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Not logging DNF's


cbearw
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Hi all: I have noticed a number of people don't log their D.N.F's (Did Not Find's) To each his own I guess but I log mine in hopes that if their is a problem with some aspect of the cache that the owner might be more quickly informed and deal with it. I think most CO's would go check their cache after a few D.N.F.'s. As the owner of a few caches I know I would appreciate knowing if people are having difficulties finding my caches. I was wondering what the rationale for not logging D.N.F.'s is. :D .

Thanks..............Tom

Edited by cbearw
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That's easy...who wants to admit failure?! I am a newbie and have a few unlogged DNF's under my belt. I assumed it was due to my inexperience and did not want to cause the placer unwanted worry/grief. I guess I can start logging DNF's with a "Newbie Disclaimer". (I will go back and I WILL find them!!)

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I log them personally for my own records more than anything. I always note if I simply didn't look very hard, so as not to alarm the cache owner. I also log them so I know which caches need to be avenged. I don't like to let a DNF stand, and I usually wait for another find or two so I know that it IS there before going back and trying a little harder.

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That's easy...who wants to admit failure?! I am a newbie and have a few unlogged DNF's under my belt. I assumed it was due to my inexperience and did not want to cause the placer unwanted worry/grief. I guess I can start logging DNF's with a "Newbie Disclaimer". (I will go back and I WILL find them!!)

No need to be concerned about giving cache owners reason to worry - I'm pretty sure most cache owners don't sweat the occasional DNF. You also don't need to provide a disclaimer (unless you just want to) because find counts are shown next to log entries. Many cache owners use find count as kind of a rough gauge of experience.

 

I log my DNFs, because I like to keep a record of all my caching experiences.

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I log them all. I think they are a valuable tool for the the owner and other seekers.

 

My son doesn't log his, just because he's 10 does all of his caching with me, anyway and it would just magnify what is really a single instance of a DNF. Plus, he's slow enough logging his finds, that I don't push him on these.

Edited by DudleyGrunt
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Thanks all: I can understand not logging a DNF if one is inexperianced or intends to go back to that cache soon but some of the folks I noticed that dont log them have several hundred finds under their belt. Perhaps I shouldn't concern myself with how others approach this but it indirectly or directly affects how other cachers or cache owners might view the cache after they read the logs or don't get to the read a DNF. I see lots of postings here stating the virtues of posting their DNF's. There must be a few cachers out there who consistantly don't post them. Am still wondering why? Perhaps there are a few more good reasons other than "admitting defeat" for not posting DNF's?...............Tom

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I log them for several reasons:

  • Alert the owner to a possible problem
  • to record what happened - I looked and did not find
  • as a sort of marker that says I was there
  • as a way to communicate to others that it may be difficult
  • in some cases to record issues with the area around the cache - not necessarily the cache itself

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That's easy...who wants to admit failure?! I am a newbie and have a few unlogged DNF's under my belt. I assumed it was due to my inexperience and did not want to cause the placer unwanted worry/grief. I guess I can start logging DNF's with a "Newbie Disclaimer". (I will go back and I WILL find them!!)

 

As a cache owner I look at each DNF and look at the cachers log and find count to judge their "newbie" status. If I hid the cache so that a newbie should be able to find it...I get concerned. If it's a hard find and a newbie can't get it all that easily I won't sweat it so much.

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Folks, we need to log those DNFs.

 

First, it may let the cache owner know that a check-up may be needed. If I was to see 2 or 3 in a row on one of my caches, I would have to get there quick.

 

Second, it is a record of your attempt. It shows that you were out trying, not watching the idiot box. It can also serve as a challange to you, to get back there and erase that frownie.

 

Third, for a hide meant to be difficult, it can serve as an "attaboy" to the hider.

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I log sometimes and other times I don't. If I've had a big caching day like 20 caches, then logging all finds is plenty of logging. Lately though I have been trying to log them more, because I want the owner to know if there is a string of DNFs developing like you do. One other reason I don't log them sometimes is because I don't want someone sending me hints. Now I just write "Please don't send me any hints" as the first line of DNF's.

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Folks, we need to log those DNFs.

 

First, it may let the cache owner know that a check-up may be needed. If I was to see 2 or 3 in a row on one of my caches, I would have to get there quick.

 

Second, it is a record of your attempt. It shows that you were out trying, not watching the idiot box. It can also serve as a challange to you, to get back there and erase that frownie.

 

Third, for a hide meant to be difficult, it can serve as an "attaboy" to the hider.

 

I'll disagree with this synopsis wholeheartedly!

 

First, I'll decide if I think the owner needs to check it. Four frownies for 'too many muggles about' doesn't tell the owner anyting.

 

Second, I know which caches I have not been able to find. Albeit, I do log most of my DNFs.

 

Third, I will not inflate the egos of COs whe deliberately put the coords off, or leave misleading hints.

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Ahhh! At last a few folks with reasons why they don't log their DNF's at times! I always log mine but it does get a bit embarassing on difficult or muggled caches where I have returned two or three times. Must say that even after all this I never get anyone e-mailing me with hints. Usually I will have to ask the CO and sometimes I get a good hint, sometimes a poor hint, sometimes no hint. If its no hint from the co then I will ask someone else who has found it. A lot of the time when the CO gets around to checking the cache the cache has been muggled or removed.

I have cached with a few others a few times and noticed that these folks never logged in their DNF on the same cache we did with them and they were very experianced cachers with many finds :D

I agree with others in that there is no shame to DNF and its to everyones benifit to log em!!!

Edited by cbearw
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For the most part I log my DNFs. When I am caching in a group larger than 2, I do not always log though.

 

This is so that when five of us together cannot find we do not clog up the owners email or the last 5 logs. I use GSAK to find the DNFs and if there are too many I won't hunt it, I think that if more than two people are hunting together...only 1 or 2 should log the DNF.

 

If I am hunting alone I ALWAYS log my DNF...have a) gotten great help that way, B) alerted a CO to a muggled cache they had just replaced within the week, c) had a great adventure on a DNF that just HAD to be told, and d) warned of just which rock to not move due to a wasps nest.

Edited by pugsley2869
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For the most part I log my DNFs. When I am caching in a group larger than 2, I do not always log though.

 

This is so that when five of us together cannot find we do not clog up the owners email or the last 5 logs. I use GSAK to find the DNFs and if there are too many I won't hunt it, I think that if more than two people are hunting together...only 1 or 2 should log the DNF.

 

If I am hunting alone I ALWAYS log my DNF...have a) gotten great help that way, :lol: alerted a CO to a muggled cache they had just replaced within the week, c) had a great adventure on a DNF that just HAD to be told, and d) warned of just which rock to not move due to a wasps nest.

 

Thanks Pugsley: That makes sense to me now why the others I was caching with may have not logged their DNF. On the other end of the spectrum their are a few cachers in our area that NEVER log their DNF's and this sems to be well known fact when we talk to other cachers. Thanks for everyones response!! :D

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First, I'll decide if I think the owner needs to check it. Four frownies for 'too many muggles about' doesn't tell the owner anyting.

 

It could tell the owner that maybe he picked a bad spot for his cache, if that wasn't his goal. Maybe he hid it during the week and the spot is popular on weekends, or vice versa. It also tells me as a fellow geocacher, that it's probably a cache I'd like to avoid.

Edited by briansnat
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We don't log a DNF if we didn't make an honest effort at looking for it. For instance today we walked to the cords, wasn't expecting the look to be as weedy (shorts and flipflops). So we didn't log it anything, we will go back more prepared. Another would be an urban hide that we drive by the area and are not in the mood to be that stealthy.

 

But if we made a honest efforted, waded the torns, poison ivey, looked in and under everything, stuck hands in all open spaces and still didn't find it, it gets logged as such.

 

I don't feel a DNF should be based on our laziness.

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I'll second what RCDispatchersx2 says. If we really give it a look, and fail, I'll log it as such. If we walk out there and say "No WAY I'm going in THERE wearing short pants!" it does not count as a DNF to us. To us, DNF implies a real search - which we bail out on often, based on time constraints, suitable clothing, etc. If I give a concerted look and don't find it, I'll say so. Usually I go out a day or two later, find it easily, and feel like a moron. I'm starting to get used to that ....

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When I first started Geocaching, I didn't realize that DNF was even an option... From there, I progressed to... If I would go to find a cache and don't spend much time looking for the cache - I keep an eye on the cache (usually someone finds it within a few days) - then I don't log the DNF. Now (years later) - I log both my finds and DNFs.

 

 

There is an exception: there's one cache in the area that I have yet to find - I have gone many times to look for it. Others don't seem to have problems finding the cache... I continue to look for the cache on occasion, but I no longer log the DNF... I will eventually find that darn thing :) .

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I have 311 DNF posts - and am proud of every single one!

 

Okay, I'll admit I have not posted every single DNF. If a cache already has 3+ DNF's, and it's a a 1/1, and the previous DNF'ers include 'experienced' cachers, I won't bother. And I do log multiple DNFs on a single cache if I don't find it a second or third or ... time.

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Reading through the posts on this topic it sounds like most folks post there DNF's when they make a reasonably good effort to find the cache which is a very good thing for all the reasons mentioned.. Possible exceptions to this might include not logging when someone else in a group of cachers looking for the same cache at the same time has already logged it as a DNF or when a number of other DNF log enrtres by other experianced cachers has already been posted. In the later case I log mine anyway as I want a record of it and I want the CO to see how many folks in total have come to the cache and failed to find it.

When having to return many times to look for a cache there seems to be a wide range of opinions on how many DNF's in a row to log by a particuliar cacher. I must admit that I logged three or 4 DNF's in a row for one particuliar cache only to have my log entries followed up by a "FOUND IT" log entry by a 6 year old child! :) Very humbling! My wife consoled me by suggesting that this child probably had considerable help from his or her parents! :blink:

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I like lots of other people will log a DNF when we haven't found a cache after a decent hunt, and so far there's only one cache we haven't found after going back a second time. For this one I haven't yet posted a second DNF but when we eventually find it (and we will!!!) I will mention in my found logs our number of attempts and why I think it was so hard for us).

 

We came to a couple of caches recently where there were so many muggles it would be really risky to try and get the cache, so I posted a note instead as a record of my visit for us and the cache owner. I think I'd always want to log some kind of record to show where we've been - the owners can then see the interest shown in their cache and and our logs will reflect what we've done. :D

 

TheWife

HoweFamily

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we logged a comment on a cache and said in the log that we ran out of time so would go back again we logged this as my son who is 10 wanted to let them know we would be back and the cache owner left a snotty not saying it sounds like a dnf and how sad it was that people didnt log them. we have not done anymore of his caches and don't intend to as my son was so upset that the cache owner had been so rude.

we still log dnfs if we have tried hard.

chris

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we logged a comment on a cache and said in the log that we ran out of time so would go back again we logged this as my son who is 10 wanted to let them know we would be back and the cache owner left a snotty not saying it sounds like a dnf and how sad it was that people didnt log them. we have not done anymore of his caches and don't intend to as my son was so upset that the cache owner had been so rude.

we still log dnfs if we have tried hard.

chris

This is how I do it too. It's funny how rude some people can get over something like that. Your note communicated everything the owner and other finders needed to know: the cache is probably still there. I actually like when people log this way, because I don't agree with logging a DNF without a good search effort. It sends out a false signal that the cache may be missing. Some people filter out caches that the last log/last two logs were DNFs.
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I don't log my DNF right away but monitor the site and see if there hasn't been any activity for a few days then I will or if the previous searcher has logged a DNF then I will right away. My ego doesn't get in my way, but I generally only note my finds. :)

 

Not sure why you wait for a few days or wait until someone else before you logged a DNF. Why not just log your DNF anyway? Why only note your finds. As a cahe owner I would be interested in anyones DNF as long as they made a reasonable effort. I certainly admire your honesty. Not many have steeped up thus far and said "I generally only note my finds". Either there is very few out there that nrarely log their DNF's or there are many but just don't want to admitt it. Curious though why you wouldn't usually log your DNF's. Thanks for your reply! :)

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I usually try two or three times before I log a DNF especially if I am in the area often. I appreciate people who log DNFs. I was able to see a problem with my first set cache (Grey Box A) because a couple of people noted their DNFs. I will probably log them more often now that I know how useful they are.

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Why not log a DNF. Are there points to be awarded/deducted? Is there a national race going on? Pride? Will GC.com cancel you account?

 

I never understood why one would purpously not log a DNF. I use it for my use in the future, sometimes the owner will send you an extra hint. Those DNF logs can be valuble on the more difficult caches.

 

Log it..no one will think lesser of you. I have 18 DNF vs 150 Finds. (as of Sept 4)

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I log a DNF if I get out of the car to hunt for a cache, and then don't find it.

 

If I didn't get out of the car, I won't log a DNF.

 

Haven't done a cache yet where I didn't have to get out of the car except for a couple of earthcaches. (I got out of the car for those anyway to try and get a decent picture.) I can see why you wouldn't log anything if you never got out of the car! :D

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I log a DNF if I get out of the car to hunt for a cache, and then don't find it.

 

If I didn't get out of the car, I won't log a DNF.

 

Haven't done a cache yet where I didn't have to get out of the car except for a couple of earthcaches. (I got out of the car for those anyway to try and get a decent picture.) I can see why you wouldn't log anything if you never got out of the car! :D

 

I think Occam was referring to driving up to an area where a geocache is located and then deciding against hunting the cache because of (dangerous elements, people nearby, or deciding that the fun factor has peaked at zero.)

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I usually blame myself for not finding it and consider it a DNFY - Did Not Find Yet! If I think I will be back and look again when I have more time - I don't log it because I don't want to mislead someone into thinking it is too hard to find or might be missing. I definitely log if I don't find it after an exhausive search.

DNF lets other know to plan time for the hunt.

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If I have not performed a THOROUGH search I will wait until I visit again and am satisfied I CAN'T find it before I DNF or ask for a further hint.
That used to be my criteria for logging a DNF too. After a few discussions here in the forums I decided that I should log EVERY DNF. They are part of my caching history and I think most owners like getting ANY kind of log on their cache. You can mention that you spent little or no time looking for the cache. That way it is less likely to cause an unnecessary maintenance visit by the owner.

 

But in the end, it's your choice. Do what makes your heart happy!

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