Guidelines for caches near schools

[HAFLAF]

With all the recent news about pedophiles and shooters causing trouble in schools, I wonder if our cache guidelines shouldn't be strengthened to make sure no caches are placed within sight of school property. There are references to this in the current guidelines, but the wording is not particularly clear or forceful. I know there are caches in my area which are close to school property, some even suggesting to park on school grounds. We dont ever want to be caught up in the reaction to unauthorized visitors which is sure to come. Let's police ourselves before they clamp down and give us a bad name.

[+briansnat]

I think the current guidelines are quite clear on caches on school property. There is some flexibility which makes sense to me.

 

You say "within sight of school property", which could rule out a cache that is 1/2 mile away in an open, treeless area but allow one that is 1/2 block away in a city. And what about public parks close to school property? If the public is allowed there, I see no reason not to allow caches there as well.

[+GreyingJay]

I'd rather say use common sense than force a set of all-encompassing rules onto people, especially since the rules for geocache placement apply worldwide. Even within the United States you range from the one-room schoolhouse (which has of course been the unfortunate subject of media attention lately) to large fenced-in compounds with locked gates and metal detectors (which, frankly, remind me much more of another kind of institution...).

 

Surely somewhere in rural Nowhereland it would be perfectly fine to place a cache near a school. I'd hate to restrict that opportunity simply due to a few unfortunate high-profile incidents.

[+sacred6]

I'd rather say use common sense than force a set of all-encompassing rules onto people, especially since the rules for geocache placement apply worldwide. Even within the United States you range from the one-room schoolhouse (which has of course been the unfortunate subject of media attention lately) to large fenced-in compounds with locked gates and metal detectors (which, frankly, remind me much more of another kind of institution...).

 

Surely somewhere in rural Nowhereland it would be perfectly fine to place a cache near a school. I'd hate to restrict that opportunity simply due to a few unfortunate high-profile incidents.

It would probebly be best to keep away. Not just because of property, but the kids. (i'm 13 so this doesn't apply to me). Kids may not no its a cache and may muggle them. I've seen it before.

[+cimawr]

I'd rather say use common sense than force a set of all-encompassing rules onto people, especially since the rules for geocache placement apply worldwide.

<snip>

Surely somewhere in rural Nowhereland it would be perfectly fine to place a cache near a school. I'd hate to restrict that opportunity simply due to a few unfortunate high-profile incidents.

 

I did two caches last weekend that are "within sight of a school", and in fact parked in the elementary school parking lot to access them. The school's in a fairly rural area, the parking lot is large, and neither cache is anywhere near the playgrounds, nor are they actually on school grounds. The day I was there, there were local teens practicing driving, and a couple of local families allowing their kids to play on the playgrounds.

Even if I'd arrived during school hours, I could have parked at the lower end of the lot to access both the cache in the field across the street, and the one in the woods at the upper end of the park which abuts the school.

Now, in a more suburban setting, where there's security and suspicion, those caches might be less appropriate. As it is, I have no problem with them, nor has there ever BEEN a problem - and the cache by the playing fields has been there since Dec. of 2002.

[+sbell111]

I'm not a big fan of rules changes being made out of fear.

 

If a cache is placed near a school, I'll make the decision as to whether I will hunt it and when. The reviewers need not worry as to whether some LEO wants to ask me what I'm doing.

 

That being said, I think the reviewers currently deny caches that are 'near' a school. I don't know if there are distance measures, or if they merely consider the school and any area across the street from it verboten.

[+Bad_CRC]

with all the stories of people being stopped or questioned by police, you'd think there would be some tighter restrictions on cache placement.

 

I know I was at a cache that was placed right next to a park playground yesterday. Not a good location to be walking around acting suspicious. Fortunately the park was completely empty.

[+sbell111]

with all the stories of people being stopped or questioned by police, you'd think there would be some tighter restrictions on cache placement....

Why? If a LEO want's to ask me what I'm doing, I'll tell him. Geocaching is not illegal.

[+The Leprechauns]

I'm not a big fan of rules changes being made out of fear.

 

If a cache is placed near a school, I'll make the decision as to whether I will hunt it and when. The reviewers need not worry as to whether some LEO wants to ask me what I'm doing.

 

That being said, I think the reviewers currently deny caches that are 'near' a school. I don't know if there are distance measures, or if they merely consider the school and any area across the street from it verboten.

The "no caches at or near elementary and secondary schools" wording was added to the listing guidelines in February 2005. I think that it has worked quite well.

 

There are lots of school caches placed prior to the date of the guideline change. These are grandfathered. Unfortunately they may mislead other geocachers into thinking that it's OK for them to hide a cache at the school playground, too.

 

There are school caches placed since the date of the guideline change. One group are those which have very clear evidence of permission by the school administrators (most typically, for a class project on geocaching). That is a good thing. Another group are caches that "slipped through the cracks" during the review process, because not all schools are shown and identified as schools on the online maps available to the reviewers. That is a bad thing, and problems should be brought to the reviewers' attention by the community.

 

The "near" language is left vague by design. A cache 200 feet away from a school fence in an urban area, with two big buildings in between the school and the little memorial park where the cache is hidden, may be just fine. A cache 400 feet from the school building, where searching geocachers can be viewed by school staff from their windows looking across the open athletic fields, often proves to be problematic. Reviewers work with cache owners on a case by case basis to decide what makes sense for a specific area that is "near" school property.

[+cimawr]

 

I know I was at a cache that was placed right next to a park playground yesterday. Not a good location to be walking around acting suspicious. Fortunately the park was completely empty.

 

 

Any and every member of the public has the right to be near a playground which is part of a public park. Whether or not your actions will be seen as suspicious will depend on the time you choose to go there, and whether you adjust your actions to the circumstances.

 

Admittedly, being a just-under 5' 40-something female who caches with dogs, I'm less likely to be seen as "suspicious" than, for example, my caching S.O. who's 6', over 200 lbs, and has long hair, but I still have sense enough to adjust my actions if I get to a cache spot and find a playground full of kids nearby.

Of course, it ALSO helps if the cache hider discloses on the cache page that there may be such nearby activity; then, I can choose to go there at a time when there are less likely to be kids.

 

As a side note, my S.O. caches WITH his kids, and pre-visits urban caches before taking them there if he has any doubts as to the suitability of the location.

[+gpsblake]

There should a owners note on the geocache site if it is near a school warning that hunting for the cache during school hours is strongly discouraged.

 

Tihs Cache for example has a disclaimer asking people to only find it after 3pm or on weekends. This one is at a public park next to a school.

[+Hula Bum]

We have several caches in parks and I see no problems with them, people either take their kids with them to do them or do them during off hours. These have been some of the most fun because we've gotten to go to the park and play with our daughter at the same time.

I can see if you don't have children this being tougher, but you can always borrow a kid, go early, or just skip it.

[+flask]

we have a cache on our school property and one IN the building. they both (of course) have administrative approval and are getting along just fine.

Edited October 9, 2006 by flask

[+TheAlabamaRambler]

I wonder if the issue appears different to parents and non, and in different places around the country.

 

Being a father, active in school events, and used to being around kids, caches on playgrounds seem normal to me.

 

Playgrounds are for playing games and are a common gathering area for folks in my area.

 

It is not at all unusual to find an adult couple on the swings or walking around the Elementary school that's 300' from my house.

 

My wife walks the track around the playground daily, and my 17 y.o. son plays ball with his friends there.

 

So, I don't feel out of place at a school, and don't think I will be seen as a threat (though I once was perceived that way on a cache hunt near a school, and had to explain myself to lots of het-up police).

 

I do advocate doing caches near schools in off hours; for any number of reasons you shouldn't be on school grounds without permission during school hours.

 

I wonder if much of this angst isn't due to non-parents being uncomfortable around kids and schools?

 

Regardless, people think and act very differently around the country, and the flexibility built into the guidelines accomodates that.

 

What's perfectly normal in Irondale Alabama may well be totally unacceptable in New York City.

 

We rely on our Reviewers to be aware of such cultural differences, but really it's up to the cacher - if it feels uncomfortable to you, don't do it.

 

Sorta like going to the doctor and saying "Doc, it hurts when I do THIS" and he tells you "So don't do that!"

 

Ed

[+Team GPSaxophone]

We rely on our Reviewers to be aware of such cultural differences, but really it's up to the cacher - if it feels uncomfortable to you, don't do it.

This is probably the best advice.

 

Really, if you pull up to a cache site and there is a police officer apprehending a suspect, do you really need a new guideline for "Don't hunt for this cache if some criminal is being arrested..."?

 

You might not be doing anything wrong, but the circumstances aren't quite right for you to be hunting a cache at that time, either.

Edited October 9, 2006 by Team GPSaxophone

[+flask]

we have a cache on our school property and one IN the building. they both (of course) have administrative approval and are getting along just fine.

 

update:

 

we have a new librarian. yesterday she went ballistic on our principal about the cache in the library, even though the previous librarian not only gave permission, but she gave it a library jacket, library label, and a place in the catalog.

 

within an hour of its archival, i got an offer from another library to house it.

 

the one outside on school grounds is still just fine; next week the third grade classes are going to do a geocaching lesson.