Surveying Question

[rynd]

I'm looking at a map of my property and along with the distance in feet there is another set of numbers ex. N 52° 28' W along each property line. Can anybody tell me in laymen terms what they mean and how I can use them to tell where the edges of my property are.

 

Thanks RyND.

[+Cardinal Red]

I'm looking at a map of my property and along with the distance in feet there is another set of numbers ex. N 52° 28' W along each property line. Can anybody tell me in laymen terms what they mean and how I can use them to tell where the edges of my property are.

 

Thanks RyND.

 

The N and W will put the far end of this line in the NorthWest Quadrant.

If you are standing at the correct end of the apropriate property line you must face Magnetic North. Then you must rotate 52° 28' Counterclockwise (West). If you pace of the distance that follows this number you should be at the pin at the other end of the property line.

 

The first letter will always be N (face magnetic north) or S (face magnetic South).

The second letter will always be E (rotate east) or W (rotate west).

 

That makes your Quadrant possibilities NW, NE, SW, or SE.

 

#1 - Do you have all the property line "calls". That is what N 52° 28' W 123.45' is.

Note the 123.45 feet was just used as an example because you did not include the actual number.

If you have all the "calls" I would then check to see if the property "closes". In other words does it start at a point and go around the perimiter of the property and come back to the starting point.

 

#2 - Do you know the date of the property line call information. With the date I would look up the Magnetic Declination at that time so I could convert to, and calculate from True North.

 

#3 - Do you know where at least 1 Property Line Pin is, and do you have GPS Coordinates for it.

 

#4 - A rough diagram of the actual property lines with the one Pin and GPS Coordinates clearly marked would be really helpful.

 

If you have that information PM or email me and I will do the calculations for you. Remember this should only be used to get you close enough to find a pin. It is nowhere near accurate enough to be considered anything but an interesting way to explore your property using a GPS.

[Difficult Run]

Hi RyND,

 

I know it looks strange, but it’s quite easy…

 

In simplest terms, the set of numbers you are referring to is direction. Combined with distance it’s known as “metes and bounds”.

It’s always in reference to true north, so make sure to take your magnetic declination into account.

You will have to find at least one property corner to find the rest.

 

Here’s a good illustration of those crazy numbers.

 

From the picture above, you can see that N 40° E gives you a compass direction of 40°.

S 50° E would equal 130°,

S 40° W equals 220°,

N 30° W equals 330°, etc.

I hope you see the pattern.

 

Now, if you really want to really get precise…

Example: N 52° 28' W = 307.533° True North.

 

Ok… so how do you convert these “set of numbers” to degrees?

Let’s use something close to your example: N 52° 28' 14” W

The last two digits → 14 ÷ 3600 = 00.00388°

The middle two digits → 28 ÷ 60 = 00.466°

Add all the digits→ → → → → → → 52.000°

This gives you → →→ → → → → → 52.46988°

 

Take 360° - 52.46988° = 307.53011°

 

Hope this wasn't too technical.

 

Regards,

Mitch

 

Disclaimer: I'm not a surveyor by trade - I just know enough to be dangerous.

[Papa-Bear-NYC]

I'm looking at a map of my property and along with the distance in feet there is another set of numbers ex. N 52° 28' W along each property line. Can anybody tell me in laymen terms what they mean and how I can use them to tell where the edges of my property are.

 

Thanks RyND.

This type of language for directions is also used in many NGS datasheet descriptions, especially older ones. You will see things like "Reference mark 1 is located 68.4 feet N 31 deg 40 min E". Sometimes I've also seen it abbreviated as in "Station is 48 feet N31E from the NE corner of the building".

[rynd]

Thanks for the info guys and or gals. I figured they where a type of compass bearing, but I had never seen it written this way. I'm still not completely clear but when I get the time to sit down and try to decipher them I think will be.

 

#1 - Do you have all the property line "calls". That is what N 52° 28' W 123.45' is.

Note the 123.45 feet was just used as an example because you did not include the actual number.

If you have all the "calls" I would then check to see if the property "closes". In other words does it start at a point and go around the perimiter of the property and come back to the starting point.

 

I do Have all the "calls" and it looks like it "closes".

 

#2 - Do you know the date of the property line call information. With the date I would look up the Magnetic Declination at that time so I could convert to, and calculate from True North.

 

I think it was in 1984

 

#3 - Do you know where at least 1 Property Line Pin is, and do you have GPS Coordinates for it.

 

No and no, at least not yet I'm still cutting down weeds and brush and trying to find one of them.

 

#4 - A rough diagram of the actual property lines with the one Pin and GPS Coordinates clearly marked

would be really helpful.

 

I've got the rough diagram,and I'm hoping to find at least one pin.

 

Again thanks, I think when I get the chance to sit down with it I shouldn't have too much problem figuring it out now that you've pointed me in the correct direction, but if I can't get it I will probably take you up on your offers.

[Z15]

laymans terms, its the beaing of the line from one point to another point on your proprty. All property lines are defined by bearing and distance.

 

A piece of property is a closed figure (think geometry) of at least 3 sides or more. They could have gave distance and the interior angles on the drawing but bearings are the universal legal requirement. A angle would make a written description vague and subject to misinterpretation.

 

Angles can always be computed from the bearings but are often of little use to anyone but a sirvayer.

Edited July 3, 2006 by Z15

[+Black Dog Trackers]

rynd -

 

Not being a surveyor, I'm no expert on finding property corner pins. However on my own property, and as I've heard here before, thousands of others, property corners are usually marked with a steel rod or pipe pounded into the ground. The best way to find it is to use (buy or rent) a metal detector. The top of the pipe will likely be a couple inches below the surface of the ground. It will likely be about an inch or slighly less in diameter.

[Z15]

Thats not to say you will find anything. Seen it many time where property is surveyed and then they come in and landscape and build, wiping out everything. Even had property owners tell me they pulled that #$%^&* pin because they hit it with their lawnmower. Then they say, "was that really my property marker?' Or worss yet, the neighbor had paid for the survey and now he is going to sue you for damges to pay for the surveyor to reset his pins, not yours.

Edited July 3, 2006 by Z15

[Papa-Bear-NYC]

...

 

#2 - Do you know the date of the property line call information. With the date I would look up the Magnetic Declination at that time so I could convert to, and calculate from True North.

 

I think it was in 1984

 

...

You don't care what the magnetic declination was when they surveyed the property (1984 of whenever it was), you need to know what is is now. The bearings were described in relation to true north which has not changed (except for continental drift which we shall ignore ). So use your compass, adjusted by the current decination, and you will be back to true north. One reason they use true north bearings is that they don't change. I can imagine property line disputes if they used magnetic bearings and the lawyers start arguing about how much the declination has or has not changed.

 

Topozone will give the current declination (not the declination of when the topographic map was made). It's given at the bottom right of the page if you print a map of the area. BTW, topographical maps use true north too. But of course!

[Bill93]

Someone mentioned using a metal detector. The treasure finder type can be useful in easy situations, but if it is a re-rod with the top buried a foot, you might not find it that way. In that case you would need a sensitive magnetic locator, made by Schonstedt or CST Berger and others, that finds only magnetic materials. They are a universal tool for surveyors but not commonly known to people outside the construction field. You might be able to find one at a tool rental center. I've heard they find corner pins at amazing depths.

[Wintertime]

Okay, I'll ask the obvious question: Why all this "S45E" and "N45W" stuff instead of just giving simple azimuths of 135 and 315 degs.??

 

Patty

[holograph]

I don't know if it really answers why, but at least there is no ambiguity about N30E. Azimuths have been variously measured as the angle from north, and sometimes as the angle from south, so you never are quite sure of the direction meant by azimuth.

[Wintertime]

Azimuths have been variously measured as the angle from north, and sometimes as the angle from south, so you never are quite sure of the direction meant by azimuth.

Oh, interesting, I didn't know that. In amateur astronomy and pointing satellite dishes, azimuths have always been with 0 degs. at north (true or magnetic, but still north).

 

Patty

[Z15]

Okay, I'll ask the obvious question: Why all this "S45E" and "N45W" stuff instead of just giving simple azimuths of 135 and 315 degs.??

 

Patty

 

Because that is the accepted legal term for use in property descriptions that has been used for hundreds of year.

 

A bearing is definative, an azimuth is an angle and can be ambgious. Its used in Geodetic Surveying, navigation and astronomy. It would complicate legal decriptions, which are often written by laypersons (i.e. lawyers and or staff).

Edited July 9, 2006 by Z15