Dnf?

[+IndyTechNerd]

I'm new, and still pretty clueless. At what point do you call it a DNF? For example, today I was going to check out one in my area, but could see that the ground between me and the location was pretty squishy. I was on my way to work, so I said skip it, I'll come back when the ground is a little more dry. Would you call that a DNF? I wouldn't. I think logging DNFs is something that I should do, but I'm not going to log a DNF if I don't even make an attempt to find the cache.

[+Chuy!]

I would not call that a DNF, but I would post a note I was in the area and why I turned back. It could help out another cacher to avoid the area until it dries out.

[+BlueDeuce]

Very good question.

 

As far as I am concerned if I click GOTO I better log something.

Edited December 31, 2005 by BlueDeuce

[+IndyTechNerd]

As far as I am concerned if I click GOTO I better log something.

 

I can see that. Once that vector shows up then you're commited.

 

I suppose that the argument could be made either way. On one hand, if you're looking at your GPSr and following a vector, then by definition, you're looking for the cache. On the other, if you drive right by that location and just get a visual reference and go on about your day, did you really fail to find the cache.

[+BlueDeuce]

Once that vector shows up then you're commited.

Well yes, but more so.

 

There is always things that a cacher owner should know and things that really don't matter, granted.

 

I'm just not interested in the fine line of "I'll only post when necessary". It's too hard to define.

 

Bring it down a bit and post when you tried. Don't try to judge what is important. (it's caching isn't it?).

 

Rather than trying to decide if a squishy location is worth noting, worry about posting that you couldn't, say, find your socks.

 

Trust me, I want to know about squishy locations and you just might entertain me me with your missing socks.

Edited December 31, 2005 by BlueDeuce

[+ZingerHead]

There are a lot of opinions on this, so take your pick. There's no shame in logging a DNF. Useful feedback to the cache owner and other potential finders is good, so a note or a DNF would be a good idea to explain why you aborted your mission. Having said that, I am not exactly religious about logging all my DNFs. Today I went after a simple parking lot micro, and there was big semi parked directly in front of the cache. In my mind, this was not a DNF - I didn't get out of the car, so I have no idea whether the cache is there or not. The truck will move sometime, so it's not like it's a permanent impediment to somebody finding the cache. I don't know how interesting or useful a "truck was in the way" log would be to anyone, so I'm not going to log it.

[+Isonzo Karst]

In your situation I would probably log something. Might be a note, might be a DNF. To some extend that would depend on my mindset at the cache site and my feelings later at the 'puter. I know as a cache owner I like knowing that somebody was hovering around my cache - so I'd definitely log something.

[salmoned]

I feel fairly safe in saying a "DNF" is generally considered equivalent to painting "LOSER" onto your forehead in the minds of most seekers, else why don't they have any "DNF"s? (Obviously, no one who has posted a DNF is included in that assessment.) A DNF, per se, has nothing to do with the cache being missing, but rather only indicates that it was sought and not found. The nature of a DNF is contained in the log.

 

I have "notes" posted on some of my caches that were nothing but DNFs in disguise. Why? That big "LOSER" sign is the only possible explanation.

 

Troll? Troll? What is "Troll"?

Edited December 31, 2005 by edchen

[+BlueDeuce]

I feel fairly safe in saying a "DNF" is generally considered equivalent to painting "LOSER" onto your forehead in the minds of most seekers, else why don't they have any "DNF"s? (Obviously, no one who has posted a DNF is included in that assessment.) A DNF, per se, has nothing to do with the cache being missing, but rather only indicates that it was sought and not found. The nature of a DNF is contained in the log.

I'm sorry, are you a Troll? Just asking.

[+BlueDeuce]

I have "notes" posted on caches that were nothing but DNFs in disguise. Why? That big "LOSER" sign is the only possible explanation.

 

This post has been edited by edchen on Dec 30 2005, 07:23 PM

not the forum

Edited December 31, 2005 by BlueDeuce

[+Kai Team]

I log a DNF when I feel that I have useful information to share. I always log a DNF when I truly search for the cache and don't find it. I also log a DNF if I turn back for a reason relevant to others (like soggy ground).

 

I don't log a DNF if I turn back for reasons no one else cares about (e.g. I ran out of time on my way there or after only briefly looking for it). In that case, I might or might not log a note.

 

BTW, when I see a DNF logged, I think "Honest person who plays the game well". Only a loser would think "loser".

[+Henki]

If I look for a cache and can't find it, I log a DNF. If I drive up to an area and there are too many people around for me to look without looking suspicious, I don't log a DNF.

 

When I do log a DNF, I also add that cache to my watchlist. If someone else is able to find it after I bomb out, I'll go back again and again until I find it. And each time I don't, I'll log it as DNF again.

[+IndyTechNerd]

I've been thinking about it off and on all evening, and I think I've come to the conclusion that I won't log a DNF when I didn't put in a reasonable attempt to find the cache.

 

Kai Team and Henki, you guys pretty well hit my situation exactly. Today, I gave myself an hour to find 2 caches, and since they were my first ones and a couple miles apart, I figured that would be an decent amount of time. I ended up only needing about half that time because I walked right to my 2nd find. From car to car in probably 3 mins. Took longer to get the log out, sign, and put it back than it did to walk to, find, and walk from the site.

The 3rd cache was a waypoint that was near my location, so I figured I'd check it out. I drove to the site and decided that it wouldn't be in my best interests to go digging for the cache since I had to go to work. Monday, I'll certainly log that one found. I know where it is, I know what to look for, and I don't have to work, so big deal if the clothes get dirty.

[+PilotMan]

My thoughts are that I will only post a DNF if I was unable to find the cache after a decent attemptt at searching. If I know I'm in the approximate area and have looked in all the obvious places and have no idea where the cache is after that, then I will declare a DNF.

[Lowsky]

Hey admin: could you add DNF / YET ??? that would solve the "loser" tag. Me I prefer the term Honest.

[+DaMoores]

I'm not trying to hijack the thread, I believe my questions fit here.

 

I am a nube, but I do not believe I'm a complete idiot. At what point do you call off a search and believe the cache is "Just not there"?

 

Would it be bad form to email the cacher to let them know what you know about the cache hints and ask if I'm on the right track?

 

Thanks

Gene

[+ZingerHead]

1. When you stop having fun.

2. Not bad form at all.

[Twister65]

I'm not trying to hijack the thread, I believe my questions fit here.

 

I am a nube, but I do not believe I'm a complete idiot. At what point do you call off a search and believe the cache is "Just not there"? 

Call off the search when you're satisfied that you've look everywhere for it.

 

Would it be bad form to email the cacher to let them know what you know about the cache hints and ask if I'm on the right track?

 

Thanks

Gene

I don't see a problem with contacting the hider for a hint, or to ask if you were in the right location. You could also just post a note on the log asking anyone for a hint.

 

Scott

[+briansnat]

I am a nube, but I do not believe I'm a complete idiot. At what point do you call off a search and believe the cache is "Just not there"?

 

That would depend on the difficulty level as well as previous logs. If its 1 or 2 star difficulty, I'll probably give it about 30 mins - unless I see a lot of DNFs among the logs (which is reason #14 why everyone should log their DNFs). If there are a lot of DNFs sprinkled among the logs I'll assume the cache might be a bit harder than it was rated by the owner and put in more time.

 

If its rated over 2 stars I'll be prepared to put in more time, but I've learned to never assume that its just not there. If I had a dollar for every time I was certain it was just not there and the very next person came along and found it, I could take the wife out for a very nice dinner.

 

Would it be bad form to email the cacher to let them know what you know about the cache hints and ask if I'm on the right track?

 

Not at all. You can always ask. Some will help you out and some won't. Some owners will even volunteer additional information without your asking after you post a DNF.

[+StarBrand]

If you went looking and didn't find it (whatever the reason) log a DNF. Your notes and reasons may help others.

 

I try to never assume that it just isn't there (I still do it but I try not to). Seems like most of the time a fellow cacher will find it a week or 2 later. Logging my DNF may prompt the owner to go check on it. Especially after a series of DNFs by a variety of experienced cachers.

[+DaMoores]

WOW! want a response. Thanks

 

I did log it as DNF for the same reasones you listed. The owner did come out and look, he found the cache missing and replaced it.

 

Thank you again

Gene

[+the hermit crabs]

I am a nube, but I do not believe I'm a complete idiot. At what point do you call off a search and believe the cache is "Just not there"? 

 

I'll often call off the search if I can't find it, but rarely do I think that that means that the cache is "Just not there" -- I usually assume that I am just having a cache-blindness day. Especially if I find myself looking in the same places over and over again, and not finding it any of the times I look in them.

 

I'm not a complete idiot, but I do have some idiot days.

 

(edit: I just checked our DNF list, and the caches were actually missing on fewer than 20% of our DNFs. They're usually right there.)

Edited January 4, 2006 by the hermit crabs

[+emb021]

I feel fairly safe in saying a "DNF" is generally considered equivalent to painting "LOSER" onto your forehead in the minds of most seekers, else why don't they have any "DNF"s? (Obviously, no one who has posted a DNF is included in that assessment.) A DNF, per se, has nothing to do with the cache being missing, but rather only indicates that it was sought and not found. The nature of a DNF is contained in the log.

Sorry, but I have to disagree.

 

If I make an honest attempt at finding a cache, and after trying and trying and not succeeding, I'll give up. I consider that a DNF.

 

If I come back within a day or so, and if I succeed, I'll only log a 'Find'. If not, I log a DNF. Who knows, maybe it is missing, maybe its not. One of my first attempts, it took me 3 times before I found it. But I was new, and learning how to find geocaches. A couple of recent ones I found the velcro they were attached to. I almost logged them at DNF, until I found the velcro and realized what happened, and logged them as founds (as others have).

 

Some cachers feel that logging DNF is a measure of honestly. I know of one person who's sig ISN'T the number of GC found/placed, but the number of DNFs!!! And he has a lot of them. DNF may indicate the cache is lost, or too hard. This can be helpful for the owners and for others contemplating attempting to find te cache. There is one tought multicache that I am still in the middle of finishing. Its currently a DNF for me.

[+HaLiJuSaPa]

I will log a DNF if I got to "Ground Zero" on the GPS and did at least some searching to find it.

 

But there are two cases where I usually do not log a DNF:

 

1) If I have good reason to think that the reason for the DNF is someone else found the cache and was holding it while I searched. I learned that to be the case with a rest area micro after I DNF logged it and thought afterwards (since I was suspicous this was the case anyway) that there was really no reason to log that except to try and find out if someone had the cache at the time; after all, it's not something the owner has to go check and it really doesn't help other searchers. That said, I realize that it's hard to tell if that is the case and one other time that I was suspicious of this I did note it as well noting that there was a car parked nearby with someone in it not getting out since that cache had DNF's from people a lot more experienced than I and I couldn't say with as much certainty that someone had it.

 

2) On a couple of occasions the MapQuest map fooled me. In the one example I did log (mainly to confirm my suspicion with the cache owner and because I thought it was an extreme example to note to others), the map would suggest you go up a road right to the cache. But that point was actually a high fence and the cache was on the other side of the fence. To get to the other side of the fence you have to actually drive around some side streets about a mile and park a few hundred feet away then walk up to this point. In this case it wouldn't have been obvious, but in the other case I had with this it was obvious that where I first went wasn't a place a cache would be hidden so I went back another way the next day and found it. No need there to log a DNF the day before.

[+pwcorg]

I feel fairly safe in saying a "DNF" is generally considered equivalent to painting "LOSER" onto your forehead in the minds of most seekers, else why don't they have any "DNF"s? (Obviously, no one who has posted a DNF is included in that assessment.) A DNF, per se, has nothing to do with the cache being missing, but rather only indicates that it was sought and not found. The nature of a DNF is contained in the log.

 

I have "notes" posted on some of my caches that were nothing but DNFs in disguise. Why? That big "LOSER" sign is the only possible explanation.

 

Troll? Troll? What is "Troll"?

I don't agree. A DNF is just that. Didn't find it. Not an admission of utter worthlessness or any other such negative moniker. I highly doubt that anyone who has been caching any legnth of time is without a single DNF. They may not have posted them, but they are there all the same. As said above, if I click "go to" then I am logging something. On another note do you think we should start a support group for cachers who can't locate their socks. I thought I was the only one.

[Lowsky]

On another note do you think we should start a support group for cachers who can't locate their socks. I thought I was the only one.

or that lose their gps'?

[+BandR]

Its really a subjective thing. Sometimes the situation will dictate but I usually log it as soon as I step out of the vehicle and search on foot. Many of the caches in this area are in busy places. Many times we drive to one only to find out that there are people all around it, then we move to the next and dont even attempt a foot search and come back to that one at a later time. I dont see that as looking but not finding, I see that as waiting for the right time.

[+the hermit crabs]

On another note do you think we should start a support group for cachers who can't locate their socks.  I thought I was the only one. 

or that lose their gps'?

They need one of these.

[+Airmapper]

On another note do you think we should start a support group for cachers who can't locate their socks. I thought I was the only one.

Ringbone? Is that you??

[+Jojogirl]

I usually log a DNF when I am reasonably sure that I have been in the right spot and did not find the cache despite a really good search.

I do not see it as a "Loser" sign but as a signal to the next cacher and the owner "watch out, tricky, there might be something wrong"

 

The reason I do this is because a DNF gives a signal.

If a cache has a lot of DNF's but is still there the difficulty rating maybe needs adjusting.

It a cache has had only DNF's for a while, the owner might need to check whether the cache is still in its original place.

 

And if I am the only one that got a DNF it s a signal for me to go back and try harder.

[+CamoCacher]

Depends on the situation, the very first example I would have gone on and tried to find it. The only thing that I have turned around on so far without trying has been thin ice.

 

To me if I go out the the area then it is a DNF even if I only searched 5 mins because of the dark.

[+wandererrob]

I log a DNF when I get out of the car and search but don't find it. I have on occassion not logged a DNF if I plan to return soon (within a few days) to continue where I left off though.

 

I guess the distinction there for me is I log a DNF when I've given up on the search as opposed to pausing it for now, usually on account of limited time or daylight. In fact, I have one of these sitting in my personal "queue" at the moment. Tromped out in the snow, in the dark the other night, gave it up for the time being but still have places to check. I'm not done yet. Hopefully I'll wrap it up today though.