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What's with the religious stuff?


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I'll agree with that.

 

I've never found any religious literature in caches. But if it started to become popular, I could imagine the following scenario emerging:

 

A Baptist leaves a tract in a cache, thinking it's a good thing. Next, a Catholic comes along and finds the cache, gets mildly offended and CITOs out the tract and leaves a Catholic brochure. A Presbeterian finds the cache next, rolls their eyes, and CITOs out the brochure and leaves a Presbeterian pamplet. A Mormon stops by later and figures the best thing to do is to CITO out the Presbeterian pamplet and leave a "Good News" tract. A Seventh Day Adventist is the next visitor, who immediately removes the Mormon stuff and places a SDA tract. A Jehovah's witness comes by, and sees the SDA tract and throws it away, and leaves their own tract....

Jesus happens along later and accidentally finds the cache. He reads all of the log entries and shakes his head, and writes PEACE in the logbook. He removes the last tract, and leaves some olives, and bread. Eventually ants invade the cache. Cache gets archived....

 

i think i love you.

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WOW! I had never heard of Chick Tracts before so I Googled them...If I found this in one of my caches I'd simply CITO it. If I found it in somebody else's cache I'd trade for it and then CITO it.

 

Here is a little food for thought. I sometimes go back to caches that I have already found. I notice if the item or items that put in have been traded or not. If I notice a particular items keeps getting taken I assume that it is wanted and make mental note to carry more of that item to place in caches. Have you ever thought that by removing all the tracts from every cache you visit you are encouraging those who are putting tracts in caches to put even more tracts in caches.

 

I actually agree with not having any "promotional items" or agenda driven items in caches. My caches are filled with childrens toys, and hiking/ camping supplies. I guess I actively promote "child enjoyment" with all the toys, and promote "outdoor activities" with all the other swag items. :laughing:

 

Of course I have an agenda when I hide caches, and it's called, "Lead by Example, Hide Great Caches in Great Locations."

 

Just because something is a child's toy doesn't mean it isn't a promotional item or not agenda driven. I suspect most McToys have a promotion or agenda behind them.

 

...Ya, shoving a piece of paper in the face of security staff is a really great idea, thanks for sharing.

 

Giving the Geocacher U phamplet to guards, land managers and other types who question what you are doing is advice given widely in the forums. My spin for "shoving it in their face" was making fun of this threads in light of knowing that people do reccomend giving out geocaching phamplets.

 

You are welcome. ;)

 

There are some things in the Geocacher U brochure that I don't 100% agree with. Maybe we should not allow those in caches either. The brochure can be construed as telling you how you should geocache and we all know every region caches a little differently.

 

Keep it 'caching related, and nobody gets hurt. :laughing:

 

Oh no! Quiggle's itchy trigger finder is on the lock button once again. :D

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Jesus is a Catholic? :laughing: Sorry...couldn't resist. :laughing:
are we talking about the same guy? that nice jewish boy?
He was a Jew. However, there was a split in that religion when he showed up. Just stating the historical facts.... :D

Ah, but he didn't want a split in the religion, just wanted to help them understand it. :D

 

Agh, somebody stop me. ;) (No, not you, Keystone....I don't need you to spike my meter again!) I'm stopping now, I promise to be good.

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That being said, I would also like to give my brief opinion on Bible tracts and the like. If anyone should be offended by bible tracts and religious advertising left in geocaches, it is Christians. No one has ever been converted or accepted Christ by getting a tract shoved in their face, or left in a geocache. It's the junkmail of Christianity. If you want to represent Christ, show love the way Christ did. If you come upon a cache in disrepair, fix it up. If you open the cache and it is filled with junk, replace it with some nice stuff. Treat nature with respect. Treat private and public property with respect. Practice Cache In-Trash Out. Live life in the service of others, helping those who deserve it and those that do not, and if someone is seeking and they ask you "why you do what you do", then share with them the message. A lot more "effective" than unsolicited junkmail. But if someone feels this is how they would like to share the message and spread the word, it won't offend me, just disappointed that there is one less matchbox car, dollar store action figure or McToy treasure for my kids to choose from.

 

amen!

 

Agreed.

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Exactly! It's about appropriateness. It may or may not be within my free speech limits to hand out a geocaching pamphlet at a church service, but I think it would be extremely disrespectful and inappropriate and I would never do it.

 

i don't know... we were going into my stepbrother's funeral and my dad and stepmother turned to talk to me about geocaching.

 

i talk about geocaching pretty frequently at church. last thursday as part of a ceremony my pastor came to a geocache with her robes and everything. i couldn't find the blasted thing, even though i'd been there before. but she could find it. THAT made a kind of surreal image.

 

i'm against pamphlets of every kind in geocaches because paper stuff sucks as swag. books are ok, but cards, pamphlets, hang-tags... spare me.

 

while i may be intersested in telling you the story of faith in my life, i am also interested in telling you the story of illness and recovery in my life. and geocaches. and bicycles. these things are all intertwined and it's hard for me to speak of one without the others.

 

i have no interest in telling you what to believe. i am not in favor of insulting other people or their religions (or lack thereof) by insisting on their intrinsic inferiority.

 

i've been accused of being a lot of things, inlcuding anti-catholic, anti-semitic, godless, anti-christian, satan-worshipping, liberal democrat, heretical, unitarian, racist, gay, not-gay-enough (go ahead, try to sort THAT out), misogynisitic, radical feminist, un-american, and un-saved.

 

either i get around a lot, or people are all too happy to slap down labels. my favorite was satan-worshipping. i got called that in a newspaper editorial.

 

i am a principled person, and life is complex. sometimes principles don't coexist happily with each other. i don't have the monopoly on answers. i will be happy to consider your answers. if you print up your answers on unlaminated paper and leave it to get mildewed in a geocache, it's rot.

 

Even better.

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Jesus is a Catholic? :laughing: Sorry...couldn't resist. :laughing:
are we talking about the same guy? that nice jewish boy?
He was a Jew. However, there was a split in that religion when he showed up. Just stating the historical facts.... ;)

Ah, but he didn't want a split in the religion, just wanted to help them understand it. :D
I just said there was a split, which there was. There was also a split many years prior to that involving Ismael and Isaac. History is loaded with splits.
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Jesus is a Catholic? :laughing:

 

Sorry...couldn't resist. :laughing:

 

Actually, my caching partner's name is Jesus. Yes. He's a Catholic. ;) He has a long running joke at stream crossings: "It's my namesake who walks on water, not me." (See. This IS geocaching related.)

 

Was his father named Levon?

 

Arguing the Book of Leviticus is especially fun! No one has been able to show me where the bible has rescinded some of the prohibitions therein.

 

As an ex Christian I'm pretty familiar with this stuff. Romans 6:14, Luke 16:16 and most of Galatians (particularly chapter 3) are often pointed to as suggesting that the old laws aree no longer in effect. To muddy the picture somewhat, Matthew 5:17-18 seems to say the opposite.

 

Anyway I'm grateful that most Christians believe that Christ's death made the laws irrelevant, otherwise I might never have have never known about the joys of bacon, spareribs and BBQ pork shoulder. Yum!

 

And to get this back on track, I think the tracts are silly. In the history of the world I doubt a single person was converted through one of those things. If it is my cache I remove them. If it's someone else's cache

I leave them be. Other religious items like crosses, Rosary beads, stars of David, pentagrams, etc... are just fine with me.

 

I came across a bunch of cheap, pewter angels in a shop a while ago. Tiny things. I bought a bunch to put in micros. Didn't see anything wrong with it.

Edited by briansnat
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You're allowed to leave religious items. You are not allowed to place caches that are intended to solicit, including for religion.
This is correct! ;)

I NEED a get out of hell free card!!

Someone handed me one of those at MWGB. :laughing:

I guess they know me well enough to think that I might need it someday? :laughing::D

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I came upon a cache in which the mold on log book revealed the image of the Virgin Mary.

 

Not sure how that fits into leaving religuos stuff, but maybe the owner could sell it on E-bay for big bucks.

You should have trashed out that stuff from the cache. (Not sure if that means the moldy log book or the religious image :laughing: )

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Last night we found a cache that I went seeking because it was in a large ammo box and was tired of hunting micros. The cache was on church property, sitting behind some bushes in a populated area. There were only a few other finders before us so I'm assuming most of the swag was original. Inside the ammo box were lots of mini bibles, some larger religious materials, flyers to their weekly meetings, lots and lots of religious toys and a cool travel bug. We took the travel bug and a tiny bible (similar to the spoonful of bible image in this thread). I wasn't expecting this cache to be of such a religious nature and was a little turned off by the flyers and such because it's not really swag, it's advertising. As if putting the cache in the church bushes wasn't advertising enough. I felt like somebody took advantage of this cache (whether it was the owner or the church itself) and went a little too far. This reminds me of church members that give children candy for attending a class :D Hopefully this was the last cache of that nature for me.

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although, i do think the advertising is going a little to far. but a mini bible or a tract? whats wrong with that?

 

Don't get me wrong, I personally don't have any issues with the religious aspect of it, it's just that I thought this cache in particular was very heavy on the advertising. I would have thought the same of it had it been baptist, budhist, muslim, etc. I found a cache behind a Home Depot and if it would have been chalk full of advertisements I would be saying the same thing about it.

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Last night we found a cache that I went seeking because it was in a large ammo box and was tired of hunting micros. The cache was on church property, sitting behind some bushes in a populated area. There were only a few other finders before us so I'm assuming most of the swag was original. Inside the ammo box were lots of mini bibles, some larger religious materials, flyers to their weekly meetings, lots and lots of religious toys and a cool travel bug. We took the travel bug and a tiny bible (similar to the spoonful of bible image in this thread). I wasn't expecting this cache to be of such a religious nature and was a little turned off by the flyers and such because it's not really swag, it's advertising. As if putting the cache in the church bushes wasn't advertising enough. I felt like somebody took advantage of this cache (whether it was the owner or the church itself) and went a little too far. This reminds me of church members that give children candy for attending a class :D Hopefully this was the last cache of that nature for me.

 

And the cache listing gave you no warning whatsoever, right? :o

 

It was a Total surprise that an ammo can at a church might have religious materials in it, I am sure! :huh:

 

If you could find and sign the log without reading the material how were you adversely affected, unless its mere existence upsets you?

 

By that I really address the whole thread - so what if someone puts something (acceptable under the guidelines) in a cache if you are under no obligation to interact with it?

 

Having a strong enough reaction to come here and post about it is as much a personal agenda as putting the stuff in there, is it not?

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Last night we found a cache that I went seeking because it was in a large ammo box and was tired of hunting micros. The cache was on church property, sitting behind some bushes in a populated area. There were only a few other finders before us so I'm assuming most of the swag was original. Inside the ammo box were lots of mini bibles, some larger religious materials, flyers to their weekly meetings, lots and lots of religious toys and a cool travel bug. We took the travel bug and a tiny bible (similar to the spoonful of bible image in this thread). I wasn't expecting this cache to be of such a religious nature and was a little turned off by the flyers and such because it's not really swag, it's advertising. As if putting the cache in the church bushes wasn't advertising enough. I felt like somebody took advantage of this cache (whether it was the owner or the church itself) and went a little too far. This reminds me of church members that give children candy for attending a class :huh: Hopefully this was the last cache of that nature for me.

 

And the cache listing gave you no warning whatsoever, right? :D

 

It was a Total surprise that an ammo can at a church might have religious materials in it, I am sure! :o

 

If you could find and sign the log without reading the material how were you adversely affected, unless its mere existence upsets you?

 

By that I really address the whole thread - so what if someone puts something (acceptable under the guidelines) in a cache if you are under no obligation to interact with it?

 

Having a strong enough reaction to come here and post about it is as much a personal agenda as putting the stuff in there, is it not?

 

Is asking that a cache conforms to the guidelines an agenda? I guess so. This cache has obviously been placed for the purpose of proselytizing and as such is inappropriate and Everythingspersonal as as much right to be concerned about it as he would be if it was placed specifically to promote Burger King.

 

Yes caches are often published on church property, but that alone doesn't make it inappropriate. Fill it with advertising and that changes things. I would hope ttat Everythingspersonal contacted the reviewer with his concerns. Caches that violate the guidelines do not belong here whether they are stocked with religious propaganda or half off coupons for a restaurant.

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...This cache has obviously been placed for the purpose of proselytizing and as such is inappropriate...

Yes caches are often published on church property, but that alone doesn't make it inappropriate. Fill it with advertising and that changes things....

 

The real answer depends on the specifics. The cache may very well have been fine when placed but eager church members help maintain it. If that's the case it's still fine though it may not seem so. If the church placed it, stocks it, and uses it as a vessel to spread the word, then that's another thing.

 

Who fills the cache with advertising does matter when it comes to the guidelines. If I fill your cache with chic tracts, your cache is fine.

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As I understand it what's in the cache, as long as it's not banned items, is irrelevant.

 

It's what's written on the cache listing and whether the description promotes an agenda that is important... that's why I asked, poorly perhaps, if the cache listing told the seeker that the cache contained religious material or promoted an agenda.

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Last night we found a cache that I went seeking because it was in a large ammo box and was tired of hunting micros. The cache was on church property, sitting behind some bushes in a populated area. There were only a few other finders before us so I'm assuming most of the swag was original. Inside the ammo box were lots of mini bibles, some larger religious materials, flyers to their weekly meetings, lots and lots of religious toys and a cool travel bug. We took the travel bug and a tiny bible (similar to the spoonful of bible image in this thread). I wasn't expecting this cache to be of such a religious nature and was a little turned off by the flyers and such because it's not really swag, it's advertising. As if putting the cache in the church bushes wasn't advertising enough. I felt like somebody took advantage of this cache (whether it was the owner or the church itself) and went a little too far. This reminds me of church members that give children candy for attending a class :huh: Hopefully this was the last cache of that nature for me.

 

And the cache listing gave you no warning whatsoever, right? :D

 

It was a Total surprise that an ammo can at a church might have religious materials in it, I am sure! :o

 

If you could find and sign the log without reading the material how were you adversely affected, unless its mere existence upsets you?

 

By that I really address the whole thread - so what if someone puts something (acceptable under the guidelines) in a cache if you are under no obligation to interact with it?

 

Having a strong enough reaction to come here and post about it is as much a personal agenda as putting the stuff in there, is it not?

 

Is asking that a cache conforms to the guidelines an agenda? I guess so. This cache has obviously been placed for the purpose of proselytizing and as such is inappropriate and Everythingspersonal as as much right to be concerned about it as he would be if it was placed specifically to promote Burger King.

 

Yes caches are often published on church property, but that alone doesn't make it inappropriate. Fill it with advertising and that changes things. I would hope ttat Everythingspersonal contacted the reviewer with his concerns. Caches that violate the guidelines do not belong here whether they are stocked with religious propaganda or half off coupons for a restaurant.

It seems kind of gray to me. The flyers don't belong, true, but the post indicates that the cache did have trinkets other than the paper flyers, albeit religious ones. If there were no flyers, but all the items in it were religious, would it be acceptable? The concensus seems to be that religious objects are okay, but is it also okay if all of the original contents are religious trinkets? Even if the cache page doesn't specify a theme and finders aren't expected to leave religious things?

Edited by Dinoprophet
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Arguing the Book of Leviticus is especially fun! No one has been able to show me where the bible has rescinded some of the prohibitions therein.

 

Sorry I couldnt let this pass.

 

Hebrews 7, Acts 15, and pretty much all of the New Testament.

 

Out here, there are caches at churches and some at mormon temples. I dont care for the ones at the mormon temples so we just dont do them. There are many items placed in caches that I dont care for either. Unless there is reason for concern (such as food or ammo) I ignore those things too. Now there is an FSM geocoin coming out. I dont care for that. I will just ignore it too when I see one of those coins.

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Is asking that a cache conforms to the guidelines an agenda? I guess so. This cache has obviously been placed for the purpose of proselytizing and as such is inappropriate and Everythingspersonal as as much right to be concerned about it as he would be if it was placed specifically to promote Burger King.

 

Yes caches are often published on church property, but that alone doesn't make it inappropriate. Fill it with advertising and that changes things. I would hope ttat Everythingspersonal contacted the reviewer with his concerns. Caches that violate the guidelines do not belong here whether they are stocked with religious propaganda or half off coupons for a restaurant.

It seems kind of gray to me. The flyers don't belong, true, but the post indicates that the cache did have trinkets other than the paper flyers, albeit religious ones. If there were no flyers, but all the items in it were religious, would it be acceptable? The concensus seems to be that religious objects are okay, but is it also okay if all of the original contents are religious trinkets? Even if the cache page doesn't specify a theme and finders aren't expected to leave religious things?
I understand the reason for the guideline disallowing caches that solicit or promote agendas and don't think this should change, but...

 

What about themed caches? I've seen caches that ask you to trade for items that relate to a theme: baseball, fishing, bugs, nautical, etc. What's the difference between caches that limits trade items to a particular sport (or whatever) and one that has trade items for a particular religion? If I'm offended by a particular sport, I can avoid the soccer-trade-items-only cache.

 

Religious-themed-item caches aside, aren't caches that ask you to trade for fishing tackle promoting an agenda?

 

This popped into my head as I read the above-quoted posts. I'm not sure what I think of it yet, just rolling it out there to get bounced around. :D

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Out here, there are caches at churches and some at mormon temples. ...
Overlooking the fact that there are only two Mormon temples in Arizona, what don't you like about those caches?

 

Lol, I shouldnt type a response before eating lunch. I meant whatever their usual building is. Ward house I think?

Typically, just a ward or stake, I think. Most people just call them 'churches'.

 

Back to the curious issue:

 

Why do you like caches on 'church' (Christian, I assume) property, but not LDS property? How are they different?

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Religious-themed-item caches aside, aren't caches that ask you to trade for fishing tackle promoting an agenda?

 

You can argue that all caches promote an agenda. When I place a cache at a nice overlook, my agenda is to introduce that spot to others.

 

There is a line however. If I place that cache at an overlook, then use the cache page to rant about how smog has spoiled the view and to contact your congressman to pass clean air legislation, the same cache crosses a line and becomes inappropriate.

 

A religious themed cache isn't necessarily an agenda. They are published all the time. Even one in a church parking lot with a religious theme would probably be fine. But once you add religious tracts, brochures with times of services, etc... it crosses the line.

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Religious-themed-item caches aside, aren't caches that ask you to trade for fishing tackle promoting an agenda?
You can argue that all caches promote an agenda. When I place a cache at a nice overlook, my agenda is to introduce that spot to others.

 

There is a line however. If I place that cache at an overlook, then use the cache page to rant about how smog has spoiled the view and to contact your congressman to pass clean air legislation, the same cache crosses a line and becomes inappropriate.

 

A religious themed cache isn't necessarily an agenda. They are published all the time. Even one in a church parking lot with a religious theme would probably be fine. But once you add religious tracts, brochures with times of services, etc... it crosses the line.

Alright, I can live with that. :huh:

 

I did just have an "Uh-oh" moment, though.

 

I've been planning a cache in my local area on land owned by a group that manages a large amount of land regionally. They've given the ok for me to place the cache, but that I should include some of their brochures in the cache. I don't imagine there really should be a problem with this, but then where is the "brochure" line drawn? I was about to contact them and ask where the brochures they promised me a month ago are at, but should I bother? :D

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Back to the curious issue:

 

Why do you like caches on 'church' (Christian, I assume) property, but not LDS property? How are they different?

 

good question. i also seem to have that bias lurking around in here. i think for me that it has something to do with my expectation that someone will want to have a few words with me about mormonism in return for hosting the cache. perhaps it is an unfair categorization, but i have never been approached in this fashion by anyone but mormons, even on church properties.

 

mormons used to come to my door all the time. i do not (nor do i want to) subscribe to large portions of mormon theology, although i am familiar with it and mormon history is a topic of interest for me. when the nice young people came to my door, they were not prepared to make chitchat with me about nauvoo or the handcart movement.

 

they do not visit me anymore.

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Out here, there are caches at churches and some at mormon temples. ...
Overlooking the fact that there are only two Mormon temples in Arizona, what don't you like about those caches?

 

Lol, I shouldnt type a response before eating lunch. I meant whatever their usual building is. Ward house I think?

Typically, just a ward or stake, I think. Most people just call them 'churches'.

 

Back to the curious issue:

 

Why do you like caches on 'church' (Christian, I assume) property, but not LDS property? How are they different?

 

Because I disagree with their beliefs. Logging a cache at a mormon church/ward is the same to me as condoning their beliefs. I dont call for it to be removed. I dont get upset over it. I choose to ignore it. Especially the one that said "Make sure to ask for the Missionaries". GC149AW in case anyone is interested.

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Because I disagree with their beliefs. Logging a cache at a mormon church/ward is the same to me as condoning their beliefs. I dont call for it to be removed. I dont get upset over it. I choose to ignore it. Especially the one that said "Make sure to ask for the Missionaries". GC149AW in case anyone is interested.

 

i think wal-mart is the epicenter of evil in the universe, but i do not believe hunting that lame LPC condones their immoral and predatory business practices.

 

does walmart have a store at megiddo yet? right next to the red heifferburger?

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Because I disagree with their beliefs. Logging a cache at a mormon church/ward is the same to me as condoning their beliefs. I dont call for it to be removed. I dont get upset over it. I choose to ignore it. Especially the one that said "Make sure to ask for the Missionaries". GC149AW in case anyone is interested
You have every right to ignore caches for any reason you want. But I don't see how cache logs, both online and off, are religous in nature.
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Out here, there are caches at churches and some at mormon temples. ...
Overlooking the fact that there are only two Mormon temples in Arizona, what don't you like about those caches?
Lol, I shouldnt type a response before eating lunch. I meant whatever their usual building is. Ward house I think?
Typically, just a ward or stake, I think. Most people just call them 'churches'.

 

Back to the curious issue:

 

Why do you like caches on 'church' (Christian, I assume) property, but not LDS property? How are they different?

Because I disagree with their beliefs. Logging a cache at a mormon church/ward is the same to me as condoning their beliefs. I dont call for it to be removed. I dont get upset over it. I choose to ignore it. Especially the one that said "Make sure to ask for the Missionaries". GC149AW in case anyone is interested.
I assume that you could log the cache without 'asking for the missionaries'. If not, the cache pushes an agenda and should be archived. (ETA: The 'ask for the missionaries' comment is not a requirement and has a smiley next to it. The cache doesn't appear to push any agenda.)

 

It's been my experience that caches on church property (whatever the denomination) aren't placed primarily to increase church enrollment. Generally, they are just like any other cache (except on Sunday morning when I don't generally go after caches on church property out of respect, mostly).

 

Further, faith is not like the chicken pox. You pretty much can't catch it unless you want it.

Edited by sbell111
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Because I disagree with their beliefs. Logging a cache at a mormon church/ward is the same to me as condoning their beliefs. I dont call for it to be removed. I dont get upset over it. I choose to ignore it.

 

How is logging a cache at a any church condoning the beliefs of that church? It's a stinkin' geocache, it's not like you are receiving a sacrament or anything.

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Because I disagree with their beliefs. Logging a cache at a mormon church/ward is the same to me as condoning their beliefs. I dont call for it to be removed. I dont get upset over it. I choose to ignore it.

 

How is logging a cache at a any church condoning the beliefs of that church? It's a stinkin' geocache, it's not like you are receiving a sacrament or anything.

 

I thought that a point in this thread is that we can avoid caches we do not agree with. We are choosing to avoid such cache placements. Isnt that the great thing about the US, that we have that kind of freedom.

Edited by Tsegi Mike and Desert Viking
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Because I disagree with their beliefs. Logging a cache at a mormon church/ward is the same to me as condoning their beliefs. I dont call for it to be removed. I dont get upset over it. I choose to ignore it.

 

How is logging a cache at a any church condoning the beliefs of that church? It's a stinkin' geocache, it's not like you are receiving a sacrament or anything.

 

The whole "my imaginary friend is better than your imaginary friend" feud between religions cracks me up. Especially when they are speaking of the same imaginary friend but putting different spins on it. Protestants find Catholics to be evil idolators. Protestants and Catholics both find Mormons to be horrible cultists. Bah. Protestants, Catholics, and Mormons all proclaim that "Jesus Christ is my personal savior and the son of God". Sounds to me like they are all Christians but simply have different (and to me almost equally bizarre) versions of Christianity. Moslems don't subscribe to the "Jesus is the son of God" but they do subscribe to the same God as the Christians but interpret that God through the teachings of their prophet, Mohammed.

 

I don't want any of it in my geocaches. Keep it to yourselves. Don't try to "spread the word" through pamphlets and such left in geocaches.

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Because I disagree with their beliefs. Logging a cache at a mormon church/ward is the same to me as condoning their beliefs. I dont call for it to be removed. I dont get upset over it. I choose to ignore it.

 

How is logging a cache at a any church condoning the beliefs of that church? It's a stinkin' geocache, it's not like you are receiving a sacrament or anything.

 

I thought that a point in this thread is that we can avoid caches we do not agree with. We are choosing to avoid such cache placements. Isnt that the great thing about the US, that we have that kind of freedom.

I generally avoid caches at churches because they tend to either be LPCs or hidden in the bushes, and I don't like either LPCs or bush hides. I have done a couple where I had to hike up a big hill behind a church that has a big cross on it. When I got up to the cache I was usually rewarded with a great view of the town below and didn't really pay much attention to the cross. So these have been some of my favorite caches.

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You know, the other day I looked in a cache and it was empty. No tracts, nothing. Why can't atheists keep their agenda out of the caches?

Now that's just funny; I don't care who you are...

 

Ok, so why waste more time getting upset whether there was or wasn't religious material to trade. Trade up when you can; don't trade if you can't or don't want to trade up; ignore/disregard what you want. And log your find however you see fit.

It ain't rocket science.... lol

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I generally avoid caches at churches because they tend to either be LPCs or hidden in the bushes, and I don't like either LPCs or bush hides.
I feel the same way. Ironically, those caches are typically too small to hold any "religious stuff."

Strangely enough, the one that was referenced is full-sized.

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