close I wanted that to be. I don't know if that's new or not but I used it within the last 6 months.

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I'm not a big fan of Puzzle caches, but of the 2 that I do have, my Puzzle out in Alliston (Barrie area) has a coordinate checker. Not only that, but it has 2 of them.

One checker is for a "close to it" checker, which will tell you if you're within something like 20 meters of the cache, and the second one is to find if you're bang on.

 

However, my Puzzle cache out in Ottawa has no checker, although I really should put one in.

 

Even so, even with my Alliston Puzzle having the checker, I still have lots of people e-mailing me about confirmation and additional hints, of which I'm more than happy to help out and steer people in the right direction, if need be.

 

I think I'm going to archive my Alliston hide, though, and relocate it to the Cambridge area.

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