Thank Goodness it Wasn't A GeoCache!

[+Confucius' Cat]

A park could very well be a terrorist target, depending on the aim of the terrorists, how many people use the park, and/or what activities (such as parades or sports events) are scheduled to be held there. I believe you're forgetting - or are unaware - that the term refers to creating terror and confusion by killing civilians, not necessarily to damaging public structures/property, causing major disruption, or killing huge numbers of people.

 

see: Terrorism

While this whole Boston thing is an absolute farce, it is correct that parks as well as anything, any time, anywhere COULD be a terrorist target.

 

This is what makes OUR suspicious (caching) activities so vulnerable to public scrutiny.

 

Frankly, I doubt that the "terrorists" are really very serious (so far) because they could so easily wreak absolute havoc with such simple things as a few firecrackers in public places or random shootings (similar to the DC sniper incidents) which could occur in lonely parks as easily as in high traffic areas..

 

Then again, by simply sitting back and doing nothing, they can watch our great democracy implode from everybody's over-reaction to the little nothings that take place day after day. The more press these incidents get, the more fear they produce, the more the terrorists sit back and laugh at how effective they are by simply doing NOTHING.

[+Confucius' Cat]

Yet another hidden item promotional campaign has upset Boston officials. This one involved a hunt for a coin hidden in the historic Granary Burying Ground.

 

Link

A little off topic perhaps, but i agree with Boston on this one.

 

Sending an unlimited number of people potentially crowding into a cemetery vying to be FTF on a $10,000 prize has a LOT of potential for damage to the cemetery as well as the possibility of a riot.

 

A quest for a $10,000 prize published to the general public is a LOT more potentially destructive than a film can with a slip of paper in it sought by a few wacko geocachers.

[+Confucius' Cat]

double post deleted

Edited February 24, 2007 by Confucius' Cat

[CoyoteRed]

A park could very well be a terrorist target, depending on the aim of the terrorists, how many people use the park, and/or what activities (such as parades or sports events) are scheduled to be held there. I believe you're forgetting - or are unaware - that the term refers to creating terror and confusion by killing civilians, not necessarily to damaging public structures/property, causing major disruption, or killing huge numbers of people.

 

THE major player in terrorism is the media. I was recently reading on the growth of "kitchen sink bombs"--bombs make from ingredients found under the typical kitchen sink. A good number of incidences of terrorism, both foreign and domestic, involve these types of bombs. Yet, what we hear from the media is "dirty-bombs" and fertilizer bombs. We see steps taken at the airports to find bombs based on the same or similar ingredients as gun power. We don't hear that the "kitchen sink bombs"--sometimes referred to as TATP or HMTD--are incredibly hard to detect. Remember the prohibition of liquids on airplanes? That's because they got wind of a possible attack using these types of bombs.

 

Liquids are again being allowed on planes. Do feel any safer now that you know that they are letting potential bombs on board while confiscating P-38's?

 

I was kind of surprised at the number of domestic terrorism cases involving the same explosives used by the "Shoe Bomber" Richard Reid. It's easy to make from materials found at Wal-mart. Yet, we're not hearing anything about reporting unusually high purchases of hydrogen peroxide or paint thinner.

 

While I don't think the government and the media are in cahoots this fear mongering benefits them both. One gets to sell more advertising while the other gets to keep its population in fear and minds off more pressing, more important, yet harder to fix, issues.

[+sbell111]

I thought this thread was about Lite Brites.

[CoyoteRed]

I thought this thread was about Lite Brites.

 

It has nothing to do with Lite Brites. It's about bomb scares, geocaching, terrorism, and the possibility of the general population confusing geocaching activities with those of a terrorist. My post was about the media over sensitizing the populace into thinking everything is related to Islamic radical terrorism.

 

In the Boston fiasco, the terrorist angle was hyped while the actual reactions of the "every man" was downplayed. It's actually heartening to see folks are getting really tired of it.

[+sbell111]

I certainly am getting tired of something.

[CoyoteRed]

I certainly am getting tired of something.

 

Here ya go.

 

Glad to have been some assistance.

[JASTA 11]

I can't believe some of the people out there. Just a prank, a marketing stunt? What most of the people don't realize is that when these 'things' were first reported, there was a bomb threat at a local hospital, with a suspect telling a security guard 'Today will be a very bad day'. In addition, there were reports from another city of toxic fumes in a subway. So what are the emergency management agencies to think? I'd rather have them err on the side of caution. What would all the bleeding hearts have to say if something had happened? Turner is to blame as well as the two imbeciles who placed them. Someone earlier wrote that they aren't surprised since we're the same ones who keep re-electing Ted Kennedy. They're right, I can't argue that. Teddy couldn't care less about bombs in Boston, he's bombed in Boston more often than not.

[+Confucius' Cat]

I can't believe some of the people out there. Just a prank, a marketing stunt? What most of the people don't realize is that when these 'things' were first reported, there was a bomb threat at a local hospital, with a suspect telling a security guard 'Today will be a very bad day'. In addition, there were reports from another city of toxic fumes in a subway. So what are the emergency management agencies to think? I'd rather have them err on the side of caution. What would all the bleeding hearts have to say if something had happened? Turner is to blame as well as the two imbeciles who placed them. Someone earlier wrote that they aren't surprised since we're the same ones who keep re-electing Ted Kennedy. They're right, I can't argue that. Teddy couldn't care less about bombs in Boston, he's bombed in Boston more often than not.

So what you're saying is, basically is, whenever some idiot calls in a bomb threat on a hospital, petty crimes like vandalism, littering and trespass become SUPER FELONIES for an indeterminate number of miles around?

 

i really don't see the logic behind an unsubstantiated (no doubt anonymous) complaint changing the response to an incident that no one has any reason to believe is related.

 

I'm sure we will all see how this plays out, but my bet is there will be a LARGE settlement paid by the city of Boston to the "artists" involved and the case will disappear very quietly.

 

If it doesn't, we have a MUCH bigger problem to contend with: our constitution can be nullified by any darn fool yelling "bomb!"

[+Confucius' Cat]

I thought this thread was about Lite Brites.

 

It has nothing to do with Lite Brites. It's about bomb scares, geocaching, terrorism, and the possibility of the general population confusing geocaching activities with those of a terrorist. My post was about the media over sensitizing the populace into thinking everything is related to Islamic radical terrorism.

 

In the Boston fiasco, the terrorist angle was hyped while the actual reactions of the "every man" was downplayed. It's actually heartening to see folks are getting really tired of it.

 

I kinda wondered about the lite-brite thing from the beginning. The pix i have seen aren't clear, but I was assuming that the boxes in question were standard kid's toys. The link you provided does not show any that look like the pix i have seen.

 

It just makes the whole fiasco even more fiascoish to think that these were "devices" that could be purchased at Wally-world.

 

How paranoid are we that we see a kid's toy in an unusual place and panic to the tune of a million bucks?

 

Actually, I think the terrorists are winning... without even getting out of bed.

[JASTA 11]

[so what you're saying is, basically is, whenever some idiot calls in a bomb threat on a hospital, petty crimes like vandalism, littering and trespass become SUPER FELONIES for an indeterminate number of miles around?

 

i really don't see the logic behind an unsubstantiated (no doubt anonymous) complaint changing the response to an incident that no one has any reason to believe is related.]

 

Now, now. It's not polite to put words into other peoples mouths there kitty cat! The man ran out of the building, told the guard "Today will be a very bad day". Minutes later, a package was discovered. It had wires and all the trappings of a pipe-bomb. Soon after, the reports of the very classy middle finger-pointing 'Lite-Brites' started coming in. The suspect from the pipe bomb has been arrested and arraigned. So much for anonymity. How would you expect the police to react in this day and age? If they blew all this off and something did happen, I'd bet you'd be amongst the first to call the talk shows, or blog, crying about why the government didn't do more. I hate big government as much as anybody, but for once, I'm glad they responded like they did. Even if it's for some dumb stunt a big corportation paid a couple of losers . What do those two care anyway? It's not like they pay taxes.

Edited February 25, 2007 by JASTA 11

[Clan Riffster]

How would you expect the police to react in this day and age?

I would expect them to act like professionals. Investigate and act accordingly. That's where they failed. Had they tasked just one, experienced IED tech with evaluating the light bright thingy, they could've avoided costing the city of Boston bunches of money.

[+Renegade Knight]

How would you expect the police to react in this day and age?

I would expect them to act like professionals. Investigate and act accordingly. That's where they failed. Had they tasked just one, experienced IED tech with evaluating the light bright thingy, they could've avoided costing the city of Boston bunches of money.

 

Exactly.

 

There is a balance to be maintained.

 

If those in authority react to every bomb threat like they did in Boston then you no longer need a bomb to cause mass distruption. You just need light brights. If they don't respond to light brights at some level (Like Seattle?) then eventually someone will make a bomb that will be ignored because it looks like a light bright.

 

The balance is a fine line.

[+Confucius' Cat]

[so what you're saying is, basically is, whenever some idiot calls in a bomb threat on a hospital, petty crimes like vandalism, littering and trespass become SUPER FELONIES for an indeterminate number of miles around?

 

i really don't see the logic behind an unsubstantiated (no doubt anonymous) complaint changing the response to an incident that no one has any reason to believe is related.]

 

Now, now. It's not polite to put words into other peoples mouths there kitty cat! The man ran out of the building, told the guard "Today will be a very bad day". Minutes later, a package was discovered. It had wires and all the trappings of a pipe-bomb. Soon after, the reports of the very classy middle finger-pointing 'Lite-Brites' started coming in. The suspect from the pipe bomb has been arrested and arraigned. So much for anonymity. How would you expect the police to react in this day and age? If they blew all this off and something did happen, I'd bet you'd be amongst the first to call the talk shows, or blog, crying about why the government didn't do more. I hate big government as much as anybody, but for once, I'm glad they responded like they did. Even if it's for some dumb stunt a big corportation paid a couple of losers . What do those two care anyway? It's not like they pay taxes.

This is kind of like listening to Dr. Laura's callers...

The wife makes a big point about what a jerk her husband is because he comes in late from work and Dr. laura banters back and forth with her about how she is over-reacting. Finally, as she is about to end the call, the wife throws in, "OBTW the last three times he has been late I have followed him to Susie's house and watched through the window while they had sex."

 

If you give all the details in the first place, kitty won't have to assume the details you left out.

 

But then saving the "big bomb-shell" to trump the argument is part of the game I guess.

 

Boston still over-reacted. The two incidents have no obvious relationship to each other... unless you have "the rest of the story" to trump that too.

[+Confucius' Cat]

How would you expect the police to react in this day and age?

I would expect them to act like professionals. Investigate and act accordingly. That's where they failed. Had they tasked just one, experienced IED tech with evaluating the light bright thingy, they could've avoided costing the city of Boston bunches of money.

 

Exactly.

 

There is a balance to be maintained.

 

If those in authority react to every bomb threat like they did in Boston then you no longer need a bomb to cause mass distruption. You just need light brights. If they don't respond to light brights at some level (Like Seattle?) then eventually someone will make a bomb that will be ignored because it looks like a light bright.

 

The balance is a fine line.

And also a darn tough line to draw.

 

Could you imagine the havoc of one phone call claiming a bomb is in a really common, public item? I sometimes wonder why the people who wish to disrupt don't more often "go for the gusto?"

 

Anything could be used to conceal a bomb. If we look at our world as if every misplaced kid's toy, every highway cone, every lamppost, or any number of other everyday objects are deadly, we have no life left.

 

We cannot allow simple rumors and threats to control our lives and our responses. We must evaluate every threat and every case on its own merits and deal with each one in accordance to our laws and our constitution if we are going to continue to live as a free people.

 

Most of all, it is absolutely IMPERATIVE that we do not trash our constitution and our personal freedoms in the interest of "safety and security". If we do, as our forefathers said, we deserve neither.

 

IMHO the Boston response did just that. unfortunately it is not the only incidence of throwing out freedom for a FEELING of security, nor no doubt will it be the last.

[+gh patriot]

a ryder moving truck doesn't look like a bomb.

[+Cardinal Red]

And now we can add Seattle to the list.

 

Toy thought to be bomb closes ferry dock

[BRTango]

Easter Bomb Hunt

[Team Misguided]

And now we can add Seattle to the list.

 

Toy thought to be bomb closes ferry dock

 

First thing I did when I saw that on the news last night was check the DB for caches nearby. We breathed a sigh of relief when the nearest one was .2 of a mile away.

[+Renegade Knight]

....THE major player in terrorism is the media....

 

There is a lot of truth in that. Without the media terrorism has no real audience and no real purpose.

[+Confucius' Cat]

Easter Bomb Hunt

And these people can get away with making and displaying "hoax devices", how? This "protest" would be a great opportunity for a terrorist group to do a serious dirty deed indeed with so many fake devices with which to hide a few REAL ones.

 

Who comes up with these stupid ideas anyway?

[CacheNCarryMA]

Boston Globe article

 

By Brian R. Ballou and Andrew Ryan, Globe Staff

 

Two men apologized in court today as prosecutors dropped criminal charges against them for carrying out a guerrilla marketing campaign in January that triggered a wave of bomb scares.

 

As a part of a plea deal, Peter Berdovsky and Sean Stevens performed community service at Spaulding Rehabilitation Hospital, where they designed a mural and helped with maintenance on the facility's sailing docks on the Charles River. After Berdovsky worked for 80 hours and Stevens for 60 hours, prosecutors agreed not to pursue charges that could have carried a sentence of up to five years in prison.

 

"Based upon the defendants' apologies and acceptance of responsibility for their actions in January and the attendant consequences, as well as the positive and substantial efforts at restorative justice made by both men through their community service, we believe that this was the most appropriate resolution to this case," Attorney General Martha Coakley said today in a statement.

 

In Charlestown Municipal Court this morning, both men read short statements, which can be found here and here.

 

"I deeply regret that this incident caused such anguish and disruption for so many people," Berdovsky said.

 

Stevens added: "I would not have placed the signs ... had I not believed that my employer had done what was needed to make it fully legal."

 

"In the end," Stevens concluded, "I simply felt this was an opportunity to provide harmless enjoyment to many people while earning a small amount of money to create my own art to share with communities I'm a part of."

 

Berdovsky, 27, and Stevens, 28, appeared calm and contrite, a stark change from their first appearance in February, when the two men mocked the media with a performance-art skit about the evolution of haircuts.

 

They told investigators they were to be paid $300 each to install battery powered light boards in 40 high visibility spots in and around Boston, such as buildings and bridges, as part of an advertising campaign for "Aqua Teen Hunger Force," an animated program on Cartoon Network. The blinking lights triggered regionwide bomb scares on Jan. 31.

 

The men had been charged with placing a hoax device in a way that causes panic, which carried a maximum of five years imprisonment, and a misdemeanor count of disorderly conduct.

 

Berdovsky and Stevens were hired by Interference Inc., a New York marketing company retained by Turner Broadcasting System, which owns the Cartoon Network. The companies apologized for the stunt and paid $2 million in restitution to local governments and law enforcement agencies.

 

During the fallout in February, Jim Samples resigned as general manager of the Cartoon Network. He had approved the botched marketing campaign.

 

"Today's hearing in Charlestown hopefully marks the conclusion of the fallout from Cartoon Network’s guerrilla marketing campaign," Mayor Thomas M. Menino said in a statement. "I hope the message goes out to all guerrilla marketers who plan on doing business in Boston that we take the public safety of those who live and work here very seriously."

 

Posted by the Boston Globe City & Region Desk at 02:30 PM

[+Renegade Knight]

Boston ...

Two men apologized in court today as prosecutors dropped criminal charges against them for carrying out a guerrilla marketing campaign in January that triggered a wave of bomb scares.....

 

Thanks for the follow up. It's worth noting (not that it matters) that the bomb scares were triggered by the responce. Not the items. Other cities had the same marketing tactic and no scare.