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Bait And Switch

Trez*

By Trez*
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Trez*

+Trez*

Posted
Posted

I am working on my new Trezure Coin and tried to use coinsforanything (Coins for Anything) as my vendor.

 

I sent them the art work I want to use and they ask for $135.00 to show good faith and quoted me a price of $2.10 per coin for 300 coins.

Approved the art work and got and invoice based on the $2.10 price and paid that if full.

 

When I went to get order update they upped the price to $2.45 per coin and added a fee of $100.00 for shipping.

 

When I called to complain the answer I got was I could cancel my order but loose the $135.00 because to the time they had spend working on the art.

 

I would highly suggest that you not use these guys if you plan on ordering any coins as they have proved to be untruthful in there business practices the classic "Bait and Switch".

 

So my dilemma now is do I just walk away from $135.00 an feel good that I did not do business with them or pay the pirates their blood money and chalk it up to a lesson learned?

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junglehair

+junglehair

Posted
Posted (edited)

I can see where they could charge you $100 for shipping (it's highway robbery, but I can see that the shipping part was still outstanding), but how are they charging you more per coin now when you have already paid the invoice for them??

 

Edit to add: Your shipping charges probably include their cost to have them shipped from China - where they likely send them out to be minted.

Edited by junglehair
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biggeeks

+biggeeks

Posted
Posted

Hi Trez,

First of all I'm sorry to hear about your bad experience with Coinsforanything. That sucks.

 

However, I recently had a coin made through them (CCGC CITO), and I found it to be overall an easy process. I ended up sending the artwork back and forth 3 times and they (Rachael) were patient & professional through the whole thing. The price/coin price did change on me too, but both types of metal went down 10c so I didn't complain.

 

I know exactly what you're talking about with the shipping. I was a little annoyed to see a $120 shipping charge. They advertise free shipping on their site, but that shipping is from them to you. It appears that like many coin manufacturer's they send their design to China to actually be made. The $100+ shipping charge ends up being the international shipping of those heavy metal filled boxes from China to them.

 

The gist: That shipping charge isn't advertised well enough, but I don't think they're running a "bait & switch". I was happy with the end result.

 

PS - If you do change coin companies I keep hearing good things about "coins and pins".

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AtlantaGal

+AtlantaGal

Posted
Posted (edited)

Do you still have your original quote? Did that quote include shipping costs? Who was your order placed with?

 

If not, I think you're fine. My shipping ranged from $65 to $75 for 150 coins. However, I was informed of that amount up front. If you didn't have the shipping amount included in your pricing before, that really is the normal amount with them.

 

Edit Added:

Like Ladycacher said, they are having real issues over there. I switched vendors also. I only use them for reorders. But the price my CC was charged is exactly what I was quoted (and that included shipping).

 

Find your quote. There is no argument they can give you on the price per coin. You would be in the right. But the shipping charge is standard, and I always ask all of that upfront. To me, it's part of my coin cost.

Edited by AtlantaGal
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Kealia

+Kealia

Posted
Posted

3 words: Coins and Pins :lol: .

 

Seriously, sorry to hear about that. Afraid I can't offer a suggestion on what to do; it comes down to what you're going to feel good about doing.

 

For me, KV Coins did the Santa Cruz coins we did last year. They were such a pain in a**, but the coins came out great. We're going to do an annual coin for the event this coin was for but I've decided to use Coins and Pins (based on recent experience with them) even though it means I can't re-use the dies like I wanted to.

 

Personally, I'll feel better about not giving them more business - but it's not my personal money I'm talking about either...

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nielsenc

+nielsenc

Posted
Posted (edited)

As they say, there is no free lunch.

 

As most people have already posted, S&H is either A) Built into the cost of the coin or B) Charged as a seperate line item. For us, we listed it clearly as a seperate line item. On our price sheet we call out that S&H is from Hong Kong to our location and on to you (in the US). I guess the only way to avoid high S&H cost is to order local, like through the Alaska Mint.

 

[Link removed by moderator]

Edited by Keystone
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Renegade Knight

+Renegade Knight

Posted
Posted

Thanks for the feedback. I would of been entirly annoyed had I been in your shoes. The price of the coin should be fixed once you start work in it. S&H charges should not exist on a site that lists as having free shipping.

 

If they want to charge you shipping from the factory to your door they should detail that up front before they ask you for a dime.

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Trez*

+Trez*

Posted
  • Author
Posted (edited)
you canceled your order because of a price-difference of $0,35 ???

$0.35 X 300 coins comes to $105 + $100 S&H = $205 dollar difference. Seems significant go me.

Here is the actual invoice they sent me which I paid in full.

 

Now they will not honor this invoice and want an additional $205.00.

 

When I tried to cancel based on this "Bait and Switch". They said they would keep $135.00 for their trouble... Their trouble? What about mine!

 

 

Invoice

Invoice Date: 11/16/2005

Invoice #: 897

Bill To:

Trez Moore

trezmoore@msn.com

Coins For Anything, LLC

106 BRENWICK COURT

STAFFORD, VA 22554

P.O. Number:

Due Date: 11/16/2005

Project:

Total

Balance Due

Payments/Credits

Description Hours/Qty Rate Amount

1.5" Shiny Gold coins with no color on both sides. 300 2.10 630.00

One time die mold charge 2 99.00 198.00

Postage and Delivery FREE 0.00 0.00

Out-of-state sale, exempt from sales tax 0.00% 0.00

$828.00

$693.00

$-135.00 paid

Edited by Trez003
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ElmoClarity

ElmoClarity

Posted
Posted
When I tried to cancel based on this "Bait and Switch". They said they would keep $135.00 for their trouble... Their trouble? What about mine!

This is splitting hairs, but that is really not bait and switch. More like blackmail.

 

If you paid the invoice with a credit card and it has been less than 30 days (or maybe 60), call your credit card company and dispute the charge. You can provide them with the original invoice to show what you agreed to and that they are not honoring the agreement. You may be able to get ALL your money back.

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PCFrog

PCFrog

Posted
Posted
Sounds like you need a lawyer.

Dito...

 

You have a legit in writing quote from them. To change prices without prior notification or consent you find is against the law. Good faith runs both ways. You have a good chance of wining a small claims suit just based on the good faith, then add the fact you have it in wringing. My suggestion is you be more forceful. If they don't give in then file the $30+ fee in a small claims court against them.

 

If they walk with your money they will continue to try it on others.

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GrandpaKim

+GrandpaKim

Posted
Posted

I did mine through The Caching Place and I was very pleased with both the service and the final product. No hidden charges, everything was up front. And the service was fantastic! action-smiley-033.gif

 

As for your problem, if it was me, I'd quit (lose the $135.00) and go with some other mint. I would do it this way just because I wouldn't want them to profit anymore than they already have from me. :lol:

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Damenace

+Damenace

Posted
Posted

I say someone type up a letter and post it here with the e-mail address to the company. Then everyone on this community can copy the same letter and e-mail it all at the same time. We can flood their e-mail box with the same complaint :lol: . And no it is not SPAM since it is coming from so many DIFFERANT e-mail addresses.

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Nazgul

+Nazgul

Posted
Posted
This is splitting hairs, but that is really not bait and switch.

Agreed. Bait and switch is when you see a camera advertised for $500 and it's the best price around, so you call and they tell you it's out of stock but really they never intended to sell that model at that price. Instead they offer you what they're really trying to sell, a different camera (often similar but the next model better and more expensive) or a package of that camera with accessories you don't really want. Hence the "bait" (camera you really want) and "switch" (attempt to sell you something else.)

 

What you're talking about sounds more like a "hidden charge" or something. When you are given an estimate that shows a line item of "Postage and Delivery FREE 0.00 0.00" then that's what you should expect.

 

Sorry to hear about your troubles.

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CacheDragons

+CacheDragons

Posted
Posted (edited)

My thoughts

 

It would cost more to go to court than to just walk away but you could contact the better business bureau, and see what they say. Did you pay by credit card, if so then contact you’re Credit Card Company and have the charges reversed due to them breaking the initial contract.

 

I second that working with coinsandpins was a great experience

Edited by CacheDragons
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Bull Moose

+Bull Moose

Posted
Posted (edited)

Wow.

It's like it's right out of my contract law casebook. I'm studying for the final.

I'm not a lawyer yet, but if this was a problem on my final I'd say:

 

He's stuck with $2.10 a coin. The $135 you sent him is consideration for a negotiated contract. When he accepted it, he was bound. As for shipping and handling, since that wasn't expressly stated, the UCC (which usually covers the sale of goods in almost every state) will allow for a gap filling term of fair market value - the actual cost of UPS or whatever, plus actual cost of shipping materials, plus a few bucks for time would seem fair. The only problem is, for over $500 the UCC requires something in writing. (Any of this on e-mail?)

 

In any case, since he is the one breaching, he certainly isn't entitled to your $135 if he doesn't deliver the coins.

 

Too bad in reality there's probably not much you can do, other than send a letter stating your position and hope he gives in since $135 probably isn't worth the time and effort.

 

EDIT: Or just get AG to call.

Edited by Bull Moose
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Trez*

+Trez*

Posted
  • Author
Posted

Well since my post Atlanta Gal has come to my rescue and called the owner on my behalf. He has agreed to honor the invoice price given me and a apology for the mix up.

 

I want to hire Atlanta Gal to handle all my disputes... She Has CLOUT.

 

Thanks AG

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Dancingfool

Dancingfool

Posted
Posted
AtlantaGal Posted on Dec 9 2005, 12:26 PM

  I contacted the owner of CFA. He assured me Trez would be taken care of personally and wouldn't have to pay any charges additional to the invoice he has already paid.

 

Easy solution to a complex problem.Nice move AG.I used CFA for both my personal coin and the Maryland coin.Both transactions went well though shipping did cause some problems.They are produced in China and because of the size of the Md coin order it was delayed and they agreed to direct ship to me.For my coins I hoped to pick them up to avoid the shipping but found out it was the overseas part that was the real expense.

Both coins came out great and I found them professional and easy to deal with.I am happy to see they will honor the quote they had given

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Damenace

+Damenace

Posted
Posted

So does one do business with this company knowing that we can contact AtlantaGal to solve any disputes or do we still heed warning to the issues that occured???

 

I know that AtlantaGal is a great person and I think it was awesome of her to do what she did, but personally I would rather not run the risk of even having to deal with the problem. the catch to this is, this could have happened to anyone with any company.

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IceCreamMan

+IceCreamMan

Posted
Posted

I highly recoment The Caching Place. I worked with them on the NEFGA and NEFGA Jeep Club Coins, my own coin and the Mrs ICM coin. They are now working on a coin for my parents. They are helpful and easy to reach. Prompt on what they promise and quick to get the coins done. Not only that, they are geocachers. Coins for cachers by cachers.

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AtlantaGal

+AtlantaGal

Posted
Posted
So does one do business with this company knowing that we can contact AtlantaGal to solve any disputes or do we still heed warning to the issues that occured???

 

I know that AtlantaGal is a great person and I think it was awesome of her to do what she did, but personally I would rather not run the risk of even having to deal with the problem. the catch to this is, this could have happened to anyone with any company.

I don't want to air a bunch of dirty laundary on the forums. But there have been some serious changes in the way that business was when I first used them in May versus how they are now. I use them for reorders of coins they already produced. I have taken new coin designs to other companies since Oct.

 

I personally recommended this company to Trez (hey, he was using KV ;) ). Because of that, I felt somewhat responsible.

 

The owner IS a top notch guy. The same cannot be said about the rest of the staff unfortunitly.

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