+Pharisee Posted November 12, 2005 Share Posted November 12, 2005 We all spend a considerable amount of our ‘caching time’ wandering through areas of woodland as this is prime caching country. Squirrels are probably the most common woodland creature that we see but has anyone else noticed that the ‘black’ grey squirrel seems to be a lot more common than it used to be? I’ve seen a dozen or more this year in various lumps of woodland. The last, this afternoon, right next to the Ollies’s Trivia –BROWN cache wasn’t just dark grey; it was jet black from its nose to the tip of its tail. Can anyone tell me if these are a different sub-species or just colour mutation of the bog-standard grey jobbie. Personally, I suspect that it’s a perfect example of Darwinian evolution allowing them to blend more easily into areas of our country that have been ‘colonised’ by ethnic minorities. Quote Link to comment
+Learned Gerbil Posted November 12, 2005 Share Posted November 12, 2005 Albinism and melanism are common mutations in all mammal species and once in a population, if recessive (as they usually are) then a few white or black individuals will appear in each generation. It is the same principle as the way Multiple Sclerosis is inhereted in humans. Normally in nature colour mutations make an animal stand out so it becomes vulnerable to predators. This means that although the carriers carry on passing o nthe gen, animals that inheret it from both parents are less likely to live t oadulthood, and so the incidence of the mutatio nstays low. However, grey squirrels have few predators in the UK, and melanistic mutations may actually be advantrageous in denser forests. For this reason I would expect there to be significant numbers of these mutations popping up, although white is likely to be less common than melanistic because white animals will stand out in woodland. As a matter of interest, white spotting is also a very common mammalian mutation (see Graham Norton for a human example) - I would be surprised if there were not grey squirrels with white head spots, or white snouts. Quote Link to comment
+The Blorenges Posted November 12, 2005 Share Posted November 12, 2005 Squirrels - the original geocachers. Mr B says there's been a population explosion of grey ones this summer in our local country park...not seen any black or white ones yet. About 3pm flurry of activity in the Blorenge back garden ... sparrowhawk swooped onto our birdtable...but missed! He then perched casually on the corner of the garage roof for a couple of minutes, surveying the deserted garden. We've seen them in our garden several times over the last few months - becoming more "urbanised"? Mrs B Quote Link to comment
+Nellies Knackers Posted November 12, 2005 Share Posted November 12, 2005 What are the odds? I'd like a tenner on the sparrowhawk! Quote Link to comment
+Skate and Jane Posted November 12, 2005 Share Posted November 12, 2005 I just miss the brown ones, and yes i was a member of the tufty club Quote Link to comment
+lordelph Posted November 12, 2005 Share Posted November 12, 2005 (edited) I know Letchworth is famed for it's black squirrel population, can't find many links about them, but the NHDC website had this to say: "...these areas house Letchworth's famous black squirrels. First sighted in 1944, these truly black squirrels are found only within four miles o f the town centre. They have featured on national television on several occasions, and a local public house is named after them." (EDIT - lots of information on other sightings here too) Edited November 12, 2005 by lordelph Quote Link to comment
+davy boy Posted November 12, 2005 Share Posted November 12, 2005 All grey squirrels should be dealt with the hard way,if only people realized what damage they do!!! I know everyone sees them as cuddly little grey things but they are only tree rats. Quote Link to comment
+Haggis Hunter Posted November 12, 2005 Share Posted November 12, 2005 All grey squirrels should be dealt with the hard way,if only people realized what damage they do!!! I know everyone sees them as cuddly little grey things but they are only tree rats. That they may be? I suppose that would make humans the parasites of Earth? I bet we (as in the human race) cause more damage than those little cuddly tree rats Quote Link to comment
+Nellies Knackers Posted November 12, 2005 Share Posted November 12, 2005 but they are only tree rats. Thats totally wrong!!! My dog knows perfectly well that they are tree rabbits! Not that he's up to chasing them anymore. Quote Link to comment
+davy boy Posted November 12, 2005 Share Posted November 12, 2005 All grey squirrels should be dealt with the hard way,if only people realized what damage they do!!! I know everyone sees them as cuddly little grey things but they are only tree rats. That they may be? I suppose that would make humans the parasites of Earth? I bet we (as in the human race) cause more damage than those little cuddly tree rats I know up in your part of the country you still have red squirrels,lets see if you feel the same when the tree rats drive them out!! Quote Link to comment
+The Golem Posted November 12, 2005 Share Posted November 12, 2005 (edited) I've lived in Keswick for 5 years now. I'll never forget the first time I saw a red, I was over the moon! Over the past 3 years I've seen a steady rise in Greys, I saw one the other day when I went to set a cache (no advertising this time!) I contacted Red Alert a local watch scheme set up by Cumbria Wildlife Trust and they suggested taking out an air rifle as they are classed as vermin. Seems a bit harsh but I'd hate to see the reds disappear.... Edited November 12, 2005 by The Golem Quote Link to comment
+Kryten Posted November 12, 2005 Share Posted November 12, 2005 Have only seen a few red squirrels this year, the most common animal I see are Roe Deer. I startled one today and it ran off through a wood making more noise than an entire football team, I thought they were supposed to be quiet animals. Quote Link to comment
+Naefearjustbeer Posted November 12, 2005 Share Posted November 12, 2005 Hugh ferny whitingstall (or however you spell it) has a great way of using they grey squirells, not to everyones taste though! Quote Link to comment
+Haggis Hunter Posted November 12, 2005 Share Posted November 12, 2005 I know up in your part of the country you still have red squirrels,lets see if you feel the same when the tree rats drive them out!! My part of the country they are very much grey, it's further up north such as the Highlands that there are reds, and it would be sad to see them go. It was MAN that decided to bring them to this country, which is the cause of the demise of the reds. So yet again it is the fault of the parasite known as the human race. One day the world may wake up and realise that we are killing our home, and have not helped in the extinction of many species, but I for one won't be holding my breath. Quote Link to comment
+Teuchters Posted November 12, 2005 Share Posted November 12, 2005 Spot a Red Squirrel at this webcam. Quote Link to comment
+Birdman-of-liskatraz Posted November 12, 2005 Share Posted November 12, 2005 When I was out caching today.. I was wandering down the side of the River Teign - When I'm pretty certain I saw an otter. Is this a) Possible? Likely? If not what else might it have been? Quote Link to comment
+Skate and Jane Posted November 12, 2005 Share Posted November 12, 2005 When I was out caching today.. I was wandering down the side of the River Teign - When I'm pretty certain I saw an otter. Is this a) Possible? Likely? If not what else might it have been? Yes it's possible but it could have been a mink. Quote Link to comment
+Learned Gerbil Posted November 12, 2005 Share Posted November 12, 2005 Mink were first sighted on the Teign (trivia time bonus points there!) but I see there is an Otter sanctuary on the nearby River Dart suggesting local populations. Quote Link to comment
+The Golem Posted November 12, 2005 Share Posted November 12, 2005 When I was out caching today.. I was wandering down the side of the River Teign - When I'm pretty certain I saw an otter. Is this a) Possible? Likely? If not what else might it have been? We went canoeing on Loch Etive a few weeks ago and saw a pair of otters. We also watched dolphins jumping in the bow wave of the ferry. Apparently there are otters on the River Derwent about half a mile from home.(I've never seen them although we did find a likely looking footprint once!) Quote Link to comment
+Skate and Jane Posted November 12, 2005 Share Posted November 12, 2005 Otters have been successfully reintroduced into many local areas including the river Otter as it happens Quote Link to comment
+The Golem Posted November 12, 2005 Share Posted November 12, 2005 I did hear the other day someone was pushing to reintroduce wolves and wild boar back into the Highlands! I think it's something to do with Trees for Life. (Just a rumour I heard, can't say for definite...) Quote Link to comment
+Munkeh Posted November 12, 2005 Share Posted November 12, 2005 kielder forrest is about the only place in the coutry now where the greys have not invaded Quote Link to comment
+Birdman-of-liskatraz Posted November 12, 2005 Share Posted November 12, 2005 Add the Isle of Wight and Brownsea Island to that list... and certainly when I lived in The Lakes near Windermere we had Reds running over the roof of the house... but that was 18 years ago! Quote Link to comment
+Hi-Tek Posted November 12, 2005 Share Posted November 12, 2005 We all spend a considerable amount of our ‘caching time’ wandering through areas of woodland as this is prime caching country. Squirrels are probably the most common woodland creature that we see but has anyone else noticed that the ‘black’ grey squirrel seems to be a lot more common than it used to be? I’ve seen a dozen or more this year in various lumps of woodland. The last, this afternoon, right next to the Ollies’s Trivia –BROWN cache wasn’t just dark grey; it was jet black from its nose to the tip of its tail.Can anyone tell me if these are a different sub-species or just colour mutation of the bog-standard grey jobbie. Personally, I suspect that it’s a perfect example of Darwinian evolution allowing them to blend more easily into areas of our country that have been ‘colonised’ by ethnic minorities. John, there was an article in the Daily Mail - Black Squirrel recently about a black squirrel spotted in Stevenage, quite close to your drum. Quote Link to comment
+Bill D (wwh) Posted November 12, 2005 Share Posted November 12, 2005 Birdman-of-liskatraz wrote: When I was out caching today.. I was wandering down the side of the River Teign - When I'm pretty certain I saw an otter. Otters and mink can both be found on the Teign, but if it was in daylight it was probably a mink - they're much more often seen in daylight than otters. Mink are smaller than otters - a mink is two foot long at most from nose to tip of tail, while an otter can be twice that length. Quote Link to comment
+Teuchters Posted November 12, 2005 Share Posted November 12, 2005 I did hear the other day someone was pushing to reintroduce wolves and wild boar back into the Highlands! I think it's something to do with Trees for Life.(Just a rumour I heard, can't say for definite...) It's true... "Paul Lister, the millionaire heir to the MFI DIY chain, wants to reintroduce the lynx, along with other animals extinct in Scotland for centuries such as the grey wolf and brown bear, at his Alladale estate near the Dornoch Firth." Quote Link to comment
+Kitty Hawk Posted November 12, 2005 Share Posted November 12, 2005 What are the odds? I'd like a tenner on the sparrowhawk! Sparrows, squirrels? Pah, they should go after the big stuff! Quote Link to comment
+choccymandm Posted November 13, 2005 Share Posted November 13, 2005 (edited) Another local black squirrel spotting spot (spotting spot?? can I say that??) is/was at the Red Lion in Kensworth, there was a small colony there a few years back, but as we haven't been there for a while, can't say for certain if they are still there. ... what more could you ask for John? a chance for a pint and to see a black squirrel ... or the chance to see a black sqiurrel and have a pint! Edited November 13, 2005 by choccymandm Quote Link to comment
+Munkeh Posted November 13, 2005 Share Posted November 13, 2005 I think the nieghbour had a vist from a squirrel collecting nuts...the cheek of it they took his car tyres as well! Quote Link to comment
markandlynn Posted November 13, 2005 Share Posted November 13, 2005 Otters are staging a comeback due to improving quality of water in rivers. They are exceedingly sensitive to the toxins we introduced and since the big clean ups and improved EU standards imposed otters have ben returning to the rivers. Birds of prey also suffered from this due to a capacity to retain mercury which was leaching up the food chain. Remember to dispose of watch batteries responsibly. Quote Link to comment
+The Ollies Posted November 13, 2005 Share Posted November 13, 2005 Whilst at Pharisee's The Planets -Saturn Cache, we saw a Black squirrel and so we swapped it for a McDonalds toy and then placed the squirrel in our cache . Quote Link to comment
Leoness Posted November 13, 2005 Share Posted November 13, 2005 I was born in Hitchin, N Herts (near to Letchworth - see lordelph's post above) and we used to regularly see black squirrels in our garden. There's even a pub in Letchworth called "The Black Squirrel". Then I moved down to Hampshire where I used to put food out for two white squirrels who regularly visited my garden. I assume they were albino. Then I moved to Germany where we used to have red squirrels in the garden. They are smaller than the greys and have tufts of fur on their ears. So, I've seen grey, black, white AND red squirrels! Quote Link to comment
+The Forester Posted November 13, 2005 Share Posted November 13, 2005 One of the grey squirrels at Forester Towers has red fur. He's not interbred with a red squirrel, he just happens to have very reddish fur. Quote Link to comment
+Learned Gerbil Posted November 13, 2005 Share Posted November 13, 2005 They are very red when young and then turn more greyish after their first winter. If you see a red Grey Squirrel it is almost certainly a youngster. Quote Link to comment
+The Forester Posted November 13, 2005 Share Posted November 13, 2005 He was red last year too! Not a very cold winter though. Quote Link to comment
nobby.nobbs Posted November 14, 2005 Share Posted November 14, 2005 now where's my air rifle? Quote Link to comment
Nediam Posted November 14, 2005 Share Posted November 14, 2005 The only black squirrels I've seen were in Florida (maybe they're the same sub species?). I have seen a litter of rabbits close to me that were all white. Seen a few black ones dotted about aswell. Quote Link to comment
+Learned Gerbil Posted November 14, 2005 Share Posted November 14, 2005 (edited) The black squirrels in Florida were probably Sciurus niger (The Fox Squirrel) which is much larger than The Grey Squirrel (Sciurus carolinensis) and is also usually dark brown or black. Edited November 14, 2005 by Learned Gerbil Quote Link to comment
+bargee Posted November 14, 2005 Share Posted November 14, 2005 On a recent caching expedition in tarvin cheshire, cassie dog and i startled a Buzzard, which was quietly disembowling and devouring it's breakfast (it looked like a hedgehog, i think) in the field we were crossing,on the way to the barrow of tar cache I find these raptors really enjoyable to watch and the population appears to be increasing greatly in recent years, cannot remember them at all from my youth 15 year ago but now see them soaring all over this part of cheshire, Love watching the red kites when in n.wales too Quote Link to comment
nobby.nobbs Posted November 15, 2005 Share Posted November 15, 2005 used to live in stokenchurch bucks and the red kites would come down into the back garden if you left them some meat or a bone etc. brilliant. Quote Link to comment
+Woody's Wanderers Posted November 15, 2005 Share Posted November 15, 2005 Around Surrey, particulary Richmond Park, Painshill Park in Cobham and Epsom Common, there are an increasing number of green parakeets! Accordingly to local RSBP, they stem from a pair that escaped (or were released) and have aclimatised and bred! Taking over like the grey squirrels..... Quote Link to comment
+Learned Gerbil Posted November 15, 2005 Share Posted November 15, 2005 The ring necked parakeets have been arround in South London since the 70's and are now extremly common in any open parkland. The population and range has soared (deliberate pun) with the incredibly mild winters for the last five years. BBC Article Quote Link to comment
+Beds Clangers Posted November 15, 2005 Share Posted November 15, 2005 Almost looked like a black squirrell myself after doing your Venus cache!!!! Know about the black squirrells in Letchworth, but they have now spread over to me Shefford (close enough). Was always told they were sort of "mutant" grey. Saw one dead on the road just past the hangars as Cardington a few days ago, so they are spreading Cheers Nick Quote Link to comment
+The Blorenges Posted November 15, 2005 Share Posted November 15, 2005 Around Surrey, particulary Richmond Park, Painshill Park in Cobham and Epsom Common, there are an increasing number of green parakeets! Accordingly to local RSBP, they stem from a pair that escaped (or were released) and have aclimatised and bred! Taking over like the grey squirrels..... Now, if we can just get the parakeets which live in the parks to cross-breed with the red kites we can have raptorial parakeets swooping down and carrying off surplus grey squirrels: Problem solved. Mrs B Quote Link to comment
+Learned Gerbil Posted November 20, 2005 Share Posted November 20, 2005 Whilst doing How to Dismantle and Atomic Bomb today I disturbed a Barn Owl - I was rewarded with the sight of the bird flying in slow circles in front of me for a few minutes in bright sunshine. At times it was less than 20 feet away. On the way back from the caceh I saw it again, flying along the path. Quote Link to comment
+Birdman-of-liskatraz Posted November 20, 2005 Share Posted November 20, 2005 I was wondering down from Dartmoor today.. along a track with trees on both sides... When a large black creature came crashing down through the trees and leapt onto the track about 10 yards in front of me.... Grizzly Bear! Was my instant thought..... No idea why I thought that.... It was after all a little Dartmoor Pony Phewwwwww I was releived! Quote Link to comment
+The Blorenges Posted November 20, 2005 Share Posted November 20, 2005 Big aaaaaahhhh...not the Beast of Dartmoor then? Quote Link to comment
+Mustard Devil Posted November 21, 2005 Share Posted November 21, 2005 There is a small black squirrel I keep seeing near a cache I hid here in Houston. I stop and watch for him often. Most of our squirrels here are grey or red, black is very rare. Did spot 2 deer? on Bute last April! Quote Link to comment
markandlynn Posted November 21, 2005 Share Posted November 21, 2005 Did anyone see the F word last week ? They were eating grey squirells to help bring back squirel nutkin ahhh Quote Link to comment
nobby.nobbs Posted November 22, 2005 Share Posted November 22, 2005 great idea, eat all the invaders/ pests. so that's wood pigeon. squirrel. deer all on the eat up menu. Quote Link to comment
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