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No cacher is an island unto themselves, or are they?


Totem Clan
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Many of the debates here end up, after a while, with one side saying, "You play your way. I'll play mine". Another often used line is, "What does it matter. It doesn't effect you anyway".

 

Do you think those statements are always true? Do the actions of other cachers help or hinder your caching? Don't just say yes or no. Tell why you feel that way. Give some examples of why it is or isn't that way.

 

I'm not talking about cache hiders but about the cache seekers and loggers.

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Many of the debates here end up, after a while, with one side saying, "You play your way. I'll play mine". Another often used line is, "What does it matter. It doesn't effect you anyway".

 

Do you think those statements are always true? Do the actions of other cachers help or hinder your caching? Don't just say yes or no. Tell why you feel that way. Give some examples of why it is or isn't that way.

 

Of course what others do affects you. Example - one person plants a cache that gets the bomb squad called out. Everybody in caching is negatively affected, guilt by association.

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Many of the debates here end up, after a while, with one side saying, "You play your way. I'll play mine". Another often used line is, "What does it matter. It doesn't effect you anyway".

 

Do you think those statements are always true? Do the actions of other cachers help or hinder your caching? Don't just say yes or no. Tell why you feel that way. Give some examples of why it is or isn't that way.

 

Of course what others do affects you. Example - one person plants a cache that gets the bomb squad called out. Everybody in caching is negatively affected, guilt by association.

Excellent point.

 

Any form of a hide that brings unwanted attention to geocaching definitely hurt us all, but what I have in mind is the actions or in-actions of the cache seekers not the cache hiders.

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The vast majority of geocachers are unknown to us. We don't know them. For the most part, that won't change.

 

We therefore do not know what they do. They don't know what we do.

 

Of those we do know, we know we all have different ways, no two of us cache exactly alike.

 

Yes, cachers are indeed islands, until they bump into each other at events or online.

 

Sometimes they stick together and form big islands, even continents, but for the most part still cache as they always did.

 

Then they discover the forums, where several folks will tell them they've been doing it wrong and spell out how they must play the game from this moment forward.

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The vast majority of geocachers are unknown to us. We don't know them. For the most part, that won't change.

 

We therefore do not know what they do. They don't know what we do.

 

Of those we do know, we know we all have different ways, no two of us cache exactly alike.

 

Yes, cachers are indeed islands, until they bump into each other at events or online.

 

Sometimes they stick together and form big islands, even continents, but for the most part still cache as they always did.

 

Then they discover the forums, where several folks will tell them they've been doing it wrong and spell out how they must play the game from this moment forward.

So are you saying, I can cache anyway I want and it won't effect you?

Edited by Totem Clan
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The way we interact with non-players while caching can affect other cachers:

 

If we misjudge someone and introduce them to the game, we could end up with a pirate in our midst.

 

If we handle conversations with land managers poorly, caches could get archived.

 

If we are rude to one another, all kinds of badness could happen to our logs and caches.

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The vast majority of geocachers are unknown to us. We don't know them. For the most part, that won't change.

 

We therefore do not know what they do. They don't know what we do.

 

Of those we do know, we know we all have different ways, no two of us cache exactly alike.

 

Yes, cachers are indeed islands, until they bump into each other at events or online.

 

Sometimes they stick together and form big islands, even continents, but for the most part still cache as they always did.

 

Then they discover the forums, where several folks will tell them they've been doing it wrong and spell out how they must play the game from this moment forward.

So are you saying, I can cache anyway I want and it won't effect you?

Yes sir, I am.

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The vast majority of geocachers are unknown to us. We don't know them. For the most part, that won't change.

 

We therefore do not know what they do. They don't know what we do.

 

Of those we do know, we know we all have different ways, no two of us cache exactly alike.

 

Yes, cachers are indeed islands, until they bump into each other at events or online.

 

Sometimes they stick together and form big islands, even continents, but for the most part still cache as they always did.

 

Then they discover the forums, where several folks will tell them they've been doing it wrong and spell out how they must play the game from this moment forward.

So are you saying, I can cache anyway I want and it won't effect you?
Yes sir, I am.
Do the suggestions that I gave figure into that argument, at all?
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Well sure, several points have been brought up in other threads, like...

- the quality of the log entries - be careful not to insult the owner -and- long entries are generally better than short ones etc.

- whether or not to log a DNF, and whether to claim a DNF or a find on a missing cache

- whether or not to fix up a damaged cache or replace a missing one

- people taking swag instead of trading, or trading down

 

All these things can affect others' enjoyment (or frustration) of the game. Or not.

Edited by QSparrow
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Interestingly (or not), I prefer to cache alone. I like the time to reflect on things and not really have to be bothered by life's dramas. Roughly 99% of my finds have been by myself or just me and the pup (rest her soul). Still, I believe that my actions affect those that come behind me.

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The vast majority of geocachers are unknown to us. We don't know them. For the most part, that won't change.

 

We therefore do not know what they do. They don't know what we do.

 

Of those we do know, we know we all have different ways, no two of us cache exactly alike.

 

Yes, cachers are indeed islands, until they bump into each other at events or online.

 

Sometimes they stick together and form big islands, even continents, but for the most part still cache as they always did.

 

Then they discover the forums, where several folks will tell them they've been doing it wrong and spell out how they must play the game from this moment forward.

So are you saying, I can cache anyway I want and it won't effect you?
Yes sir, I am.
Do the suggestions that I gave figure into that argument, at all?

Not at all. There have been caches blown up, stolen, vandalized, prohibited from certain lands and properties, folks have gotten awards for good caches and ridicule for bad, folks have crapped in caches and folks have gotten married at caches.

 

None, not a bit of it, has had one bit of effect on me or how I play the game.

Edited by TheAlabamaRambler
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Do the actions of other cachers help or hinder your caching?

Of course they do.

 

At its very base, caching is a social activity. If it weren't, there would be no point to signing the log or logging finds online. Both of those actions are both profoundly interactive and very public. That's why the claims that "everyone can play the game their own way" ring so hollow to me.

 

If all that mattered was finding boxes in the woods and keeping a record of that for yourself, then the only function of the website would be as a database of caches. Yet geocaching is far, far more. Caching logs are not merely a record of what you've done; they form a narrative you are sharing with the entire community.

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Like all questions posed today, the answer to this one is pocket queries.

 

If several cachers DNF a cache, it will show in my GSAK database. I may decide not to go after that cache while traveling because of the percieved issue. The cache may still be in place and I might miss out on the bestest cache ever.

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The way we play the game can absolutely affect others. I think the most egregious example was the cache pirates, who stole caches and re-hid them and claimed it was just another fun twist on the game. There were actually people who supported them here, but I think in general they were pretty widely condemned. As someone who had a few caches stolen and re-hidden, I didn't appreciate their version of the game.

 

Additionally, there were the examples in the other thread of people who were negatively affected by the practice of logging finds when there is no cache to be found. I know the practice caused me to waste some time and gas and Cybret documented his negative experience resulting from a phony find. I also recall l a geocacher (Lep I think) who was lured into a fruitless 100 mile round trip thanks to a phony find.

 

Another practice that affects others is that of not logging DNFs. There are a lot of people who don't do it, or will only do it if they are certain the cache is missing, or if they don't plan on comming back, or (fill in excuse here). If the cache is indeed missing, by not logging DNFs it will take longer for the owner to determine that the cache needs to be checked on. Meanwhile someone else might waste his time looking for the cache.

 

Another one is not logging anything at all, find or no find. If enough people are doing that, some owners might decided to archive what they think is an unpopular cache.

 

Then there are annoying little acts like not rehiding the cache properly, or rehiding it better than it was hidden, or moving it to a "better" spot. All things that affect others.

 

There is very little in geocaching that is done in a vacuum.

Edited by briansnat
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So, you'll change for TAR if your actions are negatively affecting him?? How far and how many times do you change for people before you come to the realization that you can't please everyone??

 

Quick edit to add...the reason for the question is this...how can you change to please everyone??? It's impossible, you'll end up driving yourself crazy! We all play the game our own way, I wouldn't change to please you (unless I was actually doing something against the rules of course). I may rethink my actions, but I can't shape my caching experience to please others.

 

Not trying to cause problems, I just saw this thread and was wondering after I saw the question.

Edited by Rockin Roddy
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Not at all. There have been caches blown up, stolen, vandalized, prohibited from certain lands and properties, folks have gotten awards for good caches and ridicule for bad, folks have crapped in caches and folks have gotten married at caches.

 

None, not a bit of it, has had one bit of effect on me or how I play the game.

Huh.

 

If the cache was stolen right before you looked for it, would it affect your finding it?

 

If the cache was crapped in two hot summer days before you found it, would it affect your enjoyment of that cache? It would affect mine. I would log about just how stinky that cache was.

Edited by sbell111
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I tried to answer sbell, computer glitch...that was the question Totem!!
I think I know what you are asking.

 

I would hope that I considered how my behavior would affect the other person beforehand and altered my actions appropriately.

Edited by sbell111
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The vast majority of geocachers are unknown to us. We don't know them. For the most part, that won't change.

 

We therefore do not know what they do. They don't know what we do.

 

Of those we do know, we know we all have different ways, no two of us cache exactly alike.

 

Yes, cachers are indeed islands, until they bump into each other at events or online.

 

Sometimes they stick together and form big islands, even continents, but for the most part still cache as they always did.

 

Then they discover the forums, where several folks will tell them they've been doing it wrong and spell out how they must play the game from this moment forward.

So are you saying, I can cache anyway I want and it won't effect you?

Yes sir, I am.

Well then, what if said, "I think all these caches are lame and I should remove them a geotrash for the good of the game". And what if I did it.

 

 

If I did that, would it effect you?

 

 

And before you folks go ballistic I would never do anything like that.

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Do the actions of other cachers help or hinder your caching?

Of course they do.

 

At its very base, caching is a social activity. If it weren't, there would be no point to signing the log or logging finds online. Both of those actions are both profoundly interactive and very public. That's why the claims that "everyone can play the game their own way" ring so hollow to me.

 

If all that mattered was finding boxes in the woods and keeping a record of that for yourself, then the only function of the website would be as a database of caches. Yet geocaching is far, far more. Caching logs are not merely a record of what you've done; they form a narrative you are sharing with the entire community.

So you are saying that people who cache alone, sign the log with their name and date, and do not log them online are not geocaching because they are not participating in the social aspects of the game?

 

The social aspects may be part of YOUR game, but they are not necessarily part of THE game.

 

Other than this forum, please show me how any one of you has had any effect on geocaching in central Alabama and my geocaching in particular.

 

Outside of this forum my geocaching is entirely disconnected from yours - we are, therefore, islands in the stream.

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So, you'll change for TAR if your actions are negatively affecting him?? How far and how many times do you change for people before you come to the realization that you can't please everyone??

 

Quick edit to add...the reason for the question is this...how can you change to please everyone??? It's impossible, you'll end up driving yourself crazy! We all play the game our own way, I wouldn't change to please you (unless I was actually doing something against the rules of course). I may rethink my actions, but I can't shape my caching experience to please others.

 

Not trying to cause problems, I just saw this thread and was wondering after I saw the question.

I think it would be helpful to take another look at the post that we are talking about:
The way we interact with non-players while caching can affect other cachers:

 

If we misjudge someone and introduce them to the game, we could end up with a pirate in our midst.

 

If we handle conversations with land managers poorly, caches could get archived.

 

If we are rude to one another, all kinds of badness could happen to our logs and caches.

Since you are talking about player interactions, I assume that you are referring to my last example, 'If we are rude to one another, all kinds of badness could happen to our logs and caches'. You will note that this is merely suggesting that we play nice and be polite. I am not suggesting that we change, at all. We should, however, consider the affect that our words, emails, posts, and logs have on others before we make them. There are plenty of examples of poorly chosen words creating a rift that resulted in deleted logs and stolen caches.
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So, you'll change for TAR if your actions are negatively affecting him?? How far and how many times do you change for people before you come to the realization that you can't please everyone??

 

Quick edit to add...the reason for the question is this...how can you change to please everyone??? It's impossible, you'll end up driving yourself crazy! We all play the game our own way, I wouldn't change to please you (unless I was actually doing something against the rules of course). I may rethink my actions, but I can't shape my caching experience to please others.

 

Not trying to cause problems, I just saw this thread and was wondering after I saw the question.

You're right, but I didn't say I would change to please him. I said I would change if as a result of my actions I hindered his caching. Not I would change if it just makes him feel bad. I not talking about feelings here. I'm talking about actions that would take away from his caching time or affect his caches.

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So you are saying that people who cache alone, sign the log with their name and date, and do not log them online are not geocaching because they are not participating in the social aspects of the game?

 

The social aspects may be part of YOUR game, but they are not necessarily part of THE game.

 

Other than this forum, please show me how any one of you has had any effect on geocaching in central Alabama and my geocaching in particular.

 

Outside of this forum my geocaching is entirely disconnected from yours - we are, therefore, islands in the stream.

What he's saying is that if people do that, the cache owner is not getting feedback. This lack of feedback taken as people not liking the cache. The cache owner could end up pulling the cache and not placing more, since people don't visit them anway. This would result in fewer caches for future cachers.

 

One of the things that makes caching better than letterboxing, in my opinion, is the online logs. By not logging online, a person takes away this part of the game. This affects those cachers that really like the social stuff.

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Well then, what if said, "I think all these caches are lame and I should remove them a geotrash for the good of the game". And what if I did it.

 

If I did that, would it effect you?

 

And before you folks go ballistic I would never do anything like that.

Not really. It would be a PITA to replace the caches, but beyond that it would have zero effect on how I play the game.

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So, you'll change for TAR if your actions are negatively affecting him?? How far and how many times do you change for people before you come to the realization that you can't please everyone??

 

Quick edit to add...the reason for the question is this...how can you change to please everyone??? It's impossible, you'll end up driving yourself crazy! We all play the game our own way, I wouldn't change to please you (unless I was actually doing something against the rules of course). I may rethink my actions, but I can't shape my caching experience to please others.

 

Not trying to cause problems, I just saw this thread and was wondering after I saw the question.

You're right, but I didn't say I would change to please him. I said I would change if as a result of my actions I hindered his caching. Not I would change if it just makes him feel bad. I not talking about feelings here. I'm talking about actions that would take away from his caching time or affect his caches.
The funny thing is that TAR is a big boy. I think if we did something bad enough to hurt his feelings that we'd already be banninated.
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Well then, what if said, "I think all these caches are lame and I should remove them a geotrash for the good of the game". And what if I did it.

 

If I did that, would it effect you?

 

And before you folks go ballistic I would never do anything like that.

Not really. It would be a PITA to replace the caches, but beyond that it would have zero effect on how I play the game.
You are a stubborn guy. I respect that.
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Do the actions of other cachers help or hinder your caching?

Of course they do.

 

At its very base, caching is a social activity. If it weren't, there would be no point to signing the log or logging finds online. Both of those actions are both profoundly interactive and very public. That's why the claims that "everyone can play the game their own way" ring so hollow to me.

 

If all that mattered was finding boxes in the woods and keeping a record of that for yourself, then the only function of the website would be as a database of caches. Yet geocaching is far, far more. Caching logs are not merely a record of what you've done; they form a narrative you are sharing with the entire community.

So you are saying that people who cache alone, sign the log with their name and date, and do not log them online are not geocaching because they are not participating in the social aspects of the game?

 

The social aspects may be part of YOUR game, but they are not necessarily part of THE game.

 

Other than this forum, please show me how any one of you has had any effect on geocaching in central Alabama and my geocaching in particular.

 

Outside of this forum my geocaching is entirely disconnected from yours - we are, therefore, islands in the stream.

I travel often. I could be in your neck or the woods any time. I fact I have an aunt that lives in Jemison. I was think of come down there in May. Would my negative actions in your area affect you then?

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Well then, what if said, "I think all these caches are lame and I should remove them a geotrash for the good of the game". And what if I did it.

 

If I did that, would it effect you?

 

And before you folks go ballistic I would never do anything like that.

Not really. It would be a PITA to replace the caches, but beyond that it would have zero effect on how I play the game.

The question is not do the actions of others change the way you play the game. The question is, do others actions affect you. You just said that my actions would be a PITA to you, therefore my action can affect you.

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Do other's actions affect my own? I vote yes.

 

I'm still annoyed over a log I stumbled on in which the finder bragged about clearing all the "unnecesary" brush from around a a cache (s)he was looking for. The phrase "...making swiss cheese of the area..." was used to describe what was done.

 

Playing the game that way can only lead to more land managers, owners, etc. forbiding caching in their jurisdictions. And that ultimately affects all of us.

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Like all questions posed today, the answer to this one is pocket queries.

 

If several cachers DNF a cache, it will show in my GSAK database. I may decide not to go after that cache while traveling because of the percieved issue. The cache may still be in place and I might miss out on the bestest cache ever.

 

Sometimes they won't log their DNF (Pride I guess). I have seen 17 people not log anything on one of my caches. And its in plain site.

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Do the actions of other cachers help or hinder your caching?

Of course they do.

 

At its very base, caching is a social activity. If it weren't, there would be no point to signing the log or logging finds online. Both of those actions are both profoundly interactive and very public. That's why the claims that "everyone can play the game their own way" ring so hollow to me.

 

If all that mattered was finding boxes in the woods and keeping a record of that for yourself, then the only function of the website would be as a database of caches. Yet geocaching is far, far more. Caching logs are not merely a record of what you've done; they form a narrative you are sharing with the entire community.

So you are saying that people who cache alone, sign the log with their name and date, and do not log them online are not geocaching because they are not participating in the social aspects of the game?

 

The social aspects may be part of YOUR game, but they are not necessarily part of THE game.

 

Other than this forum, please show me how any one of you has had any effect on geocaching in central Alabama and my geocaching in particular.

 

Outside of this forum my geocaching is entirely disconnected from yours - we are, therefore, islands in the stream.

I travel often. I could be in your neck or the woods any time. I fact I have an aunt that lives in Jemison. I was think of come down there in May. Would my negative actions in your area affect you then?

Firstly, all this silliness aside, come on down! I'd love to cache with you anytime. Mushtang will be down here in a few weeks and I look forward to hooking up with him for a few hours - the same would be true for anyone here.

 

Now, back to the senseless topic - no, you could disrupt and cause folks some issues, but we would deal with them as they arise and I can't see how they'd have any effect on my geocaching practices.

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So, you'll change for TAR if your actions are negatively affecting him?? How far and how many times do you change for people before you come to the realization that you can't please everyone??

 

Quick edit to add...the reason for the question is this...how can you change to please everyone??? It's impossible, you'll end up driving yourself crazy! We all play the game our own way, I wouldn't change to please you (unless I was actually doing something against the rules of course). I may rethink my actions, but I can't shape my caching experience to please others.

 

Not trying to cause problems, I just saw this thread and was wondering after I saw the question.

You're right, but I didn't say I would change to please him. I said I would change if as a result of my actions I hindered his caching. Not I would change if it just makes him feel bad. I not talking about feelings here. I'm talking about actions that would take away from his caching time or affect his caches.
The funny thing is that TAR is a big boy. I think if we did something bad enough to hurt his feelings that we'd already be banninated.

<_<:unsure:

 

No joke.

 

You gotta have thick skin to stick around here. :P:(

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Do the actions of other cachers help or hinder your caching?

Of course they do.

 

At its very base, caching is a social activity. If it weren't, there would be no point to signing the log or logging finds online. Both of those actions are both profoundly interactive and very public. That's why the claims that "everyone can play the game their own way" ring so hollow to me.

 

If all that mattered was finding boxes in the woods and keeping a record of that for yourself, then the only function of the website would be as a database of caches. Yet geocaching is far, far more. Caching logs are not merely a record of what you've done; they form a narrative you are sharing with the entire community.

So you are saying that people who cache alone, sign the log with their name and date, and do not log them online are not geocaching because they are not participating in the social aspects of the game?

 

The social aspects may be part of YOUR game, but they are not necessarily part of THE game.

 

Other than this forum, please show me how any one of you has had any effect on geocaching in central Alabama and my geocaching in particular.

 

Outside of this forum my geocaching is entirely disconnected from yours - we are, therefore, islands in the stream.

I travel often. I could be in your neck or the woods any time. I fact I have an aunt that lives in Jemison. I was think of come down there in May. Would my negative actions in your area affect you then?

Firstly, all this silliness aside, come on down! I'd love to cache with you anytime. Mushtang will be down here in a few weeks and I look forward to hooking up with him for a few hours - the same would be true for anyone here.

 

Now, back to the senseless topic - no, you could disrupt and cause folks some issues, but we would deal with them as they arise and I can't see how they'd have any effect on my geocaching practices.

Off topic. I'm not sure if Big Bear, my wife, is going to get the leave, but I hope so. It will be my aunt's 90th birthday. I really want to be there. If we can, I WILL look you up.

 

On topic. Ok. I can understand that and respect that. In many ways we agree. However if someone was to do something like that, although it wouldn't change the game/sport/whatever at all, but it would cause, for lack of a better word, problems, at least for a while. Therefore the actions of another did cause or have an affect on you. That wouldn't cause you to change your game, and I must respect you for that, but it would cause you do to take action.

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So, you'll change for TAR if your actions are negatively affecting him?? How far and how many times do you change for people before you come to the realization that you can't please everyone??

 

Quick edit to add...the reason for the question is this...how can you change to please everyone??? It's impossible, you'll end up driving yourself crazy! We all play the game our own way, I wouldn't change to please you (unless I was actually doing something against the rules of course). I may rethink my actions, but I can't shape my caching experience to please others.

 

Not trying to cause problems, I just saw this thread and was wondering after I saw the question.

You're right, but I didn't say I would change to please him. I said I would change if as a result of my actions I hindered his caching. Not I would change if it just makes him feel bad. I not talking about feelings here. I'm talking about actions that would take away from his caching time or affect his caches.
The funny thing is that TAR is a big boy. I think if we did something bad enough to hurt his feelings that we'd already be banninated.

<_<:unsure:

 

No joke.

 

You gotta have thick skin to stick around here. :P:(

Indeed. Actually hurt feelings is what brought me here!

 

If you look back I had very few posts before GW4.

 

I made some mistakes, some bad decisions, got myself fired as a Reviewer, and became a pariah in these forums, insulted and called every kind of scoundrel.

 

Trying to explain that I had no ill intent just made it worse. I felt like a wounded fish in a shark tank!

 

I had several Reviewers sending me emails on a regular basis telling me to get out of the forums, had moderators jumping my butt at every opportunity, deserved or otherwise.

 

I could accept the character assassination, tuck my tail and skedaddle - my local forums never had a problem with me, who needed these? Or, I could stand up and bare my teeth, dare anyone to throw me out of here.

 

That's when and why I started posting here.

 

Sure, certain attacks can still hurt my feelings, but mostly I give what I get and move on.

 

Yup, thick skin can be grown!

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Do the actions of other cachers help or hinder your caching?

Good question. It should provide some interesting debate. I think I could articulate an honest answer in either direction.

Does the fact that TheAlabamaRambler occasionally not log his finds affect me?

No. Unless I choose to get worked up about the logging practices of someone many hundreds of miles away.

 

Does the logging practices of local cachers affect me?

No. A cache can disappear at any time. A hundred people could log finds on an active, present cache, and I'd have no guarantee that it will be there when I show up. Any expense suffered or time spent going to a cache I choose to hunt is my responsibility. Blaming "fake" logs for wasted time doesn't make a lot of sense to me. I'm the one who chooses which caches I hunt, and I make those choices based upon several variables, including past logs. If I look at a cache, and I see dozens of DNF's, followed by a single find, I'm going to assume there is a strong likelihood that the cache may not be there. If I choose to hunt it anyway, the fault is mine, not the guy who posted the find.

 

Does the logging practices of local cachers affect me?

(Same question/different answer) Yes. I am fairly meticulous about my own caches. If I see a DNF by an experienced cacher, I'm out the door to check it out, as soon as I can possibly get there. If someone were to log a "fake" find before I was able to respond, I might assume the earlier cacher was just having a bad day, and I'd wait till the next log to determine if a maintenance visit was necessary. Most of my caches are what the locals refer to as lonely, in that they represent a level of difficulty which proves somewhat prohibitive to the average cacher, so they might go months between finds. I would feel guilty if one of my caches was missing for months without my correcting it, even though I had no way of knowing it. This particular guilt is of my own making, and I know I could just shrug it off, but I choose not to.

 

Would a cache pirate stealing my caches affect me?

Yes. I would have to either replace them or archive them, neither of which has much appeal to me.

 

So, to answer your original question; "Yes & No".

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So, you'll change for TAR if your actions are negatively affecting him?? How far and how many times do you change for people before you come to the realization that you can't please everyone??

 

Quick edit to add...the reason for the question is this...how can you change to please everyone??? It's impossible, you'll end up driving yourself crazy! We all play the game our own way, I wouldn't change to please you (unless I was actually doing something against the rules of course). I may rethink my actions, but I can't shape my caching experience to please others.

 

Not trying to cause problems, I just saw this thread and was wondering after I saw the question.

You're right, but I didn't say I would change to please him. I said I would change if as a result of my actions I hindered his caching. Not I would change if it just makes him feel bad. I not talking about feelings here. I'm talking about actions that would take away from his caching time or affect his caches.
The funny thing is that TAR is a big boy. I think if we did something bad enough to hurt his feelings that we'd already be banninated.

:laughing::laughing:

 

No joke.

 

You gotta have thick skin to stick around here. ;)B)

Indeed. Actually hurt feelings is what brought me here!

 

If you look back I had very few posts before GW4.

 

I made some mistakes, some bad decisions, got myself fired as a Reviewer, and became a pariah in these forums, insulted and called every kind of scoundrel.

 

Trying to explain that I had no ill intent just made it worse. I felt like a wounded fish in a shark tank!

 

I had several Reviewers sending me emails on a regular basis telling me to get out of the forums, had moderators jumping my butt at every opportunity, deserved or otherwise.

 

I could accept the character assassination, tuck my tail and skedaddle - my local forums never had a problem with me, who needed these? Or, I could stand up and bare my teeth, dare anyone to throw me out of here.

 

That's when and why I started posting here.

 

Sure, certain attacks can still hurt my feelings, but mostly I give what I get and move on.

 

Yup, thick skin can be grown!

I've seen a lot of "uncalled for" <_< remarks made here before. I don't like it and I've taken up for some of the attacked. We can disagree without fighting. In my life I've seen what bull-headed stubborn people can do when they refuse to compromise or see the other person as a person just like them. Although I don't think any shooting wars will be started in here. ;)

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We've had some good comments so far on both sides of the "hinder" issue, and by all means please continue with the discussions; however what about the "help" side of it? Can the actions of another cacher help you?

Sure. If someone finds my cache and corrects a minor issue, I don't have to do the maintenance run.

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We've had some good comments so far on both sides of the "hinder" issue, and by all means please continue with the discussions; however what about the "help" side of it? Can the actions of another cacher help you?

 

Well when they leave the cache sitting out in the open, that certainly helps me find it. I've also heard of geocachers creating arrows out of sticks or stones pointing to the cache and in a few cases, marking the route with flagging tape.

 

I don't know that any of this is a good thing though.

 

Accurate logs are always helpful. People who truthfully record finds and DNFs provide me as a cache owner, and hunter with important information.

 

As a cache owner DNFs can tell me that I might need to check on my cache. As a finder they can tell me that the cache is not a slam dunk find, or that it may be gone.

 

Found it logs can tell me as a hunter whether or not its a cache that I would be interested in finding. As an owner they tell me that people are enjoying my cache (or not).

Edited by briansnat
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I think that there are two ways of taking the main question in this thread. Do the actions of others change how I act? Certainly, we constantly adjust our actions based on everything that happens around us. In this sense, we are affected by the actions of others. However, I think that these minor things don't change our underlying motivations. In that sense, nothing that any other cacher does can possibly affect me.

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At its very base, caching is a social activity. If it weren't, there would be no point to signing the log or logging finds online. Both of those actions are both profoundly interactive and very public. That's why the claims that "everyone can play the game their own way" ring so hollow to me.

 

If all that mattered was finding boxes in the woods and keeping a record of that for yourself, then the only function of the website would be as a database of caches. Yet geocaching is far, far more. Caching logs are not merely a record of what you've done; they form a narrative you are sharing with the entire community.

 

This is really interesting. I've always thought of caching as an extremely solitary activity, much like hiking. The point of signing the log is because you're not supposed to log it online until you've signed the physical log. The point of logging finds online is basically a reflection of your experience at that cache. I've never seen anything social about it, excpet for bumping into other cachers on rare occasions and the event thingies.

 

If you look for a cache, you're going to have some kind of effect on the person that comes after you for the simple fact that you have to rehide the container and it's going to be at least a little bit different.

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This is really interesting. I've always thought of caching as an extremely solitary activity, much like hiking. The point of signing the log is because you're not supposed to log it online until you've signed the physical log. The point of logging finds online is basically a reflection of your experience at that cache. I've never seen anything social about it, excpet for bumping into other cachers on rare occasions and the event thingies.

 

If you look for a cache, you're going to have some kind of effect on the person that comes after you for the simple fact that you have to rehide the container and it's going to be at least a little bit different.

While I pretty much agree with you, I bolded the social part. Edited by sbell111
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The point of logging finds online is basically a reflection of your experience at that cache. I've never seen anything social about it, excpet for bumping into other cachers on rare occasions and the event thingies.

 

I see the shared experiences as very social, even though you are often sharing your experiences with people you may never meet. I realized the power of this when I do meet other geocachers. I'll get comments like "I loved your log for X cache", or "Your log for Y cache made me laugh", or "I saw your log for Z cache. Where did you park to avoid that swamp?". I learned that people follow the logs of others and form opinions about thier fellow geocachers through the logs.

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Certainly what we do affects others. Some guy in Ohio left a small knife as a trade item in a cache in a park, the Ranger found it, it violated the "no weapons in the park" rule, geocaches are still banned in that park.

 

Someone not too far from here thought it would be fun and self-entertaining to deficate in cache containers. (Obviously just playing the game "his way"). Did that affect the game of both future finders and the owner? Yes.

 

Someone trades down, or simply takes a trade item from a cache without leaving anything. Pretty soof the cache is empty, or full of junk. Does that affect future finders? Certainly.

 

Yet another person fails to re-hide a cache as it was hidden, the owner (me) stops by later and sees the once well-hidden ammo can sitting out in the open on top of a rock. Definitely took some of the challenge out of it for other cachers, didn't it?

 

Someone logs a find on a cache they really didn't find, but thought they know where it "should have been" and it's not there. Next cachers to come through the area don't realize the cache is missing, so they waste an hour looking for it. They walk away with a DNF and a lost hour of time because the first guy was "playing the game his way".

 

Everything we do affects others, whether we (or they) know it or not.

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