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New 24 Hour Record For Finding Most Caches (312) Has Been Set


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I have reviewed my posts to this thread and the related threads, and I do not see any "blasts" directed at The Alabama Rambler. I've met him, and had a high opinion of him that I would like to be able to maintain. I also have met GeoPirat, and I like him, too. He wrote to me privately and apologized for the effect that his actions might have had on me. So no, it isn't personal. You can separate the person from the action.

 

My own review of my posts shows I began by offering a hearty congratulations to the new record holders. I then moved to defending their actions from criticism, relying on my own experience to explain how such an effort is possible. When the facts came out about splitting the group up and signing the outsides of containers, I was one of very few people who cautioned the mob to wait until we heard an explanation. When that explanation came, I joined many others in criticizing the CONDUCT of the DRR group, and the "rules" they chose to follow. I cannot find any "blasts" or personal attacks against any of them. I do not even mention The Alabama Rambler by name in any of my posts. If my criticism of his actions "got to him," so be it. I disagree with signing the outside of a cache container, and I can say that without saying that the person who did it is an evil person.

 

As for the circumstances of my own record, all the so-called dark secrets have been disclosed previously. If you are upfront about the rules you followed, everyone can read them and judge for themselves. The very first post where the 240-cache record was announced pointed out that a local driver and navigator assisted. Yes, a solo effort would be a different record and yes, a team effort without a local guide would be different. (But not, for example, if you pre-scout the cache locations beforehand, and write to cache owners asking for exact location information.)

 

I am happy to let people form their own opinions about my own claim for a record number of caches in 24 hours, and about my conduct in this and related threads.

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So lets see. Lep is attacked about something he didn't do. I read his posts he is correct he didn't single out TAR and he was supportive at first. So regarding the overreaction of our fellow cacher TAR I have this to repeat, from someone far wiser than I.

 

"The guilty flee where none pursueth".

 

Sorry TAR, but you dug your own hole on this and until you started attacking a highly respected cache like Lep I was content to ask a few question. But I can not sit here and allow you to besmirch the good name of one of the best all around people in these forums.

Edited by LaPaglia
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So we now have two different types of team record runs.

1. Old school, clean and proper. B)

2. New school-use all the virtual steroids you want to. B)

 

Since it seems that Groundspeak couldn't care less about this type of activity, it isn't likely that there will ever be an official sactioning body, and therefore no real agreement on what constitutes a world record.

 

Good people can still make poor decisions. It doesn't make them bad people.

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I didn't see where Lep made any personal attack either. That is not to say that there haven't been any made by others in the various threads. The people who did them were wrong to have done so. Obviously errors of judgement were made, and acknowledged, on this record attempt. It might be best if the claim of holding the record is relinquished and this thread then closed. It was opened, afterall, by a member of Team DRR.

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Yup, I agree... its time to stop beating this dead horse! Let's all go outside and find a cache or two B)

 

I'd bet if more than just one member of the team came in here and admitted their mistakes (how about the thread starter) and agreed that the "record" is bogus, the thread would likely die. Since only 1 has even touched on the subject (TAR) and he still insists that they DID set a new record, the thread continues to drag on.

 

Note, if other members of the team have since been on the forums and apologized and/or renounced the record, I missed it, Markwell me.

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Yup, I agree... its time to stop beating this dead horse! Let's all go outside and find a cache or two B)

 

I'd bet if more than just one member of the team came in here and admitted their mistakes (how about the thread starter) and agreed that the "record" is bogus, the thread would likely die. Since only 1 has even touched on the subject (TAR) and he still insists that they DID set a new record, the thread continues to drag on.

 

Note, if other members of the team have since been on the forums and apologized and/or renounced the record, I missed it, Markwell me.

 

Bogus-schmogus! They don't neeeeed to renounce anything to anyone. There is no governing body that awards records SO anyone can claim any durn record they want.

 

I calim most caches ever given away at one time. 13,000 of 'em and each one had a log book. Pick that apart for awhile if it makes you feel better about yourself. B)

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Yup, I agree... its time to stop beating this dead horse! Let's all go outside and find a cache or two B)

 

I'd bet if more than just one member of the team came in here and admitted their mistakes (how about the thread starter) and agreed that the "record" is bogus, the thread would likely die. Since only 1 has even touched on the subject (TAR) and he still insists that they DID set a new record, the thread continues to drag on.

 

Note, if other members of the team have since been on the forums and apologized and/or renounced the record, I missed it, Markwell me.

 

Bogus-schmogus! They don't neeeeed to renounce anything to anyone. There is no governing body that awards records SO anyone can claim any durn record they want.

 

I calim most caches ever given away at one time. 13,000 of 'em and each one had a log book. Pick that apart for awhile if it makes you feel better about yourself. B)

 

I thought it was only 12,500. You numbers padder. B):rolleyes:

 

BTW: do you know if any o' them are gonna make it up here to ChiTown?

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Yup, I agree... its time to stop beating this dead horse! Let's all go outside and find a cache or two B)

 

I'd bet if more than just one member of the team came in here and admitted their mistakes (how about the thread starter) and agreed that the "record" is bogus, the thread would likely die. Since only 1 has even touched on the subject (TAR) and he still insists that they DID set a new record, the thread continues to drag on.

 

Note, if other members of the team have since been on the forums and apologized and/or renounced the record, I missed it, Markwell me.

 

Bogus-schmogus! They don't neeeeed to renounce anything to anyone. There is no governing body that awards records SO anyone can claim any durn record they want.

 

I calim most caches ever given away at one time. 13,000 of 'em and each one had a log book. Pick that apart for awhile if it makes you feel better about yourself. B)

 

I thought it was only 12,500. You numbers padder. B):rolleyes:

 

BTW: do you know if any o' them are gonna make it up here to ChiTown?

 

Hahaha

 

12,500+ micros in 300 seed pods. 13,000 is a nice round number. :rolleyes:

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Are you going to watchlist all of those? Lots of email!!!!!! :P:)

 

I'm hoping for about 30% placement. That's STILL nearly 4000 caches. :D Ummmm WOOT! :D

 

 

4000-12,000 micros...Ummmm woot <_<:D

 

Don't be so quick to judge. The 300 seed pods went out to 40 states and 4 countries. I doubt that they'll all be placed in your town.... :D

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As far as I can see, we could have infinite variations of the record.

 

Most caches by a team of 8, who split up within a half mile and had at least one team member sign the outside of the log.

 

Most caches by a team of 8, who split up within half a mile and had at least one team member sign the outside of the log, and didn't ask anyone for helpful hints beforehand.

 

Most caches by a team of 10, who split up in a .473 mile distance and required two team members to sign each log.

 

Most caches by a team of 10, who split up in a .473 mile distance and required two people to sign the log, but did it in the rain in December when the days are shorter.

 

By Your Rules, you have the record. But there could be so many sets of rules. Why should the one that this team decided on be the benchmark for others?

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I think we should go by simple accepted practices based on majority concensus. If we held a poll:

1) We'd find out that the vast majority of cachers do not condone taking credit for any cache that you are not present for the find and the signing of the log.

2) We'd find out the the vast majority of cachers do not condone signing anything but the logbook.

3) We'd find out the the vast majority of cachers agree that you should not find any cache (including events) more than once.

4) We'd find out the the vast majority of cachers agree that you should not find your own cache unless it is an event that you attended.

 

So the group that claims a new record did so outside the accepted practice of the majority of geocachers. Therefore the record would not be recognized by the majority. If you don't agree with any of the above assumptions then all we have to do is take a poll! :anitongue:

Edited by TrailGators
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I think we should go by simple accepted practices based on majority concensus. If we held a poll:

1) We'd find out that the vast majority of cachers do not condone taking credit for any cache that you are not present for the find and the signing of the log.

Agreed.

 

2) We'd find out the the vast majority of cachers do not condone signing anything but the logbook.

Agreed.

 

3) We'd find out the the vast majority of cachers agree that you should not find any cache (including events) more than once.

I don't know about this one. Personally I agree, but the practice seems widespread, and Jeremy did state a year ago that he wasn't going to do anything about the practice. Here in the echo chamber it seems like a majority is against this, but that might not reflect the whole caching world.

 

4) We'd find out the the vast majority of cachers agree that you should not find your own cache unless it is an event that you attended.

I'm not with you on this one. I can't imagine ever logging my own cache.

 

So the group that claims a new record did so outside the accepted practice of the majority of geocachers. Therefore the record would not be recognized by the majority. If you don't agree with any of the above assumptions then all we have to do is take a poll! :anitongue:

But a poll will only reveal what people here in the echo chamber think.

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If you don't agree with any of the above assumptions then all we have to do is take a poll! :anitongue:

But a poll will only reveal what people here in the echo chamber think.

 

Not necessarily. If TPTB truely wanted to do so, they could set up a poll somewhere and e-mail all active cachers asking them to participate in the poll. Then, it'd give the opinions of those who care enough (either way) to participate in the poll. Assuming, of course, the poll isn't set up to slant answers to any one point of view.

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Precisely. I think that most cachers would be appreciative of a record that fits within their own experience of caching. For a lot of us, that pretty much means that, with no more help than the cache page itself gives you, you go find the cache and sign the log. If there's a bunch of you, you all go find it and sign the log.

 

No single member of this team signed all the logs. One team member has been in this forum expecting to have his record recognized, even though he admittedly didn't get out of the car and find any caches at all.

Well, you can claim any record you wish. In fact, you do have the record for most caches found in a 24 hour period within the parameters that you chose for yourself. Whether you can make this record be meaningful to the cache community at large is not something you can dictate.

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If you don't agree with any of the above assumptions then all we have to do is take a poll! :anitongue:

But a poll will only reveal what people here in the echo chamber think.

 

Not necessarily. If TPTB truely wanted to do so, they could set up a poll somewhere and e-mail all active cachers asking them to participate in the poll. Then, it'd give the opinions of those who care enough (either way) to participate in the poll. Assuming, of course, the poll isn't set up to slant answers to any one point of view.

 

True, a poll linked off the GC.com home page would be much more representative.

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I'm hoping that NJ was one of the 10 states that wasn't "blessed" with one of these seed pods.

 

Blessed? :D:anitongue::(

 

The ODS project is not divine. It's just an experiment in community building, but your comment speaks volumes.

 

I've pressed upon a few of my backdoor insights into your moderators forum about this project and so far they have all kept mum. :(

 

More interesting was my brief face to face communication with someone who would really be in the know and what they didn't say spoke more than they knew to me. :(

 

Suffice it to say that if one comes to your area, (and one surely will) feel free to choose not to hunt it. :ph34r:

Edited by Snoogans
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Precisely. I think that most cachers would be appreciative of a record that fits within their own experience of caching. For a lot of us, that pretty much means that, with no more help than the cache page itself gives you, you go find the cache and sign the log. If there's a bunch of you, you all go find it and sign the log.

Yes, but I don't think you'll ever get the community to reach a consensus as to what they think. BTW, your parameter of "with no more help than the cache page itself gives you" would be the criteria I would support for a record, but the two of us hardly represent a quorum.

 

No single member of this team signed all the logs. One team member has been in this forum expecting to have his record recognized, even though he admittedly didn't get out of the car and find any caches at all.

Well, you can claim any record you wish. In fact, you do have the record for most caches found in a 24 hour period within the parameters that you chose for yourself. Whether you can make this record be meaningful to the cache community at large is not something you can dictate.

I don't think TAR ever meant for himself to be considered part of the team, he saw himself as a facilitator. While he did come here (to the forums) to make a case for recognizing the record, he did not consider himself a record holder, at least not from this attempt.

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I don't think TAR ever meant for himself to be considered part of the team, he saw himself as a facilitator. While he did come here (to the forums) to make a case for recognizing the record, he did not consider himself a record holder, at least not from this attempt.

 

Really? Sure sounds like he's claiming a record to me. (Even if most of the posters here don't recognize it.)

 

 

Just as the coach of a football team never plays a scrimmage but is still credited with a win or loss for his team, I was with a team that found, touched and signed 312 caches in 24 hours. I claim to be a member, then, of the world record number of caches found in 24 hours team.

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CheshireFrog-"I don't think TAR ever meant for himself to be considered part of the team, he saw himself as a facilitator. While he did come here (to the forums) to make a case for recognizing the record, he did not consider himself a record holder, at least not from this attempt."
TAR-"Just as the coach of a football team never plays a scrimmage but is still credited with a win or loss for his team, I was with a team that found, touched and signed 312 caches in 24 hours. I claim to be a member, then, of the world record number of caches found in 24 hours team."
Emphasis mine
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CheshireFrog-"I don't think TAR ever meant for himself to be considered part of the team, he saw himself as a facilitator. While he did come here (to the forums) to make a case for recognizing the record, he did not consider himself a record holder, at least not from this attempt."
TAR-"Just as the coach of a football team never plays a scrimmage but is still credited with a win or loss for his team, I was with a team that found, touched and signed 312 caches in 24 hours. I claim to be a member, then, of the world record number of caches found in 24 hours team."
Emphasis mine

 

I stand corrected, I missed that.

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The problem I have with this effort has nothing to do with the skill of the cachers involved. Nor with their focus and commitment and I’m sure they had a blast! It was a gutsy, edgy run and they should have given themselves high fives and came back to GW4 and crowed a bit, just for laughs and giggles.

 

My problem is the claim of a "record". When Roger Bannister ran the first sub-four minute mile, his effort was justly scrutinized, officiated and witnessed because there had been other runners who had attempted the same feat but had been disqualified because the rules of track had not been conformed to. It is in surpassing another player/athlete while abiding by the rules that creates records. When you say: “I will gladly adhere to the rules, even though the rules limit my effort, and the same rules others use and will still out-perform.”, then a record can be recorded. Otherwise, it is chaos.

 

A measurement can only be taken when there is a standard tool to compare to. Without that, there are no records, no feats, only stunts.

 

My personal experience of geocachers has been that they are a remarkably like-able, generous bunch, who have a great sense of fun and adventure.

 

I've never been with a group caching who had members of the group who waited in a car or who were not physically present and then claimed the cache. I have certainly been with groups where one found the cache and the others signed. I am surprised about the length of this discussion defending claims of a record set while "abiding by the rules WE set out", not the rules set out in the guidelines that I believe the majority adhere to.

 

Why not just post that y'all had a hoot?

Edited by ATMouse
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I've been following this thread since it started and have stayed out of the discussion. Here is my take. I haven't lost respect for Team DRR even though I may disagree with how the set the record. I am losing respect for some others in here that seem to want to pile on.

 

You can either accept the record as claimed, or you can ignore it. It's your choice. However there is no reason to try and belittle any member of this community, and there is certainly no reason to keep heaping it on.

 

El Diablo

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I've been following this thread since it started and have stayed out of the discussion. Here is my take. I haven't lost respect for Team DRR even though I may disagree with how the set the record. I am losing respect for some others in here that seem to want to pile on.

 

You can either accept the record as claimed, or you can ignore it. It's your choice. However there is no reason to try and belittle any member of this community, and there is certainly no reason to keep heaping it on.

 

El Diablo

Thank you El D, I have been trying to come up with the right way to say how I feel for days now...and you just did exactly that~ Well said!

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If you don't agree with any of the above assumptions then all we have to do is take a poll! :anitongue:

But a poll will only reveal what people here in the echo chamber think.

 

Not necessarily. If TPTB truely wanted to do so, they could set up a poll somewhere and e-mail all active cachers asking them to participate in the poll. Then, it'd give the opinions of those who care enough (either way) to participate in the poll. Assuming, of course, the poll isn't set up to slant answers to any one point of view.

 

True, a poll linked off the GC.com home page would be much more representative.

Perhaps as part of the weekly new cache notification?

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You can either accept the record as claimed, or you can ignore it. It's your choice. However there is no reason to try and belittle any member of this community, and there is certainly no reason to keep heaping it on.

 

El Diablo

 

My thoughts exactly. And, since there are no official rules or sanctioning bodies for record run attempts, that's all you'll ever be able to do: accept it or reject based on your own criteria.

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True, a poll linked off the GC.com home page would be much more representative.

Perhaps as part of the weekly new cache notification?

 

Good idea. It would be a much more representative sampling than you'd get here in the forums. However, GC.com would only be likely to do this if they intended on acting on the data gathered.

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Perhaps as part of the weekly new cache notification?

 

Nah, just a direct mailing. Remember, you have to CHOOSE to get the weekly cache mailing. Those who don't choose to get it wouldn't get notified of the poll. (Including those who chose to quit getting it, when the instant notifications rolled out.)

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I'm going for a new record. I am going to try not to find a cache in the next 15 minutes - can I do it. I will let you know and can I make that a new "world" record. Apparently I can set my own rule right?

 

A little more sarcasim...it's all we need. :anitongue:

 

El Diablo

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You can either accept the record as claimed, or you can ignore it. It's your choice. However there is no reason to try and belittle any member of this community, and there is certainly no reason to keep heaping it on.

 

There is every reason to keep heaping it on. I see no evidence those that did this have any real understanding that they did something they shouldn't've. We've gone right from "we're sorry you don't like what we did" to "stop piling it on" without the necessary AHA! moment in the middle.

 

Frankly, how they could ever think splitting up and using a Sharpie on the cache containers wasn't going to cause this sort of uproar disturbs me. The fact that they admitted it readily is to their credit at least as far as we know they aren't sneaks, but it just proves they don't "get it" at any real level.

 

So, no...that you think anyone might still accept this record means we haven't rubbed it in nearly hard enough. It means some other knucklehead might think it's the record to beat, and I don't see him doing it without similar methods. If we don't want that and we don't want more rules coming out of GC, then flamage and ridicule are the only tools we've got.

 

Peer pressure. Don't underestimate it.

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Me thinks it's time to close this thread...

 

Possibly, but the thread starter hasn't posted since the initial post. I'd at least like to see some sort of a reply from him before a mod closes the thread.

 

Why should he post? So that a handful of forum posters that think they speak for the whole geocaching world can start up all over again. They have apologized and offered to pay for the damage do you want their right arms too?

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Me thinks it's time to close this thread...

 

Possibly, but the thread starter hasn't posted since the initial post. I'd at least like to see some sort of a reply from him before a mod closes the thread.

 

Why should he post? So that a handful of forum posters that think they speak for the whole geocaching world can start up all over again. They have apologized and offered to pay for the damage do you want their right arms too?

 

Yep, and in MY mind they STILL hold the record. Come and get me thought police. :anitongue::ph34r::D

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Why should he post? So that a handful of forum posters that think they speak for the whole geocaching world can start up all over again. They have apologized and offered to pay for the damage do you want their right arms too?

 

Really? Where? Link me to it because I haven't seen it. I've seen ONE member of the team SORTA apologize, I've seen nothing from the rest.

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Yep, and in MY mind they STILL hold the record. Come and get me thought police. :anitongue::ph34r::D

No, but you (and the like-minded) ARE the reason this thread won't (and shouldn't) die.

 

I'm sorry Auntie. I didn't see your earlier post about piling on.

 

Fact is, I don't care. To me they went for over 350 caches and got 312 with 40+ DNFs. That's some kinda record regardless of your take on the situation. :(

 

Guinness has yet to put anyone's 24 hour geocaching record run in their book, so what should it matter to me what they claim? :(

 

I claimed most caches given away on this thread. BRAVO to the next knucklehead who tries to best 13k in a cache giveaway. It matters not, but I will be impressed if it is done in under a year and for less money than it cost me. :(

Edited by Snoogans
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Guinness has yet to put anyone's 24 hour geocaching record run in their book, so what should it matter to me what they claim? :anitongue:

Because any team that wants to beat it will have an impossible time doing so without adopting the same tactics, or worse.

 

Splitting up? Scouting? Cheating, but harmless. Though it certainly makes the achievement utterly meaningless.

 

Writing on caches? Bad. Bad. BADBADBAD. Bad monkeys. Leave aside quibbles about the rules and signing logbooks, that it didn't immediately and irredeemably strike everyone involved that defacing containers was going to be a problem is...breathtakingly stupid.

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Guinness has yet to put anyone's 24 hour geocaching record run in their book, so what should it matter to me what they claim? :anitongue:

Because any team that wants to beat it will have an impossible time doing so without adopting the same tactics, or worse.

 

Splitting up? Scouting? Cheating, but harmless. Though it certainly makes the achievement utterly meaningless.

 

Writing on caches? Bad. Bad. BADBADBAD. Bad monkeys. Leave aside quibbles about the rules and signing logbooks, that it didn't immediately and irredeemably strike everyone involved that defacing containers was going to be a problem is...breathtakingly stupid.

 

Any team that wants to go after the record under their rules should have fun doing so. Any person or team that wants to go after the record under the parameters set by previous record holders should have fun doing so.

 

They posted their rules and followed them and now they are the record holders under that paticular rule. Just because they didn't set the record under your rules or anyone else's does not make them bad people.

 

They made a mistake by signing the container rather than the actual log book. They acknowledged that mistake. The diferrence between ignorance and stupidity is that ignorance is temporary and stupidity is forever. These are highly respectablr cachers in the community. I don't think believe, nor do I think anyone should refer to them as stupid.

 

El Diablo

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Guinness has yet to put anyone's 24 hour geocaching record run in their book, so what should it matter to me what they claim? :)

Because any team that wants to beat it will have an impossible time doing so without adopting the same tactics, or worse.

 

Splitting up? Scouting? Cheating, but harmless. Though it certainly makes the achievement utterly meaningless.

 

Writing on caches? Bad. Bad. BADBADBAD. Bad monkeys. Leave aside quibbles about the rules and signing logbooks, that it didn't immediately and irredeemably strike everyone involved that defacing containers was going to be a problem is...breathtakingly stupid.

 

Any team that wants to go after the record under their rules should have fun doing so. Any person or team that wants to go after the record under the parameters set by previous record holders should have fun doing so.

 

They posted their rules and followed them and now they are the record holders under that paticular rule. Just because they didn't set the record under your rules or anyone else's does not make them bad people.

 

They made a mistake by signing the container rather than the actual log book. They acknowledged that mistake. The diferrence between ignorance and stupidity is that ignorance is temporary and stupidity is forever. These are highly respectablr cachers in the community. I don't think believe, nor do I think anyone should refer to them as stupid.

 

El Diablo

 

Auntie Weasel certainly makes a valid point. There has to be a set of rules/guidelines that are followed for any kind of record and they can't be those made up on the fly for only one team. They need to be recognized and followed by everyone who tries for this record attempt.

 

Geocaching consists of a few basic guidelines. One of these is, you sign (even stamp, whatever is quickest for you) the logbook. The other thing and i don't think there is a written guideline yet, it's more of a common sense issue, the team members need to stay together, not split up and make separate finds. It just seems obvious that these two basics should be used in these record attempts.

 

To be honest, i knew that there had to be some tricks to making these record runs, since finding and logging a cache every 4.6 minutes would be impossible to do using normal prcedures. I sure didn't have any idea that these kinds of tricks were being used though! :D

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Auntie Weasel certainly makes a valid point. There has to be a set of rules/guidelines that are followed for any kind of record and they can't be those made up on the fly for only one team. They need to be recognized and followed by everyone who tries for this record attempt.

 

Geocaching consists of a few basic guidelines. One of these is, you sign (even stamp, whatever is quickest for you) the logbook. The other thing and i don't think there is a written guideline yet, it's more of a common sense issue, the team members need to stay together, not split up and make separate finds. It just seems obvious that these two basics should be used in these record attempts.

 

To be honest, i knew that there had to be some tricks to making these record runs, since finding and logging a cache every 4.6 minutes would be impossible to do using normal prcedures. I sure didn't have any idea that these kinds of tricks were being used though! :)

 

FYI: there is a topic on the subject of proposed rules for record attempts here. :D

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<snip>

 

They made a mistake by signing the container rather than the actual log book. They acknowledged that mistake. The diferrence between ignorance and stupidity is that ignorance is temporary and stupidity is forever. These are highly respectablr cachers in the community. I don't think believe, nor do I think anyone should refer to them as stupid.

 

El Diablo

 

"Stupid is as stupid does." - Forrest Gump

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I'm going for a new record. I am going to try not to find a cache in the next 15 minutes - can I do it. I will let you know and can I make that a new "world" record. Apparently I can set my own rule right?

 

A little more sarcasim...it's all we need. :ph34r:

 

El Diablo

 

<_< LOL - PLEASE tell me the double sarcasm was intentional! :P

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