Over or under the bridge

[+nosenseofdirection]

Hi,

 

I'm a newbie struggling to find one of the caches near me.

 

First, have I got the settings wrong on my GPSr?

Explorist 210.

North reference set to magnetic.

Coord system: Lat Long DEG/MIN.MMM

Map system WGS 84

 

Anything wrong there? Anything else that should be set?

I thought I was set right as GPSr gets me to another cache nearby very accurately.

 

Secondly, does being up on a road bridge over a canal or down on the towpath affect the ccordinates or the indication of how close I am to the cache?

 

I have Map (Magellan DirectRoute) on my GPSr puts cache in the middle of a road bridge over a canal. When I get there, takes me to pavement (I'm in the UK = USA sidewalk I think) bit past centre of bridge. There's one place that partly fits clues nearby but, from what I can see, only partly. And doesn't fit with comments in logs.

 

I think the cache is more likely to be by the canal towpath, near the bridge. I think it unlikely to be under the bridge. Plotting on the map locates to bridge but clue suggests near but not under bridge. But as I get near, the GPSr seems to point to the other side of the canal. No towpath there so I don't see how it could be. And the log comments seem to me to indicate the towpath.

 

But as the GPSr isn't pointing to this side, I don't know whether to be hunting on up- or down-stream side of bridge. And it's a busy place, so I can't do too much obvious hunting.

 

I'd be grateful for any suggestions. I've been there three times so far and still DNF

 

Edit: And it's definitely there. While I was posting this, someone posted a find! Interestingly, (is that a word?) his GPSr pointed him to "a private locked garden" which I think might also have been the opposite side of canal to the towpath. Looking at the location, there's somewhere I think it may be but I don't see how I can possibly go climbing, scrambling and rooting around with so many passing muggles.

 

Thanks.

Edited August 19, 2006 by nosenseofdirection

[+Chuy!]

I use Garmins but your settings appear right to me.

 

However, you should be contacting the owner or previous finders for help.

 

It help us if you provided the waypoint so we could look up the webpage. However, I still suggest you contact the owner and/or previous finders. This is one way to make contacts and introduce yourself to fellow cachers in your area.

[+nosenseofdirection]

I use Garmins but your settings appear right to me.

 

However, you should be contacting the owner or previous finders for help.

 

It help us if you provided the waypoint so we could look up the webpage. However, I still suggest you contact the owner and/or previous finders. This is one way to make contacts and introduce yourself to fellow cachers in your area.

 

Thanks, Chuy! First I wanted to check whether I've set my GPSr properly (thank you for telling me I have) and secondly, whether how high I am makes a difference

- are the coordinates right, and the same, whether I'm on the bridge or down on the footpath?

- when the GPSr shows me how far I am from the cache, does that include vertical distance?

 

I hadn't explained my query clearly.

 

And I will contact the owner if I still can't find it. I've looked at the page again and there are spoiler photos so I think I know where to hunt now. I try not to look at spoilers when I set out and had forgotten they were there. GCNXEN

 

Thanks for your help.

[+AuntieWeasel]

Ha! The last finder says, "I had just about given up as my gps had me in a private locked garden. But then I thought..there can only be one place..and I was right."

 

So it sounds like a tricky one for coords, but an apparent hiding place. Good for you, logging your DNF -- it's good gamplay (and it increases the chances the owner will offer you a hint).

 

Your settings are correct for geocaching. Be careful if you use it in conjunction with any British mapping software, though -- that will use an Ordnance Survey datum instead of WGS85. Very confusing to go back and forth (though the OS maps are excellent!).

[+briansnat]

You have to remember that the cache could be 30, 40, 50 feet or more from where your GPS is telling you it is.

[+nosenseofdirection]

Ha! The last finder says, "I had just about given up as my gps had me in a private locked garden. But then I thought..there can only be one place..and I was right."

 

So it sounds like a tricky one for coords, but an apparent hiding place. Good for you, logging your DNF -- it's good gamplay (and it increases the chances the owner will offer you a hint).

Thanks for the encouragement.

Your settings are correct for geocaching. Be careful if you use it in conjunction with any British mapping software, though -- that will use an Ordnance Survey datum instead of WGS85. Very confusing to go back and forth (though the OS maps are excellent!).

 

This is something I wanted to ask more about. I've already discovered some of this - wondered why I was over 100yd out at the second & third caches I hunted for and found I'd changed settings of the datum to an OS one.

 

Sometimes I'll be walking off road using OS maps so am trying to sort out how to do this.

 

1. I download loc file from website to PC, convert with Magellan software and load onto GPSr - I assume with GPSr set on lat/long and WGS84.

2. Change GPSr to OS datum and OS grid so I can look between map and GPSr to check where I am.

3. Near the cache, do I need to swap back to lat/long and WGS84 or can I stay on both the OS settings to find the cache?

 

Thank you.

[dunderhead]

You have to remember that the cache could be 30, 40, 50 feet or more from where your GPS is telling you it is.

 

That's one of the great things about this "game", people needing 3 foot accuracy..where's the challenge?

(No-one said this..it's a slow Sunday)

[+nosenseofdirection]

You have to remember that the cache could be 30, 40, 50 feet or more from where your GPS is telling you it is.

Oh, I thought that if the GPSr was quoting me a 5yd accuracy, that was the radius to search.

 

What's been tough on the canal towpath is that accuracy varies because of the bridge and the walls up to road level. The place it points seems different depending where I am. And two parts of the clue seem to me to indicate two different places.

 

Now I've found the spoiler, I hope I'll manage - if I can find a time without passers by.

[+AuntieWeasel]

You'd be better off asking the question in the UK forum. I consistently mess this up.

 

If you've downloaded the coords off geocaching.com directly to your GPS, stick with WGS84. If you've downloaded them into a mapping program first, and then into your GPS...ummm...pass. This is where I get confused.

 

You're right, though...100 yards is about the difference.

[+Moore9KSUcats]

You have to remember that the cache could be 30, 40, 50 feet or more from where your GPS is telling you it is.

Oh, I thought that if the GPSr was quoting me a 5yd accuracy, that was the radius to search.

 

What's been tough on the canal towpath is that accuracy varies because of the bridge and the walls up to road level. The place it points seems different depending where I am. And two parts of the clue seem to me to indicate two different places.

 

Now I've found the spoiler, I hope I'll manage - if I can find a time without passers by.

 

Remember, if YOUR GPSr is showing a 5 yard accuracy, you also have to take into account that the placer also may have had that same 5 yard accuracy... giving you a possible combined accuracy of 10 yards or more.... it all depends on the configuration of the satellites! Have you ever set your GPSr down on a picnic table and watched the accuracy change constantly, or set it to a page where you actually see the coordinates and watch them fluctuate? Really interesting at times.

 

Malia

[+briansnat]

You have to remember that the cache could be 30, 40, 50 feet or more from where your GPS is telling you it is.

Oh, I thought that if the GPSr was quoting me a 5yd accuracy, that was the radius to search.

 

What's been tough on the canal towpath is that accuracy varies because of the bridge and the walls up to road level. The place it points seems different depending where I am. And two parts of the clue seem to me to indicate two different places.

 

Now I've found the spoiler, I hope I'll manage - if I can find a time without passers by.

 

Remember, if YOUR GPSr is showing a 5 yard accuracy, you also have to take into account that the placer also may have had that same 5 yard accuracy... giving you a possible combined accuracy of 10 yards or more.... it all depends on the configuration of the satellites! Have you ever set your GPSr down on a picnic table and watched the accuracy change constantly, or set it to a page where you actually see the coordinates and watch them fluctuate? Really interesting at times.

 

Malia

True. Also, the estimated accuracy (A.K.A. EPE) is just that, an estimate.

Edited August 20, 2006 by briansnat

[+currykev]

Ha! The last finder says, "I had just about given up as my gps had me in a private locked garden. But then I thought..there can only be one place..and I was right."

 

This is uncanny,as I very rarely look at this forum..But those are my very words from yesterdays find.

Don't let coords put you off.Mostly they are almost spot on,and at other times not so good.Cache spots near bridges are always double the fun and work.(is it on or under).Over time you get a sixth sense of where the cache may be,just I had yesterday.I will always read the hint if after a period of time I cannot find the cache.

I will sometimes give another slight hint in my log too,but nothing that will give the game away.The "hider" will also usually give you a further clue if you send a polite PM to him/her.

I'm sure this cache will be found if you give it another go.

[+nosenseofdirection]

I'm sure this cache will be found if you give it another go.

 

I FOUND IT! I FOUND IT!

 

Thanks for the encouragement, Kev, and the e-mailed hint. Knowing you'd found it reassured me it was still there so OK to keep hunting.

 

I'd forgotten there are picture spoilers too so I used those to confirm I was thinking of the right place.

 

Found by touch, not by sight: looked and looked, couldn't find it. Shoved my hand in where I thought it "should" be and there it was!

 

Still don't know the answer to my question - do coordinates change depending if you're higher or lower? Theoretically, if GPSr could still receive through a bridge, would it show the same coordinate on top of the bridge as under? What happens up hills? How are the coordinates accurate?

 

Would like to know the theory so grateful for any answers.

 

Meanwhile, jumping up and down I FOUND IT!

 

nosenseofdirection

(& nosenseofdecorum!)

[+darus67]

I don't think that vertical distance matters. As far as I know you could be hovering 500 ft up and 5 feet north, in a balloon, and the GPS would still only indicate 5 ft away.

 

As far as receiving through a bridge, it depends on several factors. What is the bridge made of, how big is it, how high is it, etc...

A steel and concrete bridge is going to block the signal a lot more than an old wooden one.

[+Sioneva]

Vertical distance does not factor in at all. As I discovered, much to my dismay, while standing at the bottom of a steep, unclimbable-looking cliff.

 

More then once.

[+nosenseofdirection]

Vertical distance does not factor in at all. As I discovered, much to my dismay, while standing at the bottom of a steep, unclimbable-looking cliff.

 

More then once.

I don't think that vertical distance matters. As far as I know you could be hovering 500 ft up and 5 feet north, in a balloon, and the GPS would still only indicate 5 ft away.

 

Thanks. Am learning.

 

.... wandering off planning how to hide a cache in a balloon ....

Edited August 30, 2006 by nosenseofdirection