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Packin' And Cachin'.


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It looks VERY uncomfortable ...

 

I personally wouldn't know. Additionally, I'm not so certain it would be legal in my state as it is not concealed. True, most will not know what it is, technically, you can see it. On the other hand, the clip on a knife peeking out of your pocket makes a knife not concealed and therefor legal--you're not carrying a concealed weapon. INAL and I'm not 100% on this, so take what I just said for what it's worth.

 

Also, for me, the pocket holster allows me to carry in a way that I can still carry my pack, keep my shirt tucked in, and the trigger guard is covered. I can deploy as fast as I can take my wallet out of my pocket. I can remove it easily to stow it away and still most folks won't know what it is if they're not paying close attention. They might think I'm putting my wallet away.

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Have you ever seen the need for the airbag in your car?

 

Point is, the OP asked a question and I answered. I did not post my answer to try and convince others that my way is the right way, I merely stated the fact that we do not carry a gun when caching because we don't see the need.

 

To respond to your question, at the risk of going off topic: Yes, usually more than once a week we are called to respond to an motor vehicle accident, many times involving air bag deployment. So, I can see the need for airbags. We, however, haven't had to respond to a single bear attack despite being located in bear country, so I don't see the need for a gun.

 

But, again, this thread isn't about debating the merits of either stance, so having answered both questions I am just going to sit back and enjoy. :mellow:

 

Cheers!

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Have you ever seen the need for the airbag in your car?

 

Point is, the OP asked a question and I answered. I did not post my answer to try and convince others that my way is the right way, I merely stated the fact that we do not carry a gun when caching because we don't see the need.

 

To respond to your question, at the risk of going off topic: Yes, usually more than once a week we are called to respond to an motor vehicle accident, many times involving air bag deployment. So, I can see the need for airbags. We, however, haven't had to respond to a single bear attack despite being located in bear country, so I don't see the need for a gun.

 

But, again, this thread isn't about debating the merits of either stance, so having answered both questions I am just going to sit back and enjoy. :mellow:

 

Cheers!

 

I've been saving that analogy for a while now, and I go and waste in on someone who has a FIRE TRUCK as their avatar!

Drat!

:ph34r:

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I am from the school that says; It's better to carry something and not need it than to need it and not have it. A .22 is nice to have if you can't carry a gun. Gun Control is being able to hit your target. A Leatherman Super Tool is my American Express. Oh yes I am in bear country.

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Also. It looks like you have a Keltec 3AT or a p32 with the belt clip and one of those pager holsters. Good luck drawing and deploying it.

 

P32, no pager holster.

Drawing is suprisingly fast, probably about as fast as any concealed rig.

had a pager holster once- don't waste your money (funny that's what the guy that sold it to me said too) They are uncomfortable and "print" as much as anything + they are extremely awkward to draw from.

 

I've tried just about every rig available and the p32 with the belt clip has the best comfort and concealment- bar none. As to power... well its a lot better than bending over to pick up a rock (as the "best advice" given in so many earlier threads)

 

Biggest threat (in caching or pertineer anywhere else) is dogs and .32 auto should work quite well. I'll take my chances with it for wildcats or bears too if need be... like I said- beats throwin rocks. If I was expectin one, I'd stay home, if I copuldn't stay home I'd carry .44mag

 

A .32 in the belt is a lot better than a .44mag at home in the closet. Comfort and concealment are IMHO the most important considerations. If it ain't comfortable, you won't have it when you need it.

 

Hope none of us ever needs it.

Edited by Confuse-A-Cat
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Additionally, I'm not so certain it would be legal in my state as it is not concealed. True, most will not know what it is, technically, you can see it. On the other hand, the clip on a knife peeking out of your pocket makes a knife not concealed and therefor legal--you're not carrying a concealed weapon. INAL and I'm not 100% on this, so take what I just said for what it's worth.

 

Also, for me, the pocket holster allows me to carry in a way that I can still carry my pack, keep my shirt tucked in, and the trigger guard is covered. I can deploy as fast as I can take my wallet out of my pocket. I can remove it easily to stow it away and still most folks won't know what it is if they're not paying close attention. They might think I'm putting my wallet away.

 

Pocket holster is cool, but the printing is greater. Not a problem for caching, but sometimes obvious (to me at least) when seated in a waiting room or such. Also, I have pockets full of knife, keys, flashlight, etc.

 

In Indiana license is to "carry" concealed or not. I guess you could split a lot of hairs with the "concealed" thing. In KY (prior to their CCW law) when I was LEO, concealed was defined by several court cases and was very difficult indeed to define. Generally, it was "concealed" if it was NOT recognizable from all directions as a gun. By this definition it is obviously "concealed".

 

I also find it interesting that I am allowed to carry a concealed firearm, but not a blackjack or other "deadly weapon" which most people would consider a lesser "threat" than a firearm.

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SA 1911 Champion or V10 (with appropriate "printing") almost anytime I am out and about. I use a variety of holsters depending on weather etc. (South GA gets prettty darn hot) I'm not in bear country, but have run across a few gators and more than a few two legged animals. Dont usually bother with JHP because, if you take the time to actually research it rather than repeat the rumors, what you are really after is either central nervous system interuption or massive blood loss (critical organs). Besides, not much worry about "over penetration" with the .45 ACP anyway. Think throwing a volkswagon. Plus I KNOW my gun will chamber the FMJ 100% of the time. Can't say the same for the JHP stuff. I also agree that the single most important part of the equation is parctice, practice, practice. And remember, the gun is ALWAYS loaded. Just my .02

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Additionally, I'm not so certain it would be legal in my state as it is not concealed. True, most will not know what it is, technically, you can see it. On the other hand, the clip on a knife peeking out of your pocket makes a knife not concealed and therefor legal--you're not carrying a concealed weapon. INAL and I'm not 100% on this, so take what I just said for what it's worth.

 

Also, for me, the pocket holster allows me to carry in a way that I can still carry my pack, keep my shirt tucked in, and the trigger guard is covered. I can deploy as fast as I can take my wallet out of my pocket. I can remove it easily to stow it away and still most folks won't know what it is if they're not paying close attention. They might think I'm putting my wallet away.

 

Pocket holster is cool, but the printing is greater. Not a problem for caching, but sometimes obvious (to me at least) when seated in a waiting room or such. Also, I have pockets full of knife, keys, flashlight, etc.

 

In Indiana license is to "carry" concealed or not. I guess you could split a lot of hairs with the "concealed" thing. In KY (prior to their CCW law) when I was LEO, concealed was defined by several court cases and was very difficult indeed to define. Generally, it was "concealed" if it was NOT recognizable from all directions as a gun. By this definition it is obviously "concealed".

 

I also find it interesting that I am allowed to carry a concealed firearm, but not a blackjack or other "deadly weapon" which most people would consider a lesser "threat" than a firearm.

Just goes to show, what's best for one person might not be best for another. My wife's daily carry is the P32 as well. She also carries it in a pocket holster, with nothing else in that pocket. Yes it prints somewhat, but it prints like a wallet. The clip prints like a pocket knife, which would actually draw a lot more attention in her office then a wallet does.

In CT the license is to carry as well, concealed or not; so from a legal standpoint printing isn't even an issue. And yea, it's the same way here, not allowed to carry a baton, even the ASP type, or nunchucks(sp?), or handheld taser or anything else without out a special deadly weapons permit in addition to your handgun permit.

Edited by Mopar
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Yes I have drawn while out on the trail when 2 teenagers asked what I was doing on a little used trail. Upon telling them I was geocachng they asked how much money I had on me and they started getting a little too close for comfort. I opened the backpack, chambered a round and told them I had maybe 20 buck on me but with this (holding out the .40) I could probably get more if I wanted. What would have happened if I hadn't had it that day? There's no telling, but I'm glad I did.

i have to say... i am not a person who is comfortable with guns. i took a riflery course in college, but that's the extent of my first hand experience with guns. i like to think that caching in my local area, i am better off without a gun (since i am not comfortable with them) but stories like this make me think twice about caching by myself in more isolated areas.

 

at one time i had considered going on a long weekend trip up north and hitting some caches by myself, but some of the people and places up there make me a little nervous. it is situations like these that make me consider getting a itty bitty gun and going through all the courses and permit processes.

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I carry a .380 auto in areas that are rural, and in places I could carry a gun while hunting game.

In town I'm not too concerned, and a CCW is pretty hard to get in Wisconsin. (in my area)

 

My main reason for taking it with, dogs, Coyotes and more more bear sightings are showing up.

I found what I believe to be bear scat in my last adventure, I dismissed it and moved on.

 

I like to take my dog with, and am not going to pull a coyote off him, but with a gun, could

even the odds and feel more confident.

 

Oh, and I would rather be packing, than getting packed :)

 

deliverance.jpg

 

deliverance_guitar.jpg

 

I can almost hear dueling banjos now .... :D

 

My last cache, I pulled up in this remote parking lot, playing with my GPS, there was another

car there, didn't think nothing of it, thought someone else was out hiking. To my surprise, when

I got out of my car after 10 minutes of sitting there, there was someone in the truck, just lookin at me,

and didn't return my smile and head nod. Glad I had the steel with :D

Edited by Quiggle
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Blood pressure rising... 1,2,3,4,5,6,7....

 

There that's better!

 

My Dad and my Father-in-law had to carry a firearm for 5 or six years, many years ago. It was to defend them and their friends.

 

It was a horrible, horrible time for them....!!!

 

After my Dad and my Father-in-law came back home they could not pick-up a firearm again.

 

Still brings back too many bad memories for many folks.

 

I understand how MANY firearms work... It's just that I don't have any reason to use them.

 

(respectfully)

D.

Edited by davwil
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Just goes to show, what's best for one person might not be best for another. My wife's daily carry is the P32 as well. She also carries it in a pocket holster, with nothing else in that pocket. Yes it prints somewhat, but it prints like a wallet. The clip prints like a pocket knife, which would actually draw a lot more attention in her office then a wallet does.

 

This is perhaps a gender difference. For a man to have a knife in his belt is not looked upon as anything unusual, but for a woman, it is possibly a little odd.

 

No one has ever even mentioned my "knife" so far. I don't think anyone actually "sees" it at all. (If only I could hide a cache so well in plain sight!) I often wonder if it is a little suspicious when I pull my real knife out of my pocket to open a box or something, but so far...

 

You are right- whatever works best for the individual, there are hundreds of choices (including leaving it at home; I don't think packing is always NECESSARY, it is just better to be prepared). In a lot of cases it is 6 of one half a dozen of the other.

 

I think generally people are quite oblivious to all the ways people are hiding their heat all around them. That makes it really quite easy to hide-em with just a little care and forethought. Sometimes you can "print" big time and noone notices. I sometimes carry my .45 S&W inside the belt with a t shirt over it in short pants and still have never heard a comment.

 

IMHO good concealment prevents a lot of problems. Even when caching in the "wilderness" I prefer to keep it hidden. Too many people's only "knowledge" of guns is from shoot-em-ups on TV and they think if you have a gun you must be gonna shoot somebody. When carrying legally, these people are really the biggest concern.

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WOW, What a bunch of paradiod idiots.....

 

Name calling doesn't add a whole lot to a debate, but thanks for your gratuitous comment.

 

If you really wanted to add to the debate, you could cite statistics. You could perhaps mention that there were only 5.6 million victims of violent crime in the USA last year.

Edited by briansnat
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To carry or not to carry - to have or not to have I guess is the question. I own guns and I carry them when I think it is reasonable - in back-country where there could be a need to protect myself or the people I'm with. But I don't always go geocaching in places like that and then I don't carry. It is a matter of common sense - but I'm sure you all know that already. As for me - I think the issue "to carry or not" may be summed up in the following manner. Somebody once asked me - "you'd really shoot somebody or something if they were going to hurt or kill you?" I have to admit - the thought of being in a situation like that is unimaginable and I don't know what I would do. But I guess I have long conceded that the point of having a firearm with me in the middle of the woods at night by myself (backpacking or something like that) wasn't about protection at all really - it was a matter of getting a good night sleep.

 

Most of the geocaches I've found havn't been remote enough for me to feel a need to arm my self. But that's just me - others may differ about where they've been and what they choose - and they have that right. To be totally honest - the thought about carrying or not when I go geocaching hadn't entered my mind until now. I just didn't see the need. But then again -I'm still pretty new to geocaching.

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Most of the geocaches I've found havn't been remote enough for me to feel a need to arm my self.

 

Personally, I feel safest when I'm in remote areas. I don't own a gun, never have and probably never will, but of the times in my life when I wished I had one it wasn't in remote areas. It was usually in the city.

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WOW, What a bunch of paradiod idiots.....

 

Name calling doesn't add a whole lot to a debate, but thanks for your gratuitous comment.

 

If you really wanted to add to the debate, you could cite statistics. You could perhaps mention that there were only 5.6 million victims of violent crime in the USA last year.

Yeah, but 5.5950 million of those occured in New Jersey. So, is that really a fair statistic? :P

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WOW, What a bunch of paradiod idiots.....

 

Name calling doesn't add a whole lot to a debate, but thanks for your gratuitous comment.

 

If you really wanted to add to the debate, you could cite statistics. You could perhaps mention that there were only 5.6 million victims of violent crime in the USA last year.

Yeah, but 5.5950 million of those occured in New Jersey. So, is that really a fair statistic? :P

Sure, but only if you point out that NJ is one of the few places in the USA (a few others being NYC, Chicago, and DC) where citizens don't have a right to carry a firearm. Hmmmm.....is there a correlation somewhere?

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This one is straying wildly off the point of the original topic.

 

The opening post was:

This may have been done before, but who carries when caching? I often carry my S&W 686 in .357 Mag, but we live in bear country, too. Anybody else?

If you would like to argue statistics, feel free to use the existing thread (or threads?) in Off-Topic.

 

Thanks.

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Honestly, who cares?

 

Is it going to take up space on the "geocaching topics" forum? No. Not any more than any other post. So it's off the original topic, big deal. Obviously the topic has changed, so let the discussion continue.

I care, kind of. The original topic is worthy of conversation. I even like the expansion of the topic to include methods of concealment. Devolving the topic to make it about whether it is right or wrong to carry, serves no purpose.

 

We may as well talk about politics, religion or why Garmin v Magellen.

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I care, kind of. The original topic is worthy of conversation. I even like the expansion of the topic to include methods of concealment. Devolving the topic to make it about whether it is right or wrong to carry, serves no purpose.

 

We may as well talk about politics, religion or why Garmin v Magellen.

 

I guess my post was in response to what I imagine the next action will be, which is locking the thread. That doesn't serve the original topic well either.

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Just keeping with the organizational format of the forums. If it's off topic, it's off topic. The topic has basically gotten to a "I'll show you mine, if you show me yours" thread, much like the one already existing in the Off topic forums. That's why there was such a fight a few years ago to get an Off-Topic forum, so threads like this wouldn't get shut down, and people could discuss interests only peripherally related to geocaching.

 

To keep it on topic, I don't cache with a weapon, though I'm not anti-gun. I just don't buy into the cult of the gun personally. I've never felt that a gun made me safer, even in bear country, where I HAVE had a couple of real encounters with black bears. In both, a gun would not have helped, and like the esteemed Mr. Snat has said, I feel safer in the woods than anywhere in urban areas. I don't begrudge you your right to carry if you feel it would make you feel safer, but after thousands of posts, the points have been made and rehashed...yawn...

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This same topic is being discussed in the Off Topic forum. Shouldn't the duplicate topic be closed or merged?

The Mods are afraid of the Geo Neo Gun Nuts. Just like in real life how the NRA pushes all the lawmakers around Capitol Hill. :D

 

Wow. That was not even half way through the first page. :D

 

I didn't bother to read past page one - so I apologize if this has been addressed already.

 

Every time this subject comes up, there is no shortage of folks jumping in to "show what they got". It's no wonder some others think it a little strange (gun enthusiasm).

 

But the point I really want to make is that as a gun owner and a legal carrier, it is not wise to let the public know what and where you're carrying. If any of you don't understand why that is, that is evidence that you are lacking in training. Think about it. Seek training. Keep it to yourself. :D

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Honestly, who cares?

 

Is it going to take up space on the "geocaching topics" forum? No. Not any more than any other post. So it's off the original topic, big deal. Obviously the topic has changed, so let the discussion continue.

I care, kind of. The original topic is worthy of conversation. I even like the expansion of the topic to include methods of concealment. Devolving the topic to make it about whether it is right or wrong to carry, serves no purpose.

 

We may as well talk about politics, religion or why Garmin v Magellen.

 

OK so let's combine them. How many Garmin users carry? How many Magellan users? Maybe there's a correlation.

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If you pack and cache how to carry is a valid sub topic and I've been following this thread with interest.

 

Agreed

 

it is not wise to let the public know what and where you're carrying.

 

Agreed (hence the relevance of discussing concealment methods and appropriate hardware for same).

 

Open carry invites trouble, therefore you are very right in saying "keep it to yourself". But posting in this thread is not "showing off" but rather discussion of do you carry when caching, if so what and how. We are having an in-house discussion among geocachers, not a "show-off" to the general public. I would never dream of displaying my hardware in public, but discussing it with interested persons is not indicative of a "lack of training".

 

As far as some hostile person reading these posts (i'm sure ther are many), it is one thing to read about it and quite another to act on it in some way that might be detrimental.

 

Basically, if you go around showing off you are FAR better to leave it at home. (perhaps you should not even own a gun)

 

If you are considering whether to carry whilst caching (or any other time) please consider this:

 

CCW is a grave responsibility (no pun intended), if you are not prepared to walk (or run) away from a fight, or even take a moderate beating- without pulling your weapon, you don't have any business carrying. If you think carrying makes you a "big man" then you don't have any business carrying. If you think it is going to ensure your safety in a hostile encounter, you don't have any business carrying. If you are not prepared to pull the trigger when your life depends on it, you don't have any business carrying.

 

To carry or not is a very personal decision, but either way you decide it is not necessarily a bad one.

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I have not read 90 percent of the replies on this forum.

I have some questions/concerns for those who do arm themselves while caching....

Why would you feel the need to carry a gun?

If it is because of a chance meeting with a bear? If a bear is surprised by you, depending on the closeness of the bear, it is quite possible you would never get the gun out of your holster to defend yourself...Even if you were to pull the gun and fire off a round or two (making sure that safety is off first), the adrenaline coursing through your system might not make you the best shot. Considering all factors are in place and you are charged by a bear and you get a nice shot or two off, what about other hikers in the area? Many caches are off trail, some hikers, like myself, like to hike off trail, especially to check out wildflower displays or some other natural cool thing. I was in law enforcement and I believe guns have their place, like attorneys, and sharks etc...

Being aware of your surroundings, having a keen ear to the natural world, using your senses to try and determine if you are in active bear territory, by learning animal signs and talking with rangers and or other hikers before starting out, is worth more to me in maintaining safety than any gun. There are a huge number of classes one can take to be safer in bear territory. Learning to talk louder, or make some big noises once every 15 minutes along a hike, listening for snuffling, or even smelling for bear scent (which is very potent), checking the area around you for bear prints or scat...

As far as keeping yourself safe from a muggler with bad intentions, if you look like you need to be mugged by a muggler, than you will be, and I suspect if you are paying more attention to your GPS unit than your surroundings, it will not matter if you are packin at all...

Just my 2 cents. I would hate to see innocent people getting hurt over a misunderstanding or a bad shot - heck Dick Chaney, in a controlled situation, shot his buddy. It is just to easy to take someone out by accident. I will see you all at the gun range.

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I have not read 90 percent of the replies on this forum.

I have some questions/concerns for those who do arm themselves while caching....

Why would you feel the need to carry a gun?

If it is because of a chance meeting with a bear? If a bear is surprised by you, depending on the closeness of the bear, it is quite possible you would never get the gun out of your holster to defend yourself...Even if you were to pull the gun and fire off a round or two (making sure that safety is off first), the adrenaline coursing through your system might not make you the best shot. Considering all factors are in place and you are charged by a bear and you get a nice shot or two off, what about other hikers in the area? Many caches are off trail, some hikers, like myself, like to hike off trail, especially to check out wildflower displays or some other natural cool thing. I was in law enforcement and I believe guns have their place, like attorneys, and sharks etc...

Being aware of your surroundings, having a keen ear to the natural world, using your senses to try and determine if you are in active bear territory, by learning animal signs and talking with rangers and or other hikers before starting out, is worth more to me in maintaining safety than any gun. There are a huge number of classes one can take to be safer in bear territory. Learning to talk louder, or make some big noises once every 15 minutes along a hike, listening for snuffling, or even smelling for bear scent (which is very potent), checking the area around you for bear prints or scat...

As far as keeping yourself safe from a muggler with bad intentions, if you look like you need to be mugged by a muggler, than you will be, and I suspect if you are paying more attention to your GPS unit than your surroundings, it will not matter if you are packin at all...

Just my 2 cents. I would hate to see innocent people getting hurt over a misunderstanding or a bad shot - heck Dick Chaney, in a controlled situation, shot his buddy. It is just to easy to take someone out by accident. I will see you all at the gun range.

 

Pretty much my feelings as well, and I'm a Life Member of the NRA, but the only time my guns leave the house is when I have an intended target in mind. To each their own, and no one answer to the "should I or shouldn't I carry" is right for every person or every situation.

I'm also 6'6" tall and built like Andre the Giant, which I have been called before :D , so I already have an edge. :D

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I'm also 6'6" tall and built like Andre the Giant, which I have been called before ...

Me to, back in the day, the ladies used to call me that ... :D I might even be able to stop a muggle if I pulled out my 'love gun'. However, I doubt it would have any effect on a bear ... unless of course it was sugar bear. :D

 

PS-I'm kidding ... I am an average middle aged white guy and we all know there is nothing 'giant' about that ... just trying to have fun with this tired, drawn out, beat to death topic.

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I'm also 6'6" tall and built like Andre the Giant, which I have been called before ...

Me to, back in the day, the ladies used to call me that ... :D I might even be able to stop a muggle if I pulled out my 'love gun'. However, I doubt it would have any effect on a bear ... unless of course it was sugar bear. :D

 

PS-I'm kidding ... I am an average middle aged white guy and we all know there is nothing 'giant' about that ... just trying to have fun with this tired, drawn out, beat to death topic.

 

LOL, Huggie bear meets Sugar bear.

 

My approach to bears is to avoid them, so far so good. :D

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I have not read 90 percent of the replies on this forum.

I have some questions/concerns for those who do arm themselves while caching....

Why would you feel the need to carry a gun?...

 

There, I cut out 90% of your post and it's much more manageable.

 

There are any number of situations that might come about that would make me feel the need to carry a gun. Why do police carry guns? Why do they feel the need? Ignoring that it’s a job requirement the answers are very much the same.

 

However I think perhaps you intended to ask a simpler questions.

Why…carry a gun?

For starters that’s how you get to the range. It’s how you participate in cowboy action shooting. It’s how you hunt and it’s how you have one handy if you decide to plink. It’s how you get trained and practice. That’s just to name a few.

 

In the end I would love to live in a world where we don’t need guns and we could all frolic naked in the garden of Eden and live like nymphs and satyrs. However I don’t and as I go through life I do know who’s got my back and it’s not the police. They will show up later and figure out what happened. One way or the other for anything that may come along I’m the one who will deal with it in the hear and now. Maybe a gun helps, maybe it’s buried in the pack and my end is to become a grizzly bear snack. It’s my life and so its my choice as long as I have the freedom to make it. I’d still rather dance with nymphs but I'll settle for caching with some and working with others.

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In the end I would love to live in a world where we don’t need guns and we could all frolic naked in the garden of Eden and live like nymphs and satyrs.

 

That is the one case where I haven't figured out how to conceal a gun. (although I do remember a scene in a cop show where the main character was packin in the steam room- it wasn't hidden very well though) You won't catch ME naked in the Garden! No Way! :)

 

Maybe somebody should make a photoshop project out of NudeCacher with a holster?

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As the OP I feel the need to respond to several references to not "needing" a gun in bear country. To each his own. Of course lots of people hike without a gun and are just fine. I have never drawn my revolver on a bear (and hope I never do). In fact, the only bear I have ever killed was with a bow and arrow during bear season.

 

But I like to carry in the woods. Just a little insurance. As for my ability to draw quickly when I need to, that's what practice and range time is for. I'll take my chances drawing in time over having nothing.

 

I expect I'm more likely to need my revolver to fend off a feral dog than a bear... but for the sake of posting in a mixed forum I thought that would explain my carry motives better than "to shoot wild dogs".

 

WB (who has never drawn his weapon for defense, but is ready if he ever needs to).

Edited by Wandering Bears
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I do not Carry a gun , I dont care for them , I carry a Hiking Stick .... I have never felt threatened , and this from me ( I did however have my truck broke into wilst I was off in the woods hunting a cache I dont feel a gun would have helped one bit here either ) .

 

Dick Cheney is not my friend ! *whew*

 

*bites tounge to stay on topic *

 

Star

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it is not wise to let the public know what and where you're carrying.

 

Agreed (hence the relevance of discussing concealment methods and appropriate hardware for same).

 

Open carry invites trouble, therefore you are very right in saying "keep it to yourself". But posting in this thread is not "showing off" but rather discussion of do you carry when caching....

 

Yes, but I wasn't addressing those who simply post to this thread. Here is an example of what I was talking about (not picking on anyone intentionally - just grabbed the most recent):

 

"Count me in with a Para-Ordinance Stealth Warthog .45..."

 

Not a very good example, I admit - but my point is that there is no need to give specifics of WHAT YOU CARRY to have this discussion. Were this person to accidentally piss off one of his locals that reads this forum, that person now has all the info he needs to cause the Warthog owner a lot of hardship. You may consider that far-fetched, but it is based on real-life incidents (loosely), and though it is probably less likely than the possibility of actually NEEDING that gun (a possibility that a lot of folks here are blissfully ignorant of), it is still a possibility that is not worth feeding.

 

Furthermore - If, God forbid, you ever have to actually SHOOT someone in defense - bold statements of one's prowess with a gun or willingness to use it WILL be sought out by unscrupulous prosecuting attorneys and tort lawyers. Don't think for a minute that anyone has any rea anonymity here. If such a thing happens to you, your PC will likely be confiscated as evidence - and you know what that means...

 

I'm just saying that a discussion on carry methods and gear need not include pictures of YOUR gun and YOURself in various methods of carrying. Besides, perhaps if you tone it down a bit, you wouldn't get so much backlash.

 

There ARE sites for discussing all of this where it is welcome. It's not surprising to me that some here would take offense. That's no reason NOT to discuss it here, but it IS a reason to keep the discussion a little low-key and less provocative.

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I have not read 90 percent of the replies on this forum.

I have some questions/concerns for those who do arm themselves while caching....

Why would you feel the need to carry a gun?

If it is because of a chance meeting with a bear? If a bear is surprised by you, depending on the closeness of the bear, it is quite possible you would never get the gun out of your holster to defend yourself...

 

Interesting to me how you went from "having some questions/concerns" to simply making your own statement. Anyhow - ignoring the fact that your slanted view of anyone's competence with a gun (probably based on your law-enforcement culture background - I've seen how poorly trained the bulk of YOU folks are) is not based entirely on factual history...And in spite of the fact that you weigh your own words with passages like "it is quite possible you would never get the gun out of your holster.." (hint - it is also "quite possible" that you WOULD get the gun out)....

 

...I will attempt to answer your ONE question/concern.

 

Question: Why would you feel the need to carry a gun?

 

Aswer: Many possible reasons.

 

1) To have a tool with which to deal with the possibility of criminal attack. Right here on this forum, there have been anecdotes about violent criminal attacks on geocachers who were breaking no laws.

 

2) Animal attacks. Not all vicious animals are bears, and not all animals do what experts tell us they are supposed to do.

 

3) Duty. Studies have shown over the last couple of decades that states which allow legal concealed carry by law-abiding citizens have a lower violent crime rate than those that don't. Some of those studies show a direct correlation (allowing for other factors) of reduced crime rates to active participation in concealed-carry. This can't work if no one participates. (argue the stats all you want. The reason is still valid)

 

4) Practicality. For many gun owners, it makes more sense to have it with you than to leave it somewhere - for various reasons. Use your imagination.

 

5) Principle. If you truly believe in the second amendment (those of you who don't have nothing to do with this reason), this is a pro-active why to support it, encourage it, enforce it, whatever...

 

6) Practice. You can often tell which legal gun (concelaed) carriers only do it occasionally or just started. They're the ones that are "showing" - inadvertantly or otherwise. It takes some practice and experience to find what works for you without showing. The day you become aware of a particular threat is not the best time to begin this process.

 

I'm sure there's more - but if you really wanted an answer, that should be enough. Accept it or don't - it's still a logical answer.

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Yes, but I wasn't addressing those who simply post to this thread. Here is an example of what I was talking about (not picking on anyone intentionally - just grabbed the most recent):

 

"Count me in with a Para-Ordinance Stealth Warthog .45..."

 

Not a very good example, I admit - but my point is that there is no need to give specifics of WHAT YOU CARRY to have this discussion. Were this person to accidentally piss off one of his locals that reads this forum, that person now has all the info he needs to cause the Warthog owner a lot of hardship. You may consider that far-fetched, but it is based on real-life incidents (loosely), and though it is probably less likely than the possibility of actually NEEDING that gun (a possibility that a lot of folks here are blissfully ignorant of), it is still a possibility that is not worth feeding.

Please elaborate. How would anyone be able to cause you more trouble simply by knowing what your carry weapon is (beyond the knowledge that the warthog has more stopping power than my BDA 380 and I have a possible two more chances of dropping my target)? I, for one, am very interested in other people;s feelings about methods of concealment. It helps me to know what their specific weapons are to judge whether their concerns should be mine. For instance, I would likely care about what the warthog owner has to say about concelement more than someone who carries a 'full-frame' weapon.

Furthermore - If, God forbid, you ever have to actually SHOOT someone in defense - bold statements of one's prowess with a gun or willingness to use it WILL be sought out by unscrupulous prosecuting attorneys and tort lawyers. Don't think for a minute that anyone has any rea anonymity here. If such a thing happens to you, your PC will likely be confiscated as evidence - and you know what that means...

I haven't read cold statements such as you suggested. Did I miss them? In every thread regarding this topic, two points have come up. 1) If you are going to carry a weapon, you must have the proper training and practice. 2) If you are going to carry, you must be willing to use the weapon, if necessary. These are very basic rules, not a 'bad-a**' boast. Most people who carry a weapon never have to use it. The rest wish that they didn't have to.

I'm just saying that a discussion on carry methods and gear need not include pictures of YOUR gun and YOURself in various methods of carrying. Besides, perhaps if you tone it down a bit, you wouldn't get so much backlash.

I don't see the harm. Its fair discussion that is geocaching-related.

There ARE sites for discussing all of this where it is welcome. It's not surprising to me that some here would take offense. That's no reason NOT to discuss it here, but it IS a reason to keep the discussion a little low-key and less provocative.

There are many topics that come up in here that don't interest me. I have the option to not open those threads or to hold off on posting if I can't add to the discussion. (Of course, I'm just as likely to post saom snarky comment, but that's my decision.)

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