A Plea

[+jochta]

Time for a random Monday morning rant

 

<rant>

Caches in bags. I hate them. Having recently done a couple of caches as follows.

 

1) Ammo box, camoflauged and olive green in colour, waterproof. Hidden in a black plastic bag full of water and mud. Why?

 

2) Lock n Lock box, waterproof. Hidden in a carrier bag full of water and mud. Cache was bone dry. Why?

 

Dipping hands into wet, slimy, muddy bags to retrieve waterproof boxes is not a pleasant experience, I'm sure hiders who use bags must have had this experience, so why do they emulate it for their own caches

 

It's against guidelines GAGB and it's horrible and disgusting - so please stop doing it.

 

I don't want to hear the 'camoflage' argument. Disguise the cache in other ways, or hide it better in the first place. I've found the army surplus type camo bags a pretty decent alternative BTW

 

I've a good mind to take a bin bag with me and dispose of all the plastic bags surrounding caches from now on.

</rant>

 

Ah, glad that's off my chest

[+The Hokesters]

Agreed on all counts - come and have a proper moan in the chat room

[NickPick]

I've a good mind to take a bin bag with me and dispose of all the plastic bags surrounding caches from now on.

Please do. Consider it CITO.

[Top Cat & Co]

If people have problems with see through containers and want to disgise them, try spray painting them black or whatever color matches the area their in, Please stop using black plastic bags

[+mongoose39uk]

I agree that plastic bags are a pain.

 

I really dont like them.

 

But! GAGB guidelines are not Geocaching.com's guidelines under which caches are placed. They are also guidelines not dictats.

 

People play this game how they want to play it and it is that, a game. Oh and it is their cache.

[+Windsocker]

I wrap my cache boxes in weed control cloth it lasts about 6 months or so but is far better then plastic bags

[+jochta]

I agree that plastic bags are a pain.

 

I really dont like them.

 

But! GAGB guidelines are not Geocaching.com's guidelines under which caches are placed. They are also guidelines not dictats.

 

People play this game how they want to play it and it is that, a game. Oh and it is their cache.

That's why they are called guidelines. Note that there are other good reasons not to use bags, animals ingesting them for example.

 

Also agreements with landowners in the UK follow the GAGB guidelines, for example Hampshire County Council. We wouldn't want to spoil these agreements and trust we have garnered by not following them would we?

 

IIRC the UK approvers will reject any cache that doesn't adhere to these guidelines (can they confirm this?). e.g. if the cache description mentions plastic bags, they will ask for it to be removed before approval. If I've got this totally wrong then I apologise

[+Haggis Hunter]

e.g. if the cache description mentions plastic bags, they will ask for it to be removed before approval. If I've got this totally wrong then I apologise

I believe that they will ask for the bag to be removed, but it doesn't stop approval, unless I suspect when it is in an area were approval goes by GAGB guidelines.

[NickPick]

They can't reject a cache if it's in a plastic bag (unless the landowner agreement forbids them), but Lacto and Ecks have in the past said that they will request that plastic bags be removed.

 

Good Work Fellas!

[+The Spokes]

Ok so they get dirty and sometimes a bit smelly. BUT people who are not looking for a cache and see it are much more inclined to leave it alone for those very reasons. So could it be that they are a useful deterrent against trashing.?

Edited August 15, 2005 by The Spokes

[+welch]

Ok so they get dirty and sometimes a bit smelly. BUT people who are not looking for a cache and see it are much more inclined to leave it alone for those very reasons. So could it be that they are a useful deterrent against trashing.?

You could also use unwashed food containers, or maybe wrap it up a diaper?

It might keep people away, but only becauses its DISGUSTING, not good camouflage.

[Lactodorum]

I have a standard template that I send out whenever I see mention of a plastic bag....

Hi, I've just released your new cache and I hope it goes well. Thanks for submitting it.

 

Just one thing though, you mention it's in a plastic bag. These are generally not a good idea as not only can they be chewed by small animals causing potential problems, they also tend to trap more water than they keep out! I've been to many caches where this has happened and it ain't nice!!

 

Can I suggest you either remove the bag or ask the first finder to dispose of it for you.

 

Thanks for your help.

 

Lactodorum

UK Admin

 

I use something very similar for existing caches if I see mention of a bag. As has been said we can't refuse to list a cache in a bag (unless the landowner forbids them) so gentle persuasion is our weapon.

 

I have to say that most people I contact tend to be newcomers to the sport and they tend to be happy to comply once they know. Also, most haven't found the forums and have never heard of the GAGB formulated guidelines.

[+The Spokes]

Ok so they get dirty and sometimes a bit smelly. BUT people who are not looking for a cache and see it are much more inclined to leave it alone for those very reasons. So  could it be that they are a  useful deterrent against trashing.?

You could also use unwashed food containers, or maybe wrap it up a diaper?

It might keep people away, but only becauses its DISGUSTING, not good camouflage.

I doubt unwased food containers would work as that would make the contents horrible. But a diaper now I bet there would not be many people wanting to poke there noses into that. (a clean one though please)

[+alma]

im also against black plastic bags and am also tempted to remove any i see

[+littlejim]

Plenty of caches up here in the north of England 'higher reaches' (aka North Pennines) are actually wrapped in plastic bags - some double! They do seem to give some protection from the more severe weather. However, as an alternative, I am now placing 'double skinned' plastic boxes - a small luch box inside a larger one to see if this can reduce weather ingress without the problems of plastic bags - time will tell! The only problem is you place a large cache with only limited space for contents! Any comments?

[+Phil and Ruth]

One other problem with plastic bags is that the notice "This is a Geocache, Contents Harmless" is hidden from view. Should the area ever come under the scrutiny of the police or similar they may interpret a box in a bag as a bomb and call in the Bomb disposal boys to blow it up However, if they can see the Geocache notice and the name of it, it could only take a quick call to HQ to find out that this is indeed harmless (but addictive )

[+louyee]

We could`nt agree more.

[+sTeamTraen]

However, if they can see the Geocache notice and the name of it, it could only take a quick call to HQ to find out that this is indeed harmless (but addictive )

Hmmm. If I look South Asian - or Brazilian - and carry a rucksack with "I'm not a Muslim fanatic and this is not a bomb", will this stop the police from shooting me when I get on the Tube (by swiping my Oyster card) ?

 

That said, I too hate bags (although one or two of my early caches have them, from before I knew better). On my trip to the UK (ends tomorrow, snif, and I've only logged 63 finds in 12 days!), I've only found two caches in bags. In contrast, in Germany, almost every cache is in one, two, or three shopping bags. I even know one person who uses a plastic bag to "protect" his ammo boxes. So reading this thread, I feel OK about the soaking wet bag which I trashed out from a (damp) cache earlier today...

[+third-degree-witch]

I cito placcy bags these days...I think they give a cache away in any case. If a cache is correctly prepared and maintained it has no need of an external bag..zip lock bags inside the box will keep contents bone dry.

[+Pharisee]

..zip lock bags inside the box will keep contents bone dry.

This is indeed true, TDW. The trouble is that Zip-Loc bags very often get torn by 'careless' opening techniques and a lot of time, don't get closed properly either. I've lost count (not that I ever started counting, you understand) of the number of these bages that I've replaced in caches but I always carry an ample supply in my caching bag

Like you, I'll very often 'trash out' a bin liner when I come across one.

[+t.a.folk]

Would any one remove a poly bag/sack from the outside of a cache it it could be seen that the poly bag/sack was the only thing keeping the wet out of a container in a very wet niche ?

[+Pharisee]

Would any one remove a poly bag/sack from the outside of a cache it it could be seen that the poly bag/sack was the only thing keeping the wet out of a container in a very wet niche ?

I generally temper my enthusiasm for CITO with a bit of common sense

[+sTeamTraen]

Would any one remove a poly bag/sack from the outside of a cache it it could be seen that the poly bag/sack was the only thing keeping the wet out of a container in a very wet niche ?

No... but that's like asking if you would avoid shooting a wolf if it was keeping a human baby nice and warm. Ain't going to happen. No poly bag will stay watertight for more than one cache find. They're designed to keep the rain off your shoe boxes until you get them home, not as bathing equipment.

 

I must say I've been very impressed with the "Lock and Lock" plastic boxes which I've seen over here. No sign of them in French supermarkets yet. I use ammo boxes for most of my caches now, but it's hard to get them with gaskets, resulting in intruders.

[+HazelS]

I think Mr Lock n Lock (obviously named after their inventor!!) had geocaching in mind, and geoching in an environmentally friendly way!!

 

When I released a cache, I used a lunch box of any description, so long as itwas waterproof, but Lock N Locks are great!! (although I know one of mine does need replacing.)

 

I have tracked down really cheap Lock n Locks at Wilkinson stores (Wilcos to most people!!) and I think a 1 litre Lock n Lock is about £1.75 which I think is the cheapest I've seen them.

 

So... there is no excuse. All my caches will soon be replaced into Lock n Locks, and my planned new caches will also be going into Lock N Locks.

[+crunchiespg]

I think Mr Lock n Lock (obviously named after their inventor!!) had geocaching in mind, and geoching in an environmentally friendly way!!

 

When I released a cache, I used a lunch box of any description, so long as itwas waterproof, but Lock N Locks are great!! (although I know one of mine does need replacing.)

 

I have tracked down really cheap Lock n Locks at Wilkinson stores (Wilcos to most people!!) and I think a 1 litre Lock n Lock is about £1.75 which I think is the cheapest I've seen them.

 

So... there is no excuse. All my caches will soon be replaced into Lock n Locks, and my planned new caches will also be going into Lock N Locks.

tesco's do their own. and are really cheap.

£2 ish for a 2.8l one.

 

also, dunelm, does ADDIS make ones, which can be bought is some great shapes and sizes. i got one that is about the size of 2 golf balls inside. perfect for micro caches which can hold small trades.

[+jochta]

Try http://www.lakelandlimited.com if you can't find a local supplier. They come in all sorts of shapes and sizes, from little titchy micro type size to cylinders, boxes, square, round, rectangular, deep, shallow - should be able to find just the right one for that niche you've been thinking about sticking a cache in!!

[Nediam]

Makro do packs of JML "Lock-n-Lock" boxes. There are about half a dozen in a pack ranging from 330ml up to about 3litre. I think they retail for about £6-7.

 

Edited August 16, 2005 by nediam

[+Pharisee]

I bought a 'pack' of these from Woolies but I wasn't impressed with the quality. The flaps didn't seem very positive and the lids on some of them didn't compress the seal at all. They were nowhere near as good a quality product as the ones I bought from Lakeland Plastics. In the end I chucked most of them away.

[Nediam]

I bought a 'pack' of these from Woolies but I wasn't impressed with the quality. The flaps didn't seem very positive and the lids on some of them didn't compress the seal at all. They were nowhere near as good a quality product as the ones I bought from Lakeland Plastics. In the end I chucked most of them away.

I agree that the flaps are a bit naff on the largest box (in the picture, the flaps are open) . I bought 2 packs and can't get either of the 2 big boxes to close properly.

 

However, the medium and smallest boxes seem great. I carry one of the small ones around in my caching bag with spare batteries, SD cards and other bits and bobs and have had no problems

 

Have had a quick butchers the the Lakeland site and might order some if what Pharisee says is right

[+crunchiespg]

tesco's ones are top quality. as are the Addis ones.

[Nediam]

John Lewis do a couple of different sets :-

 

A 9 piece set for £21

 

And a 6 piece for £10.95

[+The Hokesters]

I thought John Stead might have written in on this one by now but I couldn't hold my gob any longer.

 

Yesterday I visited one of John's caches which was a snap lock tupperware jobbie but it was wrapped in a polythene sack. The sack was crawling with baby snails.

 

I mailed John to tell him of the state of the bag and he was surprised because the cache was not set with a bag??!?!?

 

So the moral of this little story is that there is a phantom plaggy bag depositor out there somewhere

Edited August 16, 2005 by The Hokesters

[+sTeamTraen]

So the moral of this little story is that there is a phantom plaggy bag depositor out there somewhere

Where are the Two Ronnies when you need them ?

[+Tupperware Hunters]

im also against black plastic bags and am also tempted to remove any i see

tempted just remove them thats what i doo aint that right piro think we took about 3 in 1 day

[+littlejim]

I've just done a maintenance visit on one of my caches and removed the plastic bag which enclosed it . Accept slap on hand and now looking for better containers before winter sets in...

[+John Stead]

I thought John Stead might have written in on this one by now

I might have but so far I've agreed with pretty much everything that has been said and I had expressed my views on the subject a few weeks ago in another thread.

However thanks to The Hokesters, hopefully the one referred to has been stripped to the bare essentials and all the better for it.

Anyone for escargots?

Edited August 16, 2005 by John Stead

[+Couparangus]

This must be a British thing as I've never seen it in Canada. I have found a couple of bin-bag caches in the UK so I know where you're coming from. I'm told one should be wary of black plastic bags found in the woods because they could be dangerous waste from crystal meths labs.

[+Brenin Tegeingl]

The worse day for me was a total of 6 bags out of 10 caches in one day, all removed. One cache was actualy attempting to use a black bin liner as camo, it had been that poorly hidden. Is this just a UK/European thing?

 

Dave

[+jochta]

I know this subject had been dealt with before when I posted, but I was feeling frustrated at yet another bag enclosed cache found at the weekend.

 

Of the 7 regular sized physical caches we recently did in Luxembourg (out of a total of 14 caches visited) 6 were in plastic bags, most branded carrier bags. (Incidentally we also found 4 gas lighters and 2 boxes of matches as well!! We've never found either in a UK cache).

 

If my sample of Luxembourgish caches is typical then it did seem more common there than in the UK.

[+littlejim]

People seem to get very upset about something that seems to me to be quite trivial!! ( I'm going to get flamed, me thinks )

littlejim (he's fallen in the water...)

[+The Hokesters]

Anyone for escargots?

No ta! I've had my fill thanks - I hope no one blew a raspberry?

[+Alice Band]

I think Lactodorum's placci bag advice is falling on deaf ears. This one and this one were both made live this week.

In both cases the vast amount of dog walkers in the area make hunting for a cache in a placci bag very precarious as the lazy buggers put doggie doos in bags and 'hide' them at the base of trees rather than place them in the bin I lost count how many I found today.

Edited August 16, 2005 by Drum Major

[+Yorkypudding]

Hi,

I would like to confess that all my 3 hidden caches have plastic bags around them and when I go to check on them I will remove them. My reason is simply camoflage but like you all say I can paint them or something. If anyone goes to them and wants to remove them then please feel free. Sorry guys.

 

Yorkypudding.

[Lactodorum]

I think Lactodorum's placci bag advice is falling on deaf ears. This one and this one were both made live this week.

In both cases the vast amount of dog walkers in the area make hunting for a cache in a placci bag very precarious as the lazy buggers put doggie doos in bags and 'hide' them at the base of trees rather than place them in the bin I lost count how many I found today.

Oops! Mea Culpa - I missed those

 

I've asked the owner to remove them now. Thanks for letting me know.

[+lest44]

Just been caching around the Lowestoft area and most of them there had plastic bags covering them. I hate the bags as you always end up wet and soggy trying to take the box out of them (not to mention the threat to wildlife etc). Mrs Lest

[+KiwiGary]

My 0.02....

 

Instead of plastic, you can buy camo bags that are water proof and are a bit tougher than the plastic ones.

 

I have them on a few of my caches and there do work very well.

 

Here is a link to one place that sells them, but I am sure if you had a sewing machine there wouldn't be too hard to make.

 

Camo Bags for sale

 

See ya...Gary

[+Hi-Tek]

On BH Monday I think it was 6 out of 9 caches that we found in the Brighton area were wrapped in assorted bin liner/carrier bags. They all seemed to have an indigenous population of the local molluscs either attached on the outside or the inside of the bags - Yuk! .

[+Spnoo]

After visiting a cache in Scotland wrapped in a total of 3 plastic bags, I completely agree with everything in this thread. Was looking for a cache earlier today and nearly opened up a bag full of dog waste thinking it was what I was looking for.

 

I'll have to buy some Lock n locks when I next see some for my first cache placement, once I find a spot. the one I've found was in very good, nearly new, condition.

[+dunos]

I can't stand plastic bags. I have even seen some in supermarket carrier bags. Disgusting. It makes the cache look like litter. They smell, I don't know if I am going to get stabbed by a neadle, eugh.

 

How about if you find one in a bag you mark it as such in the log. something like:

 

WRAPPED IN NASTY PLASTIC BAG would be good.

 

That or just remove the bag - Looks like litter found its way around the cache

[+Pharisee]

How about if you find one in a bag you mark it as such in the log. something like:

 

WRAPPED IN NASTY PLASTIC BAG would be good.

 

D'ya mean something like this?