New Idea for a Cache..

[+jRandyA]

Ok.. so I have a new idea for a cache, and thankfully giving away the idea of the cache will not ruin the fun, just in case any cachers from Alabama are reading this right now.. anyways, tell me what you think of it.

 

In all, there will be four different caches.. all of them will have to be of the mystery/puzzle type, since you will have to do something to open the caches. The coords on the listing page of each individual cache will be the exact spot that each cache is located at, only there will be a lock on each cache. Listed on each of the cache pages are coords to a small container that will hold instructions (an actual map) that will relocate the cacher to where all of the keys are (which are only about a hundred feet away from the map) hidden separately. They will have to search in that area for one of the four keys.. once they find one of the keys, they will have to go to each cache and see which of the four the key opens. One person can only be holding one key at one time, though. After they find the cache, open it, sign the log, do some trading, they return the key to it's original spot and start looking for another key. This was my original idea.

 

I see several problems with this idea right off, though:

 

One of which is that it will not be accessable to everyone at all times. Once one person finds one of the keys, that cache will no longer be available to anyone except the keyholder. For this reason, I was thinking of moving each of the caches close to the keys, so that the time it took to find out which cache the key opened would be shortened.. maybe even within walking distance.

 

Another problem that I will probably face is the fact someone will probably try to find all four keys, then set off for all four caches. This stops anyone else from doing this set, and kinda refers back to problem number one. I'm going to make all of the keys really hard to find, so I think that I may just allow the cachers to try to find all the keys at the same time.. I don't know.. I've been playing aroud with this idea.

 

If I do allow one person to get all the keys if he can, it will allow FTF to be like the rush of a real treasure hunt.. whoever finds 'em first gets 'em first. I can just imagine a bunch of the FTF people from around here meeting up at the key locations, all looking for four little keys.. and when one finds one, I can see the others just steaming over it and searching even harder for the other three while that one goes off and gets the FTF prize.

 

Then of course.. one of the keys could go missing. I guess I could make copies, hah. The only other problem is that the cache will be kinda costly. Each of the caches will cost me about $20, then I have to put FTF prizes in all four.. and then maintain all four.. but I'm willing to do this cause this cache idea sounds fun.

 

What do you guys think? And if anyone wants to steal my idea, you can.. and you don't even have to give me any credit! Well.. as long as you're not from my area.. if you are, wait till I have mine out, then copy it!

[+briansnat]

How about doing it in reverse? Have a container with a map to the cache and key at the posted coords. It satisfies the GPS requirement in the guidelines because you need a GPS to find the first stage. people can then take the map and key and use them to find and open the actual cache. If someone else comes along and finds an empty cotainer, they know that someone else is on the hunt and can wait, or come back later. You can even have a "signout sheet" in the first container with the time and date the map and key were taken, so anybody else who comes looking has an idea of how long it has been out.

 

Of course if a searcher forgets to place the map and key back in the first container, it could cause problems.

[+MREAGLEWO1]

How about doing it in reverse? Have a container with a map to the cache and key at the posted coords. It satisfies the GPS requirement in the guidelines because you need a GPS to find the first stage. people can then take the map and key and use them to find and open the actual cache. If someone else comes along and finds an empty cotainer, they know that someone else is on the hunt and can wait, or come back later. You can even have a "signout sheet" in the first container with the time and date the map and key were taken, so anybody else who comes looking has an idea of how long it has been out.

 

Of course if a searcher forgets to place the map and key back in the first container, it could cause problems.

 

What if you made copies of the map and then restock the stage every so often. And state that only 1 map per visit can be taken. ( 1 per group).

[+jasond]

Of course if a searcher forgets to place the map and key back in the first container, it could cause problems.

 

Make sure that the way back to the car forces the cacher to pass by the first container. That would make it much more likely that they'd replace the key, but it's still not foolproof.

[+TheAlabamaRambler]

Don't use keys, use combination locks.

 

I was pondering a simular idea that I put off because I have several expensive trips lined up soon, and while pondering found several versions of combination lock safes.

 

The most interesting were called Pistol Safes, a water-tight box with a combination lock built into the door.

 

And don't worry about expensive FTF stuff unless you want to, few of us are in it for the loot!

 

Or put some really nice stuff in it and place it close to my house. That'll work too.

 

You're right, not many Alabamians post here, although a good number lurk and read here.

 

Join us at www.dixiecachers.com for a vibrant, fun and active Alabama community.

[+jRandyA]

How about doing it in reverse? Have a container with a map to the cache and key at the posted coords. It satisfies the GPS requirement in the guidelines because you need a GPS to find the first stage. people can then take the map and key and use them to find and open the actual cache. If someone else comes along and finds an empty cotainer, they know that someone else is on the hunt and can wait, or come back later. You can even have a "signout sheet" in the first container with the time and date the map and key were taken, so anybody else who comes looking has an idea of how long it has been out.

 

Of course if a searcher forgets to place the map and key back in the first container, it could cause problems.

 

That's a cool idea. Though the main point I guess I wanted to make with this cache is that the seekers will have to figure out which key goes with which cache.

 

What if you made copies of the map and then restock the stage every so often. And state that only 1 map per visit can be taken. ( 1 per group).

 

That could work, but I would still want to only have one copy of the key in play, so more than one copy of the map wouldn't do much good.. so I'd have to either get multiple keys or go with TAR's idea for a combination lock.

 

Make sure that the way back to the car forces the cacher to pass by the first container. That would make it much more likely that they'd replace the key, but it's still not foolproof.

 

Good point.. thanks!

 

Don't use keys, use combination locks.

 

I was pondering a simular idea that I put off because I have several expensive trips lined up soon, and while pondering found several versions of combination lock safes.

 

The most interesting were called Pistol Safes, a water-tight box with a combination lock built into the door.

 

And don't worry about expensive FTF stuff unless you want to, few of us are in it for the loot!

 

Or put some really nice stuff in it and place it close to my house. That'll work too.

 

You're right, not many Alabamians post here, although a good number lurk and read here.

 

Join us at www.dixiecachers.com for a vibrant, fun and active Alabama community.

 

Hah, I was expecting you to reply to this one, since I've seen your replies to a lot of other posts on these forums! I like the idea of a combination lock, but that kinda defeats the purpose of having multiple keys that seekers will have to guess which one goes to which cache. I could different combinations.. that could be interesting. The only thing about that is that it's a number that you enter in, and not a physical item that you had to find that grants you access only if you actually have it in your possession.. I'll have to ponder this for a while.

 

If possible, I'd like to keep the idea that there are four caches each with a separate lock that can only be opened by one of the four individual keys.. that way the fun isn't in just finding the key/combination and going to where the cache is supposed to be as the cache page or instructions say, but instead the fun is finding the key/combination and then figuring out which cache that one key/combination opens. Looking at this idea now, it appears to me that these caches are going to take a while to find, unless the seeker is lucky.

 

Thanks for the ideas/insights, guys! Keep 'em coming!

[+briansnat]

OK how about this one? Published coords point to a locked cache container. On the outside of the container you write the coordinates for 4 other containers spaced fairly widely apart (say .1 -.2 mile). Each of those contain a combination to the lock, but only one has the correct one.

 

You can re-use those containers for 3 other caches as well, so you can place 4 caches, each with the coords of those 4 containers on the outside. It would basically be similar to your cache but you don't have to worry about keys being taken.

Edited March 5, 2007 by briansnat

[+jRandyA]

Yeah.. that could work. I think I'm just being stubborn by wanting to use keys.

 

I guess I could leave instructions to leave the keys in the final cache and I'll put them back. The problem with that is that I would have to be quick so the next seeker doesn't have to wait forever.. cause I've noticed that when a new cache goes up around here there are several people who flock to it to find it first.. usually within the same day of the publishing, haha. I wouldn't want them to wait on me for the keys.

 

I think that's why I wanted the four key and four caches idea. Say someone wants to get all four.. well they park near the keys.. cause they'll all be in one central place. They find a key.. walk to one the containers, wrong one, walk to the next one, wrong one, walk to the next one, wrong one, walk to the next one, bingo! Then to find the next cache, they have to walk back to where the keys are, so why not go ahead and replace that key that they already have? Repeat for the other three caches.. as far as the last one goes, well they have to walk back to where their car is, so why not replace the key while you're there? Same goes if they find all the keys and head towards the caches.. gotta go back to the car at some point.

 

EDIT: Typed up something that didn't make sense, ha.

Edited March 5, 2007 by skawhes

[+briansnat]

On second thought my idea might not comply with the guidelines. I don't think separate caches can share stages and each of those 4 containers might be considered a stage.

 

I'm thinking as I write, so forgive me if this doesn't make sense.

 

Hide 8 individually listed caches. 4 of those caches have locks and are at the published coordinates. The other 4 are mystery caches not at their published coords (we'll call the latter 4 "key caches" and the first 4 "locked caches"). The coords of all of of the "key caches" will be on the outside of each of the "locked caches". Each of the "key caches" will have a combination for one of the "locked caches", but you don't know which one. Make sense?

[+jRandyA]

Hide 8 individually listed caches. 4 of those caches have locks and are at the published coordinates. The other 4 are mystery caches not at their published coords (we'll call the latter 4 "key caches" and the first 4 "locked caches"). The coords of all of of the "key caches" will be on the outside of each of the "locked caches". Each of the "key caches" will have a combination for one of the "locked caches", but you don't know which one. Make sense?

 

Yeaaah.. that's a cool idea. But would the cachers be able to log their visit and get a smiley on each of the key caches too?

[+bflentje]

What do you guys think? And if anyone wants to steal my idea, you can.. and you don't even have to give me any credit! Well.. as long as you're not from my area.. if you are, wait till I have mine out, then copy it!

 

Something similar was done in the Twin Cities. Although the cache is no longer active.

 

http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_detai...cb-6f7ba238f14e

[+briansnat]

Hide 8 individually listed caches. 4 of those caches have locks and are at the published coordinates. The other 4 are mystery caches not at their published coords (we'll call the latter 4 "key caches" and the first 4 "locked caches"). The coords of all of of the "key caches" will be on the outside of each of the "locked caches". Each of the "key caches" will have a combination for one of the "locked caches", but you don't know which one. Make sense?

 

Yeaaah.. that's a cool idea. But would the cachers be able to log their visit and get a smiley on each of the key caches too?

 

Yeah because each one is an individually listed cache and will have a logbook. The "key" caches will also have the combination of one of the lock caches.

 

One benefit is that if you get those locks where you can change the combinations, you can assign a new combination every once in a while to prevent cheaters from sharing the combinations.

 

Also remeber that each cache will have to conform to the guidelines, so they have to be at least .1 mile apart.

Edited March 5, 2007 by briansnat

[+briansnat]

Oh and how to lock a cache?

 

Here is what I did. 1 eye bolt, two flat rubber washers, two metal washers and two hex nuts.

 

Drill hole in ammo box, thread 1 hex nut all the way to end of thread, then add metal washer and rubber washer. Place through drill hole in box and thread on rubber washer, metal washer then hex nut on other end and tighten.

 

 

[riddlemethis]

Someting like the folowing was in Vancouver and might work for you:

 

Have 4 keys with coordinates that you place in local caches like travel bugs. If people find it they can take it and unlock one of the four caches that are listed as puzzles, and then drop off the key in any cache. The one in Vancouver was quite a popular and elusive cache.

 

Each cache could have part of a combo and coords to a fifth and very elusive puzzle cache. Call the series locked n' locked

 

Here's the one I was thinking of.

[+MREAGLEWO1]

what about something alittle different from what you may have wanted but have a micro near you cache that is locked that they must look for when they get there.....and have it tied or chained to something so people cant take it.

[+KKTH3]

How about doing it in reverse? Have a container with a map to the cache and key at the posted coords. It satisfies the GPS requirement in the guidelines because you need a GPS to find the first stage. people can then take the map and key and use them to find and open the actual cache. If someone else comes along and finds an empty cotainer, they know that someone else is on the hunt and can wait, or come back later. You can even have a "signout sheet" in the first container with the time and date the map and key were taken, so anybody else who comes looking has an idea of how long it has been out.

 

Of course if a searcher forgets to place the map and key back in the first container, it could cause problems.

 

That's a cool idea. Though the main point I guess I wanted to make with this cache is that the seekers will have to figure out which key goes with which cache.

 

A variation on that idea would be to have a stack of sheets in each of the four first stages. Each group of cachers takes one sheet and sees it has both a map from "point A to Point B" using several notable landmarks. It also has a combination for a comination lock. Here is the catch... Point A will be one of the four "first stages" but not necessarily the one you are at. Furthermore, the combination will unlock one of the four final stages, but it may not be the one associated with the map its on OR associated with the map that starts out at the cache you found the combination at.

 

To clarify, consider 4 first stage caches that are exactly at published coordinates, A B C & D. Then there are four final caches with the logbooks under a combo lock, E F G & H. If you go to the cache A, you find a map from one point to another via landmarks and a combination for a lock. It takes trial and error to find out that the map actually goes from C to H and the combination is for F. To really find any of the caches, one would need to grab several maps and obtain several combinations and use trial and error.

 

On a side note, one problem I see with the keys is that someone might pick up all 4 keys deliberately before trying any of them out to "lock out" all of the caches until they are done. Might only happen for the FTFs, and might never happen, but it is certainly possible that someone might go after all the keys first just so no other keys are taken by other cachers while they are looking for the first locked box.

 

Now, if you wanted the ultimate in using physical keys, there are always the intracate Kirk Key lockout systems, which require one or more keys just to release a new key... and those unlocking keys must be left behind if the new key is taken. Some of the locking combinations can be quite intracate and would be downright evil for a cache locking system (though horribly expensive to implement.)

[+Trucker Lee]

 

I like the idea of a combination lock, but that kinda defeats the purpose of having multiple keys that seekers will have to guess which one goes to which cache. I could different combinations.. that could be interesting. The only thing about that is that it's a number that you enter in, and not a physical item that you had to find that grants you access only if you actually have it in your possession.. I'll have to ponder this for a while.

 

Be a real bas----! Use 10 stages, with 10 different combinations, and don't say which goes with which. All combinations would have to be tried, up to 10 at the first box, up to 9 at the second, 8 at the 3rd. Of course, those that forget to mark off which combinations have already worked really do make their own life miserable.

 

Good grief!!! Did I think of that. I needa attitude adjustment, brb, I gotta slam my finger in the door.

[+Torry]

I've seen similar serial caches... they tend to quickly become unusable as cachers are not always able to coordinate their timing. It might work once but I'm not too optimistic.

[Clan Riffster]

Something I've seen south of Tampa that I want to copy is one cache containing a big ring full of keys. One of those keys fits a lock that is securing another cache. The cacher gets to figure out which one. Not sure if this idea would fit in with yours or not.

[+jRandyA]

Thank you to everyone who has contributed to this idea.. so far I've come up with this as a good solution to this cache:

 

Four caches listed as mystery caches located at posted coords. "Locked caches," with combination locks. Four other separate caches that contain logs.. also contain combinations that go to one of the other caches.

 

Also, the idea about four caches with four keys as TBs was pretty cool, and is being considered.

 

The other is the original idea of hiding keys, but this will probably not work. I'm still being stubborn and trying to figure out a way for it work, though.

 

Thanks everyone! If you have any more suggestions, please reply.