Is there a good reason to submit finds to NGS?

[+Geospatial Exploration Team]

I am not a professional surveyor, but I do have a background in GIS technology and I am pretty good at finding the benchmarks that no one from my area has logged with geocaching yet. Still it is just a hobby and I am torn as to whether there is any merit in submitting the finds to NGS. Does it benefit the NGS to recieve these submissions?

Edited September 23, 2006 by Geospatial Exploration Team

[+PFF]

Users of the NGS database benefit from updated information. Prior to the interest taken by participants of GEOCACHING.COM, the majority of updates came from the US POWER SQUADRON, with a small number of updates from state agencies and local surveyors. Many of the stations had not been recovered in several decades.

 

Reports from GEOCAC (our reporting symbol with NGS) have a well-earned reputation for accuracy and completeness. For the most part, reports are not submitted unless the recovery (or non-recovery) is definite. Current conditions, such as widened roads, missing reference points, etc., are included when the observer makes his/her report. This increases the value of the submission. Further value comes from our tradition of taking photographs and posting them for peer review. Our members are willing to assist with evaluations and suggested wording, as well as passing along proven techniques and equipment recommendations.

 

The reports from GEOCAC have steadily increased over the past few years, and last year we hit two significant milestones. First, we recovered more marks in 2005 than our group submitted in the previous four years, combined. And, we became the organization with the largest number of recovery reports, by a wide margin.

 

NGS consistently tells us that our reports are very welcome, and that the agency appreciates what we do. We feel we are doing a great job, and the confirmation from NGS is "icing on the cake". Is there a good reason to submit finds to NGS? Most certainly!

 

This is not something to be undertaken during one's first few months in the hobby, but it is a great goal to work toward. Spend time getting familiar with the rather unusual sentence structure in NGS data sheets.

 

Learn all you can about the terms used by the professionals--especially regarding the "condition" of a mark. Then, submit reports where you feel very confident about the accuracy of your recovery; i.e., you got a positive identification via the marking on the disk.

 

Compile your reports in a program such as WORD, where you can check spelling, and where you can read it several times over 24 hours. Then, copy/paste text into the NGS entry form. This helps you avoid typos or omissions. (Write me and I'll send you a sample document.)

 

Shortly after the first of each month, you will see your reports in the NGS database, and you will notice your initials on the "Statistics" report compiled by Holograph. There are no plaques or prizes, but you get the satisfaction of knowing that your hobby activities have made a worthwhile contribution to the users of the NGS database!

 

-Paul-

Edited September 24, 2006 by PFF

[+Geospatial Exploration Team]

I have found several disks that had previously been reported as not found by US Power Squadron in the 1980's and I have also found one Disk (NB0600) that was reported by US Power Squadron in August 2006 as destroyed. I have felt that these finds probabally should be reported to NGS, but was still a little hesitant to do so. I believe now more than ever that these recoveries should be submitted to the NGS. Thank You!

[+Black Dog Trackers]

Geospatial Exploration Team -

 

Some of us have had the pleasure of meeting with Dave Doyle, Casey Brennan, and Steve Randall of the National Geodetic Survey and I can assure you that they are very appreciative of our recovery submissions, our forum here, our interest in learning, and our attention to detail.

[+Ernmark]

The main reason I started submitting recoveries to the NGS is that feels like you're actually doing something worthwhile, in addition to 'just playing a game' - especially after you've found a few hundred & have to invest a little more time & gas to enjoy your hobby...

[caseyb]

Its been a long time since I have had a momment to check these forums, but better late than never.

 

I just wanted to officially say that YES, we here at NGS do greatly appreciate good recovery information! Here is a letter from the (now former) Director of the National Geodetic Survey to Jeremy, who own goecaching.com:

http://forums.Groundspeak.com/GC/index.php?showtopic=90539

 

If you found a mark that was listed as destroyed, by all means send it in!

 

-Casey-

Edited October 20, 2006 by caseyb

[+gpsblake]

I've recently started reporting some BM finds to the NGS. If the BM hasn't been found for many years or something in the description has been changed, I submit the information. The one I logged today hadn't been noted since 1993. If the BM was found previously like in 2004 or 2005, I don't bother with a report.

 

However, the best ones are when you find a BM that the USGS or other professional Geodetic survey crew couldn't find. If I find a BM that has only scaled coordinates, I've been sending in the GPS data also in my reports if they are far off.

[+BuckBrooke]

gpsblake,

Contact holograph to get your initials put on the list of benchmarkers that he tracks on his website.

[+nickrhds]

Users of the NGS database benefit from updated information. Prior to the interest taken by participants of GEOCACHING.COM, the majority of updates came from the US POWER SQUADRON, with a small number of updates from state agencies and local surveyors. Many of the stations had not been recovered in several decades.

 

Reports from GEOCAC (our reporting symbol with NGS) have a well-earned reputation for accuracy and completeness. For the most part, reports are not submitted unless the recovery (or non-recovery) is definite. Current conditions, such as widened roads, missing reference points, etc., are included when the observer makes his/her report. This increases the value of the submission. Further value comes from our tradition of taking photographs and posting them for peer review. Our members are willing to assist with evaluations and suggested wording, as well as passing along proven techniques and equipment recommendations.

 

The reports from GEOCAC have steadily increased over the past few years, and last year we hit two significant milestones. First, we recovered more marks in 2005 than our group submitted in the previous four years, combined. And, we became the organization with the largest number of recovery reports, by a wide margin.

 

NGS consistently tells us that our reports are very welcome, and that the agency appreciates what we do. We feel we are doing a great job, and the confirmation from NGS is "icing on the cake". Is there a good reason to submit finds to NGS? Most certainly!

 

This is not something to be undertaken during one's first few months in the hobby, but it is a great goal to work toward. Spend time getting familiar with the rather unusual sentence structure in NGS data sheets.

 

Learn all you can about the terms used by the professionals--especially regarding the "condition" of a mark. Then, submit reports where you feel very confident about the accuracy of your recovery; i.e., you got a positive identification via the marking on the disk.

 

Compile your reports in a program such as WORD, where you can check spelling, and where you can read it several times over 24 hours. Then, copy/paste text into the NGS entry form. This helps you avoid typos or omissions. (Write me and I'll send you a sample document.)

 

Shortly after the first of each month, you will see your reports in the NGS database, and you will notice your initials on the "Statistics" report compiled by Holograph. There are no plaques or prizes, but you get the satisfaction of knowing that your hobby activities have made a worthwhile contribution to the users of the NGS database!

 

-Paul-

[+nickrhds]

Users of the NGS database benefit from updated information. Prior to the interest taken by participants of GEOCACHING.COM, the majority of updates came from the US POWER SQUADRON, with a small number of updates from state agencies and local surveyors. Many of the stations had not been recovered in several decades.

 

Reports from GEOCAC (our reporting symbol with NGS) have a well-earned reputation for accuracy and completeness. For the most part, reports are not submitted unless the recovery (or non-recovery) is definite. Current conditions, such as widened roads, missing reference points, etc., are included when the observer makes his/her report. This increases the value of the submission. Further value comes from our tradition of taking photographs and posting them for peer review. Our members are willing to assist with evaluations and suggested wording, as well as passing along proven techniques and equipment recommendations.

 

The reports from GEOCAC have steadily increased over the past few years, and last year we hit two significant milestones. First, we recovered more marks in 2005 than our group submitted in the previous four years, combined. And, we became the organization with the largest number of recovery reports, by a wide margin.

 

NGS consistently tells us that our reports are very welcome, and that the agency appreciates what we do. We feel we are doing a great job, and the confirmation from NGS is "icing on the cake". Is there a good reason to submit finds to NGS? Most certainly!

 

This is not something to be undertaken during one's first few months in the hobby, but it is a great goal to work toward. Spend time getting familiar with the rather unusual sentence structure in NGS data sheets.

 

Learn all you can about the terms used by the professionals--especially regarding the "condition" of a mark. Then, submit reports where you feel very confident about the accuracy of your recovery; i.e., you got a positive identification via the marking on the disk.

 

Compile your reports in a program such as WORD, where you can check spelling, and where you can read it several times over 24 hours. Then, copy/paste text into the NGS entry form. This helps you avoid typos or omissions. (Write me and I'll send you a sample document.)

 

Shortly after the first of each month, you will see your reports in the NGS database, and you will notice your initials on the "Statistics" report compiled by Holograph. There are no plaques or prizes, but you get the satisfaction of knowing that your hobby activities have made a worthwhile contribution to the users of the NGS database!

 

-Paul-

[+nickrhds]

Paul,

Yes, I would like a (Write me and I'll send you a sample document.).

Thanks,

Nickrhds (rwro@yahoo.com)

[+nickrhds]

Paul,

Yes, I would like a (Write me and I'll send you a sample document.).

Thanks,

Nickrhds (rwro@yahoo.com)

[Wintertime]

Nick, FYI, you can send a message to anyone who posts in these forums by simply clicking on their username in their posting, then, when you get to their Groundspeak profile page, clicking on the Send Message link. No need to post your own address publicly.

 

That's great that you're interested in submitting some survey mark recoveries to the USGS. Paul has a lot of experience doing that, so I'm sure that whatever document he's written up to help structure submissions will be very worthwhile to you.

 

Patty

[+PFF]

Hi, Nick:

 

Thanks for your interest. I sent a sample report to you, this evening. Also, check your mailbox for two other E-mails regarding historic survey marks.

 

Best regards,

-Paul-

[Wintertime]

That's great that you're interested in submitting some survey mark recoveries to the USGS. Paul has a lot of experience doing that, so I'm sure that whatever document he's written up to help structure submissions will be very worthwhile to you.

 

Sorry, meant to say NGS, not USGS. Evidently after a certain period of time, postings are fixed in place and can't be edited even by the original poster.

 

Patty

[+K0BKL]

I have never been able to find marker disks along HY 218

in Lee County Iowa. Either they are covered up, or have

been destroyed in the reconstruction of that highway,

which is the route for the Avenue of the Saints.

 

In the Donnellson Iowa area, none are visible that I can

find. If anyone has found them, please post which ones

that you found. I cannot find any.

Edited November 8, 2006 by K0BKL

[Wintertime]

KOBKL, I don't know whether we have any active Iowa benchmark hunters on the Groundspeak forums (Holoscene's recoveries map only shows a few counties in Iowo in which geocachers have found more than 25 benchmarks), but your best bet to find them would be in the Benchmark Hunting forum. Start a new topic with a subject line such as "Having trouble with Iowa benchmarks" and maybe you'll bring some other Iowans out of the woodwork! (You might also try the Iowa forum, if there is one.)

 

Patty

[Bill93]

GH55 and I seem to be the most active hunters in Iowa. At least we have accounted for the vast majority of the reports to NGS from here. Neither of us has searched in Lee County so I can't give you any specific comments there.

 

If no one else has logged any around your area you will just have to be the pioneer. If you can get to some that HAVE been logged you will get valuable experience in recognizing a typical benchmark location. Be sure to understand the difference between SCALED locations (not very accurate) and ADJUSTED (super precise).

 

I do know that some stretches of what was 218 in the 1930's were replaced by the 2-lane "Old 218" that we knew. In those cases you have to re-interpret the directions by thinking of the 1930's roads. Also around Iowa City and south of Cedar Rapids both the 1930's Hwy 218 and 1980's Hwy 218 were reworked in various places and a lot of the benchmarks got wiped out a long time ago. I suspect that where the Avenue of the Saints expanded from 2-lane to 4-lane, a lot more benchmarks would have been disturbed.

 

If you have more questions, start a new thread so the subject will be clearer to readers.