Question on DNFs

July 10, 2007

Hi, I'm new. . .

I have found 8 caches so far. Being new, it took me 2 or 3 visits on a couple of them! I also have a few caches that I haven't found (despite seemingly being right on top of), but I know the problem is me and not the cache, and I'll just keep re-visiting them until I do.

In cases like this, am I supposed to log these as DNFs, or is it legitimate to consider myself just "continuing my search another day?" I don't know what the accepted norm is, and don't want to seem to be unfairly inflating my statistics by not counting my DNFs.

Thanks for your help!

11.3k · July 10, 2007

Welcome to the Forums!

You should log all your visits to the location, when you really looked for the cache, as a DNF. That is part of your caching history, and there is no "shame" in a DNF.

It is also part of the cache's history and gives other cachers an idea what to expect. The cache owner will read your log, see what your experience is, a make a judgement whether they need to check on the cache, or not.

Welcome to the addiction!

38.2k · July 10, 2007

In cases like this, am I supposed to log these as DNFs...

Yes. You looked and didn't find the cache.

July 10, 2007

This response is for those that you've tried several times to find. (I personally don't log a DNF if I know I'm going to try again in the next couple of days...possibly with another set of eyes.) If I can't find it and I think the problem is me, I post a DNF and say that it was probably me and I'll be back to try again. That way I know that I've attempted this cache should I not get back to it soon. Also, there is a chance it's not me and if several cachers DNF's in a row, that let's the cache owner know there is/might be a problem.

Welcome to geocaching!

July 10, 2007

Thanks everyone. I just did not want to accidentally annoy people by posting 3 DNFs on the same cache in 3 days (hopefully with a Find on Day 4!) if that wasn't what I was supposed to do.

July 10, 2007

A DNF may also result in getting an extra hint from the owner to find it next time you visit the stash place.

Greetings,

Hans

11.3k · July 10, 2007

If a new cacher posts a DNF on one of my caches, which are usually very easy to find, and usually include a hint, I'll often email them and sometimes a little hint might just slip out . . .

24.7k · July 10, 2007

...I don't know what the accepted norm is, and don't want to seem to be unfairly inflating my statistics by not counting my DNFs....

The norm has a bit of a debate about it.

My style is this. If I am looking for the cache and I can't find it. It will get a note or a DNF. The DNF is for when I have no more ideas on where to look. The cache has got the best of me. A note is for when something else comes up. I got thirsty, it got dark, the crack house next door was raided and I had to go, muggles came along and would not leave etc.

Others would post a DNF for everthing that I used a note for.

The common ground is that we agree to post something so the cache owner knows what's going on with the cache and that someone was looking.

July 10, 2007

...I don't know what the accepted norm is, and don't want to seem to be unfairly inflating my statistics by not counting my DNFs....

The norm has a bit of a debate about it.

My style is this. If I am looking for the cache and I can't find it. It will get a note or a DNF. The DNF is for when I have no more ideas on where to look. The cache has got the best of me. A note is for when something else comes up. I got thirsty, it got dark, the crack house next door was raided and I had to go, muggles came along and would not leave etc.

Others would post a DNF for everthing that I used a note for.

The common ground is that we agree to post something so the cache owner knows what's going on with the cache and that someone was looking.

The above is what I would also do. If I made a real effort where I thought the cache was I would log a DNF. If I was unable to get to the cache because of conditions ( a high tide when the cache is only accessible at low tide ) then I would post a note saying I was unable to search the proper area. I do this because I tend to put off looking for caches that have too many DNF's.

1.5k · July 10, 2007

NO. Don't log a DNF.

There... I've done it. I've taken the opposite opinion.

Now I'll have to get flamed, and defend my position...

Only log a DNF if you have given up on the search, and are pretty sure the cache is missing.

A DNF signals the owner that the cache may be missing.

If you are struggling with the hunt, just log a NOTE.

38.2k · July 10, 2007

Only log a DNF if you have given up on the search, and are pretty sure the cache is missing.

It's a DNF, not a CIPM (cache is probably missing).

A DNF may mean a cache is missing. It can also mean that the cache is harder than the owner rated it, or it may mean that the searcher is inexperienced and just not good at finding them yet, or a number of other things. That's for the owner to determine, but he can only make a determination if people log their DNFs.

A responsible owner will see a few DNFs in a row and check on the cache. If "Cacher A" searches, comes up empty and doesn't log his DNF, then "Cacher B" fails and logs a DNF, then "Cacher C" gets skunked and doesn't log his DNF, the owner will only know about 1 DNF when in reality there were three and he should be checking on his cache. So he will delay a needed maintenance trip while other people waste their time looking for a cache that is probably missing.

As a cache owner I want to know if people can't find my cache. If its a cache I made difficult on purpose, I'll get a smug sense of satisfaction. If its a cache that is supposed to be easy, I know that there may be an issue.

Either it's gone, moved or someone re-hid it too well and I'll know I should take a look.

8k · July 10, 2007

NO. Don't log a DNF.

There... I've done it. I've taken the opposite opinion.

Now I'll have to get flamed, and defend my position...

Only log a DNF if you have given up on the search, and are pretty sure the cache is missing.

A DNF signals the owner that the cache may be missing.

If you are struggling with the hunt, just log a NOTE.

I noticed you logged a few of the DNFs from Saturday. But not all of them.

18.9k · July 10, 2007

You looked, you did not find --- that is you "Did Not Find" the cache = DNF log. Pretty simple.

11.3k · July 10, 2007

NO. Don't log a DNF.

There... I've done it. I've taken the opposite opinion.

Now I'll have to get flamed, and defend my position...

Only log a DNF if you have given up on the search, and are pretty sure the cache is missing.

A DNF signals the owner that the cache may be missing.

If you are struggling with the hunt, just log a NOTE.

If you didn't find it, how do you know it "may be missing."

There is nothing wrong with logging a DNF. If I couldn't get to a cache location for some reason, but wanted to let the cache owner know I was nearby, and possibly give a reason why I couldn't actually look for the cache, then I'll log a NOTE.

Each log type has a specific purpose. There isn't one for "The Cache May Be Missing."

July 10, 2007

This is a great question! I am new also and have not been sure about the DNFs.

Initially, there were 2 caches that I looked for and did not find. They were very close to me, so I knew I would be searching again soon. I did not log them as a DNF. Within a few days, I went back and found them and logged the caches as found.

Today while out, there was one I could not find. I'm not usually in that area, so I'm not sure when I would go back. I went ahead and logged it as a DNF.

I'm new and expect that I will not be able to find most caches until I get a little better. I don't have a problem with posting a DNF b/c I know that eventually I will go back and try to find it.

However, one post said about posting a DNF for the same post a few days in a row. I think that would be a little redundant. I think I would log it once as a DNF and email the owner saying I had been out there three times and would they mind giving out a little hint.

It seems like there are varying opinions on this subject. I think it's great to see what others do in the situation.

July 10, 2007

This is a great topic, being a complete newbie myself I just logged my first DNF today. I plan on going back but I definetly DNF it today!

1.5k · July 10, 2007

NO. Don't log a DNF.

There... I've done it. I've taken the opposite opinion.

Now I'll have to get flamed, and defend my position...

Only log a DNF if you have given up on the search, and are pretty sure the cache is missing.

A DNF signals the owner that the cache may be missing.

If you are struggling with the hunt, just log a NOTE.

I noticed you logged a few of the DNFs from Saturday. But not all of them.

Ah yes..... this brings up another point (in case we don't have enough to discuss already)....

If you are with a group of 17 geocachers, and ALL of you DNF the cache......then.... NOT all of you need to log a DNF. The cache owner should be able to tell by the words in your log that 17 cachers were hunting for the cache..... unless you are trying to make a point to the cache owner :angry:

1.5k · July 10, 2007

As an example.....

In 3 days we found 266 caches and DNF'd 57. That's because we only looked for 3 minutes at each cache.

Should we log DNF's on ALL of the caches we Did Not Find? NO

However, in this case we did log DNF's on them all. (Whoops, ...I think I just won an argument against myself)

Dang, I forgot what my point was :angry:

July 10, 2007

Ah yes..... this brings up another point (in case we don't have enough to discuss already)....

If you are with a group of 17 geocachers, and ALL of you DNF the cache......then.... NOT all of you need to log a DNF. The cache owner should be able to tell by the words in your log that 17 cachers were hunting for the cache..... unless you are trying to make a point to the cache owner

I had his recently on one of my caches. It had 5 DNF on the same day from a group of cachers.

This gave an impression that it may have been muggled and would discourage others from trying for it.

Luckily another cacher found it within a week.

14.3k · July 10, 2007

...I don't know what the accepted norm is, and don't want to seem to be unfairly inflating my statistics by not counting my DNFs....

The norm has a bit of a debate about it.

My style is this. If I am looking for the cache and I can't find it. It will get a note or a DNF. The DNF is for when I have no more ideas on where to look. The cache has got the best of me. A note is for when something else comes up. I got thirsty, it got dark, the crack house next door was raided and I had to go, muggles came along and would not leave etc.

Others would post a DNF for everthing that I used a note for.

The common ground is that we agree to post something so the cache owner knows what's going on with the cache and that someone was looking.

This is typically how I do it too. Do what you think is right. You don't "have" to do it the way others do it.

14.3k · July 10, 2007

As an example.....

In 3 days we found 266 caches and DNF'd 57. That's because we only looked for 3 minutes at each cache.

Should we log DNF's on ALL of the caches we Did Not Find? NO

However, in this case we did log DNF's on them all. (Whoops, ...I think I just won an argument against myself)

Dang, I forgot what my point was

14.3k · July 11, 2007

NO. Don't log a DNF.

There... I've done it. I've taken the opposite opinion.

Now I'll have to get flamed, and defend my position...

Only log a DNF if you have given up on the search, and are pretty sure the cache is missing.

A DNF signals the owner that the cache may be missing.

If you are struggling with the hunt, just log a NOTE.

If you didn't find it, how do you know it "may be missing."

There is nothing wrong with logging a DNF. If I couldn't get to a cache location for some reason, but wanted to let the cache owner know I was nearby, and possibly give a reason why I couldn't actually look for the cache, then I'll log a NOTE.

Each log type has a specific purpose. There isn't one for "The Cache May Be Missing."

If you only log DNFs after a "good effort" that's as close as you'll get to telling the owner that the cache may be missing. Otherwise the DNF log has no purpose other than to document something that a note could have also documented... :laughing:

11.3k · July 11, 2007

When I log a DNF, that doesn't tell the owner the cache might be missing. If they know my history, it only tells them I couldn't find it.

Right after I put the cache on my "As-Yet-Unresolved DNFs" Bookmark List, I start getting logs saying, "Easy find." :angry:

14.3k · July 11, 2007

When I log a DNF, that doesn't tell the owner the cache might be missing. If they know my history, it only tells them I couldn't find it.

Right after I put the cache on my "As-Yet-Unresolved DNFs" Bookmark List, I start getting logs saying, "Easy find."

So you gave that cache a good effort and could not find the cache and others are easily finding it? Edited July 11, 2007 by TrailGators

1.5k · July 11, 2007

ok, then I'm switching sides again. :laughing:

I log a DNF for ME. It's NOT for the cache owner, it's for ME. :angry:

I like to know which caches I tried to find.

I like to leave myself a note to review... just in case I want to go hunt for that cache again.

Yep... that's what I do.

July 11, 2007

I used to log DNFs, but after a while I don't bother, because I know it is still there because of previous logs. So I keep going back until I find the cache.

What annoys me though is when DNFs are logged when folks haven't even attempted to look for the cache, I've seen it a few times.

July 11, 2007

I log my DNF's and like to add something about something positive about the area or something funny. I tried to think of each search as good exercise (I like rural rather than urban ) which this granny can always use. :angry:

I think this activity is suppose to be fun or at least I'm having fun.

11.3k · July 11, 2007

When I log a DNF, that doesn't tell the owner the cache might be missing. If they know my history, it only tells them I couldn't find it.

Right after I put the cache on my "As-Yet-Unresolved DNFs" Bookmark List, I start getting logs saying, "Easy find."

So you gave that cache a good effort and could not find the cache and others are easily finding it?

Yes. That happens all the time. I have spent a lot of time looking for a cache, not found it and have left being fairly convinced it isn't there, when it is.

Do you find every cache you look for?

I have logged 243 DNFs . . . Some of those were missing when I looked for them, however most of them were there. Some of those 243 caches I have returned to find. Some I have not. One trip to the location was enough . . .

July 14, 2007

Interesting question, and interesting range of opinions. We are new to this and started out with a really bad GPS unit that was a gift. Went out to find a couple of caches along a hiking trail, and couldn't get a signal the entire time we were on the trail. I didn't log DNFs or even notes on those because I figured without a working GPSr it wasn't really a proper effort. We will go back for those. (The good news is we were able to exchange that GPSr for a better one, and made our first find earlier tonight.)

Related question (since someone mentioned making a note if they didn't search properly because of muggles), but what is the etiquette of searching with muggles around? Are we supposed to only look when no one can see us? It seems to me that we coudl just explain the game if someone saw us finding a cache.

14.3k · July 14, 2007

When I log a DNF, that doesn't tell the owner the cache might be missing. If they know my history, it only tells them I couldn't find it.

Right after I put the cache on my "As-Yet-Unresolved DNFs" Bookmark List, I start getting logs saying, "Easy find."

So you gave that cache a good effort and could not find the cache and others are easily finding it?

Yes. That happens all the time. I have spent a lot of time looking for a cache, not found it and have left being fairly convinced it isn't there, when it is.

Do you find every cache you look for?

Nope. But most of the caches I haven't been able to find either have been muggled or the coords are way off. I am a pretty determined finder. Plus I typically cache in a group so it's hard to stump everyone in a group. If I cached by myself, I would definitely have had more DNFs. :yikes:

Question on DNFs

Recommended Posts

Link to comment

Link to comment

Link to comment

Link to comment

Link to comment

Link to comment

Link to comment

Link to comment

Link to comment

Link to comment

Link to comment

Link to comment

Link to comment

Link to comment

Link to comment

Link to comment

Link to comment

Link to comment

Link to comment

Link to comment

Link to comment

Link to comment

Link to comment

Link to comment

Link to comment

Link to comment

Link to comment

Link to comment

Link to comment

Link to comment

Join the conversation