Peanut Butter jars

[+The SuzyQs]

Look again at mine. You'll see I stopped logging online over 2yrs ago, yet I still cache. Did a bunch just today. Nobody but me has any idea what or how many I have or have not found.

 

No one accused you of being smart for exercising your right to cache but not log them. Now if you were to post a DNF on one of our caches, we would look at your find count/post ratio and not even bother checking the cache as it appears online that you are an armchair cacher, so the next person would probably find it and we would have wasted our time checking on it because such an inexperienced cacher would probably miss it anyways.

 

But Back OT... Are you allergic to Peanuts? If so, probably not safe to cache here in Jacksonville anyways.

[+IceCreamMan]

It's bed time boys and girls. You posters feel free to continue on with out me. Of course, I know you will.

[+TexasGringo]

If there was a "RIP" Icon...would that help identify the type cache?

[The Black Pearl]

I have allergys to peanuts so I think people need to think of others before they hide dangerous caches. My skin brakes out all over and my face gets red. Its not funny to do to someone else. I think you people who hide peanut jars are sick and should be stopped. Maybe that ice cream guy should call himsself peanut butter guy.

[+flask]

Forget the PB Jars, forget the lock and lock, forget the ammo can...

 

JUST HIDE A 35MM FILM CANISTER. They are FREE and I haven't ever heard of anyone that was allergic to film.

 

Eurika! That's It! Picture the USA carpeted with Film Cans! Back Brake Billy, fire up the Micro Gun!

 

i put them on the same level. film canister=peanut butter jar, in my book.

 

might as well put the "P" back in peanut butter and use them as specimen cups. it'd be an improvement.

[+KBI]

there's no reason a cacher can't just avoid the container. in cases where a cacher hikes all day to arrive at a container and then can't open it, i'd be pretty hacked if it were me.

Hacked at whom? Yourself? Or the cache owner?

 

If yourself, then congratulations on possessing a healthy (and unfortunately rare) attitude toward personal responsibility.

 

If the cache owner, then why? Did the cache owner make you waste your time? Did the cache owner force you to take the hike? Did the cache owner cause you to take the chance that the container just might be of the type to inflame your allergy?

 

Physical and mental imperfections are neither fun nor fair, but they are a fact of life. Blind people shouldn’t be knife throwers, epileptics shouldn’t be airline captains, and people with severe peanut allergies shouldn’t open containers of unknown origin, geocache or otherwise. Anyone whose personal limitations restrict their career or entertainment options has my sympathy, and any voluntary accommodation on the part of others is always appreciated I’m sure, but people with limitations, however unfair those limitations may be, have no right to demand such accommodation from others.

 

Of course, one has to draw the line somewhere. How dangerous would a cache have to be for the owner to be accountable for a seeker’s injury? I think the line should be drawn wherever there is intent.

 

Would a cache owner be responsible for a seeker’s injury if the cache were placed 500 feet up a sheer rock wall over an active lava pit? No. It is up to the seeker to decide how much risk to assume; the seeker is responsible. If a seeker’s rock-climbing (or lava-swimming) skills are less than dependable, then to pursue such a cache would demonstrate poor judgment.

 

Would a cache owner be responsible for a seeker’s injury if the cache container were intentionally designed to explode upon opening? Yes. It is up to the owner NOT to provide a malicious hazard.

 

Would a cache owner be responsible for a seeker’s injury if the cache container included peanut residue? No. It is up to the seeker to decide how much risk to assume, and the seeker is responsible for managing his own unique set of weaknesses. If a seeker is aware that they have a deadly peanut allergy, then to touch any cache container where the existence of peanut residue appears possible would demonstrate poor judgment.

 

I believe that any prosecutor would have a very difficult time convincing a reasonable jury that a cache owner's old peanut butter jar was placed with the intent of hurting anyone. It is unreasonable to expect cache owners to provide caches which are free of risk. All caching involves risk.

[+flask]

I was away most of the day and had to catch up, but couldn't get past this:

 

i know three people with deadly peanut allergies. one has an allergy so severe that simply breathing in a room where you're eating a pb&j could kill him.

 

I'm going to have to call a BS on this. He may believe it, and you might have believed it when he told you. Not saying you made it up. But I'm still calling a BS.

 

i'm not permitted to give details under the law. i'm not naive and i'm not a liar. he's had more than one reaction that required emergency medical service. the oils in question can be disturbed and become airborne. i'm not saying that he will necessarily die if he comes into a room where peanut butter is being eaten, but that it is possible and the possibility is more than remote. he did not tell me this; the information was given to me in a briefing. you know, from medical providers.

 

take the whole pile of cards, pal.

[+flask]

...if you cannot afford the $5 Lock n Lock, maybe you should reconsider hiding caches...

After reading your post I reconsidered whether I should continue hiding caches. After much consideration I decided that, yes, I will continue hiding them. And I will do so based on my own cost/benefit analysis rather than yours. Just thought you'd like to know.

 

Thanks for informing me. It's good that you can afford a GPSr, and the gas money/bicycle to get to the cache, but can't spring for a reputable container. Glad you're not in my area. Hey, I had Chinese food over the weekend. Should I send you some Chinese food containers? They usually last at least a week.

 

Looking at your stats (2,278 posts/1226 finds/20 hides) you might want to reconsider offering advise on hiding caches. But, you're definitely the go to guy for advise on posting.

That was certainly uncalled for! You don't need to be a genius to figure caching out. Most of it is simple common sense (which isn't so common.)

 

Anyway- what exactly do you think people need to offer advice? Finding 1,000 caches certainly gives you perspective on what works and what doesn't!

 

You should apologize. (Yes- i am serious.)

 

seconded. 1200 finds and 20 hides is plenty.

 

i am suspicious of people with hundreds of "hides".

 

or alternately, don't apologize. you're still out of luck, out of line, and out to lunch.

 

as for florida, i know who caches there. and i know how long it takes to find a bazillion caches strewn about. as one florida cacher said to me, i can find a hundred, move one town over, and repeat. a month later i can come back and do it again.

[+elephantmama]

All caching involves risk.

And isn't that kind of the point?

 

Seriously, my peanut allergy is at the very bottom of my safety check when it comes to geocaching. In just the few weeks I've been doing this we've found snake skins, seen a snake in the water right below us, passed by/through tons of poison ivy, found drug paraphernalia and a gun cartridge, been scratched up by thorns, had my hair and face covered with spider webs and possibly their owners, hiked through tall grass with who knows what kind of critters hiding in it, waded through stream and marsh, let my children explore a storm drain and slide down a small cliff, etc.

 

If I'm willing to do all of this to find a little container in the woods, do I really have the right at ground zero to cry foul because the cache happens to be in a washed out peanut butter container? That just wouldn't make any sense.

[+TexasGringo]

***i'm not permitted to give details under the law.***

 

What law?

[+KBI]

Looking at your stats (2,278 posts/1226 finds/20 hides) you might want to reconsider offering advise on hiding caches. But, you're definitely the go to guy for advise on posting.

That was certainly uncalled for! You don't need to be a genius to figure caching out. Most of it is simple common sense (which isn't so common.)

 

Anyway- what exactly do you think people need to offer advice? Finding 1,000 caches certainly gives you perspective on what works and what doesn't!

 

You should apologize. (Yes- i am serious.)

seconded. 1200 finds and 20 hides is plenty.

I'll third that one. Considering the issue being debated I believe the opinion of even a zero hider / zero finder muggle would be plenty valid.

[+wordnerd]

.

I've only been gone a couple of hours and it looks like I've missed a lot of the film. Perhaps it'll come out on DVD soon.

 

 

.

[+flask]

***i'm not permitted to give details under the law.***

 

What law?

 

there are laws regarding confidentiality, not to mention contractual concerns. often these cover medical and educational settings.

[+fo2gra4]

This is getting ridiculous! Why is it that the Peanut Butter Jar is being attacked? As someone else pointed out earlier in this forum there are more allergies then just Peanut Butter. You can make a list of allergies that would affect all types of containers. What about people allergic to plastic? What about people allergic to gun powder? What about this? What about that?

 

I guess we should just ban GeoCaching and not bother doing it anymore since so many people are worried and/or allergic.

 

NOT!

 

You nor I can not protect someone/everyone from any or all allergies!

 

No matter what container I use, I use it because it is what I have on hand at the time I hide my cache and it is what I can afford at the time. You use what ever type of container you want and I will not question your hide, so please don't question what containers I use. If you must have a say, then send me some money and I will be glad to buy the type of container you approve of. I do think that would get costly for you as you would probably have to send out money to way to many cachers. Check out the cache containers Worldwide, and you will find them hidden all over not is just one state or area.

 

So can we end this stupid discussion, or should we just ban GeoCaching forever????

 

The choice is up to YOU!

 

Me I am deciding to end this discussion and go caching, whether it be a Film Canister, Peanut Butter Jar, Tupperware Container, Ammo Can, etc...

 

Oh, and if you think that food containers make bad containers. That is your opinion, not everyones. I will agree that some do make lousy cache containers, but not all of them. I have seen many food containers that have lasted years and the contents stayed dry, while some ammo cans have leaked and ruined all of the contents (or rusted and could not be opened), etc. But that does not mean anything, they are just some examples, not how every cache will last or have something happen to them.

[+TrailGators]

1000 caches in say Jacksonville, FL is more like 150 miles of driving over the course of a nice weekend, hopping out of the car ever 600ft or so to grab a hide-a-key or film canister off a dumpster.

 

Which you know because you've found so many there.

Ahhh, see the problem with judging by find counts?

 

Look again at mine. You'll see I stopped logging online over 2yrs ago, yet I still cache. Did a bunch just today. Nobody but me has any idea what or how many I have or have not found.

That's cool! I no longer log YKWs. I can't say what they are because I would get attacked if I did. But I will always log a great cache mainly to thank the owner for making such a special cache. Those caches are why I still play the game!

[+TrailGators]

I actually hid a peanutbutter jar cache 5yrs ago or so. But it's ok, I have one of these:

 

You are cracking me up today, Mopar! Edited July 16, 2007 by TrailGators

[+Glenn]

 

seconded. 1200 finds and 20 hides is plenty.

 

i am suspicious of people with hundreds of "hides".

 

or alternately, don't apologize. you're still out of luck, out of line, and out to lunch.

 

as for florida, i know who caches there. and i know how long it takes to find a bazillion caches strewn about. as one florida cacher said to me, i can find a hundred, move one town over, and repeat. a month later i can come back and do it again.

 

We all know what kind of reputation Florida has for caches particularly north eastern Florida. You don't need to pour salt in the wound and rub it in.

 

I agree that 20 hides is plenty too. Since when does the number of hides someone has anything to do with their opinion on using a peanut butter jar as a cache container? I remember when I first started geocaching. We would discuss containers used for caches and no one cared how many hides you had because it didn't matter then and it doesn't matter now.

[Neos2]

Here's an interesting article on a study that I found today. It suggests that people may have psycho-somatic reactions when they smell peanuts, because they "know" they are allergic (not because they are physically at risk). When they smell the product, it causes symptoms to start as an alert warning to protect the person from the potential danger.

[Clan Riffster]

Finally, if you expect hiders to be responsible for your allergies, don't hunt my caches.

Sir, surely you're not advocating that folks should be responsible for themselves, are you? My Gosh, Man, That's just down right unAmerican!

[+IceCreamMan]

as for florida, i know who caches there. and i know how long it takes to find a bazillion caches strewn about. as one florida cacher said to me, i can find a hundred, move one town over, and repeat. a month later i can come back and do it again.

 

So.... it's unreasonable to look at the number of hides a person has to draw conclusions about how informed their opinion of various containers is. But it's perfectly reasonable to assume that an area you've never been to has poor quality caches because there are a lot of them. I guess in the upside down bizzaro world of high post to find ratios that makes sense.

 

BTW, is this the same friend who explodes at the mere though of peanut butter?

 

We all know what kind of reputation Florida has for caches particularly north eastern Florida.

 

Having actually cached in Florida, particularly Northeastern Florida, I don't have to rely on it's "reputation". I actually know. But then limiting my posts to things I actually know about does hamper my post to find ratio.

 

BTW, a friend of a cousin of a guy I work with told me that regularly posting on internet forums increases ones leaping ability (I can leap to that conclusion in TWO posts!)

Edited July 16, 2007 by IceCreamMan

[+The SuzyQs]

Are they any DOCUMENTED cases of cachers having an allergic reaction from finding a Peanut Butter jar cache? if so, then this thread should continue. IF NOT, then lock it down.

 

Straight from the Geocaching Disclaimer....

 

Cache seekers assume all risks involved in seeking a cache.

 

'nuff said.

[+JoeMerchant]

Since when does the number of hides someone has anything to do with their opinion on using a peanut butter jar as a cache container?

 

I agree. Since when is knowing what you're talking about a reflection on the quality of your posts?

[+briansnat]

I am suspicious of people with hundreds of "hides".

 

Uh oh

[CoyoteRed]

I've got to wonder about the situation where trade items have have been handed by someone who just enjoyed a PB&J. I love peanut butter. Sissy can attest to peanut butter being a "comfort food" for me much like chocolate is to others. A lot of folks like these allergens. So, will indirect contact with peanut butter like described cause reactions?

 

BTW, we've used a few peanut butter jars in the past with the only problem so far is paint adhesion.

 

The primary issue for any recycled food container is removing the smells so as to not attract wildlife. A cycle of removing all debris, put through dishwasher, 100% bleach solution rinse, and then dishwasher again seems to have done the trick for us.

 

The only problem for me now? I've been switched to "natural" peanut butter. Yep, the kind you have to stir before you eat. Supposedly, "real" peanut butter has an added oil to make it not separate and that oil is "bad" for you. ~sigh~

[Mushtang]

Are they any DOCUMENTED cases of cachers having an allergic reaction from finding a Peanut Butter jar cache? if so, then this thread should continue. IF NOT, then lock it down.

Why?

 

I'm assuming you either don't like reading the discussion, which you can easily avoid by not clicking on the link that takes you here, or you feel that discussions should be limited only to things that have actually happened.

 

The participants in this thread are enjoying themselves. I don't understand why someone would come into a thread and suggest it be locked simply because they don't want to read it.

[+elephantmama]

I've got to wonder about the situation where trade items have have been handed by someone who just enjoyed a PB&J. I love peanut butter. Sissy can attest to peanut butter being a "comfort food" for me much like chocolate is to others. A lot of folks like these allergens. So, will indirect contact with peanut butter like described cause reactions?

 

There are folks who say that people can react in situations like that. The most common discussion is about kids and playgrounds. I supposed if a person started reacting with hives at the site of contact and they had no other hive inducing allergies, you could infer that it was from touching a peanut contaminated item. But it would be a stretch to infer that, in my opinion.

 

Personally, my contact/airborne reactions have been a very runny nose and occasional progression to wheezing. So I'd probably assume that I was reacting to the plants or molds around me and never think about the cacher before me who ate pb&j.

[+IceCreamMan]

I am suspicious of people with hundreds of "hides".

 

Uh oh

 

Yep, you made the cut. Be suspect and be proud.

[+IceCreamMan]

we've used a few peanut butter jars in the past with the only problem so far is paint adhesion.

 

I use Fusion paint for plastic. It will scratch off with enough provocation, but it doesn't flake off. You can pick it up at any Ace or Walmart. They have a "River Rock" color that closely matches khaki, so it's easy to then move on to the darker colors of ultra flat cammo paint with that as your base. BTW, "Sissy" and "CoyoteRed"? Would that be Sissy & CR? That happens to be where I got my stencils.

[+JoeMerchant]

we've used a few peanut butter jars in the past with the only problem so far is paint adhesion.

 

I use Fusion paint for plastic. It will scratch off with enough provocation, but it doesn't flake off. You can pick it up at any Ace or Walmart. They have a "River Rock" color that closely matches khaki, so it's easy to then move on to the darker colors of ultra flat cammo paint with that as your base. BTW, "Sissy" and "CoyoteRed"? Would that be Sissy & CR? That happens to be where I got my stencils.

 

You might want to read the tag line on that post ICM...

[+IceCreamMan]

we've used a few peanut butter jars in the past with the only problem so far is paint adhesion.

 

I use Fusion paint for plastic. It will scratch off with enough provocation, but it doesn't flake off. You can pick it up at any Ace or Walmart. They have a "River Rock" color that closely matches khaki, so it's easy to then move on to the darker colors of ultra flat cammo paint with that as your base. BTW, "Sissy" and "CoyoteRed"? Would that be Sissy & CR? That happens to be where I got my stencils.

 

You might want to read the tag line on that post ICM...

 

DOH!!!

[+TexasGringo]

***there are laws regarding confidentiality, not to mention contractual concerns. often these cover medical and educational settings.***

 

But, if it was a matter of life and death...YOU should help others by disclosing what could save them.

[CoyoteRed]

I've got to wonder about the situation where trade items have have been handed by someone who just enjoyed a PB&J. I love peanut butter. Sissy can attest to peanut butter being a "comfort food" for me much like chocolate is to others. A lot of folks like these allergens. So, will indirect contact with peanut butter like described cause reactions?

There are folks who say that people can react in situations like that. The most common discussion is about kids and playgrounds. I supposed if a person started reacting with hives at the site of contact and they had no other hive inducing allergies, you could infer that it was from touching a peanut contaminated item. But it would be a stretch to infer that, in my opinion.

 

Personally, my contact/airborne reactions have been a very runny nose and occasional progression to wheezing. So I'd probably assume that I was reacting to the plants or molds around me and never think about the cacher before me who ate pb&j.

Thanks for the response.

 

I take it from your earlier post that my regime of cleaning those peanut butter jars is suffice to reduce the chances you reacting? I mean, I'm not sending them through an autoclave or anything, but I'd figure PETE would not absorb peanut oils and if it did would only do so while heated fairly hot. The heat in the dishwasher would either get all of the oil out or lock it in so it can't escape in the wild.

 

You have any opinions on handling a "properly" cleaned peanut butter container?

[+CYBret]

...Which is why so many people are suddenly allergic to peanuts. The peanuts are emitting toxins as an evolutionary defense mechanism. They're tired of being eaten, and now they're fighting back.

 

I have a friend who is so allergic to peanuts that he avoids parties where they're being served. If he shakes hands with someone who has been eating peanuts he has a violent and not at all fun to be around reaction.

 

I've seen several peanut butter jar cache containers. Eeh, they serve their purpose anyway. I've had a couple people tell me that they put a bead of silicone caulk around the inside of the lid to help them seal out moisture better.

[CoyoteRed]

BTW, "Sissy" and "CoyoteRed"? Would that be Sissy & CR? That happens to be where I got my stencils.

 

Yes, it is.

 

Sissy still talks about the hospitality of the Northeastern geocachers! Heck, her mom even talks about it.

 

Thanks, ICM!

 

BTW, Krylon's camo paint is made around Fusion--or at least the cans I bought at WM has it. It has worked well so far.

[CoyoteRed]

I've had a couple people tell me that they put a bead of silicone caulk around the inside of the lid to help them seal out moisture better.

Where we use them we've made the hidey-hole so you're encouraged to leave it upright. No special seals or anything. Couple or three years in the wild and a lot of visits and they're still going strong.

[+elephantmama]

I've got to wonder about the situation where trade items have have been handed by someone who just enjoyed a PB&J. I love peanut butter. Sissy can attest to peanut butter being a "comfort food" for me much like chocolate is to others. A lot of folks like these allergens. So, will indirect contact with peanut butter like described cause reactions?

There are folks who say that people can react in situations like that. The most common discussion is about kids and playgrounds. I supposed if a person started reacting with hives at the site of contact and they had no other hive inducing allergies, you could infer that it was from touching a peanut contaminated item. But it would be a stretch to infer that, in my opinion.

 

Personally, my contact/airborne reactions have been a very runny nose and occasional progression to wheezing. So I'd probably assume that I was reacting to the plants or molds around me and never think about the cacher before me who ate pb&j.

Thanks for the response.

 

I take it from your earlier post that my regime of cleaning those peanut butter jars is suffice to reduce the chances you reacting? I mean, I'm not sending them through an autoclave or anything, but I'd figure PETE would not absorb peanut oils and if it did would only do so while heated fairly hot. The heat in the dishwasher would either get all of the oil out or lock it in so it can't escape in the wild.

 

You have any opinions on handling a "properly" cleaned peanut butter container?

Like I said before, I wouldn't open a pb container, mostly out of anxiety based on past reactions. I make and serve food for my church. If there are any kinds of peanuts involved, I get someone else to open the container right before I leave the room. I just don't take unnecessary risks. Any exposure can increase my chances of a severe reaction the next time I accidentally ingest some peanut.

 

But I also have some amount of post traumatic stress based on a few anaphylactic reactions, so I know that I'm not exactly rational about peanuts. In reality, your method of cleaning the containers is most likely sufficient at removing the oils. But for me, it's not worth the anxiety I'd have over reaching inside, so I'd either have my kids open it or I'd leave it alone and post on the online log that I found it, but didn't sign the paper log.

[+Knight2000]

Like I said before, I wouldn't open a pb container, mostly out of anxiety based on past reactions. I make and serve food for my church. If there are any kinds of peanuts involved, I get someone else to open the container right before I leave the room. I just don't take unnecessary risks. Any exposure can increase my chances of a severe reaction the next time I accidentally ingest some peanut.

 

But I also have some amount of post traumatic stress based on a few anaphylactic reactions, so I know that I'm not exactly rational about peanuts. In reality, your method of cleaning the containers is most likely sufficient at removing the oils. But for me, it's not worth the anxiety I'd have over reaching inside, so I'd either have my kids open it or I'd leave it alone and post on the online log that I found it, but didn't sign the paper log.

This brings up two questions for me.

 

1) How do you know it was a jar for PB?

 

2) Couldn't you just use gloves?

[+elephantmama]

Like I said before, I wouldn't open a pb container, mostly out of anxiety based on past reactions. I make and serve food for my church. If there are any kinds of peanuts involved, I get someone else to open the container right before I leave the room. I just don't take unnecessary risks. Any exposure can increase my chances of a severe reaction the next time I accidentally ingest some peanut.

 

But I also have some amount of post traumatic stress based on a few anaphylactic reactions, so I know that I'm not exactly rational about peanuts. In reality, your method of cleaning the containers is most likely sufficient at removing the oils. But for me, it's not worth the anxiety I'd have over reaching inside, so I'd either have my kids open it or I'd leave it alone and post on the online log that I found it, but didn't sign the paper log.

This brings up two questions for me.

 

1) How do you know it was a jar for PB?

 

2) Couldn't you just use gloves?

I guess that I'd just go by the shape of the jar. Most PB jars have a similar shape. And sure, I could use gloves. I carry a set of gardening gloves with me anyway. But then I still have the gloves in my bag with potential (or anxiety induced imagined) residue on them. It would just feel weird to me.I'm sure that I could wear the gloves, then slide them off into a ziploc bag which I could immediately empty into the washing machine when I got home. But that's just a lot of work and worry. Like I said, it's probably not rational, but it's a risk that I'm not keen on taking. It sounds like I'm peanut jar phobic, huh.

 

I'm really not nutty (pun intended) about most things and since I do this game, I'm obviously not afraid of risks. It's just this particular one that freaks me out, mostly because it's something affects my everyday life, I guess.

 

What we usually do anyway is that the kids open the cache and dump the contents on the ground, so I can do a quick safety check. Then they hand me the log to sign and they plunder the goodies. I sign the log, bag it back up, and see what the kids took. I give them stuff out of my bag to put back in the cache, always a little more than we took out, and the shove everything back in, seal it up, and re-hide it. I rarely have actual physical contact with anything besides the log. If the log is wet or moldy, I wipe my hands with a baby wipe afterwards, since I'm allergic to mold too.

 

And really, is it that important to open the jar? The main point of geocaching, for me, is the hike and the hunt. I've never personally taken anything from a cache. I let my kids take stuff and I leave a bunch stuff, but the actual contents of the cache aren't the goal for me.

[+Knight2000]

You can buy disposable gloves for pretty cheap. I know some cachers carry them when they don't want to touch objects during CITO.

[+sbell111]

Anyone who knowingly leaves a health hazard for someone to encounter and then claims it's the victims fault for picking is up is only deluding themselves that they have no responsibility in the matter.

 

I don't have the allergy, but one someone very dear to me does. You DO NOT have to eat the peanut butter. The allergy can be triggered merely by contacting a microscopic portion of the oils. This is a potentially deadly allergy, so please take it seriously.

 

If you have to use a food jar, try one of the new plastic mayo jars. They're bigger, anyway.

The highlighted portion is not true.

 

People who are allergic to peanuts are allergic to peanut protein, not peanut oil. While it is certainly true that peanut oil may become contaminated with peanut protein, these proteins will certainly be completely removed by a run through the dishwasher.

 

Personally, I would also recommend a soak in a bleach solution for these containers, but that is for removal of the smell, rather than anything to do with allergies.

[The Black Pearl]

there's no reason a cacher can't just avoid the container. in cases where a cacher hikes all day to arrive at a container and then can't open it, i'd be pretty hacked if it were me.

 

Physical and mental imperfections are neither fun nor fair, but they are a fact of life. Blind people shouldn’t be knife throwers...

 

Hey, I have a friend who is blind. It is not nice to make fun of blind people. If they want to throw knifes it is ok with me. Why do people pick on blind people? My friend likes peanut buter. This agrument makes me sick.

[+sbell111]

If you have a allergicsy (i dont) to peanut butter can you get it by reaching into a peanut butter jar cache container?

oh to end all this ranting..

 

The answer to your question in YES

Actually, I believe that the answer is NO.

 

If the container has been washed, no peanut proteins are present. If none of these proteins are present, it is completely impossible to have an allergic reaction to them.

Edited July 16, 2007 by sbell111

[+JohnnyVegas]

We could have a new guidline that says "No peanut butter jars"

That would give us a new guidline that most cachers will not read or understand.

Or they could pretend they do not understand it.

[+sbell111]

Looking at your stats (2,278 posts/1226 finds/20 hides) you might want to reconsider offering advise on hiding caches. But, you're definitely the go to guy for advise on posting.

Please tell me that you forgot to put the smiley on your post.

 

Is it your position that someone with 1226 finds and 20 hides doesn't have a right to discuss cache hiding? It seems to me that someone with those stats would likely be a very good person to talk to about this subject.

 

Further, I think your snarky comment is pretty ironic considering that you only have 1007 finds (51 of which were events) and 20 finds (Conicidently, the same number of finds as the person you jumped on).

 

[+tozainamboku]

Are they any DOCUMENTED cases of cachers having an allergic reaction from finding a Peanut Butter jar cache? if so, then this thread should continue. IF NOT, then lock it down.

Why?

 

I'm assuming you either don't like reading the discussion, which you can easily avoid by not clicking on the link that takes you here, or you feel that discussions should be limited only to things that have actually happened.

 

The participants in this thread are enjoying themselves. I don't understand why someone would come into a thread and suggest it be locked simply because they don't want to read it.

I've been just hanging back and not replying to this thread since I don't have a peanut allergy and don't really care one way or the other about whether peanut jars should be used as cache containers. However this post and Mushtang's reply got me thinking of the thread I started on Friday on logging multiple finds. Keystone lock that thread I assume because some of the responders got into a heated argument about whether there should be a one find log per GC# rule. I guess there was some name calling in that thread so it got locked. Perhaps Keystone was fast one the lock button with that one because he felt my original post was "trolling". After all the topic of multiple found logs is known to be quite controversial.

 

So why hasn't this thread been locked? There has been some name calling here. People have made claims about peanut allergeries that others have refered to as BS. Some of the comments on personal responsibility have gotted quited heated - though perhaps not as much as what happened in my thread. This has also gotten a bit off topic with discussions on whether peanut butter jars make good cache containers or not and have had tips on how to clean, paint, and waterproof PB jars. At least on my thread, people were still discussing whether it might make sense to log multiple finds if we thought of the 'found it' log as a report on the cache's condition instead of a score we would compare against other cachers.

 

I realize my rant is off topic for this thread. If the moderators wish they can move this to a new thread on when controversial threads should be locked - or they can just ignore it since it will likely be buried between the discussion of peanut butter allergies, personnal responsibility, and what makes a good cache container.

 

Just to be on topic. I would only log a 'found it' once per peanut butter jar. I heard that you can get develop a sensitivity to peanuts if you are exposed to them too often so why risk it by logging a peanut butter jar more than once.

Edited July 16, 2007 by tozainamboku

[Mushtang]

If you have a allergicsy (i dont) to peanut butter can you get it by reaching into a peanut butter jar cache container?

oh to end all this ranting..

 

The answer to your question in YES

Actually, I believe that the answer is NO.

 

If the container has been washed, no peanut proteins are present. If none of these proteins are present, it is completely impossible to have an allergic reaction to them.

I wonder if proteins get airborn and can kill a person if they're in the same room as someone eating a PB&J sandwich?

[+Knight2000]

Anyone who knowingly leaves a health hazard for someone to encounter and then claims it's the victims fault for picking is up is only deluding themselves that they have no responsibility in the matter.

 

I don't have the allergy, but one someone very dear to me does. You DO NOT have to eat the peanut butter. The allergy can be triggered merely by contacting a microscopic portion of the oils. This is a potentially deadly allergy, so please take it seriously.

 

If you have to use a food jar, try one of the new plastic mayo jars. They're bigger, anyway.

The highlighted portion is not true.

 

People who are allergic to peanuts are allergic to peanut protein, not peanut oil. While it is certainly true that peanut oil may become contaminated with peanut protein, these proteins will certainly be completely removed by a run through the dishwasher.

 

Personally, I would also recommend a soak in a bleach solution for these containers, but that is for removal of the smell, rather than anything to do with allergies.

I am going to disagree with the above.

 

Although not peanuts my son has bad walnut allergies. If he comes into contact with walnut oil he will break out in a rash for weeks.

[+KBI]

there's no reason a cacher can't just avoid the container. in cases where a cacher hikes all day to arrive at a container and then can't open it, i'd be pretty hacked if it were me.

Physical and mental imperfections are neither fun nor fair, but they are a fact of life. Blind people shouldn’t be knife throwers...

Hey, I have a friend who is blind. It is not nice to make fun of blind people.

I agree, it’s NOT nice to make fun of blind people. I was not making fun of blind people. My statement might have sounded insensitive the way you took it out of context, but I believe you may have failed to notice this line:

Physical and mental imperfections are neither fun nor fair ...

And you failed to quote this one:

Anyone whose personal limitations restrict their career or entertainment options has my sympathy ...

It was not my intent to make fun of blind people. For all I know I may become one of them someday. I merely needed an example to make my point. Did you understand my point?

 

If they want to throw knifes it is ok with me.

You do understand what a knife thrower is, right? Are you volunteering to stand in front of the wooden backstop and hold the balloons while a blind person flings knives in your direction?

 

Why do people pick on blind people?

Who knows? Personally I think it’s kind of mean, but of course all the handicapped people I’ve known strongly prefer to be treated just like everyone else without pity or heavy sympathy. I try to poke at everyone equally.

 

My friend likes peanut buter.

My son likes peanut butter.

 

This agrument makes me sick.

Wow – your allergy must be pretty severe if you get a reaction just from reading this debate on your computer screen.

Edited July 16, 2007 by KBI

[+sbell111]

If you have a allergicsy (i dont) to peanut butter can you get it by reaching into a peanut butter jar cache container?

oh to end all this ranting..

 

The answer to your question in YES

Actually, I believe that the answer is NO.

 

If the container has been washed, no peanut proteins are present. If none of these proteins are present, it is completely impossible to have an allergic reaction to them.

I wonder if proteins get airborn and can kill a person if they're in the same room as someone eating a PB&J sandwich?

According to what I've read on the issue, an allergic reaction may occur if you inhale dust or aerosols containing peanuts, such as that of peanut flour or contaminated peanut oil cooking spray. You can't get a reaction simply from being in the room with a masticated sandwich or a geocache.

[The Black Pearl]

I have not hide any caches yet but I am not alergic to peanuts. Can I hide a peanut buter jar? Where do you get them? If not can I hide a caches in cashew buter jar?