Preventing Fraud - Comment

[+-treefrogs.]

Geocaches should each have a unique code inside that must be reported to the website before it can be claimed as a log to prevent fraudulent finds, just like the Travel Bugs.

 

Just an idea.

 

-treefrogs

[+The Leprechauns]

Excellent. Everyone knows that a travel bug code has NEVER been disclosed in a log, traded between geocachers, or given away in a picture. I am sure it will work just as well for geocaches.

[+welch]

I think the idea, but I think instead of hard to remember code numbers, we should use something familiar. Like say maybe your name... sound good?

Ok heres how it works, everytime someone finds a cache they write their name in the logbook. Then if anyone wants to know if they were there, their name Will Be in the logbook as proof.

[+Byron & Anne]

[+Mopar]

I think the idea, but I think instead of hard to remember code numbers, we should use something familiar. Like say maybe your name... sound good?

Ok heres how it works, everytime someone finds a cache they write their name in the logbook. Then if anyone wants to know if they were there, their name Will Be in the logbook as proof.

Works for me! Maybe Jeremy can get this implemented ASAP. Like today?

[+Pork King]

BOOOO!

[+garri]

I like your proposal. But I think that owner has to decide to implement this idea.

 

But you don't need Jeremy, don't involve us in more complicated form fields and password for find a cache, you are quite free to do it if you want implement it in your own caches, ask for your secret code in your cache descriptions, and finders can send you the code by mail after loging the find. Then, you can delete the log if geocachers don't send you the number, it's similar to virtuals method

Edited September 11, 2005 by garri

[+-treefrogs.]

Ok heres how it works, everytime someone finds a cache they write their name in the logbook. Then if anyone wants to know if they were there, their name Will Be in the logbook as proof.

Wow. It's nice to be greeted with such kind and respectful remarks. Thanks for welcoming me so warmly.

 

Great ideas guys, but unfortunately, you're a little behind. Both these things already take place. As well as other things, like names and bugs not being logged in the guestbook or online, or things being logged and taken by people who aren't even registered. So it doesn't work perfectly either. I hope that doesn't sting too much for you. From your comments, I can tell you're really sensitive. I guess I struck a nerve with the fraudulent find comment?? Oops. Guess everything need a grain of salt, huh?

 

At least with the idea of giving the cache itself a code to use to log in with would help give a little more honesty to the orginization. I understand how that doesn't sit well with you. But the comment wasn't for you anyway, it was for the company. Yet another mistake you've made.

 

Have a great day!

 

-treefrogs

[+joefrog]

At least with the idea of giving the cache itself a code to use to log in with would help give a little more honesty to the orginization. I understand how that doesn't sit well with you. But the comment wasn't for you anyway, it was for the company. Yet another mistake you've made.

Then why did you put it in the "general" forums, instead of addressing a letter to the company?

[+Mopar]

Ok heres how it works, everytime someone finds a cache they write their name in the logbook. Then if anyone wants to know if they were there, their name Will Be in the logbook as proof.

Wow. It's nice to be greeted with such kind and respectful remarks. Thanks for welcoming me so warmly.

 

Great ideas guys, but unfortunately, you're a little behind. Both these things already take place. As well as other things, like names and bugs not being logged in the guestbook or online, or things being logged and taken by people who aren't even registered. So it doesn't work perfectly either. I hope that doesn't sting too much for you. From your comments, I can tell you're really sensitive. I guess I struck a nerve with the fraudulent find comment?? Oops. Guess everything need a grain of salt, huh?

 

At least with the idea of giving the cache itself a code to use to log in with would help give a little more honesty to the orginization. I understand how that doesn't sit well with you. But the comment wasn't for you anyway, it was for the company. Yet another mistake you've made.

 

Have a great day!

 

-treefrogs

Naw, you're giving yourself WAY too much credit.

The only thing that might have struck a nerve around here is the fact that a search of the forums would show that this has been discussed about 136 times before you came up with the idea.

Each time all the pros and cons have been hashed out and the community and the website owners seem to have come to the conclusion that the idea would create as many problems as it solved, and wouldnt even be close to effective.

[+Renegade Knight]

The idea has been implemented in the past in the form of Code word micros. Find the cahe, email the code to claim your find. This site frows upon codeword miros and preferes a log.

 

Your idea would work find except for one major issue. If I hike 27 miles barefoot and naked uphill and through raging blizards both ways and forgot my pencil, or wrote down the wrong number... I'm not going to be a happy camper.

 

The system can also be comprimized by swapping numbers like is done with TB's and has been pointed out. The bottom line is that it doesn't really solve more problems than it creates. Id call it a wash, except it involves more work.

[+El Diablo]

Wow. It's nice to be greeted with such kind and respectful remarks. Thanks for welcoming me so warmly.

 

Don't take offense. You have to keep in mind that caching is an individual game. It's not a team sport. The only person that should be concerned with the numbers is the individual cacher. If they want to lie to theirselves...sobeit. The majority of us don't care.

 

El Diablo

[+LaPaglia]

Geocaches should each have a unique code inside that must be reported to the website before it can be claimed as a log to prevent fraudulent finds, just like the Travel Bugs.

 

Just an idea.

 

-treefrogs

Nobody can be so amusingly arrogant as a young man who has just discovered an old idea and thinks it is his own.

Edited September 11, 2005 by LaPaglia

[+New England n00b]

I think the idea, but I think instead of hard to remember code numbers, we should use something familiar. Like say maybe your name... sound good?

Ok heres how it works, everytime someone finds a cache they write their name in the logbook. Then if anyone wants to know if they were there, their name Will Be in the logbook as proof.

Works for me! Maybe Jeremy can get this implemented ASAP. Like today?

Dude, that is so gonna revolutionize this sport!

Edited September 11, 2005 by New England n00b

[+teamjack&birdie]

Good idea or bad......???

 

But as for you lovely people jumping on the OP for bringing up something that has already been disussed, do you wish the forums to no longer exist? Most topics have already been discussed, you are likely the same people who piss and moan when someone opens up an old topic. I guess that works out tho, you can bitch either way.

[+badlands]

Its' just a game <did I say that?>. If someone want's to pad their stats with caches they didn't really find they are only fooling them selves. Lots of people don't even log the finds on line [iMHO they should].

[+El Diablo]

Good idea or bad......???

 

But as for you lovely people jumping on the OP for bringing up something that has already been disussed, do you wish the forums to no longer exist? Most topics have already been discussed, you are likely the same people who piss and moan when someone opens up an old topic. I guess that works out tho, you can bitch either way.

I don't see anyone jumping on the OP about bring up a an old topic. I do see people being sarcastic about the idea that the OP brought up.

 

Which in my book isn't right.

 

El Diablo

[+teamjack&birdie]

It seems your post was doing exactly that. We disagree. Oh well.

[+Joypa]

Leave the OP alone. I'm sure he/she meant well. The original question has been adequately answered. No need to pile on.

[+Prime Suspect]

If a cache owner wants to confirm all the logs, there are already ways to do that, without imposing something on everyone else. An owner can include a code to be emailed back (in addition to the log book, of course). Or they can check the cache log against the on-line log.

[+Happy Bubbles]

In response to the original post, that sounds like the confirmation code system they have at Terracaching.com. The cache owner has the option of including a code in their cache, and there's a place to input the code when you write the log. It seems to work pretty well, from what I've seen. Sure, you occasionally get people who don't realize they've forgotten their code until they get back to the bottom of the mountain, but that's just part of the challenge. Like remembering to bring a pencil to the teeny tiny micros, or special tools for certain caches.

 

But I don't think such a setup would be good for Geocaching.com. Without an acutal scoring system, it doesn't matter much if people cheat, and it doesn't seem to happen that much anyway. And considering the number of people who just can't figure out how to follow directions or upload images correctly for various non-traditional caches, I'm not confident that certain cachers would be able to handle anything that complicates logging caches beyond its current difficulty.

[+Sagefox]

At least with the idea of giving the cache itself a code to use to log in with would help give a little more honesty to the orginization.

What most people are really trying to tell you is that there is not enough fraud and dishonesty to warrant any additional security measures.

 

And we don't want the additional workload that would result. And I, for one, don't want my caches to leave people feeling that I don't trust them.

 

After placing and maintaining 100 caches I haven't detected any dishonest finds. Occasionally I request that people, ususally those with under 50 to 100 finds, change a Find log to a Note. They got close, did a lot of work, and then claimed a find. I usually won't allow that to stand. Sometimes, very rarely, I will allow people to log a find if they don't actually get the container, but that is only with an unusual set of circumstances and usually a very good story went with it.

 

But actual fraud and dishonesty with container caches - I just don't see this as realistic.

[+welch]

At least with the idea of giving the cache itself a code to use to log in with would help give a little more honesty to the orginization. I understand how that doesn't sit well with you. But the comment wasn't for you anyway, it was for the company. Yet another mistake you've made.

 

The problem with that is that if you don't trust someone to sign the log, move and log the TB, etc. How can you trust them to go get a code and enter it? If you didn't trust them before I doubt you will after they've entered a code (they got who knows where).

I'd give you some of the others reason this hasn't ever happened, but it would just be repeating someone.

I'm sorry if not everyone agrees with you , but thats what happens when you post to an open forum.

[+budd-rdc]

Geocaches should each have a unique code inside that must be reported to the website before it can be claimed as a log to prevent fraudulent finds, just like the Travel Bugs.

 

Just an idea.

 

-treefrogs

If the stakes were high for logging a find (prize, prestige, etc), then sure, this is a valid idea. There was a thread talking about Geocaching Guiness Book of World Records in "Getting Started" section, and this is certainly relevant if someone was really serious about it.

 

Otherwise, I just don't see the reason to implement this idea, since I haven't seen any of these "frauds" firsthand, echoing the sentiments of others on this thread.

 

You have the option to implement this on your own caches, with e-mail/home page link, then you can find out firsthand if this is really a worthwhile endeavor.

[+geognerd]

The idea has been implemented in the past in the form of Code word micros.  Find the cahe, email the code to claim your find.  This site frows upon codeword miros and preferes a log.

It's annoying when a cache requires a codeword to be logged as found, and the cache owner never acknowledges receipt of your e-mail with the codeword in it. Who knows if the cache owner is even active anymore or reads the e-mails? If I have to send a password to the cache owner, I want to know they are actually enforcing the rules of their cache.

[+Mudfrog]

The idea has been implemented in the past in the form of Code word micros.  Find the cahe, email the code to claim your find.  This site frows upon codeword miros and preferes a log.

It's annoying when a cache requires a codeword to be logged as found, and the cache owner never acknowledges receipt of your e-mail with the codeword in it. Who knows if the cache owner is even active anymore or reads the e-mails? If I have to send a password to the cache owner, I want to know they are actually enforcing the rules of their cache.

If a cache owner wants verification then he/she can go check out the cache logbook for themselves. I myself would tend to pass up caches that required codewords or another form of email verification.

 

Virtual caches are similar and this is the reason i dont care for them!

[+Sagefox]

If a cache owner wants verification then he/she can go check out the cache logbook for themselves. I myself would tend to pass up caches that required codewords or another form of email verification.

 

Virtual caches are similar and this is the reason i dont care for them!

This about sums it up for me too. I have been filtering out virtuals in my quiries for about a year now and find it a relief. The first 250 virtuals and locationless caches were fun but now I am enjoying "The Hunt" caches.

 

But then again... we have to travel for caching. In my remote county I would visit any kind of cache anyone would be kind enough to place and I would tie my shoes around my neck and walk backward down mainstreet at noon if that is what the hider wanted.

[+AtoZ]

Geocaches should each have a unique code inside that must be reported to the website before it can be claimed as a log to prevent fraudulent finds, just like the Travel Bugs.

 

Just an idea.

 

-treefrogs

NOT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

what more can I say. Does it matter NO!!!!!!!!!!!

 

It is a GAME not a contest so if you don't trust a log then check the logbook in the cache as that is the only thing that matters.

cheers