Discussion about "Artist Edition" coins

[+tsunrisebey]

 

This post is the one that I think seems to be the crux of the discussion

 

We're seeing a growing amount of artist/marketer/broker/distributor/retailers, all wrapped up in one (or more) interactive GC ID(s). They are operating as a business on these forums, yet also as a co-posting friend. This is a very unique form of trust-based retail that's surely worth protecting with a system of checks and balances.

 

My opinion is only a small part of the system of checks and balances we have in place to prevent the next generation of vendors from realizing that they too can easily manipulate their production quantities in such a manner, and make excessive profits from the people they can easily gain trust from here.

 

And so my opinion was very clear. Charging $29.99, $34.99, or 65.99 for an "AE" geocoin is downright excessive, and not at all "trying to get paid", regardless of what that person "might" get on eBay for it. Some may not agree with that, but it's my opinion as a consumer, which many others here do share. Without critical consumer feedback, what's to stop prices from continuing to rise? When that vendor boldly states to everyone here that the coin is valued at $65.99, and people here are smart enough to know that it didn't cost more than $5 to make...the consumers have spoken. I say don't insult our intelligence, or take advantage of our community here.

 

I think you make some vaild points for discussion. You're right there is a newer trend of those who happen to be 1 or 2 people rolled up into several roles of the geocoin business. Having said that and being one of those people, I do think there are some considerations to be thought about. As a 'Designer' of coins, you (general) are put in a unique position. If you take the role of minter/reseller you are put in an even more unique position; that which holds some responsibility and special considerations. To be perfectly blunt and honest, there are some designers work that have become very popular. As a designer/minter/reseller, I am very aware of this. You know your designs are in demand and there is the potential to take advantage of the customer through prices and AE coins, if one chose to do so. Although what one considers taking advantage of or exploitation, is relative and subjective. There definitely needs to be checks and balances and that comes through the geocoin public and the consumers. Keeping on the AE track here, non-ebay issues and not the minting of coins in general; where does a designer/artist draw the line when it comes to their version? What is the better decision?

 

Coming from personal experience that is a tough question to answer. I have changed my mind about what to do with my AE coins along the way. I don't know what they were originally intended for, I wasn't around then. In the end I do what I feel is best and to be truthful the AE coins (especially the turtles) originally brought me nothing but grief. I didn't see the ugly side of what coins can do until people wanted those (the incidents were few but enough to make me hate the coins) it was then that I decided from now on that all AE coins would not be traded anymore (minus the secret santa trade I made). They get used for charity, cointests, placed in caches, and given away to customers (try to spread them around a bit) and then I keep a couple for me to sell on ebay to help me with my next coin idea. Minus ebay, nothing is ever asked in exchange. I would never offer an AE for sale on my website because it doesn't feel right to ME. I don't even know what an appropriate price would be for an AE. This is obviously a touchy subject for some people and there are many strong feelings involved. I won't even say what I do is appropriate but I am comfortable in the way I handle my AE's.

 

I admit that having an AE does hold a certain power to it (yeah, that sounds bad and egotistical but I don't mean it that way). Fact is, even more so now, certain AE coins can be used to the designers advantage over the general geocoin public and I think that is where the complaint lies. Truth is, I am still up in the air about certain issues with the AE coins, I think they can be beneficial and abused. In the end, it really is up to the person holding the AE's to decide what is the best use for them. BUT, like Mackey stated earlier and I tend to agree, in the end things will work themselves out and fate has a way of dealing with those whose intentions are less than honorable.

 

In conclusion, speaking on behalf of myself, this is and always will be a learning experience. Comments from all angles give me pause to reflect about what it is I am doing and how I want to continue doing things. So for those who are posting their heartfelt thoughts, keep it up, there are those of us who are paying attention to what you say but the spiteful comments get tossed out like trash. I do enjoy the humor in some of the posts too, these threads tend to get a bit heavy handed at times.

 

Ok, I'm done

[YemonYime]

This is all very interesting to us. What percentage of a minting constitutes an LE/XLE/AE etc.? If we do a run of 500 coins in 6 finishes, broken down 234, 73, 73, 40, 40 and 40, which is the LE etc.? From our point of view, none of them qualify. We just want a variety so everyone can get a finish they like. All the finishes have meaning to us and if someone wants a set they can have them at regular price. We designed the coin and did the artwork (way too many hours spent on that but it was fun) so there is no artist to pay. However, if we had someone else do the artwork, we would have to pay a bit more for the coins or have to pay an outside artist and in that case, if they wanted an AE as payment, great. They earned it and could sell the coins for what ever the market would bear. More power to them.

 

Artists have a talent and deserve to get paid. We aren't artists by any stretch of the imagination, so doing a design and the artwork is just a hobby and part of the fun of making a coin and we don't feel we need anything extra for it.

 

Just our humble opinion and what works for us. To each his own.

 

When I designed my first coin, it was also very hard for me to decide which finishes to go with. I eventually settled for a total of three. It's really very tempting to have a greater variety of finishes and/or color combinations done, but it is ultimately up to you since it's your own personal geocoin. The difference being discussed here though is that non-personal commercial geocoins are being sold with such a large number of finish/color combinations, that it really becomes quite confusing and silly to go about labelling them with SE/RE/LE/XLE/AE, etc.

 

Using your breakdown numbers as an example, I couldn't justify paying (or trading) anything additional for one of your "40" run coins as opposed to another of your "40" run coins. The same number of each was minted, so I couldn't really see one of those having a higher worth, or "covet factor" than the rest, unless some feature of it was just so much more striking than the others.

 

Again, it's all a matter of opinion, but when a vendor breaks down the numbers in that manner and simply selects one version to be the "AE", it's kinda cheesy innit?

[+Rockin Roddy]

I think you're doing fine Tsun, your coins have meaning and heart, your prices aren't too bad and you have a good head and heart!

 

email sent.

[+Rockin Roddy]

I think you're doing fine Tsun, your coins have meaning and heart, your prices aren't too bad and you have a good head and heart!

 

email sent.

[+jangor]

This is all very interesting to us. What percentage of a minting constitutes an LE/XLE/AE etc.? If we do a run of 500 coins in 6 finishes, broken down 234, 73, 73, 40, 40 and 40, which is the LE etc.? From our point of view, none of them qualify. We just want a variety so everyone can get a finish they like. All the finishes have meaning to us and if someone wants a set they can have them at regular price. We designed the coin and did the artwork (way too many hours spent on that but it was fun) so there is no artist to pay. However, if we had someone else do the artwork, we would have to pay a bit more for the coins or have to pay an outside artist and in that case, if they wanted an AE as payment, great. They earned it and could sell the coins for what ever the market would bear. More power to them.

 

Artists have a talent and deserve to get paid. We aren't artists by any stretch of the imagination, so doing a design and the artwork is just a hobby and part of the fun of making a coin and we don't feel we need anything extra for it.

 

Just our humble opinion and what works for us. To each his own.

 

When I designed my first coin, it was also very hard for me to decide which finishes to go with. I eventually settled for a total of three. It's really very tempting to have a greater variety of finishes and/or color combinations done, but it is ultimately up to you since it's your own personal geocoin. The difference being discussed here though is that non-personal commercial geocoins are being sold with such a large number of finish/color combinations, that it really becomes quite confusing and silly to go about labelling them with SE/RE/LE/XLE/AE, etc.

 

Using your breakdown numbers as an example, I couldn't justify paying (or trading) anything additional for one of your "40" run coins as opposed to another of your "40" run coins. The same number of each was minted, so I couldn't really see one of those having a higher worth, or "covet factor" than the rest, unless some feature of it was just so much more striking than the others.

 

Again, it's all a matter of opinion, but when a vendor breaks down the numbers in that manner and simply selects one version to be the "AE", it's kinda cheesy innit?

Agreed.

 

Thanks Yime

[+Renegade Knight]

...If we do a run of 500 coins in 6 finishes, broken down 234, 73, 73, 40, 40 and 40, which is the LE etc.? From our point of view, none of them qualify.....

 

Bold is LE

LE is generic for "Less numbers than the main coin".

You can call them LE, AE, SLE, XLE or anthing else you want.

Edited December 17, 2007 by Renegade Knight

[+Cheesy pigs]

Slightly OT: I find it incredibly disheartening that there seem to be so many factions in geocoining. It really isnt necessary, and makes for miserable reading on this site sometimes. And as for The Number1Bop, I know this person, and she most certainly isnt a sock. There is nothing knitted, buttoned-eyed or stocking-like about her, so please knock off the innuendo?

 

This is merely my view, but I am 'new' to geocoin collecting, and I feel put down when people talk about the good old days of collecting/trading, and how bad things are now. I am part of the 'now' and haven't known it any other way, but I am having an absolute ball being involved with you all.

 

I have never met such a generous bunch of people. Although I have only experienced trading/collecting recently, I have been gifted numerous AE's by the same people who are supposedly greedy, out for themselves, capitalist pigs who have 'wrecked coining'. I would not be buying coins if I thought they cost too much. I love supporting talented artists by buying their AE coins. Sometimes on eBay the prices climb too high, so I stop bidding. Obviously the prices are reasonable for the people purchasing them.

 

Nobody is being ripped off. Everyone is well within their rights to email an artist and ask politely if they'd like to trade. I dont know any artists who DONT trade some of their AE's. I am really sorry to hear of what happened with Tsun's Earth Turtles though. I think some people may be greedy or thoughtless, but from what I can tell, it is not the artists.

 

People arent naive. Yes, Artist Editions have an extra appeal because they are limited, but if you dont like the prices or the metals/colours - just dont buy them.

 

I still believe people are getting confused between Geocoin Sellers and Artists. Yes some artists have webstores, but I dont know of any artists who are minting the same coins in different metals in limited numbers and calling them artist editions of the same coin.

 

Back OT: Some of the most irascible people on this forum are the sweetest, most giving people 'behind the scenes'. Just thought I'd mention that

[+Damenace]

And as for The Number1Bop, I know this person, and she most certainly isnt a sock. There is nothing knitted, buttoned-eyed or stocking-like about her, so please knock off the innuendo?

 

 

We know she is not a sock, but perhaps her account is?? And if you know this person then perhaps you would know that she has another log in right?

[+pghlooking]

Where is pghlooking? This discussion seems right up his alley...

 

It's the finish of the first class mailing deadline. I'm betting he's taking a nap (or wishing he was).

Ah yes. Wouldn't it be nice to have the luxury of staying at home and playing online all day. Sadly must go to work.

 

Old school - When coins were done for the love of the hobby

New school - When people tried to earn a living at coins so they didn't have to get a real job

[+ArtieD]

Old school - When coins were done for the love of the hobby, and people made some money on the side.

New school - When coins are done for the love of the hobby and the art, and to make some money on the side or even for a living.

 

Fixed it for ya for accuracy.

Edited December 18, 2007 by Arthur & Trillian

[+pghlooking]

And as for The Number1Bop, I know this person, and she most certainly isnt a sock. There is nothing knitted, buttoned-eyed or stocking-like about her, so please knock off the innuendo?

 

 

We know she is not a sock, but perhaps her account is?? And if you know this person then perhaps you would know that she has another log in right?

No, not a sock. More like a slipper.

[+tsunrisebey]

Where is pghlooking? This discussion seems right up his alley...

 

It's the finish of the first class mailing deadline. I'm betting he's taking a nap (or wishing he was).

Ah yes. Wouldn't it be nice to have the luxury of staying at home and playing online all day. Sadly must go to work.

 

Old school - When coins were done for the love of the hobby

New school - When people tried to earn a living at coins so they didn't have to get a real job

 

That's the pgh we all know and love, offend all the new people

[+pghlooking]

Old school - When coins were done for the love of the hobby

New school - When people tried to earn a living at coins so they didn't have to get a real job

 

Fixed it for ya for accuracy.

And here I thought it was only over in Cinema Boxer's chat world that you were allowed to pretend to be me and put words into my mouth.

 

No I said it how I meant it and stand behind it. The better question is, "Is this your final stance or should we expect you to change your opinion again?". For someone who said

I fail to see where there's any discussion.

You sure do have alot to say, well alot of words are being put forth at least.

[+ArtieD]

And here I thought it was only over in Cinema Boxer's chat world that you were allowed to pretend to be me and put words into my mouth.

 

No I said it how I meant it and stand behind it. The better question is, "Is this your final stance or should we expect you to change your opinion again?". For someone who said

I fail to see where there's any discussion.

You sure do have alot to say, well alot of words are being put forth at least.

 

Ah...now there's the pghlooking I know and love!

 

I do have to ask one question...how many coins have you designed to be qualified to give your opinion?

[+pghlooking]

Where is pghlooking? This discussion seems right up his alley...

 

It's the finish of the first class mailing deadline. I'm betting he's taking a nap (or wishing he was).

Ah yes. Wouldn't it be nice to have the luxury of staying at home and playing online all day. Sadly must go to work.

 

Old school - When coins were done for the love of the hobby

New school - When people tried to earn a living at coins so they didn't have to get a real job

 

That's the pgh we all know and love, offend all the new people

New people doesn't the same as New School. There are people here for a short period of time that are very Old School in their way of dealings. There are people who have been here forever that are New School in their way of thoughts.

 

Age in the forums doesn't equal age of thoughts. I think you might have read that a way other than intended.

[+Eartha]

That's it. This thread has lost all of it's original purpose. You have been throwing flames at each other long enough. I'm closing this thread.

Peace on Earth, good will to mankind, and good night.

 

I'm sorry about your thread, Yime. I couldn't be in here today to keep an eye on this, but I'm not happy with what I've read.

 

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