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Land Mines!


Custheyder

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Not to start anything controversial, just a simple request. :D

 

Could the unwritten rules of posting to this forum please be written down and pinned at the top so that new posters don't get the legs blown off their threads when they accidentally step on one in their enthusiasm to post some news or a landmark in their geocaching life.

 

May I also suggest that thread locking is a last resort and that a pm from a moderator about a rule breach would give the poster a chance to rectify their error by editing their thread with minimum confrontation.

 

I feel that a psychic ability to "know" the rules of posting should not be a pre-requisit. In my opinion, if it's unwritten then it's not a rule.

 

Some thoughts for everyone to consider and a request for clarity.

 

Cust.

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In my experience of forums, most people don't read the faq before posting anyway, so having a pinned topic explaining the etiquette of the forum wouldn't do much good.

 

I'm not sure what you mean by 'getting their legs blown off'. We get a lot of threads here which have already been covered (like the 'which gps /which pda' type threads, but most of these either get answers or they get politely markwelled to the most recent thread covering the same topic.

 

I don't think I've ever seen a thread locked because someone hasn't followed the rules, apart from a few blatently obvious commercial spams, a few very non family friendly posts or inflammatory language. Generally, the moderators here only need to use a light touch and the forum users follow this. The rules here seem to be 'post as if you were talking face to face', which is how they should be.

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As NickPick said, don't let it put you off the forums.

 

Over the years there have been a number of occasions when things have gotten out of control, toys thrown out of prams, people disappearing in a huff, resignations from the powers that be, geocachers marching on Parliament, (OK, I might have made the last one up), and you're probably right, a simple do's and don'ts for topic starting pinned to the top might be useful.

 

When you started the topic I wondered how long it would be before you were "restrained". Annoying as it might be to have the thread locked, particularly for an inadvertent "infringement" as least you didn't get flamed which occasionally happens. :D

 

Also, this a chance to add my welcomes to you. Hope you continue to be as excited with the game as you are now.

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I think there is merit in this idea. I still use Usenet and read a few NGs there pretty often. Back when Usenet was the only option most NGs had a Group Etiquette post and a FAQ post which was posted on a regular basis (usually once a month) by a designated poster. A Forum Etiquette post would be a good idea. Anyone can post it and it can be bumped once a month if someone wants to take on the responsibility. That way it may get more notice than a pinned topic?

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I honestly don't want to go into the specifics that prompted me to post this request. It's not about that. Granted it's taken a shine off my enthusiasm, but my toys are still within my pram :huh:

 

It's about saving other new posters from making the same mistake, and suggesting a slight modification to the policing methods of the forum.

 

I own a forum of my own and I am involved with a very large forum on power kiting. Flame proof boxers come as standard. A simple set of Do's and Don'ts goes a long way in my experience. If the topic is pinned then moderators can always point at it and say "Sorry, but it is written in the rules posted at the top, please correct the infringement or we'll have to lock the thread or even delete it." This I have found to be far easier to accept by posters than an "unwritten rule" which requires a crystal ball.

 

Thanks for posting the FAQ's and General Rules, they don't mention the infringement that prompted this thread, that I can see. However I admit I have not read every word. :D

 

For those that were inadvertently offended by my other thread... sorry. :D

 

Cust.

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I honestly don't want to go into the specifics that prompted me to post this request. It's not about that. Granted it's taken a shine off my enthusiasm, but my toys are still within my pram :huh:

 

It's about saving other new posters from making the same mistake, and suggesting a slight modification to the policing methods of the forum.

 

I own a forum of my own and I am involved with a very large forum on power kiting. Flame proof boxers come as standard. A simple set of Do's and Don'ts goes a long way in my experience. If the topic is pinned then moderators can always point at it and say "Sorry, but it is written in the rules posted at the top, please correct the infringement or we'll have to lock the thread or even delete it." This I have found to be far easier to accept by posters than an "unwritten rule" which requires a crystal ball.

 

Thanks for posting the FAQ's and General Rules, they don't mention the infringement that prompted this thread, that I can see. However I admit I have not read every word. :D

 

For those that were inadvertently offended by my other thread... sorry. :D

 

Cust.

 

I was surprised to see that its not in the official forum guidelines as well ??

 

no offence taken perhaps a what makes a good cache lisiting thread would suit your needs :huh:

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no offense taken perhaps a what makes a good cache listing thread would suit your needs :D

 

There are many threads of that type already ... you only need to use the search facility. I read most of them before setting my first caches. I asked for a look-see to reassure myself that I had included everything that these posts suggested.

 

What I intended to do with this thread is expose the unwritten rule land mines that can catch a poster out and see if they can't become written. I could take offense at being sanctioned over a rule that is not an official rule. I'm not though because in general it is a sensible "guideline" not to promote your own caches. The forum would quickly fill with people advertising their latest and greatest. It is unfortunate that such a guideline does not help a new cache placer looking to pick the brains of the collected wisdom here about the quality of their listing. Most of us are capable of spotting the difference between a genuine post and a blatant advert with a poor excuse.

 

Take each post on merit. If it's of no interest, leave it to fall off the bottom of the page would be another suggestion.

 

Cust.

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Not to start anything controversial, just a simple request. ;)

 

Could the unwritten rules of posting to this forum please be written down and pinned at the top so that new posters don't get the legs blown off their threads when they accidentally step on one in their enthusiasm to post some news or a landmark in their geocaching life.

 

May I also suggest that thread locking is a last resort and that a pm from a moderator about a rule breach would give the poster a chance to rectify their error by editing their thread with minimum confrontation.

 

I feel that a psychic ability to "know" the rules of posting should not be a pre-requisit. In my opinion, if it's unwritten then it's not a rule.

 

Some thoughts for everyone to consider and a request for clarity.

 

Cust.

Hi Custheyder and welcome to the UK forum. I'm sorry I didn't reply sooner but I've been out all day.

 

You make a good point and we try to "go gently" on new visitors but I guess you just struck unlucky, sorry about that. I really hope you'll give us a second chance :ph34r:

 

In terms of general guidelines, all forum pages have a link at the top to the guidelines and these form a good basis. In terms of UK specific ones, we try to minimise any extra restrictions and I would just mention two. Firstly we don't allow threads specifically aimed at publicising caches, especially your own, but with the exception of Events. The odd exception can be made, as in the case of the LQ series, but in general such postings will be "edited away" :huh: .

 

Also it's good practice to do a quick search for similar topics before starting a new one. We try to give plenty of latitude with this and often allow a new thread to appear from time to time despite the same topic being brought up before. If necessary the mods will combine threads or maybe lock redundant ones.

 

Hopefully that's about it but I'm sure someone will bring up other things ;) , however stick to those and you should be fine.

 

As for pinning topics, this is always a difficult balance between making the existing ones clearly visible without going over the top and having so many that people just ignore them.

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You make a good point and we try to "go gently" on new visitors but I guess you just struck unlucky, sorry about that. I really hope you'll give us a second chance :huh:

 

I'm still here and posting, so no real harm done, but then I have a thick skin. :ph34r:

 

In terms of general guidelines, all forum pages have a link at the top to the guidelines and these form a good basis. In terms of UK specific ones, we try to minimise any extra restrictions and I would just mention two. Firstly we don't allow threads specifically aimed at publicising caches, especially your own, but with the exception of Events. The odd exception can be made, as in the case of the LQ series, but in general such postings will be "edited away" ;) .

 

"Specifically aimed at publicising" ... now that's where I take issue over my locked thread as it that was not the case at all. It was me getting over excited about publishing my first caches and looking for a sense check from a wider audience of the listing. Not many are going to jump on a boat or plane to come and do mine here in the Isle of Man, so publicising them is pointless to me. The locals spot them quick enough on their own! No option was given to "edit it away". It was locked, end of.

 

Also it's good practice to do a quick search for similar topics before starting a new one. We try to give plenty of latitude with this and often allow a new thread to appear from time to time despite the same topic being brought up before. If necessary the mods will combine threads or maybe lock redundant ones.

 

That I do any way, which is why I didn't start a thread about general guidelines for listing.

 

As for pinning topics, this is always a difficult balance between making the existing ones clearly visible without going over the top and having so many that people just ignore them.

 

This is the point of the thread I've started here. Discussing what happened to my last thread was not the intention. The problem is the "local rules" which the regulars know but the new posters have no way of knowing. It is those I feel should be right at the very top of the pinned list and the reason for starting the thread. If people ignore them, then it's their own fault if they run foul of the rules. If the rules are no where to be found then it's not the posters fault if any of the unwritten local rules are infringed. My thread didn't contravene any of the Groundspeak forum rules, which are published and I have read.

 

Something for the moderators and powers that be to discuss between themselves. I'm only bringing it to your attention as a possible sparking point for trouble in the future.

 

Cust.

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Cust,

I'm glad you're thick-skinned enough to keep posting after that rebuff! There are some unusual and peculiar posting rules on here, and many geocachers have fallen by the wayside over the years by transgressing unwittingly.

Hopefully, this incident won't cause disillusionment. I agree that there should be a guide to the "local rules".

But as you broke them, I think that your new caches should be suspended from the site until (say) a week on Saturday.

HH (back on the IOM soon (well, a week on Saturday)).

PS, e-mail me and I'll give you the other unwritten forum rules that I know of!

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I'm glad you're thick-skinned enough to keep posting after that rebuff!<snip>

 

What rebuff? If you mean Deceangi's closure post on the other thread then it wasn't rude or “buff” of any sort, I didn't think. Now the OP writer knows the particular protocol, he can avoid the mistake again. This is the first time that this particular topic has come up to my knowledge so perhaps the fact that it is an unwritten rule implies that it should be obvious. You wouldn’t go to a bank wearing a balaclava (some would!), which is obvious, and promoting your own caches when, having perused the forums, you see no evidence of any else’s doing it is equally so. The writer owns a forum, and should be more familiar than most with their little idiosyncrasies. The OP did mention blatant cache plugging and perhaps may have eschewed unwanted attention had he not done that.

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I understand the OP's frustration when this is a 9 page thread

Linky

 

Yup - I was going to say that it is not unheard of for folks in my region to post cache notices, particularly for some new caches in remote areas. That being said, it doesn't happen particularly often. I've never (in my vast 10 months of reading the forums) seen a thread locked because of it.

 

I don't think the moderator's closing post was rude. However, being geeks and all, we are the sorts who read the FAQs before posting. I think the OP's suggestion of posting these sorts of guidelines is a good one. It would reach at least some of the intended audience.

 

Have fun with the rest of your cache placements!

 

back to lurking :laughing:

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I have never said the closure notice was rude, or implied anything derogatory about any moderator. There are threads all over the forum in general announcing caches and there are even threads in here that announce them or are trying to generate interest before they are published. The difference being they didn't place a link and have not been closed.

 

Just because something doesn't happen very often does not make it obvious that it is not allowed. It does happen though, obfuscating the illegality even more.

 

What you lot do with goats in your spare time is your own business, but I'm pretty sure it's illegal!!! :laughing:

 

Again the purpose of this thread is to suggest the posting of local rules as a pinned topic and to suggest a slightly different approach to escalating infringements before a thread closure. De-railing a thread away from it's original topic is documented as as "Don't" in the general rules. :santa::santa:

 

Cust.

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Just because something doesn't happen very often does not make it obvious that it is not allowed. It does happen though, obfuscating the illegality even more.

 

Eschew obfuscations!

 

You are terribly good-natured about it all though and you'll do well on the forums. You make some fair points, I agree, but the liklihood of any change to "our" American way is pretty remote I would say: to see who's in charge, watch this -

 

"dadgum"* change to "dagnum"

 

See! :laughing:

 

*D A M N

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I'm a happy chap most of the time. Even more so as "those which cannot be mentioned" have been found and I've recieved some extremely positive feedback and encouragement from the finders by email and in the logs.

 

As to Americanism's that would be the topic of another thread durrnit! I always feel sorry for the folks that come from the place the Scunners Footie Club hail from. Mentioning their City name can get you thrown out and banned from some chat rooms. (Justified in my book! :laughing: )

 

No doubt a decision will be made on the topic of the thread eventually.

 

Cust.

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