New cache in park

[+Mandollyn]

Normally... I would suggest to contact the approver to get his/her opinion of the co-ords...

[+Stunod]

Then I'll ask those who do have thousands of finds. Anyone with a thousand finds or more run into trouble with the law while caching?

 

Over 1000 without ever speaking to a police officer.

Closest I've had is a security guard asking if we needed help.

[+Totem Clan]

www.geocreed.info

 

When placing or seeking geocaches, I will:

 

Not endanger myself or others

 

Avoid causing disruptions or public alarms

 

Use caution where children play. Parents are understandably concerned when strangers are near their children.

 

I found three lines of the creed that are appropriate in this situation.

I'm happy to see folks wanting place new and unusually caches in interesting place or ways, but they must do so responsibly.

 

Not having any concern over what problems or concerns your caches may cause for other cachers, the public in general, or law enforcement, is incredibly irresponsible. Our actions do not affect us alone.

 

Thank you Kit Fox for posting the quotes from the creed. I would encourage any cacher that has not read it to do so. Also I would encourage all of us as cachers to follow it.

 

The Geocacher's Creed.

[+Knight2000]

I truly do not understand some of you. I ask for ideas and thoughts and it turns into this.

 

FYI- i met with the chief of police today and discussed the proposed cache and other caches with him. From a security standpoint he said it would not be a problem.

 

I never mentioned placing a cache without doing it properly.

 

While i appreciate many fine comments/posters its sad how fast this and many threads turn into this.

[+Kit Fox]

I truly do not understand some of you. I ask for ideas and thoughts and it turns into this.

 

Translation:

 

I've already made up my mind, and think placing a cache on or near playground equipment is a great idea. Everyone is trying to change my mind, they are being mean.

 

Please realize that all of us are trying to help you. Most of us come from different backgrounds, but all of us share the love of geocaching. We are trying to make your first cache a success. Some posters may have come off a bit strong, when they responded to this comment (I dont have a problem with anyone getting the police called on them. Its the nature of the sport. We have been caching for less than 5 weeks and this has happened twice to us.)

 

You wrongfully assume that encounters with law enforcement happen to all geocachers. You've read threads where a few dozen cachers have written about "encounters with law enforcement. You don't realize that there are thousands of cachers that have not encountered LEs. We all cache because its an enjoyable activity. I don't know of anyone, that enjoys being question by law enforcement, suspicious parents, or neighborhood "do-gooders."

 

 

FYI- i met with the chief of police today and discussed the proposed cache and other caches with him. From a security standpoint he said it would not be a problem. I never mentioned placing a cache without doing it properly.

 

While i appreciate many fine comments/posters its sad how fast this and many threads turn into this.

 

I commend you for taking the time to speak with the Chief of Police! That was a phenominal idea on your part

 

No offense intended, but I think you aren't taking the time to understand what we are trying to tell you. I think your guard is up, because you felt slighted by everyone's comments, so you are only reading what you want to read.

Edited April 24, 2007 by Kit Fox

[+Mr. 0]

I truly do not understand some of you. I ask for ideas and thoughts and it turns into this.

 

FYI- i met with the chief of police today and discussed the proposed cache and other caches with him. From a security standpoint he said it would not be a problem.

 

I never mentioned placing a cache without doing it properly.

 

While i appreciate many fine comments/posters its sad how fast this and many threads turn into this.

 

Meeting with the local police is a great first step in setting this cache up properly. I'm sure you've already thought about this, but make sure you contact whoever it is that owns the park as well, if you're planning to go ahead with the cache.

 

I don't really think the thread has headed very far off topic here, to be honest. Thoughts on this cache hide were requested, and unfortunately it seems that most of the people who have posted to this thread don't like this particular type of hide.

 

Ultimately it is up to you whether you hide the cache or not. If you go ahead with the idea, like I said above you've already started down the right path to making sure that there will be relatively few problems with it. Just keep in mind that even though the police chief okayed it, doesn't mean that you've eliminated the possibility of the police coming out. If I recall correctly there was a cache placed in front of a police station with permission, that still ended up being "removed" by the bomb squad due to miscommunication and someone being on vacation. That's a bit of an extreme example, I think, in relation to this particular cache, but it illustrates a point. Just be ready for folks to skip over it, and possibly send less than friendly feedback, especially if the cacher is stopped/questioned by non-cachers at the park, or the police. Also be prepared to replace it once in a while due to muggling. Although these are all real possibilities for any cache out there, I think the location of it being in a playground may amplify some issues.

[+Totem Clan]

FYI- i met with the chief of police today and discussed the proposed cache and other caches with him. From a security standpoint he said it would not be a problem.

Wonderful. I wish more folks would go to that much trouble. Then we wouldn't have some of the problems we have.

 

The only problem I see with the cache is the one mention earlier. If you put it on the equipment, IT WILL BE MUGGLED. That's a fact that experience has proven.

 

(And I may only have 250+ finds, but I have everyone with 50 miles. I have the most hides in that same area. I'm the Geocaching Coordinator for the local state park. I've also started and now run a international geocaching group here locally. Finds aren't the only measure of experience. This is not a brag. It's for your information. I'm trying to help you. After all, that's what you ask for.)

[+Knight2000]

(And I may only have 250+ finds, but I have everyone with 50 miles. I have the most hides in that same area. I'm the Geocaching Coordinator for the local state park. I've also started and now run a international geocaching group here locally. Finds aren't the only measure of experience. This is not a brag. It's for your information. I'm trying to help you. After all, that's what you ask for.)

 

Maybe thats why you havent had an encounter with police. You live in the middle of nowhere.

[+ArtieD]

I truly do not understand some of you. I ask for ideas and thoughts and it turns into this.

 

FYI- i met with the chief of police today and discussed the proposed cache and other caches with him. From a security standpoint he said it would not be a problem.

 

I never mentioned placing a cache without doing it properly.

 

While i appreciate many fine comments/posters its sad how fast this and many threads turn into this.

 

Whoah...back the truck up, buddy.

 

You asked for opinions and you got them. I'm sorry if all of them didn't match your world view.

 

As far as your last comment...you're wrong and you know it. This thread has been civil and on topic.

 

Look, we all know you're going to place this cache anyway. You probably were all along, so starting this thread was probably pointless.

 

Might I suggest that you read the Geocacher's Creed really well before you do, though, and ask yourself...is this keeping with what geocaching and geocachers are all about?

[+egami]

There is nothing wrong with putting a cache in a playground. Many cachers, like myself, have young kids and finding these new playgrounds are good breaks from other nearby cache finds.

 

Any type of cache you place will generally irritate someone for some reason.

[vagabond]

How do you cache?

 

I've never even been approached by muggles, much less the police. I also cache with kids, and I've never done anything that would draw that kind of suspicion.

 

I dont know how we cache.

 

The first time we were approached is when someone from a business saw us and reported us as suspicious looking men with children. (Myself and another friend of mine.)

 

The second was when my son and i were using our flashlight to find a cache in the dark after a day of caching.

 

So far two people have said that they have not been approached by police and basically its just us. Well, sorry, but both of you have less than 300 finds. If you had 3,000 then i would wonder.

Ok hows this over 6 years caching over 3000 finds and have been questioned once about 2 years ago.

If a cache is in the area of a playground and children are present I pass on the cache, although I usually cache on sunday starting around daylight just to keep the muggle factor down

[+Knight2000]

Whoah...back the truck up, buddy.

 

You asked for opinions and you got them. I'm sorry if all of them didn't match your world view.

 

As far as your last comment...you're wrong and you know it. This thread has been civil and on topic.

 

Look, we all know you're going to place this cache anyway. You probably were all along, so starting this thread was probably pointless.

 

Might I suggest that you read the Geocacher's Creed really well before you do, though, and ask yourself...is this keeping with what geocaching and geocachers are all about?

Yeah i got opinions, but this has strayed off topic of the original question.

 

We have not decided on this cache.

 

Where on this site is the creed?

[+egami]

Where on this site is the creed?

 

This is the recommendations for cache placement: http://www.geocaching.com/about/hiding.aspx

[+Kealia]

...So far two people have said that they have not been approached by police and basically its just us. Well, sorry, but both of you have less than 300 finds. If you had 3,000 then i would wonder.

 

Wow, open mouth - insert foot. Are your really trying to piss people off? Having been around for only a month now you hardly have the experience that others have to draw upon here. I'd suggest you relax a bit. You asked for feedback and you are getting it - don't attack the people that are responding.

 

Maybe it isnt the nature of the sport.

 

From what i have observed on these forums is that most likely you will eventually come into contact with police. (For whatever reason. If you dont beleive me then do a search.)

 

So while it may not be the nature of the sport, it is a possibility.

 

It's a possibility, yes, but it's rare. Yes, you can search the forums, and what you'll find is a handful of run-ins with LE over hundreds of thousands of finds. You likely have the same odds of running into LE while caching as you do while doing anything else - unless your behavior or the location begs for somebody to call the cops.

 

Nothing too special about it. It is a nice park, and there are very few caches in this area. (Although there is another one in this park .12 miles away - near, but not on playground equipment.)

 

The reasoning was not simply just to hide a cache. It was to hide one in an interesting area in an interesting way.

 

If there's already a cache here and the location is "nothing too special" why not find a better spot for it?

[+wrlwnd]

As has been said by many in response to the questions asked by the OP I think that from the statement made that this is a bad place for a cache. I have 3 hides in the local area on my ignore list that fit close to this caches description as my GPSr was pointing me toward the playground equipment and I never found a time in 4 or 5 tries that there were no families in the area, having looked in the early morning hours and late evening into dark times. I then decided that I would no longer search for these.

 

My reasoning behind this is my appearance and the way society has gone today. I am a middle aged man with a full "Santa" beard and hair that is down to the bottom of my shoulder blades (see my profile I have a picture of me there.) One of the first thoughts that comes to many peoples minds when talking to them later is "darn hippy" or "greasy biker." I despise those that think that way, but many do. There has been way to much abuse of children by adults and an adult male alone in an area where children play raises suspicion. I have no problem with police questioning me, but in the area of child abuse todays society has an attitude of guilty till proven innocent and I want no part of it being brought on me when enjoying my sport.

 

I am ready when out caching as I have some of the fliers from Geocacher U that I am willing to provide to any one who asks about what I am doing when out hunting caches alone, which is most of the time. I have heard back from some muggles that I had given the fliers to when out caching while on a business trip and am not sure if they ever became cachers, but I hope so.

 

So my bottom line is that unless this would be a fairly quick cache find without having children playing I would try a few times to find the playground are empty, but if it looked like I have to go out of my way to do so it would go into my ignore list.

[+Mr. 0]

Even though I may not personally like this type of hide, like egami basically said you can't please everyone.

 

In that spirit I thought of another suggestion to help reduce any issues. If the park has some sort of bulletin board or something, as many parks do, right at the parking lot or where ever. Maybe you could post a copy of the standard Geocaching stash note, or some other informational piece on there. It'll be impossible to get the word out to all of the non-cachers as to what might be going on there, but even if just a few people take a minute to read the information they'll be better informed and probably more accepting of random people searching around the playground. They too can pass on information to other non-cachers nearby who may not have read the info, and be questioning what's going on. To that end as well it may get some folks interested in caching and then they have an opportunity to find their first cache right there.

 

It's just one of those brainstorming kind of things, and it may not work at all, but I figured I'd throw it out there.

[+Totem Clan]

(And I may only have 250+ finds, but I have everyone with 50 miles. I have the most hides in that same area. I'm the Geocaching Coordinator for the local state park. I've also started and now run a international geocaching group here locally. Finds aren't the only measure of experience. This is not a brag. It's for your information. I'm trying to help you. After all, that's what you ask for.)

 

Maybe thats why you havent had an encounter with police. You live in the middle of nowhere.

Then how do you explain having no contact with them when I lived and cached in a city of over 300,000? That was when I was I newb too. Plus others have already confirmed what I said. Are you going to claim they have no experience also?

[+egami]

As has been said by many in response to the questions asked by the OP I think that from the statement made that this is a bad place for a cache. I have 3 hides in the local area on my ignore list that fit close to this caches description as my GPSr was pointing me toward the playground equipment and I never found a time in 4 or 5 tries that there were no families in the area, having looked in the early morning hours and late evening into dark times. I then decided that I would no longer search for these.

 

My reasoning behind this is my appearance and the way society has gone today. I am a middle aged man with a full "Santa" beard and hair that is down to the bottom of my shoulder blades...

 

To play devil's advocate...it's interesting to me that this logic will get brought up to oppose a cache location yet there is a large constituancy of cachers that this location is not an issue for like myself with kids.

 

However, if I were to use the logic that since I cache with kids harder locations in remote, rough terrain are bad hides I'd get scoffed at by numerous folks (which I would never do because I understand there is a niche for these caches for many people that enjoy them).

 

I just don't understand why people can't get off the backs of people placing these types of caches when it's really a rather small segment of the caching population that perceives they can't do them.

 

Again, I am not trying to start anything, and I respect your position to avoid these types of caches, but I am just asking those opposed to think things through from the other perspective. My family has found some places we hadn't even known existed in our own town thanks to a cache in one of these locations.

Edited April 24, 2007 by egami

[+ToGoKo]

As a parent, grandparent and (fairly new) geocacher, here are my thoughts:

 

Law enforcement and suspicious parents aside, I can see two ways of looking at this.

 

1) If the cache hidden well enough that a child, who is using the playground, can't find it. Then it will probably require a good deal of searching by the geocacher, who is looking for it. Not something I would want to do in the middle of a playground (with or without a child in tow!)

 

2) If it is hidden in such a way that the geocacher can, pretty much, walk up and grab it. Then a child WILL find it!!

 

A few more things to consider. In scenario 1, a lot of cachers would probably pass this one by. In scenario 2, a child who finds it is likely going to open the container and scatter all of the neat little toys all over the place, before his or her parents even sees what they are doing. Of course this will take place within the 2.5 seconds that said parent took their eyes of the little angel! LOL. Which brings us to the fact that, no matter how hard they try, a parent can't watch a child EVERY single second (and face it, some don't even try), especially if they have more than one to watch.

 

Maybe you could somehow use the equipment to figure a set of coords to the cache, placed nearby. (Example: how many rungs on the ladder + how many letters in the color of the slide = N_ _*XX.XXX.) That way the cache seeker could gather the clues from a discrete distance. Just an idea!

 

It's your cache, place it how you'd like!

[+Totem Clan]

Yeah i got opinions, but this has strayed off topic of the original question.

 

Only after you took it off topic with your comments about not caring about others.

 

Where on this site is the creed?

I posted a link back on the top of the page. Just click it.

[Clan Riffster]

If muggles were a concern, I would just add the cache to my "To Do" list and come back later, or ignore it, depending on the cache.

An ammo can full of gold bullion? I'll be back!

A film canister? Eh... I've seen the park. No need to return.

[+egami]

Looking at the Creed it would seem to me to be the responsibility of the cacher as well as the cache owner to use their judgment on "causing alarm".

 

Where wrlwnd believes he would cause alarm and avoids these type of caches it is conversely convenient and completely easy for myself to find these when I am taking my children caching.

[+Totem Clan]

 

2) If it is hidden in such a way that the geocacher can, pretty much, walk up and grab it. Then a child WILL find it!!

Thank you. That was my whole point, before the OP "took the thread off topic", as he would say.

 

Place the cache, but it will be ingored by many cachers, AND IT WILL GET MUGGLED. Save yourself the trouble. Place it somewhere other than ON the equipment. Use ToGoKo's idea.

 

And BTW I see nothing wrong with park caches in and of themselves. I have one myself. I also like doing them, with or without my kids.

[Dinoprophet]

So far two people have said that they have not been approached by police and basically its just us. Well, sorry, but both of you have less than 300 finds. If you had 3,000 then i would wonder.

Hey, what are these words doing in my mouth? Pthh! ptth!

 

I did not say "it's just you". I said it's not typical. Of course it happens, but it is not the norm. I'm confident that most people here, whether they've found 70 or 3000, will agree.

[+Kit Fox]

To play devil's advocate...it's interesting to me that this logic will get brought up to oppose a cache location yet there is a large constituancy of cachers that this location is not an issue for like myself with kids.

 

However, if I were to use the logic that since I cache with kids harder locations in remote, rough terrain are bad hides I'd get scoffed at by numerous folks (which I would never do because I understand there is a niche for these caches for many people that enjoy them).

 

I just don't understand why people can't get off the backs of people placing these types of caches when it's really a rather small segment of the caching population that perceives they can't do them.

 

Again, I am not trying to start anything, and I respect your position to avoid these types of caches, but I am just asking those opposed to think things through from the other perspective. My family has found some places we hadn't even known existed in our own town thanks to a cache in one of these locations.

 

I don't recall anyone telling the OP not to place the cache on the playground equipment. Most of us came up with reason why we think its a bad idea. Those of us who chimed in have plenty of experience geocaching with hundreds to thousands of finds, as well as lots of hides between us.

 

Perhaps the OP (if she chose to hide the cache in the equipment) could write a huge warning on her cache page, written in red, that warns prospective cachers that the cache is in a high visibility spot, hidden amongst playground equipement.

 

Example:

 

Warning this cache is placed in a park's playground heavily frequented by young children, and their protective parents. If you don't like encounters with suspicious parents, dislike being viewed as a potential "child molester," and or hate encounters with Law Enforcement, Skip this cache.

 

As a parent, grandparent and (fairly new) geocacher, here are my thoughts:

 

Law enforcement and suspicious parents aside, I can see two ways of looking at this.

 

1) If the cache hidden well enough that a child, who is using the playground, can't find it. Then it will probably require a good deal of searching by the geocacher, who is looking for it. Not something I would want to do in the middle of a playground (with or without a child in tow!)

 

2) If it is hidden in such a way that the geocacher can, pretty much, walk up and grab it. Then a child WILL find it!!

 

A few more things to consider. In scenario 1, a lot of cachers would probably pass this one by. In scenario 2, a child who finds it is likely going to open the container and scatter all of the neat little toys all over the place, before his or her parents even sees what they are doing. Of course this will take place within the 2.5 seconds that said parent took their eyes of the little angel! LOL. Which brings us to the fact that, no matter how hard they try, a parent can't watch a child EVERY single second (and face it, some don't even try), especially if they have more than one to watch.

 

Maybe you could somehow use the equipment to figure a set of coords to the cache, placed nearby. (Example: how many rungs on the ladder + how many letters in the color of the slide = N_ _*XX.XXX.) That way the cache seeker could gather the clues from a discrete distance. Just an idea!

 

It's your cache, place it how you'd like!

 

Regarding number 1, this is why I brought up the dingbat who placed razorblades amongst the playground equipment.

 

Regarding number 2, this is what we all tried to tell the OP.

 

Looking at the Creed it would seem to me to be the responsibility of the cacher as well as the cache owner to use their judgment on "causing alarm".

 

Where wrlwnd believes he would cause alarm and avoids these type of caches it is conversely convenient and completely easy for myself to find these when I am taking my children caching.

 

And this is exactly why most of us would skip the cache, unless we had children in tow.

Edited April 24, 2007 by Kit Fox

[+egami]

I don't recall anyone telling the OP not to place the cache on the playground equipment. Most of us came up with reason why we think its a bad idea. Those of us who chimed in have plenty of experience geocaching with hundreds to thousands of finds, as well as lots of hides between us.

 

And that invalidates my point how exactly?

 

You can say no one is telling OP that directly, but indirectly they heavily insinuating it...

 

Nope. Bad idea. - Harry Dolphin

 

I wouldn't place or look for a cache in such a spot. There are some places that might not be addressed in the

guidelines that are still bad ideas.- briansnat

 

Playground equipment makes for bad cache placement because of the extreme high muggle factor. -Star Brand

 

And if it's that bad, why would you even consider placing a cache that would bring trouble like that on other cachers? -Totem Clan

Edited April 24, 2007 by egami

[+PJPeters]

Granted, I don't have a bunch of hunts under my belt, but the only time I've been involved with the police is when I was driving (too many times!), or work-related; I've never had the police called on me (knock on wood). I prefer to be un-noticed by everybody, police and all. That's not to say I don't have a pretty cordial relationship with the police. Chances are, if I got stopped by the police while caching in certain areas of town, it would be pretty quick and painless. They'd see me, take a second to make sure I wasn't doing anything too weird, then probably let me be. I'd just prefer not to have it happen.

Please remember, we now live in a paranoid/schizophrenic/lunatic world. What was considered normal behavior five or six and more years ago is now considered completely unacceptable. Apparently, this country is over-run with "bad people" now. In general, a guy by himself is watched more closely, especially by paranoid parents. They may be watching their kids, but what about all those kids who aren't with an adult, that doesn't have someone to keep an eye on them. And let's face it, (my experience shows) many of the people that cache are guys. I know there are families out there, and some women, but the majority of cachers I run into are 1) lone men, or 2) small groups of men.

 

It seems that you've made up your mind already, and decided what you're going to do. You asked our opinion why?

Edited April 24, 2007 by PJPeters

[+ArtieD]

Looking at the Creed it would seem to me to be the responsibility of the cacher as well as the cache owner to use their judgment on "causing alarm".

 

Hmmm...it seems like common sense to me to not place caches where the cache or the people looking for it will cause undue alarm or distress.

 

Well, it appears that common sense isn't too common with some people.

[+egami]

Hmmm...it seems like common sense to me to not place caches where the cache or the people looking for it will cause undue alarm or distress.

 

Well, it appears that common sense isn't too common with some people.

 

It's not a matter of common sense. It's a matter of subjectivity. For every cache you can show me in a park that could cause potential undue alarm or distress I could show you one somewhere else that would.

 

For example, I know for a fact our local state park that has numerous caches hidden in rather remote areas generate more 'suspicion' calls than the caches in a city parks in our area (my friend works for the DNR out at the state park and my neighbor a few doors down being the Chief of Police).

 

Again, it's perception...I am not saying there aren't valid points being raised to caution the individual for placing the cache. I just by and large people tend to over-react to these types of caches when it's really not that big of an issue.

Edited April 24, 2007 by egami

[+Renegade Knight]

A cache in the middle of the playground will be stolen.

 

First because kids are just that good at poking into everthing.

Second because some finders will not bother to worry about muggles and will seek the cache anyway and alert any muggles (especially the short ones) about the cache. Then it will be found by a muggle and muggled.

[+AStargirl]

People of any age have a right to be in a park. I am very sorry that you have had trouble in the past.

 

We cache with/for the kids. We enjoy all the different parks that we visit.

 

I would not shy away from a park if i didnt have a kid. Its a public place and anyone should have the right to be there.

 

It is a messed up world though. Every time i lose my puppy i drive around looking for him. I usually ask kids i see to help me find my puppy and the police always show up. What did i do wrong?

 

Asking kids to "help" you find a lost animal is a known ploy of kidnappers/child molesters, so that's why someone would be reported to the police for that. I know it would have worked on me as a kid because I love animals and wouldn't have had a second thought about helping a grown up find a lost pet.

[+egami]

A cache in the middle of the playground will be stolen.

 

First because kids are just that good at poking into everthing.

Second because some finders will not bother to worry about muggles and will seek the cache anyway and alert any muggles (especially the short ones) about the cache. Then it will be found by a muggle and muggled.

 

This is probably the more likely issue with these types of caches.

 

However, there is on one in the next town over from where I live that has yet to be muggled in it's few years of existance and it's a high traffic park in the summer time. While I think this is a concern I also think that these can exist relatively undisturbed if placed properly.

[+Team GeoBlast]

And if it's that bad, why would you even consider placing a cache that would bring trouble like that on other cachers?

 

What are you talking about? How would the cache bring trouble? Im not suggesting anyone do it when the park is full!

 

You actually do not have any control over what happens once you publish your cache. You don't have any control of the amount of common sense the seekers have either. I think it is a good idea to consider this in your cache placements and attempt to place them with the lowest common denominator in mind. It indisputable that if this cache lasts, it is going eventually elevate suspicions right? Why do it when you know this going in? There's got to be another place..

[+Kit Fox]

Hmmm...it seems like common sense to me to not place caches where the cache or the people looking for it will cause undue alarm or distress.

 

Well, it appears that common sense isn't too common with some people.

 

It's not a matter of common sense. It's a matter of subjectivity. For every cache you can show me in a park that could cause potential undue alarm or distress I could show you one somewhere else that would.

 

For example, I know for a fact our local state park that has numerous caches hidden in rather remote areas generate more 'suspicion' calls than the caches in a city parks in our area (my friend works for the DNR out at the state park and my neighbor a few doors down being the Chief of Police).

 

Again, it's perception...I am not saying there aren't valid points being raised to caution the individual for placing the cache. I just by and large people tend to over-react to these types of caches when it's really not that big of an issue.

 

You seem to have an argument for every topic on the forums, but most appear to me, that your in it for the debate, not to help the OP with the topic at hand. What have you offered the OP in the way of suggestions, other than arguing with the other posters? I notice that you love to argue for the sake of arguments sake, but where do you derive all your geocaching knowledge, with 11 finds? (Serious Question)

 

 

I think most of us have tried are best to explain our reasoning against this type of hide, or why we wouldn't hide or find a cache as described.

[+egami]

I think most of us have tried are best to explain our reasoning against this type of hide, or why we wouldn't hide or find a cache as described.

 

Good, and I explained why this type of hide may not necessarily be a "bad" hide. So, you are disagreeing with me why? Am I not allowed my personal explanation then? I see.

 

Oh, because I have 20 finds (yes, I still haven't logged some from this weekend) and you think I am an easy target for you based on number of finds? Baseless attacks much?

 

This is a somewhat subjective issue. Where I live in Iowa, in the midwest (more relative to Ohio than the SW), these types of issues of raising "suspicion" aren't that big of a deal because of the culture...none of the hides in local parks here has raised a call to police yet the DNR have had a couple calls per summer when geocachers were out in the forest looking for a cache near the trail.

 

My point is that these aren't necessarily inherently "bad" hides. While I've only been caching a year I am also more qualified to speak for caches in my area that I've followed over the past year and know the cache owners. What doesn't work in your world may not be an issue in others...I am not saying you aren't qualified to give advice...I am simply asking people (as I stated previously) to consider that some of these perceived issues may not apply across the board as insinuated.

 

I think you'll find I didn't attack anyones "reasons" against not hiding it there (in fact, supported the idea that it is likely to get muggled if not placed well)...I simply challenged the concept that this is inherently a "bad" placement by default.

Edited April 24, 2007 by egami

[+ToGoKo]

A cache in the middle of the playground will be stolen.

 

First because kids are just that good at poking into everthing.

Second because some finders will not bother to worry about muggles and will seek the cache anyway and alert any muggles (especially the short ones) about the cache. Then it will be found by a muggle and muggled.

 

I knew I had another point to make, in my last post, I just couldn't remember what it was!! LOL Thanks RK for reminding me!

 

What Renegade Knight said... The "second" part!

 

I will also add that although there will likely be a lot of cachers who would pass it by, there would be a few who go for it BECAUSE of where it is, like egami, who likes this type. You just can't please everyone, every time!!!

 

If you do decide to place this cache, please think really carefully about the type of container!!! See this recent thread, if you haven't already looked at it.

[+Kit Fox]

 

Good, and I explained why this type of hide may not necessarily be a "bad" hide. So, you are disagreeing with me why? Am I not allowed my personal explanation then? I see.

 

Oh, because I have 20 finds (yes, I still haven't logged some from this weekend) and you think I am an easy target for you based on number of finds? Baseless attacks much?

 

That isn't what I said. I never considered you a target of anything. I made an observation about your posts. I never attacked you, I asked you an honest question. I never once said your opinion was invalid, not once. I appologize in advance if I offended you.

 

This is a somewhat subjective issue. Where I live in Iowa, in the midwest, these types of issues of raising "suspicion" aren't that big of a deal...none of the hides in local parks has raised a call to police yet the DNR have had a couple calls per summer when geocachers were out in the forest looking for a cache near the trail.

 

IOWA has the kind of small town atmosphere, that I would love to live in and enjoy. Try living in a "fast place" like Southern California, and your perception about suspicion, and trust would change. Sadly, a good portion of us live in areas that have far higher crime rates than Rural Iowa. This naturally increases your guard, and helps determine our perception on issues. You've never seen a "helicopter parent" at a park before, they are something else.

 

I'll trade you locations.

Edited April 24, 2007 by Kit Fox

[+martinell]

A cache in the middle of the playground will be stolen.

 

First because kids are just that good at poking into everthing.

Second because some finders will not bother to worry about muggles and will seek the cache anyway and alert any muggles (especially the short ones) about the cache. Then it will be found by a muggle and muggled.

 

I knew I had another point to make, in my last post, I just couldn't remember what it was!! LOL Thanks RK for reminding me!

 

What Renegade Knight said... The "second" part!

 

I will also add that although there will likely be a lot of cachers who would pass it by, there would be a few who go for it BECAUSE of where it is, like egami, who likes this type. You just can't please everyone, every time!!!

 

If you do decide to place this cache, please think really carefully about the type of container!!! See this recent thread, if you haven't already looked at it.

 

Then again it can be kind of fun to see what the short muggles do with the cache. My first hide (now archived) was poorly hidden in a camping area and found by a several kids on several different occasions. Many of them traded and signed the log even though they didn't really know what it was all about. Once the cache went missing for a few days and was returned by the parents. That log book is really interesting to look at. Because it was in a kid area and it was my first hide I used a clear container so that anybody could see what the contents were....

[+egami]

 

Good, and I explained why this type of hide may not necessarily be a "bad" hide. So, you are disagreeing with me why? Am I not allowed my personal explanation then? I see.

 

Oh, because I have 20 finds (yes, I still haven't logged some from this weekend) and you think I am an easy target for you based on number of finds? Baseless attacks much?

 

That isn't what I said. I never considered you a target of anything. I made an observation about your posts. I never attacked you, I asked you an honest question. I never once said your opinion was invalid, not once. I appologize in advance if I offended you.

 

Well then what was the point of asking about my cache count? I don't mind be open-minded in considering why my poisition isn't valid, but not when strictly based on the frequency I've found caches...I am not offended as much as confused as to the point of bringing this up at this juncture of the conversation.

 

This is a somewhat subjective issue. Where I live in Iowa, in the midwest, these types of issues of raising "suspicion" aren't that big of a deal...none of the hides in local parks has raised a call to police yet the DNR have had a couple calls per summer when geocachers were out in the forest looking for a cache near the trail.

 

IOWA has the kind of small town atmosphere, that I would love to live in and enjoy. Try living in a "fast place" like Southern California, and your perception about suspicion, and trust would change. Sadly, a good portion of us live in areas that have far higher crime rates than Rural Iowa. This naturally increases your guard, and helps determine our perception on issues. You've never seen a "helicopter parent" at a park before, they are something else.

 

I'll trade you locations.

 

Well, I graduated high school in Seattle, Washington (Everett, actually)...so I can relate to the concern on that level. Many of my friends parents were these overbearing, helicopter parents you speak of...and certainly, in that area, probably more rightly so than rural Iowa. And frankly, Ohio has some much heavier populated areas that Des Moines which is our largest city and I don't know exactly where this individual in looking placing the cache...

 

Like I stated before in responding to the Santa looking guy (I forget his handle atm)...I just don't think it's fair when I repeatedly hear that these are inherently "bad" placements because a lot of it is really dependent on the area.

 

That's really my main gripe...that, and the fact that even more generally urban areas, I think it's reasonable for cachers like myself, that are extremely casual in the game, and like to cache with their kids (Team Signal, in my case), to find these with no problems.

 

I am just really asking people to consider that there is "market" so to speak for these types of caches because, as I've demonstrated, even the more traditional, wooded area cache placements can raise a degree of suspicion.

Edited April 24, 2007 by egami

[+baloo&bd]

This has seemed to take a few turns.

 

We have somewhere around 900 or 1K caches and have yet to be approached by a LEO and we have done some areas and or times where I was sure we would.

 

The OP is right in that other peoples paranoia should not necessarily dictate ones actions. The park, and it's equipment, are as fair of use as anywhere else we hide. I would also like to point out that someone stated from the creed that they thought "endangering others" applied here. That was a real stretch. Suspicion is also in the eye of the beholder.

 

Having said that, Knight2000, look at it from another perspective;

 

1. These caches do tend to get muggled more than others. I am sure, especially for your first hide, you do not want to have to be out there every couple weeks or more fixing it. Many also like their first cache to last and want at least to save the first full log as a souvenir, which if it gets muggled, won't happen (experience talking).

 

2. The purpose of a cache is to be found and while there are many that will look for your cache, the threads indicate that there are at least as many, if not more, who will simply add it to their ignore list and not hunt it.

 

3. While there have been some good reasons listed here, look to your area as to what is acceptable and what is not. You may find that if others in your area feel like many do here they will take a dim view of your hides and place ALL your hides on their "I'm ignoring" list no matter how great they might be.

 

If it meets the guidelines and gets approved, its a valid hide so ultimately it is up to you. It is also up to others to decide where there area of comfort in when searching.

Edited April 24, 2007 by baloo&bd

[+Totem Clan]

 

Like I stated before in responding to the Santa looking guy (I forget his handle atm)...I just don't think it's fair when I repeatedly hear that these are inherently "bad" placements because a lot of it is really dependent on the area.

 

Before you jump on me and start arguing with me, let me repeat what I said before about these caches. I don't care one way or the other. I have hunted them before and will hunt them again. Now that you know that I agree with you on that point, let me say this.

 

Most if not everyone that posted to this thread was trying to explain to the OP why they would not place or in some cases hunt a cache ON playground equipment. Yes many people, some very vocally, have said they don't like this type of cache. That's their feelings on this. As surely as you should allowed to voice your feelings toward this type, should be able to as well. They were merely trying to point out that they would not hide it, and that they felt it was bad for them.

It's not fair to repress their opinion. Nor would it be fair to repress yours.

 

As far as wrlwnd "Santa looking guy" I've cached with him before and he would never try to tell you where you could or couldn't cache. He might not want to cache where you do, but he wouldn't stop you.

 

The OP asked for people's thoughts, and they were given. Don't mistake that for an attack on your point of veiw.

Edited April 24, 2007 by Totem Clan

[+Knight2000]

We have not decided whether to place this cache or not. We have discussed it. Among ourselves, with this group, with LE. We have another person to contact to get permission. We are still thinking it over.

 

While i agree that most caches of this type have a very high muggle factor- the fact is that some are done well enough to not be muggled. I'm not claiming that this is one of them. We were willing to take a chance of losing the cache so others could have some fun. (This location would not require a more expensive cache container.)

 

Yes this cache wouldn't be for everyone. But i am sure that some would look for it.

 

As i have said before- we love going to parks as we do this for the kids. We like the many parks that the cachers in our area have placed in parks. Our kids ask to go to caches in parks.

 

While this location isn't a beautiful waterfall in Hawaii, it is a nice, pretty location to have a cache at.

 

We were not considering placing this cache to just place a cache. I think if a cache is placed it requires in most cases thought and planning. We really enjoyed the one we found on another playground. It would be nice to duplicate that factor for others.

 

I was being facetious when i mentioned asking kids to help me find my lost dog.

 

While the creed you mention is nice, i don't see what it has to do with geocaching.com. I'm not saying i agree/disagree with it. Its not like i agreed to that when i became a member of gc.com so i'm not sure why it is even being brought up. We would abide by the guidelines on the gc.com web site for placing caches though.

 

Thanks to all for the feedback.

 

We are not sure what we are going to do in regards to this particular cache. We do have other caches planned that are not on playground equipment.

 

I don't see anything positive coming from this anymore, so why not just close this thread?

[+Kit Fox]

We have not decided whether to place this cache or not. We have discussed it. Among ourselves, with this group, with LE. We have another person to contact to get permission. We are still thinking it over.

 

While i agree that most caches of this type have a very high muggle factor- the fact is that some are done well enough to not be muggled. I'm not claiming that this is one of them. We were willing to take a chance of losing the cache so others could have some fun. (This location would not require a more expensive cache container.)Yes this cache wouldn't be for everyone. But i am sure that some would look for it.

 

As i have said before- we love going to parks as we do this for the kids. We like the many parks that the cachers in our area have placed in parks. Our kids ask to go to caches in parks.

 

While this location isn't a beautiful waterfall in Hawaii, it is a nice, pretty location to have a cache at.

 

We were not considering placing this cache to just place a cache. I think if a cache is placed it requires in most cases thought and planning. We really enjoyed the one we found on another playground. It would be nice to duplicate that factor for others.

 

I was being facetious when i mentioned asking kids to help me find my lost dog.

 

While the creed you mention is nice, i don't see what it has to do with geocaching.com. I'm not saying i agree/disagree with it. Its not like i agreed to that when i became a member of gc.com so i'm not sure why it is even being brought up. We would abide by the guidelines on the gc.com web site for placing caches though.

 

Thanks to all for the feedback.

 

We are not sure what we are going to do in regards to this particular cache. We do have other caches planned that are not on playground equipment.

 

I don't see anything positive coming from this anymore, so why not just close this thread?

 

My last comment on this topic.

 

How would it make you feel if a Travel Bug, or Geocoin belonging to another disappears with your "expendable cache?" Caches get muggled all the time, and they often disappear with geocoins and travel bugs. Are you comfortable with the thought of this happening, especially knowing the risk you are taking, by placing a cache in a playground?

[+egami]

 

Like I stated before in responding to the Santa looking guy (I forget his handle atm)...I just don't think it's fair when I repeatedly hear that these are inherently "bad" placements because a lot of it is really dependent on the area.

 

Before you jump on me and start arguing with me, let me repeat what I said before about these caches. I don't care one way or the other. I have hunted them before and will hunt them again. Now that you know that I agree with you on that point, let me say this.

 

I didn't jump on you...I asked you consider a different point of view.

[+egami]

My last comment on this topic.

 

How would it make you feel if a Travel Bug, or Geocoin belonging to another disappears with your "expendable cache?" Caches get muggled all the time, and they often disappear with geocoins and travel bugs. Are you comfortable with the thought of this happening, especially knowing the risk you are taking, by placing a cache in a playground?

 

This, to me, is the most legitimate issue of concern. If you are looking at a cache in this venue that is likely to be discovered it might be best to consider a micro with a simple log unless you have very secure place that isn't likely to get muggled.

Edited April 24, 2007 by egami

[+Totem Clan]

 

While i agree that most caches of this type have a very high muggle factor- the fact is that some are done well enough to not be muggled. I'm not claiming that this is one of them. We were willing to take a chance of losing the cache so others could have some fun. (This location would not require a more expensive cache container.)

 

 

While the creed you mention is nice, i don't see what it has to do with geocaching.com. I'm not saying i agree/disagree with it. Its not like i agreed to that when i became a member of gc.com so i'm not sure why it is even being brought up. We would abide by the guidelines on the gc.com web site for placing caches though.

 

 

While you might not agree with the creed, you MUST agree the geocaching.com guidelines.

 

When you report a cache on the Geocaching.com web site, geocachers should (and will) expect the cache to be there for a realistic and extended period of time. Therefore, caches that have the goal to move (“traveling caches”), or temporary caches (caches hidden for less than 3 months or for events) most likely will not be published. If you wish to hide caches for an event, bring printouts to the event and hand them out there.

 

We realize that it is possible that a planned long-term cache occasionally becomes finite because of concerns with the environment, missing or plundered caches, or the owner’s decision to remove the cache for other valid reasons. Please do your best to research fully, hide wisely, and maintain properly for a long cache life.

 

 

You just stated that you would violate that.

[+Totem Clan]

 

Like I stated before in responding to the Santa looking guy (I forget his handle atm)...I just don't think it's fair when I repeatedly hear that these are inherently "bad" placements because a lot of it is really dependent on the area.

 

Before you jump on me and start arguing with me, let me repeat what I said before about these caches. I don't care one way or the other. I have hunted them before and will hunt them again. Now that you know that I agree with you on that point, let me say this.

 

I didn't jump on you...I asked you consider a different point of view.

 

So you want me to dislike park caches? I agreed with you on them.

[+egami]

So you want me to dislike park caches? I agreed with you on them.

 

I confused your handle from another thread...I thought maybe I had quoted you earlier hence the "before you jump on me" comment...looking back, I have no idea why you stated that to begin with.

 

I haven't "jumped" on anyone...rather, I've simply asked for those that are generally against these placements to consider the view I've stated.

Edited April 24, 2007 by egami

[+Totem Clan]

So you want me to dislike park caches? I agreed with you on them.

 

I confused your handle from another thread...I thought maybe I had quoted you earlier hence the "before you jump on me" comment...looking back, I have no idea why you stated that to begin with.

 

I haven't "jumped" on anyone...rather, I've simply asked for those that are generally against these placements to consider the view I've stated.

Because it appeared that you were arguing with anyone that disagreed with you, and that you felt their opinions need not be voiced. I just want you to know where I stood before I said what I had to say and before you, or anyone else for that matter, assumed that I was opposed to them.

 

Edit: cuz I cant spel

Edited April 24, 2007 by Totem Clan

[+egami]

Because it appeared that you were arguing with anyone that disagreed with you, and that you felt their opinions need not be voiced. I just want you to know where I stood before I said what I had to say and before you, or anyone else for that matter, assumed that I was opposed to them.

 

Edit: cuz I cant spel

 

Now there is fair accusation...I said peoples opinion need not be voiced? Please...

 

If you want to have an open-minded discussion I will gladly discuss, but I am not going to sit back and be told my perception is void because I don't have enough cache finds or whatever non-related excuse may crop up.