The 50 State Multi-cache

[+Night Stalker]

I noticed that early entries indicated that a picture at each cache would be a requirement. It hasn't been mentioned in the later entries, so I don't know is this is still a requirement. If it is how would this be accomplished. If you had to post the picture on the cache page like I have seen with some caches I would think it would be quite a chore to compile the pictures to make sure the person going for 51 was qualified. On the other hand if the person going for 51 had to send in all 51 pictures they would need a lot more band width then those of us on dial-up.

[+Blue Power Ranger]

I noticed that early entries indicated that a picture at each cache would be a requirement. It hasn't been mentioned in the later entries, so I don't know is this is still a requirement. If it is how would this be accomplished. If you had to post the picture on the cache page like I have seen with some caches I would think it would be quite a chore to compile the pictures to make sure the person going for 51 was qualified. On the other hand if the person going for 51 had to send in all 51 pictures they would need a lot more band width then those of us on dial-up.

 

There is a picture requirement for those attempting the series. It is the surest method of verification. It is very simple, post a log and upload a picture. If you are seriously attempting to complete all 51 caches, I don't think this is an unreasonable requirement.

[+Mystery Ink]

I noticed that early entries indicated that a picture at each cache would be a requirement. It hasn't been mentioned in the later entries, so I don't know is this is still a requirement. If it is how would this be accomplished. If you had to post the picture on the cache page like I have seen with some caches I would think it would be quite a chore to compile the pictures to make sure the person going for 51 was qualified. On the other hand if the person going for 51 had to send in all 51 pictures they would need a lot more band width then those of us on dial-up.

 

There is a picture requirement for those attempting the series. It is the surest method of verification. It is very simple, post a log and upload a picture. If you are seriously attempting to complete all 51 caches, I don't think this is an unreasonable requirement.

I agree . And spoiler pictures of the numbers should not be allowed.

[+Rebel]

I've submitted my contribution for approval. If/once it's up I'll edit this to add a link.

 

GCWP4X

 

Let the fun begin!

Edited June 30, 2006 by Rebel

[+Team JSAM]

I've submitted my contribution for approval. If/once it's up I'll edit this to add a link.

 

GCWP4H

 

Let the fun begin!

 

Great, I would love to but I am still waiting for my email with the html and instructions.....

Edited June 30, 2006 by Team Jsam

[+Rebel]

I've submitted my contribution for approval. If/once it's up I'll edit this to add a link.

 

GCWP4H

 

Let the fun begin!

 

Great, I would love to but I am still waiting for my email with the html and instructions.....

 

I think I was the Guinea pig. Oink!

[+Blue Power Ranger]

I've submitted my contribution for approval. If/once it's up I'll edit this to add a link.

 

GCWP4H

 

Let the fun begin!

 

Great, I would love to but I am still waiting for my email with the html and instructions.....

 

They are all coming, just stand-by. Mrs. Power Ranger is taking the lead on sending most of these out.

[+Blue Power Ranger]

They are all coming, just stand-by. Mrs. Power Ranger is taking the lead on sending most of these out.

 

The first 10 people should all have their information now. Check your email if you are taking care of the following states -

 

Arkansas

California

Georgia - Already Hidden, waiting approval

Idaho

Nevada

Pennsylvania

Tennessee

Virginia

Washington

Wisconsin

 

Once these are up and running and we know that the process is going to flow smoothly, we will get more states onboard.

Edited June 30, 2006 by Blue Power Ranger

[+Blue Power Ranger]

Please note that the cache listed in the bookmarks on your HTML page is just a place-holder at this point to show reviewers that the bookmark lists are real. As soon as the first cache publishes, that bookmark will be updated.

[fishiam]

The first 10 people should all have their information now. Check your email if you are taking care of the following states -

 

Arkansas

California

Georgia - Already Hidden, waiting approval

Idaho

Nevada

Pennsylvania

Tennessee

Virginia

Washington

Wisconsin

 

Once these are up and running and we know that the process is going to flow smoothly, we will get more states onboard.

 

I have indeed received the email and hopefully can get to this sometime this next week. I assume we want these caches to be fairly high quality so it's worth taking an extra day or two to scout a good location.

 

cheers

fishiam

Edited June 30, 2006 by fishiam

[+Blue Power Ranger]

I have indeed received the email and hopefully can get to this sometime this next week. I assume we want these caches to be fairly high quality so it's worth taking an extra day or two to scout a good location.

 

cheers

fishiam

 

Couldn't agree more!

[+Mystery Ink]

I have indeed received the email and hopefully can get to this sometime this next week. I assume we want these caches to be fairly high quality so it's worth taking an extra day or two to scout a good location.

 

cheers

fishiam

 

Couldn't agree more!

Got it thanks. I will scout an area with a view of the Golden Gate this week.

Thanks for your dedication BPR.

Edited June 30, 2006 by Mystery Ink

[+Blue Power Ranger]

IMPORTANT:

 

I have recieved the following message from one of my local reviewers...

 

I am emailing you because at least one person has

submitted one of the state caches already.

 

As I understand it the final will be in the DC area. Have you contacted

the reviewer for DC to go over this with him? Have you gotten his thumbs

up on a location and an okie dokie that this will be listable? Since you

are the person spearheading this campaign I'd like to ask you to have

people hold off on submitting new caches for this until the DC reviewer

has had a chance to give us his opinions.

 

Thanks for your understanding,

 

I don't want this to become a forum for reviewer bashing. I have met the reviewer that sent me that message. They are doing their best but I'm sure this unique project has thrown things them for a bit of a loop so lets work WITH them to work this out.

 

Lets proceed with the first 10 caches since those are already in process and halt from there until we get more info regarding the final. I will try to contact the DC area reviewer. We are in touch with the DC Final hider and there is a general location in mind. The hider has decided it was best to hold off briefly with working with the DC area land manager as they are dealing with flooding currently in the area and it wouldn't make sense to overload them with this at this time.

 

I will personally try to work with the DC reviewer to make certain this is "doable" although I can't imagine why it wouldn't be. I am struggling a bit with a chicken vs. egg scenario. What needs to be in place first, the 50 caches or the 1 final?

 

I'm not sure why this particular series would be too big of an issue as there are frequently cache series hides that don't have all caches or the final hidden immediately. These caches ARE INDEPENDANTLY findable and therefore can stand on their own merit.

 

I am struggling to find a way to get Groundspeak behind this project and to help them understand that this is a benefit to them. We are not trying to push the envalope of what is allowed.

 

PS - I still want a special icon.

[+Mystery Ink]

 

PS - I still want a special icon.

Me too.

[+Markwell]

PS - I still want a special icon.

Me too.

 

 

Let people put that on their profile with a link to an offsite list of cachers that have officially done it. I know it's not what you're looking for, but it's a stop-gap measure.

 

There's a lot of Off Your Rocker Cracker Barrel caches, right? How about an icon for them?

 

How about a special icon for the Delorme Challenge caches?

 

How about a special icon for the ...

 

The APE was a one time thing. What makes it cool to nab one is that there's A) so few of them to begin with, B) so few of them left, and C) not many strange icons.

Edited June 30, 2006 by Markwell

[+Beffums]

PS - I still want a special icon.

Me too.

 

 

Let people put that on their profile with a link to an offsite list of cachers that have officially done it. I know it's not what you're looking for, but it's a stop-gap measure.

 

There's a lot of Off Your Rocker Cracker Barrel caches, right? How about an icon for them?

 

How about a special icon for the Delorme Challenge caches?

 

How about a special icon for the ...

 

The APE was a one time thing. What makes it cool to nab one is that there's A) so few of them to begin with, B) so few of them left, and C) not many strange icons.

I really like this idea. Given how short the list of finds for the final likely will be, they'll be notable just for having the smiley on that cache. If one of the computer savvy people knows how to do it, it would be really cool (to me at least), to have that image so that when you click on it, it links to either the final cache, or to the bookmark list for the series. And, honestly, it doesn't sound like Jeremy's going to give this its own icon, so looking for good alternatives seems reasonable.

[+Blue Power Ranger]

There's a lot of Off Your Rocker Cracker Barrel caches, right? How about an icon for them?

How about a special icon for the Delorme Challenge caches?

How about a special icon for the ...

The APE was a one time thing. What makes it cool to nab one is that there's A) so few of them to begin with, B) so few of them left, and C) not many strange icons.

 

Not too different from what we have with geocoins is it? Do those icons cause undue confusion?

[+Mopar]

I will personally try to work with the DC reviewer to make certain this is "doable" although I can't imagine why it wouldn't be.

Because most of DC is off limits to physical caches.

Most of it is either National Park System land and/or considered a high terrorist risk and off limits on GC.com.

It's a 70 square mile city with 600,000 people living in it, and 5 million people living nearby, yet it only has about 2 dozen physical caches. Judging by that, I'm guessing it's fairly tough to get a cache listed in DC.

[+Blue Power Ranger]

Because most of DC is off limits to physical caches.

Most of it is either National Park System land and/or considered a high terrorist risk and off limits on GC.com.

It's a 70 square mile city with 600,000 people living in it, and 5 million people living nearby, yet it only has about 2 dozen physical caches. Judging by that, I'm guessing it's fairly tough to get a cache listed in DC.

 

The general location has been decided upon. The hider will work with the land manager for the location for approval. It is all being done on the up-and-up as this needs to have longevity and the support of the managing agency.

 

I believe the question for the local approver was whether the concept (50 caches providing information to find this one) was doable, not whether hiding a cache in DC is doable because it is. Tricky but doable.

[Keystone]

Apart from the challenge of locating a physical cache in the District of Columbia, the final mystery/unknown cache would also have to meet the requirements for that cache type. If I'm reading the thread correctly, the means for ascertaining the final coordinates have not yet been finalized. This puts the cart before the horse. Reviewers are quite used to working with the owners of a series of caches, like "find all of Santa's reindeer and collect the codes to determine the location of the final Santa Claus cache." The reindeer are scattered all around the metro area, and are standalone caches, with the final puzzle cache being located someplace central to the series. This 50 state project is the same thing on a grand scale. The difference being, it's normal procedure not to list the reindeer before knowing whether the Santa Claus cache will meet the listing guidelines. For example, if the Santa Claus cache page says "e-mail me the codes you collect, and if you are correct I will e-mail you the coordinates to this cache," then that is an issue under the listing guidelines. I would then place the entire series of reindeer "on hold" until I worked with the owner to get the final cache into compliance with the guidelines, or to obtain approval from Groundspeak for an exception to the guidelines. The DeLorme challenge caches are good examples where exceptions have been granted.

[+Blue Power Ranger]

Apart from the challenge of locating a physical cache in the District of Columbia, the final mystery/unknown cache would also have to meet the requirements for that cache type. If I'm reading the thread correctly, the means for ascertaining the final coordinates have not yet been finalized. This puts the cart before the horse. Reviewers are quite used to working with the owners of a series of caches, like "find all of Santa's reindeer and collect the codes to determine the location of the final Santa Claus cache." The reindeer are scattered all around the metro area, and are standalone caches, with the final puzzle cache being located someplace central to the series. This 50 state project is the same thing on a grand scale. The difference being, it's normal procedure not to list the reindeer before knowing whether the Santa Claus cache will meet the listing guidelines. For example, if the Santa Claus cache page says "e-mail me the codes you collect, and if you are correct I will e-mail you the coordinates to this cache," then that is an issue under the listing guidelines. I would then place the entire series of reindeer "on hold" until I worked with the owner to get the final cache into compliance with the guidelines, or to obtain approval from Groundspeak for an exception to the guidelines. The DeLorme challenge caches are good examples where exceptions have been granted.

 

So I can adequately lobby for an exception, which listing guideline does this violate or potentially violate?

 

The caches, independently stand on their own so I don't clearly understand the issue. No cache or a final will require anybody emailing anyone for coordinates but each cache will contain a unique 3-digit code that when plugged into a given equation will provide the solution.

 

Are you saying that we are more likely to see the "reindeer" approved if "santa" were already in place? Would "santa" be approved as a puzzle cache if the information needed to locate it was not yet in existence or available? - That seems to me to be a more likely issue.

 

This is a great deal of work so I want it done right. If we were to place a cache in a proper legal DC location today with the given puzzle equation, would that cache be approved even though none of the other fifty are in place?

 

I appreciate the time you took to provide feedback. I don't want to go through all the trouble of doing this only to find that there were hoops we failed to jump through.

[Keystone]

Please have that dialogue with the volunteer cache reviewer for the District of Columbia. The relevant guideline text is found here (in addition, of course, to the guidelines which apply to all cache types).

[+Blue Power Ranger]

Please have that dialogue with the volunteer cache reviewer for the District of Columbia. The relevant guideline text is found here (in addition, of course, to the guidelines which apply to all cache types).

 

I will contact the DC reviewer and work with them for the final but for the caches already hidden and out there waiting for approval... I guess I don't know what to expect for them at this point. Seems that some may get approved while others don't!?

 

I wish all this hadn't come up 11th hour when I understand there has been a reviewer thread discussing this very topic.

 

I guess am waiting for some sort of "blessing" or "poo-pooing" from TPTB. I want to work within guidelines but it seems we may be in uncharted territory here.

 

If we were to remove mention of a "final" from cache listings until the final is in place, it seems we are in the clear... right?

[Keystone]

Excuse me? This is nothing new. Please see this post from Palmetto, my learned volunteer colleague from the Great State of Florida. In addition, I understand that you've been in touch with the reviewer for your home state of Washington.

 

I am not going to conduct the review of your cache here in the forums. As a moderator, I am simply trying to point you in the right direction, which is towards mtn-man, the cache reviewer for DC.

[+Blue Power Ranger]

Excuse me? This is nothing new. Please see this post from Palmetto, my learned volunteer colleague from the Great State of Florida. In addition, I understand that you've been in touch with the reviewer for your home state of Washington.

 

I am not going to conduct the review of your cache here in the forums. As a moderator, I am simply trying to point you in the right direction, which is towards mtn-man, the cache reviewer for DC.

 

Yikes! - I guess I am not communicating or understanding something clearly. I have nothing but good to say about my reviewer and am thankful to others who have chimed in including Palmetto who made no mention that his was an unworkable idea. I guess I am surprised that independent caches are seen by some as not within guidelines. I will work with work with the DC reviewer but I guess I'm not sure which is the cart and which is the horse.

 

BOTTOM LINE: We are trying to do something GOOD FOR THE CACHING COMMUNITY. Personal gain for me? ZERO. All I want is to work TOGETHER with all volunteers to do something cool. BTW - None of these caches are even mine.

 

LET'S KEEP THIS POSITIVE! Unique for the forums I know... but we'll try.

Edited June 30, 2006 by Blue Power Ranger

[+Team JSAM]

BPR I got the email today thanks I should have my cache hid this weekend! What other states are already done?

 

-TJ

[+Blue Power Ranger]

BPR I got the email today thanks I should have my cache hid this weekend! What other states are already done?

 

-TJ

 

The first 10...

 

Arkansas

California

Georgia

Nevada

Pennsylvania

Tennessee

Virginia

Washington

Wisconsin

 

Please read a bit above. It seems we may be running into a possible guideline violation although I'm still fuzzy on details. I just want to make you aware in case you get held-up in approval.

[+Blue Power Ranger]

Update: Mtn-man has been emailed a summary of what we are doing for input.

 

Hopefully he can provide some insight. What needs to come first when hiding a series leading to a final? The final or the other caches? That is the question of the day.

[+andGuest]

If I am reading Keystone's 1:11 PM posting correctly you have to have the coordinates for the final before the other caches (In this case the one in DC would be Santa and the other states would be the reindeer). I think he made the comment (again my interpretation) about emailing for coordinates because you will not be able to have the code for the first 10 if you do not yet know where the final will be located. Glad to see one of the first 10 will be in my state so I can at least get one knocked off the list.

[+Blue Power Ranger]

FYI - for anyone watching these - the first one has been published.

 

http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_detai...d5-5f27404fde7a

 

Who in Georgia will find it first?

 

A great big thanks to Rebel for this first cache getting hidden so quickly. You can see on his page what each of the pages will look like with the information changed from state to state.

[+Miragee]

If I am reading Keystone's 1:11 PM posting correctly you have to have the coordinates for the final before the other caches (In this case the one in DC would be Santa and the other states would be the reindeer). I think he made the comment (again my interpretation) about emailing for coordinates because you will not be able to have the code for the first 10 if you do not yet know where the final will be located. Glad to see one of the first 10 will be in my state so I can at least get one knocked off the list.

Forgive me, but I don't understand the problem. Aren't all the caches in each of the 50 States individual caches? Seems to me if the last cache never got placed it wouldn't affect the status of any of the other caches.

 

I'm not a math person, but the way I understand it, the math can be worked out from the codes later to reveal the coordinates of the final cache. Those coordinates do not need to be known now before the codes are put into the caches currently being placed.

 

Since it is going to take someone a long time to find all 50 caches before they would be ready to go for the final, that cache wouldn't have to be placed right away. In fact, wouldn't it actually be better if it wasn't placed until close to the time that someone was getting close to the goal? That way it wouldn't be on local people's "Not Found" cache list for such a long time.

 

Edit to add appropriate quote . . .

Edited June 30, 2006 by Miragee

[+Miragee]

FYI - for anyone watching these - the first one has been published.

 

http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_detai...d5-5f27404fde7a

 

Who in Georgia will find it first?

 

A great big thanks to Rebel for this first cache getting hidden so quickly. You can see on his page what each of the pages will look like with the information changed from state to state.

Very cool! I'm creating my own Bookmark list, so I can watch the progress of the caches and the finders. Boy, do I wish I had an RV and the gas money for it. I would be packing right now for the adventure.

[ParentsofSAM]

FYI - for anyone watching these - the first one has been published.

 

http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_detai...d5-5f27404fde7a

 

Who in Georgia will find it first?

 

A great big thanks to Rebel for this first cache getting hidden so quickly. You can see on his page what each of the pages will look like with the information changed from state to state.

 

Maybe us.....most likely not though....

[+earthy5000]

I am writing this in reading to your dilemma today with your project, Keystone said you should place your last one first. In reality I think the best way to pull this off right is to work with Groundspeak. We are pioneering I new idea here that has the possibility of becoming a reality. If this is pulled off right we could be introducing a whole new cache type here, which in the long run would be better for the whole geocahing community. None of these caches really cannot work as independent caches, because each it depend on anther like a puzzle cache. This is not your traditional puzzle either cache because the guidelines state that no more then two miles should be driven to make it sufficient to be a puzzle cache. I think it would be cool to have all 51 caches unified as one big cache on Grounspeak.com, in other words you would be able to them find individually, as if they were individual but each one would be unified under one web page on Groundspeek. Thus the computer would already know what percentage of the cache across America cahe, the person has found. In other words people from around the country could view this and race to find all 50, this better inform the rest of the community on what exactly is going on. People would find out faster this way and the general cache public would greatly appreciate it! It would be cool see on your states a symbol of the United States along with the amount hidden and found. It would be like wining a metal of participation after running a long marathon if this is to work I would take keystones suggestion and introduce a totally new cache to grundspeak. Who knows maybe one day we be caching the world in search for a cache in each country. Just a thought I hope you take this idea in to consideration. What your doing here is vary special and I want this to succeeded. This is something the whole cache community can benefit from and is not an idea you stumble upon everyday!

 

-Thanks earthy5000, hope this helps you, with your vary special and unique project

[Team Misguided]

Update: Mtn-man has been emailed a summary of what we are doing for input.

 

Hopefully he can provide some insight. What needs to come first when hiding a series leading to a final? The final or the other caches? That is the question of the day.

 

This is what needed to happen.

 

As for your question, most are not done on such a large scale. So the final should be in place and and least given the thumbs up by your reviewer before the rest of the caches are published. It's easier to re-design a puzzle to fit a different final location if the original caches haven't been placed yet. You can ask the reviewer to hold off publishing the final until a few of the initial caches are found but it should have been reviewed and given the okay first.

[+Blue Power Ranger]

This is what needed to happen.

 

As for your question, most are not done on such a large scale. So the final should be in place and and least given the thumbs up by your reviewer before the rest of the caches are published. It's easier to re-design a puzzle to fit a different final location if the original caches haven't been placed yet. You can ask the reviewer to hold off publishing the final until a few of the initial caches are found but it should have been reviewed and given the okay first.

 

But really you could take any numbers you pick out of the sky and match them to any coordinate. The calculation is in the equation created for the puzzle. Frequently we see puzzle caches where the solutions to the Soduku for example or whatever have noting to do with actual numbers in a coordinate but are instead told to add one, subtract 6, multiply by 2.3 and then divide by the square root of Pi or to do whatever.

 

Thus, we are good for now with randomly generated numbers, which is what we are distributing. I contend that a mathematician / puzzle guru can take 50 random numbers and make sense out of them coordinate-wise.

 

At least it seems like we are on the right road now. Hopefully mtn-man will weigh in soon via email, the final will be settled and all will be well. Thanks for your help and kind suggestions! I hope you didn't get the impression I was criticizing you as I seem to have touched a nerve somehow with Keystone. That was never my intention with anyone who has participated in this forum.

 

Good karma only here please!

Edited July 1, 2006 by Blue Power Ranger

[+sillygirl & jrr]

Wow, I'm impressed, haven't read this thread since early on. Glad you got Migoi to help with the Hawaii cache!

 

I can't believe no one has mentioned this, but did you know that there is a series of caches called: Caching Across America? This is the Hawaii cache in the series. From their profile the owners of those caches have them in Hawaii, RI, MA, & OH. I believe these cachers want to own a cache in every state. They had contacted us about placing one in Hawaii a while back. The Hawaii one is one Kauai, so it's not on the same island as the planned one for this series. But since the names sound similiar, I wouldn't want anyone to get confused in HI or elsewhere.

 

JRR

edit bad grammar

Edited July 1, 2006 by sillygirl & jrr

[+Blue Power Ranger]

I can't believe no one has mentioned this, but did you know that there is a series of caches called: Caching Across America

 

Wow - they have a nice title! Whew - that was close. I searched for identical titles and came up with nothing before proceeding. Never looked for this version of the title.

Looks interesting. Different concept but interesting none-the-less.

[+mtn-man]

In my opinion, you need to get the DC cache done before any other caches in the series are listed. Frankly, you need them all done. You don't even have volunteers for all 50 states yet from what I can tell on the last couple of pages in this topic. I don't see how you can start listing a 50 state multicache if you don't have volunteers for all 50 states yet.

 

As Keystone said, I also believe you have the cart before the horse at this point. While the coordination for this has been very good in this topic, the people involved should have all been corresponding with each other via email or more diligently in this topic to work out all of the details on all 51 caches before any of these were listed. They should have all been submitted at the same time and they should all have a similar reviewer note asking that the particular listing be reviewed and approved for listing before the release of any cache in the series. It is obviously too late for that at this point. I would suggest that you take this approach for the remaining caches.

 

I would also suggest that you get all 50 states covered before getting additional caches listed.

 

The National Arboretum is a tall order. We are dealing with the USDA Forest Service on a permit for geocaching in the National Forest in GA. We have been working on it for a couple of years now. If you are looking for a speedy approval, good luck. The code of conduct is determined by the Code of Federal Regulations (CFR) no less.

 

http://www.washingtonwatchdog.org/document...e7/part500.html

 

The regulations don't specifically say anything about this type of use for the park, but I would doubt that they would want people wandering off of the paths in the National Arboretum. I hope I can be proved wrong and a suitable location can be found though, since it would be a very cool place for the final cache. I just feel that it is a tall order. There is an old cache there now, but I would not list any more unless the cache owner has permission.

 

I must catch some shut-eye. I am in NYC tonight. Ironically, tomorrow I drive to... Washington DC.

[+Mystery Ink]

In my opinion, you need to get the DC cache done before any other caches in the series are listed. Frankly, you need them all done. You don't even have volunteers for all 50 states yet from what I can tell on the last couple of pages in this topic. I don't see how you can start listing a 50 state multicache if you don't have volunteers for all 50 states yet.

 

As Keystone said, I also believe you have the cart before the horse at this point. While the coordination for this has been very good in this topic, the people involved should have all been corresponding with each other via email or more diligently in this topic to work out all of the details on all 51 caches before any of these were listed. They should have all been submitted at the same time and they should all have a similar reviewer note asking that the particular listing be reviewed and approved for listing before the release of any cache in the series. It is obviously too late for that at this point. I would suggest that you take this approach for the remaining caches.

 

I would also suggest that you get all 50 states covered before getting additional caches listed.

 

The National Arboretum is a tall order. We are dealing with the USDA Forest Service on a permit for geocaching in the National Forest in GA. We have been working on it for a couple of years now. If you are looking for a speedy approval, good luck. The code of conduct is determined by the Code of Federal Regulations (CFR) no less.

 

http://www.washingtonwatchdog.org/document...e7/part500.html

 

The regulations don't specifically say anything about this type of use for the park, but I would doubt that they would want people wandering off of the paths in the National Arboretum. I hope I can be proved wrong and a suitable location can be found though, since it would be a very cool place for the final cache. I just feel that it is a tall order. There is an old cache there now, but I would not list any more unless the cache owner has permission.

 

I must catch some shut-eye. I am in NYC tonight. Ironically, tomorrow I drive to... Washington DC.

 

Well good thing I have not placed California's yet although it will be this week. Our local caching comunity has been working with our county parks now for awhile and have no problems with placing caches as long as we obey their rules. Thanks for the info Mtn-Man and BPR for this.

Edited July 1, 2006 by Mystery Ink

[+BadAndy]

I must be daft.

 

I don't see the problem with starting to place these caches. They are independant standalone caches with a common theme. The puzzle for the reward cache in DC can easily be worked out with the generated codes regardless of it's final location.

 

It isn't a multi, it's a series.

[+Blue Power Ranger]

I appreciate all the reviewer feedback and will continue working with them to get this through but count me among the daft for not fully understanding the issue. Please don't be offended as this is not a personal attack against anyone, just a disagreement of theory.

 

These caches DO stand on their own. Even if there never was a final, the caches can still be found and are still being maintained by locals. I am not the owner.

 

That said, I will follow the admonition to get the final completed ASAP. The thought that we should have had all 51 caches list simultaneously gives project managers like me ulcers as any "issue" that is discovered is multiplied exponentially.

 

We are missing only 3 states (minus potential for drop-outs) which seems like a very minor issue considering the timing.

 

Lets press on and work with the reviewer to complete this quality series! This IS GOOD for the sport!

Edited July 1, 2006 by Blue Power Ranger

[+ParrotRobAndCeCe]

I will personally try to work with the DC reviewer to make certain this is "doable" although I can't imagine why it wouldn't be.

Because most of DC is off limits to physical caches.

Most of it is either National Park System land and/or considered a high terrorist risk and off limits on GC.com.

It's a 70 square mile city with 600,000 people living in it, and 5 million people living nearby, yet it only has about 2 dozen physical caches. Judging by that, I'm guessing it's fairly tough to get a cache listed in DC.

 

Oh baloney. Very little of the physical area of DC is NPS land, and the "high terrorist risk" federal facilities are mostly concentrated downtown. Apart from the couple of dozen square blocks in and around the national mall, Rock Creek Park, The C&O NHP and random places like Bolling AFB, DC is a city much like any other.

[+jtd18801]

There may be a little delay for puting out the Pa cache because we have a down bridge (with all the flooding in northeast Pa and southern NY)to get to where I am going to put the cache. I will hopefully have it out by next weekend.

[+SG-MIN]

If you set the name, anyone can place them as stand alone traditionals. You would not need to add the HTML or any of the language of it being a part of a series. No way that can cause problems. If for some reason DC (the santa) does not get placed, then you just end up with 50 random caches - they just happen to have a common name - and they wouldnt even have the same layout, or say there were connected.

 

no harm, no foul.

[+Miragee]

I must be daft.

 

I don't see the problem with starting to place these caches. They are independant standalone caches with a common theme. The puzzle for the reward cache in DC can easily be worked out with the generated codes regardless of it's final location.

 

It isn't a multi, it's a series.

Yes, me too. This is what I posted yesterday.

 

If I am reading Keystone's 1:11 PM posting correctly you have to have the coordinates for the final before the other caches (In this case the one in DC would be Santa and the other states would be the reindeer). I think he made the comment (again my interpretation) about emailing for coordinates because you will not be able to have the code for the first 10 if you do not yet know where the final will be located. <snip>

Forgive me, but I don't understand the problem. Aren't all the caches in each of the 50 States individual caches? Seems to me if the last cache never got placed it wouldn't affect the status of any of the other caches.

 

I'm not a math person, but the way I understand it, the math can be worked out from the codes later to reveal the coordinates of the final cache. Those coordinates do not need to be known now before the codes are put into the caches currently being placed.

 

Since it is going to take someone a long time to find all 50 caches before they would be ready to go for the final, that cache wouldn't have to be placed right away. In fact, wouldn't it actually be better if it wasn't placed until close to the time that someone was getting close to the goal? That way it wouldn't be on local people's "Not Found" cache list for such a long time.

It is going to take a cacher a long time to complete this series. Why does the final have to be placed now?

 

What if the Final Cache is placed now, with permission, but a year from now when someone is getting close to the end of their "Cache Across America" adventure, new managers for the DC cache location say the cache has to be removed . . . what then? What if the Final Cache gets muggled betwen now and the time the successful traveler goes to look for it?

 

If there was a vote on this, I would vote that the Final Cache not be placed until the potential FTF cacher was getting ready to find it.

[+Lil Devil]

Forgive me for coming into this late and not reading all 8 pages of this thread, but.. what is the big deal here? People keep posting here as if this is a new idea. Years ago there was the 50 state "HAPPY" series by CCCooperagency and today there is Found 50 States, I'm Going to Disneyland! and the State Capitol Quest. I don't see what's so special about this new series

 

Besides all that, even though you guys say its a series, if one must find the first 50 in order to find the final, then that makes it a multi by definition and all of them should be submitted, reviewed and published as a group. Oh wait, I'm just repeating what mtn-man said

Edited July 1, 2006 by Lil Devil

[+Blue Power Ranger]

Forgive me for coming into this late and not reading all 8 pages of this thread, but.. what is the big deal here? People keep posting here as if this is a new idea. Years ago there was the 50 state "HAPPY" series by CCCooperagency and today there is Found 50 States, I'm Going to Disneyland! and the State Capitol Quest. I don't see what's so special about this new series

 

Besides all that, even though you guys say its a series, if one must find the first 50 in order to find the final, then that makes it a multi by definition and all of them should be submitted, reviewed and published as a group. Oh wait, I'm just repeating what mtn-man said

 

50 states - Disneyland is very cool but not a series of specific caches ditto with the State Capitol Quest although they are very neat ideas on their own but different.

 

The HAPPY series is a neat idea too. Can I go do it today.... ? Did anyone complete it? Were there ever 50 caches in place?

 

So... This is unique in that we are trying to coordinate 50 individuals working together. Not for you? No worries.

 

I know past precedent doesn't determine future approval... but... have you ever seen individual caches that are placed with clues to a final that isn't in place yet? Seems fairly common to me. Am I wrong? I will repeat again that these are caches that stand on their own merit.

 

For debate's sake... lets say a final never gets placed. Harm? None.

 

I find it ironic that if I wanted, I could literally drive down a road through public land and chuck and altoids tin out of the window of my car and have that published in a couple of days but when trying to do something cool and worthwhile, the boo-birds come out.

[+Miragee]

Forgive me for coming into this late and not reading all 8 pages of this thread, but.. what is the big deal here? People keep posting here as if this is a new idea. Years ago there was the 50 state "HAPPY" series by CCCooperagency and today there is Found 50 States, I'm Going to Disneyland! and the State Capitol Quest. I don't see what's so special about this new series

 

Besides all that, even though you guys say its a series, if one must find the first 50 in order to find the final, then that makes it a multi by definition and all of them should be submitted, reviewed and published as a group. Oh wait, I'm just repeating what mtn-man said

50 states - Disneyland is very cool but not a series of specific caches ditto with the State Capitol Quest although they are very neat ideas on their own but different.

 

The HAPPY series is a neat idea too. Can I go do it today.... ? Did anyone complete it? Were there ever 50 caches in place?

 

So... This is unique in that we are trying to coordinate 50 individuals working together. Not for you? No worries.

 

I know past precedent doesn't determine future approval... but... have you ever seen individual caches that are placed with clues to a final that isn't in place yet? Seems fairly common to me. Am I wrong? I will repeat again that these are caches that stand on their own merit.

 

For debate's sake... lets say a final never gets placed. Harm? None.

 

I find it ironic that if I wanted, I could literally drive down a road through public land and chuck an altoids tin out of the window of my car and have that published in a couple of days but when trying to do something cool and worthwhile, the boo-birds come out.

My emphasis . . .

 

How long do you think it will take someone to complete this challenge? What if it takes a year? Or longer? Will the owner of that Final Cache go check on it every month to make sure it is still there and still findable. What if a tree falls down on the cache? What if the agency in charge of the location rescinds their approval? What if the cache is found accidentally and disappears?

 

I just don't understand why the final cache needs to be placed now, or ever . . . for that matter.

 

Where were these "boo-birds" when this thread first started? Personally, I'm glad this got started before they showed up . . .

Edited July 1, 2006 by Miragee

[Team Misguided]

I find it ironic that if I wanted, I could literally drive down a road through public land and chuck and altoids tin out of the window of my car and have that published in a couple of days but when trying to do something cool and worthwhile, the boo-birds come out.

 

The problem is that you live in Washington THE STATE and not Washington D.C. where you intend the final to be. There are very few regulations that concern geocaching in this Washington. It's quite different in the other Washington.

 

This series is not something that someone is going to finish during their summer vacation, I don't see why there is this big rush to get the first set of caches placed. All we've asked at this point is that you hold off for a few days while the details on how you intend to have the final set up are presented and reviewed.