Garmin 60 Csx "improvements"?

February 2, 2006

Just wondering how many Garmin 60CSx owners/users have actually went as far as complaining to Garmin via either email or phone concerning:

1. "Wandering" position problem

2. Dorky icons

3. No memory card icon or utility

4. Loss of alarm clock function

5. No lithium battery option

Hopefully, if enough users complain enough, they'll actually fix these issues! :lol:

Edited February 2, 2006 by Didjerrydo

February 2, 2006

Add to this list an existing issue held over from the 60 series.

When in geocache mode, after you select a cache, the highlighted button is "Find", which is annoying to me since I always seem to accidentally hit the enter button as I am carrying the unit.

I've asked that they change the highlighted button to "Notes", which is the middle one. At least that way we won't be marking caches as found by accident.

February 2, 2006

Add to this list an existing issue held over from the 60 series.
When in geocache mode, after you select a cache, the highlighted button is "Find", which is annoying to me since I always seem to accidentally hit the enter button as I am carrying the unit.

I've asked that they change the highlighted button to "Notes", which is the middle one. At least that way we won't be marking caches as found by accident.

I have done this quite a few times and it can be very annoying.

As for writing to Garmin. I have done it twice so far and I suggest all of us do it. If enough people give them the same feedback it may push them to work faster on a fix.

February 2, 2006

As far as some of the mentioned items

1. "Wandering" position problem

I haven't seen this one yet but if it were to exist, yep, it needs to be fixed

2. Dorky icons

I think the icons are fine as is, it's nice that they weren't carried over from the unit I upgraded from, besides I don't know about other people but I don't plan on walking around all day stating at the icon screen anyway!

3. No memory card icon or utility

Yep, would be nice feature to add

4. Loss of alarm clock function

Never used it and even forgot my old unit even had it, if they want to add it then fine but I don't need it

5. No lithium battery option

Yep, should have been there from the beginning

I agree also with a previous post, the default highlighted button in Geocache mode should be notes and not found, I too have accedentally sellected this and recorded the cache as found when it wasn't.

February 2, 2006

PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE send an email to Garmin Tech Support - techsupp@garmin.com about the inability to export real time plotting information via USB!!! I really don't want to go spend another $50 for serial cables and adapters- when this function should already work just fine! Even if you DO NOT own a 60csx, can you shoot an email? The more emails, the faster they'll resolve it.

Thanks guys!

3.8k · February 2, 2006

If only Garmin people lurked in these forums . . . :lol: *

*I am not in any way associated with Garmin International Inc., Garmin, Ltd. or any of their affiliates

February 2, 2006

yeah, no kidding. I am sending them emails from each of my email accounts so they THINK more people are reporting the problem. I hope many of you are doing the same- we need this resolved ASAP!!!

1.8k · February 2, 2006

I sent Garmin an email regarding how the auto-routing with my 60CX (using City Select v.7) gives a lesser lead-time when it gives the turn prompt beeps than my 60C does (using CS v.6). Both the early and final beeps come a bit late, with the final beeping too close to your turn. Also, the volume of tones on my 60CX are lower than my 60C, and I see no option to change it. Garmin support emailed back saying thank you, and these issues were sent along to engineering.

February 2, 2006

I am seriously considering upgrading my year 2000 yellow etrex. The local museum has asked that I donate it. As a result, I am in the final throes of deciding between the 60 CX or 76CX.

Reading these posts, I ask: Does the 76CX have the same issues listed above? If the answer is "no", I think my mind will be made up!

3.2k · February 2, 2006

I am seriously considering upgrading my year 2000 yellow etrex. The local museum has asked that I donate it. As a result, I am in the final throes of deciding between the 60 CX or 76CX.

Reading these posts, I ask: Does the 76CX have the same issues listed above? If the answer is "no", I think my mind will be made up!

The "found" button being highlighted by default is the same on my 76CS and, I too, have inadvertently marked caches as found. It's annoying to say the least. I would guess that this issue still exists on the 76CX unit.

February 2, 2006

I was one of the first to send 'improvement suggestions' to Garmin about the 60C(S)x and have done so 3 times. Hope you all keep emailing as well!

February 2, 2006

Yes please Garmin fix the wandering problem asap.

I went on a four mile hike this past weekend on varying terrain, altitudes and tree cover, the tracks the GPS produced were perfect.

today I go to a grocery store and left the tracks on as a test. when i downloaded it to my computer, the tracks while I was in the store was all over the place, with two points going almost a mile out from the store!!

Why such varying results???

February 2, 2006

Why would you need a track log while you are inside a building? I would expect the track to be all over as the signals are most likely weak and all over.

February 2, 2006

Why would you need a track log while you are inside a building? I would expect the track to be all over as the signals are most likely weak and all over.

like i said i was testing it out.

And you'd be surprised how strong a signal you get indoors with the new CSxs...

February 2, 2006

I send an email to techsupp@garmin.com 3 days ago.

-------------------------------------------

...

Any feedback would be great for me.

-------------------------------------------

But i did not get any feedback like: Thank's for your suggestions...

Did anyone get a feedback or is this unusual for Garmin.

February 2, 2006

I always get the same canned response.

2.4k · February 2, 2006

today I go to a grocery store and left the tracks on as a test. when i downloaded it to my computer, the tracks while I was in the store was all over the place, with two points going almost a mile out from the store!!

Why such varying results???

The GPS position calculations assume that all signals will be traveling on the direct line-of-sight path from the satellite to your receiver. That allows the transit time to be converted to an equivalent distance and therefore the receiver can determine where you are based on the known satellite locations.

But inside a store which may have a roof that's totally blocking the GPS signals you might only be getting signals that have been reflected from other buildings in the area and entered the grocery store through the windows and/or walls. In such a situation the calculated position will vary quite widely depending on exactly how the signals are being reflected and therefore how much additional distance is traveled. As the satellites move you're likely to get different reflections and corresponding position shifts.

OTOH, some buildings have roof constructions that don't block the signals so effectively and there the positions can be more stable and reasonably accurate (although certainly not as good as out in the open). Earlier today I was relaxing in a dentist office with nothing better to do while waiting for the Novacaine to take effect so I checked the reception available with my eMap (older Garmin with internal patch antenna). The room was well into the interior of the building with other offices on all sides, but I still got a solid lock with 7 received satellites and the indicated position was very stable (I don't really know the accuracy but had no indication that it was off by much). I think the building roof in this case was reasonably transparent to microwaves.

Edited February 2, 2006 by peter

1k · February 3, 2006

As I write here:

http://forums.Groundspeak.com/GC/index.php?showtopic=122214

Garmin do not add new function to released GPS, only bugfix.

I guess the fix Lithium battery problem.

Jotne

After having Garmin units for several years, I know the following.

Garmin do not add new function to released GPS, so

they will not add the possibility to store waypoint to memory card.

they will not support POI on the new "x" series GPS.

They only fix bugs, and do some minor new function.

Garmin want you to buying new GPS from them.

I am some disappointed with Garmin. When 60C was first released

we made a list of about 20 improvements that we would like to have.

They added none of them to the 60C and none of them to the “x”

series. They even removed the Alarm function on the new “x” series.

2.9k · February 3, 2006

I bought a brand new Map60Cx at BassPro shops-Outdoor World yesterday on the 2nd of febuary.

I bought it mainly because somebody said that it can work with POI, so I bought it including tax $479

I have been working with POI on the new GPS, and it is really neat stuff.

I have several POI files listed under Custom POI, when I do a FIND.

The list includes my own waypoints converted to POI, using G7ToWin into *.GPX files that the Garmin POI Loader now works with.

The list of POI files on my 60Cx are:

Costco (list of stores as a test)

All important waypoints (many of my old waypoints going back to 1998)

Traditionals

Multicaches.

I'm loving it now, that I can have a large database of caches as POI now on this 60Cx of mine, since I almost bought a really nice looking Explorist XL at Bass Pro Shops up in Pontiac Michigan.

---

Below are my screen shots of this new feature of the 60Cx.

I am going to experiment with this more, as this is why I blew $480 on a nice new 60Cx.

Edit: Had to fix the image above.

Edited February 3, 2006 by GOT GPS?

2.9k · February 3, 2006

Heres some sample caches, done by scratch without GSAK(Going to be using).

Would be cool to be able to fine-tune this feature

February 3, 2006

As I write here:
http://forums.Groundspeak.com/GC/index.php?showtopic=122214

Garmin do not add new function to released GPS, only bugfix.

I guess the fix Lithium battery problem.

Jotne

After having Garmin units for several years, I know the following.

Garmin do not add new function to released GPS, so

they will not add the possibility to store waypoint to memory card.

they will not support POI on the new "x" series GPS.

They only fix bugs, and do some minor new function.

Garmin want you to buying new GPS from them.

I am some disappointed with Garmin. When 60C was first released

we made a list of about 20 improvements that we would like to have.

They added none of them to the 60C and none of them to the “x”

series. They even removed the Alarm function on the new “x” series.

When I bought my 2610 it could only route to 1 waypoint and could only do a basic detour.

After about 6 months they added multiple waypoints, custom avoids (regions and specific streets), they added custom fields like elevation, ...

During the 3 years that I have it it is now a completely changed device than the one I bought thanks to the new features added by Garmin.

IMO Garmin will add the improvements if they are important enough and if it is technically possible.

February 3, 2006

The list includes my own waypoints converted to POI, using G7ToWin into *.GPX files that the Garmin POI Loader now works with.

Couldn't you also do it straight from Mapsource by using "save as..." and selecting the GPX format?

2.9k · February 3, 2006

The list includes my own waypoints converted to POI, using G7ToWin into *.GPX files that the Garmin POI Loader now works with.

Couldn't you also do it straight from Mapsource by using "save as..." and selecting the GPX format?

I ended up using Mapsource and *GPX, and G7ToWin Didn't work for what I needed.

5.3k · February 3, 2006

Geoff, can you give me an overview of how much the custom POIs can cover? As a former Meridian owner, you'll understand my interest in being able to have multiple files (or a facsimile) to use.

Since I am ony vaguely familiar with the custom POI process, these are some questions that spring to mind:

Is there a limit of custom POIs that can be added?

Do these end up being embedded in the map data on the card?

Can they be deleted? Individually and/or by category?

Is there any display control for custom POIs? (e.g., by category)

One of the things dissuading me from the new models is the lack of waypoint file management like Magellans have (that's about the *only* deterrent). If the custom POIs offer a reasonable workaround, I'm going to be having frank and candid discussions with my wife.

Edit: I see that someone just opened a new thread on this topic. Maybe best to respond there.

Edited February 3, 2006 by embra

1.8k · February 3, 2006

Geoff, this is very interesting as I also have a 60CX and would like to hear more. Excuse my lack of knowledge on POIs, but are the custom POIs using memory out of the 1,000 waypoints a 60CX has available? Or, would these be in addition to the normal 1,000? And, would these POIs be stored on the microSD card? If so this would be sweet! Thanks.

2.9k · February 3, 2006

Cool stuff i found out.

I took out the microSD card, and powered up the GPS.

No Custom POI, or regular City Select POI.

So these are stored on the microSD card.

I found that I cannot do multiple folders on the microSD card, but the POI files can be fairly large.

Gotta get some sleep, and work tonight, and off the next 2 days to work on this project, of perfecting this new setup with CUSTOM POI on the X-series 60Cx of mine.

I had installed the POI loader couple days ago, and it did not work with the old 60C, but as soon as I connect the 60Cx to the USB cable, the POI Loader comes up, and it is fast, loading on the microSD card. Also when you upload POI to the card, it does not effect the mapping on the card at all. I have 56 megs mapping copyed over from the old 60C via mapsource to my 64meg card, and left some room for as much POI as can come up with. There maybe a limit of 3000 POI but maybe I can go over that amount.

What I am now going to do is to have the Traditionals, Multicaches, and virtuals in separate POI files, then have a separate file for the Geocache hints for all the caches in the other files.

So much I can do with this cool GPS.

I did almost 4 miles hike in the woods, and it did quite well, despite the lack of any WAAS sats, and the sats were spread out east and west, but not north and south, so that effected my accuracy.

-

Geoff

Edited February 3, 2006 by GOT GPS?

February 3, 2006

I have added custom poi's for out of state relatives. I added them using Mapsource, saved as gpx file. Then used Garmin's POI loader, they show up as custom poi's using the find button.

2.9k · February 3, 2006

Cannot Delete individual POI, or files on the GPS, but it takes just seconds to modify the POI Loader folder on the PC, then upload of that is quick.

Eache upload erases the previous Custom POI on the card, so what you want on the card, has to be in the POI Loader folder on the PC.

IM posting over here at this link on the use of the POI Loader for use on the X-models.

Edited February 3, 2006 by GOT GPS?

5.3k · February 3, 2006

So these are stored on the microSD card.

Correct. This is becuase they're stored in the map images and the maps are stored on MicroSD.

That is also why Garmin explained they wouldn't open up the info on writing POIs to developers.

1k · February 3, 2006

Can anyone of you guys with the "x" modell look under setup and se how many language you can select?

It seems that Us version only have 4 and Europe modell have a lot more.

I know they all uses same image files.

I also jnow that the image files contains lots of language,

1k · February 3, 2006

I asked if Garmin will add POI on the old 60CS.

The answer I get was no, and he sent me a list with supportet GPS, and 60CSx was missing. (new StreePilots and Quest 2)

I did send a new message about POI suppoer on the 60CSx and got no answer back.

February 3, 2006

Robert,

Correct. This is becuase they're stored in the map images and the maps are stored on MicroSD.

That is also why Garmin explained they wouldn't open up the info on writing POIs to developers.

Out of curiosity, have you tried to reverse-engineer the format of the map files?

I would be curious to do or see a differential analysis of an empty map file containing custom waypoints against another one containing just a couple waypoints.

Regards,

-Fabien.

5.3k · February 4, 2006

Not interested. GPSBabel isn't in the map biz. I approached them to document the interface and was kind of suprised, but really this approach makes some sense for adding non-editable points - after all GPSes have been reading points from their map files for zillions of years.

I do have some tweaks to GPSBabel's POI writer in the oven:

-86.31273,36.07957,GC706 Trad/Regu (2.5/2.0),Bug Juice of the Mossy Field

-87.98747,36.81422,GCBFC7 Trad/Regu (1.5/2.0),LBL1503

-81.31262,29.85483,GCHGVQ Trad/Micr (1.0/1.5),Boat Ramp

2.9k · February 4, 2006

These POI files are not in the map images, or else my maps would be over written when I load the POI files, but I don't know if they are encripted onto the card in such a way that we can't mess with them.

I been experimenting mostly with Traditional cache listings of 400 in my area.

I have about 3 copies of the list in Custom POI, this way I can cover most of the angles, and when I go search NEAREST, I see all the Custom POIs from all the files, and can click on each version of each cache, all this done using Gee Sack(GSAK). I have something like 3 files of the same 400 traditional caches, and the 1st file contains the info like Diff/Terr, and others, the 2nd file contains comments, and the 3rd copy has the hints(This is what im working toward).

-

Geoff

Edited February 4, 2006 by GOT GPS?

5.3k · February 4, 2006

These POI files are not in the map images, or else my maps would be over written when I load the POI files, but I don't know if they are

The reason Garmin's engineering group gave me for not documenting the user POI interface was that custom POIs go in map memory images.

February 4, 2006

The GPS position calculations assume that all signals will be traveling on the direct line-of-sight path from the satellite to your receiver.

It's not quite that simple anymore, especially with the SiRF chipset. It can reject reflected low-strength signals, among other tricks.

http://www.skyaid.org/LifeWatch/sIRF_gps.htm

(Keep in mind that was written about the first generation SiRF chipset, not the 3rd gen in some newer units, aka SiRFStarIII).

As the satellites move you're likely to get different reflections and corresponding position shifts.

Angular movement of the satellites is miniscule compared to even a few inches movement of your receiver.

What you are probably seeing is some side effects from the various features in the SiRF chipset...one in particular uses the last known heading+velocity, along with down to just 1 satellite, to guess if you're still headed on that course. Also, the chipset is much more sensitive- so whereas an older unit would get 1 or zero satellite signals, the newer chipset might pick up 2-3...and position will obviously be very inaccurate.

Honestly? Don't use GPS while in the grocery store. You have some pretty unrealistic expectations of your unit if you expect to be able to leave it on inside a building and not have it "wander", especially with a fancy new chipset that works hard to get you any kind of navigation ability.

2.9k · February 4, 2006

QUOTE (GOT GPS? @ Feb 3 2006, 09:44 PM)
These POI files are not in the map images, or else my maps would be over written when I load the POI files, but I don't know if they are

The reason Garmin's engineering group gave me for not documenting the user POI interface was that custom POIs go in map memory images.

Here is an image of the 64mb card

Edited February 4, 2006 by GOT GPS?

February 4, 2006

My folder is Custom POIs with 3 gpx files created w/ Mapsource so far. Benchmarks, home poi, & other poi

Edited February 4, 2006 by whitecrow

1.8k · February 4, 2006

Geoff, this POI business with my 60CX is Soooo cool! I was able to build a custom POI file (as a .csv) from a GIS database I had of 960 runway and taxiway lights, and they all loaded just fine in one operation. I'm new to all this so I haven't included all the neat comment data you show on your screen shots. I'll keep playing. I have about 50 MB of CS and Topo mapping on my 64 MB microSD and now 960 POIs as well. If you get time could you post a help file or something for all us POI neophytes? Please share your knowledge?

February 4, 2006

Anyone else managed to get custom icons to work with the POIs? I've got a nice little benchmark icon that works fine for waypoints, but not when uploaded with the POI loader.

Also, in case anyone was wondering, there's no limit to the number of characters in the text fields: It's just limited to 2 lines of text for the title and 4 for the description. The font is proportional so you can fit in a whole heck of a lot more "l"s than "W"s.

Also also, the forums new quick edit function's nifty.

Edited February 4, 2006 by Rotareneg

5.3k · February 4, 2006

The reason Garmin's engineering group gave me for not documenting the user POI interface was that custom POIs go in map memory images.

Here is an image of the 64mb card

Well, isn't that special? I didn't have a unit that supported custom POI so I couldn't call them on that.

So it's not high on my list, but I'll look at that. Thanx.

2.9k · February 5, 2006

One item of NOTE:

Under Custom POI, the FIND BY NAME needs to be fixed.

Can we email Garmin on this ISSUE ??

- - - -

I am still working on formatting of the POI files, to help take the place of the clunky PDAs, for less to carry.

I been really tired big time, but going to work on it now, and don't have to punch a time clock till tomorrow night.

-

Geoff

EDIT: Editing of POI has to be on the PC due to the fact that there are only 2 compressed files on the microSD card, one is the gmapsupp.img file and the poi.gpi file.

EDIT 2: You can now use G7ToWin to communicate with the 60Cx/CSx, for uploading/downloading of everything except POI, but you can also use this a bit easier than Garmin X-image, to do screen captures, but you need to update the firmware in the GPS, if you had not done that yet.

Edited February 5, 2006 by GOT GPS?

February 5, 2006

Ok, call me a GPS newbie (cause I am), but how do I get started adding my own POIs? I see nothing in the manuals that refer to this. A simple step-by-step would be appreciated since I have a few POI that I would like to add. Do I need any software other than Mapsource? Please enlighten my curiousity.

Thanks

Grimm-

2.9k · February 5, 2006

Ok, call me a GPS newbie (cause I am), but how do I get started adding my own POIs? I see nothing in the manuals that refer to this. A simple step-by-step would be appreciated since I have a few POI that I would like to add. Do I need any software other than Mapsource? Please enlighten my curiousity.

Thanks

Grimm-

You can download the POI loader program from here:

It is really cool stuff

Here is an image I just made in the last few minutes:

I can see this still does not replace a PDA, but it is an experiment to see what I can do with POI.

Edited February 5, 2006 by GOT GPS?

March 24, 2006

Is there a way to increase how much text can be saved on a custom poi? When i made a poi i typed in a long sentence, but when i viewed it on my gps only half the text showed up. Also, how do i delete the custom poi off my gps?

Edited March 24, 2006 by otterbob

3.3k · March 24, 2006

Also, how do i delete the custom poi off my gps?

Replace it with another POI file! :rolleyes: Yep, send a file with only one POI, and the others will be erased leaving just the new one. Another way is to put your memory card into a card reader and delete the POI folder.

March 26, 2006

Ok, call me a GPS newbie (cause I am), but how do I get started adding my own POIs? I see nothing in the manuals that refer to this. A simple step-by-step would be appreciated since I have a few POI that I would like to add. Do I need any software other than Mapsource? Please enlighten my curiousity.

Thanks

Grimm-

You can download the POI loader program from here:

It is really cool stuff

Here is an image I just made in the last few minutes:

I can see this still does not replace a PDA, but it is an experiment to see what I can do with POI.

Can anyone tell me how to have GSAK output the cache description? I know about %hint but I think that %des is the cache name, and not the cache description. I can't see any other special tags that will export this in a GPX file. Thanks in advance.

March 27, 2006

Look at the GSAK help.

http://gsak.net/help/hs10300.htm

March 27, 2006

Look at the GSAK help.

http://gsak.net/help/hs10300.htm

Puddlewalker,

I did look at the help, the answer was not there, that is why I posted this question here and your response did not do me, or anyone with a similar issue any favors. thanks anyways newbie,

Woggs1

Edited to be nice

Edited March 27, 2006 by woggs1

June 26, 2006

Try here it has all the codes

http://gsak.net/help/hs10300.htm

Look at the GSAK help.

http://gsak.net/help/hs10300.htm

Puddlewalker,

I did look at the help, the answer was not there, that is why I posted this question here and your response did not do me, or anyone with a similar issue any favors. thanks anyways newbie,

Woggs1

Edited to be nice

Garmin 60 Csx "improvements"?

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