Geocaching For The Motion Disabled

[+svekke]

Hi,

this might very well be covered, but Search is unavailable for me, is it for Premium only?

 

I'm new to this sport, logged my first cache yesterday. Now, it seems fun and I want to try it with the kids. But my eldest is in a wheelchair, and I'd like to have a clue as to which caches he can get close to (it's OK if he can't reach the actual cache, but I don't want to leave him 50 m away or more).

 

I've realised that for some strange reason, geocaching discriminates on the grounds of terrainability by not allowing plain members to search by terrain rating. I don't know if anyone can search by handicaching rating (handicaching.com). You seem to have to have premium membership to search by these factors.

 

Why? Can't you find any better way of giving premium benefits (I don't mind the concept of premium benefits)? If I am misinformed, how do I search by these factors?

 

Regards

Svekke

[+briansnat]

The terrain rating is available on the search page for all members, regardless of ability or disability.

 

If a disabled person would like the option to search on terrain rating, he'll have to become a premium member just like anyone else

 

This isn't discrimination, its the way things work here.

[+svekke]

I suppose you meant the search result page, didn't you? The search page still doesn't have that option, or I'm blind.

 

Let me be clear. I think geocaching is a great game and I think both I and my kids will enjoy it a lot. If we become real enthusiasts we might become PM. But, as a father of a disabled child I find everywhere these little things that doesn't work when you're in a wheelchair, things that are effectively discriminating. So, I was trying to make a suggestion. But I can agree that discrimination is a strong word, and I have no thought that the people running this geocaching.com are actively discriminating anyone. I am sure they are not.

 

I also think that there should be caches on every conceivable level of difficulty.

 

So, what I'm really asking for is for someone to consider if terrain rating could be a standard search option, and that perhaps you could move something else to PM.

 

BTW, I like the attitude of: "it's the way things works here". Let's make sure nothing ever changes.

[+briansnat]

I suppose you meant the search result page, didn't you? The search page still doesn't have that option, or I'm blind.

 

Excuse me, the search results page.

[Clan Riffster]

Hi Svekki, welcome to our addiction!

 

briansnat is right in that you don't need to be a Premium Member to see terrain ratings. From the "My Account" page, click on "Search for nearest caches from your home coordinates (filter out finds)". This will show a list of caches near you. Scroll down the list, and you'll see something like

W (1/1) 21 Mar 05 Indian Mound 34

2.6mi by Jack & Ret The Challengers (GCN662)

Florida

 

The (1/1) means terrain rating 1, difficulty level 1. Focus on these for handicapable caches.

 

Good luck!

[+srt4guy]

basic rule of thumb, when you read the description, a terrain of one is usually handicap accesable, some of the posters add the handicap symbol to let you know this is a good family cache for you. here is a cache i have, fully accessable , ramps, elevators, first two stages are within 400ft of the library and 100% accesable to wheel chairs.

 

http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_detai...0d-f6bb93a200ba

 

welcome and enjoy the sport.

srt4guy

[+nfa]

My search page of nearby caches comes up with the following...

looking at the "Babyhead" cache, from the left:

 

3.1 is the distance in miles from my house and the direction (south)

 

next is the cache type (traditional)

 

next is an indicator that a travel bug is in the cache

 

next is the indication of size (not micro, not small, yes it's regular sized, not large, not unknown), above the size are the numbers describing the Diificulty and Terrain of the cache (in this case, a 2 star difficulty, and 2 star Terrain)

 

next is the date it was placed (aug 18, 05)

 

next the name of the cache/who placed it/gc cache number/state it resides in

 

and finally the date of the last find (nov 26)

Edited December 16, 2005 by NFA

[+CYBret]

If you go to the Hide and Seek a Cache page and type in your coordinates you will get a list of caches in the area you're seeking. To the right of the cache icon is the Difficultly/Terrain rating for each cache. A cache with a terrain rating of 1 should be accessible by wheelchair (I say should be because right now in my part of the world, you'll need a wheelchair with snow tires). You don't have to be a premium member to see these designations.

 

You would have to be a premium member to set up a search that culled out everything but 1/1 caches.

 

Bret

[+whistler & co.]

Caveat Emptor on older caches, though!

A lot of older caches have terrain ratings of 1 or 1.5 that are TOTALLY wrong according to the current guidelines. A cache with a 1 rating is supposed to be completely wheelchair accessible, but the older ones may involve long walks, bushwhacking, rocky trails, etc. Owners of these caches should update their terrain ratings to meet current standards!

My advice is to look for the "wheelchair accesssible" icon on the top right of the cache description page and to read all the logs of the previous finders to see what they have to say about the terrain.

Probably the best way to insure that your son has fun caching is to plan ahead by emailing either the cache owner or one of the recent finders and asking about terrain conditions if you have any doubts about suitability of terrain.

Welcome to the wonderful world of geocaching!

[+BlueDeuce]

Contact your local cachers to see if they can suggest ones that you can complete with your son.

 

Also consider placing some caches of your own. It doesn't matter that you know the final location. Then there will be that many more caches for the disabled.

 

Good Luck

[+SixDogTeam]

BTW, I like the attitude of: "it's the way things works here". Let's make sure nothing ever changes.

Kudos to Briansnat for having the class to let that lie there. We, however have never been accused of being classy.

 

We think you looked for, and found, "Atittude" where they was none, and to us THAT is "Attitude".

[CoyoteRed]

...I'd like to have a clue as to which caches he can get close to...

Folks have already mentioned above a 1 terrain is likely to be, and is supposed to be, wheelchair accessible. However, this is not always the case. You can sometimes find a 1 terrain that is not easily accessible and then sometimes higher rated caches might be accessible. It depends on your level of mobility in the chair.

 

Additionally, gc.com is not the one placing the caches, cachers do.

 

If you want to be able to filter out harder caches then you need to do just like everyone else and become a Premium Member.

 

Don't forget, wheelchair bound is not the only "disability." You will find caches listed that even able bodied persons can't do for whatever reason be it skill, endurance, physical strength, or whatever. That's not to mention the caches that require mental acuity beyond a normal human being. These can't be filtered out any different than ones that are too hard for someone wheelchair bound.

 

Hope this helps.

[magellan315]

You may want to look at the Handicaching website. This may provide you with the assistance you need to go geocaching.

 

I also would lilke to commend BrianSnat for excersisng restraint about the response to the "its the way things work here" comment. Its alot more than I would have in the same sitiuation.

Edited December 16, 2005 by magellan315

[+svekke]

Thanks for the thorough description of the results page, there actually was more to that than I realized.

 

I actually tried to make a kind of snow-chains for the electric wheelchair once, but it didn't work very well. Ground clearance is so bad he gets hanging on top of the snow.

[+nfa]

Thanks for the thorough description of the results page, there actually was more to that than I realized.

 

I actually tried to make a kind of snow-chains for the electric wheelchair once, but it didn't work very well. Ground clearance is so bad he gets hanging on top of the snow.

You'll find that geocaching.com and the forums here will continually surprise you in terms of user-friendliness and the overall utility for people of all skills and ages and abilities.

 

There are gazillions of helpful people, scores of dedicated volunteers, and a core of extremely able programmers and user-interface types who make sure that all of the stuff behind the curtain runs more smoothly than seems likely.

 

Welcome to the addiction!

 

jamie

[+altosaxplayer]

The terrain rating is available on the search page for all members, regardless of ability or disability.

 

If a disabled person would like the option to search on terrain rating, he'll have to become a premium member just like anyone else

 

This isn't discrimination, its the way things work here.

[+TheAlabamaRambler]

But, as a father of a disabled child I find everywhere these little things that doesn't work when you're in a wheelchair, things that are effectively discriminating

 

I am sorry that your child has to suffer a disasbility. I do as well. Having grown up with a sister with polio and a best friend with no arms or legs, then losing a leg in '98 and breaking my neck in '02 I do have some insight into your situation.

 

I use a wheelchair for most activities and geocache on crutches. A chronic pain situation limits how much walking I do on crutches. If more caches were chair-accessible it would certainly be a great benefit to me!

 

I pretty much quit logging cache finds a while back, so I don't really know how many I have found, but I logged 1650-something finds the first couple of years in this game and have found hundreds since then.

 

Of those, I doubt 250 were wheel-chair accessible.

 

That's not a reflection on Groundspeak or geocaching.com - they have gone above and beyond in attempting to promote accurate access ratings, even designating the terrain rating of 1 as wheel-chair accessible.

 

The Reviewer community that lists geocaches is sensitive to this as well.

 

Still, caches that are older and precede the awareness now exhibited and the occasional cache that slips by may be rated a 1 terrain while in fact not being truly accessible.

 

The biggest issue, of course, is that the able-bodied have little insight into what makes a cache site accessible! A light-pole cache at the edge of a parking lot is perfectly accessible to the able-bodied - they don't realize that the curb and 6" ditch right at the cache completely blocks chair access, or that crossing a flat but muddy field is a real issue, or that a cache in a tree where the finder can roll right up to it may be totally inaccessible if the finder can't stand up.

 

Anytime you have a community of many thousands of able-bodied and a few dozen, at most, wheelchair-bound it's understandable that the majority doesn't think of our needs unless they have reason to - perhaps have a friend with a handicap that makes them more aware.

 

So, do we suffer discrimination and have the right to ask, even demand, that caches be put out especially for us? No.

 

Should we ask that geocachers have some sensitivity to the issue and reserve the 1 terrain for wheelchair accessible? Sure. But don't be surprised when that doesn't happen!

 

It's not discrimination, I can tell you that - no one in this game, I think I can safely say, sets out to bar access to anyone. On the other hand it's a sport that revolves around hiking, and excludes certain disabilities by its very nature. That's just life...we can't do everything, and we can't expect the world to accomodate our every need.

 

Accepting, then, that we can't do most geocaches from a chair, there are a great number that we can, and I hope y'all will pursue those!

 

I have discovered something interesting about this game - it attracts the friendliest and most helpful people in the world!

 

See if there is a geocaching association in your area - if not, start one! You will find that just the knowledge that there is a handicacher in the area will lead to the placement of accessible caches!

 

Go to local events, sponsor an event, place some hides yourself, and you will build a community awareness that leads to more great caches for your family and a greater sensitivity to the 1 terrain rating that, over time, will make the ratings for listings in your area more dependable.

 

Good luck, I hope to meet you out there,

Ed

[+BigWhiteTruck]

My search page of nearby caches comes up with the following...

looking at the "Babyhead" cache, from the left:

 

3.1 is the distance in miles from my house and the direction (south)

 

Now to do the triangulation. . .

 

<evil laugh>MMWWWAHAHAHAH!</evil laugh>

[+cudlecub]

My mother was also in a chair and I can understand the frustration you encounter when you can't get where you intend to go. There's been numerous tips to find the caches that might be acceptable and I hope they work for you.

 

I don't feel the site is discriminating, although I can see your point. The basic features are free and looking at the entertainment you get, you can't ask for anything more. The cost involved for the servers and everything else makes the minimal cost of premium membership seem like nothing to me. I went premium before having a gps I could download waypoints or a pda to simply support the site of something I enjoy.

 

I hope that you can locate some caches that are accessible and come to see the premium features as a way to entice "hard core" cachers to pay for the additional services that will benefit them.

[+nfa]

My search page of nearby caches comes up with the following...

looking at the "Babyhead" cache, from the left:

 

3.1 is the distance in miles from my house and the direction (south)

 

Now to do the triangulation. . .

 

<evil laugh>MMWWWAHAHAHAH!</evil laugh>

N44 22.332, W074 11.798...c'mon by, coffee's hot...

 

is it warped that I know that off the top of my head?

 

jamie

Edited December 16, 2005 by NFA

[+BigWhiteTruck]

N44 22.332,  W074 11.798...c'mon by, coffee's hot...

 

is it warped that I know that off the top of my head?

 

jamie

Yes, it is warped. But not as warped as this, I actually did project waypoints based on that listing.

The results are pretty impressive:

 

[+nfa]

I'm in the clearing between candidates 1 and 2 and Backwoods cache...go to satellite again...I'm looking up and waving

 

BTW: that is really cool!!!

 

jamie

Edited December 16, 2005 by NFA

[+webscouter.]

I wanted to answer one of the OP original questions that wasn't answered.

 

The search feature on the forums has been temporarily disabled because of some problems it was causing. It is not a premium only feature and will hopefully be back soon.

 

Also I wanted to point out that most able bodied cachers vastly underestimate the abilities of mobility disabled cachers. Or we overestimate them and put the terrain rating to low. Either way we usually don't have accurate terrain ratings.

[+Renegade Knight]

You may want to look at the Handicaching website. This may provide you with the assistance you need to go geocaching....

As was suggested, you have access to this. If you get active in your local geocaching community, you will find they participate a lot more to accomodate your caching. Knowing someone makes all the difference for someone.

 

If you get active on handicaching you can help make the ratings work better for everone.

Edited December 16, 2005 by Renegade Knight

[+DocDiTTo]

Also I wanted to point out that most able bodied cachers vastly underestimate the abilities of mobility disabled cachers.

Guilty as charged. I just recently met Alabama Rambler at CCCA's Christmas Event, and I was really impressed with his setup (GPSr in a cradle on a wire around his neck so he could use it with crutches, as well as every other necessary gadget strapped on w/in arms reach)

 

I'm not sure I'd be willing or able to continue this hobby if I were in his situation, but talk about making the most out of what life throws at you - and having a great attitude on top of it!

 

There's another local cacher who really impresses me, too. He's legally blind, but is able to find caches just as well as (or better than) the rest of us who see fine. He's nailed some of my hides (including a 5/5) that I thought he'd not be able to do. Just goes to show you that you can do anything you put your mind to, regardless of what someone else thinks.

 

I've never heard the word "discrimination" come out of his mouth, and if he's ever used lack of sight as an excuse, he's certainly mentioned it an equal number of times as a benefit, because a lot of caches need to be felt rather than seen.

 

I'm learning not to underestimate people. On more than one occasion I'm guilty of thinking "there's no way this person could do this cache, because of ___ disability". Time and time again, people surprise me.

[+The Leprechauns]

I have had the pleasure of meeting both the geocachers mentioned in Doc Ditto's post, and I second his observations. I also found The Alabama Rambler's post earlier on to be inspiring and insightful as his opinions always are when this topic is discussed.

 

I try to rate my caches using ADA standards for wheelchair access. Several of my urban micros are rated at Terrain 1, with the accessible attribute, because there are ramps and curb cuts and the cache can be reached from a wheelchair located on the pavement. Yet, not a single log on any of those caches has ever mentioned someone using a wheelchair.

 

In contrast, I have a 7.5 mile long multicache along a rails-to-trails path in the suburbs. It has four stages to make sure that everyone has a nice long bike ride, jog or hike to find the cache -- instead of just parking at the access point closest to the cache coordinates. One of the early logs on this cache came from a geocacher who completed the cache in a wheelchair. The ability of people to overcome their "limitations" never ceases to amaze me.

[+Planet]

I don't know if anyone mentioned this because I haven't completely read all the replies, but just wanted to let you know you have to be logged in to see the coordinates and certain other info on the cache page that you don't see when you're not logged in.

 

I have a nice 3 mile handicapped loop hike virtual in a Wildlife Management area calle Trustom Pond in Rhode Island if you ever get near there. Wheelchair and stroller friendly. It's called "Look, Up in the Sky! It's a Bird!" The last undeveloped salt pond in RI. It's so pretty. The trail is hardpacked and sandy so it drains well for the most part. I know there must be many more caches out there that are perfect for you. Finding them all grouped nicely right where you are is a little harder. Have fun and enjoy!

 

And about that Alabama Rambler dude, he may say he's got a disability, but you coulda fooled me!! He and ladebear68 did practically as many caches at a tournament in MA as MilesStone and I did, and MS and I came in third with something like 54 caches in 2 days. TAR is one heck of a cacher, and one of the nicest people you could ever want to meet, in here, in chat, or in the real world. Love ya TAR!

[+blackjack65]

The search feature on the forums has been temporarily disabled because of some problems it was causing. It is not a premium only feature and will hopefully be back soon.

I think the OP meant the Search feature on GeoCaching itself.

 

Also, I do not think The OP was seeing or showing attitude.

I think the statment simply meant: "Change is Good!"

 

Finally, even if its only a few 10 bucks a year, as we know people with disabilities,

on average, make less money then others, and that they and their family have to

face more costs, I do think that adding a free "wheelchair" search criteria

would be a kind gesture. But then again, there are other disabilities,

so where would that stop?

[Jeremy]

On the search results page is the terrain setting. This, coupled with the "wheelchair accessible" attribute on cache listings should help to determine what caches are available based on your physical abilities.

 

Both of these features are readily available on the site. Yes, you would need to make an additional click to see the details of the cache, but that is the same issue that every non-premium member faces when determining whether they want to find one cache or another.

 

Lastly, if you are well versed in what a wheelchair accessible cache should be, please provide feedback to those geocachers whose listings are wheelchair accessible so they can update their attributes. Additionally you should let geocachers know if the attribute is inappropriate for the placement of the cache.

 

I don't find the actions of the web site discriminatory except when it comes to the difference between Premium Member features and regular account features. As accessibility is concerned either type of member has access to all of the information available for viewing.

[+bobbarley]

I have read this forum top to bottom and I am very impressed with the attempt at making a difficult activity accesible. I went back and updated my older caches to reflect the new guidelines. Perhaps a email to all hiders to update listings would also clarify the situation.

[Jeremy]

It's probably about time we sent a big cache owner email. We'll do this after the New Years. Thanks for the suggestion

[+briansnat]

I have read this forum top to bottom and I am very impressed with the attempt at making a difficult activity accesible. I went back and updated my older caches to reflect the new guidelines. Perhaps a email to all hiders to update listings would also clarify the situation.

Actually they're not new. 1 star terrain has been defined as handicap accessible at least since I started in this sport (in 2001).

[+2trax]

most of the site is ok the way it is search out some 1 stars and see what happens some are easy some are hard and after a while you do get the feel of what you can and cant do , some of this is all trial and error . Sometimes i have to go after several caches to get just one but hey its fun . And also lots of caches are a lot harder then the one star terrian they are listed as but thats all in the challege of it i suppose . Lots of times i only get fifty yards away so i mumble under my breath and life goes on .

 

 

 

 

 

Life is the prize and then you die

[+ChileHead]

I'm in the clearing between candidates 1 and 2 and Backwoods cache...go to satellite again...I'm looking up and waving

 

BTW: that is really cool!!!

 

jamie

Hey I know where you are! I've probably driven by your house dozens of times on my way up to Rainbow Lake to visit relatives!

[+nfa]

I'm  in the clearing between candidates 1 and 2 and Backwoods cache...go to satellite again...I'm looking up and waving

 

BTW: that is really cool!!!

 

jamie

Hey I know where you are! I've probably driven by your house dozens of times on my way up to Rainbow Lake to visit relatives!

email me sometime when you're coming up so we can go out for a hike or a beverage...

 

jamie

[+Alan2]

I undersstand how you feel about not knowing in advance. While I'm not comparing to you, I have a similar situation. I cache with my dog. Often I get to the park and find dogs are not allowed and have to leave him in the car while I hike to the cache. Neither of us are happy about that. The cache hider did not mention on his cache page that dogs are not allowed. That's pretty understandable especially if he doesn't have one. It's not something he's thinking about.

 

So what I do is a little research before I go. I read the cache logs and sometimes I'll email the cache hider or one of the finders before I set out to the cache just to make sure. It doesn't hurt to ask. In your case, ask about the terrain conditions, distance to cache, etc. Sometime the hike to the cache is OK for a wheelchair but the last 10 feet is too difficult.

 

Good luck.

Edited December 17, 2005 by Alan2

[+welch]

Geocaching For The Motion Disabled, Does geocaching.com discriminate?

Yes, and they also hate children

 

The search feature is currently broken (for everyone).

 

Basically if you want a cache that is supposed to be handicap accessiable look for one rated 1 in terrain, it should accessiable for your son. However since the ratings are picked by the cache owner setting up the page (not gc.com), this isn't uniform. Some rate low, some rate high... same problem with attributes (those PM searchable icons you referr to).

Edited December 17, 2005 by welch

[+svekke]

Thanks for all the replies.

I'm sorry for the expression "discriminate" in my OP, but it sure got the discussion rolling. I DON'T accuse geocachers of active discrimination! And I do know that there are lots of things that could cause you to want an extra marker in the cache listing.

 

I wanted to suggest that terrain rating could be "basic searchable", but of course I'm in no position to demand anything, and of course I could pay my bucks to get that option. But suggestions as such can't be forbidden, can they?

 

I've started a small discussion on this topic in the Swedish forum, and several people have responded that they will look more closely on their terrain ratings. If they do, it's great.

 

Personally, when I start placing caches I will try to handicache rate them, and I will probably place both accessible and non-accessible caches. I will also e-mail cacheowners if I think that their ratings are overoptimistic, but on a friendly note.

 

I've doubled my finds this weekend (I have two now ), and I placed a private cache just for my kids to get them interested (all kids love a treasure hunt, don't they). We'll keep on caching.

 

To Briansnat: I'm sorry for accusing you of "an attitude" (the word also doesn't have the same value in Swedish as in English). What I meant was that in my opinion, just because something is a certain way it doesn't always have to stay that way.

 

Thanks again.

[+Mystery Ink]

Welcome svekke we hope you and your kids have a fun and enjoyable time with this great hobby.

[+Nerves]

I understand some of your frustration svekke. I am temporarily wheelchair bound having broken my leg in four places. This has certainly changed my perspective on many things including geocaching which I haven't done in two months.

 

There are some wheelchair accessible caches in the New England area and I've had geocachers offer to bring me to them. I guess I'm still too fearful of breaking another limb while traversing the snow and ice so I haven't gone.

 

I think that once you have more finds you will get a better sense of which caches are appropriate for someone in a wheelchair. Some of the caches might be easy to roll up to but difficult to reach as The Alabama Rambler mentioned. Does your son have a "reacher"? Mine is a 36 inch long lightweight pole with pincers and a magnet on the end useful for grabbing things out of reach while seated in a wheelchair.

 

You might also eventually think about starting a "handicache" series or teaming up with a local disability group and other geocachers to hold a wheelchair accessible event in your area. We have had an event here that simulates finding caches if you're blind which really opened people's eyes so to speak.

 

Lastly, you can check out this website:

 

Handicaches

 

Good luck, enjoy, and don't give up!

Edited December 19, 2005 by Nerves

[+Poidawg]

I have not read the previous posts, so forgive me if I repeat something.

 

I have a physical disabililty, although I am not chair bound and I can handle alot, there are somedays I can barely get to the car. I ALWAYS check the Topozone and Satellite links to learn as much as I can about the terrain, before attempting a cache.

 

In the winter of course the terrain can vary wildly due to flooding, snowfall, standing water, mud and muck. Some of the people who hide caches in the area I live actually use the disabled access (person in a wheelchair) icon on their pages to indicate that the cache is wheelchair accessible. I find this very helpful on days Im not doing too well.

Good Luck to you and your kids, Happy Holidays and Hope the New Year is prosperous and Happy.

[+Tricyclebob]

I am also disabled in the fact that I have only one arm. I have a slight mobility problem but can get about quite well. My problem is opening some of the caches which naturally have to be watertight and therefore difficult to open. My question is this; if I reach a geocache but am unable to open it to sign the log can I still log it as 'found'?

[+SwineFlew]

I am also disabled in the fact that I have only one arm. I have a slight mobility problem but can get about quite well. My problem is opening some of the caches which naturally have to be watertight and therefore difficult to open. My question is this; if I reach a geocache but am unable to open it to sign the log can I still log it as 'found'?

If you found my cache, I would let ur log stand if u email what the cache look like. My dad suffered from a stroke and he only have one arm that work and I know I have to open many things for him.

[+niraD]

I am also disabled in the fact that I have only one arm. I have a slight mobility problem but can get about quite well. My problem is opening some of the caches which naturally have to be watertight and therefore difficult to open. My question is this; if I reach a geocache but am unable to open it to sign the log can I still log it as 'found'?

In theory, if you don't sign the log, then the cache owner can delete your online "Found it!" log.

 

In practice, I think most cache owners would let your log stand if you explained the situation. Although there may be concerns if you find a decoy instead of the actual cache, or if you find a puzzlebox container of some sort where the point of the cache is to figure out how to open the container.

[+Michaelcycle]

I am also disabled in the fact that I have only one arm. I have a slight mobility problem but can get about quite well. My problem is opening some of the caches which naturally have to be watertight and therefore difficult to open. My question is this; if I reach a geocache but am unable to open it to sign the log can I still log it as 'found'?

 

COs in my area are pretty understanding about unsignable logs (often due to water damage) and will accept a picture of the cache. Some COs may not appreciate that, however, because it reveals something they want hidden or ruins a surprise for future cachers. If you decide to go the picture route I would email the CO first before publishing it on the site.

 

Edited to add: this is one of the few "provident" thread bumps I've seen in a while...

Edited October 2, 2013 by Michaelcycle

[+TheAlabamaRambler]

Carry a cell phone and PM the owner a picture of the cache. It would be hard to deny a find!

[+Tricyclebob]

Thanks for all your prompt replies. I'll make sure I have my camera with me now when I go geocaching and do as you suggested. A private email with the photo would be the best option I guess rather than putting it straight on the found it log. The other way would be to go with a fellow geocatcher I suppose if I could link up with someone from my area. Currently near Nantwich in Cheshire UK.