bigskyguy Posted September 20, 2007 Share Posted September 20, 2007 I am going to buy one of these two, the 60CSX or the Vista HCX. It will mainly be outdoor use in mountainous areas hiking, hunting, fishing, backpacking and maybe some in car navigation occasionally but not a priority. I do not have access to either of these two to compare them side by side. With the $50 rebate of the CSX the price difference is not an issue, about $30. Many of the times I will be using them in cold weather. Are the buttons or controls for the CSX easier to navigate with gloves on as compared to the HCX? Each has strengths and weaknesses that have been discussed at great lengths on this forum. Just looking for some final advice before ordering. Thanks in advance for any help. Quote Link to comment
+Team Perrito Blanco Posted September 20, 2007 Share Posted September 20, 2007 Seeing as the 76 and 60 series still haven't received the "H" versions yet, I'm choosing to wait and see if/when that happens. Does anyone know if this is in the works? Quote Link to comment
CenTexDodger Posted September 20, 2007 Share Posted September 20, 2007 Seeing as the 76 and 60 series still haven't received the "H" versions yet, I'm choosing to wait and see if/when that happens. Does anyone know if this is in the works? The 76CSx and 60CSx ARE the H versions in that they both have the high sensitivity SiRFstar III chipset. I don't know what is in the works, but I would be willing to bet that there will be a new line that will replace the 60 series out sometime in the near future. Quote Link to comment
GreatCanadian Posted September 20, 2007 Share Posted September 20, 2007 Seeing as the 76 and 60 series still haven't received the "H" versions yet, I'm choosing to wait and see if/when that happens. Does anyone know if this is in the works? The 76CSx and 60CSx ARE the H versions in that they both have the high sensitivity SiRFstar III chipset. I don't know what is in the works, but I would be willing to bet that there will be a new line that will replace the 60 series out sometime in the near future. I think he means that he is going to wait to see if the 76 and 60 series receive the high sensitivity Mediatek chip instead of their current sirfstar chipset. It appears that the Mediatek may be just as good in regards to reception, while using less power. And cheaper too! Quote Link to comment
+casey97 Posted September 20, 2007 Share Posted September 20, 2007 If the H chip were used in a 60 style unit with the improved antanae, would that mean it would be even more accurate? Quote Link to comment
CenTexDodger Posted September 20, 2007 Share Posted September 20, 2007 If the H chip were used in a 60 style unit with the improved antanae, would that mean it would be even more accurate? I don't think so, I think it would be quite similar to the performance you have now with the 60CSx. The 60CSx is not any more accurate than the 60CS under good conditions. The big difference is that the 60CSx will continue to hold a signal long after the 60CS says "I giveup!" Quote Link to comment
+casey97 Posted September 20, 2007 Share Posted September 20, 2007 (edited) I thought the Cx and the CSx had the same chip. They are the same unit except the Cx does not have the electronic compass and barometric altimeter. This is the S (for Scientific) in the CSx. Garmin lists both as being high sensitivity. I did not know reception was any different between the 60Cx and 60 CSx. The reviews I have seen with side by side's of the Vista HCx and the 60CSx have shown them the be almost the same, with the H chip having the slight edge on occasion. How can the addition of a better antanae not improve this, to beyond the reception of both units? Unless the H chip is not compatable with the quad helix of the 60's. Edited September 20, 2007 by casey97 Quote Link to comment
CenTexDodger Posted September 20, 2007 Share Posted September 20, 2007 I thought the Cx and the CSx had the same chip. They do have the same chip. They are the same unit except the Cx does not have the electronic compass and barometric altimeter. This is the S (for Scientific) in the CSx. Garmin lists both as being high sensitivity. I did not know reception was any different between the 60Cx and 60 CSx. The reviews I have seen with side by side's of the Vista HCx and the 60CSx have shown them the be almost the same, with the H chip having the slight edge on occasion. How can the addition of a better antanae not improve this, to beyond the reception of both units? Unless the H chip is not compatable with the quad helix of the 60's. S is actually for sensors. I was comparing the 60CS to the 60CSx. The CSx is much more sensitive that the CS. I think you are mixing accuracy with reception. With a good view of the sky and the right sat configuration My 60CSx occasionally gives a full signal on all 12 channels--including WAAS. I would think it would be most accurate at these times and it will show accuracy of 9 feet. I don't see how having the H chip could be any more accurate. The antenna does not improve accuracy, it just helps it receive the signal in difficult conditions. Quote Link to comment
+Prime Suspect Posted September 20, 2007 Share Posted September 20, 2007 I thought the Cx and the CSx had the same chip. No, the "x" indicates that they use eXternal memory cards, and that they use the high sensitivity SiRFIII chipset. They are the same unit except the Cx does not have the electronic compass and barometric altimeter. This is the S (for Scientific) in the CSx. Not quite. The "S" is for Sensors. Quote Link to comment
gallet Posted September 21, 2007 Share Posted September 21, 2007 My guess is that there will be an updated 60CSx it probably will have a Media Tek chip but I think the new feature on any updated 60 will be the screen. As it is at the moment the 60 has an inferior screen to the HCx models, it is both lower resolution and less bright. So although it is bigger is shows less map area. If one is going to have a big unit with a big screen then it makes sense that the extra screen size should be used. So expect a new 60 series soon with the same size screen but much higher resolution and brighter too. Quote Link to comment
+briansnat Posted September 21, 2007 Share Posted September 21, 2007 I am going to buy one of these two, the 60CSX or the Vista HCX. It will mainly be outdoor use in mountainous areas hiking, hunting, fishing, backpacking and maybe some in car navigation occasionally but not a priority. I do not have access to either of these two to compare them side by side. With the $50 rebate of the CSX the price difference is not an issue, about $30. Many of the times I will be using them in cold weather. Are the buttons or controls for the CSX easier to navigate with gloves on as compared to the HCX? Each has strengths and weaknesses that have been discussed at great lengths on this forum. Just looking for some final advice before ordering. Thanks in advance for any help. Since hiking, backpacking, etc... are your primary use and automobile use is not a priority, go with the Vista HCX. It's more compact and lighter. The buttons on the side make for easy one hand use, but make operation in the car a bit difficult. If you plan on using the unit in the car a lot I'd recommend the 60CSX because it's easier to operate with the buttons on the front. Quote Link to comment
gallet Posted September 21, 2007 Share Posted September 21, 2007 If you plan on using the unit in the car a lot I'd recommend the 60CSX because it's easier to operate with the buttons on the front. I haven't used a unit in a car yet so I don't know how it's used but once a route is programmed in, don't you just follow the screen? Do you really need to keep pressing buttons. Surely ease of reading the screen and seeing the route is more important. Quote Link to comment
freeday Posted September 21, 2007 Share Posted September 21, 2007 i have both and use both units. hcx for: walking, running, hiking, visiting a city csx for: boat, canoe, car, MTB or if the smaller size is not necessary for me the buttons are much better of the hcx (especially with gloves) - Pressing the keys is for my fingers ~50% faster on the csx but sometimes the smaller size of the hcx is the reason to take not the csx. You should try both units in a store (use the keys for 15-20 minutes and compare both units) - that will be the only way to give you an decission. do not compare only the data-sheets in the internet. It is not easy If i had to give away one unit. i am not sure which one i should take. Quote Link to comment
gallet Posted September 21, 2007 Share Posted September 21, 2007 @'freeday Hi, freeday, can I take this opportunity to ask you if the brightness of the HCx makes it more usable in a car, when having a quick glance at the screen. (disregarding the buttons for the moment and assuming that both units are illuminated at 100%) Quote Link to comment
+Alan2 Posted September 21, 2007 Share Posted September 21, 2007 I don't know what is in the works, but I would be willing to bet that there will be a new line that will replace the 60 series out sometime in the near future. That's a pretty safe bet. Technology marches on. The question is what will be the new features. My guess is will include voice navigation commands rather than the "beeps". I believe Magellan already has one that combines off road handheld with on-road voice navigation. Of course I would never get a Magellan and would wait for a Garmin, but that's another story. Quote Link to comment
gallet Posted September 22, 2007 Share Posted September 22, 2007 @='Alan2' That's a pretty safe bet. Technology marches on. The question is what will be the new features. As I said, if it doesn't have the same fine resolution screen as the HCx then it is wasting it's size. Quote Link to comment
freeday Posted September 22, 2007 Share Posted September 22, 2007 (edited) @'freeday Hi, freeday, can I take this opportunity to ask you if the brightness of the HCx makes it more usable in a car, when having a quick glance at the screen. (disregarding the buttons for the moment and assuming that both units are illuminated at 100%) please look at the pics on http://www.naviboard.de/vb/showthread.php?...8352#post158352 (the 2. and 3. pic especially) The HCX has a brighter screen but it is smaller. On driving a car a bigger screen may be better (also a brighter Screen may be better) So i prefer the CSX in the car because the button-operation is easier. If i had to choose only because of the display, i don't know. The batterie and SAT-Status is also displayed always on the CSX. (Power-typ, 2d/3d-Reception, USB, Light, Compass) It is not displayd on the HCX !!! Therefore you have to press a button It might be important to know if you have a 3d/2d-reception or not. (The next step is NO reception and it takes some seconds to know it - so if you have 3D it is fine) I normally use a TomTom for Car-Navigation with voice-command. It is saver for travelling to use a voice command. Edited September 22, 2007 by freeday Quote Link to comment
+ergomaniac Posted September 22, 2007 Share Posted September 22, 2007 (edited) On driving a car a bigger screen may be better... http://www.naviboard.de/vb/showthread.php?...8352#post158352 As mentioned in other threads on this forum, DPI may be a more important consideration than screen size. If you take a close look at the screen shots in the link above, the map screens clearly show that the etrex is giving you more map coverage than the 60csx even though it has a smaller screen. Both GPS's show a scale of 300 ft but the etrex shows quite a bit more of the river to the east, the 60csx cuts it off. In all other directions the coverage appears to be identical. The features on the 60csx are "bigger" but not as sharp. The greater screen resolution of the etrex may allow you to zoom in more and maintain a wider area of coverage. (BTW - I own a 60cx and use it for car nav but I often have to put on my glasses to see the screen detail) Edited September 22, 2007 by ergomaniac Quote Link to comment
gallet Posted September 22, 2007 Share Posted September 22, 2007 (edited) Screen size and resolution are tied to each other. That is, if the HCx is 10% closer then it is the same as the 60. So size and resolution is really a bit of a red herring. It's brightness that makes things visible when trying to gather information quickly, which is what you will want to do when driving. The higher contrast arrow is smaller Edited September 22, 2007 by gallet Quote Link to comment
bigskyguy Posted September 24, 2007 Author Share Posted September 24, 2007 Thanks for all the help, my decision has been made, the HCX is on the way. Quote Link to comment
jcc123 Posted September 24, 2007 Share Posted September 24, 2007 (edited) Anyone hear about a new Sirf chipset coming that suppose to use less power and be MORE sensitive than Sirf 3? My cousin just said something about it. I hope they put that in the next 60 series! Voice navigation would be nice too but somehow I don't think that would happen because Garmin wouldn't want it to compete with their Nuvi line. Edited September 24, 2007 by jcc123 Quote Link to comment
+GOT GPS? Posted September 24, 2007 Share Posted September 24, 2007 With the current trend, there should be an update to the 60 and 76 series at the 2008 CES next January. Garmin should have something by January or Feb. Quote Link to comment
+Alan2 Posted September 24, 2007 Share Posted September 24, 2007 Anyone hear about a new Sirf chipset coming that suppose to use less power and be MORE sensitive than Sirf 3? My cousin just said something about it. I hope they put that in the next 60 series! Voice navigation would be nice too but somehow I don't think that would happen because Garmin wouldn't want it to compete with their Nuvi line. I agree they don't want to compete with their own line. However if their competitor Magellan Crossover does it, they would have to follow suit otherwise lose business to Magellan. Quote Link to comment
+Alan2 Posted September 24, 2007 Share Posted September 24, 2007 Plus, as a user of both Nuvi and Vista, a combined unit would be just what I would want as a geocacher - something that easily loads the caches like my PPC with Mapopolis that has both voice commands and cache icons overlaying the street maps. Quote Link to comment
+SidAndBob Posted September 25, 2007 Share Posted September 25, 2007 Many of these differences are pretty trivial. A far more important improvement would be if the Topo maps were updated with even more detail. The CSx (and I'm sure the H series too) will hold a signal in almost any conditions. For me all other features are irrelvant in comparison. Garmin could add some real value to the geocacher by integrating a Cachemate type application into the units instead of messing around with their ridiculous Geocaching mode and GPS games (which I have never used in the 18 months I've had the unit). Quote Link to comment
jcc123 Posted September 26, 2007 Share Posted September 26, 2007 Many of these differences are pretty trivial. A far more important improvement would be if the Topo maps were updated with even more detail. The CSx (and I'm sure the H series too) will hold a signal in almost any conditions. For me all other features are irrelvant in comparison. Garmin could add some real value to the geocacher by integrating a Cachemate type application into the units instead of messing around with their ridiculous Geocaching mode and GPS games (which I have never used in the 18 months I've had the unit). I don't think Garmin owns the Map data so they have no say in how or when to update them? I know that's true for the street maps but the Topo? More useful applications is a good idea. Part of the problem with Garmin is that they have way too many models with minor features separating them. The CEO Ming doesn't seem to know what people want so he makes everything hopeing that it sticks. They also tend to follow the industry rather than lead it even though they have more market share than anyone else. This all goes back to poor leadership. Imagine if they had a Steve Jobs type at the helm. They would have far fewer models and much better, feature rich units instead of the kitchen sink way of doing business. After all, most of the people on this forum are amatures when it comes to the GPS industry and even WE know what features to include to make a best of breed product! Think how dumb of a CEO you would have to be to not be able to figure that out? Quote Link to comment
jcc123 Posted September 26, 2007 Share Posted September 26, 2007 Plus, as a user of both Nuvi and Vista, a combined unit would be just what I would want as a geocacher - something that easily loads the caches like my PPC with Mapopolis that has both voice commands and cache icons overlaying the street maps. I want to have something like that as much as anyone else but I just don't think Garmin knows what the hell they're doing. Quote Link to comment
+Alan2 Posted September 27, 2007 Share Posted September 27, 2007 I don't think Garmin owns the Map data so they have no say in how or when to update them? I know that's true for the street maps but the Topo? Topo comes from the USGS topo maps. Many are very old - old as the hills so to speak (sorry, couldn't resist). While USGS has updated, many are still decades old. Imagine if they had a Steve Jobs type at the helm. Well, let's see. They would charge $600 for their new GPS thingamajig and then two months later lower the price to $400. And lose half their geocaching loyalists. Fact is Garmin leadership has led them to a majority of the market. They've done that for a reason. You can't knock success. Quote Link to comment
Newb888 Posted September 27, 2007 Share Posted September 27, 2007 (edited) I think I am going to get the 60CSX. Just not sure when. I have seen the screen size of the 60 and HCX and for me in the car, the larger screen of the 60 is what I need. I really hate the small screen of my Etrex Legend so I need this to be a worthwhile upgrade with a screen that I can quickly glance at and see as much info as possible. I never really had a problem with brightness with my Etrex Legend. I have grown accustomed to the joystick of the Etrex but I do need the beeps or voice guidance for road trips. I must say that I don't like the fact that 60CSX is now old and still pricey. I am not so sure Garmin will be using the new chipset in any new models of the 60CSX. They just launched the Nuvi 7xx series and they are still using SIRFIII. However, the antenna is now internal as opposed to external. Edited September 27, 2007 by Newb888 Quote Link to comment
+kenk Posted September 27, 2007 Share Posted September 27, 2007 Two differences between the eTrex HCx and the GPSMAP CSx not yet mentioned are: 1. The 60 series units have a connector for an external antenna. 2. The 60 & 76 series unit have a quad helix antenna which works with the unit held in both vertical and horizontal positions. The eTrex units have patch antennas which do best when held horizontally, though with the high sensativity receiver it would probably work OK in either position. Quote Link to comment
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