Search the Community

Cachers have a variety of justifications for using Note or DNF, some in no way consistent, and some just plain bizarre. Some start a stopwatch and if they only searched X minutes instead of X+1 minutes, “it's not a DNF”. If the entire area washed away in a flood, “it's not a DNF because I couldn't search because the whole side of the hill is gone”. I would never try to talk someone out of at least a Note log, because even a Note provides information. But I would like to smack some sense into them discuss ways someone might understand and communicate that they “Did Not Find” a cache, which is what the acronym “DNF” is.

No! You said - "A can not visit the coordinates" - end of story, in my opinion and as I choose to play. There's a difference between using a 'team' name so you didn't fill up a small logstrip with the names of everyone who was physically there, and using a 'team' name to get around the unfortunate sticking point that a name must be in the logbook. If Nick A was in California while Nick B was standing at the cache in Sweden, then Nick A has no business claiming the find. Period. I can't think of a single exception. How far would I take that? If I was standing at the base of a tree climb that I wasn't going to attempt, and my buddy was up there with the cache in hand, I would NOT have him sign my name. I DID NOT DO WHAT I WAS SUPPOSED TO DO TO CLAIM THE FIND. On the other hand, if I was standing with a group and there was nothing stopping me from putting my hand on the hide in situ, then I have no problem with claiming a group find, although I don't like to cache that way. I'm not so compulsive that I have to "clear my map" as others talk about.

It's a problem for me because you don't file the NM when it's needed because you've managed to talk yourself into an unlikely scenario where it won't be needed. You not posting the NM isn't a problem in itself. That's certainly up to you. But you coming here to the forums and making it sound like not posting the NM is the most reasonable choice is what concerns me. You understand exactly! So stop telling people to worry about it. There are a zillion possible reasons an NM or NA might be wrong. If you start worrying about those possibilities, you'll never post any NMs. (Well, I suppose my tense is wrong: everyone's already given up posting NMs and NAs, so the reviewers have taken over that job.) Well, of course. People who have visited GZ have absolutely zero obligation to post any log on a listing whatsoever. When you come here to the forums and explain why you didn't post an NM for no reason other than you haven't been to GZ, I take it as trying to talk people into following your example, so I argue against your publicly presented opinion. It doesn't matter to me what you actually do or why you do it.

Events always seem very, highly social. Newcomers are more often quieter and less interactive, but everyone's very friendly. Sure, there could be some divisions and cliques, but rarely do I see any visible negativity or antagonism. If anything, it happens quietly or behind people's backs There's not a lot of talk about the rights ways to do things, because it doesn't seem like there's a problem with people doing things the wrong way... occasionally there's some discussion about new features and the way people like to do things themselves, but I rarely ever get the sense that there's some widespread disagreement. In the greater area I know there are a couple of people who have struck smoe bad chords with the community, but that's general geocacher etiquette, not related to questionable GS features/practices... I don't get the sense anyone feels like there's a "cache cop" in my area either. Keep in mind, this is of course all my own observations. Things could be going on in smaller groups that I'm not privy to. Heck maybe I'm heckled by everyone and I don't know it =P But this is what I see in my general local community. Lots of general camaraderie, especially by those who don't bind themselves to any major group, but some distinct groups of friends and common cachers, though no prominent/public in-fighting or hobby-detracting all-out wars. Quite nNewbie frendly, in short. It's much the same where I am and the events I have attended. Very social, a few known groups that cache together a lot, but they seem open to having others join in too. Most of the discussion revolves around the caches in the area that have been memorable and recently visited, or puzzles that are vexing. Help with the app, questions about stuff in general are welcomed. Discussions about upcoming events and mega events, plans to cache together int he future ... not a lot of maintenance discussions or whether to post NM or NA. It happens if it's needed non discussion necessary. I've posted a few NM's with no negative feedback - the cache was either fixed promptly or archived by the CO or reviewer.

In my area, no one needs to discuss maintenance or NMs and NAs because it all just happens. I don't know how my culture got the way it is, so for all I know it's because there was lots of talk at events about these issues before I came on the scene. COs that hide a lot but don't seem to maintain them don't come up very often, but the cases I can think of, what people think about those COs was "they didn't last very long" because all those caches are gone now and the COs have disappeared. I've never heard anyone complain about NMs and NAs, if that's what you mean. I haven't heard anyone use the term "cache cop" around here (except maybe in jest), but if they did, I'd assume they were talking about someone that regularly posted NMs and NAs that were rude, unhelpful, or just wrong.

Events always seem very, highly social. Newcomers are more often quieter and less interactive, but everyone's very friendly. Sure, there could be some divisions and cliques, but rarely do I see any visible negativity or antagonism. If anything, it happens quietly or behind people's backs There's not a lot of talk about the rights ways to do things, because it doesn't seem like there's a problem with people doing things the wrong way... occasionally there's some discussion about new features and the way people like to do things themselves, but I rarely ever get the sense that there's some widespread disagreement. In the greater area I know there are a couple of people who have struck smoe bad chords with the community, but that's general geocacher etiquette, not related to questionable GS features/practices... I don't get the sense anyone feels like there's a "cache cop" in my area either. Keep in mind, this is of course all my own observations. Things could be going on in smaller groups that I'm not privy to. Heck maybe I'm heckled by everyone and I don't know it =P But this is what I see in my general local community. Lots of general camaraderie, especially by those who don't bind themselves to any major group, but some distinct groups of friends and common cachers, though no prominent/public in-fighting or hobby-detracting all-out wars. Quite nNewbie frendly, in short.

In your area, what's it like at events? Do people talk about the importance of maintenance? Do they encourage each other to log NMs and follow-up NAs? What do they think of people who hide for numbers and never maintain but are avid hiders? Or is there a negative vibe about "cache cop" types?

It's not a hobby that appeals to everyone - a lot of people just don't "get it"! And that's OK. Friends and family know we go geocaching. Sometime they've tagged along with us, and it was fun for that day or two, but on their own, they don't pursue it. If you don't enjoy the puzzles, the hunt, that "AHA - GOTCHA!" feeling when you find it, then it's not a hobby for you. It gives us just a little something extra to do when we hike, or walk, or want to explore a new town. We love it, we realize not everyone else does, and we are more than willing to talk about it with those who are interested in learning more.

That's happened to me a few times. It turns out they really just wanted someone to talk to while out for a walk. Some swear they loved the activity but wouldn't go caching unless I went. And wouldn't download the app (or get a gps) or create an account. I question whether they really like geocaching. One latched on and tried to be a BFF. Can you tell I'm introverted?

as close to a stalking target as I have been was a few years back. someone who I had never communicated with previously saw that I was going to attend an event. I got to the event and these two guys were sitting there that no one recognized so they were introducing themselves and asked "which one of you is bulldogblitz, we came just to talk to you" heh...it was a question about a cache in another part of the country and they were visiting my home area (not that they drove 700 miles to meet me... but it was convenient). they happened to be from the town where I grew up so we had much more to talk about than a single cache 100 miles from them and 600 miles from me.

Yes, that's why the very first thing I said was that the OP should talk to the ranger - they're the public face of NPWS and, while they don't have the power to approve caches (mine had to be signed off by the Regional Director) they know what's happening on their turf and can make recommendations to those higher up the chain. I gather in this case, the cache was there before the land came under the control of NPWS, but now that it has, they have the final say. Moving the cache might well have been possible - that could be worked out with the ranger - although it'd probably require a formal submission for the proposed new location and the cache would've needed to be disabled while that was going through. I guess it's all moot now that it's been archived, but perhaps it's a lesson for others.

I don't necessarily hate them, but I do value them far less than any other cache. I could talk about them for a while but I guess I'll just sum it up. -I remember almost none of the micros I have found. Meanwhile I could talk for hours about interesting small to medium caches I found and the memories I made searching for them. -When looking for normal sized caches I generally expect the journey to be the majority of the fun, and the actual hunt to be somewhere between leisurely to moderate. When hunting for micros I know I will be scouring around for 10-20 minutes for something minuscule. Not a particularly fun prospect. -Some people "micro-bomb" an area, placing tens of them all over an area in a wide radius. I have a fair few problems with this. Due to the proximity rule it cuts off large areas where larger, more deliberate caches could be placed. When one cacher drops 20 micros in an area, I feel 1/20th of the accomplishment in finding them, and it becomes a chore. No matter how much effort it may have taken to place them all, it appears lazy when that's all they hide and they're all over one area. Plus, finding nothing but micros over and over again gets boring! -I feel excitement and happiness and anticipation when I find a normal sized geocache. I feel nothing when I find a microcache. "Well, there it is." You could probably analyze that further but generally speaking I just have no fun finding them anymore.

These are the rules on cache location from the NPWS policy document: Talk with the local ranger. Most are more than willing to help but they're also limited in what they can approve so be prepared to compromise. The site I originally wanted to use for my cache appeared to tick all the above boxes but it turned out that the unofficial track out there passed through an area of Aboriginal engravings. After poring over maps with the ranger, we decided there wasn't really a feasible alternative access route so I set about finding a different spot for the cache, eventually settling on one close to the Great North Walk that they were happy with and which they then approved. All up it took close to four months.

I'm not referring to people who don't want geocaches hidden on their property or public officials who may want certain geocaches removed. I'm talking about those who know what geocaches are and are against them on a fundamental level across the board for whatever reason. They don't like them, they don't want them in nature, they think they're dangerous, they don't want to see them, or any other similar reason. Anti-cachers would fall into this category. Those that know what geocaching is and deliberately take or destroy them for personal reasons. I have not met any in person but I have seen and spoken to them online. Generally I've found it's a belief that geocaches don't belong in nature and detract from the purity of the outdoors. They're very open about stealing or destroying any caches they find and don't seem to want to talk about or discuss it. I've encountered something similar with rock cairns I stack along hiking trails occasionally. I enjoy making them and I've been told people enjoy seeing them (a few times people have stopped walking to watch me make them in fact) but they never seem to last more than a day or two on one particular trail. A passerby told me that he had seen kids kicking them down before, which for some reason didn't bother me too much. I looked it up online though and saw a similar type of people to anti-cachers who don't like seeing any cairn in nature because they go into nature to get away from civilization and cairns are a reminder that other people had been there (a mode of thinking I can understand partially which is why I'm mindful of where I make them now.) Have you met, spoken to, or seen online any people like this? People who know what geocaching is and flat out hate what it is and do not think it should exist? Is there any way to change their minds? What do you say to people like this?

If someone is watching we go over and talk to them and tell them exactly what we are doing. This is especially useful when caching near private private property. It also has a side benefit of keeping the cache from being muggled.

Yes, you should, or at the very least go and talk to the park rangers about it. I don't know what the situation in Queensland is, but in New South Wales it took many years of delicate negotiation to have caches allowed at all in national parks, and even then, getting my cache approved by them last year took several months of back and forth with the local ranger and between her and her supervisor. Leaving a cache there when they've specifically (and politely) asked you to remove it could sour the relationship for everyone else.

What kind of price category are you thinking about? The next big step in Phone GPS accuracy is the BCM47755 chip, which allows far greater accuracy than current chips. Sadly, no phones exist with this chip yet. https://spectrum.ieee.org/tech-talk/semiconductors/design/superaccurate-gps-chips-coming-to-smartphones-in-2018 If you want something available now, it doesn't really matter for GPS accuracy. They are all in the same ballpark.

This varies immensely from area to area. And even within an area, it's dependent on the cachers - one CO may do very well and you can count on log and description accuracy. Others you take your chances. I've found a wide variety of good and bad caches, and you need to talk to someone who knows the area and the cachers that place caches local to that area.

Most definitely! Offline: Geocaching Tools --> Load Pocket Queries Online: Install Geocaching4Locus and remember to turn on "Enable Periodic Updates" to allow them to talk. A good OSM map with caches sprinkled on top ... is a thing of beauty.

The local talk is that he requested that his caches should be locked while he is suspended.Not going to get any info rom him or the Mods. Just don't look for them. Besides the weather has been dreadful since they were locked.

Ah, where do I start. First, thanks for letting me live rent free in your head. I guess I won the argument since you got SO pissed off because I made an honest mistake about your gender. My company pays me to be a mind reader, or they think they do, since I have to figure out why software isn't working over the phone. You have a profile picture with a male and a female on it and I made a wrong assumption. You know, instead of getting so pissed off, maybe telling me that I was incorrect would have been more in line. Would you have done that to my face, probably not. Second, I was going by your words. There was ABSOLUTELY NO venom in my reply. You stated <quote> We just need a category or group of categories to honor the other have of this planet's population. </quote>. I was asking for clarification and stating the opinion that NO gender litmus test should ever be made on a category. You then decided to get completely derailed and jump into my face. Do you not see that I did not disagree with you? All I said was that I am not in favor of putting in a category for the reason of being "fair". Who decides "fair"? That is EXACTLY why I brought up my Swastika Hotel and the Confederate Memorials. Are they "fair" if the offend people? You talk about me not understanding you - did you happen to look in the mirror and see that maybe you don't understand me and where I'm coming from? Third, seriously, I was trying to assist on why the Citizen Memorial was setup and you were spitting hairs? By the way, the category description specifically excludes Elvis from Citizen Memorials - "Also monuments and memorials to people listed at this link, People (History)." Subcategories: Abraham Lincoln (531) Benjamin Franklin (96) George Washington (184) William F. "Buffalo Bill" Cody (54) Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr. (168) Ponce de León (47) La Famille Bonaparte (154) Vasco da Gama (43) William Shakespeare (114) Carl Linnaeus and His Apostles (25) John F. Kennedy (107) This was probably done to keep the redundancy at bay. I'm sorry you decided that my reply was a personal attack - it wasn't. Reread it again without getting pissed off and see that I was actually supporting the idea as long as the category or categories get done the proper way.

iconions, first of all: I take it for granted that I'm allowed to express my opinion, just like everybody else. Maybe I should have written "I don't need another...." instead of "We". Just to explain, why I said "We": I thought about the group of people who like the idea of having a little more attention for women. I've seen waymarks for Elvis statues, that were also listed in two or three other categories. If you want a fourth additional category for Elvis, open a new thread in this forum and go ahead. About citizen memorials: Interesting. I always thought that the person had to be a citizen of that city, province or country (at least been there as a visitor). Not military then, ok. So, if a person saved the life of someone who was injured in a car accident and a memorial is set up for the life saver, I can't list it in "Citizen Memorials", if the life saver was a soldier? And why do I find Citizen Memorials for Elvis Presley, if we all know that he has been a member of the military? Maybe I should ask some more questions in the "Getting Started with Waymarking" forums. And I appreciate your passion and the effort to write so many lines just because of a few sentences from me. However, you seem to have no idea about my gender. I've been a man for all my life of 50+ years. (FYI: If you look at our profile photo, I'm the guy with the gray hair in the background and the beautiful lady in front has nothing to do with Waymarking and this idea). It will lead too far to explain my thinking, my philosophy etc., but in a few words: For me(!), if the whole Waymarking hobby would be slightly more female, it would be more interesting. We (Oh My GOD, I said it again!) are in an early stage to find a way to do that, and right now we are only brainstorming some ideas. I also thought about a category for "Feminists" (female AND male ones!), but wanted to think more about it, before throwing just a simple word in the discussion. Finally, your last paragraph makes me a little upset. How on earth do you get the idea, that I want "categories that have been forced upon the community". Have I ever said that waymarks should be deleted or that I feel "uncomfortable" with any existing waymarks??? Do I have the "expectation that they MUST be approved because they are for women"? NO, man!!! Your final words make me think that you talk about a militant female feminist, who has no idea how Waymarking is working and not me. You don't know me at all.

I wouldn't give the city any money for hiding a cache. Some thoughts before I offer something you may not have thought about. Talk with other local active cachers about how they handle things like this. Keep an eye out for a cacher who works for the city. Logs or their profile may help with this. Simply find another place to do a hide until you get your footing on the local issues. other ideas too, see what others have said. Now here is my favorite way to do a hide. Find a local (small) business where you know the owner. (Knowing the owner, either directly or through someone else, is a HUGE trust factor in your favor. One person I know in a town I don't even live in has introduced me to three other people and that has led to a half dozen cache hides, with more to come.) Small business, few people to engage...not Walmart, try Freds Hardware Store. You only want yo deal with one person, not a bureaucracy . Now develop a draft idea, go to that owner and say, "I have something for you that is easy, fun and free." They all like Free. Then explain the game, your plan, and that you want his blessing to place the cache on his property, and that you want him to have as much fun as the other people playing this goof do. As you make final preparations to do the hide, give him a copy of the cache page, then present him with a new cache page in a couple of weeks so he can see the recent logs, then every 4 months or so after. I usually include a short cover letter thanking him again for "letting us play in his yard". After a while and things are going well, ask him if he knows anyplace else that you can do a hide. Cache Happy

I know this advice is intended to be helpful and at the same time it might lead the person reading it to spend more time second-guessing themselves as to whether or not to log an NM - especially if they are new to the game. Surely it would be simpler, especially for those just getting into geocaching, if the advice was simply If you think the cache needs maintenance - post a Needs Maintenance log and let the CO decide on the appropriate course of action. Cach Owners are nice people who welcome useful feedback on their caches so there's really no need to be afraid Sure, okay. We often like to focus on the good, not the bad. We go on a road trip and find 100 caches, 5 of which were memorable, and those are the ones we share Then if anyone asks why we love geocaching, we talk about those 5, but remember that those 5 are great because they shine out from amongst the other 95. If all 100 were great, part of me thinks the whole thing would become relatively mundane. It's not the peaks we enjoy, it's dips and the journey to the peaks define the height! Geocaching isn't all sunshine and happiness, but it's sure rewarding and fun when the clouds fade and and give way to those moments Another thing you could do if you really think the log should be replaced but believe the CO should have the log, is keep it, dry it, let the CO know, and find a way to get it to them if they want it. I would sa it depends how a photo like that is described. Without comment, it doesn't put geocaching in a good light. With a critical word, or with light at the end of the tunnel, it can add to the 'intrigue' =P You're very brave for coming to the forums as a newbie If you'd like to enjoy what I think is a vastly more positive-focused geocaching environment, check out some youtube geocaching channels. The Geocaching Network (GCNW) has been gaining steam over the last few months, and there are a bunch of channels spanning a wide variety of styles and personalities, many of which are great for kids, outdoors junkies, adventurers, gadgeteers, or just general social fun.(mine is in my signature)

And, that's when the human factor begins - if a reviewer finds out you've been cheating the system (ie, posting OM without doing OM when OM is actually needed), you will be earning much more scrutiny in the future. It's not worth risking getting caught skimping on responsibilities. And yes, occasionally a reviewer may suggest resetting the score by posting an OM - but that's only because the reviewer may understand that no OM is actually needed in such a case; it's a rare circumstance tho. Reviewers are [generally] very smart, observant people - don't fear them, talk to them