New Category Suggestion - State Capitols

[+SCOTUS]

Good Day,

 

State and Provincial Capitols are representation of the people of a state or province, its history, its government structure, and its culture.

 

In the United States, there are 50 interesting buildings in the United States that reflect their state in unique ways. There are also numerous former capitols that reflect their state at the time of their use. In other nations, there are numerous state and/or provincial capitols that do the same for the people of the state or province.

 

Each of these capitol buildings are unique and historic and should be waymarked and visited.

 

This category would be distinct from the "City/Town Halls" category that already exists in that it would be limited to State and/or Provincial Capitols.

 

Please do not hesitate to contact me with questions, comments, or suggestions!

 

SCOTUS

[+The Blue Quasar]

SCOTUS Posted Today, 05:54 PM

Good Day,

 

State and Provincial Capitols are representation of the people of a state or province, its history, its government structure, and its culture.

 

In the United States, there are 50 interesting buildings in the United States that reflect their state in unique ways. There are also numerous former capitols that reflect their state at the time of their use. In other nations, there are numerous state and/or provincial capitols that do the same for the people of the state or province.

 

Each of these capitol buildings are unique and historic and should be waymarked and visited.

 

This category would be distinct from the "City/Town Halls" category that already exists in that it would be limited to State and/or Provincial Capitols.

 

Apart from the restriction that it would have to be the capital of the state/province, how would you set this apart from the City/Town Halls since each of these would already fit into that category?

 

I just trying to see how this is unique and not just a subset of another already existing category.

 

Each category needs to stand out from the others, how do you propose to do that here?

 

The Blue Quasar

[+silverquill]

 

Apart from the restriction that it would have to be the capital of the state/province, how would you set this apart from the City/Town Halls since each of these would already fit into that category?

 

The Blue Quasar

 

Scotus is correct, this would be a distinct category. A state capitol builiding is not a city or town hall.

 

From the short description:

"City and town halls, any building housing a local municipal type government."

How would that apply to state/provinical capitols?

 

From the Detailed Description:

"Excluded from this category are state/provincial capitol buildings"

 

Now, the capital city, would probably have both a city hall for its local municipal government, and the capitol builiding for the state government. So, I see these as distinct categories. In fact, I was just thinking today that a category for national capitol buildings would be great -- truly international, and there would be only one from the U.S.

 

I am concerned, though, about making the category truly global and international. Some countries have different governmental divisions, though analogous to states and provinces. I'm thinking of prefectures in Japan, and cantons in Switzerland as examples. Shires in the UK? Anyway, I think it is a worthwhile category that deserves some attention.

 

-- Spelling edit.

Edited June 29, 2006 by silverquill

[Aushiker]

I am concerned, though, about making the category truly global and international. Some countries have different governmental divisions, though analogous to states and provinces. I'm thinking of prefectures in Japan, and cantons in Switzerland as examples. Shires in the UK? Anyway, I think it is a worthwhile category that deserves some attention.

-- Spelling edit.

 

G'day

 

Not sure about Japan but as I understand it cantons in Switzerland are along the lines of states as it is a federal system. With respect to the UK, they have provinces but their system is not federal hence no states. There local governments would fit under the existing category and the parliaments of Wales, Ireland, Scotland and England would come under the proposed category.

 

Here in Australia, our federal parliament and the parliament's of each state and territory would fit in the suggested category. In New Zealand on the national parliament would fit as they only have two levels of government.

 

Personally I support the suggested category as I also see it as being distinct from the existing town hall category.

 

Regards

Andrew

[+The Blue Quasar]

Thanks Silverquill, that makes a lot of sense. When I read what you wrote I applied it to Ontario and was able to figure out the difference. It just didn't "click" last night when I read it.

 

As for defining the area, since not everyone has provinces and/or states, it could be worded to reflect governmental country divisions. If there is one thing I've learned from a few of my categories, there are a lot of synonyms for various specific terms.

 

"Capital Buildings of a State, Province or similar primary section of a Country"

 

Update definition as required.

 

The Blue Quasar

[+JDandDD]

Scotus is correct, this would be a distinct category. A state capitol builiding is not a city or town hall.

 

From the short description:

"City and town halls, any building housing a local municipal type government."

How would that apply to state/provinical capitols?

 

From the Detailed Description:

"Excluded from this category are state/provincial capitol buildings"

 

 

Well, you could still broaden the City and town halls category to include any governmental building. This segmentation of governmental building could get too refined. What about county seats and governments? Instead of creating categories it might be a more parsimonious idea to create a variable for the type of governmental building in a larger catergory. Then as new types of governmental buildings are defined all that is needed is to add a new item in the variable list.

 

So, in sum, I think the idea of a spot for state, provinicial, prefecture, canton etc. is excellent I think a variable might be a better way to do it.

[+SCOTUS]

Blue Quasar, Silverquill, and Aushiker,

 

Thanks for your replies. I appreciate the thoughtful dialogue. I think that silverquill ably stated by this is a distinct category from the existing City/Town Hall category. I share his concern for making this an international category. In countries where there are three levels of government (local, state/province, and national) the buildings that would fit into this category would obviously be from the middle level of government. For countries with only two levels of government, I am not sure what government level, if any would fit.

 

US States, Canadian and Austrailian Provinces, Swiss Cantons, Japanese Prefectures, The Scottish Parliament, the Welsh and NI Assemblies, and anything else on that level would be appropriate. As for UK Shires, I would use this opportunity to learn more about the structure of government and the group could make a determination.

 

Silverquill's comments about a capital city having multiple buildings in mulitple categories for different levels of government is certainly accurate. In Washington, Olympia would have three buildings in two categories. Olympia City Hall would fall into the City/Town Hall Category. The Thurston County Courthouse would fall into either the City/Town Hall Category or possibly a County Seat Category, if there is one. The Washington State Capitol would fall into my proposed category.

 

ANother interesting to consider would be a state like Nevada. They have a capitol building which houses the office of the Governor and is a historical site, a Legislative building which houses the Legislature, and a supreme court building which houses the State Supreme Court. Would each of these buildings be allowed in this category? I would personally allow all three, but I would be interested in your perspectives on this issue.

 

In regards to Blue Quasar's proposed category title, I would certainly support using it.

 

I have established a group for the purposes of creating this category. If any or all of you are joining the group, please let me know and we can get started!

 

Again, I appreciate the thoughtful dialogue on this topic.

 

Thanks,

SCOTUS

[+SCOTUS]

Thanks to JD and DD for your comments.

 

[NOTE: For the sake of clarity, I'm going I'm going to refer to capitols here as "state capitols" and not the longer name. I will also refer to "state" to mean state, province, Canton, prefecture, etc. This isn't a slight on other systems of government, it's just a more simple way to type it. ]

 

I think that having separate categories for "City/Town Halls" and "Capitol Buildings of a State, Province or similar primary section of a country" is a good thing. In my opinion, State Capitols are not just another government building. They are the representation of a state and its people. The Washington State Capitol, for example has tremendous stature and beauty that other government buildings around the state don't. THe capitol is the house of the people, and though business is done there, it is not intended to be a solely functional facility. A State Capitol is the embodiment of its people, it is a symbol of a state and deserves an independent category.

 

I think having a government buildings category in general would end up being redundant and complicated. There are too many government buildings that are very functional, but not notable. I don't think we need a subcategory for emmissions test stations, DMV offices, or the local police department. City/Town Halls, State Capitols, and national capitols would all be categories tha I would like to see.

 

Thanks! SCOTUS

[+The Blue Quasar]

Why not keep it simple then....

 

"Capital Buildings"

 

"This category has been created to Waymark the central government building of a country or a state, provincial or equivalent principle division of a country. This is not for counties, municipalities or other smaller divisions of territory."

 

The Blue Quasar

[+SCOTUS]

Blue Quasar has it right,

 

Keep it simple. Capitol Buildings, I like that idea. The category could have variables for national and state (or equivalent). With a description along the lines listed below.

[+silverquill]

 

Well, you could still broaden the City and town halls category to include any governmental building. This segmentation of governmental building could get too refined. What about county seats and governments? Instead of creating categories it might be a more parsimonious idea to create a variable for the type of governmental building in a larger category. Then as new types of governmental buildings are defined all that is needed is to add a new item in the variable list.

 

So, in sum, I think the idea of a spot for state, provincial, prefecture, canton etc. is excellent I think a variable might be a better way to do it.

 

This is one of those issues that has pros and cons for each approach, and it applies to a multitude of categories -- a few broad ones with variables, or more focused separate categories. Often it is a balance. Take museums, for example. There could be one category for ALL museums with variables for things like history, art, oddball (all existing categories) science, children, etc. -- or they could be separate categories. Logically it could go either way. I think factors such as number of potential waymarks and the distinctness of the divisions are important factors. Early on a proposal was made to have just one category for historic markers, but it turned out the having separate categories for US states, Canadian provinces and countries was a much more workable solution.

 

I think state and national capitals would get lost if they were grouped with city halls. State and national capitols might go together.

 

US county buildings are more problematic. They are pretty specific to the US, although other countries may have analogous divisions. And, they even vary in function and form from US state to state. In the west, counties are big deals; when I moved to New England, I found out that counties are less important. Then some states, such as Virginia, have some "independent cities" that are not in counties at all. So, I would say that a different category for county buildings might be reasonable. They could be lumped with municipal buildings, but I think we'd end up with quite a jumble.

 

Someone, way back when, suggested a category for "courthouses." Some of these would be county courthouses, but not all. There are district courts, state and federal courts, etc.

 

All interesting stuff, and each category will be approached differently.

 

Larry (silverquill)

[+silverquill]

Blue Quasar has it right,

 

Keep it simple. Capitol Buildings, I like that idea. The category could have variables for national and state (or equivalent). With a description along the lines listed below.

 

The simplest would be just: Capitols

 

"capitol buildings" is technically redundant (since capitol IS the building, and capital is the CITY), but for clarity "capitol buildings" might be a good idea.

[+The Blue Quasar]

As a side note: I kept wondering why you guys continued to spell the word as "CAPITOL" and I was using "CAPITAL". So finally I looked up the word you guys were using. Then I asked several of my friends about it, after I learned what it was.

 

We don't have that spelling here, or it is just an American word. Kinda like you guys have "Paychecks" and we have "Paycheques"

 

Main Entry: cap·i·tol

Pronunciation: 'ka-p&-t&l, 'kap-t&l

Function: noun

Etymology: Latin Capitolium, temple of Jupiter at Rome on the Capitoline hill

1 a : a building in which a state legislative body meets b : a group of buildings in which the functions of state government are carried out

2 capitalized : the building in which the U.S. Congress meets at Washington

 

See, even without the Category I am learning stuff... I love Waymarking!

 

The Blue Quasar

[+tozainamboku]

As a side note: I kept wondering why you guys continued to spell the word as "CAPITOL" and I was using "CAPITAL". So finally I looked up the word you guys were using. Then I asked several of my friends about it, after I learned what it was.

 

We don't have that spelling here, or it is just an American word. Kinda like you guys have "Paychecks" and we have "Paycheques"

 

Main Entry: cap·i·tol

Pronunciation: 'ka-p&-t&l, 'kap-t&l

Function: noun

Etymology: Latin Capitolium, temple of Jupiter at Rome on the Capitoline hill

1 a : a building in which a state legislative body meets b : a group of buildings in which the functions of state government are carried out

2 capitalized : the building in which the U.S. Congress meets at Washington

 

See, even without the Category I am learning stuff... I love Waymarking!

 

The Blue Quasar

 

I would guess this category would be the building where the state or provincial legislature or parliment meets. If the executive (govenor, prime minister, president) uses a different building it would not be in this category.