Pure Junk ,,, Why Leave It?

February 1, 2006

My feelings on Mctoys is simple, the neopets , Ty Babies in good shape or in there Original bags are collectible,,,, However the McPlastic toy from five years ago all scratch up wheels missing is junk, pure and simple...

Here my second theory--- McPLastic toys can only be exchanged for Mcplastic toys not that nice new shinny Mag light in the cache.

Make the sport better, be original, when exchanging swag pretend this is your Cache, I find great fun to read logs of caches I been too and see someone mention that they took the Swag I left behind.

Although I have another theory really,, I sure that people that leave used Mcplastic Toys dont even read these forums or post in the log pages... Think about it have you ever seen a log entry like this..

Oct 5th 2003

It was a mild fall day me and the kids went out geocaching the river was beautiful the cache was fun too find a great time was had by all..

Took: New Compass

Left : Used Nemo McPlastic Toy

PS tks I enjoyed looting your cache and leaving junk.

Edited February 1, 2006 by DaigleFamily

February 1, 2006

It'd be nice if people traded even or up, but they don't. They won't. And some of you get terribly upset about it.

This is an unnecessary emotional drain. Reforming other people is an exercise in futility. Make peace with human nature. Hunt more difficult caches, be amused by the junk, or ignore trade items altogether.

Attitudinally, you could regard the items you put into caches as no-strings gifts, or be sure to trade items of great kitsch value but little $$ value. The OP mentioned a nice glass vase that was taken and replaced with junk. If the vase was valuable, it didn't make sense to put it into a cache in the first place. You're just asking to be disappointed.

Trading in caches is a test of character. It's obviously a sign of poor character to trade unfairly. But it's also not a very positive sign to allow petty materialism to spoil your enjoyment. Unless you are enjoying the opportunity to judge your fellows and find them wanting. In that case, carry on :huh:

1.1k · February 1, 2006

Lately I have been dropping things and taking nothing, or just TNLNSL.

February 1, 2006

It'd be nice if people traded even or up, but they don't. They won't. And some of you get terribly upset about it. not upset, confused

This is an unnecessary emotional drain. Reforming other people is an exercise in futility. Make peace with human nature. Hunt more difficult caches, be amused by the junk, or ignore trade items altogether. this is the thinking that will keep junk going 2 though, and, this does not drain me, I was curious is all

Attitudinally, you could regard the items you put into caches as no-strings gifts, or be sure to trade items of great kitsch value but little $$ value. The OP mentioned a nice glass vase that was taken and replaced with junk. If the vase was valuable, it didn't make sense to put it into a cache in the first place. You're just asking to be disappointed. no, asking for even trade ... leave something worth a dollar at least, not a golf ball that has a lawn mower gouge out of it. Even the golf course puts those in the garbage! Even, if you have a golf ball, take something equal of value

Trading in caches is a test of character. It's obviously a sign of poor character to trade unfairly. But it's also not a very positive sign to allow petty materialism to spoil your enjoyment. Unless you are enjoying the opportunity to judge your fellows and find them wanting. In that case, carry on its not SPOILING my enjoyment, but annoying, there is a difference. Even trade isn't that hard to figure out.

see bold stuff in quote above

February 1, 2006

It'd be nice if people traded even or up, but they don't. They won't. And some of you get terribly upset about it. not upset, confused

This is an unnecessary emotional drain. Reforming other people is an exercise in futility. Make peace with human nature. Hunt more difficult caches, be amused by the junk, or ignore trade items altogether. this is the thinking that will keep junk going 2 though, and, this does not drain me, I was curious is all

Attitudinally, you could regard the items you put into caches as no-strings gifts, or be sure to trade items of great kitsch value but little $$ value. The OP mentioned a nice glass vase that was taken and replaced with junk. If the vase was valuable, it didn't make sense to put it into a cache in the first place. You're just asking to be disappointed. no, asking for even trade ... leave something worth a dollar at least, not a golf ball that has a lawn mower gouge out of it. Even the golf course puts those in the garbage! Even, if you have a golf ball, take something equal of value

Trading in caches is a test of character. It's obviously a sign of poor character to trade unfairly. But it's also not a very positive sign to allow petty materialism to spoil your enjoyment. Unless you are enjoying the opportunity to judge your fellows and find them wanting. In that case, carry on its not SPOILING my enjoyment, but annoying, there is a difference. Even trade isn't that hard to figure out.

see bold stuff in quote above

Hey, I'm not on the took-heirloom-left-gouged-golfball team. So, you're confused and curious as to why an honor-system trading scheme results in a gradual deterioration of trade goods? What would you like to know about this phenomenon? The reason? If you're on the level, then this is proof of extraterrestrial life, because no human would need to ask that question (other than rhetorically).

February 1, 2006

So, you're confused and curious as to why an honor-system trading scheme results in a gradual deterioration of trade goods?

Because mean people suck. :huh:

2.1k · February 1, 2006

Interesting quoting style there :huh:

not upset, confused

I don't see what's so confusing about it. Even with everyone trading what they consider 'equally' people are bound to assign different values to different items. Generally I imagine that most people assign a higher value to what they have in hand than what it might technically be 'worth' in the wild. Like the broken sunglasses example. Now I'm willing to bet that they weren't broken when they got put in there, so they were probably 'brand new' items. Someone paid maybe $2->$3 for them (Canadian). They are looking through the cache, and they see something they think is kind of neat, and have no qualms about trading.

The sunglasses go in to the box, and the next finder, even assuming they weren't broken,

a) doesn't know they were new

Isn't necessarily the target for them, and sees them as 'junk' (even though someone spent a few bucks on them).

eventually the sunglasses break, and are of no value to anyone what so ever, so overall, even though everyone has traded fairly, or even traded up, the value of the cache goes down.

Golf balls can be a similar thing. I know more than one kid who loves to play with golf balls, and it has nothing to do with their monetary value. Personally I suspect that most of these are 'found on the way to the cache', and not necessarily trade items. In the few cases where they are traded for, its probably mostly a general 'junk for junk' kind of thing, but what you see as junk and what I see as junk are different, so again, the cache value can easily go down.

this is the thinking that will keep junk going 2 though, and, this does not drain me, I was curious is all

My personal feeling is that *most* people trade what they consider to be equal, but they don't necessarily know what 'equal' is. They tend to over value what they have, and undervalue what is in the cache.

Another point to consider is why they are trading at all. If they didn't want what was there more than what they had, then they probably wouldn't be trading. Now they may on one level see what they have as 'equal value' to what is traded, but they probably are thinking of 'equal value' to one particular group of people. What tends to stick in caches then are the items that have a smaller and smaller minority interest, and then eventually are of interest to *almost* no one (like the golf balls).

no, asking for even trade ... leave something worth a dollar at least, not a golf ball that has a lawn mower gouge out of it. Even the golf course puts those in the garbage! Even, if you have a golf ball, take something equal of value

Again, it comes down to how one assigns value. Obviously you place little to no value on a used dirty old golf ball. The person who put the mower gouged ball in there might have thought it looked neat, and maybe some kid would like to see it. (maybe wondered what had happend to it. Just because some segment of the population will throw something out, doesn't mean that it is valueless to everyone.

its not SPOILING my enjoyment, but annoying, there is a difference. Even trade isn't that hard to figure out.

Personally I think its *very* hard to figure out, and I think the errors will tend to be as I said, towards overvalue of what you have, and undervalue of what you want.

So if an even trade is so easy to figure out, what is worth more, a laser pointer, or a pair of plastic sunglasses?

The dollar value of the two at the local dollar store is identical, but I bet you never would have complained to see a laser pointer in a cache.

1.1k · February 1, 2006

My 12 year old niece LOVES the swag you folks call junk. She will take her one item and play and play and play and play with it until it breaks. If I feel the contents are not "great" I will TNLNSL and be glad there was a cache there and that I found it.

February 1, 2006

Hey Folks,

My wife and I are new at this but enjoy the addition to our walks. Like many here I was at first puzzle dby the items left until I remembered "treasured items" of our sons. Some were downright embarrasing but they wouldn't part w/ them until a truly worthy cause came up. So, Also remembering this is a family deal here folks, I now take joy in seeing what is left and think instead of the child that left it behind. If it may be a little worn or damp I may take it out and leave something in it's place. My signature Items came in yesterday, cast aluminum safety whistle keychains I got online for .50cents if you bought 100. Kids will love them and adults can use them if they hike in the woods as we do. And like was pointed out earlier, if you go for 5/5's, you probably won't find Mc toys. My $0.02 :huh:

38.2k · February 1, 2006

So if an even trade is so easy to figure out, what is worth more, a laser pointer, or a pair of plastic sunglasses?

I don't think we really need totally even trades. It's ridiculious to worry about the relative value of each item. As long as we're not taking the real nice stuff and leaving garbage I think we're good. I wouldn't have an issue with someone who takes an $8 Mini Mag Lite and leaves a $4 gluegun. Its the ones who take the Mag Lite and leave a broken McToy that are the issue.

Edited February 1, 2006 by briansnat

2.4k · February 1, 2006

Its the ones who take the Mag Lite and leave a broken McToy that are the issue.

Exactly. It's the "broken" that's the issue, not even the "McToy". Nothing wrong with a McToy in a cache -- kids like them, and they can be a great source for potential travel bugs. But not if their heads have been chewed off and two of the wheels are missing.

If it's broken, or damaged, or expired, or otherwise yucky, just throw it away. Don't put it in a cache.

2.1k · February 1, 2006

...be amused by the junk...

I like it. I really like it.

February 1, 2006

...be amused by the junk...

I like it. I really like it.

I once found a cache entirely filled with broken Barbie parts--that's entertainment.

February 1, 2006

If it's broken, or damaged, or expired, or otherwise yucky, just throw it away. Don't put it in a cache.

That's what I refer to as a don't-spit-on-the-floor sign. The term is based on philosophical reflection I had while riding the bus one day. I saw a sign that said "Don't Spit on the Floor." My first thought was, "who needs to be told not to spit on the floor?!" Second thought was "This is a bus--there are worse places to spit on the floor, so why don't they have signs? It'd be horrible if you spat on the floor in the dining room of the Ritz Carlton, but I'll bet there's no sign."

Moral of the story--the people who need to be told are beyond listening. And no one else needs to be told. The only reforms that are possible are within yourself.

February 1, 2006

Just won a big auction of American flag patches. Over 100 patches, so guess what will be left for awhile. I think this will be my sig item from now on

February 1, 2006

I agree...enough with the junk people! At least have the morals to TNLN.

While we quickly learned not to expect much out of the trade items, it's rough when you are taking along newbies. Especially newbies with children. Gee, that was fun, we walked all that way and got dirty for a box of trash. WooHoo!

Thank you to all trade-downers who have ruined the hopes and dreams of children around the world!

February 2, 2006

ruined the hopes and dreams of children around the world!

I hope that's sarcasm. If it is, :rolleyes: .

If it's not....

1.3k · February 2, 2006

While we quickly learned not to expect much out of the trade items, it's rough when you are taking along newbies. Especially newbies with children. Gee, that was fun, we walked all that way and got dirty for a box of trash. WooHoo!

We take newbie kids out pretty often. If we don't find any items worth trading, we leave a few and I let the kids take something out of my swag bag at the end of the day. This usually works pretty well.

February 2, 2006

Gee, that was fun, we walked all that way and got dirty for a box of trash. WooHoo!

Uh, the excitement of hunting for the cache and the novelty of finding it count for nothing? Couldn't you just drive 'em to the Dollar Store if they were looking for inexpensive knick-knacks? You can do that without getting too dirty nine times outta ten.

February 2, 2006

Just hide micros and hunt micros. Not any micro though, just the ones just big enough to hold the logbook, then the trading down becomes a non issue. :rolleyes:

February 2, 2006

Let's say you're headed on a trip north, and spot a TB which is going your way. Good to grab it and help it out, or would you have to trade a TB for it? Also there have been times that I've forgotten my pack, and left $1 in place of a cache item (not any items worth more than $1 tho lol). Bad practice or good improv?

Edited February 2, 2006 by johndmann

February 2, 2006

Let's say you're headed on a trip north, and spot a TB which is going your way. Good to grab it and help it out, or would you have to trade a TB for it? Also there have been times that I've forgotten my pack, and left $1 in place of a cache item (not any items worth more than $1 tho lol). Bad practice or good improv?

That's just a good conscience! :rolleyes:

February 2, 2006

When my wife and I first started caching we were excited about the "stuff." It seemed that you would be leaving a part of yourself behind for somebody to get and you would be taking something that was part of someone else.

Pretty quickly we decided to TNLN. For us it is about the hike, or the hide, or the history, or the puzzle or the people.

But it isn't about the stuff.

That is what happened to us. I can't remember the last time we took anything. Lately I don't even bring anything with me to trade since all we find is McToys or garbage.

February 2, 2006

OK. Newbie here. First cache I found today (and first cache I've ever found!) had stuff in it. I took a plastic paratrooper, and the only thing I could find in the Jeep to leave was a golf ball I had in the center console :rolleyes: Oh well. Now I know golf balls aren't appreciated by everyone. I happen to like golf though, so it does have some value to me. Newbie mistake.

Dan

Bowling Green, KY

February 2, 2006

I think range balls are the golf balls at issue here. A good golf ball is nice swag. I would consider it a "trade up" for a paratrooper.

February 2, 2006

I cache with my grandchildren and I always leave something nice for what we have taken, but usually our youngest grandchild parts with her dear treasures that just might be a torn or ragged item. It is tresure to her and she is parting with something dear to her and of most value to her. It was so precious to her she was sharing. I do not have the heart to remove her chosen item. So I include plenty of good swag to accompany it, but the next finder might view her torn flower with disdain not realizing that the leather key chain or the pocket compass where also the items left by us. When I have the grandaughters I do not have timeto write lenthy logs telling of her treasure. This might explain some of the disdainful items

This makes total sense and is probably the major reason for most of the complaints. If it is one of our caches and is just totally broken, we take it when looking after our hides. If someone doesnt like seeing it in there, just leave it where you found it and let the cache owners decide what to do with it.

February 2, 2006

We started out with the anticipation of going out and finding caches. It was a way of doing something for the family, mom, dad, 6yr old daughter and our 14yr old dog.

We started getting some swag together, and before we knew it, we had to get a new bag for all the swag we had... Walmart is a dangerous place for me... :rolleyes:

When we hit the trails, and find the caches, we try always to trade even, but mostly we try to trade up. Seeing as our 6yr old likes the little goodies inside, most often it is a trade up...

We like getting out, getting in the Geovan and driving, finding a nice spot, looking for the cache, signing the log, and not having to spend $50.00 in some movie theater, with mounds of popcorn and tubs of soft drinks.... every weekend!

Practise trade even or up... but remember to enjoy yourself. How long will these fairly inexpensive outings last?

My 2 cents.

2.1k · February 2, 2006

Gee, that was fun, we walked all that way and got dirty for a box of trash. WooHoo!

And isn't it odd that so many people carry so much junk around with them?

We've all seen here, many times, the list of useless stuff found in caches. I can't ever recall leaving the house with a pocket full of such junk let alone even having it in the house. Where do people find this stuff and what makes them actually bring it to a cache?

I think I now know how California met the mandate to reduce solid waste by 50%. "No, no, dear. We can't through that in the trash we've got a mandate to meet. Put it in the geocaching bucket!"

February 2, 2006

I just started geocaching with my kids last weekend. They love junk! :lol:

The best part of the day was when my son found an old travel alarm clock. Those older than 30 will remember these - a wind up alarm clock that folds down into a hard plastic case. While probably not "junk", it's not overly interesting to many. He loves it! He keeps it on the table where he does his homework.

My daughter is going to be a bag-lady when she grows up. She'll save just about ANYTHING. She would probably love a pair of broken sun glasses. :lol:

I did see a receipt in one cache though, no clue what that was for. Of course there is one thing to remember - perhaps some of the junk was left by non-cachers! Someone finds it, reads the info sheet and thinks they are being funny by sticking junk in. Never know...

You can see my son holding the above mentioned clock here.

-al

February 2, 2006

And isn't it odd that so many people carry so much junk around with them?

I think some of them don't go out and buy anything good, or want to get rid of their good stuff at home. They probably just sift through the junk in the back seat or something.

Also, people have said that you should leave something that is meaningful to you. Well, children go on these cache hunts too - They might cherish their McToy more than anything in the world! (at least for the moment :lol: )

What _I_ don't like finding in caches are rocks! Why would people put a rock in the cache? And I don't mean a pretty polished stone - These are junk rocks from the ground. hehe

I've been known to put some quality golf balls in a cache from time to time - but very seldom. I golf, and have them lying around in the truck (no, never a range ball!), and when I foget my pack or have a spur of the moment cache away from home, I just grab a good golf ball to take with me. These things aren't cheap! ($1 or more a piece!)

What do I like to see in a cache? I've taken to collecting the little plastic frogs. Not sure who puts them in there in my area, but I'm starting to amass a large collection of them :lol: I think they're cute, and they are slowly covering my computer desk at home

February 2, 2006

If one is in it for the swag, you will end in disappointment. If you have younger children with you, always bring a couple of items you can slip in there so they'll be happy.

Off to North Slope and attempt to get that FTF prize and hopefully meet another cacher on the same mission.... :lol:

MS

38.2k · February 2, 2006

This is what was left in a cache of mine when I archived it (everything but the logbook):

Not the same cache, but this is what my similar sized caches typically look like when they go out:

Edited February 2, 2006 by briansnat

2.4k · February 2, 2006

Let's say you're headed on a trip north, and spot a TB which is going your way. Good to grab it and help it out, or would you have to trade a TB for it?

Travel bugs are totally separate from trade items, so, no, you don't need to trade a bug for bug. If you see one in a cache and can help it, feel free to take it whether or not you have anything to leave.

(This works the other way, too: if you see a trade item in a cache that you want, you shouldn't take it and leave just a travel bug in its place. You should leave a trade item for it.)

Also there have been times that I've forgotten my pack, and left $1 in place of a cache item (not any items worth more than $1 tho lol). Bad practice or good improv?

I've seen that done occasionally, and don't see anything wrong with it at all. Dollar bills don't expire, and someone will appreciate it :lol:

February 2, 2006

Off to North Slope and attempt to get that FTF prize and hopefully meet another cacher on the same mission....

And the FTF prize is mine!!! :lol: ... $11.95 gift certificate!!! almost as good as the hides and the hike. :lol: MS

1.1k · February 2, 2006

Let's say you're headed on a trip north, and spot a TB which is going your way. Good to grab it and help it out, or would you have to trade a TB for it? Also there have been times that I've forgotten my pack, and left $1 in place of a cache item (not any items worth more than $1 tho lol). Bad practice or good improv?

You do not have to trade TB for TB. If there's one in the cache and you can help it then take it. If you happen to have one you can drop off that's a bonus. I, too, have left some $$$ in a cache when I saw something I really wanted and didn't have a suitable trade.

3.2k · February 2, 2006

When I started out I always traded. Now I don't usually trade but sometimes I still do. One day I decided to take any cash I found in the cache. I collected a total of $4.50 that day. I left around $15 worth of stuff. I pretty much always trade up if I'm trading. A couple of weeks ago I took two quarters out of a cache and left a mid-sized etch-a-sketch that probably cost $4 or so. I also carry small stuff such as a little baggie with multiple erasers or sealed post-it notes or gold dollars. Sometimes I just leave one because I feel like it and don't take anything at all. If I find a cache that I like but the swag is looking pretty slim I'll drop a few items into it for the next cachers to find. It's a lot cheaper than cigarettes or whatever else folks spend their money on and it gives me a lift to help the cache out.

February 2, 2006

Off to North Slope and attempt to get that FTF prize and hopefully meet another cacher on the same mission....

And the FTF prize is mine!!! ... $11.95 gift certificate!!! almost as good as the hides and the hike. MS

WAY TO GO!

:lol:

February 2, 2006

From a very recent cache log:

"took dollar left canadian nickel"

:lol:

February 2, 2006

"took dollar left canadian nickel"

Pfft, the exchange rate's not THAT off!

February 2, 2006

From a very recent cache log:

"took dollar left canadian nickel"

February 2, 2006

Part of the problem is the large number of caches that are placed by some individual members. They have so many out there that they can't keep any eye on them.

Now, I don't blame them because I appreciate the fact that they are placing caches to find. And they are generous enough to load up the cache when it is first placed. But when geocaching was newer, there were fewer caches put out by individuals and they could spend some more time maintaining them.

February 2, 2006

...be amused by the junk...

I like it. I really like it.

I once found a cache entirely filled with broken Barbie parts--that's entertainment.

I have no idea why I found this so amusing. That's actually a really neat and funny cache experience!

2.1k · February 2, 2006

But when geocaching was newer, there were fewer caches put out by individuals and they could spend some more time maintaining them.

That is not my experience from the "old days" of late 2001, 2002 & 2003. For most of the early caches we visited container condition was about the same as today: cache gets placed, contents degrade, tupperware and sometime ammo cans get damp, junk left in cache starts to get moldy.

A few people maintained most of their caches frequently, or so I'm told. Many people maintained their caches occasionally (my method) and many others maintained none of their caches.

It didn't seem to matter how many caches people placed. There were plenty of 1 to 10 placement cache owners who never maintained the caches. There were big-numbers placers (20 to 40!) that were responsive to calls for help. All about the same as today.

And back then, as now, many cache finders would do a little maintenance on caches that need attention: dry out the container when its wet, discard "true" junk, try to wipe off mold on "good" items, supply a new ziploc for the logbook, maybe add some stuff (not mandatory) and occasionally replace a broken or missing container. Not every cache and not all the time but whenever time and paper towels/napkins allowed.

February 2, 2006

Actually I am still amazed at the quality of most things you find in a cache. At first I thought that they would be really trivial things but most aren't. Mostly, I look at the things in the cache and try to figure out what the significance is. Many seem to have some history to them. For example I just found GCRYTR (Cachin' in the Rain) today and it was filled with Boy Scout items for the most part. That's really cool. It tells you something about the cache owner or the people who found it recently. So the quality doesn't really matter.

February 2, 2006

Actually I am still amazed at the quality of most things you find in a cache.

What I've put in a couple of caches is Disney's Virtual Magic Kingdom cards. These cards can be used in the game to get items. You can only get these cards from the Disney parks - so they are kind of cool to get.

I'm trying to teach my kids that they need to leave good stuff, because that's what they'd want to find.

-al

February 3, 2006

My son and I don't trade, we stick with TNLNSL. This hobby is more about spending time together and having fun to us.

February 4, 2006

"What _I_ don't like finding in caches are rocks! Why would people put a rock in the cache? And I don't mean a pretty polished stone - These are junk rocks from the ground. hehe"

when ever I take my kids anywhere, Fishing, out for a walk, brothers for dinner they are sure to come home with at least 1 rock in their pocket, and you better believe it is worth something to them. (known firsthand by the amount of crying untill it is found if lost)

February 4, 2006

My son always has to "settle" for something else if a cache doesn't have a dirty old golf ball in it. Those are what he lives for finding in a cache, but he's two. (Although, we always trade WAY up for it.)

What I can't stand is when cachers feel that a bunch of little items equal one nicer item in a trade.

February 4, 2006

Me and my wife just got started and have only done 10 caches but, we were introduced to the sport by her dad and we always trade up is there is trade items. Also, we have started leaving more different objects like soft squeak toys for dogs. and mini pens. they arent very valuable but hey one of our favorite geo caching helpers is a lab and it would be nice to find something for him . Also we have put all of our cache items in ziploc baggies so our hot wheels cars dont turn into rusted peices of tetnus... I think a few people need to be a little more honest or we are going to start losing alot of good players. but hey thats one cahers opinion.

February 4, 2006

I was out today placing a new cache and decided to visit an existing cahce of mine, Throne of Kaidoz, to see whether the swag contents had deteriorated to junk status. "Throne" has been in place for about 15 months and requires an easy 1-mile hike to reach. It's had about a dozen visitors.

Long story short, the contents have appreciated in value since placement. This is in line with caching experience; the quick-and-easy caches go bad fast while the more challenging caches do not.

Current contents of "Throne's" cache:

$1 million dollar bill, 10,000 Iraqi Dinars, three bucks, a gold Kokopelli, Audubon field guide to rocks, The Dog plush toy, cache decals, 4WD truck toy, BIG screwdriver, bootlace locks, chips clip, guy-wire clamp, and some kinda military ribbon.

I'll grant that a couple items are odd (the screwdriver and guy-wire clamp), but hey--they're probably useful to somebody.

Pure Junk ,,, Why Leave It?

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