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TB's not moving, just being "discovered"

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I set several TBs loose a few months back for a race, and in addition to one of them going MIA within a week, I've been fairly disappointed in the ratio of "discovered it"s to "retrieved from..."s. It seems that there are quite a few folks who are only interested in boosting their stats by "discovering" the TBs and not grabbing them and actually moving them.

Sure, I've seen quite a few TBs in caches that I didn't take (because I wasn't going to be able to move them anywhere good), but I didn't write down the nums just to log it and feel cool about my TB stats.

 

Is it just me? Am I missing the gyst of the whole TB thang?

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I agree 100%. TBs are just part of the game, and simply "discovering" them for the sake of stats is weak...[u]UNLESS[/u] maybe its one of the JEEP TBs or some other competition one. Those get abused more than any other, and since you need to get them to log them... well, you know the issue.

 

Boosting one's stats is good for what exactly?

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I set several TBs loose a few months back for a race, and in addition to one of them going MIA within a week, I've been fairly disappointed in the ratio of "discovered it"s to "retrieved from..."s. It seems that there are quite a few folks who are only interested in boosting their stats by "discovering" the TBs and not grabbing them and actually moving them.

Sure, I've seen quite a few TBs in caches that I didn't take (because I wasn't going to be able to move them anywhere good), but I didn't write down the nums just to log it and feel cool about my TB stats.

 

Is it just me? Am I missing the gyst of the whole TB thang?

I understand how you feel about your travel bugs not moving. However, sometimes I like it when people say that discovered it. It let's me know if the logged travel bug is actually in the cache.

 

I am knew to Geocaching, but have read A LOT of past messages, stories, and experiences. It would seem that Geocaching has changed from a "let's have a reason to enjoy the family and nature" to a "numbers" game. I suppose that is to be expected.

 

Don't worry. Someone will grab your bugs eventually. I think the whole travel bug idea is a great one. I am saddened by how many bugs are MIA. I wonder if someone knows a fairly accurate percentage of how many TBs are missing.

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Is it just me? Am I missing the gyst of the whole TB thang?

 

No, it isn't just you and yes you get it.

 

I've seen it said that if you aren't going to move them discover them so the owner gets status that the bug is still there. yeeeah right, sounds like a handy excuse if you ask me.

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Think of it this way: maybe the "Discover" option is actually making your bugs safer.

 

It's true that there are some people who are only interested in the numbers. Before "Discovered it" was available, they'd have to actually pick up your bug to get credit for it. But they got their numbers-boost as soon as they logged the retrieval. If they're really in it just for the numbers, they then have no particularly strong incentive to drop it off somewhere, so your TB could end up in someone's possession for months or even years.

 

With the "Discover" option, the numbers-centric people don't have to take the bug out of the cache. Which means that when your bug is eventually picked up, it's by someone who is actually interested in moving it along rather than someone who just wants to increase their TB count.

 

(Of course I really have no idea whether or not the "Discover" option will actually cut down on lost TBs, but it doesn't do any harm, and maybe it will make you feel better about it to think of it that way. And I'd rather have a TB of mine sit in a cache for months with an occasional discovery, than in someone's cache bag or junk drawer for months.)

 

Another benefit to the "Discovered it" option just occurred to me: over the long term, it could be an indicator of which types of bugs people enjoy picking up. If I have certain bugs that get picked up a lot, and others that gather dust in caches just collecting "discoveries", I'll know which type of bugs & missions to put out in the future.

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I'd like to see a new feature that allows you to control what happens with the TB. Like myself and wifey being a TB we just want to be discovered. But all of the other TB's that I have I want them to move. You should be able to choose whether or not you want your TB discovered. If someone wants to "boost" their TB numbers then woohoo go for it. It's just like being a little kid again and trying to get that gold start to show everyone you did good. Swizzle

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I agree that sometimes it's nice to have my TB's "discovered", just so that I know they are still there, but I'd rather see them moving of course.

 

I had one TB that got discovered 5 times in a cache before someone finally decided to grab it. I have no idea why.

 

AR_kayaker

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I like to discover coins and TB's at events -- it keeps a log of the ones I have seen. Lately, I have been creating a "photo album" of all the ones I see or help move along. Why? I don't know -- why do I look for hidden containers in the woods? Obsessive behaviour is my friend!

 

I do NOT like it when someone takes "ownership" of one of my coins and/or TB's and only ALLOWS people to discover it. I want my items to move.

 

The only exception are events -- then, I prefer it isn't dropped into the event. I have lost many items this way. Someone drops it, then they no longer are "responsible" for it and some other cacher has it, never logs it and ..... boo hoo.... I lost 4 coins at one event this way -- one week after they were released. Somehow I don't think they're still at the BBQ. :P

 

And....just to be hypocritical. I WILL take TB's FROM events if asked by the person holding them. I am VERY consciencious of TB's and always seek to assist them on their missons. So I trust myself :)

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I can understand the aspect of icon hunting and wanting to add a bunch of cool loooking icons to your page. My main concern is with TB's eventually just sitting there and going no where's. I think TB's that are meant to travel and don't give you an extra icon should not be discoverable. Geocoins are a whole different ballgame and I feel that they should be seperated from TB's. After all ones a tag and ones a really cool looking geocoin. Its like comparing apples to oranges. They are 2 different critters and should be treated as such. Just my opinion. Swizzle

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There's only one time where I didn't take a TB and wanted to just 'discover' it. Then again, this is still the ONLY tb I've ever come across :lol:

 

Nonetheless... the reason for me not taking it is because this was on... I think it was my second day ever geocaching. I didn't even have a GPS yet, and had no clue whatsoever if I needed to drop it off again by a certain time, or if I needed to be a premium member, etc, etc. I just didn't know anything about TB's really when I found it. In fact, I didn't even know to grab the 'number' off the tag so I would be able to 'discover' it :{

 

Hence... I tried contacting the owner, but they apparently just moved and didn't know where the number was offhand. I'll try asking them again sometime, or maybe ask whoever last had it if it's picked up by someone. Mainly because I want to log it because it was the "first" TB I've ever seen. So... with any luck, I'll be able to log my discovery of "Trevor the traveling turtle" sometime.

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I REALLY like the "Discovered" feature for two reasons. First, let me say that racking up large numbers of TB/Geocoin finds for my statistics is not at all a priority of mine. I couldn't care less how many TB finds are listed in my stats.

 

Reason 1:

I've had a couple of my TBs get stuck in a cache that doesn't get much traffic. I like getting the "Discovered" notification letting me know that everything is still fine with the TB. It may have been months since the bug was placed in the cache. It may be months before someone else finds the cache again. I would like for each person that finds the cache, but doesn't take my bug for what ever reason, to post a "Discovered" log to let me know the bug is okay. So I always post a "Discovered" entry for every bug I find in a cache that I don't take with me. Not to boost my TB find stats, but as a courtesy to the TB owner. It doesn't hurt anything, does it?

 

Reason 2:

Some of my bugs/coins have been put into caches with LOTS of other bugs in them (TB Hotels). The next cacher to come along can't take ALL of the TBs. That would be rude and most cache owners would get upset about someone wiping out their cache's entire inventory of TBs in one fell swoop. Some cache owners have rules against taking all the bugs or taking the last bug from their caches (although I don't agree with TBs being held hostage in a cache because they are the last one there). It seems that most people will just take one or two bugs from a heavily stocked cache, so some of the bugs must stay behind. The "Discovered" log lets the TB owner know their bug is still in the cache, waiting its turn to be picked up.

 

That's my take on the situation.

 

Blue skies and happy caching!

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Yeah, ok... I'm sold on the "discovered" as a way of keeping track of TBs.

 

I'm really not excited on how coins seem to disappear though. Seems if you want to OWN one, then buy the darn thing! Don't steal somebody else's coin, put it in a book, only to display your collection of "stolen" coins at events caches.

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Yeah, ok... I'm sold on the "discovered" as a way of keeping track of TBs.

 

I'm really not excited on how coins seem to disappear though. Seems if you want to OWN one, then buy the darn thing! Don't steal somebody else's coin, put it in a book, only to display your collection of "stolen" coins at events caches.

 

I guess "discovered" needs to be defined.

 

I'm definitely no expert on geocaching and on occasion come across something new which I don't understand.

 

I just placed a new Green Jeep TB that I've had for a few days into a different cache. I know the party that initiated the jeep and they passed it through a cache to us.

 

When I logged the TB in its new home and checked the TB web page I was surprised to find two different cachers from the other side of the country had "discovered" the TB while it was in my possession.

 

There are 5500 Green Jeeps out there as I understand it. I seriously doubt if someone at Jeep is sitting in their office worrying about whether their "bugs" are still on the move.

 

So, I can only assume that some people are playing some silly "numbers" game. What really made me laugh was when I went to the "discoverers" profile page and they have some long quote about the game being more about quality than quantity.

 

Or, maybe I'm wrong.

 

I feel less wrong after reading the previous posts in this thread though.

 

I guess it's inevitable that some will get wrapped up in the numbers game to the point of trying to "count" everything they come across. Perhaps these "discoverers" feel if they can scour the web around the globe and come upon a bug, they've "discovered" it.

 

I'm going to try not to get worked up about it though.

 

I get what I get out of it, and everybody does their own thing.

 

(I still think it's LAME though to log anything if you haven't been to the cache or seen the bug with your own eyes.)

 

Cache on!

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There are those that believe that it's all about quantity. I feel it's more about QUALITY!!! One could find one thousand caches, and someone could find just one that would equal it in every way. Look how many people have gone after "It's All on the Surface" GC321C, and look at how many people go for the caches grouped together. There are others caches like GC321C. But if you have 5000 finds, do something challenging for once. "QUALITY NOT QUANTITY"!!!!!

 

I guess challenging is surfing the gallery and using tracking number that got posted in the pic.

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My only gripe with the Discovered It option is that newbies who haven't read the pages before they log it. I've had a few who say, it's my first travel bug, will move it soon, and they only used the Discovered It option and not realized that they had to grab it. Therefore, they don't know that the TB stays on the web page of the cache it was found in, and they don't know then, how to log the drop when they put it in a new cache.

 

But, all that said, I'm dealing with it. The Discovered It option has created a lot more email from me to new cachers, always thanking them for playing our game and welcoming them to the best community of people in the world.

 

My rule, it's a game, if your TB goes missing, buy more tags.......

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My only gripe with the Discovered It option is that newbies who haven't read the pages before they log it. I've had a few who say, it's my first travel bug, will move it soon, and they only used the Discovered It option and not realized that they had to grab it. Therefore, they don't know that the TB stays on the web page of the cache it was found in, and they don't know then, how to log the drop when they put it in a new cache.

 

I wouldn't say that that is the newbies' fault at all. As far as I can see, there is no explanation about the "Discovered" option on the geocaching.com TB pages; it's not at all surprising that people (and not just newbies!) are choosing the wrong one. There are two main causes for the "Discovered" option being misused:

 

(1) "Discovered" is too ambiguous and confusing a term; there were plenty of other more clear and concise terms suggested when this option was first being proposed in the "Icon swap meets" thread.

(2) The Travel Bug FAQ page and the "How to use a travel bug" page, where a newbie might be expected to check, don't describe the difference between "retrieve", "grab", and "discover".

 

As far as I can tell, the only place for someone to learn what "Discovered" really means is in the forums, a place where only a small percentage of cachers ever visit.

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My rule, it's a game, if your TB goes missing, buy more tags.......

 

And if you wait long enough you can always re-release the lost ones.

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I suspect that whatever rationale produced the category "discovered" for travel bugs was well intended. However, I find that not everyone understands what it means and how it is used. I had one TB that a newcomer to the sport "retrieved" but logged as "discovered" and it took several emails to correct the process. This "discovered" thing is causing me more work and not helping much. :blink: I'd vote to get rid of it. If I want to know if my TB is still in someone’s cache (after a reasonable length of time) I'll email them and ask them to verify it on their next cache site maintenance trip - geocachers do still maintain their caches, don't they?

Edited by gallahad

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I like the 'discovered' feature for the geocoins. It allows me the option to add the icon to my Trackable list and continue to make the coin available to Junior cachers that can move the coin to a local cache they have not logged yet. I am 'cached-out' in my area and have to travel 50+ miles to get to new caches. This would take the geocoin out of the area - depriving local cachers an exciting opportunity to find and log a geocoin.

 

Is there a way to limit the 'discovered' feature to just the geocoins?

 

I have been toying with the idea af creating a 'virtual' geocoin hotel where I make the coin tracking numbers of my personal coins available in a physical cache for cachers to 'discover' and add the coin icon to their trackable list. It allows area cachers to increase their Trackable icon count and the coins never go missing. I'm not interested in releasing every coin I buy and this would allow me to share the coin's icon with multiple cachers.

 

Has anyone else thought of using the 'Discovery' feature for a virtual coin drop?

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I like the 'discovered' feature for the geocoins. It allows me the option to add the icon to my Trackable list and continue to make the coin available to Junior cachers that can move the coin to a local cache they have not logged yet. I am 'cached-out' in my area and have to travel 50+ miles to get to new caches. This would take the geocoin out of the area - depriving local cachers an exciting opportunity to find and log a geocoin.

 

Is there a way to limit the 'discovered' feature to just the geocoins?

 

I have been toying with the idea af creating a 'virtual' geocoin hotel where I make the coin tracking numbers of my personal coins available in a physical cache for cachers to 'discover' and add the coin icon to their trackable list. It allows area cachers to increase their Trackable icon count and the coins never go missing. I'm not interested in releasing every coin I buy and this would allow me to share the coin's icon with multiple cachers.

 

Has anyone else thought of using the 'Discovery' feature for a virtual coin drop?

(By the way, number 10.)

 

You purchase a coin, nobody sees it, nobody takes it anywhere.

 

They log it.

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I guess challenging is surfing the gallery and using tracking number that got posted in the pic.

 

Man O'Day ain't that the truth. I dropped a TB in a cache yesterday and checked on it this morning after the mileage updated to see how many miles it gained. Seems like someone in Utah "discovered" it while it was in my pack in West Virginia. A previous handler had posted a pic that one could garner the tracking number.

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I have been toying with the idea af creating a 'virtual' geocoin hotel where I make the coin tracking numbers of my personal coins available in a physical cache for cachers to 'discover' and add the coin icon to their trackable list. It allows area cachers to increase their Trackable icon count and the coins never go missing. I'm not interested in releasing every coin I buy and this would allow me to share the coin's icon with multiple cachers.

 

Has anyone else thought of using the 'Discovery' feature for a virtual coin drop?

 

Making your coins virtual is a good way to get them locked from anyone logging them. A couple of new caches around here had it written in the description that a coin tracking number was included in the cache. The coins were promptly locked.

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I guess challenging is surfing the gallery and using tracking number that got posted in the pic.

 

Man O'Day ain't that the truth. I dropped a TB in a cache yesterday and checked on it this morning after the mileage updated to see how many miles it gained. Seems like someone in Utah "discovered" it while it was in my pack in West Virginia. A previous handler had posted a pic that one could garner the tracking number.

 

I did a little research and that cacher had stated they 'Discovered' two bugs on 9/1. Using the number of your bug I found that if you change the 3 to a 7 it pulls up the bug that is currently sitting in the same cache as the other bug they discovered.

 

I say it was a typo. :angry:

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I guess challenging is surfing the gallery and using tracking number that got posted in the pic.

 

Man O'Day ain't that the truth. I dropped a TB in a cache yesterday and checked on it this morning after the mileage updated to see how many miles it gained. Seems like someone in Utah "discovered" it while it was in my pack in West Virginia. A previous handler had posted a pic that one could garner the tracking number.

 

I did a little research and that cacher had stated they 'Discovered' two bugs on 9/1. Using the number of your bug I found that if you change the 3 to a 7 it pulls up the bug that is currently sitting in the same cache as the other bug they discovered.

 

I say it was a typo. :angry:

 

I'll have to agree. I looked at it pre-coffee and thought it was odd.

Thanks for removing the dark cloud of suspicion. :ph34r:

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After recently attending a small event cache, I wonder if there is any way for TPTB folks to make a different category for discovered vs. found and moved? I am totally fine with each person playing the game the way that they like, but I would like to be able to compare apples to apples and not to apples and oranges. Ya know?

 

I only will log a TB or coin if I happen to take it from a cache and place it in another. That's my version of the game - I want to know what I've found and helped out. (I did discover my first TB - around the neck of a dog - but she was a cute dog!) At the event, a very nice cacher brought her binder full of trackable coins to let folks look at. It was a very impressive collection! She then offered to email the tracking numbers to whomever wanted the little icons so that they could discover them. It was and is a generous offer to be sure... but it would be so much better if there was a colum for "dicovered" vs "moved". Pretty icons would stay in place and then one could tell which trackables a cacher helped along its journey.

 

Any thoughts along those line TPTB? I'm no programmer, but it doesn't seem that it would be that hard to implement...

 

Thanks!

Edited by Wile E. Dragonfly

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At the event, a very nice cacher brought her binder full of trackable coins to let folks look at. It was a very impressive collection! She then offered to email the tracking numbers to whomever wanted the little icons so that they could discover them.

 

This is a sad practice. I've noticed folks with more coins on their list than caches.

 

I'm with you...I only log coins/TBs that I move.

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I suspect that whatever rationale produced the category "discovered" for travel bugs was well intended. However, I find that not everyone understands what it means and how it is used. I had one TB that a newcomer to the sport "retrieved" but logged as "discovered" and it took several emails to correct the process.

 

I think you're spot-on with that, since I'm a newbie and that's exactly what just happened with a TB that I've got. Within the last month, I'd picked up two TBs - from two different caches - that had been properly logged in, and when I went in to log them, it was clear that the correct thing to do was say that I'd "retrieved" them.

 

Yesterday, I stopped by a TB hotel off of I-95 to drop off the two, since one has a specific mission and I thought that would be a good place for it to continue in the correct direction. I looked through the other bugs there, & picked a cool one to move along.

But when I went to the cache page to log that I'd retrieved it, lo and behold it wasn't in the cache's inventory... so to me, the obvious choice from the drop down menu, was that I'd "discovered" it.

The bug's owner then e-mailed me - very happy that her bug had turned up, 'cos it had been AWOL for over a year - and explained that the correct choice would have been "grabbed it". Which I did, and then per her request virtually "dropped off" and then "retrieved" the bug from the cache, so that its milage would be correctly logged.

 

It remains a mystery how the bug got from Georgia, where the owner lives, to Cecil County, Maryland. (Upper NE corner of the state, bordering DE and PA.)

 

Getting back to the point, however, the terminology used for logging bugs *other* than "dropping off" and "retrieving" is not, IMO, very clear or intuitive.

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I have been toying with the idea af creating a 'virtual' geocoin hotel where I make the coin tracking numbers of my personal coins available in a physical cache for cachers to 'discover' and add the coin icon to their trackable list. It allows area cachers to increase their Trackable icon count and the coins never go missing. I'm not interested in releasing every coin I buy and this would allow me to share the coin's icon with multiple cachers.

 

Has anyone else thought of using the 'Discovery' feature for a virtual coin drop?

 

You need to read this.

 

Particularly this paragraph (insert trackable geocoin whereever it says TB):

AND THIS MOST IMPORTANT ONE:

If you log a bogus virtual log on a TB, or offer your own TB up for virtual logging you will risk having that TB page locked forever. This means, if you never saw a bug, but got the bug number and you log it, that bug is in risk of being taken out of the game. Don't do this to TB owners who inadvertently might post a photo, or someone else posts a photo, of their TB number. Don't log it virtually. It's considered abuse of the system. And it's not fair play.

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When "discovered" first came on the scene I was not sure how it was to be used or when. Not long later I had a chance to log someones personal TB, her wheel chair. As I was writing the log I realized that "discovered" would be perfect log option and used it.

 

For some time now I have been becoming quite annoyed with "discovered". I had up until yesterday a watch on "Cindy the Cinderblock." I simply got tired of getting notifications one after the other for "discovered" and not seeing the TB actually go anywhere.

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I was at the same event that Wile E. Dragonfly was at, and I have debated on discovering this impressive coin collection that was at the event. I could double the number of my coin count and quadruple the number of icons I have, easily placing my trackable page up there with the likes of some of the most prolithic cachers in the country. Of course, now I doubt that they actually found these caches in a real physical cache. My now cynical thought is that they discovered these coins at events.

 

As much as I would love to see a change in methodology of discovering TB and coins, I realize that this practice is probably too established to reverse now. However, I would propose that a new stat be listed below your trackable count total, which would be the total number of miles you have moved all of your travel bugs. So someone with only 10 trackables that has moved them all might have well over 1000 miles, but someone who has discoverd hundreds of coins and TBs at events might only have a few miles to show. This might give an additional clue to who the movers and shakers are... well maybe just the movers. It might also give incentive to move TBs instead of just letting them sit.

 

Another comment on the virtual discoveries... I had read the rule about the TBs risking getting locked, but that doesn't seem to be inforced. Just go look at the Jeep log pages of some of the jeeps that are in the contest photos. I found one jeep that had been logged almost 75 times. And from looking at the actual grab and drop logs, it didn't seem possible that this jeep had been to any events or was in any high volume caches. To further my point, one of the logs said "I discovered this jeep on the internet. A discovery is a discovery". When I checked this cacher's trackable page, they had over 70 green jeeps on their count.

 

OK, enough of my rant. I really just wanted to suggest the mileage total and see what folks thought.

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I used the discovered option when I was travelling. I stopped at a TB cache and exchanged the bugs I was carrying for a couple of bugs in the cache. I couldn't take all of them so I wrote down the numbers and discovered them. Then I was able to put notes on the other bug's pages that they were not in the cache.

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ok,

 

I used the discovered option when I was travelling. I stopped at a TB cache and exchanged the bugs I was carrying for a couple of bugs in the cache. I couldn't take all of them so I wrote down the numbers and discovered them. Then I was able to put notes on the other bug's pages that they were not in the cache.

 

Going back to the original posted topic.

 

I appreciate the effort made towards identifying missing bugs, seriously, but I'm not sure what it has to do with Discovering the bugs still in the cache.

Edited by BlueDeuce

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I agree. I report missing bugs all of the time, but never discover any. If I have no intention of taking a bug and it's been in the cache for a while, I will send an email to the owner to tell them that it is still there, but that still doesn't require discovery.

 

I really like the suggestion to have a feature indicating the number of miles a cacher has moved the TBs. The miles are already tracked on the bugs page, so I'm guessing it wouldn't be hard to include distance on a cachers page.

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I set several TBs loose a few months back for a race, and in addition to one of them going MIA within a week, I've been fairly disappointed in the ratio of "discovered it"s to "retrieved from..."s. It seems that there are quite a few folks who are only interested in boosting their stats by "discovering" the TBs and not grabbing them and actually moving them.

Sure, I've seen quite a few TBs in caches that I didn't take (because I wasn't going to be able to move them anywhere good), but I didn't write down the nums just to log it and feel cool about my TB stats.

 

Is it just me? Am I missing the gyst of the whole TB thang?

This happened to me once when i was using my former name of "psychoorange" I had bought 1 new travel bug and placed it in my funky man cache and I don't know if it had been geomuggled of if a new geocacher had taken it and just not said that on geocaching.com

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