Forum Censorship

[+Road Rabbit]

Hey, as long as you run the place and are passionate about it, be the biggest smartaleck you want to be. Nobody's going to send you to bed without your supper!

[Clan Riffster]

"Pssst... Jeremy's coming.... Everybody look busy!"

[+edscott]

 

And yes, Jeremy should probably bite his tongue or curb his tone when responding to things. He is a visible representative of his company. I can't comment on forums for my company (or about my company) for the same reasons. A professional demeanor must be maintained in public. Basically, any post he makes here, should be written as a tech support response. Polite, to the point, and thanking them for their feedback (if he won't use an idea, should seldom be commented on)).

 

 

Ugg. I'm glad I don't work at your company.

 

I'm passionate about what I do. I'd hope the same for any company. You don't have to be a cardboard cutout you know.

 

Jeremy,

 

Your website is the 800 pound gorilla of cache listing sites, because you consistantly change and improve.

 

The majority of your customers never experience your passion quite like we do here in the forums.

 

I've said this before...... Active geocachers are now equal in number to that of a large town, or a small city. YOU are the Mayor of Geocaching Town like it or not. AS SUCH, you should be above using sarcasm and derision toward the citizens of Geocaching Town for the common good.

 

I believe THAT is what Janx was trying to communicate and I agree.

 

 

I don't know if you really want to tell Jeremy to act like, "The Mayor of Geocaching Town."

 

Just last month at our city council meeting, a lady was voicing a complaint to the mayor. He told her to "Go home and clean your house."

 

 

Bet he was banned when he got home.

[+sbell111]

I don't know if you really want to tell Jeremy to act like, "The Mayor of Geocaching Town."

 

Just last month at our city council meeting, a lady was voicing a complaint to the mayor. He told her to "Go home and clean your house."

 

My towns mayor recently said, in an interview, that if people didn't like his decisions then they could move.

 

Turns out we have one more option...

Edited August 10, 2006 by sbell111

[+sbell111]

It occured to me that some of the same people that state that people are getting too politically correct complain that Jeremy is a big meanie.

[janx]

 

And yes, Jeremy should probably bite his tongue or curb his tone when responding to things. He is a visible representative of his company. I can't comment on forums for my company (or about my company) for the same reasons. A professional demeanor must be maintained in public. Basically, any post he makes here, should be written as a tech support response. Polite, to the point, and thanking them for their feedback (if he won't use an idea, should seldom be commented on)).

 

 

Ugg. I'm glad I don't work at your company.

 

I'm passionate about what I do. I'd hope the same for any company. You don't have to be a cardboard cutout you know.

 

Jeremy,

 

Your website is the 800 pound gorilla of cache listing sites, because you consistantly change and improve.

 

The majority of your customers never experience your passion quite like we do here in the forums.

 

I've said this before...... Active geocachers are now equal in number to that of a large town, or a small city. YOU are the Mayor of Geocaching Town like it or not. AS SUCH, you should be above using sarcasm and derision toward the citizens of Geocaching Town for the common good.

 

I believe THAT is what Janx was trying to communicate and I agree.

 

Snoogans has the gist of my point. And having passion for something isn't a bad thing. But how you say things matters, especially when you are the public mouth of the employee.

 

Also consider, my company is in the top 20 of the Fortune 500. Big companies like that do have rules about talking about the company, because they want a consistent (and friendly) image presented. Whether they succeed or not...

 

I'm a software developer. I have some communciating skills, but I'm keenly aware of how easy it is to slip into smarter than the users tone of voice. And that always alienates people.

 

To steer this train of thought back onto track, I would recommend this:

Any Groundspeak employee should monitor their tone in posts, to maintain a profesional appearance for the company. If they can't do that, they should get a sock puppet account for their "personal" posts, or consider that what they're saying isn't very appropriate anyway. A form of self-censorship if you will. If Groundspeak has no such policy for its moderators or employees (of any sort on the topic of posts and tone), than it should make up a policy.

[+denali7]

Great, then Groundspeak could be just another faceless corporate entity. This is a hobby and it's supposed to be fun and loose, the way many of us like it. If we wanted to feel like we were dealing with a Fortune 500 Top 20 corporation, we would actually be working right now.

Edited August 10, 2006 by denali7

[+sbell111]

... And strip mining the gc.com database is also doable. ...

You might take a look at the TOU.

To steer this train of thought back onto track, I would recommend this:

Any Groundspeak employee should monitor their tone in posts, to maintain a profesional appearance for the company. If they can't do that, they should get a sock puppet account for their "personal" posts, or consider that what they're saying isn't very appropriate anyway. A form of self-censorship if you will. If Groundspeak has no such policy for its moderators or employees (of any sort on the topic of posts and tone), than it should make up a policy.

I disagree.

 

Sure, Jeremy's wit takes a little getting used to, but it's not like he is able to leave the office at 4pm and not deal with the work until the next business day. It often seems like he's dealing with this stuff 24/7/365. Do you actually expect him to not participate online except when he is giving a technical answer? Also, as I recall, Jeremy has a personal account. Would it really make a difference to you if he was only snarky using this account? I bet it wouldn't.

 

Back to the subject of the thread, in the past, we've seen a couple of kinds of drama. Some posts that were totally inappropriate have been censored. However, threads that were used to attack TPTB were generally left open. How do you think this plays into the 'censorship' issue?

[+Snoogans]

Sure, Jeremy's wit takes a little getting used to, but it's not like he is able to leave the office at 4pm and not deal with the work until the next business day. It often seems like he's dealing with this stuff 24/7/365.

 

That does not make sarcasm & derision toward customers (paying or not) excusable.

 

Try that one on at work yourself.

[+sbell111]

That does not make sarcasm & derision toward customers (paying or not) excusable.

 

Try that one on at work yourself.

If it bothered me, I wouldn't participate in these forums. It doesn't, so I stick.

 

In my opinion, Jeremy gives what he gets.

[+sbell111]

I'm reminded of the Frybrid forums. The owner of the company simply doesn't suffer fools gladly. It makes some people angry. Fortunately, he makes the best systems so people will still buy from him.

 

Would the behavior be acceptable if the competition provided the same quality? I don't know. I do know that I could care less if a company owner gets snarky now and then. It doesn't really affect the product.

 

Again, as long as the product and service is good, the forums don't really matter.

[janx]

Great, then Groundspeak could be just another faceless corporate entity. This is a hobby and it's supposed to be fun and loose, the way many of us like it. If we wanted to feel like we were dealing with a Fortune 500 Top 20 corporation, we would actually be working right now.

 

It is not fun and loose if the folks who run geocaching.com, and effectively define GPS games for the majority of users, present themselves as impolite, unfriendly, and not open to new ideas. A fun and loose environment on GC.com would mean nearly every game idea is supported, and nobody would be complaining about tone in posts by gc.com personnel. If the gc.com people exert control on the hobby, than loose is definitely not what is occurring here.

 

My main point is, the gc.com folks SHOULD be considerate in how they handle the public, regardless of the amount of flak they get. Tech support folks aren't allowed to vent at the customers. No matter how stupid the customer is.

 

And yeah, I don't participate in online forums about my industry, because its not worth the hassle of worrying about presentation, or trouble from or for my company. Employees can get in trouble for their blogs for the same reason.

[+sbell111]

It is not fun and loose if the folks who run geocaching.com, and effectively define GPS games for the majority of users, present themselves as impolite, unfriendly, and not open to new ideas.

We could argue about when someone must be friendly and polite v being able to vent, be sarcastic, and be somewhat snarky. However, I believe that TPTB have been open to new ideas. They may not have implemented every suggestion, but it is their responsibility to pick and choose.

Edited August 10, 2006 by sbell111

[+denali7]

present themselves as impolite, unfriendly, and not open to new ideas...

 

Your opinion. I say, "hogwash."

Tomato, to-mah-to.

[+Cornerstone4]

Great, then Groundspeak could be just another faceless corporate entity. This is a hobby and it's supposed to be fun and loose, the way many of us like it. If we wanted to feel like we were dealing with a Fortune 500 Top 20 corporation, we would actually be working right now.

 

It is not fun and loose if the folks who run geocaching.com, and effectively define GPS games for the majority of users, present themselves as impolite, unfriendly, and not open to new ideas. A fun and loose environment on GC.com would mean nearly every game idea is supported, and nobody would be complaining about tone in posts by gc.com personnel. If the gc.com people exert control on the hobby, than loose is definitely not what is occurring here.

 

My main point is, the gc.com folks SHOULD be considerate in how they handle the public, regardless of the amount of flak they get. Tech support folks aren't allowed to vent at the customers. No matter how stupid the customer is.

 

And yeah, I don't participate in online forums about my industry, because its not worth the hassle of worrying about presentation, or trouble from or for my company. Employees can get in trouble for their blogs for the same reason.

 

I pulled this off the GC homepage just now:

 

There are 298912 active caches in 222 countries.

In the last 7 days, there have been 211489 new logs written by 34277 account holders.

 

I highlighted and enlarged the number of account holders. These are just the number of account holders that were active in the last 7 days. Doesn't take into account the people that are members, but have actually been working over the last week.

 

Anyway, my point is, look at all the people that are caching, and look at the small handful that are in the forums complaining about poor attitudes or inconsiderate treatment.

 

I'd be willing to wager that any Fortune 500 company would pay big money to have that kind of customer satisfaction percentage.

 

There is no way any company will ever make all of your customers happy. If you had a business with 5 customers, you can bet that if you made a major decision, at least 1 of them will be unhappy.

 

I've been in business for 24 years now. There have been times, where I have had to make a tough decision, and let a client go. Every so often, you get a client that is impossible to make happy. When you sit back and look at it, even if they generate a lot of income, sometimes the underlying costs wash out any benifit you may perceive.