Those Rattles Really Work!

[+ramapo]

I was hiking in the Newark watershed yesterday and had my first snake encounter since I was about five years old when I almost stepped on a copperhead, back in the day when rattlesnakes and copperheads still called Hawthorne, NJ home.

 

I was on the red trail headed towards Needful Things from the fire tower. I was moving at a good clip, and the trail was fairly open, although it was grassy. As often the case when hiking, I was kind of in a zone, thinking about stuff while enjoying the day, just like driving on autopilot. Now and then I'd make some noise to alert any bruins in the area.

 

Suddenly I was jolted into awareness by a very loud rattle. Just ahead, not more than a handful of steps, was a good-sized rattlesnake lying in the grass in the middle of the trail. Had he not warned me, I would've been upon him in seconds. He was not visible to me when I heard the rattle.

 

I backed off to a safe distance and watched to see what he was going to do. I took a step forward to get a better look and he rattled again. Then he started to move, not into the brush but down the trail towards me.

So I backed down the trail searching for a detour. I found one and moved very carefully around his location and then back to the trail. What was a bit disconcerting was that when I got back to the trail, I couldn't see him any longer, so after a very careful look, I quickly moved out of the area.

 

Of course I didn't have my camera with me, although I don't think I would've gotten much of a picture anyway. I certainly wouldn't have gone any closer to him to get a portrait. But he was a good-looking snake.

 

Snakes were on my mind for the rest of the hike. I've been thinking about my situation had I been bitten. I was alone, and at least a good 30-minutes from my car, not that hiking out would've been a sensible option. I guess a call to 911 would've been first on the list, followed by remaining calm and still, while waiting for assistance.

 

Some googling today brought me to a page for the Sawyer Extractor, which is a simple vacuum device that will remove up to half the venom. Might not be a bad idea to carry one, just in case.

 

Although the chance of getting bitten is slim, I consider myself warned to be more aware. I always knew rattlers are out there but there's nothing like a face-to-face encounter to make you take them a bit more seriously. The problem is that snakes are made to blend into the environment so you're not supposed to see them. Also, I just read that the snake's rattles don't work when wet. I hope the snakes stay in their dens when it rains.

 

So be careful out there, not just when searching rocks but along the trail at all times. It's not just the bears and mountain lions that you have to watch out for.

[+Phonedave]

I was hiking in the Newark watershed yesterday and had my first snake encounter since I was about five years old when I almost stepped on a copperhead, back in the day when rattlesnakes and copperheads still called Hawthorne, NJ home.

 

I was on the red trail headed towards Needful Things from the fire tower. I was moving at a good clip, and the trail was fairly open, although it was grassy. As often the case when hiking, I was kind of in a zone, thinking about stuff while enjoying the day, just like driving on autopilot. Now and then I'd make some noise to alert any bruins in the area.

 

Suddenly I was jolted into awareness by a very loud rattle. Just ahead, not more than a handful of steps, was a good-sized rattlesnake lying in the grass in the middle of the trail. Had he not warned me, I would've been upon him in seconds. He was not visible to me when I heard the rattle.

 

I backed off to a safe distance and watched to see what he was going to do. I took a step forward to get a better look and he rattled again. Then he started to move, not into the brush but down the trail towards me.

So I backed down the trail searching for a detour. I found one and moved very carefully around his location and then back to the trail. What was a bit disconcerting was that when I got back to the trail, I couldn't see him any longer, so after a very careful look, I quickly moved out of the area.

 

Of course I didn't have my camera with me, although I don't think I would've gotten much of a picture anyway. I certainly wouldn't have gone any closer to him to get a portrait. But he was a good-looking snake.

 

Snakes were on my mind for the rest of the hike. I've been thinking about my situation had I been bitten. I was alone, and at least a good 30-minutes from my car, not that hiking out would've been a sensible option. I guess a call to 911 would've been first on the list, followed by remaining calm and still, while waiting for assistance.

 

Some googling today brought me to a page for the Sawyer Extractor, which is a simple vacuum device that will remove up to half the venom. Might not be a bad idea to carry one, just in case.

 

Although the chance of getting bitten is slim, I consider myself warned to be more aware. I always knew rattlers are out there but there's nothing like a face-to-face encounter to make you take them a bit more seriously. The problem is that snakes are made to blend into the environment so you're not supposed to see them. Also, I just read that the snake's rattles don't work when wet. I hope the snakes stay in their dens when it rains.

 

So be careful out there, not just when searching rocks but along the trail at all times. It's not just the bears and mountain lions that you have to watch out for.

 

Don't bother

 

I was going to write a reply when I saw this, but first I went to eat. As I ate, I was reading the copy of Backpacker that just came. How topical can you get. Page 59

 

What is the best way to treat a bite from a poisonous snake?

 

My best advice is to relax. Most bites come from pit vipers like rattlers, and getting excited actually increases the rare chance of death. First sit dowan and calm yourself. Next wash the wound. If bitten on the arm or leg, keep it level with the heart, and remove jewelery in case of swelling, which happens in 75-percent of all pit viper bites. Walk out slowly and seek medical attention. If you are deep in the wilderness, arrange for an air evacuation.

 

He then goes into what to do if a coral snake bites you (bind and splint the wound)

 

He finishes with this advice

 

As for snakebite kits, don't bother packing one. No kit removes enough venom to change the outcome of a bite.

 

 

 

The fact is, a lot of bites are dry bites, and messing around with an extractor can make it worse. If you remain calm, dress the wound, and walk out slowly you should do fine, even if its not a dry bite.

 

-dave

Edited July 31, 2006 by Phonedave

[+edscott]

Phonedave is totally on target. Snakebite kits are worse than useless, they are dangerous. "Up to half the venom" means that it will remove half or less... so .00001% is not a lie. The manufacturers and sellers are lucky they have not been sued.. or maybe they have been.. Lawyers out there anywhere?? You are likely to cause more damage to your body than the snake did. Infection, cuting tendons or ligaments in wrists, ankles, or hands.. and most of all wasting time that could be spent getting to some professional care... which BTW will probably NOT include a dose of anti-venom. And the fact that he came toward you doesn't mean he was coming after you. He was most likely heading for the nearest cover or taking the easiest route to eventually get away. Yes when I see a snake I go on "alert", if I see that it is a Rattlesnake or Copperhead I go on "full alert", but I don't let it affect my day.

[+briansnat]

I'm on full alert in certain areas all the time now. What really worries me are copperheads. They don't rattle and like to stay still. That and they are pretty camoflaged. At least rattlesnakes let you know they are there - sometimes. I read somewhere that the tendancy to rattle is evolving out of them because snakes that rattle in encouters with humans often wind up dead.

 

My wife actually stepped on a rattler last year at one of Treequest's caches in Rockaway Valley WMA. I heard her scream from a good distance away.

[+ramapo]

Thanks for the comments...I've always had the same impression as you both in regards to snakebite kits but the one I came across was referenced on the California Poison Control website page regarding snakebites, so I gave it some credence. The Sawyer Extractor is a suction pump, there's no cutting of any kind required.

 

Interesting how you find conflicting advice though. I've seen recommendations to keep the affected limb lower than the heart, you quote level with the heart. Some say tie something loosely above the bite to reduce the venom traveling through the lymphatic system. Never tie a tourniquet though.

 

Your advice is sensible and likely the best route for all but the most serious of situations.

 

I didn't think the snake was really chasing me, it was just funny that he decided to pick that route to get away.

I'm sure he was as anxious to be left alone as I was.

[+Packanack]

Snakes appear to move a lot faster than they actually do. A human can walk faster than the fastest snake can move across ground. I encountered a snake ontop of a cache box yesterday and it was a cammo box so the snake blended right in, it moved as I was reaching for the box. Gave me a little start, but it was a harmless.

[+tadpole379]

I had had several snake encounters caching in Harriman. I've never been afraid of snakes, but the first rattlesnake that I ran into really opened my eyes and made me aware that they can be dangerous. I was hiking alone near waterboys' old cache watertank, which is really far from anything. I was moving along at a good clip and I heard the rattle. I instinctively jumped back and it took me a good 30 seconds to visually locate the snake, which was really big. I was very close to the snake, and if it hadn't rattled, I would have stepped on it, which was what scared me. It made me realize that it probably wasn't the best idea to be out alone should something happen. My family knew I was out caching, but not exactly where, and my cell phone had no service, like many areas of the park.

Since then, I always cache with someone else (I drag my dad all over the place). While caching together, we ran into another, much smaller rattler near Cats Elbow in the northern park of the park. The snake was more interested in getting away from us, but it still pays to have a buddy and be aware because there are venemous snakes out there.

[+Phonedave]

Phonedave is totally on target. Snakebite kits are worse than useless, they are dangerous. "Up to half the venom" means that it will remove half or less... so .00001% is not a lie. The manufacturers and sellers are lucky they have not been sued.. or maybe they have been.. Lawyers out there anywhere?? You are likely to cause more damage to your body than the snake did. Infection, cuting tendons or ligaments in wrists, ankles, or hands.. and most of all wasting time that could be spent getting to some professional care... which BTW will probably NOT include a dose of anti-venom. And the fact that he came toward you doesn't mean he was coming after you. He was most likely heading for the nearest cover or taking the easiest route to eventually get away. Yes when I see a snake I go on "alert", if I see that it is a Rattlesnake or Copperhead I go on "full alert", but I don't let it affect my day.

 

I am on "alert" too whenever I am out, but I still do stupid things. Geocaching has created some bad habits in me that I now try to break. Before Geocaching I never would climb a sunny rock slope reaching into holes looking for an ammo can. After a few suprises (no venomous snakes though) I started using a "poking stick" and now I use one of my trekking poles (lets hear it for achy knees !). I was out in Colorado a few weeks ago for business and was killing time caching. I once again got into the bad habit and while balancing on some rip rap in a drainage slope I was poking though the rock, and was startled by a snake (it moved too fast, and I was too busy trying not to fall down the slope to identify it).

 

But then somtimes I am startled by birds flushing as well. Man sometimes I hate grouse in the winter

 

-dave

Edited August 1, 2006 by Phonedave

[avroair]

But then somtimes I am startled by birds flushing as well. Man sometimes I hate grouse in the winter

 

-dave

 

Black dragons scare me the most... they jump right up: Vulture Bait

 

All kidding aside I have also formed some bad habits, I find wearing gloves offers a little protection from something trying to bite me, but a poking stick is also a good idea.

[+ramapo]

Wild turkeys and deer scare me all the time. On Sunday a large deer broke near the trail when I was almost back to the car. I must've jumped 10 feet, higher than from the snake. The rattlesnake just startled me (ok, I did jump back and probably even muttered something loudly).

 

I too have sometimes been less than careful while geocaching. One thing I don't ever do is stick my hand where I can't see. I usually use a stick when checking spots, but not always as I'll sometimes move rocks by hand without really checking around them. I'm always careful hiking/climbing in rocky areas, especially sunny slopes but I do tromp places that I probably shouldn't, especially through high brush where you just can't see what you're stepping into.

 

Probably a good rule of thumb is one the one used when driving at night. Don't go any faster than you can safely and clearly see ahead.

[+edscott]

All kidding aside I have also formed some bad habits, I find wearing gloves offers a little protection from something trying to bite me, but a poking stick is also a good idea.

 

Yes I've taken to using the poking stick also. When I was a kid I was taught to be very cautious about snakes. I lived in an area of Western PA that had plenty of Copperheads and we spent lots of time in North Central PA trout fishing and Rattlesnakes were relatively common. I looked for poisonous snakes as I walked and would see one or two a week.

After I started Orienteering I had pay more attention to the map and terrain so quit looking for snakes and only saw a couple over the next 25 years. Now I am starting to see them again... mostly when I get to the cache area and start to study the ground. So my conclusion is that snakes like caches and thus will hide near them.. always poke them with a stick before opening the cache...

[+Western Mass Clan]

 

Black dragons scare me the most... they jump right up: Vulture Bait

 

 

Thanks for sharing avroair ..... I got a nice chuckle out of those 4 logs.

 

Of course, I can laugh. Had I been there too I probably would have joined along in crapping my pants.

 

Cheers,

 

Matt

[+fox-and-the-hound]

It's not just the Copperheads either! We ran over (actually Fox stepped on) this Timber a couples weeks ago on our DNF at A Fruitful Find. It was just laying in the sun and tall grass. Until it turned and snapped at his pants for stepping on the tail That woke us both out of caching daydreams! Back to wearing heavy leather gloves when reaching in a hole

 

Edited August 2, 2006 by fox-and-the-hound

[+trowel32]

I've encountered three rattlesnakes so far all near the Delaware Water Gap (one at Sunfish Pond, one at Sunrise Mountain, and most recently one near the the "Don't Let the Bears Get You" cache). The recent one was the only one that actually rattled at us. My boyfriend almost stepped on the one at Sunfish Pond since it never rattled at us. For the most part the seemed to want to get away from us, or else just didn't really care that we were there. My boyfriend's theory was that the one that rattled felt the most threatened and just wanted us to get out of there. The other two seemed like they couldn't care less that we were there.

 

I was wondering the same thing about what we would do if one of us got bit. I figured I would call 911, and then slowly walk towards the car or the nearest civilization.

[+klizich]

Haven't personally seen one yet, but always looking...would like the chance to take pictures. Two suggestions, maybe 3.

First, I have a good friend who spent just shy of 3 full tours in VietNam with the 101st AB as a "lurp" - Long Range Recon. Patrol. These were the six man teams who were dropped WAY IN behind enemy lines to access intelligence and conduct ambushes. They could not speak and had to rely on hand signals. They had elephants, tigers, cobras, boa constrictors and all sorts of other lovely creatures to deal with, not to mention the VC booby traps. He impressed upon me that moving swiftly, but safely was important, and, could be done by constantly being aware of your surroundings - look close, medium, far, peripheral sides...then repeat. This has allowed me to see things I might have missed. When geocaching, there really is no good reason to be in a hurry.

Second, "Snake Guardz" or the like. Snakebite proof gaiters or leggings. After TRL had a dry bite last year and bought a pair, I did likewise. Somewhat for those few times you can't see what you are walking in, mostly to keep my legs from getting cut up by the pricker bushes, thorns, etc. outside (they also work well at home weed wacking). They are light and offer protection. They saved my buns last summer when I didn't realize I had located an underground yellowjacket nest. I felt a couple of "burns" on my upper leg, looked down and saw the 2 that were stinging me, the two that were stinging the loose pants only and about 20 below the knee biting the Snake Guardz. I would worry more about a first time anaphylactic shock/allergy reaction to the bees than the snakes out there. They run about $50 and are very helpful. I have seen a large number of snakes this year so far, but none poisonous yet. They really are not aggressive unless stepped on.

Third, take a trip to the Space Farms in Beemerville, NJ (out past Sussex Airport). They have maintained a snake pit for years. Every year it is filled with local poisonous snakes as well as non-poisonous snakes. Periodically, one of the Spaces goes into the pit and shows everyone how these reptiles are NOT aggressive...by the way, he is NOT wearing snakebite protection on his legs. He lightly handles them with a hook to show them to the audience up behind the safety fencing.

Caveat: a few years back in the local "rag" (newspaper) was an article about a guy that got bit by a rattlesnake near the Delaware Water Gap in NJ. Seems this young man had (1) been imbibing in alcoholic beverages slightly to excess, and, (2) was trying to handle the snake. DUH! Wonder why he got bit! The story didn't end there, though. Turns out he had an allergy to the antivenin and it took about a week of monitoring to make sure he was ok. Upon release he was slapped with a horrific fine (into the thousands of dollars) for his actions...the rattlesnake is federally protected as an endangered species. Also, it was the Feds who popped him. Old professional saying - don't screw with the Feds! They don't play "let's make a deal" with sentences or fines!

[+trowel32]

Do they make those guards for hands? I seem to keep getting stung this summer in the same spot on the same hand

[+Mike McLaughlin]

Copperhead "Rattles", but don't bring one to a party.

 

Many years ago (1945) I and two buddies were walking in some low ground near a swamp (in SC). We heard a rattle, very distinct. We froze, and looked around. A few feet in front of us on the trail was a copperhead. He was young, with a fairly distinct yellow tail - which was vibrating rapidly, in dry leaves.

 

More recently, much more recently, (2003) a guy was bitten by a copperhead in the midst of an annual town celebration. Right in the middle of town. How'd he get bit, when there were over a thousand people around, who did not? Easy. he brought the snake with him, in a paper bag. Then he reached into the bag to get it out ... he survived. But probably felt pretty awful when he sobered up. How do I know? I drove the ambulance.

 

If you watch where you step, and where you reach, and don't get into a full bore panic when you see one, the odds are you won't get hurt in the North Eastern and mid-Atlantic states.

[+cimawr]

 

Many years ago (1945) I and two buddies were walking in some low ground near a swamp (in SC). We heard a rattle, very distinct. We froze, and looked around. A few feet in front of us on the trail was a copperhead. He was young, with a fairly distinct yellow tail - which was vibrating rapidly, in dry leaves.

 

 

Yep. I'd be interested in SEEING the snake the OP saw, to know for sure if it actually was a rattlesnake or just a large snake of another species rattling its tail tip.

A lot of people don't realize that vibrating the tail to make a sound is a fairly generic reptile** self-defense technique - rattlesnakes just take it to a higher level with the addition of a sound-enhancing adaptation of the scales on the tail tip.

 

No offense at all intended to OP, btw; A, the post doesn't reference the snake's appearance and/or mention actually seeing rattles, and I have no idea of the OP's level of expertise in recognizing snakes and B, being aware that other snakes may make a rattling sound is a good thing for ANYBODY to know - especially since it may save the life of beneficial non-poisonous snakes.

 

**I've seen lizards rattle the tail, also.

Edited August 28, 2006 by cimawr

[+briansnat]

 

Many years ago (1945) I and two buddies were walking in some low ground near a swamp (in SC). We heard a rattle, very distinct. We froze, and looked around. A few feet in front of us on the trail was a copperhead. He was young, with a fairly distinct yellow tail - which was vibrating rapidly, in dry leaves.

 

 

Yep. I'd be interested in SEEING the snake the OP saw, to know for sure if it actually was a rattlesnake or just a large snake of another species rattling its tail tip.

A lot of people don't realize that vibrating the tail to make a sound is a fairly generic reptile** self-defense technique - rattlesnakes just take it to a higher level with the addition of a sound-enhancing adaptation of the scales on the tail tip.

 

No offense at all intended to OP, btw; A, the post doesn't reference the snake's appearance and/or mention actually seeing rattles, and I have no idea of the OP's level of expertise in recognizing snakes and B, being aware that other snakes may make a rattling sound is a good thing for ANYBODY to know - especially since it may save the life of beneficial non-poisonous snakes.

 

**I've seen lizards rattle the tail, also.

 

Being that rattlesnakes are fairly common in the area the OP was hiking, I have no reason to doubt it was one. That said, I've seen people mistake hognosed snakes for rattlesnakes. They look remotely similar and do vibrate their tails.

[+ramapo]

Well I didn't have my camera or my snake ID book but it was either a rattlesnake or a very good facsimile...

 

It had a diamond-shaped head and yellow and brownish/grayish bands. I didn't see the rattle itself as I had backed away and each time I moved towards it for a look, he rattled pretty loudly. The snake must've been on the young side, maybe 24-30" as a very rough guess (he stretched across a fairly wide trail). What was more obvious was that it wasn't that large in circumference. I've certainly seen bigger snakes.

 

I didn't know that other snakes rattle. I can only hope that the local copperheads would be as obliging....

 

Finally...

"and B, being aware that other snakes may make a rattling sound is a good thing for ANYBODY to know - especially since it may save the life of beneficial non-poisonous snakes. "

 

I really hope that anybody out hiking has enough respect for wildlife to leave a snake alone, be it rattling or not, not to mention that rattlesnakes are a protected species.

[+ramapo]

Space Farms! Great memories...haven't been there in many, many years. Poor Goliath, the giant kodiak bear stuck in a cage. And you never forget Mr. Space going into the snakepit. Mr. Space, what a great name....

[+edscott]

Hognose snakes are often confused with Copperheads, but don't really look very much like a rattlesnake. I have also heard/watched a black snake make a rattling or buzzing sound by vibrating some dry leaves when it was agitated. The sound of a rattlesnake is relatively distinct.. after you have heard one you probably will always recognize the sound.

 

..PS and on the hognosed snake again.... if you do see one, poke it gently with a stick. They will put on a great performance for you.

Edited September 1, 2006 by edscott

[+trail hound]

Space Farms! Great memories...haven't been there in many, many years. Poor Goliath, the giant kodiak bear stuck in a cage.

 

Goliath isn't in the cage any more....He's in the Dining area....Watching everyone eat Buffalo Burgers...

[+perryzip]

We've run into numerous Timber Rattlers this summer while hiking, geocaching and doing trail work with my hiking club The SATC.

 

Hiking on the AT south bound towrds Clarks Ferry we ran into one right in the trail. He was enjoying the sun and didn't want to move. He coiled and rattled. After a few rocks and sticks tossed from a distance, he got sick of us and made his way off into the brush.

 

You can view the one that hung out with us doing trail work here:

 

http://www.perryzip.com/trail_work/todays_mascot_3.jpg

 

http://www.perryzip.com/trail_work/todays_mascot_2.jpg

 

http://www.perryzip.com/trail_work/todays_mascot_1.jpg

 

http://www.perryzip.com/trail_work/todays_mascot.jpg

 

Here's another one my son came across on a previous trail work trip:

 

http://www.perryzip.com/trail_work/timber_rattler.jpg

 

Those are both in the same region but at different times in the summer - notice the distinct difference in color.

 

We visited 2 geocaches near Hamburg, PA last weekend and ran into 3 others - 2 big ones at The Pinnacle (GCEA27) and a little guy at Pulpit Rock (GCEA1A).

 

The rattling is definitely unique and a sound you'll never forget once you hear it.

 

Peace,

perryzip

[+briansnat]

We've run into numerous Timber Rattlers this summer while hiking, geocaching and doing trail work with my hiking club The SATC.

 

Hiking on the AT south bound towrds Clarks Ferry we ran into one right in the trail. He was enjoying the sun and didn't want to move. He coiled and rattled. After a few rocks and sticks tossed from a distance, he got sick of us and made his way off into the brush.

 

You can view the one that hung out with us doing trail work here:

 

http://www.perryzip.com/trail_work/todays_mascot_3.jpg

 

http://www.perryzip.com/trail_work/todays_mascot_2.jpg

 

http://www.perryzip.com/trail_work/todays_mascot_1.jpg

 

http://www.perryzip.com/trail_work/todays_mascot.jpg

 

Here's another one my son came across on a previous trail work trip:

 

http://www.perryzip.com/trail_work/timber_rattler.jpg

 

Those are both in the same region but at different times in the summer - notice the distinct difference in color.

 

We visited 2 geocaches near Hamburg, PA last weekend and ran into 3 others - 2 big ones at The Pinnacle (GCEA27) and a little guy at Pulpit Rock (GCEA1A).

 

The rattling is definitely unique and a sound you'll never forget once you hear it.

 

Peace,

perryzip

 

Awesome pictures!!!!

[+trowel32]

We saw two more the other day near (in?) Stokes State Forest. One on top of Rattlesnake Mountain (go figure) and a bigger one on the way down from Bird Mountain. This time they both rattled. The first one was sunning itself on the rock and blocking the rather narrow trail. I almost walked right into him/her because I wasn't paying attention. We backed off a little (well at least I did) and the snake stopped rattling and continued up the trail coming right up to my boyfriend. I decided to scoot around it through some brush, after carefully inspecting for any other family members. I also almost walked into the second one because I was looking up or at the GPS or something, trying to figure out where the woods road was that we wanted. I took a couple of pictures of the first one, but they aren't very good.

 

On our walk back to Buttermilk Falls along Mountain Road, we found a dead baby snake. Based on the markings I'm pretty sure that was also a rattlesnake, but it didn't seem to have a rattle yet - it was only about 4 inches long

 

We also saw one in the Newark Watershed a couple of weeks ago. It was all coiled up down in a crevice with its head right next to its rattle - kind of cute if you like snakes

 

I guess the population must be doing fairly well, as I have seen five this year (six if you count the baby), only one other a couple of years ago, and before that...none. I never see any bears anymore though

Edited September 11, 2006 by trowel32

[+ramapo]

I was out exploring yesterday with Citicar up in the watershed. We were hunting for mine pits and I went up to the top of a hill to check out a clearing. I stopped on a large, flat rocky area to survey the area when I was startled (ok, scared) by a loud rattle. I jumped back and looked down to my left and there about 10-15 ft away was a very big and healthy-looking rattler. I'm not sure how close I had actually gotten to the snake but it was too close.

 

We were able to observe him from a safe distance and got some pictures. He didn't budge as he was happily basking in the sun.

 

Edited June 3, 2007 by ramapo

[+gnbrotz]

I saw this one last weekend (heard him first!)

 

[JohnE_Cache]

To address the extractor kits [though that part of the thread is a year old], they were invented with the best of intentions, but what we learned is that it actually sucks the venom deep inside small blood vessels [the hickey effect], causing extreme localized damage.

 

The best thing to do [aside from the hospital/911/etc] is to let the venom diffuse throughout the body rather than force it into extreme concentrations. But keep in mind, half of all bites are "dry", as the snake uses its venom for prey and may not feel the need to waste it on an animal too large to be considered prey.

 

As most of you realize, these Timber Rattlesnakes are actually quite docile and would much rather prefer to flee. And due to ignorant morons killing them en masse, they are getting to be quite rare, especially here in PA. I am glad the sentiment here is of appreciation, rather than hysteria. I guess it almost makes me smile that the average snakebite victim is a young intoxicated male who tried to handle/kill a snake he was aware of...rather than hikers being bit by snakes they didn't see.

 

I've worked with venomous snakes extensively in college, milking not quite 1000 samples in my day. I can tell you one thing, the Timber Rattlesnake can nearly invert the roof of their mouths and "slash" their fangs in ways I've not seen any other snake do. Copperheads and Cottonmouths have a sort of chunky head and not pliable, whereas these rattlesnakes [specifically Timber] have upper jaws like a gymnast. I was always glad to get them out of the way when we did our milking cycle, lol. Copperheads/Cottonmouths have a head/neck profile much easier to grip.

 

If anyone knows any places where these Timbers are common [geocache-wise], please message me. I am dying to show my son one in the wild, and unfortunately they are not as common as in NC, where I grew up and attended college. Of course, I no longer handle these things now that the research is done, but I never got any pics of the snakes I worked with, other than the Cottonmouth and copperheads I adopted. Unfortunately, I had to release them back to the wild when I had kids.

 

I would love to photograph these snakes and share them on the board...I could look at these things all day long. Awesome pictures everybody...

 

-former venomous snake junkie

 

Well, tried to post a pic of my cottonmouth, but it said dynamic pages not permitted???

[+briansnat]

If anyone knows any places where these Timbers are common [geocache-wise], please message me. I am dying to show my son one in the wild, and unfortunately they are not as common as in NC, where I grew up and attended college.

 

I wouldn't say they are common here in NJ, but in the Ramapos, you are fairly likely to run into one if you hike certain areas often enough.

[+olbluesguy]

 

If anyone knows any places where these Timbers are common [geocache-wise], please message me. I am dying to show my son one in the wild, and unfortunately they are not as common as in NC, where I grew up and attended college. Of course, I no longer handle these things now that the research is done, but I never got any pics of the snakes I worked with, other than the Cottonmouth and copperheads I adopted. Unfortunately, I had to release them back to the wild when I had kids.

 

I would love to photograph these snakes and share them on the board...I could look at these things all day long. Awesome pictures everybody...

 

-former venomous snake junkie

 

Well, tried to post a pic of my cottonmouth, but it said dynamic pages not permitted???

 

Johnny.

You just missed your chance this Fathers day weekend At the Noxen Firemans Anual Rattlesnake Roundup.

[+DammitNanet]

I just ran into a timber rattlesnake last Sunday - the dog and I were going out to do some caching. Walked down the street to the fire road entering Ringwood State Park and there was one by the gate. I walked back to the house and made my husband join me on this hike because I'm so totally skittish about snakes.

 

Well, all in all, it was a good thing because I finally got him out caching with me. I'm not sure that he was completely sold on it yet, but that was because I estimated it as a 3 mile hike but it was really 7 and it took a bit longer than he wanted to be out. Oops!

[+HaLiJuSaPa]

And to think in another recent forum where someone in PA asked about a certain snake and its venom potential I had said that there are no real poisonous snakes in the northeast (and then was corrected to note the occasional copperhead), LOL!

 

Rattlers near Newark (or anywhere in NJ for that matter)? Wow, I must say (and not necessarily in a bad way) that wildlife is getting closer and closer to the big city! Time was I'd only see deer from say northern Westchester on north (and I'd have to go to Putnam Co. or (across the river) north of 202 to see wild turkeys). Last week I saw a wild turkey on the side of the Sprain Parkway in YONKERS and earlier this year I saw a deer on the Van Cortlandt Park side of the Major Deegan Expwy in the Bronx! Pretty soon even residents of the 5 boros will need those deer whistles

Edited July 8, 2007 by HaLiJuSaPa

[+chuck6277]

I'm not living in the area now, but I spent a lot of time hiking this area when I did. The copperheads are all over the place. Several people have reported stepping on or almost stepping on rattlesnakes. Copperheads are not as likely to rattle as the timbers. Copperheads prefer to sneak away rather than stand their ground. However, Coppers (like any large snake) will resort to striking if cornered. The timbers are more unpredictable. They might rattle, they might sneak away, they might grow aggressive, they may remain indifferent. You are all wise to wear long protective pants or high length boots and suitable gloves while caching.

 

From what the OP has said, it sounds like a timber to me.

[+Klatch]

Copperheads are not as likely to rattle as the timbers.

Uh, for sure.

[+briansnat]

And to think in another recent forum where someone in PA asked about a certain snake and its venom potential I had said that there are no real poisonous snakes in the northeast (and then was corrected to note the occasional copperhead), LOL!

 

Rattlers near Newark (or anywhere in NJ for that matter)? Wow, I must say (and not necessarily in a bad way) that wildlife is getting closer and closer to the big city! Time was I'd only see deer from say northern Westchester on north (and I'd have to go to Putnam Co. or (across the river) north of 202 to see wild turkeys). Last week I saw a wild turkey on the side of the Sprain Parkway in YONKERS and earlier this year I saw a deer on the Van Cortlandt Park side of the Major Deegan Expwy in the Bronx! Pretty soon even residents of the 5 boros will need those deer whistles

 

Read the logs for this cache. Less than 25 miles from Times Square and about 1 of every 3 finders report encounters with at least one rattlesnake.

[+chuck6277]

Copperheads are not as likely to rattle as the timbers.

Uh, for sure.

 

Klatch, that particular sentence was meant in reference to Ramapo's statement "I didn't know that other snakes rattle. I can only hope that the local copperheads would be as obliging...." I should have referenced it as it was an older reply. My next words were "Copperheads prefer to sneak away. . .". But they have been known to rattle their tails in brush or leaves, just don't count on it. With the number of Copperheads I have seen in North Jersey (mostly the Water Gap), everyone should be aware of their tendencies.

 

Sorry for not linking the two thoughts!