The mentor system for new cachers

[+Totem Clan]

I started a new thread for this topic so as to not take the old topic too far off topic.

 

I'm not a fan of requiring someone to have a mentor.

 

I don't like the "forced" mentor system either, but I think the reason behind it is sound. I think that we could do more to reach out to others.

 

I have had cachers in the area ask for my help/advice with caches. If we can help, we should help. But I would never like to see a forced system where you have to have a mentor.

 

Maybe some kind of a list of cachers in the area that could help others as needed would be helpful. Maybe?

 

I completely understand the dislike of having a forced mentor. But, I still think it would help the overall game/hobby/sport of geocaching if the new cachers could get some additional guidance, beyond that of the guidelines in placing their first few caches. So far, I've only placed one... it was a decent location, not a great one, and it was a poor container. It didn't last very long.

 

I'm getting ready to hide my second cache in the next few days (although I've been saying that to myself for about a month now), and I think it'll be a good hide that will last for a good length of time. But... I believe in learning from others mistakes before learning from your own. If a more experienced hider had guided me in my first few hides, the first one I placed would likely still be there, and it's more likely that I'd have several hides at this point.

 

Additionally, it would allow new cachers to get a chance to know others, and/or experience their local organization (if there is one of course). Once they have a couple of hides under thier belt, if they choose to continue those relationships great... if not, so be it. At least they have gained some collective wisdom on both cache placement and containers.

 

[edited cause I can't spell!!]

I agree with the basic idea behind the "mentor system", however I see way too many problems for ever to work.

 

I. Who would oversee it?

A. You mentioned the local organisations.

1. What if there is no local group?

a. You suggested photos sent via email. I the hider has no digital camera, who will pay for one for them?

B. Who and how will the mentors be appointed by the local group?

2. Will there be someway to ensure the local groups are appointing proper mentors?

3. Will there be a National Charter to oversee the program?

 

II. It could discourage some cachers.

 

III. How will you prove you have been "mentored".

Edited February 13, 2007 by Totem Clan

[+Jhwk]

No.

 

I got into caching to get my butt off the couch and out the door.

 

All I needed was a GPSr and some gumption.

 

I mentored myself, read the forums, perused the old logs, and have placed 4 caches (2 adopted) in almost 2 years of caching.

 

Increasing the hoops you have to jump through will only decrease the attendence and interest.

 

I live far from any organized group, so it wouldn't work for me anyway. And I am a little too old for mentoring. Plus I hate the word mentor.

[Mushtang]

Not just no, but noooooooooo.

 

Having one person teach another person "how to cache" will reduce the variation we have. Variation is good. Everyone doing the same thing is boring.

[+Jhwk]

Not just no, but noooooooooo.

 

Having one person teach another person "how to cache" will reduce the variation we have. Variation is good. Everyone doing the same thing is boring.

kind of like the whole 'quality cache' rant? no? maybe not...

 

chaos rulez!

[+sbell111]

What if the mentor hates caches that the noob likes (and the other way around)?

[+Totem Clan]

As I said I'm against a mentor system, but what if there was some sort of list of local cachers willing to help new cachers and/or hiders?

 

I don't know. Just thinking of some of things mentioned on the subject in the other thread and draggin' out over here.

[+BlueDeuce]

Our local club has geocaching 101 and 102 cache events. If you want someone to personally help you go caching we have more than enough volunteers.

 

Targeting people who truly need help (aka bad guys and idiots) won't do much. They aren't interested.

[+Totem Clan]

Our local club has geocaching 101 and 102 cache events. If you want someone to personally help you go caching we have more than enough volunteers.

 

Targeting people who truly need help (aka bad guys and idiots) won't do much. They aren't interested.

I'm planning on of those up here for this spring. I think that type of 'mentoring' is all that is needed.

[+sbell111]

As I said I'm against a mentor system, but what if there was some sort of list of local cachers willing to help new cachers and/or hiders?

 

I don't know. Just thinking of some of things mentioned on the subject in the other thread and draggin' out over here.

Isn't there a thread about that in the newbie forum?

[+BlueDeuce]

 

I'm planning on of those up here for this spring. I think that type of 'mentoring' is all that is needed.

 

ayep.

 

In case people want ideas or offer input.

 

Geocaching 201 - A Tech Event

Edited February 13, 2007 by BlueDeuce

[BRTango]

I agree with the basic idea behind the "mentor system", however I see way too many problems for ever to work.

 

I. Who would oversee it. Much like the reviewer system, the mentors would be chosen and invited by Geocaching.com and/or the local reviewers. This would be an addition to the review process and only for the first couple of caches hidden (lets call it two).

A. You mentioned the local organisations.

1. What if there is no local group. The process can be done remotely through email/photos/detailed descriptions.

a. You suggested photos sent via email. I the hider has no digital camera, who will pay for one for them? Good question. I would venture a guess and say that the majority of geocachers have a means of digitizing a photo of their cache and/or the cache location. This can be done with a regular camera and scanning in the photo, taking it to kinkos, office depot or some sort. To head off the next question, what about those cachers who are out there in the mountain valleys of the Pacific Northwest or the deep desert and live 50 miles from civilization with no means of digitizing their photos and/or don't own a camera period. Well... that's a tough one and should be taken on a case by case basis, but an email exchange with a very, very detailed description of the cache and location should suffice.

B. Who and how will the mentors be appointed by the local group? Appointed through a similar process to the reviewers, granted there would have to be many more of them. I suggested the local groups because they typically have members from across a wide area and/or there are many groups in an area. For example, where I am, I could draw from NoVAGO, MGS, or the Beltway Bandits of MAGC. If however, there is noone nearby, refer back to the detailed email process.

2. Will there be someway to ensure the local groups are appointing proper mentors. No, just like there is no way to ensure that the local reviewers are the cream of the crop, you can't ensure that you are appointing the proper mentors. However, the local reviewers and/or the local caching groups have a great institutional knowledge of who the experienced hiders are, so their input to the process would be integral. If a mentor helps someone place thier first cache which happens to be a metal pipe with end caps and a wire sticking out of it next to a police station, then that mentor may need to be removed from the list.

3. Will there be a National Charter to oversee the program. Much like the local reviewers, the ultimate overseer of the mentors could be Geocaching.com, with the local reviewers and/or local caching organizations being an integral part of the process (and likely doing most of the work, to include the actual mentoring, suggesting/recommending mentors, etc...).

 

2. It could discourage some cachers. It could also greatly encourage some cachers by introducing them to experienced cachers and/or local organizaitons.

 

3. How will you prove you have been "mentored". The reviewer will have the name of the mentor and the mentor will have to contact the reviewer prior to publication to give a thumbs up.

 

All valid questions and something that would need to be thought through a little more thouroughly. I'll see what I can throw out there for these questions.

 

While there are a lot of people who don't like the idea of a mentor system, just think of it as an education system. You are simply learning the ropes. The worst thing that will happen is your first two hides will take a little longer to go through the approval process and you will have to engage directly with an experienced cacher.

 

While not ideal, it would have the potential to greatly decrease the number of caches that are reported to local authorities, and increase the quality of the caches to assist in keeping the logs dry and prohibited items out of the cache.

Edited February 13, 2007 by BRTango

[BRTango]

What if the mentor hates caches that the noob likes (and the other way around)?

 

If the noob is placing an urban micro, the reviewer can ask someone who places urban micros to be the mentor.

 

If the noob is placing a 5/5 deep woods large, multi cache, the reviewer can ask someone who places similar caches to be the mentor.

[+sbell111]

I. Who would oversee it. Much like the reviewer system, the mentors would be chosen and invited by Geocaching.com and/or the local reviewers. This would be an addition to the review process and only for the first couple of caches hidden (lets call it two).

A. You mentioned the local organisations.

1. What if there is no local group. The process can be done remotely through email/photos/detailed descriptions.

a. You suggested photos sent via email. I the hider has no digital camera, who will pay for one for them? Good question. I would venture a guess and say that the majority of geocachers have a means of digitizing a photo of their cache and/or the cache location. This can be done with a regular camera and scanning in the photo, taking it to kinkos, office depot or some sort. To head off the next question, what about those cachers who are out there in the mountain valleys of the Pacific Northwest or the deep desert and live 50 miles from civilization with no means of digitizing their photos and/or don't own a camera period. Well... that's a tough one and should be taken on a case by case basis, but an email exchange with a very, very detailed description of the cache and location should suffice.

B. Who and how will the mentors be appointed by the local group? Appointed through a similar process to the reviewers, granted there would have to be many more of them. I suggested the local groups because they typically have members from across a wide area and/or there are many groups in an area. For example, where I am, I could draw from NoVAGO, MGS, or the Beltway Bandits of MAGC. If however, there is noone nearby, refer back to the detailed email process.

2. Will there be someway to ensure the local groups are appointing proper mentors. No, just like there is no way to ensure that the local reviewers are the cream of the crop, you can't ensure that you are appointing the proper mentors. However, the local reviewers and/or the local caching groups have a great institutional knowledge of who the experienced hiders are, so their input to the process would be integral. If a mentor helps someone place thier first cache which happens to be a metal pipe with end caps and a wire sticking out of it next to a police station, then that mentor may need to be removed from the list.

3. Will there be a National Charter to oversee the program. Much like the local reviewers, the ultimate overseer of the mentors could be Geocaching.com, with the local reviewers and/or local caching organizations being an integral part of the process (and likely doing most of the work, to include the actual mentoring, suggesting/recommending mentors, etc...).

 

2. It could discourage some cachers. It could also greatly encourage some cachers by introducing them to experienced cachers and/or local organizaitons.

 

3. How will you prove you have been "mentored". The reviewer will have the name of the mentor and the mentor will have to contact the reviewer prior to publication to give a thumbs up.

 

All valid questions and something that would need to be thought through a little more thouroughly. I'll see what I can throw out there for these questions.

 

While there are a lot of people who don't like the idea of a mentor system, just think of it as an education system. You are simply learning the ropes. The worst thing that will happen is your first two hides will take a little longer to go through the approval process and you will have to engage directly with an experienced cacher.

 

While not ideal, it would have the potential to greatly decrease the number of caches that are reported to local authorities, and increase the quality of the caches to assist in keeping the logs dry and prohibited items out of the cache.

Wow. I can't tell you how much I wouldn't like that system.

 

I bet TPTB would not be in favor of managing it.

Edited February 13, 2007 by sbell111

[BRTango]

Not just no, but noooooooooo.

 

Having one person teach another person "how to cache" will reduce the variation we have. Variation is good. Everyone doing the same thing is boring.

 

There are enough variations in the hiders out there that this shouldn't be a problem. See my response to Sbell above.

[BRTango]

No.

 

I got into caching to get my butt off the couch and out the door.

 

All I needed was a GPSr and some gumption.

 

I mentored myself, read the forums, perused the old logs, and have placed 4 caches (2 adopted) in almost 2 years of caching.

 

Increasing the hoops you have to jump through will only decrease the attendence and interest.

 

I live far from any organized group, so it wouldn't work for me anyway. And I am a little too old for mentoring. Plus I hate the word mentor.

 

How would somebody assisting you in placing your first two hides prevent you from using your gumption to get off the couch and out the door.

 

Call them helper monkeys if you don't like the word mentor.

[+sbell111]

What if the mentor hates caches that the noob likes (and the other way around)?

If the noob is placing an urban micro, the reviewer can ask someone who places urban micros to be the mentor.

 

If the noob is placing a 5/5 deep woods large, multi cache, the reviewer can ask someone who places similar caches to be the mentor.

So basically, if you don't like your mentor, you can throw him back and get a different one?

 

My idea of a mentor is someone that not only walks a noob through the hide process, but also through the find process. This is especially important given that most bomb scares are due to finders being seen.

Edited February 13, 2007 by sbell111

[BRTango]

I. Who would oversee it. Much like the reviewer system, the mentors would be chosen and invited by Geocaching.com and/or the local reviewers. This would be an addition to the review process and only for the first couple of caches hidden (lets call it two).

A. You mentioned the local organisations.

1. What if there is no local group. The process can be done remotely through email/photos/detailed descriptions.

a. You suggested photos sent via email. I the hider has no digital camera, who will pay for one for them? Good question. I would venture a guess and say that the majority of geocachers have a means of digitizing a photo of their cache and/or the cache location. This can be done with a regular camera and scanning in the photo, taking it to kinkos, office depot or some sort. To head off the next question, what about those cachers who are out there in the mountain valleys of the Pacific Northwest or the deep desert and live 50 miles from civilization with no means of digitizing their photos and/or don't own a camera period. Well... that's a tough one and should be taken on a case by case basis, but an email exchange with a very, very detailed description of the cache and location should suffice.

B. Who and how will the mentors be appointed by the local group? Appointed through a similar process to the reviewers, granted there would have to be many more of them. I suggested the local groups because they typically have members from across a wide area and/or there are many groups in an area. For example, where I am, I could draw from NoVAGO, MGS, or the Beltway Bandits of MAGC. If however, there is noone nearby, refer back to the detailed email process.

2. Will there be someway to ensure the local groups are appointing proper mentors. No, just like there is no way to ensure that the local reviewers are the cream of the crop, you can't ensure that you are appointing the proper mentors. However, the local reviewers and/or the local caching groups have a great institutional knowledge of who the experienced hiders are, so their input to the process would be integral. If a mentor helps someone place thier first cache which happens to be a metal pipe with end caps and a wire sticking out of it next to a police station, then that mentor may need to be removed from the list.

3. Will there be a National Charter to oversee the program. Much like the local reviewers, the ultimate overseer of the mentors could be Geocaching.com, with the local reviewers and/or local caching organizations being an integral part of the process (and likely doing most of the work, to include the actual mentoring, suggesting/recommending mentors, etc...).

 

2. It could discourage some cachers. It could also greatly encourage some cachers by introducing them to experienced cachers and/or local organizaitons.

 

3. How will you prove you have been "mentored". The reviewer will have the name of the mentor and the mentor will have to contact the reviewer prior to publication to give a thumbs up.

 

All valid questions and something that would need to be thought through a little more thouroughly. I'll see what I can throw out there for these questions.

 

While there are a lot of people who don't like the idea of a mentor system, just think of it as an education system. You are simply learning the ropes. The worst thing that will happen is your first two hides will take a little longer to go through the approval process and you will have to engage directly with an experienced cacher.

 

While not ideal, it would have the potential to greatly decrease the number of caches that are reported to local authorities, and increase the quality of the caches to assist in keeping the logs dry and prohibited items out of the cache.

Wow. I can't tell you how much I wouldn't like that system.

 

I bet TPTB would not be in favor of managing it.

 

Ok... anything in particular? Or just the entire idea of it?

[BRTango]

What if the mentor hates caches that the noob likes (and the other way around)?

If the noob is placing an urban micro, the reviewer can ask someone who places urban micros to be the mentor.

 

If the noob is placing a 5/5 deep woods large, multi cache, the reviewer can ask someone who places similar caches to be the mentor.

So basically, if you don't like your mentor, you can throw him back and get a different one?

 

My idea of a mentor is someone that not only walks a noob through the hide process, but also through the find process. This is especially important given that most bomb scares are due to finders being seen.

 

I was strictly speaking of the hide process. If the hide is better, it's less likely to be seen by non-cachers and therefore less likely to be reported.

[BRTango]

What if the mentor hates caches that the noob likes (and the other way around)?

If the noob is placing an urban micro, the reviewer can ask someone who places urban micros to be the mentor.

 

If the noob is placing a 5/5 deep woods large, multi cache, the reviewer can ask someone who places similar caches to be the mentor.

So basically, if you don't like your mentor, you can throw him back and get a different one?

 

My idea of a mentor is someone that not only walks a noob through the hide process, but also through the find process. This is especially important given that most bomb scares are due to finders being seen.

 

Oh... and to addressthe first part. I'm not sure under what circumstances that would be necessary, but if it is, then working through the reviewer to find a mentor that the cacher would be able to work with may be necessary on a case-by-case basis.

[+Totem Clan]

What if the mentor hates caches that the noob likes (and the other way around)?

 

If the noob is placing an urban micro, the reviewer can ask someone who places urban micros to be the mentor.

 

If the noob is placing a 5/5 deep woods large, multi cache, the reviewer can ask someone who places similar caches to be the mentor.

So there is no way you could handle on the local level because it would have to go back to the reviewer. People complain now about how long it takes to get a cache approved. Wait till this is adding to the work load.

BTW, my reviewer lives over 600 miles away.

Also when I started hiding caches, I hid things no one in this area had ever seen or thought of. I learned how to hide cache by finding caches back in Alaska. When I move here, there were very few caches and most of those were gladware dumped by University students on a whim. If I was mentored, would I have had to lowered my hides down to their standard?

[BRTango]

What if the mentor hates caches that the noob likes (and the other way around)?

 

If the noob is placing an urban micro, the reviewer can ask someone who places urban micros to be the mentor.

 

If the noob is placing a 5/5 deep woods large, multi cache, the reviewer can ask someone who places similar caches to be the mentor.

So there is no way you could handle on the local level because it would have to go back to the reviewer. People complain now about how long it takes to get a cache approved. Wait till this is adding to the work load.

BTW, my reviewer lives over 600 miles away.

Also when I started hiding caches, I hid things no one in this area had ever seen or thought of. I learned how to hide cache by finding caches back in Alaska. When I move here, there were very few caches and most of those were gladware dumped by University students on a whim. If I was mentored, would I have had to lowered my hides down to their standard?

 

Its not about hiding something to someone elses standards. Its about hiding something well, and of good quality. If those University students who dumbed gladware all over the place had someone experienced, then the quality in your area wouldn't have been poor.

 

To address the first part. It's not the reviewer doing the assiting/mentoring, it's someone closer to you that you could interact with. The reviewer would have a list of volunteers in your local area who would be willing to assist you and if you had a fundamental problem working with one of them, then the reviewer could ask someone else to work with you.

 

It's also not going to pigeon hole you into one particular type of hide. If you know of other hide types from previous experience, then great use your imagination... but if your have a great hide, with a carpy container, a mentor/assistant/helper could suggest a better container. Or if you have a great container and are planning on putting it underneath the loading dock at a local wal-mart, the mentor/assistant/helper can suggest you find a better local.

 

Will it lengthen the review process? Sure... but only for the first two hides, and after that, it's the same thing you have right now.

 

Nothing wrong with a little educaiton.

[+flask]

i am emphatically in favor of helping those who ask.

 

i am vehemently against requiring people to be mentored. oy, what a headache that would be, not to mention just plain wrong.

 

one of the things that's fun about geocaching is that sort of invisible network spread out on the land. the more rules we have, the less attractive it is.

[+Totem Clan]

 

Nothing wrong with a little educaiton.

I can only agree with that point, but the system you came up with is way to complex.

 

In most cases I've seen lame cache hiders are lame lazy cachers. In the long run a regimented mentor system would be more work for the good cachers, and wouldn't change the underling problem of the lazy cacher anyway. Not unless it is very regulated, with testes and approval ratings, and the like. And that, my friend, would do more harm than good.

 

You want mentors? Try this.

 

Have list of locals willing to help posted on the website. Cachers with a decent number of finds/hides posted by there location. When you want/need help, you can go to the list.

Edited February 13, 2007 by Totem Clan

[BRTango]

i am emphatically in favor of helping those who ask.

 

i am vehemently against requiring people to be mentored. oy, what a headache that would be, not to mention just plain wrong.

 

one of the things that's fun about geocaching is that sort of invisible network spread out on the land. the more rules we have, the less attractive it is.

 

Not quite sure what is just plain wrong with it, could you elaborate? Also not sure how it would degrade any of the fun. It's not about more rules, it's about education. The rules are enforced by the reviewer... the mentor would simply be there to educate someone who has no idea what they are doing in how to do it.

 

If you have been caching for 5 years, have 5000(+) hides under your belt and are just now placing your first cache... chances are you don't need any assistance... so it would be a simple process of the mentor saying "Ah, yup... that'd be a good one"

 

However, if you have 1 hide and decide to place your first cache... that mentor could say, you might want to use a lock-n-lock instead of a gladware.

[BRTango]

 

Nothing wrong with a little educaiton.

I can only agree with that point, but the system you came up with is way to complex.

 

In most cases I've seen lame cache hiders are lame lazy cachers. In the long run a regimented mentor system would be more work for the good cachers, and wouldn't change the underling problem of the lazy cacher anyway. Not unless it is very regulated, with testes and approval ratings, and the like. And that, my friend, would do more harm than good.

 

You want mentors? Try this.

 

Have list of locals willing to help posted on the website. Cachers with a decent number of finds/hides posted by there location. When you want/need help, you can go to the list.

 

Which website? Geocaching.com? the forums, or the local organizations webpage?

 

I don't see it as a very regulated or regimented system with any more tests and approval ratings than are already in place during the review process. Simply someone there to help you on your first two hides.

[+Totem Clan]

 

Nothing wrong with a little educaiton.

I can only agree with that point, but the system you came up with is way to complex.

 

In most cases I've seen lame cache hiders are lame lazy cachers. In the long run a regimented mentor system would be more work for the good cachers, and wouldn't change the underling problem of the lazy cacher anyway. Not unless it is very regulated, with testes and approval ratings, and the like. And that, my friend, would do more harm than good.

 

You want mentors? Try this.

 

Have list of locals willing to help posted on the website. Cachers with a decent number of finds/hides posted by there location. When you want/need help, you can go to the list.

 

I don't see it as a very regulated or regimented system with any more tests and approval ratings than are already in place during the review process. Simply someone there to help you on your first two hides.

 

And without that regimention is not going to change a lame who doen't want to change.

Edited February 13, 2007 by Totem Clan

[+sbell111]

In most cases I've seen lame cache hiders are lame lazy cachers. In the long run a regimented mentor system would be more work for the good cachers, and wouldn't change the underling problem of the lazy cacher anyway. Not unless it is very regulated, with testes and approval ratings, and the like. And that, my friend, would do more harm than good.

Well, that's kind of sexist.

You want mentors? Try this.

 

Have list of locals willing to help posted on the website. Cachers with a decent number of finds/hides posted by there location. When you want/need help, you can go to the list.

Or we can just leave it as is. If someone wants help they can either go to the local group or post a note in the newbie forum.

[BRTango]

 

Nothing wrong with a little educaiton.

I can only agree with that point, but the system you came up with is way to complex.

 

In most cases I've seen lame cache hiders are lame lazy cachers. In the long run a regimented mentor system would be more work for the good cachers, and wouldn't change the underling problem of the lazy cacher anyway. Not unless it is very regulated, with testes and approval ratings, and the like. And that, my friend, would do more harm than good.

 

You want mentors? Try this.

 

Have list of locals willing to help posted on the website. Cachers with a decent number of finds/hides posted by there location. When you want/need help, you can go to the list.

 

I don't see it as a very regulated or regimented system with any more tests and approval ratings than are already in place during the review process. Simply someone there to help you on your first two hides.

 

And without that regimention is not going to change a lame who doen't want to change.

 

right, but it isn't about lame caches, it's about good hides and good containers. A lame cache can still be hidden well, in a durable container.

[+Totem Clan]

 

Nothing wrong with a little educaiton.

I can only agree with that point, but the system you came up with is way to complex.

 

In most cases I've seen lame cache hiders are lame lazy cachers. In the long run a regimented mentor system would be more work for the good cachers, and wouldn't change the underling problem of the lazy cacher anyway. Not unless it is very regulated, with testes and approval ratings, and the like. And that, my friend, would do more harm than good.

 

You want mentors? Try this.

 

Have list of locals willing to help posted on the website. Cachers with a decent number of finds/hides posted by there location. When you want/need help, you can go to the list.

 

Which website? Geocaching.com? the forums, or the local organizations webpage?

 

Geocahin.com is the only one you could have it on. Not all areas have organizations and not all cacher come to the forums.

[BRTango]

deleting duplicate post

Edited February 13, 2007 by BRTango

[BRTango]

 

Nothing wrong with a little educaiton.

I can only agree with that point, but the system you came up with is way to complex.

 

In most cases I've seen lame cache hiders are lame lazy cachers. In the long run a regimented mentor system would be more work for the good cachers, and wouldn't change the underling problem of the lazy cacher anyway. Not unless it is very regulated, with testes and approval ratings, and the like. And that, my friend, would do more harm than good.

 

You want mentors? Try this.

 

Have list of locals willing to help posted on the website. Cachers with a decent number of finds/hides posted by there location. When you want/need help, you can go to the list.

 

Which website? Geocaching.com? the forums, or the local organizations webpage?

 

Geocahin.com is the only one you could have it on. Not all areas have organizations and not all cacher come to the forums.

 

Agreed... and that might not be a bad idea. Post it on what, the cache submission page? or make it a link off of the search pages based on your home coords?

[+Totem Clan]

 

Nothing wrong with a little educaiton.

I can only agree with that point, but the system you came up with is way to complex.

 

In most cases I've seen lame cache hiders are lame lazy cachers. In the long run a regimented mentor system would be more work for the good cachers, and wouldn't change the underling problem of the lazy cacher anyway. Not unless it is very regulated, with testes and approval ratings, and the like. And that, my friend, would do more harm than good.

 

You want mentors? Try this.

 

Have list of locals willing to help posted on the website. Cachers with a decent number of finds/hides posted by there location. When you want/need help, you can go to the list.

 

I don't see it as a very regulated or regimented system with any more tests and approval ratings than are already in place during the review process.

 

It would take a lot more work than you think to put together and maintain the list at the reviewer's level. Then the hider would have to contact the reviewer. The review would assign the mentor. They would have to get together. Then the mentor would contact the review. Simple when were only talking about one cacher. Something much more when look at the whole nation.

 

Who's going to get this system going and maintain it? As it is things are almost too much at times. Just look at all the thread complaining about slow responses. Granted it's usually nothing but a case of someone with the panties in a wad, but still.

[+Totem Clan]

 

Nothing wrong with a little educaiton.

I can only agree with that point, but the system you came up with is way to complex.

 

In most cases I've seen lame cache hiders are lame lazy cachers. In the long run a regimented mentor system would be more work for the good cachers, and wouldn't change the underling problem of the lazy cacher anyway. Not unless it is very regulated, with testes and approval ratings, and the like. And that, my friend, would do more harm than good.

 

You want mentors? Try this.

 

Have list of locals willing to help posted on the website. Cachers with a decent number of finds/hides posted by there location. When you want/need help, you can go to the list.

 

Which website? Geocaching.com? the forums, or the local organizations webpage?

 

Geocahin.com is the only one you could have it on. Not all areas have organizations and not all cacher come to the forums.

 

Agreed... and that might not be a bad idea. Post it on what, the cache submission page? or make it a link off of the search pages based on your home coords?

Now you're starting to see the promblem. If even mantaining a list is too much hassle, how can you want to add on even more?

[BRTango]

 

Nothing wrong with a little educaiton.

I can only agree with that point, but the system you came up with is way to complex.

 

In most cases I've seen lame cache hiders are lame lazy cachers. In the long run a regimented mentor system would be more work for the good cachers, and wouldn't change the underling problem of the lazy cacher anyway. Not unless it is very regulated, with testes and approval ratings, and the like. And that, my friend, would do more harm than good.

 

You want mentors? Try this.

 

Have list of locals willing to help posted on the website. Cachers with a decent number of finds/hides posted by there location. When you want/need help, you can go to the list.

 

I don't see it as a very regulated or regimented system with any more tests and approval ratings than are already in place during the review process.

 

It would take a lot more work than you think to put together and maintain the list at the reviewer's level. Then the hider would have to contact the reviewer. The review would assign the mentor. They would have to get together. Then the mentor would contact the review. Simple when were only talking about one cacher. Something much more when look at the whole nation.

 

Who's going to get this system going and maintain it? As it is things are almost too much at times. Just look at all the thread complaining about slow responses. Granted it's usually nothing but a case of someone with the panties in a wad, but still.

 

I really don't think it would be that much more complex once the lists have been made. The system is already in place nationally, and globally, so this is merely one more step and only for two cache hides per person.

[BRTango]

 

Nothing wrong with a little educaiton.

I can only agree with that point, but the system you came up with is way to complex.

 

In most cases I've seen lame cache hiders are lame lazy cachers. In the long run a regimented mentor system would be more work for the good cachers, and wouldn't change the underling problem of the lazy cacher anyway. Not unless it is very regulated, with testes and approval ratings, and the like. And that, my friend, would do more harm than good.

 

You want mentors? Try this.

 

Have list of locals willing to help posted on the website. Cachers with a decent number of finds/hides posted by there location. When you want/need help, you can go to the list.

 

Which website? Geocaching.com? the forums, or the local organizations webpage?

 

Geocahin.com is the only one you could have it on. Not all areas have organizations and not all cacher come to the forums.

 

Agreed... and that might not be a bad idea. Post it on what, the cache submission page? or make it a link off of the search pages based on your home coords?

Now you're starting to see the promblem. If even mantaining a list is too much hassle, how can you want to add on even more?

 

I'm sorry... I don't follow. I'm not seeing how hard it would be to maintain the list.

[+ePeterso2]

The idea of a process-heavy reviewer/mentor system sounds like too much work for not enough benefit. What has been proposed so far seems to rely upon mystery people that don't exist and organizations that likely aren't able or willing to fund such an increased level of review, mentoring, certification, verification, etc.

 

I've seen other professional organizations that cater to both adults and children end up dissolving or fracturing when such rule-laden approaches have been put in place. (Odyssey of the Mind is one of them, for those that are familiar with that.)

 

All of that time, effort, and money would be better spent as other cachers have said - conducting geocaching clinics, running forums, setting up local assocations, etc.

 

Please, no mandatory mentoring requirements.

 

-eP

 

PS: Maintaining a list of anything or anyone is great as long as the list owner continues to maintain it or hands it off to someone willing to do so. But there are lots of abandoned lists of things out there on the internet ...

Edited February 13, 2007 by ePeterso2

[+Totem Clan]

 

Nothing wrong with a little educaiton.

I can only agree with that point, but the system you came up with is way to complex.

 

In most cases I've seen lame cache hiders are lame lazy cachers. In the long run a regimented mentor system would be more work for the good cachers, and wouldn't change the underling problem of the lazy cacher anyway. Not unless it is very regulated, with testes and approval ratings, and the like. And that, my friend, would do more harm than good.

 

You want mentors? Try this.

 

Have list of locals willing to help posted on the website. Cachers with a decent number of finds/hides posted by there location. When you want/need help, you can go to the list.

 

I don't see it as a very regulated or regimented system with any more tests and approval ratings than are already in place during the review process.

 

It would take a lot more work than you think to put together and maintain the list at the reviewer's level. Then the hider would have to contact the reviewer. The review would assign the mentor. They would have to get together. Then the mentor would contact the review. Simple when were only talking about one cacher. Something much more when look at the whole nation.

 

Who's going to get this system going and maintain it? As it is things are almost too much at times. Just look at all the thread complaining about slow responses. Granted it's usually nothing but a case of someone with the panties in a wad, but still.

 

I really don't think it would be that much more complex once the lists have been made. The system is already in place nationally, and globally, so this is merely one more step and only for two cache hides per person.

If there was such a system I would love to be mentor, but last fall we moved to a new house, and my wife was in the hospital for a while. How would I tell the reviewer, I can't do it now or I'm back? How many times is that going to happen? The reviewer would have to keep adjusting the list daily. My reviewer covers almost all of the Northern Plains by herself. That's a big list. What if she is gone for a while? Another reviewer steps in, but they are half-way across the country. Now we need a central clearing house for the availability of the moderators. And that is just the first step, making and maintaining the list.

[BRTango]

The idea of a process-heavy reviewer/mentor system sounds like too much work for not enough benefit. What has been proposed so far seems to rely upon mystery people that don't exist and organizations that likely aren't able or willing to fund such an increased level of review, mentoring, certification, verification, etc.

 

I've seen other professional organizations that cater to both adults and children end up dissolving or fracturing when such rule-laden approaches have been put in place. (Odyssey of the Mind is one of them, for those that are familiar with that.)

 

All of that time, effort, and money would be better spent as other cachers have said - conducting geocaching clinics, running forums, setting up local assocations, etc.

 

Please, no mandatory mentoring requirements.

 

-eP

 

Ok... well, maybe my description of this was not written well. I in now way suggested a process-heavy system, nor one that requires any type of certification or verification, etc... and certainly not anything that would cost money, as much of geocaching is volunteer (reviewers, moderators, etc...).

 

Who is it that runs geocaching clinics, sets up local associations, etc... these aren't done by gc.com, and no money is given to them by gc.com (at least not that I'm aware of)... it's all volunteer. So money is not an issue.

 

I think some of you are reading way to deep between the lines as to what my suggestion was and are making it a much more complex beast than it needs to be. Dump the word mentor and change it to whatever you'd like. My suggestion is nothing more than having someone help with your first two hides.

 

In many ways this is already being done by the local assocaitions setting up clinics, classes, events, etc... this is merely taking it one additional step and having them assist the new cache hider and tell the reviewer that they did so.

 

The people do exist... we are the people... the organizations are already there and the ones that I have dealt with have plenty of people in them that would love to help out a newbie.

[+StarBrand]

No way in the world I would favor a mentor program as mandatory.

 

However, I system of "mentors" that one could seek out would be a very welcome thing to many new cachers. Even better if the mentor's were "trained" and endorsed by reviewers or GC itself.

[BRTango]

 

Nothing wrong with a little educaiton.

I can only agree with that point, but the system you came up with is way to complex.

 

In most cases I've seen lame cache hiders are lame lazy cachers. In the long run a regimented mentor system would be more work for the good cachers, and wouldn't change the underling problem of the lazy cacher anyway. Not unless it is very regulated, with testes and approval ratings, and the like. And that, my friend, would do more harm than good.

 

You want mentors? Try this.

 

Have list of locals willing to help posted on the website. Cachers with a decent number of finds/hides posted by there location. When you want/need help, you can go to the list.

 

I don't see it as a very regulated or regimented system with any more tests and approval ratings than are already in place during the review process.

 

It would take a lot more work than you think to put together and maintain the list at the reviewer's level. Then the hider would have to contact the reviewer. The review would assign the mentor. They would have to get together. Then the mentor would contact the review. Simple when were only talking about one cacher. Something much more when look at the whole nation.

 

Who's going to get this system going and maintain it? As it is things are almost too much at times. Just look at all the thread complaining about slow responses. Granted it's usually nothing but a case of someone with the panties in a wad, but still.

 

I really don't think it would be that much more complex once the lists have been made. The system is already in place nationally, and globally, so this is merely one more step and only for two cache hides per person.

If there was such a system I would love to be mentor, but last fall we moved to a new house, and my wife was in the hospital for a while. How would I tell the reviewer, I can't do it now or I'm back? How many times is that going to happen? The reviewer would have to keep adjusting the list daily. My reviewer covers almost all of the Northern Plains by herself. That's a big list. What if she is gone for a while? Another reviewer steps in, but they are half-way across the country. Now we need a central clearing house for the availability of the moderators. And that is just the first step, making and maintaining the list.

 

The list can be maintained at the local level and made available to any reviewer by any number of means.

 

Upon receipt of a cache submission from a newbie... the reviewer can fire off an email to the list and those that are available to assist can fire one back, and those that aren't available can refrain from doing so.

[+Snoogans]

I don't know if it's been mentioned yet, but THERE IS ALREADY A VOLUNTARY MENTORING SYSTEM IN PLACE.

 

 

Go to an event and suck-up to all the folks who's style of hide/container/cachin' method you like most. Duh.

 

 

I've been to at least 75 events in 5 states and I often learn something new, but those first dozen events were a wealth of information/education that formed the foundation of my unique cachin' style.

[BRTango]

No way in the world I would favor a mentor program as mandatory.

 

However, I system of "mentors" that one could seek out would be a very welcome thing to many new cachers. Even better if the mentor's were "trained" and endorsed by reviewers or GC itself.

 

Ok... I can support that... now how do we make sure new cachers are aware of the system and how it works?

[BRTango]

I don't know if it's been mentioned yet, but THERE IS ALREADY A VOLUNTARY MENTORING SYSTEM IN PLACE.

 

 

Go to an event and suck-up to all the folks who's style of hide/container/cachin' method you like most. Duh.

 

 

I've been to at least 75 events in 5 states and I often learn something new, but those first dozen events were a wealth of information/education that formed the foundation of my unique cachin' style.

 

Unfortunately, I've only been to one event. It seems that event organizors like to have them on the first weekend of the month... which, unless it falls on a holiday, I have to work the first weekend of every month.

 

However, I agree completely that events are a huge wealth of knowledge and rife with people willing to assist.

[+Totem Clan]

The idea of a process-heavy reviewer/mentor system sounds like too much work for not enough benefit. What has been proposed so far seems to rely upon mystery people that don't exist and organizations that likely aren't able or willing to fund such an increased level of review, mentoring, certification, verification, etc.

 

I've seen other professional organizations that cater to both adults and children end up dissolving or fracturing when such rule-laden approaches have been put in place. (Odyssey of the Mind is one of them, for those that are familiar with that.)

 

All of that time, effort, and money would be better spent as other cachers have said - conducting geocaching clinics, running forums, setting up local assocations, etc.

 

Please, no mandatory mentoring requirements.

 

-eP

 

Ok... well, maybe my description of this was not written well. I in now way suggested a process-heavy system, nor one that requires any type of certification or verification, etc... and certainly not anything that would cost money, as much of geocaching is volunteer (reviewers, moderators, etc...).

 

Who is it that runs geocaching clinics, sets up local associations, etc... these aren't done by gc.com, and no money is given to them by gc.com (at least not that I'm aware of)... it's all volunteer. So money is not an issue.

 

I think some of you are reading way to deep between the lines as to what my suggestion was and are making it a much more complex beast than it needs to be. Dump the word mentor and change it to whatever you'd like. My suggestion is nothing more than having someone help with your first two hides.

 

In many ways this is already being done by the local assocaitions setting up clinics, classes, events, etc... this is merely taking it one additional step and having them assist the new cache hider and tell the reviewer that they did so.

 

The people do exist... we are the people... the organizations are already there and the ones that I have dealt with have plenty of people in them that would love to help out a newbie.

Yes but that is already being done. I'm forming a class for this spring.

 

Making it a mandtory system that must be wacthed over only adds to the process and burden.

[+Totem Clan]

No way in the world I would favor a mentor program as mandatory.

 

However, I system of "mentors" that one could seek out would be a very welcome thing to many new cachers. Even better if the mentor's were "trained" and endorsed by reviewers or GC itself.

And that's as far as I think it should ever go. I would even volunteer for that

[BRTango]

 

Yes but that is already being done. I'm forming a class for this spring.

 

Making it a mandtory system that must be wacthed over only adds to the process and burden.

 

That's great and I'm sure it's being done by many local organizatoins which is great. And maybe that's all that's needed. I doubt this statistic would be possible to put together, but I'd be curious to know how many new cachers attend these events/classes prior to placing thier first cache.

[+Renegade Knight]

The folks I mentored were dragged into geocaching kicking and screaming. They have since calmed down and passed me up in finds.

 

Mentors are available, the newbies just have to ask. Personally as a newbie I'd be scared stiff of any mentor that volunteered for the position.

[BRTango]

The folks I mentored were dragged into geocaching kicking and screaming. They have since calmed down and passed me up in finds.

 

Mentors are available, the newbies just have to ask. Personally as a newbie I'd be scared stiff of any mentor that volunteered for the position.

 

Maybe it was just me... but as a newbie, I didn't know who to ask, how to ask, or even what to ask.

[+Totem Clan]

 

Nothing wrong with a little educaiton.

I can only agree with that point, but the system you came up with is way to complex.

 

In most cases I've seen lame cache hiders are lame lazy cachers. In the long run a regimented mentor system would be more work for the good cachers, and wouldn't change the underling problem of the lazy cacher anyway. Not unless it is very regulated, with testes and approval ratings, and the like. And that, my friend, would do more harm than good.

 

You want mentors? Try this.

 

Have list of locals willing to help posted on the website. Cachers with a decent number of finds/hides posted by there location. When you want/need help, you can go to the list.

 

I don't see it as a very regulated or regimented system with any more tests and approval ratings than are already in place during the review process.

 

It would take a lot more work than you think to put together and maintain the list at the reviewer's level. Then the hider would have to contact the reviewer. The review would assign the mentor. They would have to get together. Then the mentor would contact the review. Simple when were only talking about one cacher. Something much more when look at the whole nation.

 

Who's going to get this system going and maintain it? As it is things are almost too much at times. Just look at all the thread complaining about slow responses. Granted it's usually nothing but a case of someone with the panties in a wad, but still.

 

I really don't think it would be that much more complex once the lists have been made. The system is already in place nationally, and globally, so this is merely one more step and only for two cache hides per person.

If there was such a system I would love to be mentor, but last fall we moved to a new house, and my wife was in the hospital for a while. How would I tell the reviewer, I can't do it now or I'm back? How many times is that going to happen? The reviewer would have to keep adjusting the list daily. My reviewer covers almost all of the Northern Plains by herself. That's a big list. What if she is gone for a while? Another reviewer steps in, but they are half-way across the country. Now we need a central clearing house for the availability of the moderators. And that is just the first step, making and maintaining the list.

 

The list can be maintained at the local level and made available to any reviewer by any number of means.

 

Upon receipt of a cache submission from a newbie... the reviewer can fire off an email to the list and those that are available to assist can fire one back, and those that aren't available can refrain from doing so.

So now who is going to maintain it at the local level? There is no organization here. And I'm the only one for miles that would want to do it.

 

What happens when I can't, like last fall? Now what will the reviewer, who has no idea what's happening on the ground here, going to do?

[Pto]

. . . . I doubt this statistic would be possible to put together, but I'd be curious to know how many new cachers attend these events/classes prior to placing thier first cache.

 

Boy, that would be a great number to know! When I think of people taking a class or getting mentoring or help from someone to learn "wandering in the woods" I just giggle.....

 

Sounds like a great Idea, but I cant see it working. What if someone in your local area signed up and became one- then just taught people how to place bad caches? Oh wait, my idea of a bad cache isnt the same as everyone elses......

 

so would there be a breakdown in the mentors, among things like "micro hider" and "ammo can man" and

LPM'er, etc?