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Lame And Solely Commercial Geocoins


nfa

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Hi,

 

I've read and talked about the change in geocoins a lot in the last few months, and wanted to start a discussion.

 

Without naming specific coins or cachers, please put in your $0.02 about the change in geocoins in recent months (or discuss why you don't think the nature of geocoins has changed, if you don't believe that it has).

 

I'm of two minds about the recent evolutionary stage of geocoins:

  1. success breeds imitation...the production/sale of geocoins has probably followed a growth curve similar to that of GPS units or (worst case) pet rocks...and will level out once the market is saturated.
  2. TPTB opened the door to crappy and/or commercial geocoins when they brought in the new "guidelines" that allowed people to make and sell whatever they wanted as long as Groundspeak got their $1.50 per coin...

I'm interested in hearing what other people think about the reasons behind the change, or if people don't see a change.

 

Thanks,

 

Jamie - NFA

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Well the change happened longer than in the last few months. What you'll continue to see is the difficulty sellers have moving their 500+ "crappy coins."

 

Pricing and design play important roles. And those trying to sell $6 and $7 coins for $10 and $11 will have a difficult time and be stuck with a lot of product until they lower their price to what the market will bare. And even in many of those cases, the coins still won't sell. Once that realization sinks in, you'll see less new "crappy coin" editions for sale.

 

I don't see any reason to complain about it anymore though. As always, no one has to buy them. I think the days of trying to have every coin are over for most individuals.

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I am beginning to re-think how much progress has been made in this area after seeing "geo"coins relating to oriental decorating philosophies.

 

There is a sucker born every minute and there are some who are more than ready to part them with that money even if they are geocachers. What a poor way to take care of our community.

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Maybe now is the time for "us" as a community to start placing some rules/limits or even embargos on the geo-coin craze. Maybe "we" should be approaching the minters about some of these issues and even approaching TPTB about some of the concerns that have arisen. After all, this country is a Democracy and we should be Democratic about this issue.

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Maybe now is the time for "us" as a community to start placing some rules/limits or even embargos on the geo-coin craze. Maybe "we" should be approaching the minters about some of these issues and even approaching TPTB about some of the concerns that have arisen. After all, this country is a Democracy and we should be Democratic about this issue.

 

We also live in a free market society where you the consumer are in control of what YOU buy. :ninja:

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Maybe now is the time for "us" as a community to start placing some rules/limits or even embargos on the geo-coin craze. Maybe "we" should be approaching the minters about some of these issues and even approaching TPTB about some of the concerns that have arisen. After all, this country is a Democracy and we should be Democratic about this issue.

 

We also live in a free market society where you the consumer are in control of what YOU buy. :ninja:

 

I totally agree. If you don't like it, don't buy it. I see no reason why anyone needs to post negative comments on a design unless those comments were asked for. During the design process (like the current California Geocoin), critical comments are welcome but with a finished design I don't see why there needs to be any negative comments on the design. Let's keep these boards positive! :) Life is to short for so much negativity.

 

--Marky

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TPTB didn't cause commercial coins to happen. Some of the first coins were and remain commercial (USA, Canada).

 

TPTB did come out with some rules that skewed coins towards the result they wanted whatever the coins may be.

 

ICE as a group never did commercial coins, and we have since given up on anything but State and Country coins. Members sometimes do venture out into non ICE waters if they like the coin enough.

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Maybe now is the time for "us" as a community to start placing some rules/limits or even embargos on the geo-coin craze. Maybe "we" should be approaching the minters about some of these issues and even approaching TPTB about some of the concerns that have arisen. After all, this country is a Democracy and we should be Democratic about this issue.

 

We also live in a free market society where you the consumer are in control of what YOU buy. :P

 

BINGO! If this is the level of intelligence the geocaching market demands then perhaps it is time for me to start producing series of coins. Lets start with a tribute the Cookie Monster then perhaps a coin dedicated to accountants. I could make a fortune.

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It has gotten out of control but the fact of the matter is you are in control of what you want to buy. Don't like it or disagree with it then don't buy it, end of the story.

 

TPTB responded to people's wishes and desires. Should Moun10bike be the only one to have his own icon? Most thought not.

 

I think it is awesome that personals can have their own - will I buy each one that comes out? Nope, that's why I had my own made - so I can trade them (still have some left BTW). I will however purchase group, event and state coins, I think they are awesome and they can help out organizations with a little extra scratch.

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I don't buy coins like I use to due to the lack of relationship to Geocaching most of these coins have. This is nothing but a money frenzy now where someone will mint anything and hope they can sell 500. If not they will change the design based on "input/complaints". Someone will commend them for being open minded when really they could care less about their own design, they just want to sell them for their $3-5 profit. If sales are going too slow then they resort to plan B. Plan B is create another metal to have coin minted it in. 2 metals are good but 3 will generate more sales thus unloading the 500 faster. It use to be that you would produce a coin for your state (with the help of your local caching group), your caching group, or yourself. We are now having people sell coins based on things that are such a stretch to caching that I am not sure how the person minting it can even come up with the relation, at least not with a straight face. We have elephants, old wars, furniture placement trends, constellations, and the list will go on. Coins are being sold by people who have not only never even posted here before, but some have never even found a cache before. The saddest thing to me is the so called knowledgeable people wanting everyone to keep their mouths shut and allow these snake oil salesmen to sell their wares here on the wallets of the naive new collectors. I don't need the standard few people who routinely tell myself and other to just don't buy it, explaining it to me. I get it. I don't buy anything unless it's GC related. Anything that tells me where my couch should be aligned this month is not something that is GC related in my book. Anything that is for charity yet the person won't give all the profits to charity isn't really looking to save the elephants, they are looking to make a buck. Yes it was inevitable that this was going to happen, but what's sad is some people continue to protect it and actually encourage it by wanting everyone to stay quiet. Thank goodness there is freedom of speech here still.

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I like coins, i like the different icons.

 

I collect MAINLY personal coins, and a few state coins i like.

 

It has just spun WAY out of control with people having coins made that have totally nothing to do with geocaching or personal expression of themselves.

 

basically people have been hit with GREED, look at this people will buy a coin if i make it. and well at first that may have been the case, but now many people and limting what they buy, and some only trading for special ones.

 

Me, if your coin is for sale on certain stores, Im most likely not interested, unless its truely unique. I have had several people contact me wanting to trade, but why would I trade for a coin that 1000 were made and anyone can buy it if they are interested?

 

It is a buyers market, and like the housing market its not just steadied, its slowed down a lot.

 

so dont go buying 20 of that coin thinking you can sell it on ebay and make a huge profit.

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I'm interested in hearing what other people think about the reasons behind the change, or if people don't see a change.

Jamie - NFA

 

money.gifmoney.gifmoney.gifmoney.gifmoney.gif

 

Plain and simple. They are no longer made to represent anything (for the most part - there are still some good ones).

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When a non-personal coin fails to do more than have the word "geocaching" on it, then it's bound to be criticized as not belonging in these discussion groups, and subsequently not very well received. It's really time for those who question this to simply accept that people are wanting to contribute their ideas to what was once a fanatical and lucretive craze, and GC.com currently allows it. Perhaps GC.com facilitated this without anticipating the extent to which the "boundaries" would be stretched.

 

No amount of criticism here will stop capitalism. Your money is your voice.

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Maybe now is the time for "us" as a community to start placing some rules/limits or even embargos on the geo-coin craze. Maybe "we" should be approaching the minters about some of these issues and even approaching TPTB about some of the concerns that have arisen. After all, this country is a Democracy and we should be Democratic about this issue.

 

HI FOLKS!

This is AMERICA!

Capitalisim,Free enterprise,Supply & Demand.

These are a few of the things that make America Great!

It comes down to buy it,or don't.

That is all we have to say.

Have a GREAT day!

R3 & BH

 

Actually guys, not everyone on these boards live in a democracy and not everyone lives in America... Not every country is democratic about things and thats ok. So please guys, remember, even though you live in America or where ever, your goverment type does not rule the world.

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HI FOLKS!

This is AMERICA!

Capitalisim,Free enterprise,Supply & Demand.

These are a few of the things that make America Great!

It comes down to buy it,or don't.

That is all we have to say.

Have a GREAT day!

R3 & BH

 

Well, at least I get to control the links I put on my reference page. Some may not consider it complete without links to certain coins. My purpose in starting it was to show people that coins being sold on Ebay 3 to 4 times as much as they were currently being offered by the creator. The purpose of my site is to assist new and veteran geocoin enthusists.

 

 

Recently I have been asked to include links to pages for sales of coins that have minimal to marginal direct geocaching links, and are being sold for almost twice their actual value. I have decided to not include these links as I don't see the benefit to the geocoin collecting community in additional advertisement of these coins. If I find that any of my links are now to profit venture sites solely, I will adjust or delete the link accordingly.

 

When I first started to collect coins, a $3.00 coin was more a norm than steal or deal. With the additon of color and tracking numbers, I can understand that there are additional minting costs. While I realize I will never see the advertisement of a $3.00 coin again, I do wish that people would leave the profit margins behind. I have been involved in creating coins, and I know the costs of minting and there are some really greedy !@$^#&* out there right now.

 

From $80+ coin sets (with only 4 coins) to series of coins that have no geocaching relation having tracking numbers... There are strict rules about placing geocaches, I think the same needs to be done with use of tracking numbers.

 

While many of us do reside in America, not all of the caching and coin collecting community do.

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If you have very high name recognition in the gc community, or if you have a really top notch geocaching related design, or preferrably both you still have a chance to sell enough coins to pay for your icon. If you don't fall into those catagories you better bring your VISA card :P

 

I have been getting more and more people wanting truly personal coins and lower quantities and I think that is the best choice for most people that want a coin. Make it personal and make what you can afford on your own. You will be happier and your coin will be more desirable if it is relates to geocaching and represents your personality.

 

My .02

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HI FOLKS!

This is AMERICA!

Capitalisim,Free enterprise,Supply & Demand.

These are a few of the things that make America Great!

It comes down to buy it,or don't.

That is all we have to say.

Have a GREAT day!

R3 & BH

 

Well, at least I get to control the links I put on my reference page. Some may not consider it complete without links to certain coins. My purpose in starting it was to show people that coins being sold on Ebay 3 to 4 times as much as they were currently being offered by the creator. The purpose of my site is to assist new and veteran geocoin enthusists.

 

 

Recently I have been asked to include links to pages for sales of coins that have minimal to marginal direct geocaching links, and are being sold for almost twice their actual value. I have decided to not include these links as I don't see the benefit to the geocoin collecting community in additional advertisement of these coins. If I find that any of my links are now to profit venture sites solely, I will adjust or delete the link accordingly.

 

When I first started to collect coins, a $3.00 coin was more a norm than steal or deal. With the additon of color and tracking numbers, I can understand that there are additional minting costs. While I realize I will never see the advertisement of a $3.00 coin again, I do wish that people would leave the profit margins behind. I have been involved in creating coins, and I know the costs of minting and there are some really greedy !@$^#&* out there right now.

 

From $80+ coin sets (with only 4 coins) to series of coins that have no geocaching relation having tracking numbers... There are strict rules about placing geocaches, I think the same needs to be done with use of tracking numbers.

 

While many of us do reside in America, not all of the caching and coin collecting community do.

 

I think really that all of the sites listed on your extremely useful site that are selling geocoins are for profit sites. I don't believe any of them are doing it for kicks and giggles.

 

Just my .02

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You know it is crazy and I see both sides. However aren't personals coins just that personal? Are they not signature item? If you really stop and think about this when Moun10Bike first produced his coin it was a personal coin that had very little to do about Geocaching, rather it was a reflection of who he is. I am not totally convinced that a coin must be geocaching related. As long as the person doing the coin is a Geocacher is this not geocaching related? That is how the Geocoin Craze started anyway.

 

The whole point that is being missed isn't whether the coin is geocaching related or not. the point is why are we paying for a person to produce their signature item :P ? If you can't afford to pay for your own signature items then perhaps you need to find a cheaper signature item :P .

 

Of course these are just my $0.02.

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You know it is crazy and I see both sides. However aren't personals coins just that personal? Are they not signature item? If you really stop and think about this when Moun10Bike first produced his coin it was a personal coin that had very little to do about Geocaching, rather it was a reflection of who he is. I am not totally convinced that a coin must be geocaching related. As long as the person doing the coin is a Geocacher is this not geocaching related? That is how the Geocoin Craze started anyway.

 

The whole point that is being missed isn't whether the coin is geocaching related or not. the point is why are we paying for a person to produce their signature item :P ? If you can't afford to pay for your own signature items then perhaps you need to find a cheaper signature item :P .

 

Of course these are just my $0.02.

 

Moun10Bike wasn't selling his coin then... or now.

 

I think the major complaint is that coins are being SOLD that have little or nothing to do with caching... but are being advertised as such. Messages aren't being posted in forums selling signature items with a team name on them. The complaint is people producing coins that are seeking a profit, and these same coins bear only a "trackable at geocaching.com" relevenece to geocaching as a whole.

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Hi again folks!

We mentioned America, because it seems it is people from here who are having the problems with profitability. Even if you only produce a personal coin, if you sell that coin, you are going to make a profit on it. Unless you are selling your coins at cost (what YOU paid for it) you are making a profit. Why shouldn't you? If you were selling any other items you made, for example, a work of art, you would EXPECT to make a profit. Why should geocoins be any different?

As for being geocaching related, if you look at any item, there is a way it can be made to be geocaching related. You know.... beauty in the eye of the beholder thing....who are we to say what someone else may consider to be "geocaching related?"

We can beat this subject to death, and talk until we are blue in the face, but it is still going to come down to profitability, plain and simple. If people didn't want these items, they wouldn't sell, then this conversation would be moot.

We can say we are looking out for the newbie collectors, but in reality, these people are adults (most of them...LOL) We are sure they can make up their own minds as to what they like, and want to collect.

BTW,If you are REALLY into Geocaching,Produce a coin,and sell it at cost, we will buy ONE,and promise not to sell it.ANY TAKERS?

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You know, I have to say, having recently sold my coin: If I had it to do over, I wouldn't have. I would have instead minted 100, and traded. I love my coin, and selling it did pay for them. But I think I would have been just as happy with traders only. I would have missed my fantastic icon, but if I mint another coin next year, it will be for trade and caches only.

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I don't mind all the extra coins, but I don't buy many of them. I figure it is a free market and people can make their own choices. Some of the "theme" coins are quite fun, but I have given up on buying most of them.

 

I started out wanting every coin. After I saw what that cost me, along with realizing that some of the coins meant little to me and I had just been in a new collector craze, I calmed down. Now I generally buy only state coins and some personal coins. Sometimes I buy a few extra of something to have coins to trade. With all the other coins, if one speaks to me in some way I will buy it, but more likely I will just trade for those or ignore them. Once in awhile I really like the theme though and will jump on it. And I definitely try to avoid ones that seem purely commercial, such as ebay only sales or way overpriced etc.

Edited by carleenp
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Interesting thread. I am happy to see Geocoins which are posted here as they help support one of my hobbies, Geocaching. Servers, Bandwidth, people all cost money.

 

If there is a coin that you dont like, vote with your money. That is what each of us do.

 

BTW, I went to *bucks this morning, paid $7.00! That was gone in about 15 mins. Aftwards, I said to myself, that could have been a Geocoin!

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Hi again folks!

We mentioned America, because it seems it is people from here who are having the problems with profitability. Even if you only produce a personal coin, if you sell that coin, you are going to make a profit on it. Unless you are selling your coins at cost (what YOU paid for it) you are making a profit. Why shouldn't you? If you were selling any other items you made, for example, a work of art, you would EXPECT to make a profit. Why should geocoins be any different?

As for being geocaching related, if you look at any item, there is a way it can be made to be geocaching related. You know.... beauty in the eye of the beholder thing....who are we to say what someone else may consider to be "geocaching related?"

We can beat this subject to death, and talk until we are blue in the face, but it is still going to come down to profitability, plain and simple. If people didn't want these items, they wouldn't sell, then this conversation would be moot.

We can say we are looking out for the newbie collectors, but in reality, these people are adults (most of them...LOL) We are sure they can make up their own minds as to what they like, and want to collect.

BTW,If you are REALLY into Geocaching,Produce a coin,and sell it at cost, we will buy ONE,and promise not to sell it.ANY TAKERS?

 

Well said

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