Gardens Sub Category Under Nature

[+pdxmickey]

We would like to get a sub-category under nature to place categories related to Gardens. We have a group of excited waymarkers that would like to see the addition of categories for different types of public gardens. Examples include:

 

Rose Garden

Botanical Gardens

Cactus Gardens

Arboretums

English Gardens

Perenial Gardens

 

We think it would be much wiser to set up this sub-category in Nature (similar to statues) so that all the Gardens would be located in one space.

 

How do we get this done, and does it count against the total number of categories an individual can host?

 

Thanks for your help!

[+chstress53]

We can not create any sub-category. The word is a misnomer. We can only create Categories then TPTB place them within the index. These sound like interesting Categories to me so if you want to see them under Nature create a group to manage one of them, create a write up and submit that to an officer vote and then on to peer review if the category passes peer review then it becomes a category and TPTB will place it within the index and I can almost surmise that it would be placed where you have suggested. IF you do not have 5 Categories to lead you can create up to 5 Categories, might I suggest that you suggest to some of the officers you recruit to take up one of the others you suggested. I understand it is confusing but every one of what you are calling sub-categories are in actuality Categories managed by a group and were placed within the index by TPTB. For example all of these statues are not really sub-categories

Atlas Statues • Living Statues

• Dog Statues • Musician Statues

• Equestrian Statues • Sphinx Sculptures

• Insect Sculptures • U.S. Civil War General Statues

• Lion Statues • Whispering Giant Sculptures

 

Every single one of these are Categories not sub-Categorie as you surmised. placed within the nomenclature by TPTB. They have only gotten where they are because of the leader creating a group and managing the group.

Edited July 23, 2006 by chstress53

[+Ambrosia]

I own the category for Botanical Gardens. That really includes basically any public garden. If sub categories get made for gardens, I would see them being placed underneath this one.

 

The original owner said they didn't want Arboretums in this category, but we've been discussing changing the description and including them, because really an Arboretum falls into a botanical garden when you think about it.

[+silverquill]

I own the category for Botanical Gardens. That really includes basically any public garden. If sub categories get made for gardens, I would see them being placed underneath this one.

 

The original owner said they didn't want Arboretums in this category, but we've been discussing changing the description and including them, because really an Arboretum falls into a botanical garden when you think about it.

 

Good ideas. chstress53 has given an excellent explanation of the process and what categories actually are. The category is the level where waymarks are actually created, and may be placed in various levels within the tree structure of the waymark organization, thus appearing as "sub-categories." It can be confusing.

 

Certainly it seems logical to include arboretums as a variant of botanical gardens.

 

It is part of the broader question that we struggle with -- a broad category with many variables, or a lot of smaller categories for each type. The garden types that you suggest could each be a category, or they could be variables under a broader garden category.

 

There is no policy on this, so it is pretty much left up to individuals and their management groups to decide how they want to structure a particular category -- and to the peer review process, of course.

[J.A.R.S.]

I own the category for Botanical Gardens. That really includes basically any public garden. If sub categories get made for gardens, I would see them being placed underneath this one.

 

The original owner said they didn't want Arboretums in this category, but we've been discussing changing the description and including them, because really an Arboretum falls into a botanical garden when you think about it.

 

Good ideas. chstress53 has given an excellent explanation of the process and what categories actually are. The category is the level where waymarks are actually created, and may be placed in various levels within the tree structure of the waymark organization, thus appearing as "sub-categories." It can be confusing.

 

Certainly it seems logical to include arboretums as a variant of botanical gardens.

 

It is part of the broader question that we struggle with -- a broad category with many variables, or a lot of smaller categories for each type. The garden types that you suggest could each be a category, or they could be variables under a broader garden category.

 

There is no policy on this, so it is pretty much left up to individuals and their management groups to decide how they want to structure a particular category -- and to the peer review process, of course.

 

It certainly is perplexing at times. Is there a FAQ or help page that explains (hopefully in chart form) the hierarchy of categories, sub-categories, groups and variants?

 

Recently I started to create an Arboretum group because I wanted to submit an arboretum in my area but there was no category for it. The Botanical Gardens group, as has been mentioned, didn't include Arboretums. In the process of creating it the Gardening group was/is being created but it too didn't have arboretums as a variant. Now there's a possibility that gardens (rose, japanese, arboretum, etc) will fall under the heading Botanical Gardens. This actually makes a lot of sense to me but now that I'm at the stage of calling a vote on the Arboretums group, what do I do? Can I continue the process? If it is approved as Nature>Arboretums can it later be switched to Entertainment>Botanical Gardens>Gardens>Arboretums? I am currently leader of the proposed Arboretum group. If it falls under Botanical Gardens would I then continue to be leader or do I become an officer? i.e. would I approve arboretum waymarks as they are posted?

 

Another question....Botanical Gardens falls under Entertainment. Nature seems more appropriate to me. What do others think?

 

J.A.R.S.

[+pdxmickey]

We can not create any sub-category. The word is a misnomer. We can only create Categories then TPTB place them within the index. These sound like interesting Categories to me so if you want to see them under Nature create a group to manage one of them, create a write up and submit that to an officer vote and then on to peer review if the category passes peer review then it becomes a category and TPTB will place it within the index and I can almost surmise that it would be placed where you have suggested. IF you do not have 5 Categories to lead you can create up to 5 Categories, might I suggest that you suggest to some of the officers you recruit to take up one of the others you suggested. I understand it is confusing but every one of what you are calling sub-categories are in actuality Categories managed by a group and were placed within the index by TPTB. For example all of these statues are not really sub-categories

Atlas Statues • Living Statues

• Dog Statues • Musician Statues

• Equestrian Statues • Sphinx Sculptures

• Insect Sculptures • U.S. Civil War General Statues

• Lion Statues • Whispering Giant Sculptures

 

Every single one of these are Categories not sub-Categorie as you surmised. placed within the nomenclature by TPTB. They have only gotten where they are because of the leader creating a group and managing the group.

 

Thanks for taking the time to respond - I understand that they are all categories. It would be nice however if you did not have to take one of teh 5 categories that you can manage to set up a category that will be used for the sole pupose of keeping the site organized. I think that the limit of 5 categories is stifling the growth of Waymarking and while I agree that quality needs to remain high I wish that this rule was not there. Peer review should help weed out junk and "category grabers".

[+pdxmickey]

We can not create any sub-category. The word is a misnomer. We can only create Categories then TPTB place them within the index. These sound like interesting Categories to me so if you want to see them under Nature create a group to manage one of them, create a write up and submit that to an officer vote and then on to peer review if the category passes peer review then it becomes a category and TPTB will place it within the index and I can almost surmise that it would be placed where you have suggested. IF you do not have 5 Categories to lead you can create up to 5 Categories, might I suggest that you suggest to some of the officers you recruit to take up one of the others you suggested. I understand it is confusing but every one of what you are calling sub-categories are in actuality Categories managed by a group and were placed within the index by TPTB. For example all of these statues are not really sub-categories

Atlas Statues • Living Statues

• Dog Statues • Musician Statues

• Equestrian Statues • Sphinx Sculptures

• Insect Sculptures • U.S. Civil War General Statues

• Lion Statues • Whispering Giant Sculptures

 

Every single one of these are Categories not sub-Categorie as you surmised. placed within the nomenclature by TPTB. They have only gotten where they are because of the leader creating a group and managing the group.

 

This sounds good to me, once we have a category approved through peer review, can we switch it's location with an officers vote? Thank you for letting Botanical Gardens serve as a parent category for these more specific categories.

[+Ambrosia]

Good discussion. I agree that it all comes down to how narrow or how broad we want these categories to be. It's too bad that we didn't understand this a bit better when everything started, so we could have organized the categories a bit better.

 

I'm gonna hafta wait on my Arboretum thingy now until I find out if there will be a new category for it! I'm fine either way.

[+The Blue Quasar]

I thought that Arbo(u)retums were distinct from Botanical Gardens.

 

From Merriam Webster:

 

Arboretum: a place where trees, shrubs, and herbaceous plants are cultivated for scientific and educational purposes

 

Botanical Garden: a garden often with greenhouses for the culture, study, and exhibition of special plants

 

 

There seems to be a bit of a difference, and guessing, it seems that the Arboretum is for scientific reasons regarding the non-pretty types, whereas Botanical Gardens are the pretty ones people look at.

 

Another way I guess would be saying that Arboretums are the farm, and Botanical gardens are the zoo. Zoos are more of the exotic and viewing of such, whereas the farm is about production and experiments???

 

Again... just kinda guessing

 

The Blue Quasar

[+Ambrosia]

Interesting, looking back on all of the entries in the botanical gardens, there are a lot of just basically gardens. I think that there is a confusion about what the original owner intended. I'm thinking that it was a sort of public gardens idea.....that's why I've thought that maybe the name of the category needs to be changed.

Edited July 26, 2006 by Ambrosia

[+pdxmickey]

Interesting, looking back on all of the entries in the botanical gardens, there are a lot of just basically gardens. I think that there is a confusion about what the original owner intended. I'm thinking that it was a sort of public gardens idea.....that's why I've thought that maybe the name of the category needs to be changed.

 

That was what we were thinking originally. There are a lot of wonderful gardens out there that I would not consider being botanical gardens. Many towns in our area have rose gardens that are cultivated by a local group of dedicated gardners. These garden could be put into the botanical garden category, but I have always viewed botanical gardens as much larger, cultivated by specialist and having a rare collection of plants that woul not grow in that area naturally.

 

That makes me wonder if it would be go back to the original idea of having a category for gardens. Have botanical gardens be one of the detail categories under that, along with categories for Rose Gardens, Dahlia Gardens, Cactus Gardens, Arboretums, Japanese Gardens, and what ever else we could think of. This way if you are visiting a town and want to see some gorgeous flowers in a city park with no additional cost to you - you would have the information that you need.

 

Does someone want to propose a concludsion here on the forum and try to help us get moving forward. I will do anything I can to help make it possible, but I am the new kid on the block compared to others.

[+pdxmickey]

Interesting, looking back on all of the entries in the botanical gardens, there are a lot of just basically gardens. I think that there is a confusion about what the original owner intended. I'm thinking that it was a sort of public gardens idea.....that's why I've thought that maybe the name of the category needs to be changed.

 

Amborsia,

 

You have a perfect example right there in your home town. There is a great rose garden on the south side of town and then you have Bohme Gardens on the north side. Sould those two gardens be placed under botanical gardens, or would it be better to have separate categories. I look at Bohme as much more of a botanical garden and the rose garden as a community project garden.

[+TheBeanTeam]

I think the category should be for gardens that are designated as botanical, either in the name or in some document that can be referenced on the web.

 

IMO you should leave the arboretums and rose gardens for other/future categories.

 

(Ambrosia @ Jul 25 2006, 08:21 PM) *

 

Interesting, looking back on all of the entries in the botanical gardens, there are a lot of just basically gardens. I think that there is a confusion about what the original owner intended. I'm thinking that it was a sort of public gardens idea.....that's why I've thought that maybe the name of the category needs to be changed.

 

The original Locationless Cache was specific to botanical gardens. Any old garden wouldn't do. I know this is a different animal now but if you look back at the history prior to Waymarking it was a very specific line that was drawn.

 

I agree with Silverquill when he says...

 

It is part of the broader question that we struggle with -- a broad category with many variables, or a lot of smaller categories for each type. The garden types that you suggest could each be a category, or they could be variables under a broader garden category.

 

It can go either way. I really like variables but as the site progresses I am personally beginning to prefer the smaller more specific categories. The real special items do not seem to get lost in the larger picture that way.

 

The larger category I think will become a behemoth that generates a few ho-hum entries and some stellar eones that get lost among the chaff. Then once you form a variable for a few other garden types pretty soon you have to create another variable for the thirty other Historic Garden Types and the thirty found in that list doesn't even mention English, urban or sculpture gardens.

 

I know I am repeating myself here but in this case I advocate less variables and more user defined categories as the site grows.

Edited July 26, 2006 by TheBeanTeam

[+Hikenutty]

Hi,

Just thought I'd add my two cents as I'm part of the garden group that pdxmickey is leading.

 

I'm a very active gardener and I really think that the different types of gardens should be made into separate categories. I would like to see them organized by the site under "gardens" heading, though.

 

Botanical and arboretum definitions are sticky as they really vary. But I know many rose gardeners who don't care about anything but roses. It would be difficult to sift the rose garden waymarks out of an overall garden category. I personally am not a big rose fan (unless they come by the dozen delivered to my door [] ) on the other hand I LOVE Japanese gardens and I'm always excited about visiting them and getting some new ideas for my garden.

 

What if we create the separate categories, but we can serve as officers on other categories. I'm happy to be an officer in the rose garden category and would be willing to create a Japanese garden category if Pdxmickey and JARS would be willing to be officers in it. JARS (if you're interested) could then lead one of the other garden types that interests them.

 

Hmmm... All of this organizational talk is making my head spin

 

What do you guys think?

[+Ambrosia]

This whole thing is confusing me too. When I took over the Category, I thought that it was just "Gardens". I don't think that I want to be the manager for a more specific Botanical category.

 

I agree that in this case it would be better to have every kind of garden in a seperate category. But since we can't set up sub categories, I'm not sure what we are supposed to do. This is a big organizational thing, and I think that we need some help in deciding all of this. And at this moment, there is no broad garden category, so it would seem.

[+The Blue Quasar]

Maybe I misunderstood what PDXMICKEY is suggesting...

 

They have a "Gardens Group" but they want to have an upper layer of Gardens in the Nature area, which breaks down into "Botanical Gardens", "Arboretums", "Rose Gardens", "Japanese Gardens" and etc.... as individual Categories under the banner of Gardens.

 

That part I understand... but there is no need for a GARDENS group if they don't manage one of the Categories.

 

It's kinda like the "Historic Plaques"... no Group runs that. But there is one group for each type of State or Province Historical Plaque

 

What is "Garden Group" going to own as a Category?

 

The Blue Quasar

[+Hikenutty]

Things are getting a bit clearer. I think.

 

So... Pdxmickey wanted to start off with a rose garden category and her group can go forward with those plans and manage that. I want a Japanese garden category, so I would need to start a separate group to manage that. Ambrosia doesn't want to manage the botanical garden category, as it wasn't what she thought it was when she adopted it. JARS has the Arboretum category in peer review.

 

I guess the question is (and Pdx has asked this earlier I think) who at Waymarking.com would be the one to create a garden heading under the nature section and how would we go about contacting them?

[+Hikenutty]

This whole thing is confusing me too. When I took over the Category, I thought that it was just "Gardens". I don't think that I want to be the manager for a more specific Botanical category.

 

I agree that in this case it would be better to have every kind of garden in a seperate category. But since we can't set up sub categories, I'm not sure what we are supposed to do. This is a big organizational thing, and I think that we need some help in deciding all of this. And at this moment, there is no broad garden category, so it would seem.

 

Is there a certain type of garden that you're interested in, Ambrosia? Maybe someone else would be interested in taking on botanicals for you and you could focus on something of more interest to you.

[+Ambrosia]

This whole thing is confusing me too. When I took over the Category, I thought that it was just "Gardens". I don't think that I want to be the manager for a more specific Botanical category.

 

I agree that in this case it would be better to have every kind of garden in a seperate category. But since we can't set up sub categories, I'm not sure what we are supposed to do. This is a big organizational thing, and I think that we need some help in deciding all of this. And at this moment, there is no broad garden category, so it would seem.

 

Is there a certain type of garden that you're interested in, Ambrosia? Maybe someone else would be interested in taking on botanicals for you and you could focus on something of more interest to you.

Oh, boy! Do we have a complete list? My mind needs a nudge.

 

Off the top of my head, I'd have to say xeriscape, maybe.

[+chstress53]

Each of you create a group to manage all those specific Categories. Different ones of you can be leaders in each just remember the 5 rule. If Ambrosia does not want to lead the botanical Category just quit the group the next in line becomes Leader. IF the waymarks do not match the titla then You can send an email to Groundspeak and explain that the Category was not understood and ask for a title Change. They may not do so but it is worth a shot. Or just tighten up the Requirements. I did that for a Category O adopted and grandfathered everything in. As you continue to create types of Categories that would fall under what you are calling Gardens TPTB would do the nomenclature thing as was done for Historic Plaques. No one group as the Blue Quasar said would be in charge of that. Your group can not manage all of the Categories that would fall under an index title of gardens. Categories are very specific. Just Manage 1 or 5 Categries that you like, that could be Botanical , Japanese , Roses, Cactus Arboretums

English , Perenial etc, etc. The name of the group could be as simple as Japanes Garden Managers or even specifc for example the Rose Category could be the Latin name for roses . Everyone is just getting hung up on the nomenclature. Just create specific Groups tp manage, Specifically ones that you enjoy to manage. Do not even worry about the index. Trust TPTB. And no you can not vote to change the location within the index, only TPTB create the index of nomenclature, placing the Categories each group creates were they are best suited. We can suggest here in the forums what we see as a suitable location but TPTB have ultimate responsibility there. Each of you guys all could be officers or members in as many Categories as you wish but you can only lead 5. And one group can not operate moore that one Category. Just focus on the Category that intersts each one of you and create a group to manage it. email the others to become officers or members and it will take off from there.

Edited July 27, 2006 by chstress53

[+Ambrosia]

My problem is that my officers are members of my family, who won't want to own the category either.

[+The Blue Quasar]

Right !

 

I think

 

It would seem that what 'chstress53' said rings true... if enough variations of gardens are created as individual categories, then TPTB will splinter off the whole lot of them under the Nature 'master heading' in a 'minor heading' of "Gardens"

 

And yes... the use of 'sub-category' being higher up than 'category' is a misnomer, or at least confusing.

 

Hmmm... sounds like a new topic suggestion... I haven't bugged OpinioNate in a while... I'm overdue!

 

The Blue Quasar

[+chstress53]

Ambrosia , If you do not want the Category nor do any of your Officers place a thread in the forums to recruit other officers then promote them up to rank #1 and demote your other officers to rank 2 and 3 etc and the number one becomes the lead. My experience with opening the Category up to many officers is that there is less management responsibilities on me as officer. ANd the Category benefits with all the experience. Although until I am through the process of peer review for voting I keep it to 3 then when that is done I promote officers into the Category to make it more interesting. I have even delegated editing etc to others.

[+Ambrosia]

Ambrosia , If you do not want the Category nor do any of your Officers place a thread in the forums to recruit other officers then promote them up to rank #1 and demote your other officers to rank 2 and 3 etc and the number one becomes the lead. My experience with opening the Category up to many officers is that there is less management responsibilities on me as officer. ANd the Category benefits with all the experience. Although until I am through the process of peer review for voting I keep it to 3 then when that is done I promote officers into the Category to make it more interesting. I have even delegated editing etc to others.

Ok. I have a few regular members, so I will send them an email first. If none of them want it, then I'll start a thread.

[Aushiker]

G'day

 

Looks like there areat least three garden related groups now looking for members ...

 

Gardens

 

Arboretums

 

Gardening Group

 

Maybe some working together is need.

 

Regards

Andrew

 

[J.A.R.S.]

...... I'm happy to be an officer in the rose garden category and would be willing to create a Japanese garden category if Pdxmickey and JARS would be willing to be officers in it.

 

Yes, I would definitely be willing to be an officer in the Japanese garden category (my favourite type of garden). Let me know when you set it up.

 

JARS