Help identifying a benchmark

[+jackrock]

While caching, I found a benchmark. I was at PCS#51 - Russell #2 and I spotted a benchmark when I got out of the car. I took coords at N31 43.450 W095 10.697. When I did a search on those coords, the closest benchmark was 1.2 miles away. Any ideas on what benchmark this is?

[DaveD]

This is one of the thousands of marks set by the U.S. Geological Survey (USGS) that were never submitted to the National Geodetic Survey for inclusion in the National Spatial Reference System.

[Wintertime]

Hey, Dave or anyone, do you know what the significance is of the "TT" prefix? There are a lot of marks with that designation in Yosemite. I don't recall whether any of them are disks as with the USGS mark that "Jackrock" found in Texas, but I've seen lots of wooden stakes next to tree nails and such that have "TTnnnn" designations. Any idea why?

 

Patty

[+shorbird]

Don't know the significance of the TT prefix, but around here, they all seem to be on USGS marks. I'm curious, too.

[+jackrock]

This is one of the thousands of marks set by the U.S. Geological Survey (USGS) that were never submitted to the National Geodetic Survey for inclusion in the National Spatial Reference System.

 

So I stumble across a benchmark and I don't get to log it. I've only done a few benchmarks, thought it was neat when I found one while not looking for it. Thanks for the explanation.

[Difficult Run]

Hey, Dave or anyone, do you know what the significance is of the "TT" prefix? There are a lot of marks with that designation in Yosemite. I don't recall whether any of them are disks as with the USGS mark that "Jackrock" found in Texas, but I've seen lots of wooden stakes next to tree nails and such that have "TTnnnn" designations. Any idea why?

 

Patty

 

The designation "TT" stands for Transit Traverse.

 

~ Mitch ~

Edited December 15, 2007 by Difficult Run

[DaveD]

On USGS marks the TT standards for Transit Traverse, which indicates the station was set primarily for horizontal control. We have a pretty good collection of the old USGS data in the NGS archives so I should be able to find the data for this station and post it here when I get back to the office on Monday.

[Z15]

I can see why USGS never submitted a lot of this stuff. I have a collection of USGS control for my area, many quads and the accuracy is stated right on the data sometimes. Statements such as work does not meet specification, 25 ft of error has been distributed over 10 miles or work meets 3rd order requirements but is tied to sub-standard work. Many of the descriptions make finding marks that don't have a lat and lon, impossible. It seems this was work done circa 1950.

 

Descriptions like on one BM, 3 miles south and 5 miles west of (name of RR siding on USGS ) and 350 ft east of fence corner.

Edited December 15, 2007 by Z15

[Wintertime]

On USGS marks the TT standards for Transit Traverse, which indicates the station was set primarily for horizontal control.

Thanks, Dave and Mitch. Horizontal control would make perfect sense, as I've mostly seen the "TT" stakes alongside roads in Yosemite Valley.

 

Patty

[+Black Dog Trackers]

So I stumble across a benchmark and I don't get to log it.

jackrock - you can log it here.

You can even log it with the USGS as per this topic.

[+jackrock]

So I stumble across a benchmark and I don't get to log it.

jackrock - you can log it here.

You can even log it with the USGS as per this topic.

 

I had seen the Waymarking category but hadn't logged it mainly because I find that website a bit user unfriendly and don't spend any time over there. I have now, since you mentioned it. I also sent the photo and coordinates to the USGS via the email address indicated in the thread.

 

Thanks.

[Difficult Run]

This is just too funny!

It's uncanny how this benchmark compares to the opening poster's.

 

In case you're wondering...

This particular mark was officially removed from it's setting by the USGS in 1968.

It's original location previously resided near Rolla, North Dakota.

 

~ Mitch ~

[DaveD]

The USGS data for this station provides only the NAD 27 position of 31-43-26.28N and 95-10-40.77W

[Difficult Run]

I can see why USGS never submitted a lot of this stuff. I have a collection of USGS control for my area, many quads and the accuracy is stated right on the data sometimes. Statements such as work does not meet specification, 25 ft of error has been distributed over 10 miles or work meets 3rd order requirements but is tied to sub-standard work. Many of the descriptions make finding marks that don't have a lat and lon, impossible. It seems this was work done circa 1950.

 

Descriptions like on one BM, 3 miles south and 5 miles west of (name of RR siding on USGS ) and 350 ft east of fence corner.

 

Please forgive me for hiijacking this thread.

 

[soapbox mode on]

During the 1950's - 1980's, the USGS was focused on the production of maps using the least amount of resources (money) as possible. The primary goal of setting benchmarks was to support the mapping process. Nothing more. After 1980, USGS directed its' priorities towards scientific interests.

 

Other agencies had the exact same mindset, except for the NGS (winks to Dave D).

They didn't see the big picture. The end result is a patchwork of level lines, triangulation stations and various benchmarks set by multiple govermental entities in the same quad. Inter-agency cooperation could have saved millions of $$, if department heads could have worked together. [/soapbox mode off]

 

Back to your regularly scheduled program,

~ Mitch ~

Edited December 18, 2007 by Difficult Run

[+jackrock]

So I stumble across a benchmark and I don't get to log it.

jackrock - you can log it here.

You can even log it with the USGS as per this topic.

 

Good tip. Here's the response I got:

 

Greetings: the cap you found was part of a transit traverse done in that region back in 1941. A USGS employee located it in the field in 1973, but we've had no reports of recovery since then. I annotated our records to reflect what you sent, so thank you for contacting us with that information.

 

Steve Reiter

USGS Infoservices

Box 25286

Denver Federal Center

Denver CO 80225

Voice: 303-202-4168

FAX: 303-202-4188

Email: snreiter@usgs.gov

[+bullionhunter]

Hey, Dave or anyone, do you know what the significance is of the "TT" prefix? There are a lot of marks with that designation in Yosemite. I don't recall whether any of them are disks as with the USGS mark that "Jackrock" found in Texas, but I've seen lots of wooden stakes next to tree nails and such that have "TTnnnn" designations. Any idea why?

 

Patty

Here are some I've found and placed as waymarks

"www.Waymarking.com/waymarks/WMYR0"

"www.Waymarking.com/waymarks/WM9BW"

Edited December 22, 2007 by bullionhunter