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Beds Clangers
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Beds Clangers

+Beds Clangers

Posted
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Posted

Well, didn't quite expect such an intresting response.

 

OK, after reading your responses I did report it to Beds finest and have to say was a bit surprised by the outcome. Completely by accident as I set out I did notice a car parked in the lay-by and it did have a "personnel" number plate which I remembered. Gave all the detail I could and left it with the "boy's in blue" and they may treat it as ABH looking at my arm.

 

Police phoned me today, and car and dog owner are the same person and police have been around to see the guy and he has owned up to the incident. They have asked, do I want to go any further with this so at the moment not sure what that means but am going back to them in a few days?

 

Arm is a nice shade of purple and black with a "mouth" shaped bite mark, I can actually count the dog's teeth marks!! The bite was through my jacket and waterproofs so would have been a real mess on bare skin which is very scary if it had been a small child who was bitten.

 

Has made me very weary of any dogs and I think it was the speed at which it happened that really scared me.

 

Cheers and thanks for the advice!!

 

Nick

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purple_pineapple

+purple_pineapple

Posted
Posted

 

"Personal Attacks and Flames will not be tolerated. If you want to praise or criticize, give examples as to why it is good or bad, general attacks on a person or idea will not be tolerated."

 

Alan did give examples of why he holds his opinion and in my view he did not launch a personal attack. You may disagree (strongly!) with what he said but I don't see this as reason to kill further discussion.

 

At least not at the moment!

 

As you can see above, I tried not to take Alan's comments personally, and to reply with a reasoned argument, although I can completely sympathise with stuey on this point. What I don't understand is where Alan's examples for the opinion he holds, ie that all dog owners are irresponsible, can be found.

 

If this is a moral point of view concerning the ownership of ANY domesticated animal, than Alan is of course entitled to that view. But it appears to me that it is only dog owners that are an issue, and that this is a general attack on a group of people AND an idea, WITHOUT any examples about why that view is held.

 

I would consider myself a VERY responsible dog owner, when I had one. Obviously, there are irrsesponsible owners, just as there are irresponsible geocachers, drivers, etc. Should these activities be banned?

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Eckington

+Eckington

Posted
Posted

I think the last post by Mr B Clangers is a very neat sign off to this topic.

 

A lot of very strong ideas have been aired and opposing viewpoints examined from many angles.

 

At this point in time I, like Lactodorum, believe that no forum guideline has been damaged. For this reason the thread has stayed open.

 

However I believe that there have been times when statements have been made that could, and I repeat could, have been taken personally.

 

This being so I think now is the time to draw the debate to a close and for those in conflict to agree to differ, or carry out their debate in a more private forum.

 

Lacto and I know you are all very reasonable people, so I hope you will agree with my sentiments here.

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Wadders

+Wadders

Posted
Posted

Well, didn't quite expect such an intresting response.

 

OK, after reading your responses I did report it to Beds finest and have to say was a bit surprised by the outcome. Completely by accident as I set out I did notice a car parked in the lay-by and it did have a "personnel" number plate which I remembered. Gave all the detail I could and left it with the "boy's in blue" and they may treat it as ABH looking at my arm.

 

Police phoned me today, and car and dog owner are the same person and police have been around to see the guy and he has owned up to the incident. They have asked, do I want to go any further with this so at the moment not sure what that means but am going back to them in a few days?

 

Arm is a nice shade of purple and black with a "mouth" shaped bite mark, I can actually count the dog's teeth marks!! The bite was through my jacket and waterproofs so would have been a real mess on bare skin which is very scary if it had been a small child who was bitten.

 

Has made me very weary of any dogs and I think it was the speed at which it happened that really scared me.

 

Cheers and thanks for the advice!!

 

Nick

 

Being a dog owner, who up to now has stayed out of this i have to say you should take it furthur make a statement and let the police prosecute.

The owner knows what type of character his/her dog is, and if the dog was on a lead then why did he let it near you?

My dog is only a puppy at the moment, and has a habit of running and jumping up at people to play, but that is his character, if there are lots of people around he stays on his lead so that i can CONTROL him.

 

The few spoil it for the many.

 

Wadders

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Jolly green giants

+Jolly green giants

Posted
Posted (edited)

I like to think that we are responsible dog owners. However having been bit in the past as a child by our family pet the dog in question should definatly been reported. As Everyone else is saying. Just how many times has the owner said . WELL HE'S NEVER DONE THAT BEFORE!. Saying that I also like the theory SP came up with of kicking it and saying WELL I'VE NEVER DONE THAT BEFORE! :(

Edited by Jolly green giants
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Woody's Wanderers

+Woody's Wanderers

Posted
Posted

NEVER, EVER kick a dog, even if it bites you. See previous post about ignorance. The is NO EXCUSE for it. Humans are supposed to be the most intelligent of animals (although there is beginning to be scant proof of it in this post!)

 

how would you like it if I suggested comming round and giving you a good kicking? Not much I expect.

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Jolly green giants

+Jolly green giants

Posted
Posted (edited)

NEVER, EVER kick a dog, even if it bites you. See previous post about ignorance. The is NO EXCUSE for it. Humans are supposed to be the most intelligent of animals (although there is beginning to be scant proof of it in this post!)

 

how would you like it if I suggested comming round and giving you a good kicking? Not much I expect.

Sorry I personaly would not, and apologise for the poor taste in Humour. I can understand how it feels to be on the other end of a dogs bite and feel totaly helpless when it's trying to rip you apart. That is why I am glad that our dog who is 14 and never bitten anyone is so gentle and mild mannerd. But incidents like that should be reported next time it could be a child.

 

And no would not like it if I suggested comming round and giving you a good kicking? but people have a right to defend themselves

as the law states using reasonable force.

What I don't expect and don't condone is the brutalty to defenless creatures Dogs, cats, budgies, gold fish and cachers alike. All should be allowed to roam free with out fear of being attacked.

Edited by Jolly green giants
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t.a.folk

+t.a.folk

Posted
Posted

Like em or not ,fact of life is that dogs are out there .

I think advice from anyone who has knowledge of dog behavior and of how we humans can modify controlable body language if and when confronted by an aggressive dog or even just passing harmless looking dogs might help avoid some future nasty incidents .

 

I'm thinking along the lines of constructive things like Chris n Maria ,for example,have already posted .

 

Sometimes hear people say, unconstructively I think,not be be scared because dogs can smell the fear and will attack because of it .

Like people can control the release of fear smell if they feel afraid !!

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Da Rubber Chicken

Da Rubber Chicken

Posted
Posted (edited)

To be honest if a dog had its slimey, disgusting, drolling mouth around my arm I would at first shake my arm about like a headless chicken in hope that it lets go.

 

But If it did not let go I would leave my arm in mid air until it lets goes and when its in mid air "Bang!!" and would say to the owner "what can i say i gave it a chance" and if they said "But it has never done that before" I would reply "I have never kicked a dog that hard and far before :( !!)

Edited by Da Rubber Chicken
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Simply Paul

+Simply Paul

Posted
Posted (edited)

I have never been bitten by a dog, but I have dated a couple....

 

I can't say I agree with Alan's comments. As I've no doubt they're from the heart, I can only think he's had some (many?) very unpleasant experiences. To quote a little:

Responsible dog owners...is an oxymoron. Anyone who keeps a wild animal and, even worse, takes it out among the general public cannot be responsible.
All animals, from goldfish up, are essentially wild creatures - yet the smarter ones (dogs, horses, pigs) can be trained to behave in predictable and socially-acceptable way. However, much of the control a person believes they have over that animal is actually the illusion of control. I see there is an argument to 'ban' the 'exploitation' of all animals but I'd say most animals kept as pets get as much (or more in the case of cats!) out of the relationship as their 'owners' do. The same might not be said of the beef in your burger, or the lamb on your plate though.
Problem dogs are in the minority - Not in my experience. There are very few dogs we meet while out caching (just to keep this on topic) who do not come rushing up to us causing us distress and spoiling our day. It's about time that the keeping of all wild animals for amusement was banned.
The Whites may have the look of a family with food on them while caching? In my experience, dogs will trot over, give your hand a sniff and walk off as they can't hump or eat you. Again, it sounds like Alan has had a different experience. As a non-pet-owner myself, I sympathise with animal owners who lavish time, energy and love on their pets who've found his comments unpalatable. He has, after all, insulted you and a four-legged family member. But from an absolute moral position, he has a point. Just because we have bigger brains, why should we imagine we have the right to impose our control on, and exploit, lower lifeforms? Or let them exploit us, in the case of cats...

 

The advice about turning your back on a dog didn't work for me. The only time I've been hurt by a dog was on the island of Madeira, walking in the hills. We (g/f and I) came across a little hut and was invited inside by the owner, to have a drink of water. It was a hot day and we'd walked a fair few miles. As we left, his dogs took a dislike to us and as we smartly walked away (me bring up the rear to shield the lovely Judith) the backs of my legs got scratched by unclipped claws (the hut didn't even have electricity, and it was this old chap's home so I guess claw-clipping wasn't a priority) as I was wearing shorts. When I told my mum, who's a keen rambler, this story she said, "I carry a stick." - So there's your answer. Carry a stick. And if a dog goes for you, shout "Fetch!", lob the stick and run the other way!*

 

*This may not have been what my mum meant. :(

 

Edited to add: I didn't actually say kick the dog - I said it could be considered for 'next time'. I think, if push came to shove, in a life-or-death, dog-eat-cacher situation, if it came down to it, looking rabid death in the eyes, I *might* kick a dog in self defence. Gently. But firmly. That or bite the dog back. Fair's fair.

Edited by Simply Paul
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Bear and Ragged

+Bear and Ragged

Posted
Posted

I'm not a legal person.

 

Police may just say to the owner "Don't let it happen again"

 

Dog owner could get a Police Caution, and possibly a fine (around/upto £80?), if the owner agrees to accept the Caution.

 

It could go to court, if the police think they can get a result -and you agree to be a witness.

 

Or, the police, if they can't get/haven't got enough evidence -or the owner wont co-operate- leave it on file and if the dog does do it again -then prosecute.

 

OR... The dog has done it before, others have reported it, and the police are going to throw the book at the owner!

 

If it was me, I'd go along with the police decision.

 

Hope the sore arm doesn't stop the cacheing!

 

G

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Boardslider

+Boardslider

Posted
Posted

Most dogs we meet are well behaved and do as thier owners ask / command i applaud the people who take time out to train their dogs.

 

My son is petrified of dogs and phrases like hes only being friendly do not help him a well trained dog however does and indeed these have helped him to overcome his fears.

 

They are certainly not wild animals now our cat at home could be called a wild animal but she is more likely to run away.

 

Dog mess in bags in hedges is another matter entirely though :(

 

Having slogged through this thread, MarkandLynn have summed up my argument exactly: There are a lot of people out there who are frightened of dogs, and they have as much right to be out and about as the next man / woman / child. In law, a person with a dog must be in complete control of it at all times, the calling feebly and making excuses routine just doesn't wash. My friend has an 'unpredictable dog, and when it is out it is NEVER off a short lead, and also muzzled most of the time - he is a responsible owner, anything less is legally actionable. An aquaintance of mine successfully took action against an owner who's out of control dog trashed a kitesurf kite (don't ask -read expensive) on the beach; the owner was uncooperative so they followed him back to the car took the number and called the old bill. That may seem extreme, but if a strange dog attacked or bit me I would stop at nothing to make sure the authorities knew about it.

 

Oh, and don't even start me on the plastic wrapped poo thing.......

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Nellies Knackers

+Nellies Knackers

Posted
Posted

As a dog owner who has walked around carrying a bag of dog poo I realy can't understand the point in going to the trouble of picking up just to leave it in a hedge either, but I have known people to hang a bag in a tree to pick it up on the way back rather than carry it an extra mile(that makes sense) but it still looks horrible.

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Lactodorum

Lactodorum

Posted
Posted

Having been out for the evening at another activity I am pleased to see that the discussion has remained mostly civil on what was a very emotive subject.

 

However I think it has now left Geocaching far behind so I am choosing this moment to close it.

 

Oh, and if anyone didn't know. I have a dog who accompanies me on most geocaching trips.

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