How Extreme Will You Go?

[LokiDucks]

Hey everyone!

 

We recently hid a cache in a spot that requires crossing over a fallen log that spans a small river/stream. One of our team members expressed concern that no one will bother with our cache because they won't want to risk falling in the water.

 

So my question to you is this: would an obsticle like this prevent you from completing the task? Would you just do it or find another way? How extreme is too extreme for hiding a cache?

 

I'd do it...

[+Sir Robin]

My girlfriend (GeoJenC) and I have crossed small creeks on logs at least 3 times I can think of right away. Actually about 5, we had to go back twice to get one of the finds.

 

I get tired of the too hard/ dangerous comments, if you don't feel up to a cache go to another, you don't have to find them all, just try.

[+Bill & Tammy]

If crossing over a fallen log is extreme then maybe I don't understand the definition. To me extreme might be parachuting into a remote region or scaling a rugged mountain peek, etc..

 

I hope easy drive-ups aren't the direction this activity is going cause I would love some more excitement in finding caches.

 

My most prized find to date was a 4/4.5 which I further complicated by doing at night in a thunderstorm.

 

Bring 'em on

[LokiDucks]

heh, well i use "eXtreme" lightly here. Because most of the caches in my area that we have found so far are simply follow the beaten trail and then deviate ten feet to find an ammo box under a log. Or worse, a micro, camoflaged and hooked into an evergreen tree. Compared to what we've seen, crossing this log is eXtreme. I'd love to see more difficult and challenging caches in my area!

[+The Leprechauns]

Crossing logs can be dangerous. In addition to falling and getting wet, there is the ever-present risk of splinters. When I see logs across streams, I wonder if I should be calling LE.

 

[+briansnat]

If crossing a stream on a fallen log is extreme, then probably 1/3 of my finds are extreme and half of my hides are.

 

Extreme to me would be walking out on a 4 inch wide beam suspended 40 feet over a shallow river. When I had a cache that required me to do that, I passed, but a log over a stream is very routine.

 

A quick look at my gallery came up with these:

 

 

Not quite a log, but a beaver dam:

Edited January 7, 2006 by briansnat

[+kentuckygirls]

We would certainly do this type of cache unless it was say 50 foot up or something. We don't worry too much about getting wet. We did a cache similar to this last weekend. We took off in the direction of the cache and came to a pretty substantial drop-off. There were several logs that spanned the drop off but it was like I said a long ways down so we turned back and found a way around that went through a stream that we had to rock hop to get across. Luckily didn't have to get wet but we would have . It was a fun cache. I say go for it!

[+The Leprechauns]

OK, I just called my local police department and explained that I was a geocacher, and sometimes finding a cache might require that I walk on a narrow, slippery log in order to cross a stream, and what did they think about such dangerous activities going on in the local parks, and is it against any laws.

 

They hung up on me.

[+BlueDeuce]

I'd probably be more likely to cross the stream on foot, if I knew I wouldn't be washed away.

 

I guess it depends if I could control the circumstances well enough that I wouldn't be killed if I fell. (Like using a rope when climbing down a cliff)

 

If the worst thing about falling off the log would be getting wet and/or muddy, yeah, I'd do it.

Edited January 7, 2006 by BlueDeuce

[+Isonzo Karst]

I've used the butt scoot technique for most of the log crossings I've done. The logs have been palm trunks mostly and slick. So I look a little funky after, but I look a little funky anyway so what's the harm?

OT, if something really looks extreme to me (mostly around here that will involve tree or structure climbing) I tend to walk away. Not much of a climber.

[+BlueDeuce]

OK, I just called my local police department and explained that I was a geocacher, and sometimes finding a cache might require that I walk on a narrow, slippery log in order to cross a stream, and what did they think about such dangerous activities going on in the local parks, and is it against any laws.

 

They hung up on me.

No, they wrote your name down, then hung on you.

[+Isonzo Karst]

OK, I just called my local police department and explained that I was a geocacher, and sometimes finding a cache might require that I walk on a narrow, slippery log in order to cross a stream, and what did they think about such dangerous activities going on in the local parks, and is it against any laws.

 

They hung up on me. sad.gif

 

Thank you

[+kentuckygirls]

OK, I just called my local police department and explained that I was a geocacher, and sometimes finding a cache might require that I walk on a narrow, slippery log in order to cross a stream, and what did they think about such dangerous activities going on in the local parks, and is it against any laws.

 

They hung up on me. 

Note in the future please use proper geocaching etiquette and email the owner of the cache before contacting the authorities .

[+The Leprechauns]

OK, I just called my local police department and explained that I was a geocacher, and sometimes finding a cache might require that I walk on a narrow, slippery log in order to cross a stream, and what did they think about such dangerous activities going on in the local parks, and is it against any laws.

 

They hung up on me. 

Note in the future please use proper geocaching etiquette and email the owner of the cache before contacting the authorities .

It was my own cache. The voices in my head talk regularly. I see no need for an e-mail above and beyond that.

Edited January 7, 2006 by The Leprechauns

[+kentuckygirls]

OK, I just called my local police department and explained that I was a geocacher, and sometimes finding a cache might require that I walk on a narrow, slippery log in order to cross a stream, and what did they think about such dangerous activities going on in the local parks, and is it against any laws.

 

They hung up on me. 

Note in the future please use proper geocaching etiquette and email the owner of the cache before contacting the authorities .

It was my own cache. The voices in my head talk regularly. I see no need for an e-mail above and beyond that.

Okay, my mistake. As long as you notified the owner you shouldn't have anything to worry about. .

 

 

(I was only joking and trying to get in on some of the fun )

[+Mopar]

OK, I just called my local police department and explained that I was a geocacher, and sometimes finding a cache might require that I walk on a narrow, slippery log in order to cross a stream, and what did they think about such dangerous activities going on in the local parks, and is it against any laws.

 

They hung up on me.

[+Airmapper]

This is funny

 

As for the OP's question, Yes I'd cross a log, I do it all the time out hunting and caching should be no different.

 

I wouldn't cross it if the drop was enough to hurt me if I fell off or if there was swift water I could not walk out of.

[+sept1c_tank]

...The voices in my head talk regularly...

You have that problem too?

[+kentuckygirls]

...The voices in my head talk regularly...

You have that problem too?

[+Torry]

Hey everyone!

 

We recently hid a cache in a spot that requires crossing over a fallen log that spans a small river/stream. One of our team members expressed concern that no one will bother with our cache because they won't want to risk falling in the water.

 

So my question to you is this: would an obsticle like this prevent you from completing the task? Would you just do it or find another way? How extreme is too extreme for hiding a cache?

 

I'd do it...

Um, what happens after the next good storm and the log is moved downstream?

 

These kinds of caches are tons of fun, go for it.

[+Mopar]

Back on topic.

Crossing a log is usually not even CLOSE to extreme for me.

How extreme will I go for a cache? I dunno, I can't think of one that I've passed on yet because it was too extreme. Come close a few times.

 

I'm afraid of heights, but I climbed a tree in a snowstorm for a cache:

 

I'm afraid of heights, but I flew across the country once to climb several miles of this with a bunch of other cachers:

 

But what a view from the top!

 

I'm afraid of heights, but I climbed the scary ladder for a cache:

 

I'm afraid of heights (did I mention that yet?), but I walked along this little trail carved into the side of a bluff hundreds of feet above the beach to get a cache:

 

Compared to that stuff, crossing on a log is childs play!

Edited January 7, 2006 by Mopar

[+wilkintj]

I would cross for sure, seems more fun that way. The more 'out in the woods' / crossing streams / playing on logs there is, the more excited I'd be to go there.

[+Timber_Wolf]

I dindn't cross on logs because i went servall times on food through some streams.

I climbed in an Bomb hole that was 8 to 10 meters deep.

I used an inflable Boot to get to island in the middle of the night.

I Went through some swap in the middle of the night to find one cache.

 

I think i would do some more stuff because it's fun.

[+VegasCacheHounds]

Well, here's a few pics from a cache we found this morning:

 

 

 

 

This was for THIS cache

Edited January 7, 2006 by VegasCacheHounds

[+Airmapper]

I dindn't cross on logs because i went servall times on food through some streams.

I climbed in an Bomb hole that was 8 to 10 meters deep.

I used an inflable Boot to get to island in the middle of the night.

I Went through some swap in the middle of the night to find one cache.

 

I think i would do some more stuff because it's fun.

Wow, I've never done any of those things.

[+Timber_Wolf]

I dindn't cross on logs because i went servall times on food through some streams.

I climbed in an Bomb hole that was 8 to 10 meters deep.

I used an inflable Boot to get to island in the middle of the night.

I Went through some swap in the middle of the night to find one cache.

 

I think i would do some more stuff because it's fun.

Wow, I've never done any of those things.

Ja danke dir.

[+Timber_Wolf]

Well, here's a few pics from a cache we found this morning:

 

This was for THIS cache

But there is a ladder in the Pic.

Why didn't they use the ladder?

[+BlueDeuce]

Well, here's a few pics from a cache we found this morning:

 

This was for THIS cache

But there is a ladder in the Pic.

Why didn't they use the ladder?

Exactly what I was thinking!

 

Getting the practice in I guess.

Edited January 7, 2006 by BlueDeuce

[+Vinny & Sue Team]

OK, I just called my local police department and explained that I was a geocacher, and sometimes finding a cache might require that I walk on a narrow, slippery log in order to cross a stream, and what did they think about such dangerous activities going on in the local parks, and is it against any laws.

 

They hung up on me. 

Note in the future please use proper geocaching etiquette and email the owner of the cache before contacting the authorities .

It was my own cache. The voices in my head talk regularly. I see no need for an e-mail above and beyond that.

Lep, the voices in my head are louder than the voices in your head And, I know you all hate me because I can hear my Rice Krispies talking to me and you cannnot!!!

[+The Leprechauns]

Have your Rice Krispies contacted the volunteer cache reviewer about you? I know that my Lucky Charms have ratted me out to Keystone.

[+CamoCacher]

Hey everyone!

 

We recently hid a cache in a spot that requires crossing over a fallen log that spans a small river/stream. One of our team members expressed concern that no one will bother with our cache because they won't want to risk falling in the water.

 

So my question to you is this: would an obsticle like this prevent you from completing the task? Would you just do it or find another way? How extreme is too extreme for hiding a cache?

 

I'd do it...

I'd do it.

[+BadAndy]

I'd hit it.

 

Stream crossings don't qualify as extreme in my book. Maybe if the waters below had sharks with freakin lasers on their heads it might....

[skibum923]

Just this week I waded across a 15 meter wide stream in January to get to a Cache (it was only shin deep and I'm in Kentucky). I then scaled what was essentially a cliff without safety gear. The cache didn' require it, it was only becasue I am an idiot and didn't know there was a trail 100 meters away that went to the top. Was it extreme? Yes, extremely stupid.

[+Confucius' Cat]

I was having this discussion with murasaki today on the way to a cache. I proposed making a cache called something like "what would you do for a smiley?" (not for a Klondike® bar).

 

Then she reminded me of this cache and I figured the game's over.

 

Crossing a log is not even in the same league as extreme.

And no, I have not done that one... it is definitely beyond my limit.

 

A foot-log? No problem... if I couldn't rationalize the exposure, I'd probably wade or find "the back door".

[LokiDucks]

It's very good to knwo that so many of you would do it and don't consider it any sort of real challenge. But like i said, around here there aren't that many REALLY difficult caches. Maybe some thick bushwacking through thorns is the most "extreme" we've had to do so far.

 

I'm glad that there are really difficult and more extreme caches out there somewhere. Perhaps a road trip is in order?!

[LokiDucks]

<Double Post>

Edited January 8, 2006 by LokiDucks

[n0wae]

Well I did a cache once that was half way down a cliff

 

[+KoosKoos]

I wouldn't call crossing a stream extreme either (and I cache with a 7yo), I agree with everyone else, place the cache!

 

I will add a caveat, if the cachers in your area are completely happy with the walk up or park-n-grab caches, you might catch some gried of get few visitors. DO NOT let this discourage you...just saying, be ready to hear it (maybe).

[+VegasCacheHounds]

Well, here's a few pics from a cache we found this morning:

 

This was for THIS cache

But there is a ladder in the Pic.

Why didn't they use the ladder?

Exactly what I was thinking!

 

Getting the practice in I guess.

Sure, I could have used the ladder, but that ladder was built by kids, years ago at that. Half the rungs were missing, and those that were there were rotton and the nails were coming out. I may be a fool, but I'm not stupid.

 

Besides, almost anyone can climb a ladder, but going straight up a rope? That takes skill

[+VegasCacheHounds]

Well I did a cache once that was half way down a cliff

 

Now that looks like an amazing cache!

[+Vinny & Sue Team]

Have your Rice Krispies contacted the volunteer cache reviewer about you? I know that my Lucky Charms have ratted me out to Keystone.

Welll, yes, that has happened (I had placed a cache in an abandoned nuclear reactor, and rated it 1/1 while it was really a near-guaranteed-fatality 10/10, and my darn Rice Kispies tattled to our local reviewer), but, what is worse is that at 5 AM this morning I discovered my Rice Cripies talking to your Lucky Charms. AAARRRGGHH!! I am sickened byt he capriciosness of these cereals!

[+Fergus]

I love terrain 4 & 5 caches. The harder it is to get to the cache, the better I feel about finding it.

[+Vinny & Sue Team]

Hey everyone!

 

We recently hid a cache in a spot that requires crossing over a fallen log that spans a small river/stream. One of our team members expressed concern that no one will bother with our cache because they won't want to risk falling in the water.

 

So my question to you is this: would an obsticle like this prevent you from completing the task? Would you just do it or find another way? How extreme is too extreme for hiding a cache?

 

I'd do it...

As you have likely realized by now, a stream crossing for a cache hunt MAY merit raising the Terrain rating to a 3 or even a 3.5 if it is a pretty rough stream in equally rough terrain, but this is NOT considered extreme in the caching world.

 

Since the SEARCH function of the forum has been down, and you therefore cannot have found previous threads on the topic of extreme caches, I will share with you here some notes I have posted in the past on other threads here about extreme caches; those notes appear below, with some annotations:

 

There are PLENTY of truly extreme caches in the geocaching world, all of which are fully approved by geocaching.com reviewers and which are found by cache hunters every day. These extreme caches will usually bear a Terrain rating of 4.5 or higher, and the more extreme ones will often feature several paragraphs of warnings and disliamers on the cache listing page. The warnings will usually involve a reasonably complete disclosure of known hazards and challenges, along with a listing ot the skills and gear needed to safely complete the cache, and overall, the hunt may involve any of the following to find the cache:

• reaching an island in a swift river by boat or swimming
  using SCUBA or snorkeling gear to reach an underwater cache
  climbing a steep cliff with climbing gear
  descending a cliff with climbing gear
  crawling deep into a cave
  crawling deep into storm drain systems under a city
  wading 300 yards into a stinky swamp, with mud up to your thighs and water to your waist, to find an ammo can buried in the mud.
  crawling on your back deep into a storm drain pipe which is barely wider than your shoulders (with your arms in front of you), and into which anyone with a waist size larger than 34 cannot even fit, with your arms straight out beyond your head, wiggling like a snake for locomotion
  retrieving a magnetic keyholder cache placed 32 feet up a lamppost at a busy intersection in the middle of a city
  retrieving a magnetic keyholder cache placed 45 feet up a highway lamppost along a lonely highway.
  crawling, with safety gear, on the ironwork under an abandoned railroad bridge over a river gorge
  crawling, with safety gear, on the concrete pillars and arches under an abandoned highway bridge over a river
  wading or swimming 150 yards thru a very smelly sewage overflow pond to retrieve a cache buried in the stinky sludge
  hiking 200 yards into an unremediated EPA-listed Superfund toxic waste site filled with thick greasy yellow mud, while wearing a protective Tyvek bunny suit and self-contained breathing (SCBA) apparatus, to retrieve a cache. Worse, venturing in without the protective gear to get the cache.
  entering a "sanitary" sewage drain pipe filled with toxic gases (mosly ammonia and hydrogen sulfide), wearing a protective Tyvek bunny suit and self-contained breathing (SCBA) apparatus, to retrieve a cache
  scaling the walls of an abandoned concrete water tank 20 feet tall -- with sheer vertical concrete walls and no ladders or handholds -- in the middle of a forest, after fording a river and climbing a steep cliff to reach the site, and now the task is to somehow safely ascend the sheer outside wall of the tank and then (safely) descend the inside wall 22 feet into the weedy abandoned interior to find the cache therein, oh, and then to get back out again...
  hiking up a bear-infested mountain to a rattlesnake den/rock pile at the top, wherein lies the geocache
  approaching a street corner in an ghetto-like urban "blight" area heavily populated with street corner drug dealers and other urban street personalities, all to retrieve a magnetic keyholder cache mounted under a pay phone, the same pay phone used by the drug dealers and pimps for their trade calls.
  retrieving an underwater cache placed on the bottom of a deep trench in the Atlantic Ocean, where the cache lies 1.6 miles below the surface of the sea next to a geothermal vent which is spewing boiling water laden with methane and hydrogen sulfide gas.
  

A number of extreme geocaches with which we are personally acquainted are listed on one of our public bookmark lists, named

Extreme and Adventure Caches. Feel free to browse the list, although it is far from all-inclusive. There are many more which I have only heard rumors about!

 

Bottom line: have fun!

Edited January 8, 2006 by Vinny & Sue Team

[+Vinny & Sue Team]

I love terrain 4 & 5 caches. The harder it is to get to the cache, the better I feel about finding it.

Folks, Fergus is well-known around here for creating the best Terrain 4 and higher caches in the state! Personally, I am much like Fergus, and nowadays, I (for myself, unless dragged along by Sue on other hunts) largely only go after caches with terrain ratings of 4 or higher.

[+HaLiJuSaPa]

We were actually at a cache in November that while getting to the cache did not require crossing a log on a stream, such a feature was there near the cache. We had noticed that the leaves were blocking the small waterfalls in the area and crossed (including our 4 year old and 2 year old who we held carfeully) to do an unusual form of CITO.

 

The point is, I would think that would only bump the terrain rating to maybe a 2.5 or 3 because that is a very easy feature.

 

Vinny and Sue, I was curious if some of the "tough hides" you mentioned were real or facetious. I imagine that hiding something 30-40 ft. up on a lampost, especially on a public highway, would be illegal (though I've heard of caches where you actually climb that high up a tree). I also wondered about the magnetic keyholder on a "drug dealer" pay phone. I am assuming you are 100% tongue-in-cheek, but I was actually thinking about the pay phone one the other day since I live pretty near the Bronx, NY City and all and wondered if someone would ever really create such a hide since I've never seen one (contrary to what some stereotypes have, there are LOTS of nice parks in the Bronx for caches and as such are lots of caches as well). I had joked to my wife last week that we could make that our first hide and she just cringed :-)

[+HaLiJuSaPa]

Oh wait, I think you weren't kidding about the "drug dealer phone" cache, I just looked at your listings and see a series of "Psycho Urban Caches". I am not a premium member so it wouldn't let me read the "premium only" cache further, but it did give the distance and direction from my home coords so I am guessing they are in some gritty part of either Baltimore, MD or Washington, DC :-)

[+Vinny & Sue Team]

...Vinny and Sue, I was curious if some of the "tough hides" you mentioned were real or facetious.  I imagine that hiding something 30-40 ft. up on a lampost, especially on a public highway, would be illegal (though I've heard of caches where you actually climb that high up a tree).  I also wondered about the magnetic keyholder on a "drug dealer" pay phone.  I am assuming you are 100% tongue-in-cheek, but I was actually thinking about the pay phone one the other day since I live pretty near the Bronx, NY City and all and wondered if someone would ever really create such a hide since I've never seen one (contrary to what some stereotypes have, there are LOTS of nice parks in the Bronx for caches and as such are lots of caches as well).  I had joked to my wife last week that we could make that our first hide and she just cringed  :-)

Thanks for your note! Almost every cache type/hide which I listed is either one which I have myself found (with Sue) or placed (see our Psycho Urban Cache series or our Psycho Backcountry Caches #3 and #4 if you think I am kidding!), and a few are simply types of hides of which I have heard, but not yet found myself. As for the "up the lamppost" hides, there are at least eighty of them in the USA, and likely far more; we own a couple ourselves. The bear/rattlesnake mountain hide is an old cache, located not far from our home in the wilderness. About the ONLY cache hide types where I used a bit of literary license as I wrote -- because I am not TOTALLY sure that such a cache exists, and have only heard stories or rumors of their existence, are the following two:

 

hiking 200 yards into an unremediated EPA-listed Superfund toxic waste site filled with thick greasy yellow mud, while wearing a protective Tyvek bunny suit and self-contained breathing (SCBA) apparatus, to retrieve a cache. Worse, venturing in without the protective gear to get the cache.

entering a "sanitary" sewage drain pipe filled with toxic gases (mosly ammonia and hydrogen sulfide), wearing a protective Tyvek bunny suit and self-contained breathing (SCBA) apparatus, to retrieve a cache.

 

Indicentally, the first such example, about a sludge pit in an EPA Superfund site - I have actually found several such sites in Baltimore, and am slowly scouting out each site to find a candidate site -- which is not behind a fence and NO TRESPASSING signs and which is fully legal to access (i.e., not within 150 feet of active RR tracks), and which has a good slimy sludge pit -- in which to place another Psycho Urban Cache.

 

If you are still not sure that caches of the types which I had mentioned really do exist, please see our public bookmark list, named

Extreme and Adventure Caches. Feel free to browse the list, although it is far from all-inclusive.

 

By the way, regarding the Bronx: many years ago, I useta do contractual work for the City of New York on the seedy edges of the Bronx -- along the waterfront in the rundown industrial areas -- this is some VERY ROUGH territory, and gosh, there should sure be some GREAT places for hiding caches there!

Edited January 8, 2006 by Vinny & Sue Team

[+Vinny & Sue Team]

Oh wait, I think you weren't kidding about the "drug dealer phone" cache, I just looked at your listings and see a series of "Psycho Urban Caches".  I am not a premium member so it wouldn't let me read the "premium only" cache further, but it did give the distance and direction from my home coords so I am guessing they are in some gritty part of either Baltimore, MD or Washington, DC  :-)

No, we do not at this time have any caches on corners populated with drug dealers and pimps in so-called "urban ghetto" (although I have been told of the existence of a few, and have read a few log entries for same; may be able to give you some waypoint IDs if and when the search function returns.) Since you are not yet a Premium member (I do recommend a Premium membrship highly, by the way), here is a quick review of our more extreme caches:

 

Psycho Urban Cache #2 - Dismal, Dirty and Tough (GCQ91V)

Psycho Urban Cache #3 - Bowels of the City (GCQ91Y)

The two caches above are storm drain cache hides in an urban area. #3 is multistage.

 

Psycho Urban Cache #4 - Where is Padre Pio? (GCQ969)

30 feet up a lamppost

 

Psycho Urban Cache #5 - Brief and Bizarre Descent (GCQA4C)

Storm drain cache under a highway

 

Psycho Urban Cache #6 - Downtown Wuthering Heights (GCQABV)

30 feet up a lamppost

 

Psycho Urban Cache #7 - A Good Day to Die (GCQHBH)

Storm drain cache, multistage

 

Psycho Backcountry Cache #2 - Point 29 Zero

In a wilderness area in a state park. Seeker must leave trails and travel at least 1/2 mile by bushwacking across some rough wilderness terrain (including mountain ridge ascent and descent) to reach site.

 

Psycho Backcountry Cache #3 - Bitch Creek Crossing (GCQNN5)

In steelwork under an abandoned railroad bridge, the deck of which is 134 feet above the river below, across a river gorge.

 

Psycho Backcountry Cache #4 - High Country Cave (GCQNT7)

Deep in a cave -- from which a cold wind blows at 35 MPH or more year-round -- at nearly 10,000 feet elevation after a 3.5 mile hike from a trailhead parking lot which involves a 2,000+ foot gain in altitude. Final ascent to cave mouth involves climbing a cliff -- at an elevation of over 9,000 feet -- in the face of a waterfall emerging from the mouth of the cave. Cave is only accessible for 5.5 months out of each year, due to extreme buildup of snow and ice on the trails and cliffside paths.

Edited January 8, 2006 by Vinny & Sue Team

[+robert]

You mean to tell me I bought a Tyvek Bunny Suit and may not even need it! I'm going to get hit with a 10% restocking fee!!!

 

 

 

 

 

(still gearing up to tackle the rest of your PUCs, Vinny. )

[+ParrotRobAndCeCe]

Psycho Urban Cache #4 - Where is Padre Pio? (GCQ969)

30 feet up a lamppost

 

Psycho Urban Cache #6 - Downtown Wuthering Heights (GCQABV)

30 feet up a lamppost

Wow, I drive past those two every day and had no idea they were up there. Musta been tough getting approval from Allegeny Power to stick micros on their poles, eh?