Placing a cache on Forestry Commission land

[+Crid]

I'm in South East England and I'm looking to place my first cache on Forestry Commission land. I see there's a form I'm supposed to fill in with coordinates and forward to "the appropriate reviewer". I'm not quite sure what that means, or what order I'm supposed to do things in. Do I place the cache, submit it on the website and forward the form once I know who the reviewer is? Or do I submit the coordinates and not actually place the cache until (if) the cache is approved both by Forestry Commission and the geocaching reviewer?

 

I'm wanting to do a multi (a micro near the recommended parking which will contain the coordinates of the main cache). Do I submit both sets of coordinates on a single Forestry Commission form, or do I have to do two forms?

[+Jango & Boba Fett]

Best plan is to pop into your local Forestry Commision office and talk to the local forester. I have found mine very helpfull especially at suggesting areas that would be good to encourage folks to visit and also highlighting areas that are going to have extensive forestry opperations and therefore might not be so good. Also certain areas may be covered by other regulations such as Natura 2000 where you will not get permision to place a cache if it conflicts with the over riding ecological objectives.

 

Once you have done that you can go forth and plan your cache.

[+The Blorenges]

First, have a look at the GAGB Landowners' Agreements. to see if there's one for your FC area.

 

The plan of action that we've followed for placing caches in FC land around here was as follows

 

1. Scouted around for where we hoped to place our cache.

2. Found out who the FC manager was for that particular area of wood/forest. We did this by taking the details off the notice at the carpark.

3. Contacted him by email, explaining what we would like to do and gave links to Geocaching.com so he could find out what Geocaching was all about. Said we would be in touch by phone in a week or so...

4. Phoned him and chatted. This turned out to be very amiable and surprisingly casual... Told him where we'd like to put the cache and queried a couple of things with him (e.g. Would it be acceptable to fix it to a tree?) This particular FC manager was also an organiser for the local "Walking for Health" group, so he was quite keen on the idea of bringing more people walking on his patch. He said "It's all OK with me... go ahead."

5. We set the cache, submitted it, got it published.

6. We then gave full details to the FC manager: a print out, our full contact details etc., and we also produced a "permission given" form that he was happy to sign for us.

 

I'm not saying that it will be that easy for you. Maybe we were lucky. I know in some areas of the country the FC rules are more restrictive (totally restricted in some areas).

Good luck with it.

MrsB

[+Bill D (wwh)]

Ah, the information is a bit ambiguous...! I suggest you place the cache and fill out the cache submission form, but uncheck the box on the form where it says "Yes, this listing is active". That way you get a cache page with the required GCxxxx number and the map, but the cache page doesn't actually go to a reviewer. Assuming you get permission, go back and check the box and re-submit the form, and post a note to the reviewer saying that you have permission. If you encounter any problems feel free to contact me through my gc.com or GAGB profile. Best of luck!

 

---

Bill, Chairman GAGB

[+Crid]

OK, now I'm even more confused. I read geocache.co.uk and there is a link to the appropriate form. The blurb says "Permission has been granted to place caches in woods managed by Forest Enterprise in the South East of England" and then says that includes Kent (where I am). "When placing a cache the cache owner must complete an agreement form... Complete and sign it either with name and e-mail or with an image of actual signature then forward it to the appropriate reviewer. The reviewer will then check it out, append a map of the area showing the cache location then forward it to the Forestry Commission on the cacher's behalf."

 

I had interpreted this as meaning that the reviewer acts as the liaison between the cache placer and the Forestry Commission (since it says that permission is already granted). But you seem to be saying that I have to get permission from the Forestry Commission myself (presumably attaching the maps myself) and then forward the completed paperwork to the reviewer, rather than the reviewer doing that part.

[Lactodorum]

Hi Crid, welcome to Geocaching and thanks for checking on correct procedure. As the reviewer involved in the original SE Forestry Commission negotiations I have to take some of the blame for the confusion! When it first started the process you describe was how we did it i.e. A cacher submitted a cache and the reviewer (originally me) would put all the details together with maps etc. and forward it to the FC.

 

However with the increasing number of caches we have to deal with we had to stop doing it this way and we placed the onus on the cacher to do all the "prep work" as Bill D suggested and as you correctly described in your last post. We'll have to get the GLAD information updated.

 

I hope that's a bit clearer now.

[+maxkim]

Hi Crid, welcome to Geocaching and thanks for checking on correct procedure. As the reviewer involved in the original SE Forestry Commission negotiations I have to take some of the blame for the confusion! When it first started the process you describe was how we did it i.e. A cacher submitted a cache and the reviewer (originally me) would put all the details together with maps etc. and forward it to the FC.

 

However with the increasing number of caches we have to deal with we had to stop doing it this way and we placed the onus on the cacher to do all the "prep work" as Bill D suggested and as you correctly described in your last post. We'll have to get the GLAD information updated.

 

I hope that's a bit clearer now.

Hi there but how does this square with the problem of the £50 payment for each cache, or does this just apply to NW area. reply to cache set in Cheshire "Hi thank you for the cache submission, you have placed your cache on land owned by the Forestry Commissions North West Area. Who require a payment of a £50 fee for permission to place a geocache (visit link)

Both the UK Reviewers and the GAGB committee, request cachers not to purchase a Geocache Placement Permit off FC NW. Due to the fact that this would set a precedent which would quickly be taken up by other FC areas, who willing agreed during negotiations with them not to charge a fee for a permit, but would also be taken up by the NT, who have previously raised the same issue and after negotiations agreed to drop the idea.

 

The GAGB hope to reopen negotiations with FC NW in the future with the aim of getting the Fee dropped, provided that no person has purchased a geocaching placement permit of them.

 

I am temporarily disabling your cache until you are ready. When you are ready for me to have another look at your cache, go to the Edit page and click on the "This cache is active" box so I will see it again.

 

Deceangi@googlemail.com"

 

No probs with the matter untill its sorted but this is not the advice given above.

 

What is the status with FC land please? or is down to which region you work in?

 

Thanks MaxKim.

[+Bill D (wwh)]

MaxKim wrote:

What is the status with FC land please? or is down to which region you work in?

Yes, there are different agreements with different FC areas - see the Agreements Database for details.

 

Edited to add: If your local FC area isn't listed there then there's probably no agreement with them.

Edited October 20, 2007 by Bill D (wwh)

[+The Wombles]

Yes, it's entirely down to which FC region you're dealing with. I did approach FC HQ but they didn't want to grant a blanket permission although they were encouraging.

 

We've negotiated with several regions so far, some are very positive and have a good agreement in place but some are quite discouraging. in the case of the FC NW, one of mine, they decided that a fee should apply. GAGB and the reviewers agreed that this was a very bad precedent and decided not to endorse this, but the FC NW have this process in place anyway.

 

If lots of local cachers pay the £50 fee then they probably won't change it. However, if no-one pays it then they may reconsider in time.

[+Crid]

Thanks for the guidance. I'm currently reaquainting myself with the wood I want to place my cache in, so next time I'm up there I'll see if I can find a board with contact details. There's only one car park so it should be fairly straightforward hopefully.

[+Bill D (wwh)]

The Forestry Commission South East England agreement page in GAGB's database is now updated with detailed instructions on the process for applying for permission. As Lactodorum, who negotiated that agreement, has said, the workload for UK reviewers has increased enormously as so many new caches are being placed, and they're no longer able to deal with processes like this.

 

Good luck with your cache, Crid!