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government entering into Geocaching?


kitkatt1960

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Listed in the Medicine Hat News today (saturday Sept 16) in the TRAVEL section is an article that really makes me wonder.

 

It states that tourism officials in P.E.I with the aid of the federal Minister of the Atlantic Canada Opportunities Agency is planning on contributing over $29,000 dollars to develop the geocaching craze in PEI.

 

The Feds are kicking in $17,350

The Tourism PEI will be kicking in $5000.

and the "Central Development Corp is putting up $ 4000

 

They are going to develop a web site known as "www.geocachingpei.com" and teach people in the area of the benfits to them in the form of tourism.

 

The article also states that there are more than 21,000 geocachers in the country of Canada.

 

NOW

Is it just me that is getting a bit miffed at this? :)

 

I mean really... the government of Canada spending that kind of money to develop a web site and a set of caches when there are 21,000 people in the country already doing exactly the same d**&(* thing FREE of charge!

 

OOOOOH ... I forgot to mention that there will be GPS units available for loan for those who want to try this new "sport" :D

 

geeeeeezzzzzz

 

Surely some of you out there must have some strong feelings about this one....

I dont know about all of you, but I spent my own money, time, energy and fuel to have some decent enjoyment in areas that are not so TOURISTY that you cant even see the ground for the trash left behind.

:o:):)

Is it not time to start writing to our MP's

:)

 

Oh one more thing... there are already over 150 caches on the Island! and who knows how many "cachers"...... I personnally think this is just plain STUPID

 

Fred and Cathy In Medicine Hat

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As one who has spent a Geocaching Vacation in both PEI and Ontario I too am upset by the use of public funds (ACOA primarily) to enter what has been a commercial free developed activity at the grass roots level.

Ths PEI thing is a knee jerk reaction to a decline in tourism. There being no real updating of tourism activities or destinations on PEI in recent years, coupled with higher costs of fuel and increasing seasonal rates for accomondations this, a decline in tourists, had to happen.

Look for some tourism group in Newfoundland, my home province, to go after ACOA soon.

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Listed in the Medicine Hat News today (saturday Sept 16) in the TRAVEL section is an article that really makes me wonder.

 

It states that tourism officials in P.E.I with the aid of the federal Minister of the Atlantic Canada Opportunities Agency is planning on contributing over $29,000 dollars to develop the geocaching craze in PEI.

 

The Feds are kicking in $17,350

The Tourism PEI will be kicking in $5000.

and the "Central Development Corp is putting up $ 4000

 

They are going to develop a web site known as "www.geocachingpei.com" and teach people in the area of the benfits to them in the form of tourism.

 

The article also states that there are more than 21,000 geocachers in the country of Canada.

 

NOW

Is it just me that is getting a bit miffed at this? ;)

 

I mean really... the government of Canada spending that kind of money to develop a web site and a set of caches when there are 21,000 people in the country already doing exactly the same d**&(* thing FREE of charge!

 

OOOOOH ... I forgot to mention that there will be GPS units available for loan for those who want to try this new "sport" :)

 

geeeeeezzzzzz

 

Surely some of you out there must have some strong feelings about this one....

I dont know about all of you, but I spent my own money, time, energy and fuel to have some decent enjoyment in areas that are not so TOURISTY that you cant even see the ground for the trash left behind.

:blink:;):)

Is it not time to start writing to our MP's

B)

 

Oh one more thing... there are already over 150 caches on the Island! and who knows how many "cachers"...... I personnally think this is just plain STUPID

 

Fred and Cathy In Medicine Hat

 

Hey UBG, Your sounding as bitter as a Starbucks Java. Read between the lines my friend, Not just Alberta has a labour shortage. With all the easterners here, they need someone to harvest the spudatoes. And what a better way to do it. Post the co-ordinates of each plant on a taxpayer funded website and then have everyone drop of their find in the "Community Cache" located at every parking lot. HMMMM!!!! The City is complaining about their Natural Gas reserves. :laughing:

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and a set of caches

 

I didn't see that, I did see that they are creating a website and getting some GPS receivers that can be signed out by visitors.

Initiatives like this are great for the activity, geocaching could be far more popular if there was money spent on advertising and infrastructure and tourism groups are natural promoters as they have a direct stake in attracting visitors. Every geocacher will eventually become a tourist if they continue to geocache.

I am thinking about making a GPS receiver available for borrowers at some point in the future. I know people might be interested in trying out the activity but they are not going to spend a lot of money to try geocaching and even cheap receivers are fairly pricy.

Geocaching is going to continue to grow and people who can see the benefits of geocachers coming to an area to visit are legion. The definition of geocaching is fluid but not many people ever bother to learn the intricacies of actually hiding a cache and the government would make a very poor geocache hider, that is my opinion. I know how difficult it is to hide a geocache that offers a challenge to finders and isn't just a "stone down the well". Stunod has linked a log entry in his profile and I think it is profound and should be required reading. It can be difficult to meet all the listing guidelines outlined on this website and they do add new guidelines as the activity matures and the impact of geocaching begins to be felt in many communities. i.e. Did you know it is against the geocaching.com guidelines to attach any cache to any man made or natural object using any type of screw, here is the link.

I think that geocaching is a great way to introduce visitors to an area and every geocache I place is designed to draw visitors, that is why I place geocaches actually. I do think that tourist groups should get involved in promoting geocaching but I don't think they should get involved in hiding geocaches, it is actually much harder than people think to hide an interesting and fun geocache that meets the guidelines of this listing service, provides a challenge, doesn't cause environmental disturbance and satisfies all types of seekers.

 

Other than the "government hiding geocaches" I think they have a good plan to draw more visitors and get more locals involved.

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PEI1.jpg

 

Wavector, I agree that something like this would be good for the activity. What I don't like is that our tax dollars are used for it. I chose to get into the hobby, I invested MY money into the purchase of a GPSr, and I pay to be a Premium member of the website and this board. When the government gets involved things go wrong. If it looks like something that might turn a buck, then all h3ll breaks loose. Regulations, fees, permits?????? Setting up a website to list the caches. $17,350.00 to develop a Geocaching project. Wait a minute, Is this not what Geocaching.com does. Are they not established. Why do it twice? If the governments need to spend tax dollars :laughing: , then donate something to help this site and list with them. I found 104 caches listed for PEI. Now as a cacher planning to visit PEI I would visit GC.com and load up some caches in the GPS for the areas I plan to be in. I'm not going to search out another website that has listing for special tourism caches and then have to manually imput everything because someone didn't do therir homework and the only format they offer is .xyz for the commodore 64.

 

I have no problem showing people the hobby or loaning out a spare gps. Even a local cache day to twig some interest. But keep it out of the hands of the government. It makes no sense to re-invent the wheel.

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Ok I got the westerners working and thinking!

 

Wavevector: read the article.... it is not the fact that the government is "promoting" geocaching, it is that the government is getting INVOLVED in geocaching. It is fine if they put up a web site... heck they could even point to geospeak if they want.... the problem that I have is that they are promoting it in a fashion as if they had invented the dadgum thing. :laughing:

 

The loaning of gps equipment is great, but we have that here... and we have training on the use of the gps before you take equipment out in the field.... not many people know about it, but it is in place. And up until recently I was one of the instructors on the use of the units..... they are not hard to understand, but if you randomly hand out a "etrex" to a complete novice, chances are you will not see him or it again! ;)

 

My biggest beef is that the use of government funds in this vein are getting WAY out of hand. :blink:

 

Tourist promotion is fine.

Training is fine.

Equipment loans is fine.

 

but where is this "big brother assistance" going to stop?..... in the bedroom????? :)

(hey that was a quote from another time!)

 

Hey if the feds will give me $20G, I bet I could build a multi that even wavevector couldnt find!

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I don't want to confuse "geocaching" and "promoting geocaching."

I have no objections to the government using my tax dollars to promote geocaching, I am entirely against my tax dollars being used to restrict geocaching (Parks Canada) and I am entirely against the government "hiding or listing" geocaches.

 

I have no desire to see this listing site (geocaching.com) empowered to the extent that it is the only listing service, I do contribute to make sure that we have strong central direction in defining this activity but I am glad that other listing services exist. i.e. I saw that Thunderbolt was recently archived and moved to another listing service, this cache has been on our family watch list for quite awhile and now if I want to log it I am going to have to reactivate my membership over there. :laughing:

I do not see that the website mentioned is being set up as a competitor to geocaching.com, in fact the article does not mention either "hiding" or "listing" geocaches so assuming that they are going to do that may not be warranted.

Individuals contribute to the extent that they are interested and able, the activity of geocaching will grow and the requirement to provide infrastructure will grow, commercial sites have trouble cutting themselves in as geocaching.com is very focused and intends to continue the monopoly they enjoy, look at how quickly dissenting members become banned members.

 

As I said, I think any dollars being spent to promote geocaching are a good thing, tourism groups getting involved is good thing, websites that promote geocaching at the regional or local level are a good thing, attracting tourists and making geocaching accessible, another good thing. Parks Canada has already banned geocaching in the parks and I expect they intend to make the temporary moratorium a permanenet moratorium. In the process of banning geocaching in the parks they went to great lengths to co-opt the community and gain support for the restrictive views they advance when discussing geocaching, they indicated just how stupid and foolish a government department can get when they banned waypointing as well. They paid good money, my tax dollars, to gather a group that helped them cement the policy and it included many geocachers or people who run geocaching websites.

If geocachingpei.com was up and running we would have had some strong government advocates of the activity instead of a bunch of toadies reflecting the Parks Canada hard line.

 

If the governement intends to hide geocaches they will end up with "just another cache" or a "stone thrown down the well", it is harder than it looks to hide a memorable cache. If they intend to highlight some of the well liked and well placed PEI caches and they intend to offer greater access to the activity of geocaching for all visitors then we are on the same side. Visitors who do not know about geocaching are not going to load a few caches from geocaching.com website. Visitors who see that they can try this activity because the tourism group has made it accessible and they are making a GPS available might try geocaching even if they have never heard of it before.

 

I think promoting geocaching is a worthy effort and I would like to see my governement tax dollars spent that way, I wouldn't consider it a waste at all.

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That amount of money by the Feds doesn't concern me at all. $17,350 is chump change in a multi-billion dollar budget.

 

Besides, it probably will do a lot of good. It will promote PEI and tourists being a lot of dollars with them. That $17350 will be made back in GST alone from tourists.

 

Second, somebody will get the money to set up the site and that will go in their pockets and they will spend it and there will be GST on the expenditures that flow back to the Feds etc. etc. Think of it this way. Money flows around. So, the person receiving the $17000 spends it in six spots and pay 6% GST on it. Then the 6 places that get it spend it again in another 6 places and each of them pays GST. Now its is an additional 36 places and each of them buys something and pays GST on it and so on. That $17000 will easily return to the Feds before 6 months are done, its a no brainer really. Whenever people complain about tax money being spent they always forget that money flows around, its not a static single expenditure and the government knows it will flow back to them.

 

Finally, anything that supports the sport and advances its is a good thing for all of us. There are a lot more serious things in the world to worry about than that small amount.

 

JD

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If the PEI government wants to sponsor something like this then fine. But why should the Federal government have to support regional tourism. I have to pay taxes so the South Shore of PEI can get a few more tourists? Bullpuckie!!!! Call me a Redneck Albertan then. Just think of how many regions in Canada there are. So their South shore tourism industry is more important than Southern Alberta’s. Hmm, a $17,000 donation? Then what about the Cypress Hills region? Roughly same size? Distinct? What's it worth to promote tourism and caching in? Who decides what regions get promoted? How much? Why not promote and fund caching in Canada as a whole. Why just this region. And don't say that it'd because someone took the initiative to enquire about funding. That funding should be local and/or provincial. Why must the government dole out money to every little group with their hand out? As far as I’m concerned, the Government of PEI is exploiting our hobby to increase tourist dollars and make money. My point is that as a Federal government, it should promoting Canada as a whole, and not by region.

 

I can read the headlines now.

 

TORIES LINKED TO GOECACHE SPONSORSHIP SCANDAL

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You need to get hold of the idiots in government that thought that up, and let them know that no matter what they spend, if they won't buy my airfare and provide a free motel, I will have to spend my dollars closer to home.

 

I have seen wonderful pics of your island, but just don't have the funds to get there at this time.

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why should the Federal government have to support regional tourism

That seems to be a tangenital discussion.

 

The OP was talking about government funds developing geocaching.

I don't think the government should be a listing service nor should they be hiding caches ("Canada Steamship Lines" hidden by Paul Martin, the coordinates would be in Liberia) :laughing:

I am entirely in favour of any level of government developing geocaching and I think it is OK to spend my tax money doing this. If my tax dollars were spent on developing geocaching as an activity, getting more participants out walking, CITOing, hiding and seeking then this is good, that would be my opinion.

I think we should all help establish the principles that make this activity sustainable, enjoyable and beneficial, getting the word out and letting people try gecoaching are important steps in developing the future of this activity. The synergies between tourism and geocaching run very deep and I think many organizations involved in tourism are realizing that geocachers spend a lot of money. The words of Eltod come to mind, "I've spent most of my money on ammo cans & swag- the rest I've just wasted."

Edited by wavector
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Hey I too have spent lots of money on "swag" and containers, but that is not the point.

 

Like Pigy puts it, who decides and how much.

 

Wavey put forward that the FEDS are telling us that the geocaches on national parks land is VERBOTTEN, and yet they are pushing money to promote geocaches on private land???? Lets look at this from both sides of the bush....

 

if it is good enough for the "goose"then what about the "gander"...... or is Newfoundland not worthy of the support of the feds?????????

 

This hobby, like a lot of others is being totally fouled up by a lot of beauocrats, and thowing federal money at it in any way shape or form is just going to make this problem amplify.

 

Let a politician get involved in geocaching and the rules will read:

only titanium containers 3.75mm X 9.38mm X4.39mm may be used for geocaching, Plus these container cannot be placed any higher than .27m or lower than .25 m from the relative surrounding ground terrain. The mounting hardware must be of suitable biodegradable material such that all signs of this cache (including the container) must decompose upon exposure to the elements for any duration longer than 132hours. Such components may be purchased for use from the queens printers for the sum of only $4397.95 plus shipping handling and tax.

Said geocache may only be installed between the hours of 0840 and o925 local time and all cache finds and hides must be cleared through your local MPs office

 

It is starting to get a bit tooo darn strict for the ones that have been into this for a long time. I for one have a real job, this is a hobby.... if it gets too bad, I guess Ill find another.... but keep up this general facade of "the governement is here to help" and you are as blind as I am without my glasses.

 

Fred

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but keep up this general facade of "the governement is here to help"

 

Hi Fred, I am not sure where you are getting that message?

Your opening post specifically referred to an article that relates the government is spending money to develop geocaching as an activity in PEI, this is good. They are going to make GPS receivers available to tourists, they are going to make a geocaching website, this is good, there are a lot of tourists who might enjoy geocaching. I do not have to know a lot more than that, as it sits I think the money is money well spent, even if it is my tax money and it is being spent in PEI. I would hate to see the government waste my tax money and do nothing for geocaching. I would hate to see the government waste money. :laughing::blink:

 

It is starting to get a bit tooo darn strict for the ones that have been into this for a long time.
I am having trouble equating this with any thing in the article or anything that the government has done. The guidelines that affect all geocachers have little to do with the government. Geocache listing services have developed guidelines that are quite comprehensive, to get your geocache listed on major listing services you will have to follow those guidelines. The only direct input from the government has been in the form of a complete ban on all lands administered by Parks Canada. What is getting "tooo darn strict"? Are you suggesting that the listing guidelines are too strict or that the Parks Canada ban is too strict, if the latter, I agree completely.

 

I for one have a real job, this is a hobby.... if it gets too bad, I guess Ill find another

 

I am not certain what these final comments mean, a lot of people have real jobs and manage to enjoy geocaching. The best thing about geocaching is that you can contribute a lot of time and effort to geocaching, it is an enjoyable activity in all of it's many manifestations or you can find a few caches once in awhile or be anywhere in between. I have a real job as well and I do something geocaching related almost every day and I have for a long time. :) Geocaching has led me to do things and get involved in ways that I could have never imagined. To be honest I actually haven't even noticed it getting "bad" let alone "too bad".

 

I predict that geocaching is going to continue growing and that many tourist agencies and levels of government are going to get involved and spend money on developing geocaching as a beneficial activity suitable for everyone. In principle I am not opposed to the government spending money on developing geocaching. In regards to increasing regulatory requirements I think park services have to be involved, the lax guidelines employed by listing services fall far short of the needs of most land managers. In many US states you need a permit to place a geocache and containers are specified, even down to size and camouflage so you are making a good point there. Many geocachers do not understand why the park service implements restrictions but in every case the land manager can tell you why it makes sense. For example, on this listing service there is no system for identifying that a cache has an active owner, a park service might implement a permit system to ensure that geocaches have active owners, you have to get a permit and renew a permit, very simple and it ensures that the land manager can contact the placer as needed. I think having some government regulations would be preferable to a complete ban as Parks Canada has done.

 

We are all really sharing the same adventure when we are geocaching. We are all helping to shape the future of this activity through participation. Where is geocaching going to go, I don't know, but I am going to go find out - for sure. ;)

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The loaning of gps equipment is great

 

No it isn't. The "loaning" of anything is poor English. Surely the Government of Canada can lend things to people?

 

<ducking>

 

Seriously though, I don't have a problem with this as long as they do a better job than the Eastern Ontario GPS Treashure Hunt people did.

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why should the Federal government have to support regional tourism

That seems to be a tangenital discussion.

 

Why would sun burned testicles even factor into this discussion :mellow::o

 

All I am saying is that local and provincial governments should be the ones promoting local tourism. Everyone seems to need the feds to dig deeper into my pocket to help their cause. If PEI is struggling to attract tourists then should it not be their tax dollar and businesses that pay to promote their province. Do you really trust our Government to handle any kind of promotion. I think it should be left to the ones that have a clue!

 

That amount of money by the Feds doesn't concern me at all. $17,350 is chump change in a multi-billion dollar budget.

 

Sounds like your an MP in Ottawa talking like that. :tired: Look at all the chump change that caused a big change in who runs the country.

 

Now I know this has really gotten away from the intent of the original post. What’s done is done in PEI, so let’s sit back and see what happens. :rolleyes:

 

And wavector, enough of the off colored remarks about the family jewels. :laughing:

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to help their cause. If PEI is struggling to attract tourists

 

The reasons we are approaching different conclusions can be attributed to the fact that I am talking about geocaching and you are talking about tourism. :blink:

I am in favour of programs that develop geocaching no matter where they are and I would not object to a government spending my tax money to develop geocaching.

None of my statements are applicable to tourism but hold true for "geocaching", that is my cause you might say.

 

In the scenario outlined in the article it appears that the feds are just going to cough up some cash and then the PEI tourism operators are going to use the funds to develop geocaching, I am not sure the feds have any ability to "promote" but tourism groups do. The funds are going to be used to develop geocaching, this may help tourism, I can't be sure but I can be sure it will help geocaching by raising the profile and by making this activity more accessible.

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to help their cause. If PEI is struggling to attract tourists

 

The reasons we are approaching different conclusions can be attributed to the fact that I am talking about geocaching and you are talking about tourism. :anitongue:

I am in favour of programs that develop geocaching no matter where they are and I would not object to a government spending my tax money to develop geocaching.

None of my statements are applicable to tourism but hold true for "geocaching", that is my cause you might say.

 

In the scenario outlined in the article it appears that the feds are just going to cough up some cash and then the PEI tourism operators are going to use the funds to develop geocaching, I am not sure the feds have any ability to "promote" but tourism groups do. The funds are going to be used to develop geocaching, this may help tourism, I can't be sure but I can be sure it will help geocaching by raising the profile and by making this activity more accessible.

 

If the feds are going to promote anything, then why not on the nationally. I will try to look at this the way you are. Yes, promoting geochacing with federal dollars is beneficial to the hobby, but could it not be done at the national level and get away from any notion(perceived or not) that regional promotion amounts to nothing more that favortiism. It would benefit the hobby more if the thousands that may travel to Canada for a va-cache-tion were aware of the hobby opportunities nationwide than the few hundred tourists that opt for a PEI trip. But I am still against public money funding hobbies. Remember, there might be something that gets the public money that you disagree with.

Edited by Pigshanks
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But I am still against public money funding hobbies. Remember, there might be something that gets the public money that you disagree with.

Public money funds all kinds of hobbies, many of which couldn't happen if there wasn't public money. How about boaters using the Rideau and Trent canals. As a former canalman, I can tell you that the daily fees don't even approach covering the daily operating costs. The canals are primarily for recreational boaters, a hobby.

 

Public funds support building arenas, hiking trails, rowing clubs, ski clubs, and any other club/activity that applies and meets the criterion. Without public funds all kinds of things wouldn't happen.

 

JD

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Public money funds all kinds of hobbies, many of which couldn't happen if there wasn't public money.

JD

 

Ok, let me rephrase. I am still against Federal money being used to promote regional activites. Local and provincial governments should be responsible for this. With such diversity in this country the Federal government cannot do something in one part without offending people in anther part. This thread is well on its way to demonstrate this. IMHO Defence, healthcare, education, basic living standards, and promoting Canada as a whole should be the bulk of the responsibilities of the feds. My beliefs are that government(all branches) have way to much to do with how we live our day to day lives and it frustrates me to no end that anyone with an idea figures that it is the responsibility of the Federal government to see that it becomes reality.

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Ok, let me rephrase. I am still against Federal money being used to promote regional activites. Local and provincial governments should be responsible for this. With such diversity in this country the Federal government cannot do something in one part without offending people in anther part. This thread is well on its way to demonstrate this. IMHO Defence, healthcare, education, basic living standards, and promoting Canada as a whole should be the bulk of the responsibilities of the feds. My beliefs are that government(all branches) have way to much to do with how we live our day to day lives and it frustrates me to no end that anyone with an idea figures that it is the responsibility of the Federal government to see that it becomes reality.

 

You didn't use the word geocaching once? B)

 

I try and promote geocaching at every turn.

At some point you have to look at the world around you and decide if you want everyone to know about geocaching. It is an activity in the early stages of development. I think that right now any money spent on adding geocaching to the lexicon of recreational activities is good. I am entirely in favour of developing and promoting geocaching because it needs much more exposure than it currently gets.

I think the PEI tourist groups will benefit from having some money and geocachers will benefit when they spend it on developing geocaching.

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And when there are ridiculous amounts of people in the hobby, then what? No places to hide caches! Complaints of trespassing! Area closed to caches (National Parks). I'd be very interested in what the City of Med Hat has to say about caches in parks. Just a few short weeks ago I was told that I was no longer able to drive under the TC Highway Bridge past the two bridges because now the City deemed it a natural park. A few fools getting stuck prompted that decision I was told. No big stink has been made to date about caching in the city, but get a few thousand people out and then see. . Now I want to see the sport grow to, but let it grow without federal dollars. When the feds invest in something, it can all go south in a hurry(see FEDERAL SPONSORSHIP SCANDAL and/or GUN REGISTRY)

 

How many of your caches have you received permission to place in the parks system? How much damage would be done in Police Point Park should 5000 people per year leave the ESTABLISHED trail system to venture 10-15" off the path, push back some branches and maybe roll a log off then back on to get at a cache. I think the City would put the brakes on our hobby in a hurry if they ever thought it might happen. Something to consider when you want to share a hobby with the masses.

 

And just a side note on hobbies. I fish. Have for nearly 40 years. Alberta promoted fishing to the four corners of the earth for years. People came, they destroyed, and now have we have some of the most restrictive regulations in place because the hundreds of thousands of anglers have almost collapsed the fisheries to the point that certain lakes and streams that were some of my favorite spots are permanently closed. Special permits to catch one fish in one lake per tag. Now really not comparing apples to oranges, but it does show what can happen with overpromotion.

 

We really should catch up and chat over coffee sometime.

Edited by Pigshanks
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I’m a “displaced” Islander and I commend any effort to promote geocaching in my birthplace. I’ve been in contact with the PEI Minister of Tourism and have suggested that a greater benefit would be derived if the entire province were promoted to the established geocaching fraternity. In my contacts with other geocachers I’ve pointed out there is the possibility of bragging you’ve found all the caches in a Canadian province when you visit PEI.

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I’m a “displaced” Islander and I commend any effort to promote geocaching in my birthplace. I’ve been in contact with the PEI Minister of Tourism and have suggested that a greater benefit would be derived if the entire province were promoted to the established geocaching fraternity. In my contacts with other geocachers I’ve pointed out there is the possibility of bragging you’ve found all the caches in a Canadian province when you visit PEI.

 

And I hope you will contact the Federal Minister of Tourism and suggest that a greater benifit would be devrived if the entire country were promoted to the established geocaching fraternity since the lionshare of the PEI money came from the Feds.

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then what?
get a few thousand people out and then see

 

My plan exactly. :laughing:

 

I can see you point of view, greater numbers of seekers might lead to problems, the potential is there. People hiding geocaches often underestimate the effects of others searching for and replacing geocaches, searchers can and do make an impact. If you use sticks to hide your geocache in time the area near the cache will be stick free and the zone will extend a bit farther each year.

 

The guidelines are fairly spare in regards to actual placement details and people generally follow the dictates and customs of the area in which they learned to cache. A key thing about geocaches is that if they are removed from the place they are hidden there should be no impact or evidence they were there. I am not sure that the City has any detailed knowledge of geocaching but Parks and Rec is familiar with our activity. We have had contact with the parks and the city operations dept. while doing CITO events so they do know we are there in amongst the other recreational users, we held a CITO event in the Police Point Park this spring. The guidelines are for the most part already sufficient for urban greenspace which is probably the most popular location for hiding geocaches but greater participation will help make the guidelines more robust and more comprehensive. The key to greater participation is exposure, getting the word out, making geocaching more accessible.

 

Geocaching is not something I feel nationalistic or patriotic about, I like geocaches everywhere and I realize that this activity is actually all about physical connections to other places and other people all over the world. Developing geocaching as an activity is something that will take time, energy and money and I just can't see myself objecting to any efforts aimed at promoting geocaching. I don't expect parity in Federal funding or sensible spending by government but I think money spent on developing geocaching in PEI benefits all geocachers everywhere. At this stage I think money spent anywhere on increasing exposure and accessibility will benefit this activity. I really am not too particular about funding details either, if the Fed's wanted to spend money to develop geocaching in New Guinea my position would not be substantially different because I see the question as a geocacher, not as a Canadian taxpayer or an Albertan. Every geocacher will become a tourist, it is inevitable, but unlike other tourists, the geocachers will get to see ALL the nice spots.

Edited by wavector
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Being one of the highest taxed industrial countries I wonder why the roads are in poor condition, Post secondary education is a dream for many young people, and waiting list for years for certain medical procedures. In my childrens school, my wife and many others, for years had to fundraise to purchase new playground equipment because there was no money available to the schools to replace old equipment. Two years of drip pails all over their school on rainy days because the money was not available for repairs. These are just a few of the things that I feel tax dollars would be beter spent than to promote treasure hunts around a province that I do not even live in.

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I have never found any treasure. :)

 

You seem to be taking a very narrow position.

The government should not spend money on promoting geocaching in PEI because you don't live there? It seems like you are saying that childless taxpayers should object to funding education for people who choose to have children and people who get sick should pay for their own health care because they are the ones who are sick. The current government just announced the slashing of $5 million in museum funding, they must have figured out that museums don't turn a profit.

I cannot argue against your position, I just think that it is very narrow and little I say would be relevant.

 

In my opinion developing geocaching is money well spent, getting people out and active results in lower health care costs for all Canadians. Developing tourism in areas that have the ability to attract tourists and are chronically underemployed is another initiative that will help all Canadians, not just people from PEI, we are all living under the same tax regime. Tourism and geocaching have great synergy and I am sure we will see similar funding arrangements in the future in other provinces.

 

Our taxes are higher than many other industrial countries because we have decided to share the cost of health care amongst all Canadians rather than lumping it all on the ones who are sick, no other reason.

 

Your school roof is leaking, there is no money for playground equipment and Alberta roads are little better than washboards because Albertans voted in Ralph Klein for 16 years of governance and the legacy that he left is exactly the legacy he promised, Alberta is debt free.

In my opinion I still think that money spent developing geocaching in PEI is money well spent. I think money spent on education is also money well spent and I feel some government debt is much better than leaking school roofs, unsafe playground equipment or trying to turn educators into fund raisers, we have a lot of common ground.

 

We should get together and have coffee one day, that sounds like a great idea. If you are not busy this weekend we should arrange to meet at a local coffee shop and swap geocaching tales.

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I don't want to confuse "geocaching" and "promoting geocaching."

I have no objections to the government using my tax dollars to promote geocaching, I am entirely against my tax dollars being used to restrict geocaching (Parks Canada) and I am entirely against the government "hiding or listing" geocaches.

 

I have no desire to see this listing site (geocaching.com) empowered to the extent that it is the only listing service, I do contribute to make sure that we have strong central direction in defining this activity but I am glad that other listing services exist. i.e. I saw that Thunderbolt was recently archived and moved to another listing service, this cache has been on our family watch list for quite awhile and now if I want to log it I am going to have to reactivate my membership over there. :unsure:

I do not see that the website mentioned is being set up as a competitor to geocaching.com, in fact the article does not mention either "hiding" or "listing" geocaches so assuming that they are going to do that may not be warranted.

Individuals contribute to the extent that they are interested and able, the activity of geocaching will grow and the requirement to provide infrastructure will grow, commercial sites have trouble cutting themselves in as geocaching.com is very focused and intends to continue the monopoly they enjoy, look at how quickly dissenting members become banned members.

 

As I said, I think any dollars being spent to promote geocaching are a good thing, tourism groups getting involved is good thing, websites that promote geocaching at the regional or local level are a good thing, attracting tourists and making geocaching accessible, another good thing. Parks Canada has already banned geocaching in the parks and I expect they intend to make the temporary moratorium a permanenet moratorium. In the process of banning geocaching in the parks they went to great lengths to co-opt the community and gain support for the restrictive views they advance when discussing geocaching, they indicated just how stupid and foolish a government department can get when they banned waypointing as well. They paid good money, my tax dollars, to gather a group that helped them cement the policy and it included many geocachers or people who run geocaching websites.

If geocachingpei.com was up and running we would have had some strong government advocates of the activity instead of a bunch of toadies reflecting the Parks Canada hard line.

 

If the governement intends to hide geocaches they will end up with "just another cache" or a "stone thrown down the well", it is harder than it looks to hide a memorable cache. If they intend to highlight some of the well liked and well placed PEI caches and they intend to offer greater access to the activity of geocaching for all visitors then we are on the same side. Visitors who do not know about geocaching are not going to load a few caches from geocaching.com website. Visitors who see that they can try this activity because the tourism group has made it accessible and they are making a GPS available might try geocaching even if they have never heard of it before.

 

I think promoting geocaching is a worthy effort and I would like to see my governement tax dollars spent that way, I wouldn't consider it a waste at all.

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I’m a “displaced” Islander and I commend any effort to promote geocaching in my birthplace. I’ve been in contact with the PEI Minister of Tourism and have suggested that a greater benefit would be derived if the entire province were promoted to the established geocaching fraternity. In my contacts with other geocachers I’ve pointed out there is the possibility of bragging you’ve found all the caches in a Canadian province when you visit PEI.

 

It's called the Red Dirt Dash, We have it every year!

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