Women Who Cache Alone

[Hugh Jazz]

Multiple Choice Test:

 

Put yourself in the attacker's shoes for just a minute. If YOU were a lone attacker, rapist, murderer etc., hiding out in the woods waiting for your chance to perpetrate mayhem on random geocachers. It's your lucky day, along comes your choice of one of the following:

 

Victim 1) Carrying a Cell Phone (strong service area, 9-1-1 preprogrammed on a 1-key speed dial)

Victim 2) Wearing a "Black Belt" (karate, judo, tai-kwon-do, pick your favorite martial art here)

Victim 3) Concealing a 3oz Police-Strength 17% Pepper Spray (effective range 10 feet, 7 seconds total spray time available)

Victim 4) Concealing a Compact .45 cal Pistol, total capacity 11 rounds. (Glock 30 or equivalent)

 

Assume each victim is female, physically fit, practiced with whatever defensive means at her disposal, weight about 70% of yours. Each is alert and becomes visibly suspicious of your approach at say 25 feet distance. Oh and the wind is light and variable. Partly sunny, 72 degrees F.

 

Q1: Which of these would you prefer to attack?

Q2: Which of these would you least want to attack?

 

How would your answers differ if you were not a lone wolf but the leader of a gang of three (total) attackers?

 

How would your answers differ if you were armed with a knife? A baseball bat? A woodsman's axe? A cheap Brazilian-made .25 cal "saturday night special" handgun?

[+New England n00b]

Trick question.

 

1 - I wouldn't want to attack ANYBODY, but if I did

 

2 - I don't know - if the area allows concealed carry, it's like a box of chocolates. You never know what injury (or worse) you are going to get.

 

EDIT: You know what? I'd least want to attack a martial arts experts. If you are planning anything other than mugging, getting in close is a really bad thing.

Edited December 7, 2005 by New England n00b

[+bobbarley]

Anybody have the stats on how many handguns are used AGAINST those carrying them? More guns=more gun violence. It is your constitutional right though. Ladies, if you must cache alone defend yourself through avoiding bad situations, observation and a good dog. It can't be used against you.

In 1998,151 gun homicides in Canada, 11,789 in the US.

Some Stats

[Sadie]

Multiple Choice Test:

 

Put yourself in the attacker's shoes for just a minute. If YOU were a lone attacker, rapist, murderer etc., hiding out in the woods waiting for your chance to perpetrate mayhem on random geocachers. It's your lucky day, along comes your choice of one of the following:

 

Victim 1) Carrying a Cell Phone (strong service area, 9-1-1 preprogrammed on a 1-key speed dial)

Victim 2) Wearing a "Black Belt" (karate, judo, tai-kwon-do, pick your favorite martial art here)

Victim 3) Concealing a 3oz Police-Strength 17% Pepper Spray (effective range 10 feet, 7 seconds total spray time available)

Victim 4) Concealing a Compact .45 cal Pistol, total capacity 11 rounds. (Glock 30 or equivalent)

 

Assume each victim is female, physically fit, practiced with whatever defensive means at her disposal, weight about 70% of yours. Each is alert and becomes visibly suspicious of your approach at say 25 feet distance. Oh and the wind is light and variable. Partly sunny, 72 degrees F.

 

Q1: Which of these would you prefer to attack?

Q2: Which of these would you least want to attack?

 

How would your answers differ if you were not a lone wolf but the leader of a gang of three (total) attackers?

 

How would your answers differ if you were armed with a knife? A baseball bat? A woodsman's axe? A cheap Brazilian-made .25 cal "saturday night special" handgun?

Bad premise.

 

Typically, none of these defenses are visible. So, ruling in or out a victim based on these choices is moot.

Otherwise, deprive the woman of her purse and odds are she doesn't have the last two options available. Martial arts or street fighting skills are a learned skill. If the person looked confident and alert, I would wait for someone else.

 

Avoidance is the best, but I still say a dog is the best deterrent.

[+Geo Froggy]

I carry pepper spray, which comes out in a stream and not a spray.Fox pepper spray A few months ago it was recommended by some LEO’s, on this list, as best for using outdoors as is isn’t suppose to blow back to you in the wind. I also carry either a hiking pole with a sharp pointy end, or a sturdy hiking staff that I expect either could do some damage. Anyone I pass on the trail I look in the eye and speak too. I really don’t think any fool would consider me a victim and I feel much safer in the woods than in a parking lot. I expect the serial killer, rapist or thief will be patrolling urban areas, in the woods you are more likely find homeless folks, pot growers and drunks who just want you to go away.

[+Mopar]

Anybody have the stats on how many handguns are used AGAINST those carrying them? More guns=more gun violence. It is your constitutional right though. Ladies, if you must cache alone defend yourself through avoiding bad situations, observation and a good dog. It can't be used against you.

Ahhh..... gotta have that one. Used against you.

Extremely rare. Especially with proper training. You don't present a weapon unless you need to use it. In the case of a firearm, not until there is no other way out and you fear for your life. Kill or be killed.

Think about it. Would YOU want to grab a loaded gun out of someone's hand? If it was that simple and safe to do, why not just grab it back? Do most police (unarmed) just take the bad guy's gun from them?

Most police carry pepper spray and a firearm, not a dog. There is a reason for that. Those are 2 of the most effective and efficient methods to protect themselves from harm.

 

In 1998,151 gun homicides in Canada, 11,789 in the US.

Some Stats

Apples to oranges.

In 2004, 622 total reported homicides in Canada, 16,137 in the US.

It should be noted that in the Canadian stats, deaths caused by criminal negligence, suicide, and accidental or justifiable homicide are not included.

In the US, if a mutant shoots a police officer and the officer shoots and kills the mutant, that's still a firearm homicide. Even funnier, if a pair of 20yr old gangbangers shoot each other over a drug deal; the Brady Bunch counts that as 2 innocent children killed by evil guns.

[+reveritt]

Why is it that whenever a woman brings up the topic of geocaching alone (and it has been discussed before), right-wing males gun lovers have to hijack the discussion?

[+New England n00b]

Why is it that whenever a woman brings up the topic of geocaching alone (and it has been discussed before), right-wing males gun lovers have to hijack the discussion?

Hijack? Where? Looks like a relatively flame-less discussion of personal safety and various means of achieving it. Well, flameless until you posted that 'right-wing males' comment anyway.

[Hugh Jazz]

Why is it that whenever a woman brings up the topic of geocaching alone (and it has been discussed before), right-wing males gun lovers have to hijack the discussion?

Because, like it or not, a gun is a woman's best defense. The media for whatever reasons have convinced you (as they did me) into thinking that a woman can reliably fend off an attacker by scratching him with your car keys. BTW I'm not a right-wing anything. And Geo-Ho would resent being called a male.

 

It's interesting to see that no one has yet answered my test. It's a vaild test, don't skirt around it. Think about it. Answer all the questions.

 

Which one would you pick if you could? Put yourself in the bad guy's shoes. Do you fear a karate chop at 25 feet? Can any cellphone hold off your gang at any distance? Do you fear the lady with the 3oz tube of hot sauce? (and I was very generous there, most of the keychain tubes are 1/2 oz at 10% strength or less). Can you get the gun away from the lady with the Glock from 25 feet away and use it against her?

 

You don't have to post your answers here if you don't like, but think about the choices from the bad guy's perspective. Really think about it. Don't quote me statistics, there are no party-line politics, no right wing gun nuts, or gun control proponents any where near this scenario, and this isn't Canada because the woman with the Glock wouldn't be able to legally carry or own it there. You are simply the bad guy here. Which victim would you pick if you could choose? Which would you never pick?

Edited December 7, 2005 by Hugh Jazz

[+Nerves]

Why is it that whenever a woman brings up the topic of geocaching alone (and it has been discussed before), right-wing males gun lovers have to hijack the discussion?

Yes, why is that?

 

There are loads of studies with statistics that show criminal gun use is far more common than self defense gun use. It's just a delusion to think that a woman is going to be able to whip out a gun and defend herself.

 

Additionally, most perps look pretty normal when you pass them on the trail. They may then double back and follow you for a distance catching you unaware i.e. while signing the logbook or just looking at the birds and trees. Yes, we must remain vigilant at all times but perps will pick the times when you are least vigilant. It's part of the "hunt" and the "fun" for them. Or, they may just lie in wait on the trail while you walk back to your car. You won't be able to get your gun, release the safety and shoot them. They will overpower you before you can even scream. Some like the slow seduction to death in which they use the "get her to trust me" technique to make you think they're safe to talk to. Remember that charmer Ted Bundy?

[Hugh Jazz]

You won't be able to get your gun, release the safety and shoot them. They will overpower you before you can even scream. Some like the slow seduction to death in which they use the "get her to trust me" technique to make you think they're safe to talk to. Remember that charmer Ted Bundy?

 

It sounds like what you're saying is there's no hope. That's sad. Someone has convinced you that you are powerless against an attack. Who would want to convince you that you are powerless and why?

 

As Bart Simpson once said: "Can't win. Why try?"

Edited December 7, 2005 by Hugh Jazz

[+Moose Mob]

Why is it that whenever a woman brings up the topic of geocaching alone (and it has been discussed before), right-wing males gun lovers have to hijack the discussion?

reveritt is correct.

 

The topic was caching alone, and the emphasis has become why we should or shouldn't carry guns.

 

Let's keep this on track and ease up on the hysteria.

 

Thanks

[magellan315]

Multiple Choice Test:

 

Put yourself in the attacker's shoes for just a minute. If YOU were a lone attacker, rapist, murderer etc., hiding out in the woods waiting for your chance to perpetrate mayhem on random geocachers. It's your lucky day, along comes your choice of one of the following:

 

Victim 1) Carrying a Cell Phone (strong service area, 9-1-1 preprogrammed on a 1-key speed dial)

Victim 2) Wearing a "Black Belt" (karate, judo, tai-kwon-do, pick your favorite martial art here)

Victim 3) Concealing a 3oz Police-Strength 17% Pepper Spray (effective range 10 feet, 7 seconds total spray time available)

Victim 4) Concealing a Compact .45 cal Pistol, total capacity 11 rounds. (Glock 30 or equivalent)

 

Assume each victim is female, physically fit, practiced with whatever defensive means at her disposal, weight about 70% of yours. Each is alert and becomes visibly suspicious of your approach at say 25 feet distance. Oh and the wind is light and variable. Partly sunny, 72 degrees F.

 

Q1: Which of these would you prefer to attack?

Q2: Which of these would you least want to attack?

 

You want answer to your test, here we go. If was going to attack any of the women in this group the answer would be ALL OF THEM. Since they are not holding a sign in their hands that says, "I have a gun", or "I have pepper spray" there is nothing that would deter me. Your test is squewed to the assumption that I know how each person is armed.

 

Having been the victim of a violent crime; mugged in open air suburban bus terminal, 3pm on a Saturday. I can only speak from my own experience. I never saw it coming, who ever attacked me came up from behind me and bounced my head off the bullet proof window at the information desk. No one saw the guy, because it happened to fast, and it was three blocks away from the police station. I spent three days in the hospital with a concussion and for some unkown reason they didn't take my wallet.

 

In my opinion if your going to be assualted, its going to happen so fast you won't be able to do anything. One good hit to the head or a weapon pointed at you will make you think twice about reaching for your protective device.

 

We have some LEO's on the forums. I'd like to see what their thoughts are on this test.

[+Titansfan]

I'll save my gun debate for other forums, I didn't reply to this trend to get into a pro or anti gun debate.

 

If the situation doesn't feel right (armed or not, big dog on a leash or not, pepper spray, whatever), the game of geocache is NOT worth loss of life. Trust your instincts and leave the area.

[+Kerstin76]

Why is it that whenever a woman brings up the topic of geocaching alone (and it has been discussed before), right-wing males gun lovers have to hijack the discussion?

That is an interesting question and - from my european point of view - always hard to understand. Personally, I would never want to carry a gun; in germany they only belong in the hands of LEO's. However gun's were never the question of the OP but experiences of others.

As I said earlier, I never had any bad experience and as long as you stay in safe neighbourhoods, what is the problem to cache alone as a woman?

[magellan315]

Coming back the OP’s original post, here are my thoughts after 4 years of Geocaching, without a partner.

 

In all honesty I am more concerned about being injured by losing my footing than of being assaulted in the woods. One person already mentioned how they slipped on a trail and I met someone else who did the same thing. I feel safer carrying a whistle because in the event of an injury I can blow it and signal for help. I’ve found that as the terrain rating goes up, two stars or higher the likely hood of running into someone in the woods goes down very quickly.

 

Caches in parks with terrain ratings under two stars I check to see how many cars are parked, if people are using the park, and the general condition of the park.

[Hugh Jazz]

Back on topic then...

I never cache alone as a woman.

 

I sometimes cache alone as a man. That is to say, I mean, I'm always a man but sometimes I cache alone. But never as a woman. Not even dressed like a woman, though I have used a female caching handle (Judy_Jetson) in the past, so I've logged a cache or two alone online as a woman but never actually cached as a woman, alone or otherwise! Then later I changed Judy_Jetson into Hugh Jazz and the rest is history.

[+reveritt]

... That is to say, I mean, I'm always a man...

Always? You seem a bit ambivalent about gender role. It's perfectly OK to go caching in woman's clothing if it will make you feel better.

[+ladysmokeater]

I almost exclusively cache alone. I carry a knife and a walking stick. Makes me feel safe anyhow.... I also let someone know where im going and always have a cell phone.

im not too worried about some one "jerking me up off the street" as I am a, shall we say, well built woman, and unless caught unawares I'd be a tough one to "jerk up".... lets hope I never have to find out, eh?

[+Polgara]

This is easy, if you uare a woman being perpetrated, all you got to do is throw up on yourself. Every man in the world will automatically back up 50 feet.

[Hugh Jazz]

It's perfectly OK to go caching in woman's clothing if it will make you feel better.

Hmmm....

That gives me an idea for a locationless cache along similar lines of Snoogans' "Nude Cacher" TC...

[+FlygURL]

Hi, I'm the original poster... Many of you have made me even more paranoid.

[+Moose Mob]

Hi, I'm the original poster... Many of you have made me even more paranoid.

My daughter is high drama also. Typically she isn't "wrong", but the perspective is way over to one side.

 

If you feel safe in a local park in broad daylight and other families are playing in the park, go for it. If you feel comfortable going to Wal mart at dusk, go ahaed and grab the micro while you are there.

 

If you are OK going there by yourself if you aren't caching, then I would say go ahead and go there if you are.

[+nancois]

I always have trouble deciding which of my sidearms I should use on a charging attacker. To avoid the hassle, I just try to keep my eyes open.

 

I'm going to take an educated guess that most Mr. Bad Guys fall into one of 3 categories:

 

a) The type that you probably have already gone out for coffee with and you may even take caching with you.

 

b The stranger that has been watching you for a while and was waiting for the right time to attack.

 

c) The drug addict/homeless person/ thug that you stumbled across by accident.

 

The first is the most common but least regarded type. I usually avoid these by getting to know somebody pretty darn well before going for a long walk alone in the woods with them, although I've foolishly taken risks in the past (but that's another story).

 

The second type is a little trickier to avoid. But he probably won't first see you while you are walking down a dark trail; more likely he will spot you at someplace like the quick mart. Keep an eye out for for people around you; if you notice the same shady person more than once (or even just once, depending), change your plans to meet up with a group.

 

The third type I avoid by being extra vigilant around urban parks and greenways, especially if there is crappy housing, industrial areas or bars and such nearby. If the neighborhood looks like a war zone, don't get out of your car; just send a nastygram to the person who placed the cache there.

 

I believe your senses and your judgement are your best defense. If you use those you can be as safe as anyone else! Most important, have fun

Edited December 7, 2005 by nancois

[Sadie]

Hi, I'm the original poster... Many of you have made me even more paranoid.

Heck, if it feels good, do it.

 

Don't let the folks convince you that the sky is falling.

[hide & seekers]

Others said it before, I'll say it again: dogs are great! My frequent caching partner is Zoe-dog the German Shepherd. I've never felt uncomfortable being out alone, but I think the big-dog factor deters a lot of people from approaching.

[+Camper17]

FlygURL - Situational awareness is Rule #1. Be aware of your surrounding and don't get too focused on searching for the cache that someone can sneak up on you.

 

If it doesn't feel right, don't do it. There are urban caches that I have done in the daylight that you couldn't pay me to do at night. And I'm 6'2, 200+, know Karate and have a CCW.

 

Find a caching buddy and if he can't always go when and where you want to go, recruit some others into the Geocaching community.

 

It's only a game and games are about having fun.

 

My $.02 worth

 

Camper17

 

(FlygURL - aren't you suppose to be in class????)

[+bobbarley]

Apples to oranges.

In 2004, 622 total reported homicides in Canada, 16,137 in the US.

It should be noted that in the Canadian stats, deaths caused by criminal negligence, suicide, and accidental or justifiable homicide are not included.

Are you trying to justify gun violence by saying more people are killed in Canada by guns than are in the stats?

16,137!!! people killed in the US in 1 year! How is that sane? Worried about terrorist with bombs? I'd say worry about your neighbor with guns.

[+clearpath]

Women !!! If you want to feel safe while geocaching alone, don't read this thread.

[+FlygURL]

Find a caching buddy and if he can't always go when and where you want to go, recruit some others into the Geocaching community.

 

...

 

(FlygURL - aren't you suppose to be in class????)

Camper17 - Know anyone I can go caching with?? And, aren't you supposed to be working?

 

All - Camper17 is one of my best caching buddies, right behind my husband, dad, and daughter. I do prefer to cache with others. It's just that my need for caching sometimes exceeds other's needs for caching. I admit it, I am addicted.

 

And, I am recruitung - took 5 newbies out into the woods today at lunch looking again for That's Not Fair, with no luck. We will be trying again soon.

 

FlygURL

[Sadie]

Find a caching buddy and if he can't always go when and where you want to go, recruit some others into the Geocaching community.

 

...

 

(FlygURL - aren't you suppose to be in class????)

Camper17 - Know anyone I can go caching with?? And, aren't you supposed to be working?

 

All - Camper17 is one of my best caching buddies, right behind my husband, dad, and daughter. I do prefer to cache with others. It's just that my need for caching sometimes exceeds other's needs for caching. I admit it, I am addicted.

 

And, I am recruitung - took 5 newbies out into the woods today at lunch looking again for That's Not Fair, with no luck. We will be trying again soon.

 

FlygURL

I'll cache with you.

[+Mopar]

Apples to oranges.

In 2004, 622 total reported homicides in Canada, 16,137 in the US.

It should be noted that in the Canadian stats, deaths caused by criminal negligence, suicide, and accidental or justifiable homicide are not included.

Are you trying to justify gun violence by saying more people are killed in Canada by guns than are in the stats?

16,137!!! people killed in the US in 1 year! How is that sane? Worried about terrorist with bombs? I'd say worry about your neighbor with guns.

It's apples to oranges because you are comparing two different forms of stats. Canada excludes justifiable homicide from their murder stats, whereas in the US, even if a police officer lawfully kills someone in the line of duty, it's listed as a homicide.

 

It's apples to oranges because there are probably more people living within 250 miles of me here in the US then there are in the entire country of Canada.

 

It's apples to oranges because murder is not the only violent crime. If you look at ALL forms of violent crimes, like rapes, assaults, carjackings, etc, you will find that overall it's dropped dramatically in most states in the US, and yet risen just as drastically in countries with "sensible gun control"; like Canada, UK, Australia, and Mexico.

 

It's apples to oranges because here in the US, each state is allowed to enact it's own laws (including gun laws) and the places with the strictest gun laws have the highest crime rates. Why is it that cities and states that make it virtually impossible for a person to defend themselves (like DC, Chicago, NYC, Camden, Boston) have a much higher crime rate per capita then someplace like VT. Despite what some people may think, guns don't sneak out at night and kill people. They don't have some form of mind control that makes good people do bad things. Good people with a gun are still good people, and bad people will be still be bad people, even without one.

How many of those gun crimes are committed by lawful CCW holders? (answer, somewhere around .01%)

 

Worried about terrorist with bombs? I'd say worry about your neighbor with guns.

Why would I worry about my neighbors with guns? I know that they have passed local, state and federal background checks. I know they have no criminal record. I know they have no record of drug or alcohol abuse. I know they have never had a restraining order against them. I know they have no record of any mental health issues. I know they have taken training in the safe and proper use of firearms. I know they are 3-10 times less likely then the average American to commit ANY type of crime. How much do you really know about your neighbors WITHOUT guns?

 

Anyway, this is going way off topic, and speaking of off topic, there is this long-running thread in the OT forum where you can continue this if you like.

 

Back on topic, as posted above, my wife cached alone before we even met, and she carried a firearm whenever it was legal to do so.

[+briansnat]

Never ever go with the creep to "crime scene number two." At "crime scene number one," where you first encounter the bad guy, you have a chance to escape, even if the attacker has a gun or knife on you. You will most likely be injured, stabbed, or shot. You may even be killed, but you do at least have a chance to get away or cry out for help in a mall parking lot or other such public place.

 

Yep a friend of mine was approached by two guys toting guns in NYC. One put the gun to his head and demanded that he follow them to a nearby alley. My friend said "You do what you're gonna do to me here. "I'm not going into that alley". They punched him in the face, grabbed his wallet and ran.

 

He still thinks to this day had he gone into that alley he'd be dead.

[+Moose Mob]

Perhaps I am out of line and taking this personal, but...

 

I have a problem when people insist that people need to be armed to the teeth in order to go to the mall for lunch. The country I live in may not be crime free, but it's a heck of a lot better than the message some of you are sending.

 

steps off soap box.

[+Nerves]

I think that my father and husband have convinced me to be very paranoid to the point that if the cache is not in an open space, say it is in urban woods, I am less likely to search for it, or if I do choose to search for it, less likely to find it becasue I am nervous.

 

Comments? Experiences?

This is the original question. I think this discussion needs to get back on topic.

[+clearpath]

I think that my father and husband have convinced me to be very paranoid to the point that if the cache is not in an open space, say it is in urban woods, I am less likely to search for it, or if I do choose to search for it, less likely to find it becasue I am nervous.

 

Comments?  Experiences?

This is the original question. I think this discussion needs to get back on topic.

There are several drugs that your doctor can prescribe if you are concerned about being 'nervous'.

[Hugh Jazz]

There are several drugs that your doctor can prescribe if you are concerned about being 'nervous'.

And when you take lots and lots of these drugs you'll realize that there's never any cause to be nervous at any time. You can go freely wherever you like, at any time, stop and smell the flowers, find some caches, because we all love each other and no one would ever try to hurt anyone, ever, for any reason.

 

Let's all join hands and sing.

[+Mopar]

Perhaps I am out of line and taking this personal, but...

 

I have a problem when people insist that people need to be armed to the teeth in order to go to the mall for lunch. The country I live in may not be crime free, but it's a heck of a lot better than the message some of you are sending.

 

steps off soap box.

I don't see anyone insisting a person be armed. To the contrary, I see lots of people insisting one should NEVER be armed.

 

Oh, and when you go to lunch at a mall, ya might want to skip this one, because bad things NEVER happen at the mall.

[+clearpath]

There are several drugs that your doctor can prescribe if you are concerned about being 'nervous'.

And when you take lots and lots of these drugs you'll realize that there's never any cause to be nervous at any time. You can go freely wherever you like, at any time, stop and smell the flowers, find some caches, because we all love each other and no one would ever try to hurt anyone, ever, for any reason.

 

Let's all join hands and sing.

"Michael row your boat ashore, aaa laaaay louuu ya ..."

[+Mearth]

This thread is downright creepy!

 

Fear, fear, fear, fear. Sheesh!

 

I've been wandering around outdoors alone for 30 years. I've encountered several "self-stimulators" and found that my outright laughter 'disarms' them nicely. A year ago a young fella tried to grab my pack off my back, but I was paying attention, perceived his attack effort and was able to spin and deflect him with no trouble at all. I study taiji, which helped with that a lot, but I also work with assaultive people I can't legally shoot. I've learned that even folks who intend to do real harm can be managed without you adopting their agenda.

 

It's creepy that so many of the men responding here are able to conjur these vivid scenes of violence. Maybe we need to be worried about cachers who are really suppressing their psychosis.

 

It takes training to learn how to control your adrenaline and continue thinking in assault situations. It takes training to learn how to use your body to your best benefit. It takes training to learn to use a handgun. Why not choose training in the first two...they are cheap, you have to maintain your body and mind anyway, and if you can't inadvertantly kill anyone with either of them. AND...learning to use your head and your body instead of reacting to the external triggers improves just about every aspect of your life. I have quite a bit of experience with firearms and am a fair shot. Would I carry one while I'm out, not hunting, "having fun"? Nope. Wouldn't be fun anymore.

 

Ok...a paintball gun would be fun. In fact....

[+CamoCacher]

I'm sorry but I strong;y disagree that a gun is my best defense. BS pure and simple. My DOG is my best defense. Trust me come at me in a threatening manner and while my dog is trying to rip out your throat I am hightailing it as far away from you as possible. Approach me nicely and while my dog will tolerate you and even lick your hand lay a hand on me and he'll get you while I am breaking away from your grip and hightailing it out there.

 

I don't have to wait for you to get close enough to ensure I shot you dead cuz my dog did it for me. He's got sharp white teeth and a growl that can chill you to the bone if prokoved. Heck he's scared me a few times when he has growled at other dogs.

 

And just so you know he's not mean, in all the time we've had our Dobie he's growled at two people. One time was when me and my neighbor were walking our dogs at 0530 and a guy appeared out of nowhere with no dog on a 4 degree morning. And of all the times we had walked we'd never seen him before. Needless to say he went the other way from us.

 

The other time was at my brother, who is a known drug user.

[+CamoCacher]

Coming back the OP’s original post, here are my thoughts after 4 years of Geocaching, without a partner.

 

In all honesty I am more concerned about being injured by losing my footing than of being assaulted in the woods. One person already mentioned how they slipped on a trail and I met someone else who did the same thing. I feel safer carrying a whistle because in the event of an injury I can blow it and signal for help. I’ve found that as the terrain rating goes up, two stars or higher the likely hood of running into someone in the woods goes down very quickly.

 

Caches in parks with terrain ratings under two stars I check to see how many cars are parked, if people are using the park, and the general condition of the park.

You are 100% correct!

[+CamoCacher]

Hi, I'm the original poster... Many of you have made me even more paranoid.

FlyGurl I think that you really don't have much to worry about as long as you are AWARE. Now your sorroundings, keep your head up, eyes looking around, don't get sucked into watching the GPS intently, look around and behind you. Make sure someone knows where you are going and how long. Your more likely to be hurt then jumped.

[+Hoosier Katie]

I shared earlier in this thread about how I have never felt threatend while out caching, but that I have also allowed my own subconscious fear to limit my activities. If I evaluate how to alleviate that fear, (I believe this is really the underlying question in the thread) I immediately think of how to arm myself in order to protect myself.

 

It's not surprising that the OPs question about women feeling threatened when out alone would lead to a discussion about the pros & cons of being armed. It's also completely expected that in a discussion about the pros & cons of being armed you will hear the following in response to the first pro offered: words like "Right Wing"; a Canadian quoting gun-crime statistics; and someone stating that criminals use guns more than non-criminals, are better at it, so it's hopeless. Every discussion I have ever had that starts with anything close to, "Is a woman safe out and about alone in this world?" has gone this way.

 

As a woman, and one who has a rather pragmatic & libertarian view of the personal choice to arm onself or not in order to feel safe, I must say that I do get offended at some of the above. Particularly when someone who is either a) not a woman or b ) lives in another country where there is no right to bear arms, makes the choice to be judgmental of a woman in America who is faced with this choice. Each of us needs to do what is right for each of us to feel safe. Whatever that is, just make your choice and then choose not to judge the choices of others.

 

My brother tells a story of how he was once approached by some kids with a gun who tried to rob him. He very calmy looked at them and said, "Man, I don't have no money. I gave it all to my old lady and then she got mad & threw me out! All I got is these here cookies. You want my cookies?" The kids looked at each other, put the gun away, and then sat and had a cookie with him, chatted for awhile and then went on there way. So, I suppose for those who choose not to be armed, maybe always carrying some Famous Amos around with you will do the trick!

Edited December 8, 2005 by Kama Raga

[ManD]

Wow, great thread !! Lots of good advice.

 

One half of ManD is male, the other, happily, not. Being the male half, I will say this...

It's a dangerouse wolrd out there, and you cannot pick the time or the place when that danger might cross your path. Be it a 4 legged predator or 2, in the woods or in the dark shadows of a parking lot where some cache is hidden.

 

I've seen a lot of discussion about the 2 legged variety, and none about the 4. Here in AZ we have large cats and some bears. In Phx we have all manner of 2 legged creeps, as in most urban areas.

 

When caching at night, I carry a cell phone, my trusty Glock and a flashlight with fresh batteries.

 

I have heard a lot here about SA (Situation Awareness). It is of course primary. If things get bad, with good SA, you can hopefully be able to anticipate the situation some.

 

Another thing I have not heard on this topic though is this... ALWAYS let someone know WHERE you are going, and WHEN you expect to return. And then let them know that you HAVE indeed returned when you do. Leave them instructions to alert the athorities that something is amiss, if you have not returned in, say, a hour ??, after your intended return. At least that way, if a tree does fall on you in the woods, someone can come and help.

 

There my 2 pennys worth.

[silverwolfe]

Interesting thread..... Awareness seems the most important ingredient of all the responses. I've 'felt' need to exercise caution at times and places , but as mentioned can never predict, so 'awareness' is always crucial.... and after reading all the above, I should be more 'prepared' than I am.

 

I lived in the woods many years and actually have more fear of the humanoid whackos than errant animals, altho respect them greatly!! And dangerously, a ('whacko', drunk/druggie) doesn't respond in typical ways, and is often impervious to the pain they're encountering, thus fight on in deranged ways!

 

And to add to 'prepared', a friend who works in the woods lectured me recently about having sufficient first aid kit/supplies in my car!!! If someone was injured, would you be able to take care of them/yourself at your rig??

 

I'll keep practicing vigilance and caution along w/my excitement and enjoyment, and try to find some cachers to go w/for some of the 'caution' caches.

 

PS: I'm not opposed to guns for protection or family hunting. One protected me from an aggressive bear quite nicely....

[+Hoosier Katie]

PS: I'm not opposed to guns for protection or family hunting. One protected me from an aggressive bear quite nicely....

Can you share the details about this? I have had a debate about whether a handgun wouldprotect you from somehting like this. A friend has said "No way a little handgun is gonna stop a big aggressive bear! You're just gonna make it mad." My thinking is that even such a loud "unnatural" noise might startle the bear enough to reconsider an attack and he might just leave you alone. I also believe that if this is not true, and you need to shoot the bear, that a well-placed shot from a handgun would drop a bear. But I really have no idea if this is correct!

[Hugh Jazz]

I also believe that if this is not true, and you need to shoot the bear, that a well-placed shot from a handgun would drop a bear. But I really have no idea if this is correct!

No matter how big a gun you use, the bear will simply grab it away from you and shoot you with it!

[+Criminal]

I also believe that if this is not true, and you need to shoot the bear, that a well-placed shot from a handgun would drop a bear.  But I really have no idea if this is correct!

No matter how big a gun you use, the bear will simply grab it away from you and shoot you with it!

Well, it's his right to bear arms.

[Hugh Jazz]

I also believe that if this is not true, and you need to shoot the bear, that a well-placed shot from a handgun would drop a bear.  But I really have no idea if this is correct!

No matter how big a gun you use, the bear will simply grab it away from you and shoot you with it!

Well, it's his right to bear arms.

And he can keep it too.