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CharlesIsland

Off Your Rocker Series

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Yes, Micheal has said he is on the job here. Maybe we should all just sit back and watch the process. CI was the one who brought this to our attention, but someone with the proper contact channels (such as Micheal) should be the one heading this.

 

I agree that too many people trying to get an answer might get an answer which isn't favorable! Hey...and I haven't even tried one of these (nor do I have an opinion as to the series)!

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Michael, Mtn-man, and Quiggle all asked for us not to contact them further. Michael is the appropriate contact for this issue and he's on it. If a bunch of us also bug them, they will merely tell us to get lost.

 

Please let TPTB handle it.

 

Maybe i am looking at this wrong but i have a different opinion. A person needs to take action if this is important to them. There are times when it is good to let a single person speak for many but i'm not sure this is one of those times. These caches are not the property of Groundspeak. They are the property of individuals, and those individuals should be the ones asking about Cracker Barrel's new policy. It stands to reason that one person's voice is most likely not going to be heard as well. I can tell you right now that if i had a vested interest (owned one of the caches affected or really liked finding them), i wouldn't hesitate to contact CB and express my concerns. Seems obvious to me that the more who do this, the faster that CB will look into the matter, and i believe, the better the chances would be for a favorable outcome.

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Michael, Mtn-man, and Quiggle all asked for us not to contact them further. Michael is the appropriate contact for this issue and he's on it. If a bunch of us also bug them, they will merely tell us to get lost.

 

Please let TPTB handle it.

Maybe i am looking at this wrong but i have a different opinion. A person needs to take action if this is important to them. There are times when it is good to let a single person speak for many but i'm not sure this is one of those times. These caches are not the property of Groundspeak. They are the property of individuals, and those individuals should be the ones asking about Cracker Barrel's new policy. It stands to reason that one person's voice is most likely not going to be heard as well. I can tell you right now that if i had a vested interest (owned one of the caches affected or really liked finding them), i wouldn't hesitate to contact CB and express my concerns. Seems obvious to me that the more who do this, the faster that CB will look into the matter, and i believe, the better the chances would be for a favorable outcome.
Faster doesn't necessarily guarantee a positive outcome. If a person is bombarded with requests, it becomes more likely that they will make a quick decision that 1) will stop the requests and 2) will not require them to overstep their authority and get in trouble later. In this case, that answer is to tell us to get lost.

 

I'm deeply concerned that the more people contacting CB, that the more likely that they'll give that easy answer and tell us to take our caches and play somewhere else. With more people contacting them, we also run the risk of having some people who have less than perfect tact or are poor negotiators. Both possibilities lead to a negative response.

Edited by sbell111

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As I recall, during the SC fiasco...

You recall wrong. There were a lot of folks involved in the efforts to head the legislation. I certainly didn't tell anyone directly involved to back off as you are.

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Michael, Mtn-man, and Quiggle all asked for us not to contact them further. Michael is the appropriate contact for this issue and he's on it. If a bunch of us also bug them, they will merely tell us to get lost.

 

Please let TPTB handle it.

Maybe i am looking at this wrong but i have a different opinion. A person needs to take action if this is important to them. There are times when it is good to let a single person speak for many but i'm not sure this is one of those times. These caches are not the property of Groundspeak. They are the property of individuals, and those individuals should be the ones asking about Cracker Barrel's new policy. It stands to reason that one person's voice is most likely not going to be heard as well. I can tell you right now that if i had a vested interest (owned one of the caches affected or really liked finding them), i wouldn't hesitate to contact CB and express my concerns. Seems obvious to me that the more who do this, the faster that CB will look into the matter, and i believe, the better the chances would be for a favorable outcome.
Faster doesn't necessarily guarantee a positive outcome. If a person is bombarded with requests, it becomes more likely that they will make a quick decision that 1) will stop the requests and 2) will not require them to overstep their authority and get in trouble later. In this case, that answer is to tell us to get lost.

 

I'm deeply concerned that the more people contacting CB, that the more likely that they'll give that easy answer and tell us to take our caches and play somewhere else. With more people contacting them, we also run the risk of having some people who have less than perfect tact or are poor negotiators. Both possibilities lead to a negative response.

 

I understand what you are saying but i can't imagine that Cracker Barrel would tell us (potential customers) to get lost. It still seems like it would be better to make sure that Cracker Barrel knows that there are more than just a couple of people who are concerned about this. While i'm sure that Michael has stated to CB that he is speaking for the geocaching community as a whole, i still believe that there's strength in numbers and this strength is shown by the number of individual contacts made to the company. This is a petition of sorts, the more names on it, the more impact it will have for the making of a favorable decision.

 

Changing the ending of your quote as to the way i think it might read:

If a person is bombarded with requests, it becomes more likely that they will make a quick decision that 1) will stop the requests and 2)
make those who are bombarding him (again, potential customers) happy! :unsure:

 

Just like writing your congressman, one letter is likely not going to be important enough to grab his or her attention. More letters though, means that he or she is probably going to take a look at a specific situation more closely and in a more timely manner.

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Y'all go ahead and ignore GC's request that we allow them to deal with this.

 

Let's ignore that one company with a huge user base speaking to another company who like to share that user base through a singular communication channel is probably better than a bunch of individuals flooding someone's communication channels.

 

Let's also ignore the fact that some of those individuals do not always act with the tact needed to address this issue and that Michael is probably skilled in this area since he deals with these issues regularly.

 

Everyone go ahead and just ignore the very good advice that has been given.

 

That will probably ensure that several .1 mile radii open up around Crackle Barrels around the nation very soon.

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Where is this "blanket policy" on their site? I cannot find it. There's a CB near a cache I have already. I'd be willing to plant one. This is the first I'm hearing about OYR caches.

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I'm deeply concerned...
Why? You even have a dog in this hunt?
Everyone who enjoys these caches has 'a dog in the hunt'. Since you are on record as not enjoying what the bulk of these caches are, perhaps you are the one without 'a dog in the hunt'.

 

It would appear that your motivations are closer to those that I feared.

Edited by sbell111

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May I respectfully suggest that the side comments and the "along the edge" discussion be taken to Email or PM. It isn't helping this thread at all.

 

Thank you.

 

As a follow up. The gentleman I work with has been of the office and should return early next week. I am waiting his return to speak to him.

Edited by Michael

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Wow, I didn't realize the can I was opening with this thread.

 

Update: I made one call and one call only to the contact found in the bookmark for OYR caches. I left a message and still haven't had any response. That is all I plan on doing at this point. The woman that sent me the original emails also left me a voice message to my cell phone leaving a number if I had any further questions. I don't really plan on calling her either. Again, if I get any response from my initial contact I will post it here.

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Wow, I didn't realize the can I was opening with this thread.

 

Update: I made one call and one call only to the contact found in the bookmark for OYR caches. I left a message and still haven't had any response. That is all I plan on doing at this point. The woman that sent me the original emails also left me a voice message to my cell phone leaving a number if I had any further questions. I don't really plan on calling her either. Again, if I get any response from my initial contact I will post it here.

 

You did the right thing by bringing this to everyone's attention. Unfortunately sometimes we get side tracked from the topic at hand.

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Here is the official response from Cracker Barrel regarding geocaches placed on Cracker Barrel property

 

Michael,

 

Unfortunately we have had a change in policy regarding Geocaching. We are unable to allow geocachers to hide geocaches on our premises. Sorry for the change in policy.

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Here is the official response from Cracker Barrel regarding geocaches placed on Cracker Barrel property

 

Michael,

 

Unfortunately we have had a change in policy regarding Geocaching. We are unable to allow geocachers to hide geocaches on our premises. Sorry for the change in policy.

 

So does this mean all CB caches must be instantly archived?

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Here is the official response from Cracker Barrel regarding geocaches placed on Cracker Barrel property

 

Michael,

 

Unfortunately we have had a change in policy regarding Geocaching. We are unable to allow geocachers to hide geocaches on our premises. Sorry for the change in policy.

 

So does this mean all CB caches must be instantly archived?

If this is the final word then I guess it's okay to contact CB Customer Relations via email or snail mail to politely express our disappointment with their decision?? Edited by Trinity's Crew

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Two questions, already asked:

So does this mean all CB caches must be instantly archived?
...or does it just mean no new ones?
Was there a reason given by the corporate execs?
...and if so, what was it?

 

Thanks for all you do, Michael. :lol:

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Two questions, already asked:

So does this mean all CB caches must be instantly archived?
...or does it just mean no new ones?
Was there a reason given by the corporate execs?
...and if so, what was it?

 

Thanks for all you do, Michael. :D

 

You know as much as I do at the moment. If/when I hear more I will post it here.

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Here is the official response from Cracker Barrel regarding geocaches placed on Cracker Barrel property

 

Michael,

 

Unfortunately we have had a change in policy regarding Geocaching. We are unable to allow geocachers to hide geocaches on our premises. Sorry for the change in policy.

 

 

After getting the emails and voice mails I was curious as to how much more official it was going to be. I guess there was a slight bit of hope. Thanks Mike.

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Here is the official response from Cracker Barrel regarding geocaches placed on Cracker Barrel property

 

Michael,

 

Unfortunately we have had a change in policy regarding Geocaching. We are unable to allow geocachers to hide geocaches on our premises. Sorry for the change in policy.

 

 

After getting the emails and voice mails I was curious as to how much more official it was going to be. I guess there was a slight bit of hope. Thanks Mike.

 

Why do Charles Island's posts look different than everyone elses? On firefox only, and I'm not making this up. Really. <_< To stay on topic, I'd think the chances of existing OYR's being grandfathered is practically nil. I've been wrong before though.

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Why do Charles Island's posts look different than everyone elses? On firefox only, and I'm not making this up.

I see it in Firefox, too. Don't see it in IE. I suspect there is something in his sig line that the forum software, rendering through Firefox, isn't handling correctly.

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Kind of looks like the close comment tag is not correct for the stumble upon statement. Perhaps if he removes it? It serves no purpose that I can see anyway.

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Why do Charles Island's posts look different than everyone elses? On firefox only, and I'm not making this up.

I see it in Firefox, too. Don't see it in IE. I suspect there is something in his sig line that the forum software, rendering through Firefox, isn't handling correctly.

 

Interesting . . . I don't see anything different using Opera 9.23. <_<

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Why do Charles Island's posts look different than everyone elses? On firefox only, and I'm not making this up.

I see it in Firefox, too. Don't see it in IE. I suspect there is something in his sig line that the forum software, rendering through Firefox, isn't handling correctly.

 

Interesting . . . I don't see anything different using Opera 9.23. <_<

I see it in Firefox too.

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This is an important thread that many are following. Let's stay on topic, please.

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"I am not sure how they plan on dealing with the hundreds of caches placed at Cracker Barrels across the US, but my feeling is that they may be gone all together in the future."

 

Perhaps this was answered already, but since you have such an effectve communications channel with these people, did you ask them? <_<

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I'm deeply concerned...
Why? You even have a dog in this hunt?
Everyone who enjoys these caches has 'a dog in the hunt'. Since you are on record as not enjoying what the bulk of these caches are, perhaps you are the one without 'a dog in the hunt'.

 

It would appear that your motivations are closer to those that I feared.

 

GC.com has some expertise, but doesn't actually place caches as a corporate entity.

Cache owners are impacted but CB cuts across state lines. There is no national organization ready to tackle such things. There are some state organizations who are ready to tackle this. They are the best party at this point in time.

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....Michael is an appropriate contact. There is no downside to letting him be the singular contact point.

...

 

Groundspeaks policy of secrecy does not bode for having them work for the common good.

 

Locally we have a hospital. They wanted to take the hospital new directions but had funding issues. Their current public status as an arm of the county got in the way of that. There were offers to go private, go public, go non profit. The county commissioners were tempted by the up front payment to go private. The county citizens had a preference for non profit. The hospital board had their own views.

 

Something finally got decided. Everyone with any power signed a non disclosure agreement. No nobody knows the real answer. I believe we do need closed door meetings at time to discuss things frankly. However the end result, and must of the process needs to be open.

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I'm deeply concerned...
Why? You even have a dog in this hunt?
Everyone who enjoys these caches has 'a dog in the hunt'. Since you are on record as not enjoying what the bulk of these caches are, perhaps you are the one without 'a dog in the hunt'.

 

It would appear that your motivations are closer to those that I feared.

 

GC.com has some expertise, but doesn't actually place caches as a corporate entity.

Cache owners are impacted but CB cuts across state lines. There is no national organization ready to tackle such things. There are some state organizations who are ready to tackle this. They are the best party at this point in time.

This makes sense. You can't negotiate with a group you don't have. But I wouldn't approach CB with several different state organizations because you will annoy them. So these organizations should at least coordinate their activities.

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I'm sure that it is only a matter of time before I have to archive my Cracker Barrel cache but at least I'll have this log to remember = "Log Date: 9/13/2007

Ok, finally logging a couple caches I found a week and a half ago. Of all the "Off Your Rocker" series, this is probably the best done cache of the series (that I've done) simply because this is not a simple little "stock" micro. Thanks! "

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Here is the official response from Cracker Barrel regarding geocaches placed on Cracker Barrel property

 

Michael,

 

Unfortunately we have had a change in policy regarding Geocaching. We are unable to allow geocachers to hide geocaches on our premises. Sorry for the change in policy.

 

 

After getting the emails and voice mails I was curious as to how much more official it was going to be. I guess there was a slight bit of hope. Thanks Mike.

 

Why do Charles Island's posts look different than everyone elses? On firefox only, and I'm not making this up. Really. :laughing: To stay on topic, I'd think the chances of existing OYR's being grandfathered is practically nil. I've been wrong before though.

 

I am not sure why my posts look different. I do have the stumble thing and noticed it is in my sig. If it is not allowed or is causing problems, please let me know and I will remove it.

 

On Topic: I have been getting great logs on the two OYR caches that I have. I will be sad to see them go, but I am not worried about it. We will find something else, I have been working on another series just after I started caching. Maybe some of you would be interested in helping... if so send me a message. I don't want to irritate the topic police. :laughing:

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It might be useful to estimate how many meals CB has sold due to the caches on their property. 200 caches, 1 of 10 visitors eat there, say most people cache with a partner... each cache with at least 50 visits...

 

200 * (10% of 50) * 2 = 4000 meals?

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We will find something else, I have been working on another series just after I started caching. Maybe some of you would be interested in helping... if so send me a message. I don't want to irritate the topic police. :laughing:

 

I would, but I cant figure out how to pm you on this forum. I dont know if you just dont have it turned on, or if the weird way your post comes out is preventing me from seeing the button to pm you. Feel free to initiate contact with me and let me know how to help.

 

I wont be contacting CB, but I wont be eating there any more either.

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I wont be contacting CB, but I wont be eating there any more either.

 

 

You should contact them. Tell them you won't be doing business with them and why. Tell them what business you have done with them that will now be going elsewhere. They need to know that. If they don't hear anything about it they will assume they have made a great decision.

 

If there really are the numbers of people that geocache who are upset and make it known to CB they may come to understand the ramifications of their policy change. Let the local store owners know as well. They are the ones that will feel it the most.

 

Take geocaching out of the mix. If any company that you have be doing business with made a change in a policy that you disliked so much that you would no longer do business with them, won't you let them know? This is no different.

 

On the other hand it may not really matter to them. But that tells you something as well. What are they going to do ... not allow any more caches to be placed there?

 

I have never done an OYR cache but I have eaten at CB. Just as it is their choice to make this policy I have plenty of options of where I can do business. CB has removed themselves from consideration.

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I'm deeply concerned...
Why? You even have a dog in this hunt?
Everyone who enjoys these caches has 'a dog in the hunt'. Since you are on record as not enjoying what the bulk of these caches are, perhaps you are the one without 'a dog in the hunt'.

 

It would appear that your motivations are closer to those that I feared.

GC.com has some expertise, but doesn't actually place caches as a corporate entity.

Cache owners are impacted but CB cuts across state lines. There is no national organization ready to tackle such things. There are some state organizations who are ready to tackle this. They are the best party at this point in time.

My previous posts were made prior to CB's reply to Michael. I felt that, pending that reply and any formal decision by CB, it was best not to minimize the points of contact.

 

Since they have responded, it's now a whole new ball game, in my opinion.

Edited by sbell111

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I wont be contacting CB, but I wont be eating there any more either.

 

 

You should contact them. Tell them you won't be doing business with them and why. Tell them what business you have done with them that will now be going elsewhere. They need to know that. If they don't hear anything about it they will assume they have made a great decision.

 

If there really are the numbers of people that geocache who are upset and make it known to CB they may come to understand the ramifications of their policy change. Let the local store owners know as well. They are the ones that will feel it the most.

 

Take geocaching out of the mix. If any company that you have be doing business with made a change in a policy that you disliked so much that you would no longer do business with them, won't you let them know? This is no different.

 

On the other hand it may not really matter to them. But that tells you something as well. What are they going to do ... not allow any more caches to be placed there?

 

I have never done an OYR cache but I have eaten at CB. Just as it is their choice to make this policy I have plenty of options of where I can do business. CB has removed themselves from consideration.

 

Ditto that! :laughing:

 

If i had something at stake, then i wouldn't just sit back and let things take their course. I still say that contacting CB and letting them know how you feel is the what needs to be done. Seems obvious to me that the more people who do this, the harder they'll look into the situation.

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As I recall, during the SC fiasco...

You recall wrong. There were a lot of folks involved in the efforts to head the legislation. I certainly didn't tell anyone directly involved to back off as you are.

In dealing with elected officials, numbers are important. Often, a vote is swayed by the amount and direction of the feedback received. In this case, it is a corporate entity that is being contacted, and to allow a single representative to make contact on behalf of many is the proper first step. If this person is not successful, and the corporate official needs public persuasion, that comes later.

 

Then we get to bombard with phone calls and letters and hound them off the face of the planet!! :P:P

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....Michael is an appropriate contact. There is no downside to letting him be the singular contact point.

...

 

Groundspeaks policy of secrecy does not bode for having them work for the common good.

 

Locally we have a hospital. They wanted to take the hospital new directions but had funding issues. Their current public status as an arm of the county got in the way of that. There were offers to go private, go public, go non profit. The county commissioners were tempted by the up front payment to go private. The county citizens had a preference for non profit. The hospital board had their own views.

 

Something finally got decided. Everyone with any power signed a non disclosure agreement. No nobody knows the real answer. I believe we do need closed door meetings at time to discuss things frankly. However the end result, and must of the process needs to be open.

 

Please stop trying to contact Cracker Barrel corporate headquarters, except for Michael. He is on top of it

 

Here in the local are of Cracker Barrel corporate headquarters, we have two geocachers that work there, they can do more good than all the emails from disgruntled cachers

 

Please let Michael do his thing

 

Joe

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Groundspeaks policy of secrecy does not bode for having them work for the common good.

 

Locally we have a hospital. They wanted to take the hospital new directions but had funding issues. Their current public status as an arm of the county got in the way of that. There were offers to go private, go public, go non profit. The county commissioners were tempted by the up front payment to go private. The county citizens had a preference for non profit. The hospital board had their own views.

 

Something finally got decided. Everyone with any power signed a non disclosure agreement. No nobody knows the real answer. I believe we do need closed door meetings at time to discuss things frankly. However the end result, and must of the process needs to be open.

...

 

I took the liberty of removing the parts of your post that had nothing to do with my post and left the parts that do.

 

Did you have something real to ask, or a counterpoint to make, or anything at all related to the post?

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...You know as much as I do at the moment. If/when I hear more I will post it here.

 

Excellent: Thanks.

 

I would suggest that if after a reasonable amount of time you don't hear anything that you post that as well. That is also a responce worth knowing about.

Edited by Renegade Knight

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Here is the official response from Cracker Barrel regarding geocaches placed on Cracker Barrel property

 

Michael,

 

Unfortunately we have had a change in policy regarding Geocaching. We are unable to allow geocachers to hide geocaches on our premises. Sorry for the change in policy.

 

Reading the thread in bits, screws up responces.

 

This is a corporate non answer. It's quick, expedient, and worthless. They had a reason for the policy change and they can share. There is no reason not to share it unless it would do more harm than good. For example it's a stupid reason such as "Our new VP thinks geocaching is stupid" and naturally CB would not want to advertise that even if they are stuck with the new VP's policy.

 

In this light, I'd say anyone at all contacting CB is fair enough. Enough pressure and maybe the lines of communications would open up to a real level.

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Is Michael still doing his thing?

My money would say that he asked for a clarification knowing full well he got a non answer. If corporate policy wins the day though there won't be a follow up of any significance. In other words either zero follow up, or a rehash of more of the same non answer.

 

Corporate Policy often ties the hands of the people forced to respond. The mucky muck who makes the 'don't say anything rule' isn't the one who has to live with it. They are the ones who get to break the rule if a problem rises to their level.

 

Guess who can never be the hero? An off the table phone call can shed some light, but you have to have inside information to know who to talk to, or have someone inside tell you the real deal.

 

That there are geocachers who work for CB is a good thing if they have some sway, or at least can shed light on what's really going on.

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