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Garmin 60csx Observations


Didjerrydo

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Had my 60csx out today as well the best accuracy I can get is 10-12 feet.  With my 60cs I had accuracy of 2-3 feet most of the time. I was just wondering perhaps that may have been a false accuracy.  With the new sat. rec. perhaps this accuracy is closer even thou it is reading 10-12 feet

As I said, I never got accuracy better then 12-14 feet with my 60CS, but thats in Europe -

Usually you can't get EGNOS signal here (at least with Garmin).

 

Anyway, accurancy of 2-3 feet seems wrong to me - thats 60cm accuracy!

Thats much better then Garmin's specs!

 

Batnun

 

those 5 decimals for each degree, at the latitude of 45 degrees where I live, will provide an 1.2 meters resolution (that men 4 feet). no matter how good is the accuracy, if resolution have only 5 decimals, an 2-3 feet accuracy shown on gps is fake (unless you are close to north or south pole, but I haven't experience that). you need an extra decimal to be shown in order to have a better resolution, so only then we can talk about accuracy less then 4 feets (if that will ever happen).

 

this is like someone have only indications for hour and minute on it's mechanical watch and is trying to figure out it's watch seconds accuracy.

he will be close to...., but never sure about.

 

I've used to see 4-5 meters (12 to 15 feet) accuracy on eTrex Legend and on GPS V. I've got 2meters (6 feet) on GPS V only when EGNOS was active.

 

I'm taking tracks and points for RO.A.D. (garmin map of Romania, you can check www.romaniadigitala.ro, but only romanian language not english), so i've tried to get the best from my gps on the laptop placed on the right seat.

filtered the track for each second, at every red-light i've got a terrible jam of the track. filtered the track for 5meters, tracks got more accurate (without garbage). ofcourse traveling high speed spots got only at 10, 15, 20 meters and so on.

 

to have 3 to 5 meters (10 to 15 feet) accuracy is fine even for geocaching. the gain I would expect from SIRF is fast acquiring of satellites, and tracking signal in bad coverage situation.

hope i'll have soon an GPSMAP60 CSX.

 

best regards,

Dan

Edited by danal70
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Danal is right. The issue is not so much the accuracy, although that is better, but the ability to see satellites when the older units can't even get a lock or hold it well. Although I'm not using an x model, I am using a Sirf III in my PPC. Driving down the canyons of Manhattan, with the unit inside the car (no external antenna) I was consistentaly getting 5-7 satellites while my old Vista could not lock on coordiunates at all. Only twice did I momentarily lose the sats with the Sirf III. but regained them as I hit the intersection.

 

Once the leaves come out in the spring, I'm expecting to see (and x models should also) the same kind of results in the woods.

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Mr. Grimm  Posted on Jan 27 2006, 09:26 PM

 

(lostinthewoods @ Jan 27 2006, 08:51 PM)

Pick the NiMH/NiCd setting. They have a discharge curve nearly identical to Li-Fe cells.

 

BTW, how is the battery life? The manual was depressing. That short life time was the main reason I *didn't* buy one.

 

Cheers,

David

 

Short Life? According to everything I have read, the battery life in the 60Cx is like 30hrs... How is this short?

 

Grimm-

 

David is right, at least if Garmin knows what they're printing. The Cx is stated to have 18 hours batterytime, just like the CSx. However, the data has been wrong before... Is 18 h really "depressing"? From people I have spoken to, 18 or 20 h is more than you need, especially if you have a pack of extra cells just in case. Besides, I haven't read any other complaints at all (I think) about the somewhat shortened batterylife in the x-models, at least not in this thread.

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I am glad to see that most people are pleased with the new 60CSx, I got mine via ups and put new batteries in it, the screen came on, for about 2 min, then faded out, and that was it.... :D Could not get it function any more, tried other batteries, hooked it up in the truck via lighter cable,, nothing. Called GPS city and they said to send it back, must be a defective unit...Oh well, will wait for another B) Guess it will be nice when a good one arrives B)

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I am glad to see that most people are pleased with the new 60CSx, I got mine via ups and put new batteries in it, the screen came on, for about 2 min, then faded out, and that was it.... :D Could not get it function any more, tried other batteries, hooked it up in the truck via lighter cable,, nothing. Called GPS city and they said to send it back, must be a defective unit...Oh well, will wait for another :D Guess it will be nice when a good one arrives :)

that depends, were they lithium batteries, If you read a few more of the threads you will find that this seems to be a known problem with Lithium batteries.

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I have observed on my new 60CX a "delay", or "lag" in the auto-routing beeps (prompts). I had both my 60C and new 60CX auto-routing together to compare. My CX seems to wait a lot longer to give a beep to alert for an upcoming turn, then beeps again almost right at the turn. My 60C gives much more lead time with both beeps. Also, the CX seems to have a lower volume on the tones than my C. Anyone else notice this?

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I have observed on my new 60CX a "delay", or "lag" in the auto-routing beeps (prompts). I had both my 60C and new 60CX auto-routing together to compare. My CX seems to wait a lot longer to give a beep to alert for an upcoming turn, then beeps again almost right at the turn. My 60C gives much more lead time with both beeps. Also, the CX seems to have a lower volume on the tones than my C. Anyone else notice this?

can't say the same for mine. Although I am first time C owner.

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Also, I think I'll add to this thread my list of observations of the new 60 CSx which I used extensively this weekend. (Keep in mind I upgraded from an Etrex Yellow, so some qualms may just be native of the 60 line. Maybe newbies might find this helpful in trying to figure out what the best unit is for them.):

 

Reception:

-Kept lock at good accuracy (20-25ft) in virtually all conditions, including heavy tree cover. Although I have yet to gain under 10ft. accuracy anywhere, including places where my yellow Etrex achieved under 10ft.

 

-Incredibly fast lock (>15 sec.)

 

-Getting 20ft. accuracy in my house, 10ft. from window (at a side obscured by trees). Got locks in virtually every indoor scenario thus far. In fact, I think I've only seen the low visibility screen once, and before i could pick an option, got a lock.

 

UI:

-Fairly intuitive. Got around menus and options pretty quickly. Although I wish it would have custom universal setting sets that would affect all options across the board. Right now, if I wanted to plan a trip to New Hampshire, park the car, grab lunch around a town, then go hiking in the afternoon, that would require several button pushes to get the optimal settings for driving, walking around a town, and hiking in the woods.

 

-For driving, Setup Map>Orientation>Track Up is pretty useful. However, when Hiking, the direction cursor "jumps" and jiggles the map around with it...Extremely disorienting esp. at low zooms.

 

-Tracks saved or real time were very thin and difficult to see. (I miss those wide track lines in the Etrex, in huge fields of nothingness :D)

 

-Miss the Alpha Index Tabs in the old Etrex. You have to be cognizant of using icons as that seems to be the best way to categorize WP.

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However, when Hiking, the direction cursor "jumps" and jiggles the map around with it...Extremely disorienting esp. at low zooms.

 

Do you have the electronic compass on? I fornd on my 60cs turning the compass off sloved that problem.

 

Rick

Edited by rstickle
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The icons are identical (almost) to my Legend C, so to me, it's business as usual.

 

I just want an alarm clock added in and a fix for the mystical wandering cursor..

 

Oh, I also want to be able to turn off the trip computer... as I don't really find it useful unless it's tied to turning on tracks.

 

A memory card status/usage meter would be nice too!

 

As would an option for lithium batteries.

 

5 relatively minor 'fixes' and this unit would be perfect.

 

(6 if you count removing the item refering to Temperature from the 60Cx.)

Not sure what the alarm clock would get you if you can't hear it. Have turn by turn beeping to make my turns, but so low that if you are in conversation, you won't hear it. I certainly wouldn't wake up to that!! No volume control...

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I have had trouble with my GPSmap 60csx and nroute. I have City select Europe V7 loaded. In nRoute the 60csx is recognised, the satellited picked up but no navigation. I have clicked "keep vessel visible". I have contacted Garmin but they had no suggestions.

This is a known problem that Garmin is already working on resolving. The new 60/76C/CSx models have a modified USB interface protocol that doesn't work correctly with nRoute. There should be a new version of either nRoute or the 60/76'x' model firmware to resolve the issue. No availability date yet though.

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The *shape* of the discharge curve is very similar, but the actual voltages are not. The Energizer lithiums start out around 1.7V, stay steady at about 1.6V, and are almost dead by the time they drop down to 1.3V. OTOH, NiCd and NiMH cells start at about 1.3V and stay steady at about 1.2V until falling off rapidly at the end.

You are completely correct. Slipped my mind. Good catch.

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Short Life?  According to everything I have read, the battery life in the 60Cx is like 30hrs...  How is this short?

GPSMAP60Cx manual page 74 says expected battery life is 18 hours. While for the 60C it's 30 and the 60, it's 28.

Then all the sellers of the unit are misrepresenting the hardware. As an example, from the lakepowell website

 

<snip>

....

# LED backlit display and keypad

# Battery life: up to 30 hours using two AA alkaline batteries

# Includes a built-in Americas autoroute basemap with automatic routing capabilities, including highways, exits, and tide data (U.S. only)

etc...

"

 

<end>

 

This is the description every retailer I have looked at has up for the 60Cx. I am not singling out lakepowell..

 

Grimm-

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Well, this can be tricky. If you look in the manual for the new Vista Cx, it says that the unit's supposed to have 32 h of batterytime. (Same as the Legend Cx.) The retailers, however, state that it only goes for 20 hours. The probable reason for this is that Garmin made a "paste-error" and used the Legend's value twice.

 

I don't know if this explains the 60Cx-case, they may have mixed it up with the 60CSx's value?

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Well, this can be tricky. If you look in the manual for the new Vista Cx, it says that the unit's supposed to have 32 h of batterytime. (Same as the Legend Cx.) The retailers, however, state that it only goes for 20 hours. The probable reason for this is that Garmin made a "paste-error" and used the Legend's value twice.

 

I don't know if this explains the 60Cx-case, they may have mixed it up with the 60CSx's value?

Ahh.. but which is right? The manual or the Sites? Anyone have any real-life feedback?

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Reception:

-Kept lock at good accuracy (20-25ft) in virtually all conditions, including heavy tree cover. Although I have yet to gain under 10ft. accuracy anywhere, including places where my yellow Etrex achieved under 10ft.

 

Sketchy--Do you have WAAS enabled and are you getting differential indications (the little D on the satellite bar)?

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Reception:

-Kept lock at good accuracy (20-25ft) in virtually all conditions, including heavy tree cover. Although I have yet to gain under 10ft. accuracy anywhere, including places where my yellow Etrex achieved under 10ft.

 

Sketchy--Do you have WAAS enabled and are you getting differential indications (the little D on the satellite bar)?

Yes, WAAS is always enabled. I get a signal but no lock on 35. I do have diff., although not very often (and I keep mine on a lot).

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I'd like to add an observation I made today using my Map 60CX. I was using our Trimble Pathfinder ProXR (DGPS) sub-meter GPSr to locate light pole bases in a large open parking lot. I carried my 60CX to take companion shots to run my own little accuracy test. The conditions were close to ideal and my 60CX was WAAS enabled and was receiving corrections. My indicated EPE was around +/- 10' to +/- 14' during my test.

 

I located 56 light bases with both units, recording waypoints at the same time which each. Every waypoint from my 60CX was within 12 feet of the sub-meter Trimble's determined positions! Most were within 4' to 6'!

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I am glad to see that most people are pleased with the new 60CSx, I got mine via ups and put new batteries in it, the screen came on, for about 2 min, then faded out, and that was it....  ;)    Could not get it function any more, tried other batteries,  hooked it up in the truck via lighter cable,,  nothing.  Called GPS city and they said to send it back, must be a defective unit...Oh well, will wait for another  :rolleyes:    Guess it will be nice when a good one arrives  ;)

that depends, were they lithium batteries, If you read a few more of the threads you will find that this seems to be a known problem with Lithium batteries.

Nope, using alkaline batteries, several sets, even used my power cable for the car, had one for my 60CS, still nothing, I had Garmin on the phone, he had me try several things, finally he said, the unit was just a dud, , but on the lithium, I use them in my 60CS with no problem, are they going to be a problem with the 60CSx???

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but on the lithium, I use them in my 60CS with no problem, are they going to be a problem with the 60CSx???

Several people have reported that their 60Cx/CSx units have an over-voltage detector that's a bit too sensitive when using brand-new Energizer lithium cells. These start out at about 1.75 V when new and some of the 60Cx/CSx units decide that's too high and shut down. A workaround is to use the cells in some other device for a few minutes which is enough to drop the voltage a bit - and then they work fine. Garmin has been made aware of the problem but I haven't heard of a resolution yet. Hope they can modify the high voltage threshold just a bit higher in firmware since that would be by far the easiest fix.

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Yes, WAAS is always enabled. I get a signal but no lock on 35.

Garmin users will not be able to get a "lock" on satellite 35 for the next few months while it is being moved. That's because the ranging functions have been turned off for the move. Fear not, the WAAS corrections are still being transmitted and used.

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I guess it’s my turn to chime in with my two cents about the new Garmin GPSMAP60CSx. I received my new “toy” last Tuesday after owning the Garmin GPS III plus for many years. My first impressions were that it was a huge step forward. So here are my observations:

 

Pros:

 

Nice color screen, easy to read in bright conditions.

 

Quick reception/acquisition of satellites, and continued lock-on, even in heavily wooded areas, is very, very impressive. I even walked around inside a large store/warehouse (with a high ceiling and large glass store front) and my tracks on the map page were extremely accurate. I tried this in another store, just for fun, but ended up losing reception. It had a much lower ceiling and no glass store front.

 

Barometer appears to be extremely accurate. I have a weather station at home and it is always within .01Hg.

 

Extremely accurate as far as position. But I guess that’s the purpose of a GPS.

 

Cons:

 

The “wandering around” problem. The GPS seems to think it’s moving even when it is at a full stop. Example: If you set the GPS down and watch the trip odometer it can actually register a movement of up to ½ mile (or more) after about an hour. Garmin needs to address this issue immediately and it needs to be their first priority. Like many other people I spent hundreds of dollars on a GPS for accuracy. Another problem I have noticed is on the odometer page, the “moving time” will immediately start advancing once it registers a movement (i.e. greater than 0.0) however once you stop (i.e. speed is showing 0.0), stopped time does not begin advancing. It may be that the “wandering problem” and this issue are related – which I am being told by Garmin ultimately relates to the sensitivity of the SIRF chip.

 

Basemap, as far as highways, is non-existent. The major interstates and major highways are shown, but my 5 year old Garmin GPS III plus had a much better basemap. I guess its Garmin’s way of making you purchase their extra maps – which I have done.

 

Real time tracking will not work. I have seen this issue reported on this forum and I know other people are having the same problem. This appears to be a problem with all programs - nroute, and all third party programs. It will transfer maps, waypoints etc, but will not real time track. I have spoken with Garmin and they have not heard of this being a problem. I guess we need to all speak up.

 

I have contacted Garmin, by phone, twice, on some of these issues this week. The first representative was not aware of the wandering problem. The second representative said they had a meeting that morning about the issue and was told that the engineers are working to resolve the “wandering” issue in the next firmware update.

 

Summary:

 

My primary purpose for the upgrade to the new 60CSx was because of the increased sensitivity and reception due to the SIRF chip. My favorite pastime is hiking, and over the years I have always lost satellite reception once I entered the woods. This should no longer be a problem, so ultimately I am very satisfied with the new product.

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Just installed and fully loaded a 512mb card into my 60csx. Now whenever I select a POI through the find menu beit a waypoint or whatever, selecting "setup map" through the menu causes the the gps to fade out and die. WTF? Reinstalling the origonal 64mb card clears this problem. What the point of extra memory if the unit cannot handle it (even with the firmware update)? :o

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My CX seems to wait a lot longer to give a beep to alert for an upcoming turn, then beeps again almost right at the turn.

Isn't that a setting?

Boy, I don't think so. I can sure change the "tones", but can't find a way to change the timing or the loudness.

 

Did you ever find a way to change this? I am looking for the solution also.

 

Grimm-

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Did you ever find a way to change this? I am looking for the solution also.

Grimm-

 

No, I have not. I emailed Garmin (at: techsupp@garmin.com) and got this reply on my comments/questions regarding lead-time beeps and volume:

 

"Thank you for contacting Garmin,

 

You wrote to the right place, I'll pass your letter to the engineers. Some

of the difference between 'lead times' will be attributed to using v6/v7.

But the volume settings on the beeps they'll want to hear about."

 

Best regards,

 

Carl Huffman

Product Support Specialist

Garmin International

1200 E. 151st Street

Olathe, KS 66062

Ph. 1-800-800-1020

Fax 1-913-440-5488

www.Garmin.com

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Did you ever find a way to change this? I am looking for the solution also.

Grimm-

 

No, I have not. I emailed Garmin (at: techsupp@garmin.com) and got this reply on my comments/questions regarding lead-time beeps and volume:

 

"Thank you for contacting Garmin,

 

You wrote to the right place, I'll pass your letter to the engineers. Some

of the difference between 'lead times' will be attributed to using v6/v7.

But the volume settings on the beeps they'll want to hear about."

 

Best regards,

 

Carl Huffman

Product Support Specialist

Garmin International

1200 E. 151st Street

Olathe, KS 66062

Ph. 1-800-800-1020

Fax 1-913-440-5488

www.Garmin.com

 

Oh, way to go Garmin.. Talk about side-stepping the question.. Love how they never actually answered the question of how to change the distance between beeps... Ahh well.. I am sure some geek geocacher will figure it out and let us know.. :ph34r:

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I am glad to see that most people are pleased with the new 60CSx, I got mine via ups and put new batteries in it, the screen came on, for about 2 min, then faded out, and that was it.... :o Could not get it function any more, tried other batteries, hooked it up in the truck via lighter cable,, nothing. Called GPS city and they said to send it back, must be a defective unit...Oh well, will wait for another :lol: Guess it will be nice when a good one arrives :ph34r:

 

I had almost the same problem:

 

The unit came. I took it out of the package.

Used new alkaline batteries. Everything was OK. Then after plugging in the USB cable and copying some POIs on the 60cx storage card I wanted to shut off the 60cx. I pressed the power/on button and the light of the display went up. The display control was visible for some seconds, the sentence "external power source" appeared at the screen and after that the unit switched off and I am not longer able to switch it on. It is dead.

 

I think there is a huge bug in the Power Management of the 60cx because I read on some other forum similar error report:

---------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Bob Denton am 26.01.06 in alt.sattelite.gps:

 

New 60Cx fried!

The 60Cx was acting strange out of the box. It would power down during

zoom up or zoom downs on the map. Garmin suggested a reset, which

seemsd to work. Then after a couple of days Idecided to load some more

maps and plugged it into the PC using the USB port.

 

A mysterious glowing dot appeared on the screen and got bigger and

bigger, along with the old burning chip smell and some crackling.

 

I quickly powered down and removed the batteries, which were hot, very

hot.

 

Now the unit won't power up, although it does work on the USB power (I

suppose I could strap it to a laptop) and the burn in the LCD makes

for an interesting landmark.

 

This is my 6th or 7th new Garmin and first out of the box failure

 

If your new Cx powers down by itself, beware and send it back.

 

Cya

Bob Denton

Blue Ridge Art & Graphics

www.blueridge-signs.com

 

 

--------------------------------------------------

 

Best regards Mungo

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I have noticed that exact same "delay" when using my 76Cx. As a small, unscientific test I put both of my units on my dash (76C & 76Cx), loaded with City Select 7. I picked a couple of Waypoints and started driving around the neighborhood. Observations: Alerts for making a turn the 76C would give the First Alert at 0.3 miles, the 76Cx would give the First alert at 0.2 mile. The second alert, the 76C would alert somewhere around 475 feet, the 76Cx would alert at around 225 feet.

 

This makes a noticeable difference when trying to navigate busy roads (especially in an unfamiliar area). The 76Cx does not give nearly as much time to change lanes or prepare for an exit. I also switched between my 128mb and 512mb memory. And yes there is a noticeable audible difference between the two units… the 76C being louder.

 

Hopefully these will/can be addressed in a firmware update.

Edited by PhntmArcher
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PhntmArcher, if you would take a moment to send your fine observations in to Garmin as I did (at: techsupp@garmin.com) it may help a great deal. The more of us that report such findings will assure these little bugs get addressed in firmware updates. Thanks!

Edited by Timpat
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Talked to a Garmin Technician, about some things, about my Map60Cx:

1) WAAS stopped working with firmware version 2.50, since I installed that.

2) For Custom POI, FIND By Name does not work, when you try to FIND by NAME, it falls back out to a previous screen.

3) The tecnician did say that the SiRF chip works differenly, in that the Reciever never will use it for positioning, just for WAAS data, so the BARS on the Satellite Page, will never darken in, just hollow bars.

 

The technician did say he will look in on the FIND by NAME, for Custom POI problem though.

 

-

Geoff

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Now I'm kind of worried, My 60 csx should be delivered today or tomorrow and now I'm reading all these posts about problems. I'm new to geocaching and this is my first unit, I went for the higher line because I want to use it in my Jeep for auto-navigating also. I already bought a 512mb transflash card and city select. I am 100% new at this and hope I made the right pick. I guess my questions are:

 

Should I use regular alkaline batteries or am I Ok with NIMH with all the talk about voltage problems.

 

Can I use the included USB cable with my city select to download to the 60.

 

Thanks for any input. :ph34r:

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Alkalines and NiMH rechargable should be fine. It appears that the voltage problem only occurs with Lithium ion batteries (and maybe just Energizer E2 Lithiums).

 

The USB connection to load City Select maps should work fine, and Garmin has successfully tested the x units with 512MB transflash cards (although not officially with 1GB cards yet). I'm betting you will really like this unit.

Edited by Sputnik 57
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Should I use regular alkaline batteries or am I Ok with NIMH with all the talk about voltage problems.

 

Can I use the included USB cable with my city select to download to the 60.

 

NiMH will be fine. The issue was with lithium cells that put out a higher voltage than alkalines (1.75 vs. 1.55). NiMH cells put out less voltage (about 1.25 V), so they act just like alkalines that have already been used for awhile. And the current models with 2300 mA-hr or more of capacity last as long per charge as good alkalines.

 

And the USB cable should be fine for downloading maps.

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Talked to a Garmin Technician, about some things, about my Map60Cx:

1) WAAS stopped working with firmware version 2.50, since I installed that.

2) For Custom POI, FIND By Name does not work, when you try to FIND by NAME, it falls back out to a previous screen.

3) The tecnician did say that the SiRF chip works differenly, in that the Reciever never will use it for positioning, just for WAAS data, so the BARS on the Satellite Page, will never darken in, just hollow bars.

 

The technician did say he will look in on the FIND by NAME, for Custom POI problem though.

 

-

Geoff

 

I get my defect 60cx now replaced soon.

 

What are the DOs and what are the DON´Ts to avoid problems ?

 

As i understood now, a don´t is "to install Firmware 2.5" isn´t it`?

 

Best regards

Mungo

Edited by Mungo Park
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Other than WAAS, it's just the FIND BY NAME failure with CUSTOM POI, that never worked, as soon as I click FIND BY NAME, I'm back to the NEAREST Screen.

 

-

Geoff

 

My solution to this is to select NEAREST CONTAINING, vs FIND BY NAME. Once the screen comes up, start keying in the letters that a POI begins with. It works just like Find by Name.

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Hi Folks,

again my question:

 

What are the DOs and what are the DON´Ts to avoid problems with the GPSMAP 60 cx?

 

Firmware 2.5 is a problem or not ?

Batteries, which type is a problem which not ?

what should be avoided ?

 

Maybe you can put together your collective intelligence and post a list, what to be aware of because i´m a little bit afraid of unpacking the unit after replacement and afterwards again having no chance to awake it to life after some hours.

 

Thanks in advance for your answers

 

Best regards

Mungo

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Firmware 2.5 is a problem or not ?

Batteries, which type is a problem which not ?

what should be avoided ?

 

new firmware is not a problem, works fine for me

 

Batteries - lithiums have caused issues due to voltage. use alkaline and NiMH for now untill Garmin updates the firmware to fix the lithium problem

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