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Sophisticated Littering ?


vds
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Here here Jeremy. A very ignorant article. I hug trees harder than most but what a silly conclusion the author had as far as geogaching. The amount of trash we pick up is far greater than the amount of concentrated junk we (or some people <_<) leave. Personally I leave rare or no longer minted European coins.

 

For the most part, CITO aside, geocachers, at least the ones I've met, are very earth-friendly responsible people.

 

Funinthealps

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What cachers think:

 

GPS 300.00

Bag of Swag for trades. 25.00

Gas for the day. 40.00

Eating out. 50.00

 

The look in your kids eyes when they find treasure. Priceless.

 

What this lady thinks.

 

GPS: 300.00

4x4 For getting to the right spot. 17,0000

Ammo Can. 10.00

Swag for the cache 25.00

Round Trip Expenses 150.00 for that remote cache.

 

Placing sophisitcated litter that otherws will enjoy. Pricless.

Edited by Renegade Knight
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Ok, now that I've read the letter.

 

Problem number 1.

"What we don’t need to do is to encourage the public to participate in activities that are of no benefit to the earth’s current situation"

 

What does this mean? Does it mean she shouldn't drive a Subaru? It seems so since she's defining something that has people enjoying the world and picking up some of that trash she's talking about on the way back out as "litter" and worthless. Just as driving a Subaru contributes nothing to the world by it's own existance by her standards.

 

Next we have:

"As an amateur herpetologist, I have seen dumped and left-behind objects in the deserts and mountain foothills, including in what was once considered unspoiled habitat. People illegally dump all the time."

Funny, as an Amateur Geocache I see the same thing. If anything I've seen more of it, and done more about it as well. However it's always possible she puts her money were her mouth is.

 

The last point worth mentioning.

 

"What makes geocaching that much different? "

 

To which there is only one answer. The people.

 

The woman is clearly smart and articulate.

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What we don't need is a bunch of amateur herpetologists going out into nature and turning over every rock and looking in every crevice for snakes, frogs and lizards! <_<

 

I'd bet my gps that she has a room full of wild critters she has collected from her special natural places and I think the environment would be in better shape if all those amateur herpetologists looked for their lizards in the cities. :D

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Rattlesnake Subaru driving Amateur Herpatologist Kabobs

 

 

~ 1 rattlesnake Subaru driving Amateur Herpatologist, cut into 5 - 8 sections

~ 1 bell pepper, cut into 5 - 8 sections

~ 1 red onion, cut into 5 - 8 sections

~ 1 bottle of A-1 sauce

 

Place rattlesnake Subaru driving Amateur Herpatologist sections onto a metal skewer with bell pepper and red onion sections between each section of snake.

 

With a brush, generously apply A-1 sauce to snake sections.

 

Place skewers over an open flame, preferably a campfire.

 

Cook for about 15 - 20 minutes rotating halfway every 3 - 5 minutes.

 

Serve and Enjoy!

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Rattlesnake Subaru driving Amateur Herpatologist Kabobs

~ 1 rattlesnake Subaru driving Amateur Herpatologist, cut into 5 - 8 sections

~ 1 bell pepper, cut into 5 - 8 sections

~ 1 red onion, cut into 5 - 8 sections

~ 1 bottle of A-1 sauce

 

Place rattlesnake Subaru driving Amateur Herpatologist sections onto a metal skewer with bell pepper and red onion sections between each section of snake.

 

With a brush, generously apply A-1 sauce to snake sections.

 

Place skewers over an open flame, preferably a campfire.

 

Cook for about 15 - 20 minutes rotating halfway every 3 - 5 minutes.

 

Serve and Enjoy!

 

I prefer smaller pieces - you get better marinade taste and as we all know, these sorts tend to be rather flavorless...

 

rockon.gif

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Rattlesnake Subaru driving Amateur Herpatologist Kabobs

 

 

~ 1 rattlesnake Subaru driving Amateur Herpatologist, cut into 5 - 8 sections

~ 1 bell pepper, cut into 5 - 8 sections

~ 1 red onion, cut into 5 - 8 sections

~ 1 bottle of A-1 sauce

 

Place rattlesnake Subaru driving Amateur Herpatologist sections onto a metal skewer with bell pepper and red onion sections between each section of snake.

 

With a brush, generously apply A-1 sauce to snake sections.

 

Place skewers over an open flame, preferably a campfire.

 

Cook for about 15 - 20 minutes rotating halfway every 3 - 5 minutes.

 

Serve and Enjoy!

 

I find it unconscionable that you would promote the eating of people who are critical of geocaching. Cannibalism will not give outsiders a favorable view of our sport.

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I believe BigWhite Truck nailed it. However, I'm trying to eat less meat so in spite of fiercely held convictions I doubt I do my fair share of the cannabalism. I have cats - they eat meat, but they sure like it cut into itsy bitsy tinsy winsy little pieces. (They're old, losing their teeth)(I'm old, losing my mind)

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Rattlesnake Subaru driving Amateur Herpatologist Kabobs

 

 

~ 1 rattlesnake Subaru driving Amateur Herpatologist, cut into 5 - 8 sections

~ 1 bell pepper, cut into 5 - 8 sections

~ 1 red onion, cut into 5 - 8 sections

~ 1 bottle of A-1 sauce

 

Place rattlesnake Subaru driving Amateur Herpatologist sections onto a metal skewer with bell pepper and red onion sections between each section of snake.

 

With a brush, generously apply A-1 sauce to snake sections.

 

Place skewers over an open flame, preferably a campfire.

 

Cook for about 15 - 20 minutes rotating halfway every 3 - 5 minutes.

 

Serve and Enjoy!

 

I find it unconscionable that you would promote the eating of people who are critical of geocaching. Cannibalism will not give outsiders a favorable view of our sport.

 

Dang...and I was getting hungry. What we do to give folks a good impression of us...!

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Rattlesnake Subaru driving Amateur Herpatologist Kabobs

 

 

~ 1 rattlesnake Subaru driving Amateur Herpatologist, cut into 5 - 8 sections

~ 1 bell pepper, cut into 5 - 8 sections

~ 1 red onion, cut into 5 - 8 sections

~ 1 bottle of A-1 sauce

 

Place rattlesnake Subaru driving Amateur Herpatologist sections onto a metal skewer with bell pepper and red onion sections between each section of snake.

 

With a brush, generously apply A-1 sauce to snake sections.

 

Place skewers over an open flame, preferably a campfire.

 

Cook for about 15 - 20 minutes rotating halfway every 3 - 5 minutes.

 

Serve and Enjoy!

 

I find it unconscionable that you would promote the eating of people who are critical of geocaching. Cannibalism will not give outsiders a favorable view of our sport.

 

Dang...and I was getting hungry. What we do to give folks a good impression of us...!

 

Well it certainly isn't eating them. Besides, have you ever tasted human? Yuk!!

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Did anyone notice reading it that right after that letter was a positive letter from a teacher in Wisconsin noting how educators are integrating geocaching more and more into geography and environmental curriculums and how much she loved the article?

 

Nice to see that Suburu is being balanced with letters on the issue (though would've been better if the positive letter was listed first).

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In the letter she said she was an amateur herpetologist, being an amateur means she thinks she knows more than she does and that she is not very good at it. Otherwise she would be a professional herpetologist.

 

Now I have to go get some eye of newt, lizards feet and a toad skin for a potion that may make it easy for be to spot geocaches <_<

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I find it unconscionable that you would promote the eating of people who are critical of geocaching. Cannibalism will not give outsiders a favorable view of our sport.

 

I agree. We have already earned for ourselves a bit of a bad name because a number of us in certain unnamed states regularly kill muggles who might interfere with the cache hunt, and because a large number of us regularly kill other geocachers just to make sure that we get the FTF on a new cache. Please do not think that this practice goes unnoticed by the authoritites, and escalating to cannbalism of muggles can only make it worse. At some point, the authorities are gonna start making it a crime to engage in one or more of the three above-cited activities, and ideally, we should start to police ourselves before this should come to pass.

Edited by Vinny & Sue Team
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Quote: "What we don’t need to do is to encourage the public to participate in activities that are of no benefit to the earth’s current situation."

 

Wow, that is a really deep statement. There goes my weekend. Let me see if I can list some activities I have done this week that " are of no benefit to the earth’s current situation."

 

1. Watched 24 last night.

2. Used bathroom facilites this morning and added to the world's water pollution.

3. Used bathroom facilites this morning and used a scarce resource ... water.

4. Drove my car to the store to buy a part for my boat ... more air pollution ... contributed to oil drilling.

5. Installed part on boat so I can go out and pollute the air some more and cause more drilling.

6. Cooked some fish on the grill, more air pollution.

7. Washed the car ... soap down the storm drain ... more water pollution.

8. Used computer to make this post ... used electricity generated from coal ... more pollution.

 

For those of you who are still in your "child bearing years", please refrain from any activities which may increase the world's population, since that is clearly "of no benefit to the earth’s current situation." But don't take a cold shower ... that uses precious resources and pollutes the water.

 

To call this woman a left-wing wacko would be too kind.

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Besides, have you ever tasted human? Yuk!!

 

I hear it's greasy...ugh.

Actually it tastes like chicken.

I always heard that it tastes like pork, in fact cannibals called it, Long pork. I bet like real pork it is bad for heart.

As a lover of the other white meat, smoking the meat for 12 or so hours renders out all the greasyness. Wait a tick, am I discussing how to cook...OK, geocaching makes you nuts.

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I am reminded of somehting that happened last week on a semi-related forum. It is comprised of people who love to explore the NJ Pine Barrens. They are very knowledgeable of the area and have a great forum, so I posed a question to them about some ruins that we happened upon. We placed a cache near the ruins and wanted information to post on the cache page.

This started a nasty flurry in which I was called a thoughtless idiot among other things. I was asked to remove the cache for fear of cacher traffic causing the demise of the ruins. It's apparently okay for them to explore, but cachers are irresponsible, and it's sickening that people place "freaking tupperware" in places like this.

The admin later apologized for calling me an idiot, but the sentiment remains. I think that was the first time I had ever noticed that there is a real live anti-caching faction. Everyone has to have a cause, I guess. If everone had a cause that was worth worrying about, perhaps the world would be a better place. But that's just one eenie weenie little cacher's opinion. :blink:

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Today for lunch I spent an hour and a half cleaning up the area around one of my caches, in addition to doing some cache maintenance. Additionally, later this year I will be doing some environmental maintenance by clearing out some very non-beneficial invasive plants. Also, I will be moving a park bench there to a safer location.

 

I placed a cache there (with permission, to boot) for the main purpose of encouraging people to remove water-borne trash. Some of the logs mention that finders have removed trash as a result. So... yeah no benefit to caching whatsoever.try2.gif

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This started a nasty flurry in which I was called a thoughtless idiot among other things. I was asked to remove the cache for fear of cacher traffic causing the demise of the ruins. It's apparently okay for them to explore, but cachers are irresponsible, and it's sickening that people place "freaking tupperware" in places like this.

The admin later apologized for calling me an idiot, but the sentiment remains. I think that was the first time I had ever noticed that there is a real live anti-caching faction. Everyone has to have a cause, I guess. If everone had a cause that was worth worrying about, perhaps the world would be a better place. But that's just one eenie weenie little cacher's opinion.

I wonder if your cache was hidden near a cave. :P I also wonder how many cavers drive Suburus? :P Cavers don't like cachers, and want to keep their special places all to themselves. :o

Of course since many reports indicate that Suburu Drivers are less likely to procreate; they aren't adding to the growing burden that the human population is placing on the planet. :blink: (not that there's anything wrong with that. :o )

I guess that's a good thing? :)

 

 

BSF-it's just the lonely opinion of one extremsit who feels they knows what is best for all. Suburu's editors did a nice job of balancing her view with the pro-caching letter following it.

I also wonder if as an amateur scientist she has ever left any research or measurement equipment out in the field? But that would be different right? :P

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I wonder if your cache was hidden near a cave. :P I also wonder how many cavers drive Suburus? :P Cavers don't like cachers, and want to keep their special places all to themselves. :o

 

 

Maybe I started that. I like to watch them go into their precious caves :blink: then throw in a smoke grenade. :o

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I have to agree that she sounded foolish, driving a Subaru Outback is certainly not contributing to the environment... however she should be entitled to her opinion. Many of you are just as if not MORE so ignorant than she was in her little letter.

 

In the letter she said she was an amateur herpetologist, being an amateur means she thinks she knows more than she does and that she is not very good at it. Otherwise she would be a professional herpetologist.

 

Amateur can mean something as simple as saying that the activity is a hobby, that you don't get paid for it, it doesn't necessarily mean that you are bad at it or don't know what you are talking about... If you want her to change her outlook on GeoCaching, then do something to prove that we aren't just leaving junk lying around.

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I have to agree that she sounded foolish, driving a Subaru Outback is certainly not contributing to the environment... however she should be entitled to her opinion. Many of you are just as if not MORE so ignorant than she was in her little letter.

 

In the letter she said she was an amateur herpetologist, being an amateur means she thinks she knows more than she does and that she is not very good at it. Otherwise she would be a professional herpetologist.

 

If you want her to change her outlook on GeoCaching, then do something to prove that we aren't just leaving junk lying around.

 

The reality is she won't change her outlook on geocaching, so it is more fun to marginalize her statements.

 

This opinion was brought to you by an amateur psychologist and sociologist.

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I am reminded of somehting that happened last week on a semi-related forum. It is comprised of people who love to explore the NJ Pine Barrens. They are very knowledgeable of the area and have a great forum, so I posed a question to them about some ruins that we happened upon. We placed a cache near the ruins and wanted information to post on the cache page.

This started a nasty flurry in which I was called a thoughtless idiot among other things. I was asked to remove the cache for fear of cacher traffic causing the demise of the ruins. It's apparently okay for them to explore, but cachers are irresponsible, and it's sickening that people place "freaking tupperware" in places like this.

The admin later apologized for calling me an idiot, but the sentiment remains. I think that was the first time I had ever noticed that there is a real live anti-caching faction. Everyone has to have a cause, I guess. If everone had a cause that was worth worrying about, perhaps the world would be a better place. But that's just one eenie weenie little cacher's opinion. :blink:

 

The real issue (though it's hard to find in the rheteric you encountered) is that there are morons in the world who walk among us. They live to destroy and to destroy is how they take their enjoyment of the world. They shoot no trespassing signs, they vandalize caves, they use home made torches on bats, and toss keystone cans alongside the road.

 

The vast majority of us are fine. We like seeing ruins, and caves, and don't vandalize. But because of the morons trust can't be automaticly extended.

 

Trust though is not hard to earn. I'll email you an example.

Edited by Renegade Knight
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I find it unconscionable that you would promote the eating of people who are critical of geocaching. Cannibalism will not give outsiders a favorable view of our sport.

 

Her thinking is rather comedic . . . do you suppose she'd taste funny??? :blink:

 

JohnTee

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My mother showed me that and I knew I would be a little angry at it by the end...the last few sentences, full of "quotations" made me stop reading.

 

We have 2 Subarus, and they have never "left a satisfied feeling inside of me" because their magazine likes the environment. :blink:

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We have 2 Subarus, and they have never "left a satisfied feeling inside of me" because their magazine likes the environment. :blink:

 

That's true. I'd be much more 'satisfied' if my Outback got more than 21 MPG in mixed highway driving. My Honda Civic gets 32 in the same driving.

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I have to agree that she sounded foolish, driving a Subaru Outback is certainly not contributing to the environment... however she should be entitled to her opinion. Many of you are just as if not MORE so ignorant than she was in her little letter.

 

So what you're saying is we're not entitled to our opinion. Rubbish.

 

The fact is she spoke her opinion in ignorance of the hobby based on her narrow minded views without establishing a proper modicum of research before putting it down in writing. She made assumptions about a a game that "anything left out" is litter.

 

I wonder if she has the same opinion of letterboxing... you know... that older version of our sport that's been around for 150+ years?

 

How about those mountain climbers leaving their mark at the top of that exceptional mountain by leaving behind a logbook?

 

How about those folks leaving behind some stash of trinkets to act as a time capsule for some later historian?

 

With the exception of letterboxing, these other items are left behind with no intention to be retrieved by the owner, and barely maintenanced with visitor followups. Further, they are not considered abandoned whereas caches are if they aren't properly maintenanced by the owner or adopters of the cache.

 

My point being, our belittlement of her opinion is not based on ignorance. It is based on publicly available knowledge of what we are really about. Any scientist worth their salt would know better to put down in writing something they know little about without at least a little research into the issue.

Edited by TotemLake
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I have to agree that she sounded foolish, driving a Subaru Outback is certainly not contributing to the environment... however she should be entitled to her opinion. Many of you are just as if not MORE so ignorant than she was in her little letter.

 

In the letter she said she was an amateur herpetologist, being an amateur means she thinks she knows more than she does and that she is not very good at it. Otherwise she would be a professional herpetologist.

 

If you want her to change her outlook on GeoCaching, then do something to prove that we aren't just leaving junk lying around.

 

The reality is she won't change her outlook on geocaching, so it is more fun to marginalize her statements.

 

This opinion was brought to you by an amateur psychologist and sociologist.

 

With some of the people you have to deal with, I'd say you could be ranked as a professional.

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