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"cache Cops"


NetDrummer
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I'm seeing a discouraging trend around Springfield, Missouri. There are a couple of cachers - one in particular - that have taken it upon themselves to evaluate and judge new geocaches in the area. Their unwarranted and unsolicited criticism is in my opinion detrimental to the atmosphere around here. They have sucessfully run one guy off. Recently a fairly new geocacher placed several challenging caches. He clearly stated the caches were challenging and tiny. Within a few weeks the criticism on the cache logs became so negative that he's archived several and is planning on archiving the remainder of his new caches soon. He won't even respond to directed emails. I recently experienced the same situation to a much lower degree. The one cacher in particular apparently isn't pleased with the location of my latest placement.

 

My question: is this a common occurance in other areas - for a few experienced cachers to try & dictate how caching is done in a particular area ? Is this likely to blow over in time ? Of course I'm tempted to contact these guys & ask them where they got their authority to bash other cachers but I really don't want to cause even more problems.

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I had a couple of "experienced" cachers comment negatively about one of our hides. That's fine. They are entitled to their opinion. I had others who commented on how much they enjoyed it.

 

I have also commented a couple of times about caches. It irks me when multistage caches are done by writing coords on benches, signs, walkways, etc with permanent marker. One that we did like this was hidden by a new cacher so I suggested a few nearby multistages that they could do for ideas on ways to hide the coordinates without defacing public property. They thanked me and I didn't think anymore about it until this week when I did a new multistage they put out. I was thrilled to see that there was no grafitti on this one.

 

There have also been some hides that I really didn't like the way it was done but I did not say anything. Like the one where the hider drilled a hole in a tree, inserted the cache, the put a branch over it to conceal it. Oops... I guess I've commented on that one now too. :D

Edited by Lil Elephants
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I'm always hesitant to step into these threads, because sometimes the backstory changes everything. But "hesitant" isn't the same thing as not doing it :D

 

If I thought caches in my area were being unfairly criticized, my overwhelming temptation would be to hide a series of themed caches with titles like "You-Know-Who Won't Like This One" and "Guaranteed To Irritate My Betters."

 

On the other hand, I don't like micros in the woods. So perhaps I wouldn't.

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Yeah, I see both points. It just irks me when I see a guy that was fired up about geocaching get run off because some people don't like micros. They're not my favorite either but this guy was very clear about his hides. Now he's making comments like "my heart is broken over this" and he's archiving 10 or so hides.

Oh well, I think I'm better off just doing the ones I want to do, & keep to myself.

It's just a hobby - sheesh ! some people try to control everything. What's new, right ?

 

Thanks !

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It is possible to make a clever and interesting hide using a micro-cache. Unfortunately many people just run out and plop one down without much thought. That may be why new cachers are advised to get a few finds under their belt before they hide one. I have, a few times, posted what may be considered a ‘negative’ log for a cache. Why am I here? What were you trying to show me? If the cache seems to have no other purpose than to provide a ‘hide’ stat for someone, what’s the point?

 

Example 1. Micro cache in a tiny park. Woop-d-damnn-doo right? The owners of this particular cache took the time so that the journey to the park was fun. You have to stand on a high bridge and, using a compass and provided bearings, pick off the clues from the skyline of the city. Using those clues gets you the final coordinates.

 

Example 2. Micro cache whose coordinates take you to a piece of sculpture art in the city. Not terribly thrilling enough for you? After you’ve puzzled the benches and planters, you turn and see something peculiar on the sculpture itself. The owners painted the container the exact color as the sculpture and the round mint container blends in to the sculpture perfectly. It became part of the piece! Its survival is indicative of how well the cache is hidden in plain sight.

 

A needle-in-the-haystack micro that is just an exercise in futility isn’t much fun.

Edited by Criminal
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Yeah, I see both points. It just irks me when I see a guy that was fired up about geocaching get run off because some people don't like micros. They're not my favorite either but this guy was very clear about his hides. Now he's making comments like "my heart is broken over this" and he's archiving 10 or so hides.

Oh well, I think I'm better off just doing the ones I want to do, & keep to myself.

It's just a hobby - sheesh ! some people try to control everything. What's new, right ?

 

My thoughts exactly.

 

Two thoughts:

 

When I have a problem with a cache I contact the owner rather than complain in the logs. Whatever I have a problem with might be something done by a finder, and not the intention of the owner, so this gives the owner a chance to either explain to me why they did what they did, or to fix it. I did this last weekend and the owner promptly replied that I was the second to report this and he was heading out this week to fix it. I look forward to completing his multi.

 

Also, why would someone who doesn't like micros go look for one, and then whine about it when he finds it. Between the classification, description, maps and logs there should be no doubt in a cachers mind that they are looking for a micro before they start out. If someone doesn't like micros, fine, then just don't do them.

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It varies, but there are always people who take it upon themselves to police their local area for whatever it is they think needs policing. Log books, cache quality, micros.

 

These folks are a nuisance but normally not fatal unless you obsess over them.

 

Mosty people these folks manage to chase out of geocaching couldn't handle honest feedback either.

 

There are exceptions.

Edited by Renegade Knight
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Some people have way too thin skin. If someone was critical of my caches, I'd ask myself if the critique was warranted. If not I'd ignore it and if it was I'd try to do better next time.

 

Actually, I wish more people were honest in their logs. It might cut down on the micro spew. People place things and when don't see any criticism it encourages them to place more.

Edited by briansnat
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Yee - Haa ! I figured I'd get some good feedback. Excellent...and thank you !

It's just me but I agree with CheshireFrog. I think it ought to be between the criticizer and the owner. I wouldn't bash someone's poorly done cache on the log for all to see. Logs should be logs...and we have a forum for discussion and email for personal comments....(ideally)

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Yeah, I see both points. It just irks me when I see a guy that was fired up about geocaching get run off because some people don't like micros. They're not my favorite either but this guy was very clear about his hides. Now he's making comments like "my heart is broken over this" and he's archiving 10 or so hides.

Oh well, I think I'm better off just doing the ones I want to do, & keep to myself.

It's just a hobby - sheesh ! some people try to control everything. What's new, right ?

 

Thanks !

Send the guy (the one who's archiving his caches) a private e-mail. Give him some positive feedback, and coach him a little on how to glean the constructive parts out of the critical logs without taking it personally.

 

I remember that on my first cache, which I had spent a lot of time on, I got several nice logs and then one very lengthy one that really disappointed me. After having some time to get over my initial dismay, I was able to re-read the log a bit more objectively, and came away from it with several very good suggestions which I tried to keep in mind in the future.

 

Help him remember that not everyone is especially skilled with words, and not everyone is a diplomat. Yeah, maybe the guy who posted the logs in question really is a jerk -- but maybe he's also just trying to make some suggestions on how it could be better, and he's just very clumsy in the way he says it.

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I know of many experienced cachers that have no problem criticizing other peoples caches. They feel that they are doing this in the best interest of geocaching. It often comes down to caches that they don't like to do - but it's easy to justify that there are too many micros or the cache is in a bad part of town or simply that the hider didn't put much effort into hiding the cache. One thing that I've found is that many of these caches don't last long anyhow. And the hiders usually decide that hiding caches isn't so much fun after their caches get muggled a few times and they get mostly TNLNSL logs. My general advice is to hide the kinds of caches you like to find and ignore what other people may think. However, for those who need positive feedback from others, I have posted these guidelines for hiding a cache.

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I'm seeing a discouraging trend around Springfield, Missouri. There are a couple of cachers - one in particular - that have taken it upon themselves to evaluate and judge new geocaches in the area. Their unwarranted and unsolicited criticism is in my opinion detrimental to the atmosphere around here. They have sucessfully run one guy off. Recently a fairly new geocacher placed several challenging caches. He clearly stated the caches were challenging and tiny. Within a few weeks the criticism on the cache logs became so negative that he's archived several and is planning on archiving the remainder of his new caches soon. He won't even respond to directed emails. I recently experienced the same situation to a much lower degree. The one cacher in particular apparently isn't pleased with the location of my latest placement.

 

My question: is this a common occurance in other areas - for a few experienced cachers to try & dictate how caching is done in a particular area ? Is this likely to blow over in time ? Of course I'm tempted to contact these guys & ask them where they got their authority to bash other cachers but I really don't want to cause even more problems.

 

It's my opinion (after spending way too much time surfing logs in the Springfield area :D ), that the comments posted (specifically to Nightmare on Erie street) are not the least bit out of line, very good natured and sincere constructive criticism offered by an experienced cacher from the area. And the cache hider is being way too sensitive. I think (my opinion again) even starting a forum thread titled "Cache Cops" is an over reaction. Also, I feel this will blow over, even in a matter of weeks, rather than months.

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This may be frowned upon by some.... but if this individual is being overly mean has a tendancy of doing this over and over again one option for the cache owner is to edit or delete the log entry. I'm sure this would upset this individual, but if this person is constantly doing this perhaps it'll get his attention.

 

As mentioned before tact is key. Unfortunately tact is like common sense - many seem to be lacking it.

 

-al

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Some caches, micro or not, are great, some are good, some are ok, and a few just plain suck. To tactfully say so isn’t complaining or whining, it’s constructive criticism. Get over it.

 

While it may be true that some micros are great, some are good and some suck, that hardly applies to the post in question here, since the poster had not found the micro.

 

I went back and reviewed the log in question, and I have to disagree; that was whining. Doubly so, since the poster praised the cache on his first DNF and ripped micros in general on his second DNF for the same cache. How much more constructive would it have been for this poster to PM the owner and suggest that he try his hand at some more conventional caches? That said, if the owner is taking his ball and going home (archiving his micros and quitting placing caches) based on the criticism in that post, he is a bit thin skinned.

Edited by CheshireFrog
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I have found caches that were flat out lame, sucked big time, and/or were hidden in some of the saddest uninteresting locations imaginable,,,in my opinion. :D Even so, i don't think i have ever whined about a cache not meeting my standards. So it sucked,,, it's not a big deal! That being said, a person can probably tell that i wasn't too impressed with their cache as my log will be short with just the date, a thanks, and my signature. I just don't see any point is writing in my log that i didn't like someone's cache.

 

Now, if it's a safety, private property, or cache maintenance issue then i will post my concerns in the log and in an email to the owner! :D

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Like white Eurkel I read through some of the logs, and really saw nothing wrong,except maybe a few people with thin skins.

I think Constructive criticism should be considered helpful,and the posts I read were that, in my opinion.

Of course opinions are like -------- everyone has one

:D:D:D:D:D

Edited by vagabond
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I'll generally say what I think. A GladWare container visible from twenty feet away on a golf driving range is not a well-placed or thought-out cache. Okay, I should take the time to e-mail the owner to offer advice.

A bison tube hanging from a tree next to a swamp, with bad coordinates. "Why do I bother?" seemed a fair assessment. My log of "Coords 700' feet off, even worse than the coords on the rest of this multi" did get deleted. :D Gosh, I don't know why.

True, extra concern should be given to newbies. But for the owner whose coords are always fifty or more feet off, I will tell it like I see it.

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For what it's worth, I found the geocache mentioned above just today.

After actually experiencing one of the caches that started this mess, I'll stick with my original view. It was a nice hide. Ingenious but not impossible...nowhere close. Actually, the "container" was small but markedly different than similar objects on the structure it was on. I spent 10 -15 minutes and enjoyed it. Why discourage that ?

It's kinda looking like to me that a guy with 500+ finds had trouble and didn't like it.

I appreciate all the comments. I've learned some human nature reading this topic.

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It is possible to make a clever and interesting hide using a micro-cache. Unfortunately many people just run out and plop one down without much thought. That may be why new cachers are advised to get a few finds under their belt before they hide one. I have, a few times, posted what may be considered a ‘negative’ log for a cache. Why am I here? What were you trying to show me? If the cache seems to have no other purpose than to provide a ‘hide’ stat for someone, what’s the point?

 

Example 1. Micro cache in a tiny park. Woop-d-damnn-doo right? The owners of this particular cache took the time so that the journey to the park was fun. You have to stand on a high bridge and, using a compass and provided bearings, pick off the clues from the skyline of the city. Using those clues gets you the final coordinates.

 

Example 2. Micro cache whose coordinates take you to a piece of sculpture art in the city. Not terribly thrilling enough for you? After you’ve puzzled the benches and planters, you turn and see something peculiar on the sculpture itself. The owners painted the container the exact color as the sculpture and the round mint container blends in to the sculpture perfectly. It became part of the piece! Its survival is indicative of how well the cache is hidden in plain sight.

 

A needle-in-the-haystack micro that is just an exercise in futility isn’t much fun.

 

I can't believe that no one else from Springfield has responded to this thread.

 

I have to agree with Criminal on this one. An interesting and cleverly placed micro can be fun. Not a whole bunch of micros that are nearly impossible to find. The whole situation was getting out of hand.

 

I don't have much of a response as to the types of micros that this cacher was putting out, I hear most of them were quite creative, but I do have a problem with the rate at which the caches were being hidden. Every park, every nook and cranny was being taken up with these "tiny, clever, evil" micros about every other day. And most of those places where they were hidden could have supported a bigger cache. Smaller is not always better. It started to seem as if the whole point of the hide was to make so it couldn't be found at all. I personally don't care to spend so much time looking for a micro in a heavily populated place. It makes the chance of being seen and the cache being muggled later all that much greater.

 

That's all I have to say about that.....

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Some people have way too thin skin. If someone was critical of my caches, I'd ask myself if the critique was warranted. If not I'd ignore it and if it was I'd try to do better next time.

 

Actually, I wish more people were honest in their logs. It might cut down on the micro spew. People place things and when don't see any criticism it encourages them to place more.

 

You rock, Brian. Always have, always will.

Thanks for explaining in a few words what I couldn't have said without writing a novel about it...lol

Edited by PandyBat
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I'm seeing a discouraging trend around Springfield, Missouri. There are a couple of cachers - one in particular - that have taken it upon themselves to evaluate and judge new geocaches in the area. Their unwarranted and unsolicited criticism is in my opinion detrimental to the atmosphere around here. They have sucessfully run one guy off. Recently a fairly new geocacher placed several challenging caches. He clearly stated the caches were challenging and tiny. Within a few weeks the criticism on the cache logs became so negative that he's archived several and is planning on archiving the remainder of his new caches soon. He won't even respond to directed emails. I recently experienced the same situation to a much lower degree. The one cacher in particular apparently isn't pleased with the location of my latest placement.

 

My question: is this a common occurance in other areas - for a few experienced cachers to try & dictate how caching is done in a particular area ? Is this likely to blow over in time ? Of course I'm tempted to contact these guys & ask them where they got their authority to bash other cachers but I really don't want to cause even more problems.

 

Okay, so I'm the "one in particular" cacher who stated his opinions about some caches in the Springfield MO area. I will second PandyBat's previous comments about the tiny micros - I agree with her 100%.

 

Here is my log for NetDrummer's cache (SSSeminole Hatchling) . I would like everyone to tell me what is wrong with it, and what is wrong with the cache:

 

Find #502. It took me a minute to locate the cache but I eventually found it. Signed logbook. I had actually scoped out this park last year looking for a place to hide a cache but never did see one I liked, mainly because of the close proximity to the houses. I'm not so sure about the location of this cache, since when you're finding it you are basically peering into someone's back yard. (However, not a problem if the property owner knows what you are doing). As I was walking back to my car, an elderly gentleman strolled across from the other side of the park and stopped me and asked if I found what I was looking for. I told him yes, and then he told me that this park is notorious at night for kids partying and doing drugs late at night. When I thought he suspected that I was hiding something I shouldn't be, I told him what I was doing and he said he didn't have a problem with that. In fact, he thinks another cache was hidden here a few years ago. He told me to watch where I step back there because there might be needles hidden in the brush and that he definitely wouldn't want little kids to be back there. I thanked him and told him I would pass this info along. Thanks for the cache. ~ozarksjim - Nixa MO

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I agree with PandyBat and OzarksJim. I like Phenixcachers and no one had any intention of "running him off". I even personally emailed him, and never got a reply back. I know of another cacher that has bashed other caches in the area in years before and it never led to this, but I think the people that got bashed took it in stride and took as constructive instead of cruel and mean.

 

 

I'm seeing a discouraging trend around Springfield, Missouri. There are a couple of cachers - one in particular - that have taken it upon themselves to evaluate and judge new geocaches in the area. Their unwarranted and unsolicited criticism is in my opinion detrimental to the atmosphere around here. They have sucessfully run one guy off. Recently a fairly new geocacher placed several challenging caches. He clearly stated the caches were challenging and tiny. Within a few weeks the criticism on the cache logs became so negative that he's archived several and is planning on archiving the remainder of his new caches soon. He won't even respond to directed emails. I recently experienced the same situation to a much lower degree. The one cacher in particular apparently isn't pleased with the location of my latest placement.

 

My question: is this a common occurance in other areas - for a few experienced cachers to try & dictate how caching is done in a particular area ? Is this likely to blow over in time ? Of course I'm tempted to contact these guys & ask them where they got their authority to bash other cachers but I really don't want to cause even more problems.

 

Okay, so I'm the "one in particular" cacher who stated his opinions about some caches in the Springfield MO area. I will second PandyBat's previous comments about the tiny micros - I agree with her 100%.

 

Here is my log for NetDrummer's cache (SSSeminole Hatchling) . I would like everyone to tell me what is wrong with it, and what is wrong with the cache:

 

Find #502. It took me a minute to locate the cache but I eventually found it. Signed logbook. I had actually scoped out this park last year looking for a place to hide a cache but never did see one I liked, mainly because of the close proximity to the houses. I'm not so sure about the location of this cache, since when you're finding it you are basically peering into someone's back yard. (However, not a problem if the property owner knows what you are doing). As I was walking back to my car, an elderly gentleman strolled across from the other side of the park and stopped me and asked if I found what I was looking for. I told him yes, and then he told me that this park is notorious at night for kids partying and doing drugs late at night. When I thought he suspected that I was hiding something I shouldn't be, I told him what I was doing and he said he didn't have a problem with that. In fact, he thinks another cache was hidden here a few years ago. He told me to watch where I step back there because there might be needles hidden in the brush and that he definitely wouldn't want little kids to be back there. I thanked him and told him I would pass this info along. Thanks for the cache. ~ozarksjim - Nixa MO

Edited by Attacacher
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I'm seeing a discouraging trend around Springfield, Missouri. There are a couple of cachers - one in particular - that have taken it upon themselves to evaluate and judge new geocaches in the area. Their unwarranted and unsolicited criticism is in my opinion detrimental to the atmosphere around here. They have sucessfully run one guy off. Recently a fairly new geocacher placed several challenging caches. He clearly stated the caches were challenging and tiny. Within a few weeks the criticism on the cache logs became so negative that he's archived several and is planning on archiving the remainder of his new caches soon. He won't even respond to directed emails. I recently experienced the same situation to a much lower degree. The one cacher in particular apparently isn't pleased with the location of my latest placement.

 

My question: is this a common occurance in other areas - for a few experienced cachers to try & dictate how caching is done in a particular area ? Is this likely to blow over in time ? Of course I'm tempted to contact these guys & ask them where they got their authority to bash other cachers but I really don't want to cause even more problems.

 

Okay, so I'm the "one in particular" cacher who stated his opinions about some caches in the Springfield MO area. I will second PandyBat's previous comments about the tiny micros - I agree with her 100%.

 

Here is my log for NetDrummer's cache (SSSeminole Hatchling) . I would like everyone to tell me what is wrong with it, and what is wrong with the cache:

 

Find #502. It took me a minute to locate the cache but I eventually found it. Signed logbook. I had actually scoped out this park last year looking for a place to hide a cache but never did see one I liked, mainly because of the close proximity to the houses. I'm not so sure about the location of this cache, since when you're finding it you are basically peering into someone's back yard. (However, not a problem if the property owner knows what you are doing). As I was walking back to my car, an elderly gentleman strolled across from the other side of the park and stopped me and asked if I found what I was looking for. I told him yes, and then he told me that this park is notorious at night for kids partying and doing drugs late at night. When I thought he suspected that I was hiding something I shouldn't be, I told him what I was doing and he said he didn't have a problem with that. In fact, he thinks another cache was hidden here a few years ago. He told me to watch where I step back there because there might be needles hidden in the brush and that he definitely wouldn't want little kids to be back there. I thanked him and told him I would pass this info along. Thanks for the cache. ~ozarksjim - Nixa MO

 

Basically, this log is telling me that I probably shouldn't take my kids with me when I go, I should probably take another person with me and to be prepared to be confronted when I do go. I appreciate this type of log. That's not to say that this was a bad hide but it does show that maybe the cache hider wasn't aware of what could happen or what the hiding place was really like when they hid the cache. Sometimes you find a good spot and sometimes you don't. There's nothing wrong with that. And to get a log like this on your cache, doesn't mean you should grab your ball and go home and never hide another geocache again. It just means this didn't turn out to be the best place to hide one afterall.

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Here is my log for NetDrummer's cache (SSSeminole Hatchling) . I would like everyone to tell me what is wrong with it, and what is wrong with the cache:

 

Find #502. It took me a minute to locate the cache but I eventually found it. Signed logbook. I had actually scoped out this park last year looking for a place to hide a cache but never did see one I liked, mainly because of the close proximity to the houses. I'm not so sure about the location of this cache, since when you're finding it you are basically peering into someone's back yard. (However, not a problem if the property owner knows what you are doing). As I was walking back to my car, an elderly gentleman strolled across from the other side of the park and stopped me and asked if I found what I was looking for. I told him yes, and then he told me that this park is notorious at night for kids partying and doing drugs late at night. When I thought he suspected that I was hiding something I shouldn't be, I told him what I was doing and he said he didn't have a problem with that. In fact, he thinks another cache was hidden here a few years ago. He told me to watch where I step back there because there might be needles hidden in the brush and that he definitely wouldn't want little kids to be back there. I thanked him and told him I would pass this info along. Thanks for the cache. ~ozarksjim - Nixa MO

 

I see nothing wrong with this log. It seems like you did the responsible thing. But never mind me, I've been accused of being a "cache cop" myself.

 

If filing detailed and truthful logs which give people a little "heads up" about situations they might encounter makes you a "cache cop" (and that somehow makes you somewhat less than an ideal person), then so be it.

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WOAH !

Here's the deal - All I'm getting at is - if you don't like 'em don't do 'em, but don't discourage the other guy.

It's a big town...lots of good places to hide traditional caches.

If you don't like it, email the owner. Case in point: "SSSeminole Hatchling" was a poor cache. I hurried and I didn't do it right. And there was information from a neighbor I was definitely not aware of when I placed it. But because of a public comment in the log, it's becoming an "us & them" situation. I've gotten several emails since I archived "SSSeminole Hatchling" saying " don't let those guys with a lot of finds stop you".

I archived it because I did take some advice from above and objectively saw it as a bad hide after reading comments. I don't want it to appear as anything else. I will edit the entry to reflect that as soon as I'm done here.

 

Please, Jim, PandyBat, any other Springfield area cacher looking on, this is a great pastime - we don't need a fight. I sincerely apologize for adding to the fire today. I'm simply really bummed about Scott & what happened to him. In the past we've e-conversed and I've never seen anyone as fired up about Geocaching as him. He latched onto this and was having a blast and he's out now.

One of the great things about Geocaching is the creativity of the hides. I don't like them all either. Honestly, I'd rather look for a bigger cache, and there are a couple out there right now I won't do, or I won't go back to, but I don't want to discourage the owner in public, and I'm not going to try & persuade anyone to do any certain type of cache. I don't think we should. Really, simply, if we don't like 'em, there are plenty of others to find.

And if we REALLY don't like 'em we have every right to let them know but not in front of everybody.

That's my deal - I am truly sorry about any hurt feelings.

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WOAH !

Here's the deal - All I'm getting at is - if you don't like 'em don't do 'em, but don't discourage the other guy.

It's a big town...lots of good places to hide traditional caches.

If you don't like it, email the owner. Case in point: "SSSeminole Hatchling" was a poor cache. I hurried and I didn't do it right. And there was information from a neighbor I was definitely not aware of when I placed it. But because of a public comment in the log, it's becoming an "us & them" situation. I've gotten several emails since I archived "SSSeminole Hatchling" saying " don't let those guys with a lot of finds stop you".

I archived it because I did take some advice from above and objectively saw it as a bad hide after reading comments. I don't want it to appear as anything else. I will edit the entry to reflect that as soon as I'm done here.

 

Please, Jim, PandyBat, any other Springfield area cacher looking on, this is a great pastime - we don't need a fight. I sincerely apologize for adding to the fire today. I'm simply really bummed about Scott & what happened to him. In the past we've e-conversed and I've never seen anyone as fired up about Geocaching as him. He latched onto this and was having a blast and he's out now.

One of the great things about Geocaching is the creativity of the hides. I don't like them all either. Honestly, I'd rather look for a bigger cache, and there are a couple out there right now I won't do, or I won't go back to, but I don't want to discourage the owner in public, and I'm not going to try & persuade anyone to do any certain type of cache. I don't think we should. Really, simply, if we don't like 'em, there are plenty of others to find.

And if we REALLY don't like 'em we have every right to let them know but not in front of everybody.

That's my deal - I am truly sorry about any hurt feelings.

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WOAH !

Here's the deal - All I'm getting at is - if you don't like 'em don't do 'em, but don't discourage the other guy.

It's a big town...lots of good places to hide traditional caches.

If you don't like it, email the owner. Case in point: "SSSeminole Hatchling" was a poor cache. I hurried and I didn't do it right. And there was information from a neighbor I was definitely not aware of when I placed it. But because of a public comment in the log, it's becoming an "us & them" situation. I've gotten several emails since I archived "SSSeminole Hatchling" saying " don't let those guys with a lot of finds stop you".

I archived it because I did take some advice from above and objectively saw it as a bad hide after reading comments. I don't want it to appear as anything else. I will edit the entry to reflect that as soon as I'm done here.

 

Please, Jim, PandyBat, any other Springfield area cacher looking on, this is a great pastime - we don't need a fight. I sincerely apologize for adding to the fire today. I'm simply really bummed about Scott & what happened to him. In the past we've e-conversed and I've never seen anyone as fired up about Geocaching as him. He latched onto this and was having a blast and he's out now.

One of the great things about Geocaching is the creativity of the hides. I don't like them all either. Honestly, I'd rather look for a bigger cache, and there are a couple out there right now I won't do, or I won't go back to, but I don't want to discourage the owner in public, and I'm not going to try & persuade anyone to do any certain type of cache. I don't think we should. Really, simply, if we don't like 'em, there are plenty of others to find.

And if we REALLY don't like 'em we have every right to let them know but not in front of everybody.

That's my deal - I am truly sorry about any hurt feelings.

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WOAH !

Here's the deal - All I'm getting at is - if you don't like 'em don't do 'em, but don't discourage the other guy.

It's a big town...lots of good places to hide traditional caches.

If you don't like it, email the owner. Case in point: "SSSeminole Hatchling" was a poor cache. I hurried and I didn't do it right. And there was information from a neighbor I was definitely not aware of when I placed it. But because of a public comment in the log, it's becoming an "us & them" situation. I've gotten several emails since I archived "SSSeminole Hatchling" saying " don't let those guys with a lot of finds stop you".

I archived it because I did take some advice from above and objectively saw it as a bad hide after reading comments. I don't want it to appear as anything else. I will edit the entry to reflect that as soon as I'm done here.

 

Please, Jim, PandyBat, any other Springfield area cacher looking on, this is a great pastime - we don't need a fight. I sincerely apologize for adding to the fire today. I'm simply really bummed about Scott & what happened to him. In the past we've e-conversed and I've never seen anyone as fired up about Geocaching as him. He latched onto this and was having a blast and he's out now.

One of the great things about Geocaching is the creativity of the hides. I don't like them all either. Honestly, I'd rather look for a bigger cache, and there are a couple out there right now I won't do, or I won't go back to, but I don't want to discourage the owner in public, and I'm not going to try & persuade anyone to do any certain type of cache. I don't think we should. Really, simply, if we don't like 'em, there are plenty of others to find.

And if we REALLY don't like 'em we have every right to let them know but not in front of everybody.

That's my deal - I am truly sorry about any hurt feelings.

 

I get where you are coming from, NetDrummer, I really do. Maybe the best thing to do would have been to contact the owner of the cache in private but when the cache owner doesn't respond or responds like Scott did, there aren't many other options to take than to openly discuss it. I too felt sorry for him at one point but when he started taking his reaction to all this to an extreme, I questioned whether I should feel sorry for him or for the rest of us....LOL

I'm glad you took Jim's log to heart and are doing the right thing by closing the cache if you see fit for it to be closed. It makes me appreciate you that much more as a responsible geocacher and I can't wait to see your next hide. Like Jim said, your hide wasn't a bad one, just in a bad spot. And had he not posted a log and you two were discussing this bad spot back and forth in emails, you run the risk of several other geocachers going after it without a clue of what could happen while they were there.

Jim finds A LOT of caches and he finds them practically minutes after they are published. Because of that, he runs the risk of being called a cache cop because he "reports" his experiences and sometimes they are not always what people want to hear. I kind of like to hear from an experienced geocacher so soon after a geocache is placed. It helps me decide what geocaches I should try to go after on my next geocaching trip and which ones I should take my kids with me and which ones I should not.

As far as your cache is concerned, I was glad to see Jim's log and glad to see you take the appropriate action. I appreciate the both of you for looking out for the rest of us.

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I'm always hesitant to step into these threads, because sometimes the backstory changes everything. But "hesitant" isn't the same thing as not doing it :rolleyes:

 

If I thought caches in my area were being unfairly criticized, my overwhelming temptation would be to hide a series of themed caches with titles like "You-Know-Who Won't Like This One" and "Guaranteed To Irritate My Betters."

 

On the other hand, I don't like micros in the woods. So perhaps I wouldn't.

 

Hahahaha awesome!

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WOAH !

Here's the deal - All I'm getting at is - if you don't like 'em don't do 'em, but don't discourage the other guy.

 

A. If I don't do the cache, how do I know I won't like it? Sure, I may know it's a "tiny, evil" cache, but it may turn out that I like it. As long as there is a cache nearby, I will do it because I love geocaching and I know other geocachers like people going after their caches.

B. We don't always know what will or will not discourage the other guy. Everybody takes things differently. All we can do is post honest (but friendly) comments in our cache logs.

 

If you don't like it, email the owner. Case in point: "SSSeminole Hatchling" was a poor cache. I hurried and I didn't do it right. And there was information from a neighbor I was definitely not aware of when I placed it. But because of a public comment in the log, it's becoming an "us & them" situation. I've gotten several emails since I archived "SSSeminole Hatchling" saying " don't let those guys with a lot of finds stop you".

I archived it because I did take some advice from above and objectively saw it as a bad hide after reading comments. I don't want it to appear as anything else. I will edit the entry to reflect that as soon as I'm done here.

 

I only posted the comments I did so other cachers (especially those with kids) would be aware of the situation. Surely you don't think looking after the welfare other my fellow cachers is a bad thing, do you?

 

Please, Jim, PandyBat, any other Springfield area cacher looking on, this is a great pastime - we don't need a fight. I sincerely apologize for adding to the fire today.

 

Apology accepted :rolleyes:

 

And if we REALLY don't like 'em we have every right to let them know but not in front of everybody.

 

Unless it's to give a good heads up to other cachers, or to keep the quality of the local caches high.

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The log (both the physical log and the online log) are records of my expierence of finding your cache.

If I log that the cache is lame (for any reason), that is MY expierence of finding that cache that day.

If you do not like constructive feedback, then hide better caches or get a thicker skin.

I will not be "run off" (nor should anyone else) because you prefer to be the cheerleader for lame caches.

Who is the cache cop; the one writing their thoughts on their find, or the one complaining about what was written by someone else??

Edited by The Badge & the Butterfly
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Yeah, I see both points. It just irks me when I see a guy that was fired up about geocaching get run off because some people don't like micros. They're not my favorite either but this guy was very clear about his hides. Now he's making comments like "my heart is broken over this" and he's archiving 10 or so hides.

Oh well, I think I'm better off just doing the ones I want to do, & keep to myself.

It's just a hobby - sheesh ! some people try to control everything. What's new, right ?

 

Thanks !

 

My wife and I very nearly DID quit because of more experienced geocachers in our area coming down on us with both feet. One of the very first geocaches we did was placed along a creek in a very rural area near the town in which we live. My wife, and my daughter who at the time was only a year and a half old, our two dogs and myself parked at the side of a highway that was not too busy, navigated our way over a small barbed wire fence that was meant to keepcattle off the highway, and had a very pleasant stroll along the creek. Saw some great wildlife, took some great photos, and otherwise, had a blast.

 

The very first goy to log the cache was a COMPLETE jerk, took photos of everything negative he could find, complained about the life threatning barbed wire fences, how his kids "could have fallen in the creek and drowned", and basically ripped apart the cache, it's contents, (He removed many items that HE had decided were innapropriate - photographed them for the logs - and kept them for himself) and everything in between, right nown to the fact that there wasn't a paved parking lot available for him and his brood to get out and on their way without being mowed down mercilessly by heavy traffic.

 

We can accept critisizm from people who are more experienced in the sport, no problem. But, when someone is malicious, mean, and act like a couple of trigger happy, over enthusiastic newbies treading on what is exclusively THEIR sport on THEIR turf... It gets my hackles up. To this day, I despise him and his little pack of clones.

 

Luckily, the love of the game keeps us going, and we enjoy the hunt. Unfortunately, because this particular guy was friends with everyone else in the clique, we were pretty much ostrasized and made to feel VERY uncomfortable at meets and other functions. So, we just keep to ourselves, and do our own thing.

 

Bottom line - there's always going to be people who get off on exerting their will on others, and being self appointed cops of whatever the common interests may be. I say, let 'em. If the only place people like that have any power in the universe is online and in some completely unimportant medium such as geocaching... I feel sorry for them.

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Dang - I just can't quit. One more & I'm done.

Here's the truth - I've had an abscessed tooth for six days and won't be able to get in till monday. I can't take the pain medication 'cause it wipes me out. The antibiotic makes me mean. My mouth hurts and it was bad timing. Honestly, at first I was ticked at some responses of my new cache. "We don't think.....etc" I thought "ok, here we go again - another cache doesn't live up to the expert's standards". I started this post for opinions and buddy I got 'em. Really, thanks for every one.

I gleaned some wisdom from one or two, stepped back, re-read the logs and archived a bad hide.

Thanks, The Badge & the Butterfly. I had the same thought a while ago. I'm doing the same thing aren't I ?

Thanks especially to Team GeoMacs for your comment. I don't equate the people involved in this situation to your encounter by any means. I see their intentions are good. I should have known better than to bring up the subject in a forum. I felt strongly about what happened to a fellow geocacher & still do. I'm happy that some folks enjoy this activity enough to look out for the rest of us. I hate it that feathers got ruffled so that I'd learn a lesson but I'm with you, Team GeoMacs, I love geocaching & I'll keep doing this "unimportant medium such as geocaching" but I'm not interested in living & breathing it - there are many other things that deserve my attention & energy. I forgot one of my rules to live by. As Albert Einstein sez "If A is success in life, then A equals x plus y plus z. Work is x; y is play; and z is keeping your mouth shut." I'll be Z'ing now.

Thanks again and apologies again. I'm out.

Edited by NetDrummer
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Logging your comments about a cache found IS great info for other cachers who plan on hunting that particular cache.

Example: remarking that the cache is in the middle of a PI patch, do not take the kiddos on this one OR this was a great hunt, I had a fun time.

 

There are alot of great micros out there but I wouldn't call a micro at the end of a dead end road, in or near a trash site, in or near PI & that takes 4-5 times there, searching 30+ minutes each time without the find, a fun time.

 

Granted new cachers are excited and want to get into the hiding phase of the game but they also need some education on what & how to make their cache hide something fun for other cachers. What fun are they having when 10 cachers have gone out to hunt their hide and can't find it. What fun is the cache hunter having when they develop a bad case of PI.

 

I am very involved with trying to keep the integrity of caches high in Springfield, MO. I do this by educating the Newby with discussions at events & Geocaching 101 events.

 

I am not the one that this guy is upset with but I have done his caches & have wondered what the hell am I doing here searching a smelly area next to a huge dumpster. No one had found this cache since it was up so I had no finders remarks to go by & the dumpster was NOT mentioned in the cache description.

 

This guy could do our community of cachers a great deal by putting is efforts & enthusiasm

into something more solid like a traditional size or a more creative micro other than a 1" bison tube hidden at the end of a dead end road with nothing to see but a bushy PI area.

 

Take me somewhere special to you, show me something special like a panoramic view, educate me with the history of the area, make the cache container new & different & hidden with thought. Do that & the cache finder will tell others.

 

There are cachers out there that I can't wait for them to put up another cache for me to hunt but than there are those that I remove from my list.

 

All it takes is a little thought to make a cache fun...think about it first!

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Send the guy (the one who's archiving his caches) a private e-mail. Give him some positive feedback, and coach him a little on how to glean the constructive parts out of the critical logs without taking it personally.

 

I have but he is not responding. His posts read "my heart is broken". I feel bad that he is taking this so hard. Cachers remarks about his hides have not been that bad that he needs to be crying over it. I have read the posts and they are just their remarks about his hides and not meant to be taken personally but as a matter of 'same ole same ole'.

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Log Date: 4/28/2005

I had trouble finding this one like the others listed I will not deface or damage this public land to log it.I think once all the flowers and garden are in people will deface.

 

Note: How do I place a cache?

http://www.geocaching.com/about/guidelines.aspx#traditional

 

Off-limit (Physical) Caches

Caches that deface public or private property, whether a natural or man-made object, in order to provide a clue or a logging method.

 

I've had other exchanges with this guy of a similar nature.

BTW the cache in question is a matchstick container hanging in a tree in a public park.

 

Wulf

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WOAH !

Here's the deal - All I'm getting at is - if you don't like 'em don't do 'em, but don't discourage the other guy.

It's a big town...lots of good places to hide traditional caches.

If you don't like it, email the owner. Case in point: "SSSeminole Hatchling" was a poor cache. I hurried and I didn't do it right. And there was information from a neighbor I was definitely not aware of when I placed it. But because of a public comment in the log, it's becoming an "us & them" situation. I've gotten several emails since I archived "SSSeminole Hatchling" saying " don't let those guys with a lot of finds stop you".

I archived it because I did take some advice from above and objectively saw it as a bad hide after reading comments. I don't want it to appear as anything else. I will edit the entry to reflect that as soon as I'm done here.

 

Please, Jim, PandyBat, any other Springfield area cacher looking on, this is a great pastime - we don't need a fight. I sincerely apologize for adding to the fire today. I'm simply really bummed about Scott & what happened to him. In the past we've e-conversed and I've never seen anyone as fired up about Geocaching as him. He latched onto this and was having a blast and he's out now.

One of the great things about Geocaching is the creativity of the hides. I don't like them all either. Honestly, I'd rather look for a bigger cache, and there are a couple out there right now I won't do, or I won't go back to, but I don't want to discourage the owner in public, and I'm not going to try & persuade anyone to do any certain type of cache. I don't think we should. Really, simply, if we don't like 'em, there are plenty of others to find.

And if we REALLY don't like 'em we have every right to let them know but not in front of everybody.

That's my deal - I am truly sorry about any hurt feelings.

 

I'm sorry, but there is one person responsible for Scott quitting, and that's Scott himself. The quality of one's character is not determined by what happens to them, but by their response to it.

 

If you're going to admittedly post caches that you know are difficult and frustrating--so much so that you routinely name them "evil"--then you must expect the users to respond accordingly and you must be ready take it in stride. That's a mature response, rather than "Fine! I'm just going to take my caches and go home."

 

Frankly, judging by Scott's the wording in cache descriptions and the obvious pride he took in creating such difficult caches, I'm surprised that he didn't consider each post to be a badge of honor proving that his efforts were paying off.

 

As has been stated earlier in this thread, I appreciate others' warnings and notices in the logs that help to prepare me for what I should expect when looking for a cache. One must be able to distinguish between a warning to others and an "attack" on or "bashing" of the one who hid the cache.

 

I am extremely grateful for geocaching because it gives me a chance to get out from behind my computer, get exercise and spend fun time with my sons. I took my boys and looked for two of Scott's micro caches and one of his traditional caches a couple of weeks ago. We found the traditional but weren't in the right frame of mind to find the micros. I must admit that at that time, I finally started to understand the love/hate relationship that golfers have with their sport. The frustration that I was experiencing had me repeating to myself, "This is what I do to relax and for fun?"

 

It forced me to step back a bit and put things into perspective--but not to quit.

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I was wondering when the Springfield situation would show up on the forums. Here is my take. I have no comment on NetDrummers newest cache, but his Duck,Duck, Goose is one of my Springfield Favorites. My comment will be about the cacher with thin skin that is getting "run off". I posted a couple of DNF's along with minor complaint log about micros in the woods. I don't think I am the main cause of running him off but I guess I am part of it. Here are my main reasons for complaining.

 

1. He was putting out caches almost every other day, they were neat at first. But at that rate he was taking up all the hiding spots in town. I think he gave up on getting permission from the park board, he took a micro from a breeder cache and had it placed a few days later. I know from experience that the approvall process takes at least 10 days.

 

2. Some of the caches were in locations where you were practically on display while searching for them. I hate trying to explain caching to onlookers. He also got a bad rap for poison ivy caches and caches where the police hasseled you.

 

3. Some of his caches would be out for a couple days, then he would change containers or something else and create a whole new cache page instead of just editing it. This made getting a FTF in town a lot less of a challenge.

 

4. He seemed to be disappointed if his caches didn't get dnf's. He was making caches and not wanting them to be found, I wish I could come up with some more difficult hides for my own caches, but I don't want to torture people just so I can get some dnf logs. I think a well hid regular cache is a true challenge for both the placer and seeker.

 

No one makes you go after caches you don't want, I went after a some micros in the woods knowing I might not like them. People say you should just ingore the caches you don't like, well a lot of us are addictted to this sport and ignoring one is just not posible. <_<

 

If I had it to do over again I would have emailed him instead of posting a complaint log. I had a lot of email contact with him when he started out, he is a real nice guy and I really love his enthusiasm, I hate to see anyone get "run off", but I also think we need to save some caching room for others.

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I'm sorry, but there is one person responsible for Scott quitting, and that's Scott himself. The quality of one's character is not determined by what happens to them, but by their response to it.

 

If you're going to admittedly post caches that you know are difficult and frustrating--so much so that you routinely name them "evil"--then you must expect the users to respond accordingly and you must be ready take it in stride. That's a mature response, rather than "Fine! I'm just going to take my caches and go home."

 

 

Exactly. No one was exerting anything towards phenixcachers (Scott) and his caches except a little constructive criticism that he took way too personally. At this point, he is even taking it to the extreme. I'm not sure if he is really as hurt and crushed over all this as he says in his logs or if he is liking all the attention. He has even gone so far as to say in one of his logs on the Ophiophobia Hatchling that he would be archiving the cache and that he would go out and get the logbook and leave the container for OzarksJim to go pick up. Now to me, that shows signs of irresponsibility, immaturity and he needs to step back, re-evaluate and get a grip on himself and this situation. No one wants him to quit, just gear his enthusiasm towards putting out better caches. I have to admit, when he first started geocaching, the guy got me all fired up again with his posts about how great this sport really is. I haven't seen that kind of excitement in a long time.

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<_< I realize this horse is on its last breath, but I would like to throw my two cents in from the newbie perspective. My son and I have been doing this about 6 weeks now and average about 10 finds per week. Scott was one of the first cachers we met and echo the admiration for his enthusiam and friendship. The "Nightmare on Erie Street" was our first FTF (and we did NOT find the "easy" version on Fools Errand weekend). We are just gaining experience and trying all types...learning as we go for the day when we try our first hide. Even after 60-something finds, I don't feel qualified to do a great job hiding yet.

 

I say all that to say, I also hate to see these "new hiders" get so upset over criticism, but as a new seeker and future hider, I appreciate very much reading the critiques and learning from the comments of experienced cachers like OzarksJim. If he and others gives advice to these hiders only via email, how will the rest of us newbies ever learn? I must admit that I am apprehensive about placing my first cache for fear of hearing from others, but when that day comes, please don't hold back. Correcting me will be the only way I and other newbies can learn. Thanks to the old Springfield cachers for helping us newbies in all kinds of ways! :huh:

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It is possible to make a clever and interesting hide using a micro-cache. Unfortunately many people just run out and plop one down without much thought. That may be why new cachers are advised to get a few finds under their belt before they hide one. I have, a few times, posted what may be considered a ‘negative’ log for a cache. Why am I here? What were you trying to show me? If the cache seems to have no other purpose than to provide a ‘hide’ stat for someone, what’s the point?

 

Example 1. Micro cache in a tiny park. Woop-d-damnn-doo right? The owners of this particular cache took the time so that the journey to the park was fun. You have to stand on a high bridge and, using a compass and provided bearings, pick off the clues from the skyline of the city. Using those clues gets you the final coordinates.

 

Example 2. Micro cache whose coordinates take you to a piece of sculpture art in the city. Not terribly thrilling enough for you? After you’ve puzzled the benches and planters, you turn and see something peculiar on the sculpture itself. The owners painted the container the exact color as the sculpture and the round mint container blends in to the sculpture perfectly. It became part of the piece! Its survival is indicative of how well the cache is hidden in plain sight.

 

A needle-in-the-haystack micro that is just an exercise in futility isn’t much fun.

 

I know both of those caches. Perfect examples of how to turn an otherwise mundane micro into very memerable caches.

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If you dont complain a bit in the log when you do a lame one, others coming behind you will not know that it might be garbage. People will say, if its lame dont hunt for it. You dont know its lame until you find it. I recently did a real lame one, in my opinion. The description stated that it was hidden in a ravine and was a nice place to go when the weather changed. Ok, doesnt sound bad. I find it and it is a large prescription bottle hidden in the rock wash that leads to a flood zone overflow area. The rock wash led up to three drainage pipes that went under the road. This is not a nice place to go when the weather changes and it was not a ravine. There were houses on each side of the overflow area and the hider lived in one. Had someone brought up these issues in earlier posts I probably would not have gone looking for it. Instead people write, tfth, tnlnsl. I now know when a cache has mostly acronyms in the logs, it more than likely stinks. People need to be more honest with their logs. If your feelings get hurt by someone slamming your cache, then dont hide one and really pump it up. Tell it like it is. I also found another one under a drainage cover in the gutter. Again, had someone said it was in the gutter I wouldnt have gone looking for it. So, anyways, I slammed them when I logged them and got beat up in return. I later apologized for what I had done and explained why I did what I did. I dont think any of the explanation sunk in. If the cache stinks, you should be able to say so without being attacked. If we were more honest in the logs, then those who still want to find it will, and they more than likely will log a positive experience. Just my opinion, and it should be yours. :grin:

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Yee - Haa ! I figured I'd get some good feedback. Excellent...and thank you !

It's just me but I agree with CheshireFrog. I think it ought to be between the criticizer and the owner. I wouldn't bash someone's poorly done cache on the log for all to see. Logs should be logs...and we have a forum for discussion and email for personal comments....(ideally)

 

The log, both online and the physical logbook, are places for the finder to write their thoughts about the cache, location, and the hunt.

 

If the finder had a negative expierence, and writes about it...that's their right.

 

Ed

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Sometimes feedback is neccessary but most of the time it isn't.

 

I had a couple of "experienced" cachers comment negatively about one of our hides. That's fine. They are entitled to their opinion. I had others who commented on how much they enjoyed it.

 

I am one of those that commented to the above. I have no problem with difficult caches. The problem with the above cache is that, if the Land Manager were to see me retrieve the cache it would reflect very badly on geocaching. There is no way to get the cache without climbing on a stucture that was not ment to be climbed. My fear is that when someone gets caught this will be the end of caching in this area. Some cachers saying they enjoyed the cache does not make it right.

 

Therefore I wrote the owner and decided that I would just pass on this one. I didn't even post a should be archived note since I expressed my opinion and had made contact with the owner.

 

For those who know me I do not pass on caches unless there is a good reason and this is only the second cache that I have refused to do. The other being in a abandoned wastewater treatment plant with numerous no trespassing signs. This one I did post a should be archived and it was. The posting was after I could not reach the owner.

 

Team Sand Dollar

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I don't have much of a response as to the types of micros that this cacher was putting out, I hear most of them were quite creative, but I do have a problem with the rate at which the caches were being hidden. Every park, every nook and cranny was being taken up with these "tiny, clever, evil" micros about every other day. And most of those places where they were hidden could have supported a bigger cache. Smaller is not always better. It started to seem as if the whole point of the hide was to make so it couldn't be found at all. I personally don't care to spend so much time looking for a micro in a heavily populated place. It makes the chance of being seen and the cache being muggled later all that much greater.

 

That's all I have to say about that.....

We can't do much about other people's strange reactions to our reasonable comments. What we CAN do is keep our comments reasonable.

 

I've heard many others express the same opinion as yourself: "... most of those places where they were hidden could have supported a bigger cache. Smaller is not always better."

 

Here's an opposing viewpoint:

 

While I might agree with your underlying preference, whenever I hear someone openly criticize another person's hide by saying that a larger container should have been used in a particular place simply because it could have, I'm compelled to ask: If you feel so strongly that an ammo can should have been hidden in those woods (or wherever) instead of a micro, then why haven't you already hidden an ammo can there yourself? Sure, maybe you'd have done it differently at that location if it were up to you. Maybe I would have too. The point is that it's no longer up to you. You, I, and the actual hider all had the same opportunity to place a cache at that particular spot, but ... the hider beat us to it! He got there first. As long as his cache meets the guidelines, and the cache reviewer approved it, it's OK. No need to challenge someone on their choice of container size just because they got there before you. He got there first. Accept it. If you want more full-size containers hidden in your area, then find some good spots and go hide them.

 

You also say "Every park, every nook and cranny was being taken up with these "tiny, clever, evil" micros about every other day." In addition to their size, you seem to indicate that the quantity of those micro hides bothers you as well. My response to that is similar: If you didn't want a particular park "taken up" by another person's hide, then why hadn't you already put something there yourself? There is a spot near my house that I had scoped out a few months ago as a great place for a hide. I kept it in the back of my mind until I could get around to doing something about it, but -- someone beat me to it. His hide wasn't nearly as challenging or creative as what I'd had in mind. It never occurred to me, however, to criticize him for not "making the best of the spot" in a way that would have been more pleasing to me. I simply accepted that I'd been caught napping, and made a mental note not to wait too long before carrying out my ideas in the future.

 

And BTW, if you don't like the "'tiny, clever, evil' micro ... in a heavily populated place," then just don't hunt for it. Some of us happen to like exactly that type of hide. I like them a LOT.

 

Now, if a hider turns out to be so thin-skinned that he abandons the game after even the slightest criticism, regardless of whether the criticism is justified, then that's HIS problem. (I once watched a hider archive his cache after I dared to question him for deleting my "Found It" log. He didn't like the tone of my description of the existing, badly deteriorated swag. He even deleted my other attempts to log it after I removed the swag comments. Whaddya gonna do?)

 

To repeat: We can't do much about other people's strange reactions to our reasonable comments. What we CAN do is keep our comments reasonable.

Edited by KBI
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I am not one to read every log on a cache that I am about go out searching for. The owner of the cache should and if there are issues brought up in the postings (illicit activities, safety issues, etc) the cache owner should edit the cache description to include a note about those things so geocachers can make their own decisions on whether they bring their kids along, perhaps the proper attire (boots vs flipflops, etc), exposure to non geocachers, etc. This is can be a big help. Granted it may not help the paperless crowd but it shows you are concerned about your geocaching compatriots whether you ever meet them or not.

 

I am sure there are self appointed cache cops in all areas. They are ones in real time who give unsolicited advice on everything. They no doubt like to hear the sound of their own voice, here they like to see it in print. I have a brother like that, you learn to ignore them over time.

Edited by brodiebunch
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