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Event Caches


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In lew of the spew that is going on over here Multiple Finds on Events

 

I thought I would ask if there is any way perhaps a way of logging temp event caches could be added to the Event pages ?

 

If not could TPTB clarify what is proper and what is not?

 

Its offensive that good people and good cachers are being accused of "cheating" by puritians, when there is no set of rules or clairification on what is right and proper.

 

We personally log the finds as per what the person holding the event would like us to do . Thus far in my area this has worked well . Unfortunately this also is making us "cheaters" per the conversations going on in that thread.

 

We do not beleive that anyone is actually "cheating" in this sport/game. But perhaps something can be done to help clear up this problem ?

 

Thank you so much .

 

Star

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How can you cheat when nobody wins? Did I miss the prize?

 

Seriously - I think that TPTB have never really cared about the logs one way or another. I have a link somewhere where Jeremy himself says he doesn't give a hoot how temporary caches are logged.

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I wouldn't call it cheating so much as it is lying. By logging temporary caches you are most definately claiming to have done something you most certainly did not do. This activity is based on the honor system and truthfulness is the basis of any such sytem. When you lie you cheapen not only yourself but everyone else who participates in that system.

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How can you cheat when nobody wins? Did I miss the prize?

 

Seriously - I think that TPTB have never really cared about the logs one way or another. I have a link somewhere where Jeremy himself says he doesn't give a hoot how temporary caches are logged.

If you mean this one, then he said it's "stupid" but he was not losing "sleep over it."

His (Mopar's) point is that it might be impossible or extremely difficult to do the programming that would be required to make it possible for the Temp caches to show up as a different Icon in the stats.

The point is irrelevant. Temp caches aren't allowed on the site. And as I indicated in countless threads in the past, I think logging attended twice for an event is stupid, and posting additional logs to "match" whatever "count" you determined your numbers should be is equally stupid. However I have no plans to be the point police and create complicated rules for determining what counts as a find. That is up to the cache listing owner to decide.

 

However I do reserve the right to stop abuse on this web site, and frown highly upon fake logs on archived caches (or any cache) just to boost numbers here - such as counting finds on other listing sites. Just because I don't want to be the point police doesn't mean I can't take appropriate action against the users who decide to abuse the features of this site.

 

But as I also said before, I don't lose sleep over it. I stand by my stance that there are no "points" for geocaching and no score to be kept. The site does not keep score but simply offers a history of your finds.

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I wouldn't call it cheating so much as it is lying. By logging temporary caches you are most definately claiming to have done something you most certainly did not do. This activity is based on the honor system and truthfulness is the basis of any such sytem. When you lie you cheapen not only yourself but everyone else who participates in that system.

 

I am not sure that it really qualifies as lying either , because you did actually find the event caches temporary as they may have been . How are you lying about something you DID do ?

 

Star

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How can you cheat when nobody wins? Did I miss the prize?

 

Seriously - I think that TPTB have never really cared about the logs one way or another. I have a link somewhere where Jeremy himself says he doesn't give a hoot how temporary caches are logged.

If you mean this one, then he said it's "stupid" but he was not losing "sleep over it."

His (Mopar's) point is that it might be impossible or extremely difficult to do the programming that would be required to make it possible for the Temp caches to show up as a different Icon in the stats.

The point is irrelevant. Temp caches aren't allowed on the site. And as I indicated in countless threads in the past, I think logging attended twice for an event is stupid, and posting additional logs to "match" whatever "count" you determined your numbers should be is equally stupid. However I have no plans to be the point police and create complicated rules for determining what counts as a find. That is up to the cache listing owner to decide.

 

However I do reserve the right to stop abuse on this web site, and frown highly upon fake logs on archived caches (or any cache) just to boost numbers here - such as counting finds on other listing sites. Just because I don't want to be the point police doesn't mean I can't take appropriate action against the users who decide to abuse the features of this site.

 

But as I also said before, I don't lose sleep over it. I stand by my stance that there are no "points" for geocaching and no score to be kept. The site does not keep score but simply offers a history of your finds.

 

Thanks that is how we generally play !

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I wouldn't call it cheating so much as it is lying. By logging temporary caches you are most definately claiming to have done something you most certainly did not do. This activity is based on the honor system and truthfulness is the basis of any such sytem. When you lie you cheapen not only yourself but everyone else who participates in that system.

 

I am not sure that it really qualifies as lying either , because you did actually find the event caches temporary as they may have been . How are you lying about something you DID do ?

 

Star

 

The found or attended log indicates you found or attended the cache that is listed on this site. It does not indicate you found a scrap of paper in somebodies pocket. You are claiming one thing as another. That, where I come from, is called lying.

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I wouldn't call it cheating so much as it is lying. By logging temporary caches you are most definately claiming to have done something you most certainly did not do. This activity is based on the honor system and truthfulness is the basis of any such sytem. When you lie you cheapen not only yourself but everyone else who participates in that system.

 

I am not sure that it really qualifies as lying either , because you did actually find the event caches temporary as they may have been . How are you lying about something you DID do ?

 

Star

 

The found or attended log indicates you found or attended the cache that is listed on this site. It does not indicate you found a scrap of paper in somebodies pocket. You are claiming one thing as another. That, where I come from, is called lying.

 

K point well taken , I guess we really havent done any events with pocket caches at them , but the events we have attended tend to have real but temp caches placed in them , complete with logs and such . Wherein hicking and enjoying the area are involved .

 

Star

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How can you cheat when nobody wins? Did I miss the prize?

 

Seriously - I think that TPTB have never really cared about the logs one way or another. I have a link somewhere where Jeremy himself says he doesn't give a hoot how temporary caches are logged.

If you mean this one, then he said it's "stupid" but he was not losing "sleep over it."

That is up to the cache listing owner to decide.
Thanks that is how we generally play !

If you follow the rest of that thread (which you can do by clicking the little arrow next to the "quote"), Jeremy also said this:

I know what I was suggesting was adding an option when logging on an event page in the drop down list like "Event Cache Found" or something similar. When it shows in our stats it could have a different icon for caches found at events.

No. No temporary caches. No special log type. No "count" find for caches found during an event. I don't know how much clearer I need to be.

;)
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How can you cheat when nobody wins? Did I miss the prize?

 

Seriously - I think that TPTB have never really cared about the logs one way or another. I have a link somewhere where Jeremy himself says he doesn't give a hoot how temporary caches are logged.

If you mean this one, then he said it's "stupid" but he was not losing "sleep over it."

That is up to the cache listing owner to decide.
Thanks that is how we generally play !

If you follow the rest of that thread (which you can do by clicking the little arrow next to the "quote"), Jeremy also said this:

I know what I was suggesting was adding an option when logging on an event page in the drop down list like "Event Cache Found" or something similar. When it shows in our stats it could have a different icon for caches found at events.

No. No temporary caches. No special log type. No "count" find for caches found during an event. I don't know how much clearer I need to be.

;)

 

Thank you again TFTC , was not aware of this at all , perhaps sometime in the future someone will change their mind :D !

 

Star

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Thank you again TFTC , was not aware of this at all , perhaps sometime in the future someone will change their mind ;) !

 

Star

Here's one more - Markwell's "two hoots" reference post.

quote:
Originally posted by Markwell:

And yet, on numerous times people have volunteered to assist in the process, and the calls have gone unanswered.

 

I believe we have a large enough list of manageable approvers at the moment. Here are the combined issues as to why temporary caches should not be created:

 

1. Temporary caches are exactly that: Temporary. I didn't think it was necessary to apply the "semi-permanent" to "permanent" rule to geocache listings as we do to virtual caches, since in almost all cases they are meant to be there tomorrow.

 

2. An "event" as defined can contain "caches," much like multicaches. If you want to post coordinates to pre-event caches on the event cache page, feel free. The fact that these caches are part of a specific event does not warrant their own cache page.

 

3. Use existing caches if you want to, say, provide pieces of coordinates in caches to find a final cache. I'd say the exception would be if the caches are farther than 10+ miles away from each other. Having 5 separate caches listed in the same park doesn't make much sense to me.

 

I couldn't give two hoots if someone wants to log an event cache twice. It's their find count and there is no competition here. So if you find a cache at an event, knock yourself out.

 

I gues my question is, what's the point? People at the event seek these things out, so what's wrong with using the event cache page?

 

Jeremy Irish

Groundspeak - The Language of Location

It's clear this discussion has been going on for years! At least it's not going to slow us down from finding caches! :D
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I wouldn't call it cheating so much as it is lying. By logging temporary caches you are most definately claiming to have done something you most certainly did not do. This activity is based on the honor system and truthfulness is the basis of any such sytem. When you lie you cheapen not only yourself but everyone else who participates in that system.

 

I am not sure that it really qualifies as lying either , because you did actually find the event caches temporary as they may have been . How are you lying about something you DID do ?

 

Star

 

The found or attended log indicates you found or attended the cache that is listed on this site. It does not indicate you found a scrap of paper in somebodies pocket. You are claiming one thing as another. That, where I come from, is called lying.

 

K point well taken , I guess we really havent done any events with pocket caches at them , but the events we have attended tend to have real but temp caches placed in them , complete with logs and such . Wherein hicking and enjoying the area are involved .

 

Star

 

I take your point too. But my standard still applies. In that case you are still claiming to have atended an event twice when you only did so once. It also applies to logging them on any other cache for the same reasons. It is generally accepted to not log a cache multiple times, yet in these cases it is right and proper?

 

A fitting and current analogy, IMHO, is the current situation with Barry Bonds. Are his accomplishment the same as Ruth's or Aaron's if he used steroids? That gives me an idea, maybe we could carry the analogy on and have an asterisk next to those cache types where a cacher has logged a single cache multiple times. It worked in the Maris case... ;)

 

In the end I guess it really is a small matter in the grander scheme of things. I'm not going to lose any sleep over it or let it stop me from enjoying this pastime. :D

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IMO, temporary caches at an event are not true caches. They may be fun to find as games during the event but should not count as a smiley. I believe that you should not be able to log a cache as found more than once and for existing find logs, the second and subsequent founds should be converted to notes.

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Read all the posts of what Jeremy said.

 

He doesn't like them

He isn't going to stop anyone unless they abuse the system

He doesn't care if you do them

We are not the log police.

 

 

So everyone should do what they think is right and STOP worrying about what the other guy is doing. Nothing anyone else does can change how I feel about my finds unless I let it. Worry about your own game. Not everyone else's. These threads are sounding like first grade. "Teacher, teacher, Johnny cheated on the test." Isn't it time we all acted like adults and stopped being our brothers keeper?

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So everyone should do what they think is right and STOP worrying about what the other guy is doing

 

I would also add that cachers should probably stop worrying about how others feel regarding what they are doing.

 

You had him, Mr. Eastwood! You could have just walked away, and nobody would o' thought the less o' ya for it. All it would have been was words... hot air from a buffoon. Instead you let him rile ya...rile ya into playing his game, his way, playing his rules. Seamus McFly, Back to the Future III

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Most of us are 'quantified' in some way or another at work. This game is one of the ways I play and enjoy myself. IMO, if I allow myself to quantify my play, then it starts to lean towards work. I've only been to one event and that is what I logged -- 1 event. I was actually quite amused at the mutiple logging of the event and also of logging geocoins that people actually hadn't found. I'm new to the sport, but I want to find the coin in the wilds before I log it. I've released 5 geocoins already for others pleasure, and have gone on some great trips retrieving geocoins for myself to log. The adventure is much more satisfying if I've actually done something for that # of caches or for that icon!

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Read all the posts of what Jeremy said.

 

He doesn't like them

He isn't going to stop anyone unless they abuse the system

He doesn't care if you do them

We are not the log police.

 

 

So everyone should do what they think is right and STOP worrying about what the other guy is doing. Nothing anyone else does can change how I feel about my finds unless I let it. Worry about your own game. Not everyone else's. These threads are sounding like first grade. "Teacher, teacher, Johnny cheated on the test." Isn't it time we all acted like adults and stopped being our brothers keeper?

 

Thank you for the nice concise post. I totally agree with you. Blatant cheaters get found out very quickly (especially in my area). I will sit back and <_<

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