+Chinchilla_Man Posted February 15, 2006 Share Posted February 15, 2006 I have an idea for a cache that I will call Pure Heart. I will get one of those famous heart-shaped altoids tins, but paint it white. Inside in the cache (in the log book or taped to the inside of the lid) I will put the following bible verse: "Blessed are those that are pure in heart, for they will see God." ~ Matthew 5:8 Too Religious? Opinions Please! Quote Link to comment
+KoosKoos Posted February 15, 2006 Share Posted February 15, 2006 I certainly have no problem with it....but then, I wouldn't be offended to open a cache and see ANY quote from a religious tract, a holy book, a poem, etc., etc., provided said quote wasn't patently offensive. P.S. I'd like it better if it was in an ammo can, though. Quote Link to comment
+Salvelinus Posted February 15, 2006 Share Posted February 15, 2006 If a Boy Scout TB offends cachers ...this one will do the same, or worse. I suggest letting it go. Quote Link to comment
+clearpath Posted February 15, 2006 Share Posted February 15, 2006 If a Boy Scout TB offends cachers ...this one will do the same, or worse. I suggest letting it go. I agree ... Quote Link to comment
+webscouter. Posted February 15, 2006 Share Posted February 15, 2006 Although it doesn't bother me I think it would violate the part of the guidelines that states. Solicitations are also off-limits. For example, caches perceived to be posted for religious, political, charitable or social agendas are not permitted. Geocaching is supposed to be a light, fun activity, not a platform for an agenda. Quote Link to comment
+StarBrand Posted February 15, 2006 Share Posted February 15, 2006 If that is all you do - I think it is a good idea. Nothing wrong with a quotation inside the cache container. Even if it is a quote from the bible. The cache page and cache items should not push an agenda but nothing wrong with what you have described. Quote Link to comment
+cache_test_dummies Posted February 15, 2006 Share Posted February 15, 2006 It has been my experience that Altoids tins are not the best choice for a container. Quote Link to comment
+wandererrob Posted February 15, 2006 Share Posted February 15, 2006 (edited) I see no problem with this. Now, if you were to stock the cache with religious fliers and stuff, maybe then you fall under the agenda rule, but a simple quote, I persoanlly have no problem. Your reviewer will probably be able to give you the final word though. But of course, there's always some twit that will whine about it (see Boy Scout TB reference as an example). As long as you don't mind the occassional complaint, go for it! Edited February 15, 2006 by wandererrob Quote Link to comment
+sbell111 Posted February 15, 2006 Share Posted February 15, 2006 I have no problem with this idea. Hide it somewhere that it won't be in the elements, however. Altoids containers leak and rust up pretty quickly. Quote Link to comment
+Chinchilla_Man Posted February 15, 2006 Author Share Posted February 15, 2006 I was not intending on putting anything else religious in the cache so IMHO I did not think it would be against guidelines. I'll contact my local approver! Thanks guys! Quote Link to comment
+Renegade Knight Posted February 15, 2006 Share Posted February 15, 2006 (edited) Cache concept is fine, the altoids tin though needs a spot that is out of the elements and not likely to get wet. Edited February 15, 2006 by Renegade Knight Quote Link to comment
+Team GPSaxophone Posted February 15, 2006 Share Posted February 15, 2006 I have an idea for a cache that I will call Pure Heart. I will get one of those famous heart-shaped altoids tins, but paint it white. Inside in the cache (in the log book or taped to the inside of the lid) I will put the following bible verse: "Blessed are those that are pure in heart, for they will see God." ~ Matthew 5:8 Too Religious? Opinions Please! Your cache reeks of agenda. This game isn't the place for it. Personally, I like the message, but if it's allowed they also need to allow "Arms for Allah", "Hatred for Hitler", and any other type of non-Christian messages, just to be fair. Quote Link to comment
+karrooite Posted February 15, 2006 Share Posted February 15, 2006 bible verse: "Blessed are those that are pure in heart, for they will see God." ~ Matthew 5:8 Seeing that my cache submission was just rejected because it made use of quasi-religious sounding verbiage although it had no actual message, I'd be -- scratching my head if yours got approved. Quote Link to comment
+Lil Devil Posted February 15, 2006 Share Posted February 15, 2006 if it's allowed they also need to allow "Arms for Allah", "Hatred for Hitler", and any other type of non-Christian messages, just to be fair. Yeah, what the blue dude said. Let's keep all agendas out of this game, please Oh, yeah, and Altoids tins suck as a cache container. They should be banned Quote Link to comment
+Prime Suspect Posted February 15, 2006 Share Posted February 15, 2006 Too Religious? Opinions Please! If this was godcaching.com, it'd be fine. But this isn't. Keep religion and politics out of the caches. As we're seeing in the news, what one group finds acceptable, another may find blasphemous. Quote Link to comment
+Alan2 Posted February 15, 2006 Share Posted February 15, 2006 Back in the woods with Ranger Rick ....shhh let’s listen in… “Hey Ranger, what’d’ya doin’ in the lake with my minnow bucket?” “Ah, ahem, ah, well, I was just adjusting it so them little shiners could get more fresh water. It’ll keep ‘em alive longer, ya know.” “Well, maybe so, but I wish you wudn’t mess around with my personal property. Fer a moment I thought yer wuz stealin’ it. By the way, ya haven’t seen an ammo can around here have ya? I cud a swore I placed it nearby. My son’s a preacher man and geocacher, ya know. Asked me to hide it fer himself while I was out bassin’. Strange hobby he has, ya know. Takes these little bibles, sticks em in an ammo box and hides it in them woods. Then people come alookin’ fer it. Strange way to find God if you ask me. Why not just go to church or sumthin'? By the way, nuthin wrong with hiding bible-filled ammo boxes is there?” “Ohh no. Ah, Of course not. Go right ahead. I think that falls under Freedom of Religion and protected speech. I’d be the last guy to go against our constitution. ” Quote Link to comment
+Team GPSaxophone Posted February 15, 2006 Share Posted February 15, 2006 “Ohh no. Ah, Of course not. Go right ahead. I think that falls under Freedom of Religion and protected speech. I’d be the last guy to go against our constitution. ” The question has nothing to do with the constitution or any other goverment document. This is a privately owned website and the owners have decided to keep agendas out of caches. Quote Link to comment
+Alan2 Posted February 16, 2006 Share Posted February 16, 2006 (edited) Sorry you missed the intended humor, satire and irony in my post I wuz intending to highlight all the usual complaints about our hobby - bibles in ammo boxes, cache containers in the woods being personal property like minnow boxes and not abandoned property, etc. Edited February 16, 2006 by Alan2 Quote Link to comment
vagabond Posted February 16, 2006 Share Posted February 16, 2006 (edited) I have no problem with it. Some cachers use bible verses as clues. To make some thin skinned people happy you could leave the chapter and verse off of it Edited February 16, 2006 by vagabond Quote Link to comment
+Wander Lost Posted February 16, 2006 Share Posted February 16, 2006 Too Religious? Opinions Please! Too Religious? Maybe Yes, maybe No. It depends on the personal belief of the person reading that phrase. I can't honestly say how it will be perceived by the next person who reads it. I find it to be overly preachy, but that is just me. My opinion is that this is geocaching and should be about the hunt and the location. Everything has a proper time & place, the inside of a cache container is not the proper place for religion. p.s. What they said about Altoids containers! They are not waterproof, and they get very hard to open after they've started rusting. Quote Link to comment
+wandererrob Posted February 16, 2006 Share Posted February 16, 2006 (edited) Not to belittle anyone's religious beliefs of course, but from a nonreligious angle, it's just a quote from a book. Not unlike any other quote to me. Edited February 16, 2006 by wandererrob Quote Link to comment
+Shaggy of Mysteries Inc Posted February 16, 2006 Share Posted February 16, 2006 (edited) I have an idea for a cache that I will call Pure Heart. I will get one of those famous heart-shaped altoids tins, but paint it white. Inside in the cache (in the log book or taped to the inside of the lid) I will put the following bible verse: "Blessed are those that are pure in heart, for they will see God." ~ Matthew 5:8 Too Religious? Opinions Please! I would have no problem with your cache as you have discribed it. If others do, you could leave out the words of the text and just write Matthew 5:8 inside your cache. That way it is thier decision to look it up or not look it up. The altoids can could be placed inside another container to keep it dry. ~Shaggy~ Edit: Punctuation. Edited February 16, 2006 by Shaggy of Mysteries Inc Quote Link to comment
+JohnnyVegas Posted February 16, 2006 Share Posted February 16, 2006 Just leave it out. Quote Link to comment
+Googling Hrpty Hrrs Posted February 16, 2006 Share Posted February 16, 2006 Regardless of our opinions, I don't see how this one would get listed as it's described. Why not find a secular quote with a similar message? Quote Link to comment
+briansnat Posted February 16, 2006 Share Posted February 16, 2006 (edited) Not to belittle anyone's religious beliefs of course, but from a nonreligious angle, it's just a quote from a book. Not unlike any other quote to me. Agreed. I don't see it as an issue. As a devout agnostic, it doesn't bother me a bit. As far as an agenda, it's not nearly as blatant as some caches that have been published. Edited February 16, 2006 by briansnat Quote Link to comment
+Snoogans Posted February 16, 2006 Share Posted February 16, 2006 Not to belittle anyone's religious beliefs of course, but from a nonreligious angle, it's just a quote from a book. Not unlike any other quote to me. Agreed. I don't see it as an issue. As a devout agnostic, it doesn't bother me a bit. As far as an agenda, it's not nearly as blatant as some caches that have been published. THANK YOU! Ya beat me to it and I couldn't have said it better. It's a quote! Nothing MORE. I'm Agnostic too and nothing about that cache bothered me. It shames me to see the religious phobia that some folks display while calling themselves Agnostic. Someone outline the agenda to me because I don't see it. Quote Link to comment
tttedzeins Posted February 16, 2006 Share Posted February 16, 2006 I don't have a problem with it really, but quotes from the Torah, Quran and various other religious writtings should be equally allowed. It should not be restricted to one religion. So I figure best leave it out you never know who you might offend. I do agree with wandererrob (not to belittle anyone and from a purely nonreligious pov) it is just a quote from a book. This would be what some people think but there is no accounting for everyone. Quote Link to comment
Trinity's Crew Posted February 16, 2006 Share Posted February 16, 2006 (edited) Not to belittle anyone's religious beliefs of course, but from a nonreligious angle, it's just a quote from a book. Not unlike any other quote to me. Amen, Brother! Edited February 16, 2006 by Trinity's Crew Quote Link to comment
+Googling Hrpty Hrrs Posted February 16, 2006 Share Posted February 16, 2006 Not to belittle anyone's religious beliefs of course, but from a nonreligious angle, it's just a quote from a book. Not unlike any other quote to me. I agree. But it still doesn't change the fact it probably won't get published. Quote Link to comment
dsandbro Posted February 16, 2006 Share Posted February 16, 2006 Just put a disclaimer on the description that it is a religious themed cache. Then the cacher can decide for himself whether to search or not. I think I would leave out the picture of Muhammed with a bomb in his turban though.... Quote Link to comment
+Renegade Knight Posted February 16, 2006 Share Posted February 16, 2006 Well now, seeing as this is a container and this is how it's decorated (ahnd the key concern is that it doesn't look like a bomb) I'm not entirly sure there is a guideline for it beyond that it's acceptable for a person to have a view on life. They could use it in their sig card. They could have it made into a coin. It represents them, they are who they are. If they do that quote instead of little hearts for the dots on their "I"s there is no harm. Quote Link to comment
+Corp Of Discovery Posted February 16, 2006 Share Posted February 16, 2006 It's your cache. Feel free to write whatever you want in your logbook. There is no need to mention it on the cache page or even tell your reviewer that it is there. Last time I looked there was nothing in the rules against it. I do agree about the tin tho, make sure it's protected from the elements. Quote Link to comment
+Googling Hrpty Hrrs Posted February 16, 2006 Share Posted February 16, 2006 Feel free to write whatever you want in your logbook. There is no need to mention it on the cache page or even tell your reviewer that it is there. You're right. I guess I should have clarified what I said about it not being approved. What quote or items that are in a cache have less to do with it being approved than what is actually on the cache page. Quote Link to comment
+stormcloud Posted February 16, 2006 Share Posted February 16, 2006 I think you folks forget that all quotes used say something about the person or thier beliefs. Why is it okay to quote some secular person who is expounding on thier beliefs but if some one quotes the bible we all freak. Take a look at some of the signatures, and tell me that some one isn't presenting thier beliefs. Given a chance someone will find offense with something. You can find these same sentiments in the Koran or in the budist beliefs. Quote Link to comment
+Magoonies Posted February 16, 2006 Share Posted February 16, 2006 If you hide it, people will find it. Like someone pointed out. If a boyscout TB offended people, and it did, anything can/will offend someone. They day people stop being offended this will be a very boring planet. I think Corp of Discovery had it right. As long as I don't have to join your church or something like that to log it, I'm cool with it. Quote Link to comment
+Clothahump Posted February 16, 2006 Share Posted February 16, 2006 Too religious. Those of us that have chosen to be free from religion really get aggravated when others try to shove religion down our throats. I'm afraid someone a little more activist than I would trash a cache like that. I would settle for a nasty note in the logbook. Quote Link to comment
+StarBrand Posted February 16, 2006 Share Posted February 16, 2006 Too religious. Those of us that have chosen to be free from religion really get aggravated when others try to shove religion down our throats. I'm afraid someone a little more activist than I would trash a cache like that. I would settle for a nasty note in the logbook. Exactly how is this quote on the lid of an otherwise ordinary geocache going to "shove" anything down your throat?? Any more than leaving a penny in a cache with the quote "in god we trust"? Any more than the several sig lines in this very thread? Would the quote offend you as much if it was attributted to Budda? or Mark Twain? Are they trying to "shove" thier ideals on you too? Quote Link to comment
+Cylifornia Posted February 16, 2006 Share Posted February 16, 2006 If you are trying to remove all religion from your life, what do you use as monetary currency? "In God We Trust"!!!! Quote Link to comment
Clan Riffster Posted February 16, 2006 Share Posted February 16, 2006 Go for it, Brother! For the true Agnostic, a Bible quote is no different than a Shakespere quote. If you let those folks with religious phobias control your life, you've lost before you ever started. Just on a side note, I'm curious, let's say I printed a Bible quote in one of my caches. It's a group of words expressing a sentiment, which the individual cacher is free to read or ignore, at their whim. How exactly is that "shoving religion down someone's throat"? Why would somebody be so thin skinned to get aggravated over something written on a piece of paper? Are there really activists who would destroy something that somebody else made simply because they disagreed with a few words written on a piece of paper? I can't believe anybody is so intolerant that this behavior would be acceptable to them. As for those who leave nasty notes in your log, there ain't nothin' you can do about it. You'll find that tolerance is pretty one sided these days, so it's up to you to be the grown up and ignore childish stunts like this. BTW, I'm not Agnostic, but I respect the beliefs of those who are. "An it harm none, do as thy wilst" Quote Link to comment
+onionpond Posted February 16, 2006 Share Posted February 16, 2006 Go for it, Brother! For the true Agnostic, a Bible quote is no different than a Shakespere quote. If you let those folks with religious phobias control your life, you've lost before you ever started. Just on a side note, I'm curious, let's say I printed a Bible quote in one of my caches. It's a group of words expressing a sentiment, which the individual cacher is free to read or ignore, at their whim. How exactly is that "shoving religion down someone's throat"? Why would somebody be so thin skinned to get aggravated over something written on a piece of paper? Are there really activists who would destroy something that somebody else made simply because they disagreed with a few words written on a piece of paper? I can't believe anybody is so intolerant that this behavior would be acceptable to them. As for those who leave nasty notes in your log, there ain't nothin' you can do about it. You'll find that tolerance is pretty one sided these days, so it's up to you to be the grown up and ignore childish stunts like this. BTW, I'm not Agnostic, but I respect the beliefs of those who are. "An it harm none, do as thy wilst" Quote Link to comment
+onionpond Posted February 16, 2006 Share Posted February 16, 2006 (edited) I lost count, were there more opinions against using the Altoid can? Or were there more against using the Bible Verse? I say it's your Cache hide it in whatever you want, your the one that has to maintain it,and use the verse if it's to your liking. You can't please all the people all the time. Edited February 16, 2006 by onionpond Quote Link to comment
+ecocyclist Posted February 16, 2006 Share Posted February 16, 2006 The Altoids tin is fine, in my opinion. Just hide it so it doesn't get wet. I have no problem with the bible verse, either. Quote Link to comment
+onionpond Posted February 16, 2006 Share Posted February 16, 2006 I lost count, were there more opinions against the use of the altoid can? Or were there more against the use of the verse? I say use the altoid can, and the Bible verse, it's your Cache and all maintainence is up to you. You can't please all the people all the time. Quote Link to comment
TCE Posted February 16, 2006 Share Posted February 16, 2006 No problem. But to keep it in good condition I'd hide it in a place that stays dry. Quote Link to comment
+gaits Posted February 17, 2006 Share Posted February 17, 2006 I say go for it! Make it clear in oyur description what it is. If anyone does not want to be offended by the scriptures then they should not go looking for this cache. As others have said if someone is going to get offended by a Boy Scout Cache (which I do not support them) then they will get offended by anything. But in all honesty I seek the caches for the numbers. So if I came across a Boy Scout cache i would sign it and leave and not worry about the quotes. So if you make it clear in your description what the cache is about then other cachers will have the same choice. So in short place your cache....it is up to you what you put in it....as another cacher said it is a little thing called freedom of religion and speech. Good Luck with it Quote Link to comment
+stormcloud Posted February 17, 2006 Share Posted February 17, 2006 I work in youth custody center as a Youth Supervisor(politically correct term for youth jail guard). In the pastors office is a chart showing the golden rule. Which i dont think alot of people would take issue with. It was interpreted using about a dozen different quotes from different religions. Would anybody have a problem if the person put the Quote "treat others they way you would want to be treated". yet this same sentiment can be found in almost every religion in the world. Its your cache and if we can't respect each other enough to be courtious to each other and respectful then its not the quote thats the issue but basic human dignaty. I don't have to agree with you or even like you but i do have to respect you and your property. If its a great cache i will tell you. If it aint a great cache i will sign the log and leave. Quote Link to comment
+Team Teuton Posted February 17, 2006 Share Posted February 17, 2006 If you want the opinion of a devout atheist, here it is... It's your cache. Do what you want with it. Quote Link to comment
+Alan2 Posted February 17, 2006 Share Posted February 17, 2006 If you want the opinion of a devout atheist, here it is... It's your cache. Do what you want with it. Amen. Quote Link to comment
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