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DEAF Geocacher in alaska


deafnut
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...In the class we had a hearing and deaf instructor. We were asked if we knew how was deaf? Only a few could and I was one of them. ...

 

When I was a student at the University of Alaska at Fairbanks I met the only person I've actually known was deaf. Until she tripped going up the stairs and explained that lip reading while I was bounding up the stairs and trying to keep up at the same time was difficult I had no idea at all she was deaf.

 

It's possible I have met other deaf people but unless it's an issue I recon it doesn't come up.

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I still don't trust this character...something just doesn't feel right.

 

None of the deaf people I know have problems writing correctly. Heck, the blind guy I know types better. Guess they must be special.

I'm with Arthur & Trillian.

I have seen a lot of people here in the forums who are not deaf and write atrociously. The two things could be compounded in this case.

Edited by Ambrosia
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Okay... Lemme get this straight... about what you are saying here... You seem to be saying that we should encourge sock puppets and trolls?

;):huh:

 

I would be intersted in knowing how you came to your conclusion that deafhunt was a troll or a sockpuppet? It is very clear to me that he is a young man who is deaf and he has discovered geocaching. Did you see that oleruns has Discovered his lackey geocoin? Perhaps oleruns is a sock puppet as well. :D:D:lol:

 

Here is a link to the YouTube video that caused Rothstafari to give deafhunt a Groundspeak lackey Geocoin. deafhunt actually owns his Groundspeak Lackey Geocoin as well, I am certain he is not aware that owning that Lackey geocoin is very unusual.

 

Deaf Geocaching on Youtube

:P

Thank you for helping clear this up wavectorencourage

 

Some of you should be ashamed.

 

I moved from Anchorage last year. I know oleruns personally. I've done the cache in question. I worked with the deaf community there, namely the ARC. I think some of you need to check your standing in the human race, because you're acting like baboons. Don't attack someone with a disablity becauase you're not comfortable with them. And get your ducks in a row before you acuse anyone of anything like that. :P

I agree. Deafhunt's native language seems to be American Sign Language. Someone who translates their native language into written English would look similar. This is not a sign of lack of intelligence. It's very disheartening to see so many people so quick to judge without the proper knowledge. Instead of making fun of a young man because of his command of the English language, we should welcome him to this wonderful hobby. As a man that has worked with Deaf children for many years, I have an understanding of some of the obstacles and prejudices they face everyday. I can honestly tell you that learning English without the benefit of being able to hear it is an enormous task. Imagine yourself trying to master Chinese in a soundproof room, only being able to look at the teachers lips.

I myself have just learned of geocaching and have yet to try it out. I have been reading up on this exciting sounding treasure hunt to learn the rules before I start. Hopefully I will find more positive experiences as I go along. Hang in there Deafhunt and remember Deaf is viewed as cultural not a disability.

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I have been reading this and a few of you people should be ashamed of your selves. I was stationed in Alaska and took ASL. In the class we had a hearing and deaf instructor. We were asked if we knew how was deaf? Only a few could and I was one of them. Hung out with some deaf people to try to learn more. This young man is deaf and I might have met him a time or too.

I also know of the cache he went after. It took me something like 6 times to figure it out and to find it. I felt so stupid37.jpg that I couldn't find such a cool cache and cool cache. Maybe I will read the hints and some of the photos more correctly. :D Just please quit bashing this deafhunt I can tell with his writing and when he is signing. I wish I could have picked up more than I did. He moves very fast with his signs. Like most deaf people do when especially when they are very excited.

 

I want to welcome deafhunt to caching and when I get back up to Anchorage Alaska I will look you up. Maybe we can go out caching and I want to go to the picnics that is with the ARC I think.

Before any of you all judge someone on how they are physically disabled and in a wheel chair (which I know some people who are), mentally disabled (which I am going to get with the Special Olympics and put out some caches for them to try to find), spiritually, and if they can hear or not or they are blind or not.

But by no means am I an English perfectionist. I'm lucky I can do what I do with writing. English was always my worst subject in school.

So once again deafhunt welcome to Geocaching and YOU are in the coolest places to be caching. Keep up with the events there and if you see Knapping tell him I said hi. :D

I love it!!! Ha Ha

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After careful self-reflection and coming to the realization that I have been a royal horse's hiney...I offer my apologies to deafhunt. Sometimes I get too impassioned and stubborn for my own good in regards to changing my own opinions. My actions were totally uncalled for and I am sorry.

 

It takes a good person to say that. Thank you.

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WOW! I am sure glad that I found geocaching first before my wife or 3 kids did. I couldn't handle any of them being all bent out of shape because of the reception (or lack there of) from some of the posters here. Yep, ALL 3 are deaf! I am not, however, I have been around the deaf community for over 25 years now.

 

deafhunt has my full 100% support and some of the posters here have my prayers. I could tell that he writes in ASL so I was never worried about his socks, underware or other articles that people thought he was (yes, I do know how a "sock" is actually used here!). Oh, by the way, only deaf people have/use the Video Relay Service that he posted so that was another piece of evidence for me.

 

So, as I have said about this hobby and others that I enjoy...LIGHTEN' UP! It's a hobby, have fun!!!

 

deafhunt is more than welcome to contact me for any help or questions.

 

whistlen

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Could someone please educate me why a deaf person who signs in ASL would type like the poster does? I have always assumed that since deaf people could read plain text that they would be able to write it but get the distincet impression that he is writing the signs and the interpretation of such is more abstract. But why type like this when written language would be incomprehensible to regular readers (assuming he knows how to write). I have no experience with deaf people or sign language - just want to understand a bit more and this is a sincere genuine request for information I have no knowledge about.

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I had a friend in college who's parents were both deaf. He had his hearing but spoke ASL fluently and "without an accent." As he explained to me, sign language is more than just "talking with your hands." There are sentence structures and cadence that is completely different than what we think of as American English.

 

Now, imagine immersing yourself in that language and then suddenly trying to remember the rules of sentence structure and composition for the rest of the English speaking world. It's quite a chore.

 

I'm sure others could explain it better, but that's as best as I remember.

 

One thing I always remember about Jon was when his parents would come visit. The first time I met his dad, Jon signed something to him and he started laughing at me and walked away. Later he told me that he had told his father, "Bret doesn't understand sign language at all. Point and laugh at him."

 

heh....what a pal. :rolleyes:

 

Bret

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Could someone please educate me why a deaf person who signs in ASL would type like the poster does? I have always assumed that since deaf people could read plain text that they would be able to write it but get the distincet impression that he is writing the signs and the interpretation of such is more abstract. But why type like this when written language would be incomprehensible to regular readers (assuming he knows how to write). I have no experience with deaf people or sign language - just want to understand a bit more and this is a sincere genuine request for information I have no knowledge about.

I have pretty much no experience with deaf people. I do know that I can read German fairly well -- I like to practice by reading German newspapers online -- but when I try to write it, I have to triple-check all my verb tenses and noun genders and word order, and even then it would look like a mess to a native German speaker/reader. I could get my point across, but it would be very broken German. I imagine it's similar going from ASL to English.

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Well put bret.

 

When I try to sign to my friend, who happens to be deaf if thats ok with some of you, I'm sure I sound like an idiot since ASL is not my primary language and I use it only when he visits. I make up signs when I don't know the right one and, I'm certain I use the wrong ones at times. I would imagine I sound as wrong to him as he does to me when he writes. NEVER once has he made fun of the way I sign and i don't make fun of the way he types.

 

This thread is one of the worst displays af assiness by a few that I have ever read and I hope that at least a few people have managed to open their eyes since they posted.

 

That said, Welcome to geocaching Deafhunt!

 

Chris

Edited by Muddy Chris
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I have always assumed that since deaf people could read plain text that they would be able to write it but get the distincet impression that he is writing the signs and the interpretation of such is more abstract.

I made the same assumption, but if you think of English as a foreign language, which to Deafhunt it probably is, then it would be similar to my ability to read and write French. I know enough French to read something and get the general idea of what is being said, but if I tried to write something in French anyone who was fluent in that language would probably be left thinking "what the heck... ?". I think Deafhunt has educated quite a few of us about some of the challenges he faces. I just hope that a few posts, made out of ignorance rather than malice, haven't scared him away for good.

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Could someone please educate me why a deaf person who signs in ASL would type like the poster does? I have always assumed that since deaf people could read plain text that they would be able to write it but get the distincet impression that he is writing the signs and the interpretation of such is more abstract. But why type like this when written language would be incomprehensible to regular readers (assuming he knows how to write). I have no experience with deaf people or sign language - just want to understand a bit more and this is a sincere genuine request for information I have no knowledge about.

Since I don't know Deafhunt, I can't really address his situation. But here is my experience. My mother is deaf. She became deaf later in life - so English is her native language. She often has problems communicating with deaf people who are native ASL speakers. ASL is its own language with its own grammar and syntax. Deafhunt's post are very consistent with ASL grammar and syntax. Still my mother has many deaf friends who have quite good English skills. Many, like her, were deafened later in life. Even if they became deaf in childhood after acquiring language, they have good command of English. Some people who were born deaf also have very good English skills. They are often deaf children of deaf parent. The explanation here is that they acquired their first language (ASL) as infants because their parents used sign language with them from the start. Apparently, acquiring language skills as an infant is important in being able to acquire a second language later in life. Often deaf children of hearing parents start out at a disadvantage. The parents need to learn sign language at the same time the child is begining to aquire language skills. These children's language development is delayed and sometimes this results in language difficulties later in life. The lack of language skills does not equal a lack of intellegence however. Many of these people are very bright and intelligent.

BTW, PBS is showing a documetary tonight on many of its stations about deafness and Deaf culture. It may be of interest to some people who are following this thread.

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First of all, just like I said earlier, just keep in mind that we see "normal" hearing people in these forums who write almost the same way deafhunt does. If people can have a hard time with the English language without a disability, then perhaps we can start to understand how much harder it can be for people who do have one. Also keep in mind that deafhunt is a teenage boy.

 

Forgive me if my explanations are off in any way, to anyone who possibly understands this better than I.

 

There are two main types of sign language in the U.S. The first one, and main one, is ASL - American Sign Language. The second one is SEE - Sign Exact English.

 

ASL is almost another language. It uses a kind of short hand (pardon the pun), in that a lot of simple words are left out like "the" and "and". Even larger words can be left out as long as it doesn't get confusing. I think the reason is that basically, when you're signing, you want to use as few words as possible because it gets redundant and difficult. Also, the grammar can be different, almost more along the lines of what you'd see in a foreign language like Spanish. Words can be turned around, dropped or added.

 

SEE strives to teach children (hopefully from birth) literal English, just like you or I speak, read and write. Every word has a sign, so people who use SEE can have a much larger vocabulary. Every different way of saying a word has a way to sign it, past present and future tense, etc. etc. (probably poor examples, you're dealing with someone with a poor grasp of grammar herself :rolleyes:) It can be harder to learn, but it can be more functional in a hearing world.

 

Quite a bit of sign language is body language. You can say the same exact word and it can be a negative or a positive, just by your expression or how you move your body. I love watching deaf people sign! It is so beautiful and expressive. But try translating that into a forum.

 

On top of that, no matter what sign language a deaf person uses, it's of course harder to learn a language when you cannot hear from birth, like others have mentioned. If there are any other learning disabilities or issues along the way, everything can be hugely compounded. Each individual is different. Some deaf people have no problems reading and writing. But in our society today, we've seen reading and writing skills start to go downhill very quickly with many children. Yet again, that can be hugely compounded if you are deaf.

 

I have two close, older friends who are married and who are deaf (as well as other deaf friends).

 

One can read and write fairly well. She likes to use large print to read, and says that a lot of deaf people do as well, because it's easier to understand. She has a bible made especially for deaf people. It has large print, and the translation is more plain, with easy to understand words so it is easier for a deaf person to read. If she writes small things, it looks ok. But a couple times she's written long essay type things to me, and when you read it out loud it can be a bit confusing, exactly like reading something from someone who's second language is English.

 

My other close deaf friend has a very difficult time reading, is slow, and so he prefers his wife to read out loud to him. I haven't seen him write, but I don't suppose that it would be much different than deafhunt, just from knowing him. In fact, I see a lot of personality traits the same with my deaf friend and deafhunt! A lot of personality quirks that I've seen people complain about in these threads. Not everyone is the same, we just need to learn to be patient and enjoy getting to know someone who's different than us.

 

After more than two years of spending closer time with my friends and getting to know their language and having long, deeps talks with them, I've become more and more aware of the challenges that deaf people can meet in the world. It astounds me of how unaware all of us can be to this large society within our society. I wish there was more sharing and understanding between us, because we're all the same and living in the same place. I do know, that my life has been greatly enriched by getting to know my deaf friends, some of the most wonderful, open and loving people that I have ever met.

Edited by Ambrosia
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First of all, just like I said earlier, just keep in mind that we see "normal" hearing people in these forums who write almost the same way deafhunt does. If people can have a hard time with the English language without a disability, then perhaps we can start to understand how much harder it can be for people who do have one. Also keep in mind that deafhunt is a teenage boy.

 

Forgive me if my explanations are off in any way, to anyone who possibly understands this better than I.

 

There are two main types of sign language in the U.S. The first one, and main one, is ASL - American Sign Language. The second one is SEE - Sign Exact English.

 

ASL is almost another language. It uses a kind of short hand (pardon the pun), in that a lot of simple words are left out like "the" and "and". Even larger words can be left out as long as it doesn't get confusing. I think the reason is that basically, when you're signing, you want to use as few words as possible because it gets redundant and difficult. Also, the grammar can be different, almost more along the lines of what you'd see in a foreign language like Spanish. Words can be turned around, dropped or added.

 

SEE strives to teach children (hopefully from birth) literal English, just like you or I speak, read and write. Every word has a sign, so people who use SEE can have a much larger vocabulary. Every different way of saying a word has a way to sign it, past present and future tense, etc. etc. (probably poor examples, you're dealing with someone with a poor grasp of grammar herself :rolleyes:) It can be harder to learn, but it can be more functional in a hearing world.

 

Quite a bit of sign language is body language. You can say the same exact word and it can be a negative or a positive, just by your expression or how you move your body. I love watching deaf people sign! It is so beautiful and expressive. But try translating that into a forum.

 

On top of that, no matter what sign language a deaf person uses, it's of course harder to learn a language when you cannot hear from birth, like others have mentioned. If there are any other learning disabilities or issues along the way, everything can be hugely compounded. Each individual is different. Some deaf people have no problems reading and writing. But in our society today, we've seen reading and writing skills start to go downhill very quickly with many children. Yet again, that can be hugely compounded if you are deaf.

 

I have two close, older friends who are married and who are deaf (as well as other deaf friends).

 

One can read and write fairly well. She likes to use large print to read, and says that a lot of deaf people do as well, because it's easier to understand. She has a bible made especially for deaf people. It has large print, and the translation is more plain, with easy to understand words so it is easier for a deaf person to read. If she writes small things, it looks ok. But a couple times she's written long essay type things to me, and when you read it out loud it can be a bit confusing, exactly like reading something from someone who's second language is English.

 

My other close deaf friend has a very difficult time reading, is slow, and so he prefers his wife to read out loud to him. I haven't seen him write, but I don't suppose that it would be much different than deafhunt, just from knowing him. In fact, I see a lot of personality traits the same with my deaf friend and deafhunt! A lot of personality quirks that I've seen people complain about in these threads. Not everyone is the same, we just need to learn to be patient and enjoy getting to know someone who's different than us.

 

After more than two years of spending closer time with my friends and getting to know their language and having long, deeps talks with them, I've become more and more aware of the challenges that deaf people can meet in the world. It astounds me of how unaware all of us can be to this large society within our society. I wish there was more sharing and understanding between us, because we're all the same and living in the same place. I do know, that my life has been greatly enriched by getting to know my deaf friends, some of the most wonderful, open and loving people that I have ever met.

Much of what you say is true, although ASL is a full rich complete language that even the language requirements in many states. It is not considered a "short hand" anymore than the languages in many other countries that do not use many of the English markers. What seems to be "left out" are communicated via subtle body shifts, eye gazes, facial expressions and intensity of the signs. SEE is not a language, rather a code of English on the hands. I hope this helps clear things up a bit. In any case, ASL is a visual language that is difficult to transcribe to written words.

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First of all, just like I said earlier, just keep in mind that we see "normal" hearing people in these forums who write almost the same way deafhunt does. If people can have a hard time with the English language without a disability, then perhaps we can start to understand how much harder it can be for people who do have one. Also keep in mind that deafhunt is a teenage boy.

 

Forgive me if my explanations are off in any way, to anyone who possibly understands this better than I.

 

There are two main types of sign language in the U.S. The first one, and main one, is ASL - American Sign Language. The second one is SEE - Sign Exact English.

 

ASL is almost another language. It uses a kind of short hand (pardon the pun), in that a lot of simple words are left out like "the" and "and". Even larger words can be left out as long as it doesn't get confusing. I think the reason is that basically, when you're signing, you want to use as few words as possible because it gets redundant and difficult. Also, the grammar can be different, almost more along the lines of what you'd see in a foreign language like Spanish. Words can be turned around, dropped or added.

 

SEE strives to teach children (hopefully from birth) literal English, just like you or I speak, read and write. Every word has a sign, so people who use SEE can have a much larger vocabulary. Every different way of saying a word has a way to sign it, past present and future tense, etc. etc. (probably poor examples, you're dealing with someone with a poor grasp of grammar herself :rolleyes:) It can be harder to learn, but it can be more functional in a hearing world.

 

Quite a bit of sign language is body language. You can say the same exact word and it can be a negative or a positive, just by your expression or how you move your body. I love watching deaf people sign! It is so beautiful and expressive. But try translating that into a forum.

 

On top of that, no matter what sign language a deaf person uses, it's of course harder to learn a language when you cannot hear from birth, like others have mentioned. If there are any other learning disabilities or issues along the way, everything can be hugely compounded. Each individual is different. Some deaf people have no problems reading and writing. But in our society today, we've seen reading and writing skills start to go downhill very quickly with many children. Yet again, that can be hugely compounded if you are deaf.

 

I have two close, older friends who are married and who are deaf (as well as other deaf friends).

 

One can read and write fairly well. She likes to use large print to read, and says that a lot of deaf people do as well, because it's easier to understand. She has a bible made especially for deaf people. It has large print, and the translation is more plain, with easy to understand words so it is easier for a deaf person to read. If she writes small things, it looks ok. But a couple times she's written long essay type things to me, and when you read it out loud it can be a bit confusing, exactly like reading something from someone who's second language is English.

 

My other close deaf friend has a very difficult time reading, is slow, and so he prefers his wife to read out loud to him. I haven't seen him write, but I don't suppose that it would be much different than deafhunt, just from knowing him. In fact, I see a lot of personality traits the same with my deaf friend and deafhunt! A lot of personality quirks that I've seen people complain about in these threads. Not everyone is the same, we just need to learn to be patient and enjoy getting to know someone who's different than us.

 

After more than two years of spending closer time with my friends and getting to know their language and having long, deeps talks with them, I've become more and more aware of the challenges that deaf people can meet in the world. It astounds me of how unaware all of us can be to this large society within our society. I wish there was more sharing and understanding between us, because we're all the same and living in the same place. I do know, that my life has been greatly enriched by getting to know my deaf friends, some of the most wonderful, open and loving people that I have ever met.

Much of what you say is true, although ASL is a full rich complete language that even the language requirements in many states. It is not considered a "short hand" anymore than the languages in many other countries that do not use many of the English markers. What seems to be "left out" are communicated via subtle body shifts, eye gazes, facial expressions and intensity of the signs. SEE is not a language, rather a code of English on the hands. I hope this helps clear things up a bit. In any case, ASL is a visual language that is difficult to transcribe to written words.

Yup. I was trying to explain sign language to speaking people, which is very difficult. To a hearing person, ASL seems to be a short hand, because it leaves stuff out, substitutes stuff, changes stuff. It's the best comparison that I could think of. And that's why I mentioned the body language as well!

 

And, not to get into politics here or anything, but I don't see why deaf people need another language, when they are having to live in the same place everyone else does. It makes it hard for them to integrate into an English speaking world unless they are speaking English, too. Case in point, this thread.

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....And, not to get into politics here or anything, but I don't see why deaf people need another language, when they are having to live in the same place everyone else does. It makes it hard for them to integrate into an English speaking world unless they are speaking English, too. Case in point, this thread.

 

I'm not sure it matters. I don't sign SEE any better than I sign ASL. I think they missed a real opportunity when they derived ASL that they didn't do WSL (W for World). It would be a huge boon to have access to the world when others are stuck speaking one of the hundreds of spoken languages. Especially in the digital era.

 

Actually if the entire world spoke one languate that would be a huge boon to the human race. This could be achieved in 2 generations with cooperation.

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....And, not to get into politics here or anything, but I don't see why deaf people need another language, when they are having to live in the same place everyone else does. It makes it hard for them to integrate into an English speaking world unless they are speaking English, too. Case in point, this thread.

 

I'm not sure it matters. I don't sign SEE any better than I sign ASL. I think they missed a real opportunity when they derived ASL that they didn't do WSL (W for World). It would be a huge boon to have access to the world when others are stuck speaking one of the hundreds of spoken languages. Especially in the digital era.

 

Actually if the entire world spoke one languate that would be a huge boon to the human race. This could be achieved in 2 generations with cooperation.

Using SEE isn't so much for you, as it is for them. It would help then with reading skills, etc. which would help to understand concepts and anything else that a good grasp of English could do for anyone living in this country (or the native language of any country they may be living in). And yes, I'm sure having a universal language could solve a lot of problems, but right now none of us is using a universal language. And since we're talking (in general) about people growing up and living in this country, I believe that knowing the English language would helpt them quite a bit. If the deaf communitiy was like another culture and language group that had a rich translation of written text or a bunch of their own written language/arts, then it might not be so bad. It is limiting to their growth and capabilities. And it certainly can make it hard for them to communicate with their world, as yet again this situation shows.

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I'm glad DeafHunt dropped in.

First - It is always a good thing to have a new face (as it were) around here.

Second - I've learnd something about an interesting subject.

 

So, Deafhunt, and all those who have posted all this info, thank you.

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I DID FOUND THE FRIST CACHE I WAS SO HAPPY AND FRIST DEAF GEOCACHER IN ALASKA !!!!! WHOOOOOO YEA BABY :huh::laughing:

 

um...that is great. :laughing: I'm deaf too and live in Michigan..um doubt that I'm the only deaf cacher from Michigan...maybe in my home town yes since I'm almost about the only cacher. However, I don't go around SCREAMING MY HEAD OFF like you. Even after finding a good number of caches. Also not only you ard deaf but also a bad speller.

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I DID FOUND THE FRIST CACHE I WAS SO HAPPY AND FRIST DEAF GEOCACHER IN ALASKA !!!!! WHOOOOOO YEA BABY :huh::laughing:

 

um...that is great. :laughing: I'm deaf too and live in Michigan..um doubt that I'm the only deaf cacher from Michigan...maybe in my home town yes since I'm almost about the only cacher. However, I don't go around SCREAMING MY HEAD OFF like you. Even after finding a good number of caches. Also not only you ard deaf but also a bad speller.

People get excited about different things. Just because you have something in common like being deaf, doesn't make you know everything else about his personality. Let him be excited without trying to burst his bubble.

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First of all, just like I said earlier, just keep in mind that we see "normal" hearing people in these forums who write almost the same way deafhunt does. If people can have a hard time with the English language without a disability, then perhaps we can start to understand how much harder it can be for people who do have one. Also keep in mind that deafhunt is a teenage boy.

 

Forgive me if my explanations are off in any way, to anyone who possibly understands this better than I.

 

There are two main types of sign language in the U.S. The first one, and main one, is ASL - American Sign Language. The second one is SEE - Sign Exact English.

 

ASL is almost another language. It uses a kind of short hand (pardon the pun), in that a lot of simple words are left out like "the" and "and". Even larger words can be left out as long as it doesn't get confusing. I think the reason is that basically, when you're signing, you want to use as few words as possible because it gets redundant and difficult. Also, the grammar can be different, almost more along the lines of what you'd see in a foreign language like Spanish. Words can be turned around, dropped or added.

 

SEE strives to teach children (hopefully from birth) literal English, just like you or I speak, read and write. Every word has a sign, so people who use SEE can have a much larger vocabulary. Every different way of saying a word has a way to sign it, past present and future tense, etc. etc. (probably poor examples, you're dealing with someone with a poor grasp of grammar herself :huh:) It can be harder to learn, but it can be more functional in a hearing world.

 

Quite a bit of sign language is body language. You can say the same exact word and it can be a negative or a positive, just by your expression or how you move your body. I love watching deaf people sign! It is so beautiful and expressive. But try translating that into a forum.

 

On top of that, no matter what sign language a deaf person uses, it's of course harder to learn a language when you cannot hear from birth, like others have mentioned. If there are any other learning disabilities or issues along the way, everything can be hugely compounded. Each individual is different. Some deaf people have no problems reading and writing. But in our society today, we've seen reading and writing skills start to go downhill very quickly with many children. Yet again, that can be hugely compounded if you are deaf.

 

I have two close, older friends who are married and who are deaf (as well as other deaf friends).

 

One can read and write fairly well. She likes to use large print to read, and says that a lot of deaf people do as well, because it's easier to understand. She has a bible made especially for deaf people. It has large print, and the translation is more plain, with easy to understand words so it is easier for a deaf person to read. If she writes small things, it looks ok. But a couple times she's written long essay type things to me, and when you read it out loud it can be a bit confusing, exactly like reading something from someone who's second language is English.

 

My other close deaf friend has a very difficult time reading, is slow, and so he prefers his wife to read out loud to him. I haven't seen him write, but I don't suppose that it would be much different than deafhunt, just from knowing him. In fact, I see a lot of personality traits the same with my deaf friend and deafhunt! A lot of personality quirks that I've seen people complain about in these threads. Not everyone is the same, we just need to learn to be patient and enjoy getting to know someone who's different than us.

 

After more than two years of spending closer time with my friends and getting to know their language and having long, deeps talks with them, I've become more and more aware of the challenges that deaf people can meet in the world. It astounds me of how unaware all of us can be to this large society within our society. I wish there was more sharing and understanding between us, because we're all the same and living in the same place. I do know, that my life has been greatly enriched by getting to know my deaf friends, some of the most wonderful, open and loving people that I have ever met.

Much of what you say is true, although ASL is a full rich complete language that even the language requirements in many states. It is not considered a "short hand" anymore than the languages in many other countries that do not use many of the English markers. What seems to be "left out" are communicated via subtle body shifts, eye gazes, facial expressions and intensity of the signs. SEE is not a language, rather a code of English on the hands. I hope this helps clear things up a bit. In any case, ASL is a visual language that is difficult to transcribe to written words.

Yup. I was trying to explain sign language to speaking people, which is very difficult. To a hearing person, ASL seems to be a short hand, because it leaves stuff out, substitutes stuff, changes stuff. It's the best comparison that I could think of. And that's why I mentioned the body language as well!

 

And, not to get into politics here or anything, but I don't see why deaf people need another language, when they are having to live in the same place everyone else does. It makes it hard for them to integrate into an English speaking world unless they are speaking English, too. Case in point, this thread.

I really don't want to go into this too deeply, but ASL is the native language of Deaf people that live in America. Just as with any spoken language sign language is different in each part of the world. ASL is not invented (as is SEE, SEE2, Contact sign or many other manual codes for English), rather it has evolved and continues to evolve as does any spoken language. My knowledge on this subject is quite limited and much more information can be had on the subject by a web search. A good place to start for anyone that might be intersed would be to Google "William C. Stokoe ". He has done much reasearch on ASL.

I do enjoy a good debate, but this wonderful site is too full of great geocaching info for me to read. I'll bow out of this thead now and get back to reading about this great sounding hobby.

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I had a friend in college who's parents were both deaf. He had his hearing but spoke ASL fluently and "without an accent." As he explained to me, sign language is more than just "talking with your hands." There are sentence structures and cadence that is completely different than what we think of as American English.

 

Now, imagine immersing yourself in that language and then suddenly trying to remember the rules of sentence structure and composition for the rest of the English speaking world. It's quite a chore.

 

I'm sure others could explain it better, but that's as best as I remember.

 

One thing I always remember about Jon was when his parents would come visit. The first time I met his dad, Jon signed something to him and he started laughing at me and walked away. Later he told me that he had told his father, "Bret doesn't understand sign language at all. Point and laugh at him."

 

heh....what a pal. :anitongue:

 

Bret

 

24.gif24.gif24.gif24.gif

 

Thats funny. I had to stop for a while so I could quit laughing so hard.

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Well put bret.

 

When I try to sign to my friend, who happens to be deaf if thats ok with some of you, I'm sure I sound like an idiot since ASL is not my primary language and I use it only when he visits. I make up signs when I don't know the right one and, I'm certain I use the wrong ones at times. I would imagine I sound as wrong to him as he does to me when he writes. NEVER once has he made fun of the way I sign and i don't make fun of the way he types.

 

This thread is one of the worst displays af assiness by a few that I have ever read and I hope that at least a few people have managed to open their eyes since they posted.

 

That said, Welcome to geocaching Deafhunt!

 

Chris

I agree with you. I know a little sign. Still working on it though. Everyone I have been around who is deaf and I try my best as I can at it they will help me with learning it right. Few deaf people I do know NEVER made fun of me with my signing and I will NEVER make fun of them. Some people I just want to beat the living daylights out of them, because they think they are better than anyone else. This also comes from a person who has a mentally handicapped brother. I always defended him because people would pick on him because of what he was.

SO of anyone wants to knock someone because of their difference of language, race, color, religion, or handicapped. Come on over and I'll set you strait. Just to let you all know I am an American, Not a Black American, White American, Hispanic American, Or Asian American. I was born and raised here in America and I love it here. Being in places where people don't have the rights as we do is very sobering. That is why I joined the Military is to help where I can. I'm even defending the rights of these truds so they can burn the flag and knocking the military. But NO ONE has the right to put someone down because they are different.

 

Sorry Everyone I got off the subject and ranted for a while. But I had to get some of that off my chest.

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