Dave_W6DPS

Phones are not the greatest GPS for geocaching, although not all apps are created equal. Some are better, and some are much worse. Everyone should get an idea of how well their phone or GPS actually works. Pick a convenient spot that you pass by at least daily. Just outside your front door, perhaps. Something you can precisely get back to each time. Mark a way point. Then the next time you think about it mark another waypoint. Then over a week mark waypoints on each day at whatever time you pass by. When you compare the waypoints you should get a good idea of how accurate your waypoints are. With an actual GPS, I recommend clearing the track log, putting the GPS somewhere that it has a good view of the sky, and starting a fresh track log. Let it run for as long as the batteries hold up. A GPS, including the one in you phone, is a navigation device intended to get you to some destination. It is not a tracking device. You should always keep this in mind when hiding or searching for a geocache.

Yes, there is a notification for any log.

Thanks for the vote of confidence! And the nudge to hide some themed caches. I am sure I can think of a few to place for release coincident with the various event anniversaries. Such as launch, landing, recovery, etc. It might be interesting to literally launch some TBs and then release them at the event. Should be good start to a story. And then maybe race to Houston or Florida....

If there was other evidence I might leave a discovered log. But since they are, in my experience, only associated with event caches followed by a bunch of discovered logs. If it were actually in a physical cache it might be different, but yes, so far no photo means I delete. If anyone contacted me about why their log was deleted, we could discuss it. So far, no one has even asked. Once I asked that the photo be deleted due to it showing the TB number, and of course left the log.

It is an online forum. "In my opinion" should be assumed on all posts. The owner can specifically designate that they accept "virtual" logs, even though this is not encouraged. I specifically state that I only want real logs. Completely within the guideline you quoted. As you noted, I own my trackables.

1. Find the cache 2. Sign the log 3. Replace the cache 4. Log online If you have not done 1, 2, AND 3, then you don't do 4. No pen or pencil, no find. No excuses!

It is only a legitimate log IF you actually discover the trackable. Discover meaning lay eyes and/or hands on the actual item. You didn't quote the parts about not being abandoned at events or put on lists of trackables. "Discovering" a bug on a list of numbers at an event no where near the bug is not a legitimate log. "Discovering" a bug that has been lost for years is not a legitimate log. Suddenly getting a dozen or more "Discovered" logs on a trackable from people who have never seen it just adds noise to the page. Requiring a photo weeds out bogus "discovered" logs. Mentioning in your cache log that the listed bugs are, or are not, in the cache helps as much as a "Discovered" log. I prefer that my travel bugs travel. They are not called "Discover Bugs".

I am hosting an event cache on the 50th anniversary of the first moon landing. Apollo 11 Fiftieth Anniversary I am holding this at a dry lake bed used for rocket launches by our local club, and I plan to launch an Estes model of the Apollo Saturn V. I thought of having it on the anniversary of the launch, but that would be Tuesday the 16th, and I thought it would be better on Saturday, 7/20. Any other Apollo 11 related events or caches being planned? This seems like it might even be worth a Souvenir, "Apollo 11 Anniversary Caching".

I have a number of coin in my collection that have never been in a cache. I used to buy coins regularly, but lost interest. I have thought about sending them out, but really want to keep them. Maybe a wooden proxy would be the best idea. It would get the numbers, and now rare icons, out in circulation without risking the actual coins. Maybe I should play with my wood burning stuff again...

I had a bunch of "discovered" logs show up on a bunch of long lost travel bugs. Apparently they got on a list circulating in Europe. I deleted the logs, and locked the TBs to prevent more. I have specific directions on my current bugs regarding "discovered" logs, and delete any that don't follow. Logs should reflect the actual movement and status of the bugs. Fake logs just add garbage to the bugs' pages. I sometimes wonder which is more OCD, the cachers who love to build numbers with fake logs, or me for being so annoyed at them...

I have not found any problems in a GPS unit that has a USB connection, whether hand-held or puck. Some of my older serial units have been affected and some have not. Mostly serial pucks and OEM modules that I use for other activities like tracking rockets and high altitude balloons... But if you have an older GPS you haven't tried yet, it would be prudent to check it out. May be time to recycle.

I don't re-release the same number. It wipes the history of the first iteration. Absent direct evidence, I usually don't mark them missing for a couple of years.

I think doing (1) and (2) is the best answer. Ignore the cache rules if they are not consistent with the game. Point out to the cache owner that they cannot set the rules for other people's travel bugs. I don't see why it is "risky" to inform the CO that they are outside of normal practice. What will they do to you? Delete your find? Archive the cache? Log: "Picked up travel bug rather than let it sit. Did not leave a bug, since there is no real requirement to do so. Cache rules do not apply to other people's property." As for the reviewers, they don't seem to care or there would not so many caches with these rules.

I have found a cash register broken open and reported it to the police.

This has been a question as long as there has been geocaching. Expecting two GPS to have exactly the same ground zero at different times in unrealistic. I suggest everyone using a GPS to try this little exercise, even though it costs a set of batteries. Turn your GPS on, set it somewhere it has a view of the sky and can stay for a while, clear the track log and then start tracking. Leave it there for at least 10 to 12 hours, and then look at your track log. You will find it looks like your GPS a=has been wandering all around. This is normal due to variations in the GPS satellites positions. Usually the track will stay in a circle about 60 feet across, but sometimes there are glitches. My GPS once went from California to Oregon and back in less than a minute! Your GPS is a navigation device, not a tracking device. When you get within 20 feet or so, put your GPS away and start looking.

Please note that the point of this topic is fake logs produced by people sharing lists of traveler numbers for the purpose of generating fake "discovered" logs. The moral is, if you do not have it in your hand, do not log it. I should not have distracted the topic by mentioning not liking discovery logs. The real issue is fake logs.

I never thought that would be needed, since the point of travelers is to travel. I generally did give my travelers goals, even if it was just to move around.

I can appreciate real logs. I find no value in fake logs. The logs I deleted were fake logs posted by people who share lists of trackable numbers to "discover", even if they have never seen the trackable. What value is there in fake logs?

The owner can also be frustrated that their trackable has wound up in in a rarely visited cache and the only person to visit in months left it there.

I had a number of travel bugs that had been gone for years suddenly start showing up as discovered. I locked them down and deleted the bogus logs. I do not see the attraction of just having a list of travel bug numbers to discover if you have never seen them. Of course, I was never in favor of discover logs anyway. The point of travelers is to pick them up and move them along. if you do not move them, why log them t all?

Yesterday there were a number of logs from an individual on several of my TBs that have been lost for years. I sent him a message, here is his reply: "aller-aller has sent you a new message. "hey, I found the code on facebook 'geocaching trackable challenge' there is a list with old trackable-numbers that you can use for trackable-challenges... not pretty I know... they claim that owners can delete the codes from the list if that is wanted the list is placed on a website called geocachingchallenge.weebly.com good luck with your search greetings from the Netherlands, Maarten" I deleted the logs, and will be watching. Unfortunately, many of the TBs listed on that site belong to people who have stopped caching, so the cheaters can build their counts and fraudulently earn awards with them. Sites like that should not be allowed... Dave_W6DPS Edit to add: I also used the contact form on that website to express my displeasure with them.

By the way, thanks for the additional info! Dave

Definately a differing version of events. I think my main point is still valid, however--keep aware of the wildlife around you. Two adult humans and a dog were still very close to a big predator! As Mr Morse says, absence of proof is not proof of absence. During dry conditions you don't see many animal tracks. Dave

It happened in the Santa Ana Mountains, SW of Lake Elsinore... News article. If my understanding of the location of the incident is accurate, it appears to have been on the same trail as this cache. Please keep aware of your surroundings in the Santa Ana mountains, and always use the "Buddy System"!!! I love dogs--but thank God no humans were injured or killed--this time... Dave_W6DPS

Such problems are quite common, and usually have nothing to do with local radio interference. Try this some time: 1. Put fresh batteries in your GPSr. 2. Go to a location where you can safely set it down overnight. (I use a bird bath in my back yard.) 3. Turn it on and let it lock. 4. Wait 15 minutes, then clear the track log. 5. Set the GPSr down and restart the track log. 6. Let it set and track for at least 6 to 8 hours--longer is better, up until the batteries discharge. 7. Stop the track log and upload it to you computer. It is common for the GPSr to record movement around a rough circle up to 100 meters in diameter. Mine once recorded moving spontaneously fom California to Oregon, about 1400 Kilo-Meters! Try taking the same waypoint again on a different day, or even a few hours later, and you may get very different results. This is all completely normal. Especially outside the continental USA or when not using WAAS/EGNOS. Dave_W6DPS