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Do You Want All Finds Listed In One Account?

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Since Premium Members will also have accounts at Waymarking.com, why not allow Premium Members to keep totals of all caches of ANY KIND on our geocaching.com account?

 

In other words, if I choose to make a Waymarking "find," I would like to look at my geocaching.com account and see it show up on My Account page as a find. I want it in my total count, listed in the appropriate category (as it is now). I think this would be a fair request of Groundspeak since they are "changing the rules in the middle of the game" so to speak.

 

So, how does everyone else feel about this idea? Come on, let me know and let Groundspeak know, also!

 

 

:D And my opinion of Waymarking: I wish Groundspeak had left geocaching.com alone. I like it just the way it is now. Adding a second game site just takes up time I don't have (the Fraggles said this best).

...I wish this membership was a democracy and we could actually vote on proposed changes.

Edited by anet

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Waymarks aren't caches. Caches are little boxes I find, trade trinkets in, and sign a logbook. Why would I want to lump those together with a favorite restaurant in Philadelphia that I visited because of a waymark category, or a neat aircraft crash site that I hiked up a mountain to visit because of a waymark category?

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Adding a second game site just takes up time I don't have (the Fraggles said this best).

psst. It isn't compulsory.

 

...I wish this membership was a democracy and we could actually vote on proposed changes.

 

In a true democracy, everyone eats pepperoni pizza.

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Waymarks aren't caches.  Caches are little boxes I find, trade trinkets in, and sign a logbook.  Why would I want to lump those together with a favorite restaurant in Philadelphia that I visited because of a waymark category, or a neat aircraft crash site that I hiked up a mountain to visit because of a waymark category?

Waymarks aren't caches? Caches are little boxes...?

 

When did that change?

 

All one needs to do is take a look at their USER STATS in their account.

What do you see? In addition to traditional caches, you see virtual caches, webcam caches, earth caches, locationless (reverse) caches, etc.

We have been playing the game for awhile now and these have always been caches! Now, the rules are changing and some caches aren't caches anymore?

 

Call 'em what you want, but they are still caches to me.

Edited by anet

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You're living in the past, where some things were shoehorned into places they didn't belong. Now we have a proper place for "locationless" categories and "virtual" waymarks, so we don't need to pound that square peg into a round hole any more.

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Uh, I believe that changed this week. It's about time that we had a structure that acknowledged the inherent difference between hiking 5 miles to find an ammo can, or spending 45 minutes ferreting out an evil micro, versus taking a picture of a flagpole or a yellow jeep.

 

I had a two-month head start, and at first I found Waymarking pretty confusing, too. It may take awhile for lots of people to figure it out. Some may not. That's cool, too.

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I wouldn't mind seeing all my stats on one page (like I can see benchmarks along with my trinket caches)....but if it doesn't happen, I probably wouldn't notice either.

Edited by KoosKoos

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I understand the difference. But, as I mentioned in another thread I would love to have all of my personal geo-information located on one page. Benchmarks aren't little boxes with trinkets, they're metal discs (or antennas, or church steeples, or, or, or) yet they're listed on the same page (but NOT counted in the total number of cache finds).

 

I have no problem with them not counting as CACHE finds, I never thought locationless caches should have been counted. I supposed I won't mind not being able to log virtuals (where I personally noted some fine differences between locationless and virtual caches).

 

I, like many others, will probably want to participate in geocaching, benchmarking and/or Waymarking. It'd be great if all of my Groundspeak data was in one spot. I know I'm not alone in feeling this way. It may not be problematic for some to visit multiple pages (and I use problematic in a very large and vague manner) but it is for others - I would hope that people wouldn't underestimate the inconvienance some will experience.

 

I do understand some of the reasons Waymarking.com is a seperate site (different concept, beta project, etc) but I think in the long run confusion will occur no matter what you do - but people will figure it out eventually. When they do, many will want to participate and they'll want one "profile"/"stats" page.

 

sd

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I envision people being attracted to Waymarking who have absolutely no interest in fighting off mosquitoes, poison ivy and thorns in order to sign a soggy notebook in a two-year old ice cream bucket. If geocaching and Waymarking are tied together, that could limit Waymarking in the eyes of the broader GPS user group as "part of that geo-thing where the bomb squad got called."

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I don't believe waymarks should count toward *cache* finds, but I would love to have both stats accessible on my gc.com stats page. Sort of like benchmarks.

I agree. It would obviously nice to see stats on one page but have two sets on the same page, one for waymarks and another for geocaches.

 

Does this mean that if one looks at the little profile block in GC you'll see GC numbers and if you look at the little profile block in WM you'll see WM numbers?

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It's about time that we had a structure that acknowledged the inherent difference between hiking 5 miles to find an ammo can, or spending 45 minutes ferreting out an evil micro, versus taking a picture of a flagpole or a yellow jeep.

I am not in any way suggesting that virtuals be retained, but before lambasting all virtuals as mere flagpoles, check out Trev's Freedom Cache in Washington, D.C. I guarantee you that was much more difficult than some of the traditional caches we've found. Maybe not as physically challenging, but certainly as an intellectual exercise and as a test of the powers of observation.

 

Of course, there are some overly simple virtuals. Washington is full of them. So, during a recent vacation there we made the conscious decision not to post virtual finds unless they posed a particular challenge or led us to something noteworthy that we would not have otherwise discovered.

 

At the same time, there is a place for well-planned "virtuals." Wayaching seems to be a good compromise. By separating waycaches and giving them their own Website, Jeremy & Co. are making the virtuals world potentially more intriguing, interesting and inviting. Now, folks can limit themselves to physical caches, or they can mix-and-match -- or they can collect historic flagpoles, if that is the personal interest. And none of this will taint the physical geocaching environment.

 

For those of us mix-and-matchers, it would be nice to have all the stats in one place. Without adding waycaches to the total, just to list them, along with benchmarks etc., as others have suggested.

 

For us, the stat sheet is for us to keep track of us, not to impress others (as our skimpy totals attest.)

Edited by The Old Bet Brigade

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Waymarks aren't caches.  Caches are little boxes I find, trade trinkets in, and sign a logbook.  Why would I want to lump those together with a favorite restaurant in Philadelphia that I visited because of a waymark category, or a neat aircraft crash site that I hiked up a mountain to visit because of a waymark category?

Waymarks aren't caches? Caches are little boxes...?

 

When did that change?

 

All one needs to do is take a look at their USER STATS in their account.

What do you see? In addition to traditional caches, you see virtual caches, webcam caches, earth caches, locationless (reverse) caches, etc.

We have been playing the game for awhile now and these have always been caches! Now, the rules are changing and some caches aren't caches anymore?

 

Call 'em what you want, but they are still caches to me.

And taking this to the next logical step, should not benchmarks be either moved to Waymarking or spun off into their own site as well? Just a thought since these also do not have containers and signable logs.

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I like the idea of a "Groundspeak" account with stats for things I found from listings on the various Groundspeak sites. Maybe a tab for Geocaching.com finds, another for Waymarking.com finds, or better yet, I'd get to have some control over how those stats were arranged on my account page.

 

And some control over how my stats appear to others, as long as we're asking for stuff. :rolleyes:

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And taking this to the next logical step, should not benchmarks be either moved to Waymarking or spun off into their own site as well? Just a thought since these also do not have containers and signable logs.

Yes. They will be eventually.

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And taking this to the next logical step, should not benchmarks be either moved to Waymarking or spun off into their own site as well?  Just a thought since these also do not have containers and signable logs.

Yes. They will be eventually.

Wow.

 

And to get back on topic, I'd like to add my vote to having a central stats page.

Perhaps the page could have sections for caching, benchmarking, and Waymarking for clarity.

 

At the same time, redesign the TB side of the stats page for all trackable items and section off TB's, jeeps, coins, and whatever else comes down the road later.

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And taking this to the next logical step, should not benchmarks be either moved to Waymarking or spun off into their own site as well?  Just a thought since these also do not have containers and signable logs.

Yes. They will be eventually.

Thereby answering the FAQ's:

 

"Why isn't benchmark xyz listed in the database, it is active at the government site?"

 

"Why can't this other type of benchmark (non-NGS) be listed?"

 

Marvelous. Flexibility and expandability.

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I like the idea of a "Groundspeak" account with stats for things I found from listings on the various Groundspeak sites. Maybe a tab for Geocaching.com finds, another for Waymarking.com finds, or better yet, I'd get to have some control over how those stats were arranged on my account page.

 

I like this idea, too. For me I don't care if they're on one page together or not, but I like the idea of being able to access them from a central point.

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I'd like to see waymark finds with my other find information...

 

and I don't want them counted in my cache find count.

 

(One reason I haven't logged any locationless finds is they didn't seem like real caching.)

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....

(One reason I haven't logged any locationless finds is they didn't seem like real caching.)

That's because they are not.

 

Don't get me wrong. I like LCs, virts, trads. I like them all.

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Hey as long as we are talking about the stats, why not develop a Leaderboard...... There used to be one offsite, but an onsite one, with each member having the option to participate or not, would be an interesting idea. Just a thought...

 

Baptist Deacon

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I haven't figured out what waypointing has to do with geocaching.

 

Maybe I am catching on after all.

 

Perhaps Keen does need to update their options.

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I haven't figured out what waypointing has to do with geocaching.

Nothing. That's the whole point. It's a different game.

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I like the idea of all finds listed on one account.

 

There's a good chance people will be combining both Waymarking and Geocaching on one trip. It's not like we are going to carry separate GPSr for each activity. :lol:

 

Groundspeak might consider centralizing these two, then Waymarking and Geocaching can promote each other almost automatically. This is especially useful for new members.

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And taking this to the next logical step, should not benchmarks be either moved to Waymarking or spun off into their own site as well?  Just a thought since these also do not have containers and signable logs.

Yes. They will be eventually.

Thereby answering the FAQ's:

 

"Why isn't benchmark xyz listed in the database, it is active at the government site?"

 

"Why can't this other type of benchmark (non-NGS) be listed?"

 

So would benchmarks be moved to Waymarking? Or would they get their own site?

 

I can see value for some survey marks in the Waymarking site - those from outside of the United States (like the UK Trig Points or the Canadian marks), or those in the US not listed in the National Geodetic Survey database (Cadastral Marks, for example). I would hope that the NGS marks (for which there is already a wonderful section on the geocaching website) would get their own site if this division is to take place.

 

Many of the benchmark folks are almost exclusively into benchmarking. I enjoy both and incorporate both into my searches. I hope that whatever solution is taken, it will still be easy to search for nearby NGS benchmarks from the geocaching site, and geocaches from the benchmark site.

 

Unfortunately, the frequently asked questions listed above wouldn't be frequently asked questions, if people would read the site FAQs. :laughing:

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I'm going to chuck in my pennies. First of all I love Locationless 'caches' because I find it awakens me to my surroundings. I'm always on the lookout for Eternal Flames, or Flatiron buildings and because of this I'm looking at EVERYTHING and seeing so much more stuff even in places I know like the back of my hand (hey...when did I get that scar?) While the rule is that only one locationless object may be found by one person, there is a finite number of these things and not everyone in the caching community will be able to log the 1600 September 11 memorials (not currently a locationless). Maybe if the rules were changed that each location can be logged only once a year, that would allow new cachers to claim a location that was originally posted 4 years ago.

 

Virtuals are fun to do, and my wife's personal favorite and I can see a point having them on a seperate point of interest site. For that matter, I can almost go along with Earthcaches being on the same page. But lets talk about Webcams. I've not logged a cam cache yet, but the effort and co-ordination these involve certainly merits a cache find. You have to be in a special location, often times in a special pose and you have to communicate with someone else to take the picture. All of that effort certainly deserves a smiley.

 

Also, I understand that the game originated as a hide a container game. It seems now we are forcing it to be something after it has evolved. If TPTB felt so strongly about it, why did they allow it to evolve at all and come up with this 'solution' earlier? Could they just say "NO, that's just a dumb statue, that's not a cache". I also understand that participation in Waymarking is not required, but to be honest, I really like the game as it is and the diversity of it was what made it so attractive to me and my family earlier this year.

 

All that said, I'd like one page to show my cache finds, benchmarks, waymarks, etc. Waymarking sounds to me like it's a shared experience sort of deal. I ate at this cool place and you should too? Eh, I'd rather look for a cool statue or keep my eyes open for that elusive Carnegie Library.

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I dont know anything about making websites or how hard it is to maintain a site.In my opinion it is up to the ones who have to deal with maintaining the website as to wether or not the stats are on one site or on seperate sites.

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If folks get their stats consolidated into one page, can I get the ability to hide ours from everyone but us? I figure it's no one else's business other than our own, thank you very much.

 

~CR <--because I'm still not a premium member.

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NO CONSOLIDATION!

 

Waymarking is a completely different beast from geocaching. Geocaching is a game and a hobby. Waymarking is not a game, it's more of a travel assistant. The two sites are designed VERY differently.

 

Some might disagree, but the way Waymarking has been designed, it's built more for locating points of interest while in a certain area. Waymarking would be very handy for people RVing long distances.

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NO CONSOLIDATION!

 

Waymarking is a completely different beast from geocaching. Geocaching is a game and a hobby. Waymarking is not a game, it's more of a travel assistant. The two sites are designed VERY differently.

 

Some might disagree, but the way Waymarking has been designed, it's built more for locating points of interest while in a certain area. Waymarking would be very handy for people RVing long distances.

Don't say that too soon, young skywalker. It will be a game. But you are right that it isn't geocaching.

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I think one key difference between locationless caches and Waymarking is that the former doesn't have "cache owners" - only category owners.

 

Locationless caches say "find a windmill" (and often each one can be found once). So I find a great windmill, but it won't benefit any other cacher, and they probably won't even know it exists if is near the bottom of 500 other logs of visits to windmills.

 

An example of this is the . "UNESCO world heritage sites". Each is a fantastic place, but if someone finds one, then that blocks it off from everyone else, since it is "finders keepers". So there is no incentive for others to visit the same site, even if they knew where to look. So you could drive by a brilliant site and not have any idea it was there.

 

On the other hand, Waymarking says "here is a neat windmill." we want to share it, and you will get a Finder's point too if you want to count points. So this is more about sharing good experiences, rather than grabbing them for MEEEE!

 

Mind you, I think some of the proposed categories are silly, and very transient. I want to go to/ know about places that will still be there in 30 years time. Preferably ones that are not in the guidebooks. So a tailgaters party category should be a non-starter, but award winning architecture could be in.

 

And I owuld like a single page of stats please.

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Waymarking is not geocaching and geocaching is not Waymarking. BUT Both are owned by Groundspeak. We wouldlike to see everything listed in one profile. If I am on the Waymarking site and click on my profile, it shows me my geocaching profile. So how hard would it be to add another line and icon in our stats page for Waymarking? From all the new geocoin icons popping up, I would say that it isn't that hard at all.

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If folks get their stats consolidated into one page, can I get the ability to hide ours from everyone but us? I figure it's no one else's business other than our own, thank you very much.

 

~CR <--because I'm still not a premium member.

What he said.

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If folks get their stats consolidated into one page, can I get the ability to hide ours from everyone but us?  I figure it's no one else's business other than our own, thank you very much.

 

~CR  <--because I'm still not a premium member.

What he said.

What they said.

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Waymarking is not geocaching and geocaching is not Waymarking. BUT Both are owned by Groundspeak. We wouldlike to see everything listed in one profile. If I am on the Waymarking site and click on my profile, it shows me my geocaching profile. So how hard would it be to add another line and icon in our stats page for Waymarking? From all the new geocoin icons popping up, I would say that it isn't that hard at all.

For sure you will get separated stats to start with, mainly because of time constraints. I can't speak for what will be included on geocaching.com, but I do see a likelihood that geocaching stats could be optionally displayed alongside the Waymarking stats on the Waymarking stats page in the future.

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....

(One reason I haven't logged any locationless finds is they didn't seem like real caching.)

That's because they are not.

 

Don't get me wrong. I like LCs, virts, trads. I like them all.

And at the risk of opening a whole NEW can of worms. I was just pondering the question of caches vs. waymarks and came up with --- Should GeoEVENTS be moved out of geocaching as well?

 

Discuss.... :laughing:

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Should GeoEVENTS be moved out of geocaching as well? 

 

Discuss....  :laughing:

I believe Jeremy already said (or inferred) no.

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You're living in the past, where some things were shoehorned into places they didn't belong. Now we have a proper place for "locationless" categories and "virtual" waymarks, so we don't need to pound that square peg into a round hole any more.

"Proper place" according to YOU. Certainly not according to me. "Speak for yourself, John Alden!"

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We would like to see all the stats on one page.

 

I hope we are not forced to move our Webcam caches and Earthcache to Waymarking. We have very little interest Waymarking except for the impact it looks like it will have on Geocaching. I'm not saying we are anti Waymarking, it just has no appeal for us. I'm sure some folks will enjoy it.

 

2bugs

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I think the best of both worlds could be had, and was implied by others in this thread.

 

This is probably a lot of work, but here goes.

 

Groundspeak.com 'could' be the 'portal' to see all of your Stats. It could have direct links to "My Geocaching" and "My Waymarks"

 

People would sign in to Groundspeak and get an overall picture of all the games they play that are affliated with Groundpeak. This also allows future additions in the way of new games. On this page you would also be able to search for elements of ALL games, by proximity or whatever.

 

There then would be subpages for Geocaching and Waymarking and whatever else comes along. People that only want to play one specific game, or some of them could 'click the link' that takes them to the Game they interested in at that time.

 

On each of those subpages, you could see the stats that specific to that game only. From there you could also search for game elements that are specific to that game.

 

What I am suggesting could be better explained by using Amazon as an example... on the main page they have tabs for Movies, Books, Music etc. When you search there, you get items that fit all catagories. But if you did the same search in Music, you should only get music and no books or movies.

 

:( The Blue Quasar

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I want my stats all in one place! If we have to change the stats page a bit, that is fine. Use tabs or some other multi-page feature, but keep it all together. I've also got no problem with listing them separately at Waymarking.com. But one place for all is absolutely preferred.

Btw, finding a unique, unlogged WWII tank is as much a "find" as any ammo can--and in some ways even better, cuz like a FtF, it's never been found before. No, they're not seprate activites for some of us. The thrill o the hunt is just as real whether we trade something or not. But better tools to map and search found items is needed.

 

I like Blue Quasar's comments, and while we're blue-skying, like Amazon, lets get the user-ratings on these buggers from something equivilent to "Waste of time" to "Must visit" !!

-Joel G. (G2 of the Seven G's)

Edited by The Seven G's

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Just wanted to add that I too like the idea of viewing all the stats on one page. Like benchmarks, have them there but not count towards your total. :anitongue:

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NO CONSOLIDATION!

 

Waymarking is a completely different beast from geocaching. Geocaching is a game and a hobby. Waymarking is not a game, it's more of a travel assistant. The two sites are designed VERY differently.

 

Some might disagree, but the way Waymarking has been designed, it's built more for locating points of interest while in a certain area. Waymarking would be very handy for people RVing long distances.

Don't say that too soon, young skywalker. It will be a game. But you are right that it isn't geocaching.

I would love an explanation on how Waymarking will be a game. Yes, you can go find a bunch of waymarks, but it really does not seem like much of a game. Wow, I ate at 3 different McDonald's this week, so now my stats go up. Not much effor there.

 

I agree that Waymarking is basically a travel assistant that allows you to keep track of where you have been. Maybe, I am wrong. If so, an explanation would be great.

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I would love an explanation on how Waymarking will be a game.  Yes, you can go find a bunch of waymarks, but it really does not seem like much of a game.  Wow, I ate at 3 different McDonald's this week, so now my stats go up.  Not much effor there.

You would think that a site that exists to report the cheapest gas prices in the bay area wouldn't be a site where you could 'play' a game, but look, here's a leader board for that site:

 

http://www.sanjosegasprices.com/member_pts_leader.aspx

 

It's obvious that a lot of people are using the site to 'play' the game of reporting gas prices. I know some people who are active on the site and think it is a fun pastime/game (and a public service as well). I think Waymarking will become something very similar. A fun pastime/game and a public service. No reason why it can't be both. :unsure:

 

--Marky

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Marky,

I would have to say that seems like a bit of a stretch to call a game. I guess you are right, there just won't be much to the game. I agree with the previous post that it sounds like more of a travel assistant than a game.

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